Author Topic: Focus? Hocus Pocus! (Read 12884 times)

cthoman · « **on:** June 22, 2011, 10:50 »

I read this article about a camera start up:

http://www.pcworld.com/article/230867/camera_startup_lytro_promises_to_revolutionize_photography.html

Was also playing around on their website adjusting the focus:

http://www.lytro.com/picture_gallery

Sean Locke Photography · « **Reply #1 on:** June 22, 2011, 11:15 »

Neat!

Graffoto · « **Reply #2 on:** June 22, 2011, 11:21 »

Yes, if it is everything they say it is, we will all need to buy new cameras soon!

OTOH, I was very hopeful about the Foveon sensor when it was first announced but ASAIK it's promise has never been fully realized.

Jo Ann Snover · « **Reply #3 on:** June 22, 2011, 11:27 »

It's an interesting hybrid - keeping some of the camera-view-of-the-world conventions while allowing after-the-fact changes you can't do with current cameras.

It doesn't seem to permit you to have everything in focus - as you would get via focus stacking multiple shots. It also doesn't seem to be able to let you do what a tilt-shift lens would do and move the in-focus plane at an angle.

Will be interesting to monitor this to see how things progress.

click_click · « **Reply #4 on:** June 22, 2011, 11:47 »

It's a nice idea, useful for the masses = snap shooters.

I think it won't work for any stock work. Resolution seems to be an issue. Noise is definitely an issue and focus is still soft even at the screen size the show case.

No massive use for professional work.

lthn · « **Reply #5 on:** June 22, 2011, 12:03 »

plenoptic camera? I remember an article about experimenting with that, lenticular leny arrays, from a few years ago. The problem was back than, that -as always- a certain quantity of data is divided up into variations that you can display, meaning it was very low resolution. This still looks very low resoltion, bit if they overcome that, we wont get anymore focus rejections : ) I have my doubts that they can produce this in more than a few megapixels sharp any soon.

cthoman · « **Reply #6 on:** June 22, 2011, 12:37 »

Quote from: sjlocke on June 22, 2011, 11:15

Neat!

As a non-photographer, that was my professional opinion as well.

nruboc · « **Reply #7 on:** June 22, 2011, 13:20 »

Here's another company trying to commercialize camera arrays, this time on cell phones

http://www.technologyreview.com/blog/helloworld/26638/

nruboc · « **Reply #8 on:** June 23, 2011, 12:05 »

Speaking of Lytro, I went to their launch party last night. While the dynamic refocusing is cool, it's the combination of a vibrant 3D image with dynamic focusing and adjustments to depth of field that was the most striking. They weren't saying how big the camera lens and aperature will be, but the parallax is enough that the 3D looks very good. The value of a light field for capturing and post processing a 3D image is exciting, I'm a believer after seeing it in person.

lagereek · « **Reply #9 on:** June 23, 2011, 12:17 »

Agree, very neat! but for professional work? dont know and what about resolution, pixel power, etc?

nruboc · « **Reply #10 on:** June 23, 2011, 12:37 »

Quote from: lagereek on June 23, 2011, 12:17

Agree, very neat! but for professional work? dont know and what about resolution, pixel power, etc?

They didn't mention that, but my guess is it won't be suitable for production work for awhile. That's always been the downside of plenoptic imaging, you split your sensor N number of ways, resulting in much smaller images.

Sean Locke Photography · « **Reply #11 on:** June 23, 2011, 13:00 »

Quote from: nruboc on June 23, 2011, 12:05

Speaking of Lytro, I went to their launch party last night. While the dynamic refocusing is cool, it's the combination of a vibrant 3D image with dynamic focusing and adjustments to depth of field that was the most striking. They weren't saying how big the camera lens and aperature will be, but the parallax is enough that the 3D looks very good. The value of a light field for capturing and post processing a 3D image is exciting, I'm a believer after seeing it in person.

Nice name drop

.

nruboc · « **Reply #12 on:** June 23, 2011, 13:09 »

Quote from: sjlocke on June 23, 2011, 13:00

Quote from: nruboc on June 23, 2011, 12:05
Speaking of Lytro, I went to their launch party last night. While the dynamic refocusing is cool, it's the combination of a vibrant 3D image with dynamic focusing and adjustments to depth of field that was the most striking. They weren't saying how big the camera lens and aperature will be, but the parallax is enough that the 3D looks very good. The value of a light field for capturing and post processing a 3D image is exciting, I'm a believer after seeing it in person.

Nice name drop .

Yeah, because it was so off topic, I shouldn't share my observations.

Shank_ali · « **Reply #13 on:** June 27, 2011, 13:40 »

Quote from: click_click on June 22, 2011, 11:47

It's a nice idea, useful for the masses = snap shooters.

Nothing wrong with snap-shooters.....

BaldricksTrousers · « **Reply #14 on:** June 27, 2011, 14:39 »

It looks to me as if it adjusts to three or four planes of focus and nothing in between.

No doubt it will get better and better, if the initial idea catches on with buyers.

RacePhoto · « **Reply #15 on:** June 28, 2011, 02:05 »

Quote from: BaldricksTrousers on June 27, 2011, 14:39

It looks to me as if it adjusts to three or four planes of focus and nothing in between.

No doubt it will get better and better, if the initial idea catches on with buyers.

No that's not how it works. The answer is more like it measures the light along each individual ray flowing into the image sensor. That's instead of combining all the light, like a standard camera and lens does.

sharpshot · « **Reply #16 on:** October 19, 2011, 18:07 »

The cameras on their site now. Looks like a toy and there's very little info about things like sensor resolution. In the low resolution samples, distant subjects look soft. I'm still excited though, it breaks the mould of digital cameras being very much like film cameras. Hopefully the technology will be useful for pros one day.
http://www.lytro.com/

jamesbenet · « **Reply #17 on:** October 19, 2011, 19:03 »

The Lytro camera released today outputs 11 megarays or around 1 Megapixel with 1080px on its height. No word on the width but I'm betting 1200px. Hardly stock material.

In a few generations it will be an incredible tool in the arsenal but right now it is pretty useless besides net pic sharing. In Macro imaging and microscopy where you usually have to layer and merge several depth exposures this camera could revolutionize those markets.

Lets hope the technology survives until it matures in the market. I have a Lytro order option right now that lapses in a week. Somehow I don't think it is enough resolution to buy it. At 3MP it would be a different story, 1MP is just too low.

cobalt · « **Reply #18 on:** October 19, 2011, 19:03 »

Very cool! I want one!

"It is built for Mac OS and requires Mac OS X 10.6 or higher. A Windows application is in development."

I think I love these people...

sharpshot · « **Reply #19 on:** October 20, 2011, 01:49 »

They will sell a few of these to camera geeks and collectors but if they can't get the price down to $99, I don't think they will sell many. Hopefully they have the funding in place to work on a pro version already.

I do like the radical design but wouldn't dream of paying $399 for a toy.

fujiko · « **Reply #20 on:** October 20, 2011, 03:41 »

I don't like products with integrated memory where the difference between 8GB and 16GB is $100.

RacePhoto · « **Reply #21 on:** October 20, 2011, 07:12 »

Quote from: fujiko on October 20, 2011, 03:41

I don't like products with integrated memory where the difference between 8GB and 16GB is $100.

And it's go everything built in like battery. Seems they took that Mac approach of treating the buyer like some cretin, who's not allowed to manage their own equipment?

Yes designed for the Mac folks, what's that 10% of the world? Mac only? They don't release the MP just that it's 1080i, Oh gee thanks for insulting us again.

Toy right now and I agree on the price point needing to fall drastically.

Hey wait, maybe I can get a toss ball camera with a bunch of sensors...

That entertainment runs out fast after the first pictures. What I'd make is a gas powered launcher (compressed air) and parachute recovery system! Now we're talking!

pancaketom · « **Reply #22 on:** October 20, 2011, 14:14 »

It definitely doesn't sound like it is really ready for prime time, but with a bit of advancement it could radically alter something like macro photography. Imagine being able to just shoot a macro and then in post decide how much of a depth of field you want. You could also vastly improve portrait photography by having more of the face in focus but also have the very out of focus background - plus the data is already there to make things 3d.

I totally agree that the "mac" approach to consumer electronics is very frustrating. I would much rather be able to buy 2 batteries and swap them and upgrade the storage with just a card rather than having to pay an extra 100$ to get 8 more GB worth built in. Not to mention the fact that if the trends of the past continue you could buy a new 64 GB card for that price and the convenience of being able to swap in a fresh card when traveling away from your computer...

RacePhoto · « **Reply #23 on:** October 20, 2011, 14:50 »

Quote from: pancaketom on October 20, 2011, 14:14

It definitely doesn't sound like it is really ready for prime time, but with a bit of advancement it could radically alter something like macro photography. Imagine being able to just shoot a macro and then in post decide how much of a depth of field you want. You could also vastly improve portrait photography by having more of the face in focus but also have the very out of focus background - plus the data is already there to make things 3d.

I totally agree that the "mac" approach to consumer electronics is very frustrating. I would much rather be able to buy 2 batteries and swap them and upgrade the storage with just a card rather than having to pay an extra 100$ to get 8 more GB worth built in. Not to mention the fact that if the trends of the past continue you could buy a new 64 GB card for that price and the convenience of being able to swap in a fresh card when traveling away from your computer...

Yes for macro it would be interesting to make one exposure and then go back and produce a stack, and blend them. Very Cool!

Anyone own a White stereo camera, Nimslo? Well pretty much everyone had or saw a Viewmaster as a kid, and turn of the Century and I mean the last one, Stereo Viewers were the hot item. Same as some of the future for this camera and 3D. It will be in some history books and some people will have saved bits and pieces, but honestly, it's not necessary and it's that much better than flat images so that it makes a big difference.

Now when they come out with the 3d laser holographic TV - I want one! Virtual TV, that would be excellent, walk into a room and stand between the elements of the image, looking any direction you wish. Now that would be 3D TV!

click_click · « **Reply #24 on:** October 20, 2011, 14:54 »

Quote from: RacePhoto on October 20, 2011, 14:50

... Now that would be 3D TV!

You watched too much Star Trek. Not gonna happen in the next 100 years - for regular consumers anyway.

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Author Topic: Focus? Hocus Pocus! (Read 12884 times)

cthoman

Sean Locke Photography

Graffoto

Jo Ann Snover

click_click

lthn

cthoman

nruboc

nruboc

lagereek

nruboc

Sean Locke Photography

nruboc

Shank_ali

BaldricksTrousers

RacePhoto

sharpshot

jamesbenet

cobalt

sharpshot

fujiko

RacePhoto

pancaketom

RacePhoto

click_click

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