Author Topic: Where have all the good OLD MEMBERS gone!? (Read 14075 times)

sgoodwin4813 · « **Reply #1 on:** March 12, 2016, 14:28 »

Retired to Florida?

My guess is the best ones moved on to greener pastures, wherever they might be.

Freedom · « **Reply #2 on:** March 12, 2016, 14:54 »

My guess is, even though they once demanded for other people's true IDs, they have changed their user names.

cobalt · « **Reply #3 on:** March 12, 2016, 14:58 »

That and a lot of people read here, then go discuss things in private facebook groups.

Justanotherphotographer · « **Reply #4 on:** March 12, 2016, 15:06 »

When a load of bad old members migrated over from SS the good old members disappeared.

Mantis · « **Reply #5 on:** March 12, 2016, 15:19 »

There are three certainties in life. Death, taxes and microstockgroup defection

etudiante_rapide · « **Reply #6 on:** March 12, 2016, 16:47 »

Quote from: Mantis on March 12, 2016, 15:19

There are three certainties in life. Death, taxes and microstockgroup defection

death is certainly one of them; i know 3 passed on.
as for the younger ones, i say they might still be here under a pseudonym,
after getting all the s-load of personal assasination or got chased off with a pitchfork , as someone
described it.

all in all, it is the personal ASSassination that drove many away from here

Copidosoma · « **Reply #7 on:** March 12, 2016, 17:32 »

I'm still here

cathyslife · « **Reply #8 on:** March 12, 2016, 23:07 »

I'm still here.

sharpshot · « **Reply #9 on:** March 13, 2016, 03:30 »

I left a long time ago.

Chichikov · « **Reply #10 on:** March 13, 2016, 03:41 »

I left when I was good and turned back being bad…

Epsilonth · « **Reply #11 on:** March 13, 2016, 04:32 »

Some members seem to have more fun trolling here than doing actual photography work.

There's little to no moderation. There're too many idiotic members here. There's no motivation to contribute anymore. I see this forum dead in a few years if not months.

Red Dove · « **Reply #12 on:** March 13, 2016, 08:24 »

They are on the Knitting Forum

60D · « **Reply #13 on:** March 13, 2016, 09:42 »

Quote from: etudiante_rapide on March 12, 2016, 16:47

death is certainly one of them; i know 3 passed on.

What happened to their ports? That's why some agencies doesn't have auto pay option.

PaulieWalnuts · « **Reply #14 on:** March 13, 2016, 09:44 »

They've gone from MSG to MRH. Microstock Retirement Home.

Lana · « **Reply #15 on:** March 13, 2016, 10:13 »

Quote from: Red Dove on March 13, 2016, 08:24

They are on the Knitting Forum

the funniest one!

fotografer · « **Reply #16 on:** March 13, 2016, 10:59 »

Quote from: Epsilonth on March 13, 2016, 04:32

.

There's no motivation to contribute anymore. I see this forum dead in a few years if not months.

I still find this forum extremely useful. It's so much easier to pop in here to see what's going on in the stock world than having to keep check at all the idividual sites that we upload to. The first thing I do if I notice something odd at one of the sites is come here and invariably somebody is already talking about it. People like Joanne, Sean etc save us from having to do hours of research ourselves and I'm very grateful for that.

stockVid · « **Reply #17 on:** March 13, 2016, 11:01 »

Quote from: cathyslife on March 12, 2016, 23:07

I'm still here.

The most aware.

etudiante_rapide · « **Reply #18 on:** March 13, 2016, 11:34 »

Quote from: 60D on March 13, 2016, 09:42

Quote from: etudiante_rapide on March 12, 2016, 16:47
death is certainly one of them; i know 3 passed on.

What happened to their ports? That's why some agencies doesn't have auto pay option.

i am not sure. all i know is you can get an estate or something and the agency will continue to pay you. one of the blokes who kicked the bucket , the family just closed the accounts... which is a shame because they could still collect money . shame because the fella had a good payout each month.

the other two, no one said anything. their children did not contact me to say anything. they just stopped writing.

i guess we have to kick the bucket to find out LMAO

etudiante_rapide · « **Reply #19 on:** March 13, 2016, 11:35 »

Quote from: PaulieWalnuts on March 13, 2016, 09:44

They've gone from MSG to MTH. Microstock Retirement Home.

that would not be too bad either, as they could still have a cute nurse claim the payout for them

Leo · « **Reply #20 on:** March 13, 2016, 12:51 »

So reading this thread, three possibilities:

They got tired of being harassed by others,
They got tired of harassing others.
They died.

cathyslife · « **Reply #21 on:** March 13, 2016, 12:52 »

Quote from: stockVid on March 13, 2016, 11:01

Quote from: cathyslife on March 12, 2016, 23:07
I'm still here.

The most aware.

rimglow · « **Reply #22 on:** March 13, 2016, 12:54 »

I'm 67. Is that old?

sharpshot · « **Reply #23 on:** March 13, 2016, 13:05 »

Quote from: Leo on March 13, 2016, 12:51

So reading this thread, three possibilities:

They got tired of being harassed by others,
They got tired of harassing others.
They died.

I suspect some might still be here but have changed their name and become lurkers.

LesHoward · « **Reply #24 on:** March 13, 2016, 13:42 »

Quote from: Red Dove on March 13, 2016, 08:24

They are on the Knitting Forum

That's more profitable.

etudiante_rapide · « **Reply #25 on:** March 13, 2016, 13:45 »

Quote from: Leo on March 13, 2016, 12:51

So reading this thread, three possibilities:

They got tired of being harassed by others,
They got tired of harassing others.

They died.
[/list]

correct... but correction item#3

They died.

they got tired of being tired

Tryingmybest · « **Reply #26 on:** March 13, 2016, 13:52 »

I'm 42. Does that count as old?

Lana · « **Reply #27 on:** March 13, 2016, 14:02 »

Quote from: etudiante_rapide on March 13, 2016, 11:34

i am not sure. all i know is you can get an estate or something and the agency will continue to pay you. one of the blokes who kicked the bucket , the family just closed the accounts... which is a shame because they could still collect money . shame because the fella had a good payout each month.

That's sad, and it's not only about the payouts - his art was still in demand and could live for a very long time..

jodijacobson · « **Reply #28 on:** March 13, 2016, 14:05 »

I'm still here! Still love IStock by Getty and Yes I did move to sunny Florida 5 years ago. Living the life

LesHoward · « **Reply #29 on:** March 13, 2016, 14:14 »

Many of the topics are simple rehashes of older conversations that have occurred many times before. I don't write unless I have something NEW to say (or something irresistable tickles my funnybone like the 'knitting' comment!) Otherwise I just read the newsy stuff that affects me like the recent conversation about Veer shutting down. This is why there are so many lurkers on the forum.

FlowerPower · « **Reply #30 on:** March 13, 2016, 17:38 »

Quote from: Epsilonth on March 13, 2016, 04:32

Some members seem to have more fun trolling here than doing actual photography work.

There's little to no moderation. There're too many idiotic members here. There's no motivation to contribute anymore. I see this forum dead in a few years if not months.

Most of the replies on this subject agree with you. Noithing but rehash, complaining, anonymous trolls. Funny how 2 people who aren't anonymous are the ones who add the most research and helpful information. Trolls and mean comments what this has become.

cascoly · « **Reply #31 on:** March 13, 2016, 18:34 »

it's partly a good sign - as the industry matures (if not the trolls), there's fewer new sites opening, gaining our uploads, then sinking out of sight. in the last year or so Canva is the only new site that i'm still uploading to

a few years ago new sites were common and MSG was helpful in deciding which to support; print on demand & direct sales from indiv sites bloomed, then leveled

if something new comes along I still expect to hear about it here first

cidepix · « **Reply #32 on:** March 13, 2016, 19:36 »

Quote from: Leo on March 13, 2016, 12:51

So reading this thread, three possibilities:

They got tired of being harassed by others,
They got tired of harassing others.
They died.

or,

they just have better things to do..

things that actually pay the bills..

Hongover · « **Reply #33 on:** March 13, 2016, 19:50 »

I see myself posting less and less on this forum over time. I've done this on a number of forums...where the your interest declines over time, so you don't visit anymore.

For this particular forum, it's lacking engagement in the sense that many people don't want to share ideas, strategy and technique. There is critique, advice for newbies and then there are debates, but it never gets too deep because contributors are holding back.

I used to visit and post on videogame forums often because we were able to share strategy and techniques for defeating enemies and discovery of secrets. So we keep going back to learn and share. There isn't that kind of engagement here. If you are not very successful, you share your frustrations. If you achieve success, you don't want to share too much. It's a strange dynamic for sure and it doesn't make for deep engagement.

etudiante_rapide · « **Reply #34 on:** March 13, 2016, 21:03 »

Quote from: Minscer on March 13, 2016, 19:50

I see myself posting less and less on this forum over time. I've done this on a number of forums...where the your interest declines over time, so you don't visit anymore.

For this particular forum, it's lacking engagement in the sense that many people don't want to share ideas, strategy and technique. There is critique, advice for newbies and then there are debates, but it never gets too deep because contributors are holding back.

I used to visit and post on videogame forums often because we were able to share strategy and techniques for defeating enemies and discovery of secrets. So we keep going back to learn and share. There isn't that kind of engagement here. If you are not very successful, you share your frustrations. If you achieve success, you don't want to share too much. It's a strange dynamic for sure and it doesn't make for deep engagement.

actually, when the forum first took hold, we had a lot of good ppl willing to share knowledge...
(lisafx, jonathan, april, mitz, yuri,dolgachov,stacy,hatman,etc...) but they all disappeared as it became territorial and lots of character assassins.
not just the old experienced , but also the ones who disappeared included alot of the very young ones, who used to be very active here...

i remember dolgachov and yuri coming in here to say so, that's why they too got tired of being harassed... to quote leo.

yes, it has come down to almost something to have your morning cup of coffee to read when you have nothing better to do.
shame really, because leaf did a good job of starting something good,
which ends up being something not so.

etudiante_rapide · « **Reply #35 on:** March 13, 2016, 21:10 »

Quote from: Lana on March 13, 2016, 14:02

Quote from: etudiante_rapide on March 13, 2016, 11:34
i am not sure. all i know is you can get an estate or something and the agency will continue to pay you. one of the blokes who kicked the bucket , the family just closed the accounts... which is a shame because they could still collect money . shame because the fella had a good payout each month.

That's sad, and it's not only about the payouts - his art was still in demand and could live for a very long time..

yes, it's sad, Lana! the reason i got from the family who closed the accounts was that they did not feel like leaving his work with the agency. i guess they felt it was too much work to keep on checking or perharps grief made them want to find closure with the passing of a very loved one.

it's something no one likes to discuss, even though many contributors are of that age group
that needs to discuss estate... and afaik agencies do allow accounts to be continued if the family submits an estate form . if not, i guess, the money piles up and the agency gets 100% indefinitely...
sort of like intestate, only it does not go to the government, it goes to ss, is, etc..

(update: correction, last sentence... no , not ss, as they pay out automatically)

Leo · « **Reply #36 on:** March 13, 2016, 21:27 »

Quote from: Minscer on March 13, 2016, 19:50

I see myself posting less and less on this forum over time. I've done this on a number of forums...where the your interest declines over time, so you don't visit anymore.

For this particular forum, it's lacking engagement in the sense that many people don't want to share ideas, strategy and technique. There is critique, advice for newbies and then there are debates, but it never gets too deep because contributors are holding back.

I used to visit and post on videogame forums often because we were able to share strategy and techniques for defeating enemies and discovery of secrets. So we keep going back to learn and share. There isn't that kind of engagement here. If you are not very successful, you share your frustrations. If you achieve success, you don't want to share too much. It's a strange dynamic for sure and it doesn't make for deep engagement.

Great stuff. The whole post. Your speaking my language. If you have access to netflix, you should watch this: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt3214002/

Hongover · « **Reply #37 on:** March 13, 2016, 21:33 »

Quote from: Leo on March 13, 2016, 21:27

Quote from: Minscer on March 13, 2016, 19:50
I see myself posting less and less on this forum over time. I've done this on a number of forums...where the your interest declines over time, so you don't visit anymore.

For this particular forum, it's lacking engagement in the sense that many people don't want to share ideas, strategy and technique. There is critique, advice for newbies and then there are debates, but it never gets too deep because contributors are holding back.

I used to visit and post on videogame forums often because we were able to share strategy and techniques for defeating enemies and discovery of secrets. So we keep going back to learn and share. There isn't that kind of engagement here. If you are not very successful, you share your frustrations. If you achieve success, you don't want to share too much. It's a strange dynamic for sure and it doesn't make for deep engagement.

Great stuff. The whole post. Your speaking my language. If you have access to netflix, you should watch this: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt3214002/

Looks good. I'll definitely check it out.

Hongover · « **Reply #38 on:** March 13, 2016, 21:40 »

Quote from: etudiante_rapide on March 13, 2016, 21:03

Quote from: Minscer on March 13, 2016, 19:50
I see myself posting less and less on this forum over time. I've done this on a number of forums...where the your interest declines over time, so you don't visit anymore.

For this particular forum, it's lacking engagement in the sense that many people don't want to share ideas, strategy and technique. There is critique, advice for newbies and then there are debates, but it never gets too deep because contributors are holding back.

I used to visit and post on videogame forums often because we were able to share strategy and techniques for defeating enemies and discovery of secrets. So we keep going back to learn and share. There isn't that kind of engagement here. If you are not very successful, you share your frustrations. If you achieve success, you don't want to share too much. It's a strange dynamic for sure and it doesn't make for deep engagement.

actually, when the forum first took hold, we had a lot of good ppl willing to share knowledge...
(lisafx, jonathan, april, mitz, yuri,dolgachov,stacy,hatman,etc...) but they all disappeared as it became territorial and lots of character assassins.
not just the old experienced , but also the ones who disappeared included alot of the very young ones, who used to be very active here...

i remember dolgachov and yuri coming in here to say so, that's why they too got tired of being harassed... to quote leo.

yes, it has come down to almost something to have your morning cup of coffee to read when you have nothing better to do.
shame really, because leaf did a good job of starting something good,
which ends up being something not so.

In what way were they harassed? I joined last year so I'm completely oblivious to what happened. I know Yuri is one of the big success stories of microstock, and I can imaging some envy from other contributors. Perhaps you can shred more light.

I can see why people would share in the beginning because everyone was starting out. As the pieces of pie gets smaller and smaller for everyone, it naturally became more competitive and people sharing less.

Leo · « **Reply #39 on:** March 13, 2016, 22:21 »

The problem is multifaceted. You could probably even get scientific on it (though I am no scientist).

A forum based on an industry with high work/low reward ratio for most. Dissolusioned people with something to say about their feelings...
A forum is a perfect and ideal atmosphere for busybodies, like warm meat in open air is to bacteria.
Most forum culture has a tendency to degenerate over time anyway.
Moderation often stifles expression for most, especially for those who have something legitimately negative to express for a good reason.
No moderation allows the bolder people with less restraint time to gain dominance, ruining the experience of those more sincere.

The internet in general alters social behavior and instincts, and artifcial communication mediums can sometimes encourage narcissistic (selfish) behavior. Studies in this has shown a very unique and new generation that isn't ready for "reality" because their main source of interaction is through social networks, gaming networks, computer chats, etc.

As someone above mentioned, communication in general (especially in a forum like this) should have an objective, a purpose, and a constructive result.

In normal society you can almost instantly tell if a person is acceptable to you to speak with, shares your interest, your education, your values, etc (birds of a feather flock together). The internet alters that as well, and it takes great skill to see the persona behind the words.

Natural and normal (productive) people will eventually be displaced from the forum environment by the less productive regardless of the forum subject.
Add yet another dynamic - industry agendas, which allows a bit of crowd manipulation, playing on the emotions and state of the people here.

So we'd love to have a simple answer to a complex problem, but like any economy or system, nothing is simple, especially with the "human" element.

Most forums at least have a "forum rules" post that everyone is required to agree to. If people's intent was innovation, it would show. But often people just need a medium to vent ... and I think that is what MSG has become by necessity, since few can innovate in such a way to make a difference.

PixelBytes · « **Reply #40 on:** March 13, 2016, 22:26 »

Quote from: Leo on March 13, 2016, 22:21

The problem is multifaceted. You could probably even get scientific on it (though I am no scientist).

A forum based on an industry with high work/low reward ratio for most. Dissolusioned people with something to say about their feelings...
A forum is a perfect and ideal atmosphere for busybodies, like warm meat in open air is to bacteria.
Most forum culture has a tendency to degenerate over time anyway.
Moderation often stifles expression for most, especially for those who have something legitimately negative to express for a good reason.
No moderation allows the bolder people with less restraint time to gain dominance, ruining the experience of those more sincere.
The internet in general alters social behavior and instincts, and artifcial communication mediums can sometimes encourage narcissistic (selfish) behavior. Studies in this has shown a very unique and new generation that isn't ready for "reality" because their main source of interaction is through social networks, gaming networks, computer chats, etc.

As someone above mentioned, communication in general (especially in a forum like this) should have an objective, a purpose, and a constructive result.

In normal society you can almost instantly tell if a person is acceptable to you to speak with, shares your interest, your education, your values, etc (birds of a feather flock together). The internet alters that as well, and it takes great skill to see the persona behind the words.

Natural and normal (productive) people will eventually be displaced from the forum environment by the less productive regardless of the forum subject.
Add yet another dynamic - industry agendas, which allows a bit of crowd manipulation, playing on the emotions and state of the people here.

So we'd love to have a simple answer to a complex problem, but like any economy or system, nothing is simple, especially with the "human" element.

Most forums at least have a "forum rules" post that everyone is required to agree to. If people's intent was innovation, it would show. But often people just need a medium to vent ... and I think that is what MSG has become by necessity, since few can innovate in such a way to make a difference.

Brilliant answer. This is what I've seen happen here and on other forums too. Never heard it explained so well before.

PaulieWalnuts · « **Reply #41 on:** March 13, 2016, 22:32 »

I think one reason more experienced people stopped sharing is the bad reactions they got from trying to help. I've seen it happen over and over where somebody new would ask for advice and then would either argue the advice is wrong, insult people, or just show no appreciation. Who wants to continue helping when the response to your help is abuse? Nobody.

PixelBytes · « **Reply #42 on:** March 13, 2016, 22:44 »

Quote from: PaulieWalnuts on March 13, 2016, 22:32

I think one reason more experienced people stopped sharing is the bad reactions they got from trying to help. I've seen it happen over and over where somebody new would ask for advice and then would either argue the advice is wrong, insult people, or just show no appreciation. Who wants to continue helping when the response to your help is abuse? Nobody.

Yeah. It's also fun when you help out and then they go to your port and copy your bestsellers. Happened to me on some site forums. Another reason to either not help here or be anonymous.

etudiante_rapide · « **Reply #43 on:** March 13, 2016, 23:04 »

Quote from: PaulieWalnuts on March 13, 2016, 22:32

I think one reason more experienced people stopped sharing is the bad reactions they got from trying to help. I've seen it happen over and over where somebody new would ask for advice and then would either argue the advice is wrong, insult people, or just show no appreciation. Who wants to continue helping when the response to your help is abuse? Nobody.

defintely.
i guess the problem with forum goes way back to caesar...
we all know what happened to him at the forum LOL

fotografer · « **Reply #44 on:** March 14, 2016, 03:27 »

I think the reason for the lack of help to others these days is because everybody is fighting to keep their increasingly smaller part of the pie. I used to be more than willing to help newbies in the days when anybody half decent was making good money. Nowadays I don't bother as I don't want to encourage competition. In real life when I meet other photographers I used to tell them about stock photography nowadays I keep quiet about it.
At DT I sometimes click through some of the ports of people that have me in favourites and find copies of my images. It's best these days to keep a low profile and get on with it.

sharpshot · « **Reply #45 on:** March 14, 2016, 05:22 »

Quote from: etudiante_rapide on March 13, 2016, 21:03

Quote from: Minscer on March 13, 2016, 19:50
I see myself posting less and less on this forum over time. I've done this on a number of forums...where the your interest declines over time, so you don't visit anymore.

For this particular forum, it's lacking engagement in the sense that many people don't want to share ideas, strategy and technique. There is critique, advice for newbies and then there are debates, but it never gets too deep because contributors are holding back.

I used to visit and post on videogame forums often because we were able to share strategy and techniques for defeating enemies and discovery of secrets. So we keep going back to learn and share. There isn't that kind of engagement here. If you are not very successful, you share your frustrations. If you achieve success, you don't want to share too much. It's a strange dynamic for sure and it doesn't make for deep engagement.

actually, when the forum first took hold, we had a lot of good ppl willing to share knowledge...
(lisafx, jonathan, april, mitz, yuri,dolgachov,stacy,hatman,etc...) but they all disappeared as it became territorial and lots of character assassins.
not just the old experienced , but also the ones who disappeared included alot of the very young ones, who used to be very active here...

i remember dolgachov and yuri coming in here to say so, that's why they too got tired of being harassed... to quote leo.

yes, it has come down to almost something to have your morning cup of coffee to read when you have nothing better to do.
shame really, because leaf did a good job of starting something good,
which ends up being something not so.

Yuri has been rude to people here at times, so I have little sympathy for him. I don't understand why people expect good manners from everyone on an internet forum? It isn't like the real world, a small percentage of people say horrible things on the internet that they would never say if they were speaking to the person face to face. This forum could be more heavily moderated but them people would complain about that.

Justanotherphotographer · « **Reply #46 on:** March 14, 2016, 05:51 »

It can be really frustrating posting on this forum. I used to try and engage more, now I usually don't bother posting if I disagree with somene or know they are just plain incorrect.

I don't know how someone like, for example, Sean does it. He's been here for years offering information and engaging civilly with people and still regularly ends up having to argue points of fact with people who literally know nothing about the industry. Other members I know have gotten so frustrated with the BS they have gradually ended up being regarded as trolls and left the forum, frankly I can't really blame them too much.

There are too many people on here that are both loud and wrong. Why would anyone that is successful want to come on here and share their knowledge? It's one thing to be good enough to offer advice to your competitors, its another to have to argue with them to take that advice. Why bother?

To give an example there have been threads where people have posted stats about the state of the industry based on their calculations from their tiny amount of experience. I have actually gone as far as writing a reply breaking down why I know they are wrong, for a fact, but I know if I posted I would just get into an argument that would benefit me not at all, and in fact provide more accurate information that would help my competitors. It's not an environment conducive to information sharing.

stockyme · « **Reply #47 on:** March 14, 2016, 06:19 »

Who is looking for me here?

Chichikov · « **Reply #48 on:** March 14, 2016, 07:08 »

Quote from: fotografer on March 13, 2016, 10:59

Quote from: Epsilonth on March 13, 2016, 04:32
.

There's no motivation to contribute anymore. I see this forum dead in a few years if not months.
I still find this forum extremely useful. It's so much easier to pop in here to see what's going on in the stock world than having to keep check at all the idividual sites that we upload to. The first thing I do if I notice something odd at one of the sites is come here and invariably somebody is already talking about it. People like Joanne, Sean etc save us from having to do hours of research ourselves and I'm very grateful for that.

I agree with you, I find this forum very useful too.

Unfortunately I find that the level of knowledge and information given by some (super) users also equals their level of arrogance and pedantry…

stockastic · « **Reply #49 on:** March 15, 2016, 11:31 »

Quote from: rimglow on March 13, 2016, 12:54

I'm 67. Is that old?

Yes.

I'm 64.

Leo · « **Reply #50 on:** March 15, 2016, 13:42 »

Leaf has some complex politics / social issues to mind as a moderator. I don't envy him.

I wonder, though, if a small change might make a big difference.

The voting system, small though it is, changes everything - adding a level of gamification to what could otherwise be a sincere conversation. It increases engagement, but also increases volatility. I noticed, for instance, the downvote is no longer available.

I think this would solve much (though I am not the one that has to live with these ideas!) but I will mention them:

VERIFIED badges (or some verified sign) should be available to people who are genuine real users.
Voting system should be shifted toward how positive, ingenuitive, or constructive a comment is. Not merely how "profound" or witty it is.

The aim is credibility. People are less likely to be obnoxious if it directly impacts their personal professional image. A fake persona, on the other hand, is practically a license for destructive or subversive behavior.

For many the forum is just a big game or entertainment. Some are using it constructively and its a professional necessity. I'm extremely interested in seeing this forum improve because it really can empower the right people for success, hence I comment this much.

cathyslife · « **Reply #51 on:** March 15, 2016, 15:20 »

You could always start your own forum and implement your own rules.

I have been coming here for 10+ years. I ignore the trolls, pontificators and blowhards, and use (and appreciate) the honest, intelligent information given by those who know their stuff. I am pretty sure everyone here knows the difference.

The great thing about any forum is that you don't have to participate. You can go somewhere else or start your own if it isn't doing what you think it should. I think Leaf does a great job.

Leo · « **Reply #52 on:** March 15, 2016, 15:43 »

Quote from: cathyslife on March 15, 2016, 15:20

You could always start your own forum and implement your own rules.

I have been coming here for 10+ years. I ignore the trolls, pontificators and blowhards, and use (and appreciate) the honest, intelligent information given by those who know their stuff. I am pretty sure everyone here knows the difference.

The great thing about any forum is that you don't have participate. You can go somewhere else or start your own if it isn't doing what you think it should. I think Leaf does a great job.

^^

etudiante_rapide · « **Reply #53 on:** March 15, 2016, 16:47 »

Quote from: Leo on March 15, 2016, 15:43

Quote from: cathyslife on March 15, 2016, 15:20
You could always start your own forum and implement your own rules.

I have been coming here for 10+ years. I ignore the trolls, pontificators and blowhards, and use (and appreciate) the honest, intelligent information given by those who know their stuff. I am pretty sure everyone here knows the difference.

The great thing about any forum is that you don't have participate. You can go somewhere else or start your own if it isn't doing what you think it should. I think Leaf does a great job.

^^

yes, cathy,
whether or not this forum has gone down the hole , one has to credit leaf for doing a good job.
as for lack of moderation, i need to say that i did in fact ask leaf why he does not moderate enough.
his answer was that unless someone goes over the edge, and only when someone who is insulted
emails him, he would prefer not to moderate too much.

sharpshot · « **Reply #54 on:** March 15, 2016, 18:12 »

I preferred it when there was no voting system at all.

Leo · « **Reply #55 on:** March 15, 2016, 18:25 »

Quote from: sharpshot on March 15, 2016, 18:12

I preferred it when there was no voting system at all.

+1! (Sorry, couldn't resist)

cathyslife · « **Reply #56 on:** March 15, 2016, 19:09 »

Quote from: sharpshot on March 15, 2016, 18:12

I preferred it when there was no voting system at all.

When there wasnt a voting system at all, there was still a voting system...the +1 method. People will still agree, disagree, post positives, post negatives, etc. That is what a forum is.

When Leaf overmoderates, people complain. When he undermoderates, people complain. It is what it is, as the saying goes.

cascoly · « **Reply #57 on:** March 16, 2016, 14:26 »

Quote from: cathyslife on March 15, 2016, 15:20

You could always start your own forum and implement your own rules.

I have been coming here for 10+ years. I ignore the trolls, pontificators and blowhards, and use (and appreciate) the honest, intelligent information given by those who know their stuff. I am pretty sure everyone here knows the difference.

The great thing about any forum is that you don't have to participate. You can go somewhere else or start your own if it isn't doing what you think it should. I think Leaf does a great job.

all true, but what about newbies who don't know the forum's history? -- a forum needs to attract new blood for all the reasons given earlier as to why older members may not be as active.

I do appreciate less rather than more moderation, letting good speech overcome the bad

FlowerPower · « **Reply #58 on:** March 20, 2016, 13:06 »

Quote from: cathyslife on March 15, 2016, 15:20

You could always start your own forum and implement your own rules.

I have been coming here for 10+ years. I ignore the trolls, pontificators and blowhards, and use (and appreciate) the honest, intelligent information given by those who know their stuff. I am pretty sure everyone here knows the difference.

The great thing about any forum is that you don't have to participate. You can go somewhere else or start your own if it isn't doing what you think it should. I think Leaf does a great job.

I think that's where the old members have gone. Same as the people who complain about the pay and agents all the time. You can always quit and do something else. You don't have to come here and complain about how bad micro is. Same as you don't have to come here for the forum if the people aren't to your liking. I miss the conversations about something else but money, sales, the latest place that's stealing from us. If I want to do something different for a living I will.

Mantis · « **Reply #59 on:** March 20, 2016, 13:40 »

Quote from: FlowerPower on March 20, 2016, 13:06

Quote from: cathyslife on March 15, 2016, 15:20
You could always start your own forum and implement your own rules.

I have been coming here for 10+ years. I ignore the trolls, pontificators and blowhards, and use (and appreciate) the honest, intelligent information given by those who know their stuff. I am pretty sure everyone here knows the difference.

The great thing about any forum is that you don't have to participate. You can go somewhere else or start your own if it isn't doing what you think it should. I think Leaf does a great job.

I think that's where the old members have gone. Same as the people who complain about the pay and agents all the time. You can always quit and do something else. You don't have to come here and complain about how bad micro is. Same as you don't have to come here for the forum if the people aren't to your liking. I miss the conversations about something else but money, sales, the latest place that's stealing from us. If I want to do something different for a living I will.

I keep in touch with several "old timers" and they are still here under different names and do not participate any longer. The main reason was for speaking up against Fotolia and then getting kicked out. These are people who make their living at stock so they simply do not wish to take any risk. I was kicked out of FT and do not regret it, but I have toned down my dissatisfaction with agencies except for FT. They acted like little spoiled rotten babies - stick and stones - can break their bones but names hurt their puny little feelings more - when we were treated like production robots. Why wouldn't we speak up? Did FT think contributors wouldn't? And their game plan was to toss out any naysayers they deemed disposable.

That's why a handful left and went completely off the grid.

etudiante_rapide · « **Reply #60 on:** March 20, 2016, 14:08 »

Quote from: Mantis on March 20, 2016, 13:40

Quote from: FlowerPower on March 20, 2016, 13:06
Quote from: cathyslife on March 15, 2016, 15:20
You could always start your own forum and implement your own rules.

I have been coming here for 10+ years. I ignore the trolls, pontificators and blowhards, and use (and appreciate) the honest, intelligent information given by those who know their stuff. I am pretty sure everyone here knows the difference.

The great thing about any forum is that you don't have to participate. You can go somewhere else or start your own if it isn't doing what you think it should. I think Leaf does a great job.

I think that's where the old members have gone. Same as the people who complain about the pay and agents all the time. You can always quit and do something else. You don't have to come here and complain about how bad micro is. Same as you don't have to come here for the forum if the people aren't to your liking. I miss the conversations about something else but money, sales, the latest place that's stealing from us. If I want to do something different for a living I will.

I keep in touch with several "old timers" and they are still here under different names and do not participate any longer. The main reason was for speaking up against Fotolia and then getting kicked out. These are people who make their living at stock so they simply do not wish to take any risk. I was kicked out of FT and do not regret it, but I have toned down my dissatisfaction with agencies except for FT. They acted like little spoiled rotten babies - stick and stones - can break their bones but names hurt their puny little feelings more - when we were treated like production robots. Why wouldn't we speak up? Did FT think contributors wouldn't? And their game plan was to toss out any naysayers they deemed disposable.

That's why a handful left and went completely off the grid.

all 3 of you made some fine points, yes.
the thing is many , new and old, forget the purpose of a forum. it is a place to openly discuss things,
not a fan club. i think someone else pointed out in another thread very well, ie. you don't have to
come here if you don't like the tone of the forum,
you also, don't have to keep complaining how unfair everything is... you can always delete
your port from the agencies which pisses you off.

the final point being, we may all agree to disagree, but that does not mean that
we are out to strangle or drive someone out of town with a pitch fork.
it's the topic we disagree , not the person, ...

Mantis · « **Reply #61 on:** March 20, 2016, 16:04 »

Quote from: etudiante_rapide on March 20, 2016, 14:08

Quote from: Mantis on March 20, 2016, 13:40
Quote from: FlowerPower on March 20, 2016, 13:06
Quote from: cathyslife on March 15, 2016, 15:20
You could always start your own forum and implement your own rules.

I have been coming here for 10+ years. I ignore the trolls, pontificators and blowhards, and use (and appreciate) the honest, intelligent information given by those who know their stuff. I am pretty sure everyone here knows the difference.

The great thing about any forum is that you don't have to participate. You can go somewhere else or start your own if it isn't doing what you think it should. I think Leaf does a great job.

I think that's where the old members have gone. Same as the people who complain about the pay and agents all the time. You can always quit and do something else. You don't have to come here and complain about how bad micro is. Same as you don't have to come here for the forum if the people aren't to your liking. I miss the conversations about something else but money, sales, the latest place that's stealing from us. If I want to do something different for a living I will.

I keep in touch with several "old timers" and they are still here under different names and do not participate any longer. The main reason was for speaking up against Fotolia and then getting kicked out. These are people who make their living at stock so they simply do not wish to take any risk. I was kicked out of FT and do not regret it, but I have toned down my dissatisfaction with agencies except for FT. They acted like little spoiled rotten babies - stick and stones - can break their bones but names hurt their puny little feelings more - when we were treated like production robots. Why wouldn't we speak up? Did FT think contributors wouldn't? And their game plan was to toss out any naysayers they deemed disposable.

That's why a handful left and went completely off the grid.

all 3 of you made some fine points, yes.
the thing is many , new and old, forget the purpose of a forum. it is a place to openly discuss things,
not a fan club. i think someone else pointed out in another thread very well, ie. you don't have to
come here if you don't like the tone of the forum,
you also, don't have to keep complaining how unfair everything is... you can always delete
your port from the agencies which pisses you off.

the final point being, we may all agree to disagree, but that does not mean that
we are out to strangle or drive someone out of town with a pitch fork.
it's the topic we disagree , not the person, ...

I am sure there are several reasons for people leaving, etudiante_rapide. And I also agree that without differences of opinions, experiences, there would be no need for anything other than a woooyay forum. I personally have had some great experiences here and am humbled enough to have been helped several times, albeit privately. I think a flame-flanner here is people who are either new to MS, or want to join simply to stir the pot. When we "gang up"on someone it's usually because we have YEARS of experience in MS, how agencies have repeatedly found ways to dilute artists incentives to keep uploading, some caught simply ripping contributors off, some, like FT, who placed our content in a completely new business without our permission, etc. It's a constant uphill battle for 'many' of us just to maintain our average royalty benchmark. When someone comes in and says things like it is just your work, step it up, that's your problem....people get anxious to reply because they know that it's not simply their work; while there is some culpability for everyone, you cannot dispute how agencies have devalued our work and the sneaky ways in which they've done it. So the "gang up"comments that have been floated a few times recently are based on that variable in a large way.

When an agency like FT does what they did, acts like they act, keep their current management when moved to Adobe, people simply do not want to risk their livelihood any longer, so they leave or go underground. And I don't blame them one iota.

YadaYadaYada · « **Reply #62 on:** March 20, 2016, 16:34 »

Quote from: Mantis on March 20, 2016, 13:40

Quote from: FlowerPower on March 20, 2016, 13:06
Quote from: cathyslife on March 15, 2016, 15:20
You could always start your own forum and implement your own rules.

I have been coming here for 10+ years. I ignore the trolls, pontificators and blowhards, and use (and appreciate) the honest, intelligent information given by those who know their stuff. I am pretty sure everyone here knows the difference.

The great thing about any forum is that you don't have to participate. You can go somewhere else or start your own if it isn't doing what you think it should. I think Leaf does a great job.

I think that's where the old members have gone. Same as the people who complain about the pay and agents all the time. You can always quit and do something else. You don't have to come here and complain about how bad micro is. Same as you don't have to come here for the forum if the people aren't to your liking. I miss the conversations about something else but money, sales, the latest place that's stealing from us. If I want to do something different for a living I will.

I keep in touch with several "old timers" and they are still here under different names and do not participate any longer. The main reason was for speaking up against Fotolia and then getting kicked out. These are people who make their living at stock so they simply do not wish to take any risk. I was kicked out of FT and do not regret it, but I have toned down my dissatisfaction with agencies except for FT. They acted like little spoiled rotten babies - stick and stones - can break their bones but names hurt their puny little feelings more - when we were treated like production robots. Why wouldn't we speak up? Did FT think contributors wouldn't? And their game plan was to toss out any naysayers they deemed disposable.

That's why a handful left and went completely off the grid.

The people who were kicked off FT are justified and were treated wit no respect. Could be that's why so many went anonymous. Nothing wrong with speaking out against that and the way some agencies treat us or cheat us. When it's something besides a day to day dissatisfaction with the whole business.

You and E-R make many other valid and good reasonable points. Especially that we might disagree but it's the points not the person, with a couple minor exceptions where everything that person said was of little or no value. But he left because we were such twats and not up to his high standards of RM professional photos. He was also kicked off the IS and SS forum. Seems to be a personal trend.

I have no expectations of growth for artists while the Microstock market continues with gains, profits and makes more off our backs. I have the personal power to stay or leave, I don't need to be reminded all day long how bad it has become in the last five years.

KB · « **Reply #63 on:** March 20, 2016, 17:33 »

Quote from: YadaYadaYada on March 20, 2016, 16:34

The people who were kicked off FT are justified and were treated wit no respect. Could be that's why so many went anonymous.

I'm not that old a member, and I'm definitely not a good one, but I see that my first post was about 7.5 years ago ... complaining about FT.

And, yeah, that's absolutely why I was anonymous (and remain so, though I don't have anything bad to say about FT any longer, I sure do about Getty).

marthamarks · « **Reply #64 on:** March 20, 2016, 23:15 »

Quote from: stockastic on March 15, 2016, 11:31

Quote from: rimglow on March 13, 2016, 12:54
I'm 67. Is that old?

Yes.

I'm 64.

Correct answer: No.

I'm 69, about to turn 70 in 4 months. And I still love to get outside and photograph wild critters and places. Hope that love never, ever dies.

So, no… 64 and 67 are most definitely not old!!

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