Removing exclusivity

gaja

« on: April 09, 2010, 07:10 »

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I've decied to start selling a few pictures as RM, and therefore have to stop being an exclusive to Dreamstime. It's a pity, but I don't want to limit myself that much. Had it been possible to keep RF pictures exclusive and still do RM, I would have. At least for a while. I'm very excited about the new possibilities, and curious about how my pictures will do on other agencies.


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cclapper

Premium Member

« Reply #1 on: April 09, 2010, 07:20 »

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Quote from: gaja on April 09, 2010, 07:10

I have been under the impression that you could sell RF exclusive and still sell RM. There are many here who do. Did DT change their policy on that?


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gaja

« Reply #2 on: April 09, 2010, 07:49 »

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They had the same rules in this forum post from 2008, so I if some are selling RM while being exclusive to DT, they circumventing the rules a bit.

http://www.dreamstime.com/thread_10743


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cclapper

Premium Member

« Reply #3 on: April 09, 2010, 09:39 »

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Let me clear up my statement. Sorry, I didn't elaborate correctly...

If you are exclusive at DT and selling RF images, you cannot sell any of those images at any other site selling RF images and cannot sell those same images as RM.

If you have other images, none of which appear on DT as RF images, and you wish to sell them on an RM site, you can. You would not be breaking your exclusivity agreement with DT.

At least that is how I understand all of the microstock's sites exclusivity agreement. So unless DT has something different that I don't know about...

When I said that many people here sell both RF and RM, I meant in the context I described above. I don't mean that someone here is exclusive with DT and is selling those same images somewhere else as RM.

Let's say I am exclusive with IS and I have 50 images in my RF port. I have 50 other completely different images, from different shoots, that are not on IS. I have the right to sell those images RM anywhere I choose. I just cannot sell them anywhere RF.

My suggestion would be to email support at DT directly and get a clarification. There is a distinct difference between exclusive RF and selling other content as RM.


« Last Edit: April 09, 2010, 09:41 by cclapper »	Ignore \| Logged

madelaide

Premium Member

« Reply #4 on: April 09, 2010, 11:13 »

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My understanding is the same as cclapper's. RF images at DT exclusively. Any other images can be sold as RM.

I wonder if images rejected but unique can still be sold as RM elsewhere.


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Klauts

« Reply #5 on: April 09, 2010, 12:11 »

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I had the same understanding as cclaper and madelaide but after reading a little from that forum post I know understand that if you're exclusive with DT you can't sell any photos, under any license, if you are represented by a third party(not selling the image directly). This includes print-on-demand sites like Zazzle. If what I understood is true, then exclusivity with DT is one of the worst deals ever(not that I ever planned on going exclusive with them).


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gaja

« Reply #6 on: April 09, 2010, 12:12 »

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From another thread on the DT forum:
"

Quote

Can't he go RM with different pictures than RF?

No, this is not possible, being exclusive with an agency means just that. You can only sell images through that agency.
You can have exclusive images here and sell other images elsewhere but you can not be exclusive photographer and sell images with other agencies, be them different and rights managed. "

http://www.dreamstime.com/thread_21296


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lisafx

Premium Member

« Reply #7 on: April 09, 2010, 13:52 »

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Quote from: gaja on April 09, 2010, 12:12

From another thread on the DT forum:
"

Quote

Can't he go RM with different pictures than RF?

No, this is not possible, being exclusive with an agency means just that. You can only sell images through that agency.

(emphasis mine) I am sure it is a misunderstanding, but you seem to be saying that NO agency allows exclusives to sell RM elsewhere and that is not true.

Dreamstime appear to have stricter exclusivity rules than other agencies. For example Istock exclusives can also sell different images Rights Managed on other stock agencies.

Best of luck with whatever choice you end up making


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cclapper

Premium Member

« Reply #8 on: April 09, 2010, 14:05 »

#link

Quote from: lisafx on April 09, 2010, 13:52

Quote from: gaja on April 09, 2010, 12:12

From another thread on the DT forum:
"

Quote

Can't he go RM with different pictures than RF?

No, this is not possible, being exclusive with an agency means just that. You can only sell images through that agency.

It's possible that DT is requiring total exclusivity and if so, as has been mentioned, it would be the worst place to be exclusive.

I went back and re-read the DT paragraph regarding exclusivity, and it is vague, to say the least. It never even mentions RF or RM, just gives a blanket you can't sell.

Here is the wording.

Quote

Exclusive images: A contributor may work with other agencies in addition to Dreamstime.com. However, the images provided to Dreamstime.com and marked as being exclusive are sold only on Dreamstime.com. An exclusive image is represented by concepts, models, wardrobe, and subject matter which provide a unique creative message and small variations in the image (variations in camera angle, model posture or gesture, for example) do not enable an image as being different. Exclusive images may only be sold through Dreamstime.com and may not be offered through other channels. Contributors shall receive 34.5-57.5% of the sale price received by Dreamstime.com for the exclusive images they have contributed to the site which are subsequently sold by Dreamstime.com. A Contributor may remove the exclusivity rights to an image with thirty (30) days prior written notice to Dreamstime.com.

Exclusive contributors: An exclusive contributor is not represented by any other agency and will work solely with Dreamstime.com for selling their images. Exclusive contributors may, however, sell their other artwork on a photographer-to-client basis, under a work for hire contract, outside of this Agreement. Exclusive contributors shall receive sixty (60%) percent of the sale price received by Dreamstime.com for the exclusive images they have contributed to the site which are subsequently sold by Dreamstime.com, as well as a commission of $0.20 (twenty cents) for each submission uploaded and accepted by Dreamstime.com. Dreamstime.com is under no obligation, however, to accept an exclusive contributor’s submissions and acceptance of images is at Dreamstime.com’s sole discretion. Dreamstime.com may terminate an Exclusive Contributor’s status at any time with no advance notice; an Exclusive Contributor may terminate their status as an Exclusive Contributor with thirty (30) days prior written notice to Dreamstime.com. If an Exclusive Contributor terminates this Agreement prior to the passage of six (6) months, Dreamstime.com reserves the right to recover all commission payments made to the Exclusive Contributor prior to the termination of Exclusive Contributor status. These payments include the upload bonus received after each accepted submission and the extra percentage earned by exclusive contributors.

If a contributor breaks this Exclusivity Agreement, either for an exclusive image or as an exclusive contributor, Dreamstime.com reserves the right to invalidate and recover all earnings made by that Contributor through Dreamstime.com sales commencing with the date the exclusive image or images or portfolio were made subject to the Exclusivity Agreement.

If it were me, I would be getting a firm answer from DT support, not from forums. Not to say that people in the forums don't know, it's just that in order for it to be legal, it needs to come from someone in authority representing DT. I think using the terms RF and RM in the explanation above would do a lot to clearing the questions up for everyone, but we get back to that whole idea of non-transparency from the sites. The less we know, the more they can get away with.

And after re-reading the above paragraph regarding contributor exclusivity, I would never consider going exclusive at DT.


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gaja

« Reply #9 on: April 09, 2010, 14:06 »

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It's not me saying it. It is a quote from the DT forum of a DT admin. Achilles has two posts in the same thread and backs her up (click on the link http://www.dreamstime.com/thread_21296 and see).

I have already made the choice, and will start uploading to Alamy and other micros in a month.


« Last Edit: April 09, 2010, 14:09 by gaja »	Ignore \| Logged

cclapper

Premium Member

« Reply #10 on: April 09, 2010, 15:20 »

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Quote from: gaja on April 09, 2010, 14:06

OK, then, that would be confirmation. Sorry I didn't read through that whole thread.

Thanks for asking about it, though. Made me re-read the DT agreement and reaffirm my notion that exclusivity is NOT the way to go.


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gostwyck

« Reply #11 on: April 09, 2010, 15:21 »

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Quote from: gaja on April 09, 2010, 14:06

Very silly of DT to insist on total exclusivity. Good luck with your RM venture.


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gaja

« Reply #12 on: April 09, 2010, 15:27 »

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Quote from: gostwyck on April 09, 2010, 15:21

Quote from: gaja on April 09, 2010, 14:06

Very silly of DT to insist on total exclusivity. Good luck with your RM venture.

Thank you! I'm very excited about all the new possibilities.


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lisafx

Premium Member

« Reply #13 on: April 09, 2010, 17:58 »

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If you are having to drop DT exclusivity to upload RM shots, then I guess you will also be uploading your RF portfolio to the other major sites?

I am betting you will see a big jump in your income once your ports are on the 4 top micros


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Artemis

« Reply #14 on: April 09, 2010, 18:09 »

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Silly DT. They're cutting their own flesh with rules like this one... just like the 6 months lock in. Apparantely they're losing exclusives over this and i fx haven't uploaded there in 9 months because i was considering exclusivity somewhere else. Did not go exclusive but am still not uploading there because i want to be able to change my mind without having to wait for them only again.

I think you made a good choice on expanding your horizon gaja! Good luck!


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madelaide

Premium Member

« Reply #15 on: April 09, 2010, 20:28 »

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Surprising indeed. And more surprising to see Achilles saying a SR-EL is more or less the same as a RM license.

I never considered being exclusive to any site, but now it's clear that DT would never be this site anyway.


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gaja

« Reply #16 on: April 10, 2010, 02:34 »

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Quote from: lisafx on April 09, 2010, 17:58

I will be uploading most of it, yes. It will be very interesting to see how it will effect my earnings. But I was really quite happy with exclusivity with DT. If not for this rule, I wouldn't have dropped it. Or if DT had a RM-scheme. But I do not want to sell more pictures of sensitive issues as RF. I have a few already in my port, and it doesn't feel right.

Artemis: thank you for your good wishes.


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Albert Martin

« Reply #17 on: April 10, 2010, 03:58 »

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Gaja Welcome to the club and Good Luck!


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gaja

« Reply #18 on: April 10, 2010, 06:38 »

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Quote from: Albert Martin on April 10, 2010, 03:58

Gaja Welcome to the club and Good Luck!

Thank you very much!


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Kone

« Reply #19 on: April 10, 2010, 22:01 »

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Quote from: gaja on April 10, 2010, 02:34

I was really quite happy with exclusivity with DT. If not for this rule, I wouldn't have dropped it. Or if DT had a RM-scheme. But I do not want to sell more pictures of sensitive issues as RF. I have a few already in my port, and it doesn't feel right.

Maybe not my business but...
I don't get this?!?
Uploaded files......232
Total sales...........231
and you are quite happy with this? Undecided