Keywording service

uliss

New Member

« on: January 31, 2008, 07:18 »

#link

Hi everyone,

I have created the site for photographers and illustrators to speed up the process of finding keywords to the images. The basic point is that the list of keywords is not abstract, the customers actually use these keywords in their searching process. You can test the beta-version of the site here: photokeywords.com.

How does it work?
1.   You type in the form several basic keywords, which exactly describe your image. You can use search engines of Shutterstock or Dreamstime. You can also combine the results of search.
2.   Among the results of search you choose several images which are most similar to yours.
3.   The site automatically takes the keywords from the chosen images and demonstrates them. Identical keywords which coincide in the chosen images will be removed automatically. Also the list of keywords will be automatically sorted by frequency of use in the chosen images and then by the popularity of retrieval requests to make easier your final selection of keywords.
4.    First 50 words in the list are marked as most relevant to the image.
5.   After you make all the necessary changes, the final list of keywords is generated.

Now a few words about where I have found the base of retrieval requests. On several photostocks there are pages (http://www.dreamstime.com/latest-photos, http://www.luckyoliver.com/browse/words) where the latest retrieval requests are generated. I have created a program which automatically collects these requests. For approximately two months my program collects 90.000 retrieval requests from Dreamstime and 270.000 requests from Luckyoliver.

If you’ve got any ideas concerning improving the site, you are welcomed to mail them here or to the following e-mail address: [email protected]


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null

« Reply #1 on: January 31, 2008, 07:28 »

#link

Clever, but over the edge legally, IMHO. ShutterStock explicitly forbids in its TOS the automatic harvesting of data. Moreover, you infringe on the copyright of the contributors by presenting the thumbs on your own site. Finally, I saw some of my shots turn up on your commercial site, and I forbid you explicitely to do this unless you buy a license of my shots from DT and SS. Clear?


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« Reply #2 on: January 31, 2008, 07:47 »

#link

Hmmm It works I'll give you that, but I agree I'm not sure how you stand legally with using the information gained from another website for your own commercial gain.

I agree about the thumbnail thing, you'd need to check whether that breaches any copyright, but I must at least give you credit for not attaching a referral link when you click through on an image.

I have no doubt your intentions are well meant and I congratulate you on developing a clever piece of software, also the fact that you ask for voluntary contributions is another good move.

I'd say get the backing of the sites you're using for information and you could be onto a winner, that could also help with any copyright issues.


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null

« Reply #3 on: January 31, 2008, 08:13 »

#link

Of course it's well programmed, but the idea is not new at all. The reason it never took off is that it's a breach of copyright. The sites can not decide on this since it's a violation of the right of the submitters. When FeaturePics introduced its free blogging license of thumbs, they presented an opt-in option to each and every contributor first.

Yuri Arcurs is working on a similar program but he did it the legal way, getting hold of the database of a major stock agency and he will not present thumbs, just anonymous keywords. This guy is leeching DT and SS for thumbs he has no rights for. A quick look on Alexa learns he's spamming the Net all over on all possible forms (for instance post #1 at Talkmicro), and he hides his identity well, according to whois.


« Last Edit: January 31, 2008, 08:56 by FlemishDreams »	Ignore \| Logged

uliss

New Member

« Reply #4 on: January 31, 2008, 12:03 »

#link

Quote from: FlemishDreams on January 31, 2008, 07:28

Finally, I saw some of my shots turn up on your commercial site, and I forbid you explicitely to do this unless you buy a license of my shots from DT and SS. Clear?

FlemishDreams, please don't carry on so. Now service is free, enjoy.

Quote from: FlemishDreams on January 31, 2008, 07:28

A quick look on Alexa learns he's spamming the Net all over on all possible forms (for instance post #1 at Talkmicro)

It's not spam, it's announcement (for instance http://submit.shutterstock.com/forum/abt30963-0-asc-0.html and http://www.microstockgroup.com/index.php?topic=3280.0).


« Last Edit: January 31, 2008, 12:05 by uliss »	Ignore \| Logged

bryan_luckyoliver

« Reply #5 on: January 31, 2008, 12:32 »

#link

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fair_use#Fair_use_on_the_Internet

http://www.out-law.com/page-8065

A couple of useful articles on the topic.


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grp_photo

« Reply #6 on: January 31, 2008, 15:05 »

#link

It's great i'm impressed!
I don't know the legal status but doesn't google the same (showing thumbnails) in the picture search?
I think you are overreacting FlemishDreams as i said i don't know the legal status but its certainly not spam it is an announcement.


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null

« Reply #7 on: January 31, 2008, 16:19 »

#link

Update: after an email from Serban of DT, out of which I cannot quote of course, there seems to be no problem with the thumbs as such. As Bryan of LO implied by the links he provided, thumbs seem to be often a case of fair use. But there might be other problems, which DT will investigate. I'm confident DT will report back here or somewhere on the DT forum what the outcome of the issue is.


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null

« Reply #8 on: January 31, 2008, 16:25 »

#link

Quote from: grp_photo on January 31, 2008, 15:05

I think you are overreacting FlemishDreams as i said i don't know the legal status but its certainly not spam it is an announcement.

The legal status seems questionable. Let's wait what DT has to say later. They are investigating it.


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RacePhoto

« Reply #9 on: January 31, 2008, 20:22 »

#link

Quote from: grp_photo on January 31, 2008, 15:05

It's great i'm impressed!
I don't know the legal status but doesn't google the same (showing thumbnails) in the picture search?

From the link provided: the court found that the thumbnails were fair use

I suspect it's only free for now, but so what, I'll enjoy it while I can.

This is no different than one of us, going to a site and finding matching images and scanning for keywords, then selecting some that fit to add to what we already have.

Yes, how do the search engines get away with doing the same thing... searching?


« Last Edit: January 31, 2008, 20:24 by RacePhoto »	Ignore \| Logged

yingyang0

« Reply #10 on: January 31, 2008, 21:55 »

#link

Quote from: FlemishDreams on January 31, 2008, 07:28

Clever, but over the edge legally, IMHO. ShutterStock explicitly forbids in its TOS the automatic harvesting of data. Moreover, you infringe on the copyright of the contributors by presenting the thumbs on your own site. Finally, I saw some of my shots turn up on your commercial site, and I forbid you explicitely [sic] to do this unless you buy a license of my shots from DT and SS. Clear?

1) ShutterStock's TOS is irrelevant. It's a contract and most likely the search is conducted without being a member, and therefore not a party to the contract.
2) He's not infringing on your copyright, ask any IP attorney familiar with the issue. (This is a issue Google has litigated and been successful in defending its image search).
3) It's not a commercial site, it free.

It's always best to consult an IP attorney before making such bold assertions. If you still believe there is infringement of your copyrights occurring, then consult an attorney about sending a DMCA takedown request to the ISP for the website.

@uliss. I'd recommend a few changes. The images should link back to the either SS or Deamstime to make sure this use of images can't be distinguished from current case law in the US. Also, if the numbers being displayed next to each check box is the companies' actual file number, then I would stop displaying that because it is proprietary information that the company may and can take issue with.


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kgtoh

« Reply #11 on: February 01, 2008, 05:45 »

#link

Uliss

Very cool tool. Please don't let the ugly kneejerk reactions discourage you.
Whatever legal issues you have would be between you and the stock sites.
We can only express our opinions.
Again, cool tool.