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Agency Based Discussion => iStockPhoto.com => Topic started by: Sadstock on February 23, 2011, 20:33

Title: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Sadstock on February 23, 2011, 20:33
http://www.istockphoto.com/forum_messages.php?threadid=307512&page=1 (http://www.istockphoto.com/forum_messages.php?threadid=307512&page=1)

Here are the new Partner Program commissions, (retroactively) effective January 1, 2011:

Non-exclusives will earn 28˘ per download (was 25˘).

Exclusives will earn the following amounts per download, according to their current royalty level here at iStock:
25% at iStock - 38˘ (was 30˘)
30% – 40˘ (was 32˘)
35% – 42˘ (was 34˘)
40% – 44˘ (was 36˘)
45% – 46˘ (was 38˘)

So Istock is seeking to encourage participation at the low end while discouraging it at the mid-level (cutting commissions)

JJRD's comment "Thanks to you for fighting, KK." seems to suggest that KK wanted to raise PP payouts, but somebody above him needed convincing.

Insert jokes about sustainability here
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: BooKitty on February 23, 2011, 20:37
Call me what you will but I am opted into the PP and I am happy about the increase.  :)
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: gostwyck on February 23, 2011, 20:50
Call me what you will but I am opted into the PP and I am happy about the increase.  :)

You've got fewer than 200 sales at IS in nearly 3 years. It may only be a bit of pin money and fun to you but to those of us who earn our living through microstock the PP would potentially be very damaging if it were to become successful. That's why anyone with any sense or hope for the future doesn't support it.

Fortunately that possibility seems remote right now. The fact that Getty are actually increasing commissions (shock, horror) indicates just how poorly the PP is being supported with new content and gaining customers. Good.

It's not enough for me. They'll have to match the commission structures at SS, DT and FT if they want my content.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: jamirae on February 23, 2011, 21:32
wow.. boy.. all the exclusives will be jumping right in now! 

I'll keep my opt-out on that thing.  not enough to get my heart started.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: lightscribe on February 23, 2011, 23:37
hmmm, so withholding images from an agency pp has for the first time been officially confirmed as a legit way to put enough pressure on an agency to get them to raise commissions! So it is also official that the 25cents was not what they could reasonably afford to pay to keep the program sustainable as they always claim with all the rates, but was the lowest price they thought they could get away with paying us.  So we can also be certain that the new price structure was just pulled out of thin air as well. Well I must humbly apologize to those folks who held strong and opted out as I thought it would make no difference so I opted in way back, I wonder if holding out longer will increase it more?
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: pling on February 23, 2011, 23:56
they increase the payout now after you joint they will cut paid..this is their game
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Graffoto on February 24, 2011, 00:11
they increase the payout now after you joint they will cut paid..this is their game


I was thinking exactly that as well.

Is it possible to opt out after one has already opted in?
If so, when they lower commissions once again, there could be a mass opt out done in protest.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: gostwyck on February 24, 2011, 00:27
hmmm, so withholding images from an agency pp has for the first time been officially confirmed as a legit way to put enough pressure on an agency to get them to raise commissions! So it is also official that the 25cents was not what they could reasonably afford to pay to keep the program sustainable as they always claim with all the rates, but was the lowest price they thought they could get away with paying us.  So we can also be certain that the new price structure was just pulled out of thin air as well. Well I must humbly apologize to those folks who held strong and opted out as I thought it would make no difference so I opted in way back, I wonder if holding out longer will increase it more?

Kudos to you too for acknowledging the role that those who opted out of the PP have played in this sorry debacle.

Now is absolutely NOT the time to volunteer your content to the PP. Now is actually the time to withdraw any content you might have there to force the issue and make them pay the same commission as other agencies for it. Apparently they can afford to pay exclusives up to 46c per download. I'll have some of that please __ not 28c. For once we are beating Getty at their own game. Hopefully this could be the first of many victories if we act together.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Eco on February 24, 2011, 00:35
28c for non-exclusives?

I will remain opted out and I encourage all other non-exclusives to do the same.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Ploink on February 24, 2011, 00:55
It's interesting to see "management" in some kind of conversation with contributers after months of silence - or "Yeppers!" - at the most. Even if it quickly changes to: "I could tell you, but then I'd have to kill you" when it gets really interesting about long term strategy...
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Anyka on February 24, 2011, 00:59
I will have to refuse this very generous offer and stay opted out  ;D
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Chico on February 24, 2011, 01:11

JJRD's comment "Thanks to you for fighting, KK." seems to suggest that KK wanted to raise PP payouts, but somebody above him needed convincing.


Our personal super hero, the invencible F5CUTBUGMAN
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: SNP on February 24, 2011, 01:20
It's interesting to see "management" in some kind of conversation with contributers after months of silence - or "Yeppers!" - at the most. Even if it quickly changes to: "I could tell you, but then I'd have to kill you" when it gets really interesting about long term strategy...

I think it was simply an honest reply. it's not a guarantee and frankly I would like one, as unrealistic as that is. but those posts calmed some of my more recent concerns. certainly not with hard facts, as facts weren't offered and that much was said, but, I respect the sincerity of the message that was given and repeated. I have an obvious stake in iStock's success as an exclusive. I admittedly want to hear that TPTB are aware of the value that iStock represents and that the iStock brand=its content/contributors above all else. so it was good to see that put out there so boldly. anyways. I expect a good deal of disagreement, which is fine. I'm just expressing my impression of the exchange. information about their investment in the future of iStock is certainly a better carrot than pennies here and there in pay raises.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Ploink on February 24, 2011, 01:55
It's interesting to see "management" in some kind of conversation with contributers after months of silence - or "Yeppers!" - at the most. Even if it quickly changes to: "I could tell you, but then I'd have to kill you" when it gets really interesting about long term strategy...

I think it was simply an honest reply. it's not a guarantee and frankly I would like one, as unrealistic as that is. but those posts calmed some of my more recent concerns. certainly not with hard facts, as facts weren't offered and that much was said, but, I respect the sincerity of the message that was given and repeated. I have an obvious stake in iStock's success as an exclusive. I admittedly want to hear that TPTB are aware of the value that iStock represents and that the iStock brand=its content/contributors above all else. so it was good to see that put out there so boldly. anyways. I expect a good deal of disagreement, which is fine. I'm just expressing my impression of the exchange. information about their investment in the future of iStock is certainly a better carrot than pennies here and there in pay raises.

I'm truly amazed about the amout of faith in IS that you're still able to have, given their track record in the last 12 months. And that is not meant as a personal attack, I realize not everybody is a cynic like me and I admire people who manage to keep a positive view on things.

IMO, your main question, whether TS and IS serve two different markets or not, was not adressed at all, instead allusions 'to 'the future of our offerings'' were given. I'm sure Getty and H&F know the value that IS represents and that they have "no single reason (none) to set up iStockphoto for failure". They'd be crazy to do so as they are reaping in 85% to 55% of the profits. The questions remains if the bright future for IS will be equally bright for us contributors - exclusive or not...
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: lagereek on February 24, 2011, 02:01
Looks like a desperate action!  I dont know but it seams that no matter what they try nowdays it just simply backfires and why is that?  because the credibility is gone, nobody exept a poor newbie, believes in them.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Jo Ann Snover on February 24, 2011, 02:28
I was amazed to see something approaching a direct statement - that they want more content in the partner program than they currently have and a tacit admission that their lowball payout scheme has cost them that content.

The pathetic offer of a small amount of additional cash changes nothing. Admitting that that they're willing to change things in contributors' favor should only encourage people to hold out for something decent.

In spite of the fact that they're mandating 'lypse content (Japan and the April in London one) goes to the partner program, they haven't got to the flow of good new images they need to keep buyers happy. The risk would be that at some point they'd drop the opt out (like they did for Vetta/Agency on Getty).

I'm fairly certain JJRD believes what he's saying, but even sincere nice people can be very wrong sometimes. They can believe that what they're being told by their management is true and pass it on. The fact remains that what's in Getty's best short term interests may not be in IS contributors' long term interests. H&F is a Carl Icahn-like  (http://www.stlmag.com/St-Louis-Magazine/October-2005/TWA-Death-Of-A-Legend/)entity that will happily cripple a business if they can get the cash they want in the process - they're not in it for the long haul.

I urge anyone who is thinking about their stock portfolio's long term success to leave the partner program alone. That little bit of extra cash now is destructive to your ability to earn the same or higher royalty rate next year (no RCs for PP sales) and for independents is chipping away at the leader in microstock subs - SS. SS pays better (and lets you earn higher payouts the more you earn, something the PP does not) and while it may have skipped raises, hasn't shafted its contributors the way other sites have done.

Starving the partner program sites of good content is the only way to get any changes in the terms offered.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Ariene on February 24, 2011, 04:06
jsnover, I'm with you, I agree and think you're absolutely right so... I'm in, I mean I opt OUT wright now!
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: travelstock on February 24, 2011, 04:47
I was amazed to see something approaching a direct statement - that they want more content in the partner program than they currently have and a tacit admission that their lowball payout scheme has cost them that content.

The pathetic offer of a small amount of additional cash changes nothing. Admitting that that they're willing to change things in contributors' favor should only encourage people to hold out for something decent.

In spite of the fact that they're mandating 'lypse content (Japan and the April in London one) goes to the partner program, they haven't got to the flow of good new images they need to keep buyers happy. The risk would be that at some point they'd drop the opt out (like they did for Vetta/Agency on Getty).

I'm fairly certain JJRD believes what he's saying, but even sincere nice people can be very wrong sometimes. They can believe that what they're being told by their management is true and pass it on. The fact remains that what's in Getty's best short term interests may not be in IS contributors' long term interests. H&F is a Carl Icahn-like  ([url]http://www.stlmag.com/St-Louis-Magazine/October-2005/TWA-Death-Of-A-Legend/[/url])entity that will happily cripple a business if they can get the cash they want in the process - they're not in it for the long haul.

I urge anyone who is thinking about their stock portfolio's long term success to leave the partner program alone. That little bit of extra cash now is destructive to your ability to earn the same or higher royalty rate next year (no RCs for PP sales) and for independents is chipping away at the leader in microstock subs - Shutterstock. Shutterstock pays better (and lets you earn higher payouts the more you earn, something the PP does not) and while it may have skipped raises, hasn't shafted its contributors the way other sites have done.

Starving the partner program sites of good content is the only way to get any changes in the terms offered.


I'm not sure that making a direct statement is an admission of anything beyond what he actually says - they want more content in the program and are going to pay for it.

The way they've structured the royalty increases seems to suggest that what they want in their is the older IS exclusive stuff. Non-exclusives get a 12% increase, whereas Exclusives get a 25% increase.

Its probably not going to be enough to convince many non-exclusives that are now opted out now - where the problem seems more ideological opposition to anything Getty, but if you have a big, older portfolio of images that are suffering from low sales now, its a way of accessing the instant gratification that subscription sites like SS offer without losing the higher royalties at iStock. In context, the "pathetic offer" for exclusives is higher subscription royalties than the highest tier on Shutterstock or Fotolia. Compared to the 25c subs at Crestock, even the independents rates look good.

While I don't disagree with the sentiment, the reality of the PP is that its Getty's way of attacking Shutterstock & Dreamstime's offerings. The pricing of Thinkstock lines up neatly against SS and Photos.com undercuts Dreamstimes $129/mth subs packages. Those who disagree with the partner program do have valid reasons, but the reality in the market place is that there are subscription sites doing very well, and that from what I can tell IS is actually the only major site that lets you opt out of them. 
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: gaja on February 24, 2011, 05:07
.28 is more than I've been getting from regular Istock sales lately. Maybe I should opt out from Istock and in on the PP?
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: ShadySue on February 24, 2011, 05:09
they increase the payout now after you joint they will cut paid..this is their game
I was thinking exactly that as well.
Is it possible to opt out after one has already opted in?
If so, when they lower commissions once again, there could be a mass opt out done in protest.
Yes, I was in at first and only uploaded old non-sellers, most of which were only available at Medium. I opted straight out again when they mass emailled their big buyers suggesting they move over to TS, which made a mockery of what they had told us - that it was a 'new market' they were seeking. At that time, I think I got out within two weeks, a bit longer than the promised '10 days'. Since then, people have had all manner of problems, running on for months, if they want out (or IN!!!).
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: borg on February 24, 2011, 05:12
This is the attack on Shutterstock!!!!
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: BaldricksTrousers on February 24, 2011, 05:14
What's incredibly weird is that they are backdating it to Jan 1. That means that for almost two months they have been paying a higher rate without getting any benefit from it at all because nobody knew about it.
But a lot of things a istock are weird.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: ShadySue on February 24, 2011, 05:16
This is the attack on Shutterstock!!!!
Indeed, I was just about to add the following to my earlier post, but will add it here.
At first, I was happy with the idea that we (!!) would be stealing sales from SS, but with everything that's happened at iStock since then, I'd rather there were other agencies and not one monopoly that could then screw us even harder.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: aeonf on February 24, 2011, 05:16
OT: How can I know exactly how many of my photos are ACTUALLY on the PP site (Thinkstock)  ?
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: sharpshot on February 24, 2011, 05:21
This is just another insult.  28 cents is still below what was being paid by StockXpert years ago, 30 cents.  It's still 10 cents lower than I get with SS and all they have done is stop the other sites from raising their subs commissions.  

And I presume the only way I could supply them is through istock and I don't upload there any more because 17% commission doesn't interest me.

Getty/istock have really gone a long way to ruin my desire to be a microstock contributor.  The fact that they can't even bring themselves to match the old StockXpert subs commissions doesn't restore my faith in them, it feels like another big let down.  I will stay opted out and recommend any subs buyers go to shutterstock, as they have a much better collection and give their higher selling contributors a much fairer commission.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: borg on February 24, 2011, 05:23
This is the attack on Shutterstock!!!!
Indeed, I was just about to add the following to my earlier post, but will add it here.
At first, I was happy with the idea that we (!!) would be stealing sales from Shutterstock, but with everything that's happened at iStock since then, I'd rather there were other agencies and not one monopoly that could then screw us even harder.

Maybe they have plan to shut down Istockphoto also one day... True value is in customers, when someone want to buy site, he doing that only because of market part of that site...
So, they try to redirect subs customers to Thinkstock, also Veeta and Agency collection is step to traditional RF and RM and that part of customers they will redirect to Getty in a future..
Probably they don't want to have double crew on more than one site...
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: ShadySue on February 24, 2011, 05:27
OT: How can I know exactly how many of my photos are ACTUALLY on the PP site (Thinkstock)  ?
IIRC you can put your real name into the search box.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: aeonf on February 24, 2011, 05:33
OT: How can I know exactly how many of my photos are ACTUALLY on the PP site (Thinkstock)  ?
IIRC you can put your real name into the search box.

Nop. Doesn't work.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: qwerty on February 24, 2011, 05:37
is there any change to the commissions via the old stockxpert ?

What would be acceptable ?

30c like we got at stockxpert ?
33-38c like shutterstock ?
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: ShadySue on February 24, 2011, 06:20
OT: How can I know exactly how many of my photos are ACTUALLY on the PP site (Thinkstock)  ?
IIRC you can put your real name into the search box.

Nop. Doesn't work.
Sorry. I'm pretty sure it used to. I double checked with an iStocker's image I knew was there. Couldn't find it by his real name or user name (but the image is still there, triple check).
Hopefully someone else knows.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Ariene on February 24, 2011, 06:34
Used to work with:
'name surname'
but today I don't see my images too.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Ploink on February 24, 2011, 06:40
Used to work with:
'name surname'
but today I don't see my images too.

I just used "Real Name" and it worked as it always did  ??? Maybe it's double vs. single quotes?
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: ShadySue on February 24, 2011, 06:55
Used to work with:
'name surname'
but today I don't see my images too.

I just used "Real Name" and it worked as it always did  ??? Maybe it's double vs. single quotes?
I forgot the double quotes.  ::)
Tx!
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: aeonf on February 24, 2011, 08:14
Ploink: thanks, worked like a charm! :)
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: ThomasAmby on February 24, 2011, 09:03
28c for non-exclusives?

I will remain opted out and I encourage all other non-exclusives to do the same.

+1  ;) Not falling for that
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Microstock Posts on February 24, 2011, 09:04
This is just another insult.  28 cents is still below what was being paid by StockXpert years ago, 30 cents.  It's still 10 cents lower than I get with Shutterstock and all they have done is stop the other sites from raising their subs commissions.  

And I presume the only way I could supply them is through istock and I don't upload there any more because 17% commission doesn't interest me.

Getty/istock have really gone a long way to ruin my desire to be a microstock contributor.  The fact that they can't even bring themselves to match the old StockXpert subs commissions doesn't restore my faith in them, it feels like another big let down.  I will stay opted out and recommend any subs buyers go to shutterstock, as they have a much better collection and give their higher selling contributors a much fairer commission.

But don't they just not want non-exclusives? All their actions indicate that they do everything possible to deter non-exclusives, without actually saying out loud we don't want you.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Sean Locke Photography on February 24, 2011, 09:11
I guess we now know why the constant forced grab for content from the recent 'lypses for the PP.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: gostwyck on February 24, 2011, 09:25
But don't they just not want non-exclusives? All their actions indicate that they do everything possible to deter non-exclusives, without actually saying out loud we don't want you.

Of course they want non-exclusive content. They're just not prepared to pay fairly for it.

Even if they matched subscription commission levels at other agencies I don't think I'd participate. I just don't feel I can trust them. Nobody ever seems to know when and how their sales are going to be reported or paid and I don't know how anyone can have confidence that the reports are accurate. I don't think they care enough about it to provide the necessary resources.

Those of you that are in the PP should consider clubbing together and buying a month's subscription to test whether sales are being accurately reported. If you download most of the entitlement then the cost should be minimal as you'll be reimbursed through commissions.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: ShadySue on February 24, 2011, 09:49
I guess we now know why the constant forced grab for content from the recent 'lypses for the PP.
Kudos to you for actually getting them to state the enforced content grab.
After the Japan bash, you'd have thought they'd have been right upfront with this one, but even after you questioned it several times, they dithered and swithered about whether they were actually going to admit it.
I guess all the woo-wayers will still be in the bucket, though.
But at least you forced 'fully informed consent'.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: caspixel on February 24, 2011, 10:21
What boggles my mind is that people are thanking iStock for an 8 cent raise. Is my memory faulty, or didn't they recently CUT PP royalties? And now they are giving it back and people are woo-yaying? Classic iStockholm Syndrome.  ::)
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: mlwinphoto on February 24, 2011, 10:56
28c for non-exclusives?

I will remain opted out and I encourage all other non-exclusives to do the same.

+1  ;) Not falling for that

Ditto!!
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Jo Ann Snover on February 24, 2011, 11:01
What boggles my mind is that people are thanking iStock for an 8 cent raise. Is my memory faulty, or didn't they recently CUT PP royalties? And now they are giving it back and people are woo-yaying? Classic iStockholm Syndrome.  ::)


I don't think they changed PP royalties recently. There was the huge fuss when it was first announced and they changed the percentage system to the flat rate, but after that, I think it has stayed the same.

If I were independent and opted in already I'd be happy to take the extra few cents, although I'd be more concerned to have the portal to get new content to the site actually working. If I were one of the exclusives who chose to opt in earlier, the extra money would be a plus, but not a big one. They didn't touch the 20% on "image pack" sales, I notice.

With subscription sites the big thing is volume - SS has it and almost everywhere else doesn't. I watch the monthly threads where those in the PP report earnings, and it still seems pretty low numbers to me.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Starbucks on February 24, 2011, 11:28
iStockholm Syndrome.  ::)

 :D Funny, clever, and a little accurate.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Freedom on February 24, 2011, 13:18
Even though the raise does not excite me, iStock's PP never bothers me because the contributor is the decision maker, you can opt in or out. Not only that, you can decide which ones you want to opt in. If you don't like it, stay out of it.

The raise is better than a cut or mandatory opt-in, let's put it this way.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Risamay on February 24, 2011, 13:25
Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, but I think that there was some change. Maybe per the institution of RCs or going from a percentage to a flat rate. I can't recall now. There have been so many changes over the last year, it's hard to keep track and keep them all straight.

As I have PP files and earn a pittance now from ISP, I'm happy to have the additional $0.08 - though, I'm not doing cartwheels. But money DOES make me happy, so the tiny extra is welcome.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: melastmohican on February 24, 2011, 14:29
I decided to opt out now after participating since ThinkStock was opened. Results are actually pathetic and number of downloads is going down.  They were not able to attract enough buyers to make it viable competition to Shutterstock so I will no longer going to help them competing :-)
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: lisafx on February 24, 2011, 17:14
Well, most of my opinions on this have been well covered, but I will add to the chorus in case anyone's counting up who feels how...

My first reaction is happiness that, apparently, the boycott of TS by many of us has been successful in starving it for content.  It is rewarding to have this tangible confirmation that if enough of us band together, we can affect the conditions we work under. 

Of course, .28 is ridiculous.  I've seen the figure of an 8 cent raise mentioned several times, but for independents it's just a 3 cent raise.  And still 2 cents under what we were making through StockXpert two years ago.  Not tempting.  Sorry. 

Funny thing is, if they had simply kept us at the .30 we were making when they bought StockXpert, I would have stayed opted in.  But now, seeing how Getty wants to undermine the fairer agencies, how they have been directing Istock buyers to Thinkstock, and their insatiable greed and ruthlessness toward contributors and buyers alike, I can't imagine myself supporting them, even if the .30 was offered.

Because of the income I have built up on Istock, I can't afford to quit them right now.  But I don't have any TS income, so I can definitely afford not to start up with them in the first place.   I object to helping Getty further undermine the industry where I make my living.  And fortunately, the lowball offer of .28 makes the decision that much easier :)

And to everyone who has been opted in to the partner program and is getting a raise as a result of those who have stood firm against it:  You're welcome. ;)
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: iclick on February 24, 2011, 17:49
[url]http://www.istockphoto.com/forum_messages.php?threadid=307512&page=1[/url] ([url]http://www.istockphoto.com/forum_messages.php?threadid=307512&page=1[/url])

Here are the new Partner Program commissions, (retroactively) effective January 1, 2011:

Non-exclusives will earn 28˘ per download (was 25˘).

Exclusives will earn the following amounts per download, according to their current royalty level here at iStock:
25% at iStock - 38˘ (was 30˘)
30% – 40˘ (was 32˘)
35% – 42˘ (was 34˘)
40% – 44˘ (was 36˘)
45% – 46˘ (was 38˘)

So Istock is seeking to encourage participation at the low end while discouraging it at the mid-level (cutting commissions)

JJRD's comment "Thanks to you for fighting, KK." seems to suggest that KK wanted to raise PP payouts, but somebody above him needed convincing.

Insert jokes about sustainability here


28 cents?? you have to be kidding me, and we are suppoised to be thankful for that? Thanks but no thanks!

This is so transparent...... so now they want our support? IS/Getty may just get a wake up call that support and respect is a two way thing and hard to regain once lost!
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: iclick on February 24, 2011, 18:00
My first reaction is happiness that, apparently, the boycott of TS by many of us has been successful in starving it for content.  It is rewarding to have this tangible confirmation that if enough of us band together, we can affect the conditions we work under. 

  I object to helping Getty further undermine the industry where I make my living.  And fortunately, the lowball offer of .28 makes the decision that much easier :)


+1  ;)
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Phil on February 24, 2011, 18:03
I cant get past the thinking that this is offered now, people say yay! add 2 million images and next year we have, oh its not sustainable / need more money for marketing and it will get cut back down.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: lisafx on February 24, 2011, 18:11
I cant get past the thinking that this is offered now, people say yay! add 2 million images and next year we have, oh its not sustainable / need more money for marketing and it will get cut back down.

Yep.  You don't have to be psychic to see that one coming...
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: cathyslife on February 24, 2011, 18:15
And I can't get over how many contributors are grateful for this mere pittance, after all that has been taken away in the past few months! They take away dollars, give back pennies and everyone is happy! Stockholm syndrome indeed.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: gostwyck on February 24, 2011, 18:30
Well, most of my opinions on this have been well covered, but I will add to the chorus in case anyone's counting up who feels how...

My first reaction is happiness that, apparently, the boycott of TS by many of us has been successful in starving it for content.  It is rewarding to have this tangible confirmation that if enough of us band together, we can affect the conditions we work under. 

Of course, .28 is ridiculous.  I've seen the figure of an 8 cent raise mentioned several times, but for independents it's just a 3 cent raise.  And still 2 cents under what we were making through StockXpert two years ago.  Not tempting.  Sorry. 

Funny thing is, if they had simply kept us at the .30 we were making when they bought StockXpert, I would have stayed opted in.  But now, seeing how Getty wants to undermine the fairer agencies, how they have been directing Istock buyers to Thinkstock, and their insatiable greed and ruthlessness toward contributors and buyers alike, I can't imagine myself supporting them, even if the .30 was offered.

Because of the income I have built up on Istock, I can't afford to quit them right now.  But I don't have any TS income, so I can definitely afford not to start up with them in the first place.   I object to helping Getty further undermine the industry where I make my living.  And fortunately, the lowball offer of .28 makes the decision that much easier :)

And to everyone who has been opted in to the partner program and is getting a raise as a result of those who have stood firm against it:  You're welcome. ;)

Beautifully put Lisa, my thoughts entirely.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: cathyslife on February 24, 2011, 18:51
I cant get past the thinking that this is offered now, people say yay! add 2 million images and next year we have, oh its not sustainable / need more money for marketing and it will get cut back down.

Yep.  You don't have to be psychic to see that one coming...

And I think that they will take away the opt out right before the unsustainable announcement.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: ShadySue on February 24, 2011, 18:56
And to everyone who has been opted in to the partner program and is getting a raise as a result of those who have stood firm against it:  You're welcome. ;)
And don't forget to thank us for fighting so hard for your raise.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: gostwyck on February 24, 2011, 21:09
And to everyone who has been opted in to the partner program and is getting a raise as a result of those who have stood firm against it:  You're welcome. ;)
And don't forget to thank us for fighting so hard for your raise.

Of course the best way to thank us is to actually follow our lead and opt-out now. You'll be doing yourself and your future business prospects (and that of many others) a big favour at the same time. It's obvious what the right thing to do is.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: PaulieWalnuts on February 24, 2011, 21:15
I too will add my opinion. Thppppppppppppppp.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: WarrenPrice on February 24, 2011, 22:05
Not sure what happens when Opted In?  I'm not even sure how to find that option. My StockXpert images were transferred to Thinkstock.  How can I tell if iStock is continuing to add images?

Does being opted in mean that ALL my iStock images are available at Thinkstock ... for 28 cents?

Not really as dumb as I seem.  Just that I started with iStock using DeepMeta to Fetch Data.  Seldom login to the site itself.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Kone on February 24, 2011, 22:26
Not sure what happens when Opted In?  I'm not even sure how to find that option. My StockXpert images were transferred to Thinkstock.  How can I tell if iStock is continuing to add images?

Does being opted in mean that ALL my iStock images are available at Thinkstock ... for 28 cents?

Not really as dumb as I seem.  Just that I started with iStock using DeepMeta to Fetch Data.  Seldom login to the site itself.

Hey Warren,

Just go there and search for: "firstname lastname", if this is what you looking for

Kone
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: helix7 on February 24, 2011, 22:46
...Funny thing is, if they had simply kept us at the .30 we were making when they bought StockXpert, I would have stayed opted in.  But now, seeing how Getty wants to undermine the fairer agencies, how they have been directing Istock buyers to Thinkstock, and their insatiable greed and ruthlessness toward contributors and buyers alike, I can't imagine myself supporting them, even if the .30 was offered...

I never understood how Getty figured they would have a chance with TS up against Shutterstock, when Shutterstock has so many advantages. Instead of coming out with a real competitor, they did the typical istock thing and launched a buggy site with industry-low pay rates. Getty being the greedy ego-maniacs that they are figured they'd blast out of the gate with a real winner and get away with paying low and turning over high profits. What they failed to realize was that they weren't cutting rates for people already on board. They were asking everyone to join up with TS brand-new, so it was much easier for everyone to just say 'no thanks.'

This pay increase just looks like a desperation move after what is likely a disappointing start all around for TS. Most folks are opted out, so there's no chance that buyers at other subscription sites will be tempted to take their business to TS while the collection is sub-par. Getty has no choice now but to raise rates and hope they get the collection growing.

But, again in a typical istock-like fashion, the increased rate for independents is what I'd like to call "unsustainable" for the contributors, and even if they manage to get people opted in it won't have much inpact right now while the site is backlogged with opt-ins that haven't even been migrated yet.

I think TS has one possible move to survive and realistically compete: Raise independent rates to 35 cents. Short of that, TS will never gain enough support from independents and have a chance to pull buyers in from other sites.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: klsbear on February 24, 2011, 23:43
And to everyone who has been opted in to the partner program and is getting a raise as a result of those who have stood firm against it:  You're welcome. ;)
And don't forget to thank us for fighting so hard for your raise.

Of course the best way to thank us is to actually follow our lead and opt-out now. You'll be doing yourself and your future business prospects (and that of many others) a big favour at the same time. It's obvious what the right thing to do is.

Done!  I had opted in when I started uploading last year, but stopped including recent uploads a few months ago.  Today I opted out on every image. 
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: BaldricksTrousers on February 25, 2011, 02:19
While I understand the exclusives' position on this, particularly as iS has tried to redirect buyers to TS, I think the independents commenting on it have trapped themselves in some slightly hysterical group-think.

TS is not seeking to wipe out SS. If it was, it would not be charging more for access to an inferior collection. I suspect TS has actually increased its prices because last time I looked they were the same as SS, making it less competitive.  It obviously thinks it can access a market that is not already aware of what SS offers.

If everyone is so hot about not undermining higher-paying agencies, how come nobody among the independents was impressed by this argument when SS and DT and CS and Fot were undermining IS's pricing a couple of years back, when everything at IS seemed rosy for exclusives?

Initially, I was very worried by the implications of TS but when I saw some black diamonds climbing aboard I reached the conclusion that this was going to be a significant part of the market and the rational thing to do was to accept it and treat it the same way I treat the other significant micro agencies, none of which I am boycotting.

Finally, it's interesting to see how quickly people grab onto KK's words as the fountain of truth when he says something they want to hear. His track record hardly encourages faith in the accuracy of his announcements. Very often he seems to say something as a smokescreen for something else and "puts his foot in it" in the process. Telling boycotters "hey, you won, we can't get enough TS content" strikes me as another classic Kelly foot-in-mouth comment; I have trouble believing he would reveal that if it really was something they were worried about. So maybe they are trying to cheer up disconsolate exclusives after the commission cut, or maybe they increased the TS prices and this is keeping commission payouts at the corporate level. If lack of content was really the problem, wouldn't they reduced the exclusive lock-out to a year or six months, and then announce it was a special bonus for exclusives?

Anyway, carry on. If you want to boycott the thing that's fine with me.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: gostwyck on February 25, 2011, 04:47
While I understand the exclusives' position on this, particularly as iS has tried to redirect buyers to TS, I think the independents commenting on it have trapped themselves in some slightly hysterical group-think.

TS is not seeking to wipe out Shutterstock. If it was, it would not be charging more for access to an inferior collection. I suspect TS has actually increased its prices because last time I looked they were the same as Shutterstock, making it less competitive.  It obviously thinks it can access a market that is not already aware of what Shutterstock offers.

If everyone is so hot about not undermining higher-paying agencies, how come nobody among the independents was impressed by this argument when Shutterstock and Dreamstime and CS and Fot were undermining IS's pricing a couple of years back, when everything at IS seemed rosy for exclusives?

Initially, I was very worried by the implications of TS but when I saw some black diamonds climbing aboard I reached the conclusion that this was going to be a significant part of the market and the rational thing to do was to accept it and treat it the same way I treat the other significant micro agencies, none of which I am boycotting.

Finally, it's interesting to see how quickly people grab onto KK's words as the fountain of truth when he says something they want to hear. His track record hardly encourages faith in the accuracy of his announcements. Very often he seems to say something as a smokescreen for something else and "puts his foot in it" in the process. Telling boycotters "hey, you won, we can't get enough TS content" strikes me as another classic Kelly foot-in-mouth comment; I have trouble believing he would reveal that if it really was something they were worried about. So maybe they are trying to cheer up disconsolate exclusives after the commission cut, or maybe they increased the TS prices and this is keeping commission payouts at the corporate level. If lack of content was really the problem, wouldn't they reduced the exclusive lock-out to a year or six months, and then announce it was a special bonus for exclusives?

Anyway, carry on. If you want to boycott the thing that's fine with me.

Ugh __ you seem desperate to twist reality to justify selling yourself short with TS. It won't wash.

There are 39 BD's. How many of them have actually climbed aboard TS in any significant way? I can only see files from 3 of them, all independent, who have only got a relatively small proportion of their images at TS. Certainly not their entire port like you have done. Can you find any images from Lise, DNA, SJL, Hidesy, etc, etc. Of course not.

SS, DT, FT have always been cheaper than IS __ they had to be to gain a foothold in the market. That didn't matter to independent contributors because they all paid a much higher commission than IS. When was this curious time "a couple of years back" that you speak of when they suddenly "undermined IS" on price? As I remember it IS have continued to hike prices and the others have followed suite.

What about transparency and diligence of reporting too? Not only are you accepting piss-poor commissions that undermine much better agencies but you seem happy to accept whatever numbers they tell you happened ... a couple of months previously ... maybe ... if they feel like it ... whenever they can actually be bothered to do so.  You don't even get credited as the author of your own images. It's an absolute disgrace. Contributors to TS are being treated by Getty as worthless cretins who will accept whatever pennies they choose to throw at them at the time of Getty's own choosing. For a contributor to accept such conditions is essentially to agree with Getty just how worthless they consider themselves and their work. Do you touch your forelock in gratitude when Mr Getty throws a few coins at your feet? That's how it appears to me. Pathetic.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: BaldricksTrousers on February 25, 2011, 05:11
I really don't need a lecture from the Captain of the good ship "Boycott iStock uploads", thank you, Gostwyck.

You may think that nobody noticed that you jumped ship and were in the upload lifeboat 21 days after saying this:

"I've stopped uploading to Istock too. There will probably be some minor retraction from this announcement, maybe an adjustment to the redeemed credit levels, but it won't be enough. I may never upload another image to Istock again."

http://www.microstockgroup.com/istockphoto-com/istock-changing-royalty-structure/msg158888/#msg158888 (http://www.microstockgroup.com/istockphoto-com/istock-changing-royalty-structure/msg158888/#msg158888)

and this (in direct reference to me):
It'll be the same limp-wristed f*ck-wits who joined Thinkstock because "Ooh __ there's nothing we can do about the big juggernaut". You can pretty much guarantee that they'll wimp out of this fight too.
http://www.microstockgroup.com/istockphoto-com/istock-changing-royalty-structure/msg159171/#msg159171 (http://www.microstockgroup.com/istockphoto-com/istock-changing-royalty-structure/msg159171/#msg159171)

and even this:
Quote from: BaldricksTrousers on September 08, 2010, 17:22
Do you really think anything as feeble as an upload boycott is going to work, when 90% of submitters are probably still in blissful ignorance about this?


Gostwyck: Yes, given enough months, I think it has a very good chance. It's not as feeble an idea as doing nothing at all which seems to be your main suggestion.

http://www.microstockgroup.com/istockphoto-com/istock-changing-royalty-structure/msg159178/#msg159178 (http://www.microstockgroup.com/istockphoto-com/istock-changing-royalty-structure/msg159178/#msg159178)

But you couldn't even manage ONE month.

So it seems you are very good at shouting and badmouthing everyone, playing the cheerleader and guardian of "the right thing to do", but when it comes to standing by your words you are found wanting.

When you were complaining about pathetically low commissions at TS I asked if you would support a new agency offering 50% and you said no, because it wasn't delivering a worthwhile return (very true). So you are not even consistent about whether you want decent percentages or cash-in-hand regardless of the percentage.

You often have good points that are worthy of consideration but I hope the hectoring way you shout down anyone who disagrees with you doesn't push people into doing things that you won't really do - like boycotting Istock uploads, for example.

BTW, congratulations on the several hundred extremely fine images you have uploaded there since you began your "maybe never again" boycott. They really are excellent.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: ShadySue on February 25, 2011, 06:47
Not sure what happens when Opted In?  I'm not even sure how to find that option. My StockXpert images were transferred to Thinkstock.  How can I tell if iStock is continuing to add images?

Does being opted in mean that ALL my iStock images are available at Thinkstock ... for 28 cents?

Not really as dumb as I seem.  Just that I started with iStock using DeepMeta to Fetch Data.  Seldom login to the site itself.
I think if you're opted in you can still choose for each image. (certainly the option is there or exclusives, though that's iStock OR TS)
Not that I'm encouraging such an action.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: BaldricksTrousers on February 25, 2011, 06:49
If you go to partner program in the options available for "view portfolio" there is a box beside each image which you can tick to opt in or untick to opt out.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: sharpshot on February 25, 2011, 07:12
I really don't need a lecture from the Captain of the good ship "Boycott iStock uploads", thank you, Gostwyck.

You may think that nobody noticed that you jumped ship and were in the upload lifeboat 21 days after saying this:

"I've stopped uploading to Istock too. There will probably be some minor retraction from this announcement, maybe an adjustment to the redeemed credit levels, but it won't be enough. I may never upload another image to Istock again."

[url]http://www.microstockgroup.com/istockphoto-com/istock-changing-royalty-structure/msg158888/#msg158888[/url] ([url]http://www.microstockgroup.com/istockphoto-com/istock-changing-royalty-structure/msg158888/#msg158888[/url])

I feel like one of my fellow hunger strikers has been caught with a hamburger :)
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: fotografer on February 25, 2011, 07:17
Well, most of my opinions on this have been well covered, but I will add to the chorus in case anyone's counting up who feels how...

My first reaction is happiness that, apparently, the boycott of TS by many of us has been successful in starving it for content.  It is rewarding to have this tangible confirmation that if enough of us band together, we can affect the conditions we work under. 

Of course, .28 is ridiculous.  I've seen the figure of an 8 cent raise mentioned several times, but for independents it's just a 3 cent raise.  And still 2 cents under what we were making through StockXpert two years ago.  Not tempting.  Sorry. 

Funny thing is, if they had simply kept us at the .30 we were making when they bought StockXpert, I would have stayed opted in.  But now, seeing how Getty wants to undermine the fairer agencies, how they have been directing Istock buyers to Thinkstock, and their insatiable greed and ruthlessness toward contributors and buyers alike, I can't imagine myself supporting them, even if the .30 was offered.

Because of the income I have built up on Istock, I can't afford to quit them right now.  But I don't have any TS income, so I can definitely afford not to start up with them in the first place.   I object to helping Getty further undermine the industry where I make my living.  And fortunately, the lowball offer of .28 makes the decision that much easier :)

And to everyone who has been opted in to the partner program and is getting a raise as a result of those who have stood firm against it:  You're welcome. ;)

Beautifully put Lisa, my thoughts entirely.
Lisa and Jsnover always manages to say everything that I want to say and in a much better way than I ever could :)
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: BooKitty on February 25, 2011, 08:53
Call me what you will but I am opted into the PP and I am happy about the increase.  :)

You've got fewer than 200 sales at IS in nearly 3 years. It may only be a bit of pin money and fun to you but to those of us who earn our living through microstock the PP would potentially be very damaging if it were to become successful. That's why anyone with any sense or hope for the future doesn't support it.

Fortunately that possibility seems remote right now. The fact that Getty are actually increasing commissions (shock, horror) indicates just how poorly the PP is being supported with new content and gaining customers. Good.

It's not enough for me. They'll have to match the commission structures at Shutterstock, Dreamstime and Fotolia if they want my content.

Actually I did not become a contributor till July 2009, so it's less than 2 years. I stopped uploading in April 2010 because I got a full time job after being unemployed for two years. Yes I am a low earning part timer and no competition for anyone.  If the small TS royalties are too small and insulting for you then don't opt in. I am OK with it. if I want to give my stuff away for free that is my business. Say what you will about how this will destroy the micro model at IS, I don't buy it.

I am not going to try and convince anyone to opt in and I would certainly never call anyone foolish if they don't. I want to opt in, that is my prerogative. I get that it's not for everyone but quit bashing those that are in it. I suspect that there are a lot more people opted in, they just aren't going to mention here, seeing the reception they receive.   

Peace out.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: jamirae on February 25, 2011, 10:39
is there still an issue with getting files on or off the PP?  last I remember if you opted out, after having previously been in, your files remained there for sale due to some feature.. er.. I mean bug in the system.  is that still the case or has that bug been squashed?
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Jo Ann Snover on February 25, 2011, 10:48
It's apparently been offline since Jan 29th after a brief period working before that - see here (http://www.istockphoto.com/forum_messages.php?threadid=307512&messageid=5933142) for more.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: BooKitty on February 25, 2011, 11:32
What boggles my mind is that people are thanking iStock for an 8 cent raise. Is my memory faulty, or didn't they recently CUT PP royalties? And now they are giving it back and people are woo-yaying? Classic iStockholm Syndrome.  ::)


I don't think they changed PP royalties recently. There was the huge fuss when it was first announced and they changed the percentage system to the flat rate, but after that, I think it has stayed the same.

If I were independent and opted in already I'd be happy to take the extra few cents, although I'd be more concerned to have the portal to get new content to the site actually working. If I were one of the exclusives who chose to opt in earlier, the extra money would be a plus, but not a big one. They didn't touch the 20% on "image pack" sales, I notice.

With subscription sites the big thing is volume - Shutterstock has it and almost everywhere else doesn't. I watch the monthly threads where those in the PP report earnings, and it still seems pretty low numbers to me.

I understand where you are coming from. However, the extra $10-20 dollars per month I make at TS (and that is with only 52 files out of my 96 opted in showing) it allows me to buy a sandwich for lunch one day a week or get the name brand peanut butter instead of the store brand. I don't want to sound pathetic, but this is just the way it is for me and I suspect many other folks as well.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: SNP on February 25, 2011, 12:22
While I understand the exclusives' position on this, particularly as iS has tried to redirect buyers to TS, I think the independents commenting on it have trapped themselves in some slightly hysterical group-think.

TS is not seeking to wipe out Shutterstock. If it was, it would not be charging more for access to an inferior collection. I suspect TS has actually increased its prices because last time I looked they were the same as Shutterstock, making it less competitive.  It obviously thinks it can access a market that is not already aware of what Shutterstock offers.

If everyone is so hot about not undermining higher-paying agencies, how come nobody among the independents was impressed by this argument when Shutterstock and Dreamstime and CS and Fot were undermining IS's pricing a couple of years back, when everything at IS seemed rosy for exclusives?

Initially, I was very worried by the implications of TS but when I saw some black diamonds climbing aboard I reached the conclusion that this was going to be a significant part of the market and the rational thing to do was to accept it and treat it the same way I treat the other significant micro agencies, none of which I am boycotting.

Finally, it's interesting to see how quickly people grab onto KK's words as the fountain of truth when he says something they want to hear. His track record hardly encourages faith in the accuracy of his announcements. Very often he seems to say something as a smokescreen for something else and "puts his foot in it" in the process. Telling boycotters "hey, you won, we can't get enough TS content" strikes me as another classic Kelly foot-in-mouth comment; I have trouble believing he would reveal that if it really was something they were worried about. So maybe they are trying to cheer up disconsolate exclusives after the commission cut, or maybe they increased the TS prices and this is keeping commission payouts at the corporate level. If lack of content was really the problem, wouldn't they reduced the exclusive lock-out to a year or six months, and then announce it was a special bonus for exclusives?

Anyway, carry on. If you want to boycott the thing that's fine with me.

I'm remaining opted out for now. but I think this post is excellent. well said. the latest PP discussion had me thinking a lot about it. the biggest obstacle standing between me and opting in is this : if I extrapolate on the current situation and consider all exclusive main collection content mirrored on TS....the most obvious outcome is that buyers start migrating to TS instead of Stock. I just can't shake that because it seems the inevitable consequence. what makes exclusive content valuable on iStock is it's relative unavailability elsewhere. as an exclusive, it's a different decision than the decision faced by non-exclusives.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: ShadySue on February 25, 2011, 12:47
I just did a search on TS which returned 0 results, and a suggestion that I should try Getty, as there were 607 matching images.
Not a bleat about iStock, where there happen to be over 7,000 matching files.
So, not directing customers to the widest choice, which would probably be best for them. Directing them to where the profit is 80%.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Risamay on February 25, 2011, 13:04
Initially, I was very worried by the implications of TS but when I saw some black diamonds climbing aboard I reached the conclusion that this was going to be a significant part of the market and the rational thing to do was to accept it and treat it the same way I treat the other significant micro agencies, none of which I am boycotting.

Finally, it's interesting to see how quickly people grab onto KK's words as the fountain of truth when he says something they want to hear. His track record hardly encourages faith in the accuracy of his announcements. Very often he seems to say something as a smokescreen for something else and "puts his foot in it" in the process. Telling boycotters "hey, you won, we can't get enough TS content" strikes me as another classic Kelly foot-in-mouth comment; I have trouble believing he would reveal that if it really was something they were worried about. So maybe they are trying to cheer up disconsolate exclusives after the commission cut, or maybe they increased the TS prices and this is keeping commission payouts at the corporate level. If lack of content was really the problem, wouldn't they reduced the exclusive lock-out to a year or six months, and then announce it was a special bonus for exclusives?

+1
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Risamay on February 25, 2011, 13:17
If you go to partner program in the options available for "view portfolio" there is a box beside each image which you can tick to opt in or untick to opt out.

Didn't there used to be two boxes so you could see if an image was on both IS and PP sites? And somehow the PP box was grayed out if it was still too new a file to appear on both sites. Now I'm confused. How long is it before a file can be on both sites? 18 calendar months? Or is it that if you're an indie, you can have all files on both sites - new or not?

I'm getting sick of IS making changes to its site that make it more of a hassle to use than not.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Starbucks on February 25, 2011, 13:20
Any iStock exclusive should, quite obviously, opt out of this; Not doing so is short sighted. I can't believe exclusives are even debating about this.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Sean Locke Photography on February 25, 2011, 13:22
Not only that, but they're paying thousands of dollars to go to an event to create content for it . ?...
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Mantis on February 25, 2011, 22:08
hmmm, so withholding images from an agency pp has for the first time been officially confirmed as a legit way to put enough pressure on an agency to get them to raise commissions! So it is also official that the 25cents was not what they could reasonably afford to pay to keep the program sustainable as they always claim with all the rates, but was the lowest price they thought they could get away with paying us.  So we can also be certain that the new price structure was just pulled out of thin air as well. Well I must humbly apologize to those folks who held strong and opted out as I thought it would make no difference so I opted in way back, I wonder if holding out longer will increase it more?

Ha..good summary.  We all know how difficult it's been to "PULL" ports from the partner program once they're in.  So maybe the strategy is to lure in more contributors with a whopping 28 cents (for nons) and a tad more for exclusives.  Then as soon as they have what they're looking for, VIOLA!  A commission cut:) 
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: caspixel on February 25, 2011, 22:12
Not only that, but they're paying thousands of dollars to go to an event to create content for it . ?...

I'm not much of a business person, but even I can see the ROI for that is crap. LOL
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: RacePhoto on February 25, 2011, 22:21
Not only that, but they're paying thousands of dollars to go to an event to create content for it . ?...

I'm not much of a business person, but even I can see the ROI for that is crap. LOL

Actually this came up with the whole JUI, StockXpert, Photos.com issues back in 2008 and here's the quote that explains it all.

In February 2006, Getty Images, the largest agency by far with more than 30 percent of the global market, purchased iStockphoto for $50 million. “If someone’s going to cannibalize your business, better it be one of your other businesses,” says Getty CEO Jonathan Klein."

This is the same logic. If subs are stealing your customers and low price sites are draining your sales... create the same type of site and content and cannibalize your own sales.

Same as the conclusion that many people came to when confronted with the fact that they cannibalize their own sales by selling on all the cheap sub sites. They fear that someone else will make that sale if the image isn't on the cheap sites. The same photos on all the sites, which is the same thing that Getty is doing, but they are the evil dumb people and we're the smart marketing people.

Funny how the same act and philosophy of cannibalizing sales, with pricing and selling everything, everywhere, is OK for artists, but the subject of constant criticism for an agency.

I obviously don't see any difference.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: michealo on February 26, 2011, 06:40
Not only that, but they're paying thousands of dollars to go to an event to create content for it . ?...

I'm not much of a business person, but even I can see the ROI for that is crap. LOL

Not having ever attended one how can you say that?

Some attendees at Tokyo have already covered all their costs from sales.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: ShadySue on February 26, 2011, 07:14

Some attendees at Tokyo have already covered all their costs from sales.
Must be from Getty sales then [1]. The top sale on iStock in the 'lypse lightbox has <40 sales. Of course, if a contributor lived in Tokyo, and already had the relevant gear, they would have had very little out-of-pocket expense for that 'lypse. Even if someone lives in central London, there's a $500 fee to participate.
[1] Or maybe Thinkstock.  ::)
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: caspixel on February 26, 2011, 10:28
Not only that, but they're paying thousands of dollars to go to an event to create content for it . ?...

I'm not much of a business person, but even I can see the ROI for that is crap. LOL

Not having ever attended one how can you say that?

Some attendees at Tokyo have already covered all their costs from sales.

From sales on TS? Really? Prove it.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Sean Locke Photography on February 26, 2011, 10:42
Yeah, sorry, no way.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: michealo on February 26, 2011, 11:46
Not only that, but they're paying thousands of dollars to go to an event to create content for it . ?...

I'm not much of a business person, but even I can see the ROI for that is crap. LOL

Not having ever attended one how can you say that?

Some attendees at Tokyo have already covered all their costs from sales.

From sales on TS? Really? Prove it.
I am talking about the ROI from events. Not from PP from IS.

@Sean I sure you made a return on your HQ lypse investment? No?
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Jo Ann Snover on February 26, 2011, 12:59
...I am talking about the ROI from events. Not from PP from IS.

@Sean I sure you made a return on your HQ lypse investment? No?


I don't know how Sean did, but I went to the HQ lypse and have not made in sales what it cost me to attend - airfare, hotel, taxis, meals, $500 ticket cost. That's absolutely fine as I figured the experience would be worth it for me - an opportunity learn that has real value IMO.

I've talked with others who attended that lypse and have attended others (this was my one and only). The common thread seems to be the experience, not the financial payback. So if someone somewhere once did make it pay I don't think that changes the general situation for most attendees.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Risamay on February 26, 2011, 14:57
I don't know how Sean did, but I went to the HQ lypse and have not made in sales what it cost me to attend - airfare, hotel, taxis, meals, $500 ticket cost. That's absolutely fine as I figured the experience would be worth it for me - an opportunity learn that has real value IMO.

I've talked with others who attended that lypse and have attended others (this was my one and only). The common thread seems to be the experience, not the financial payback. So if someone somewhere once did make it pay I don't think that changes the general situation for most attendees.

That makes sense. Big events with many multiple photographers all shooting the same or very similar subjects, from different angles ... It would be surprising if those were big money-making events for the attendees, right? Seems much more an opportunity to learn, meet your peers and iStock idols, hang out, and get pretty drunk (from what I can tell or have heard). Sounds like fun. Or, it used to.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: nruboc on February 26, 2011, 15:08
Istock's lucky, so much wholly owned content makes it simple to compensate for these increased commissions. One thing is certain, they aren't going to lose money with this move.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Sadstock on February 26, 2011, 22:43
I agree its hard to cover 'lyspe expenses.  But here is one contributor who certainly covered them.  :-)
http://www.istockphoto.com/search/lightbox/2171221/#183a83b5 (http://www.istockphoto.com/search/lightbox/2171221/#183a83b5)
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: caspixel on February 27, 2011, 01:55
I agree its hard to cover 'lyspe expenses.  But here is one contributor who certainly covered them.  :-)
[url]http://www.istockphoto.com/search/lightbox/2171221/#183a83b5[/url] ([url]http://www.istockphoto.com/search/lightbox/2171221/#183a83b5[/url])


But would he have from sales on TS instead? That was the whole joke about it.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: michealo on February 27, 2011, 09:13
I agree its hard to cover 'lyspe expenses.  But here is one contributor who certainly covered them.  :-)
[url]http://www.istockphoto.com/search/lightbox/2171221/#183a83b5[/url] ([url]http://www.istockphoto.com/search/lightbox/2171221/#183a83b5[/url])


But would he have from sales on TS instead? That was the whole joke about it.


Your point was that there wasn't an ROI from lypses, there is for some contributers.
I'm not discussing the PP except in that it's a condition that lypse content is added to it. Personally I have no issue with that.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Sadstock on February 27, 2011, 09:43
I agree its hard to cover 'lyspe expenses.  But here is one contributor who certainly covered them.  :-)
[url]http://www.istockphoto.com/search/lightbox/2171221/#183a83b5[/url] ([url]http://www.istockphoto.com/search/lightbox/2171221/#183a83b5[/url])


But would he have from sales on TS instead? That was the whole joke about it.



I was more responding to jsnover's point that few 'lypse attendees cover their expenses through any kind of sales which I fully agree with.  Just posting the link with the exception that proves the rule. 
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Sean Locke Photography on February 27, 2011, 10:24
Well, Austin was like 5 years ago.

Yes, there are exceptions to the rule, but most people won't make their money back from the 'lypses.  It's up to you, of course, whether just having a fun weekend (although now they are like a week long!) is worth the money.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: OhGoAway! on February 27, 2011, 10:30
I agree its hard to cover 'lyspe expenses.  But here is one contributor who certainly covered them.  :-)
[url]http://www.istockphoto.com/search/lightbox/2171221/#183a83b5[/url] ([url]http://www.istockphoto.com/search/lightbox/2171221/#183a83b5[/url])


But would he have from sales on TS instead? That was the whole joke about it.



I was more responding to jsnover's point that few 'lypse attendees cover their expenses through any kind of sales which I fully agree with.  Just posting the link with the exception that proves the rule. 


Even that example, I think, is iffy. There are locations from three different 'lypses in that lightbox -- Seattle, Nevada (whatever they called that one out there), and Austin. If you sort by downloads, the top downloaded file has more than 600 . . . by the bottom of the page, you're at around 30 downloads.  I didn't check them all, but even if you give credit for 4000 downloads from that front page (which I think is more than generous), at an average return rate, I think it's STILL not guaranteed he's covered costs. $500 tickets, travel, hotels & food . . . that adds up fast.  
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: ichiro17 on February 27, 2011, 11:07
I really don't need a lecture from the Captain of the good ship "Boycott iStock uploads", thank you, Gostwyck.

You may think that nobody noticed that you jumped ship and were in the upload lifeboat 21 days after saying this:

"I've stopped uploading to Istock too. There will probably be some minor retraction from this announcement, maybe an adjustment to the redeemed credit levels, but it won't be enough. I may never upload another image to Istock again."

[url]http://www.microstockgroup.com/istockphoto-com/istock-changing-royalty-structure/msg158888/#msg158888[/url] ([url]http://www.microstockgroup.com/istockphoto-com/istock-changing-royalty-structure/msg158888/#msg158888[/url])

and this (in direct reference to me):
It'll be the same limp-wristed f*ck-wits who joined Thinkstock because "Ooh __ there's nothing we can do about the big juggernaut". You can pretty much guarantee that they'll wimp out of this fight too.
[url]http://www.microstockgroup.com/istockphoto-com/istock-changing-royalty-structure/msg159171/#msg159171[/url] ([url]http://www.microstockgroup.com/istockphoto-com/istock-changing-royalty-structure/msg159171/#msg159171[/url])

and even this:
Quote from: BaldricksTrousers on September 08, 2010, 17:22
Do you really think anything as feeble as an upload boycott is going to work, when 90% of submitters are probably still in blissful ignorance about this?


Gostwyck: Yes, given enough months, I think it has a very good chance. It's not as feeble an idea as doing nothing at all which seems to be your main suggestion.

[url]http://www.microstockgroup.com/istockphoto-com/istock-changing-royalty-structure/msg159178/#msg159178[/url] ([url]http://www.microstockgroup.com/istockphoto-com/istock-changing-royalty-structure/msg159178/#msg159178[/url])

But you couldn't even manage ONE month.

So it seems you are very good at shouting and badmouthing everyone, playing the cheerleader and guardian of "the right thing to do", but when it comes to standing by your words you are found wanting.

When you were complaining about pathetically low commissions at TS I asked if you would support a new agency offering 50% and you said no, because it wasn't delivering a worthwhile return (very true). So you are not even consistent about whether you want decent percentages or cash-in-hand regardless of the percentage.

You often have good points that are worthy of consideration but I hope the hectoring way you shout down anyone who disagrees with you doesn't push people into doing things that you won't really do - like boycotting Istock uploads, for example.

BTW, congratulations on the several hundred extremely fine images you have uploaded there since you began your "maybe never again" boycott. They really are excellent.


finally someone says it!
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Rob Sylvan on February 27, 2011, 13:13
FWIW, I gave the PP a fair run when it first launched just to see how it went. I opted in all that was eligible of mine, but I think only about 150 or so ever made it over there. I opted out last October and it took until Jan of this year to get all the files finally off. Over the course of last year I earned less than $100 from the PP. My understanding of the sort on PP sites is that it favors newness, so my files, being the geezer that I am, were at a disadvantage. I won't be opting back in under the updated structure.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Sadstock on February 27, 2011, 16:46
FWIW, I gave the PP a fair run when it first launched just to see how it went. I opted in all that was eligible of mine, but I think only about 150 or so ever made it over there. I opted out last October and it took until Jan of this year to get all the files finally off. Over the course of last year I earned less than $100 from the PP. My understanding of the sort on PP sites is that it favors newness, so my files, being the geezer that I am, were at a disadvantage. I won't be opting back in under the updated structure.
----------------------------


Given that you've been in since it first launched, why did you decide to pull out in October?  Point taken on favoring newness so likely few sales in the future.  But as it seems you had little concerns about cannibalism at first launch, something must have changed your perspective.  Was it the September announcement or something else?
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Jo Ann Snover on February 27, 2011, 17:44
Rob, you're not exclusive any more. Am I just spacing something I already knew or is this a recent change?

Will you be uploading elsewhere? And you can't be a geezer or that'd make me even more ancient :)
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Sadstock on February 27, 2011, 18:15
Rob, you're not exclusive any more. Am I just spacing something I already knew or is this a recent change?

Will you be uploading elsewhere? And you can't be a geezer or that'd make me even more ancient :)

----------------------

Wow!  Your right, no crown.  I don't think you spaced it.  

Rob welcome to the dark, light, this side  :)

Or maybe its just a new Istock bug? ::)
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: jamirae on February 27, 2011, 18:22
Rob, you're not exclusive any more. Am I just spacing something I already knew or is this a recent change?

Will you be uploading elsewhere? And you can't be a geezer or that'd make me even more ancient :)

darn it.. more competition! ;)
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Rob Sylvan on February 27, 2011, 21:20
Given that you've been in since it first launched, why did you decide to pull out in October?  Point taken on favoring newness so likely few sales in the future.  But as it seems you had little concerns about cannibalism at first launch, something must have changed your perspective.  Was it the September announcement or something else?

I was not worried about the PP eating pay-as-you-go sales. I just didn't like how it was run and no longer wanted any part of it.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: michealo on February 28, 2011, 05:15
...I am talking about the ROI from events. Not from PP from IS.

@Sean I sure you made a return on your HQ lypse investment? No?


I don't know how Sean did, but I went to the HQ lypse and have not made in sales what it cost me to attend - airfare, hotel, taxis, meals, $500 ticket cost. That's absolutely fine as I figured the experience would be worth it for me - an opportunity learn that has real value IMO.

I've talked with others who attended that lypse and have attended others (this was my one and only). The common thread seems to be the experience, not the financial payback. So if someone somewhere once did make it pay I don't think that changes the general situation for most attendees.

The top selling photo from Malta had over 900 dls, I am pretty sure for that contributor that that photo alone probably paid for their trip.
The top selling photo from Berlin had over 600 dls, and of course this isn't the only picture they had.

I am not an iStock apologist but facts are facts. Lots of contributors make money from official lypses.

Personally I have never made my money back from an official lypse but I am happy to accept I'm not all that great a photographer ...
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: leaf on February 28, 2011, 08:52
...I am talking about the ROI from events. Not from PP from IS.

@Sean I sure you made a return on your HQ lypse investment? No?


I don't know how Sean did, but I went to the HQ lypse and have not made in sales what it cost me to attend - airfare, hotel, taxis, meals, $500 ticket cost. That's absolutely fine as I figured the experience would be worth it for me - an opportunity learn that has real value IMO.

I've talked with others who attended that lypse and have attended others (this was my one and only). The common thread seems to be the experience, not the financial payback. So if someone somewhere once did make it pay I don't think that changes the general situation for most attendees.


The top selling photo from Malta had over 900 dls, I am pretty sure for that contributor that that photo alone probably paid for their trip.
The top selling photo from Berlin had over 600 dls, and of course this isn't the only picture they had.

I am not an iStock apologist but facts are facts. Lots of contributors make money from official lypses.

Personally I have never made my money back from an official lypse but I am happy to accept I'm not all that great a photographer ...


I think the iStock events are generally a positive net investment.  Of course the mileage varies for everyone, but with my earnings from the malta trip I paid off all my expenses (http://www.microstockgroup.com/microstock-gtg/anyone-going-to-ref5resh-in-malta/msg140386/#msg140386) over a year ago.  If I was exclusive and if it had been a 'real' istockalypse it would have been quite a bit easier to turn a profit.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: jamirae on February 28, 2011, 10:19
I've never been to an iStockalypse but I have been to several minilypses.  the Red Rock events in Utah - I attended the first two, paid for themselves within a year (just looking at sales from photos taken at that event only).  Other minilypses I've been less fortunate and have not recouped what I spent.  However.. the friendships I made and the many different things I learned were well worth the price.  It just all depends on how you look at it. 
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: lisafx on February 28, 2011, 10:28
Can I just say how nauseating it is to read all the "thank you Kelly" posts on the Istock thread about this?!  

Note to the fawning sycophants confused and misguided - Kelly/Istock/Getty, aren't responsible for getting you this "raise".  Nobody at HQ "fought" for you - least of all Kelly "money isn't going to be what makes you happy" Thompson.   

They are only doing this in response to the majority, who opted out of their insulting, cheapo PP royalties in the first place.  Believe me, if they could get away with keeping your royalties low and just sweetening the pot for the holdouts, they would do it.   ::)
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: cathyslife on February 28, 2011, 10:37
Can I just say how nauseating it is to read all the "thank you Kelly" posts on the Istock thread about this?!  

Note to the fawning sycophants confused and misguided - Kelly/Istock/Getty, aren't responsible for getting you this "raise".  Nobody at HQ "fought" for you - least of all Kelly "money isn't going to be what makes you happy" Thompson.  

They are only doing this in response to the majority, who opted out of their insulting, cheapo PP royalties in the first place.  Believe me, if they could get away with keeping your royalties low and just sweetening the pot for the holdouts, they would do it.   ::)

+1

If it were up to Kelly/istock/getty, most contributors wouldn't be getting paid at all. And they are almost there!
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Microstock Posts on February 28, 2011, 10:51
Can I just say how nauseating it is to read all the "thank you Kelly" posts on the Istock thread about this?!  

Note to the fawning sycophants confused and misguided - Kelly/Istock/Getty, aren't responsible for getting you this "raise".  Nobody at HQ "fought" for you - least of all Kelly "money isn't going to be what makes you happy" Thompson.   

They are only doing this in response to the majority, who opted out of their insulting, cheapo PP royalties in the first place.  Believe me, if they could get away with keeping your royalties low and just sweetening the pot for the holdouts, they would do it.   ::)

Lisa, why don't you just tell it as it is, instead of beating around the bush? I just want to say thank you Kelly for this raise, I know we have helped line your pockets beyond belief, but it is a small price to pay for enriching our lives. I would not be half the person I am today without iStock, thank you Kelly and may God bless you and all your children and all your childrens children, you have truly touched the lives of so many and indeed you are a truly noble and gracious person. Thank you Kelly, thank you!!!  ::)
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: WarrenPrice on February 28, 2011, 11:45
Can I just say how nauseating it is to read all the "thank you Kelly" posts on the Istock thread about this?!  

Note to the fawning sycophants confused and misguided - Kelly/Istock/Getty, aren't responsible for getting you this "raise".  Nobody at HQ "fought" for you - least of all Kelly "money isn't going to be what makes you happy" Thompson.   

They are only doing this in response to the majority, who opted out of their insulting, cheapo PP royalties in the first place.  Believe me, if they could get away with keeping your royalties low and just sweetening the pot for the holdouts, they would do it.   ::)

Lisa, why don't you just tell it as it is, instead of beating around the bush? I just want to say thank you Kelly for this raise, I know we have helped line your pockets beyond belief, but it is a small price to pay for enriching our lives. I would not be half the person I am today without iStock, thank you Kelly and may God bless you and all your children and all your childrens children, you have truly touched the lives of so many and indeed you are a truly noble and gracious person. Thank you Kelly, thank you!!!  ::)

 ;D
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: RacePhoto on February 28, 2011, 18:41
Can I just say how nauseating it is to read all the "thank you Kelly" posts on the Istock thread about this?!  

Note to the fawning sycophants confused and misguided - Kelly/Istock/Getty, aren't responsible for getting you this "raise".  Nobody at HQ "fought" for you - least of all Kelly "money isn't going to be what makes you happy" Thompson.   

They are only doing this in response to the majority, who opted out of their insulting, cheapo PP royalties in the first place.  Believe me, if they could get away with keeping your royalties low and just sweetening the pot for the holdouts, they would do it.   ::)

+1 And I do believe you.

I'm still confused by the money doesn't make me happy claim. What do I use to buy all my new toys and cameras if I have no money? Certainly not my "good looks" at this stage.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Karimala on March 01, 2011, 13:35
Well, most of my opinions on this have been well covered, but I will add to the chorus in case anyone's counting up who feels how...

My first reaction is happiness that, apparently, the boycott of TS by many of us has been successful in starving it for content.  It is rewarding to have this tangible confirmation that if enough of us band together, we can affect the conditions we work under. 

Of course, .28 is ridiculous.  I've seen the figure of an 8 cent raise mentioned several times, but for independents it's just a 3 cent raise.  And still 2 cents under what we were making through StockXpert two years ago.  Not tempting.  Sorry. 

Funny thing is, if they had simply kept us at the .30 we were making when they bought StockXpert, I would have stayed opted in.  But now, seeing how Getty wants to undermine the fairer agencies, how they have been directing Istock buyers to Thinkstock, and their insatiable greed and ruthlessness toward contributors and buyers alike, I can't imagine myself supporting them, even if the .30 was offered.

Because of the income I have built up on Istock, I can't afford to quit them right now.  But I don't have any TS income, so I can definitely afford not to start up with them in the first place.   I object to helping Getty further undermine the industry where I make my living.  And fortunately, the lowball offer of .28 makes the decision that much easier :)

And to everyone who has been opted in to the partner program and is getting a raise as a result of those who have stood firm against it:  You're welcome. ;)

Thank you, Lisa and everyone else!   :)

I totally agree with Lisa's post and want out of Getty soooooooooooo bad, but I just can't swing it yet financially.  However, I also can't justify myself contributing my hard work to a company that acts like a giant robber baron, so I stopped uploading new content when they moved StockXpert to TS.  Currently I'm developing new avenues for revenue and will completely leave the Getty racket once my income is up to a certain level.

What's happening in Wisconsin isn't unlike what Getty is doing to our industry...the little guy always making concessions and sacrifices so the big guy can take more and more and more.  Enough already!     
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Karimala on March 01, 2011, 13:54
Can I just say how nauseating it is to read all the "thank you Kelly" posts on the Istock thread about this?!  

Note to the fawning sycophants confused and misguided - Kelly/Istock/Getty, aren't responsible for getting you this "raise".  Nobody at HQ "fought" for you - least of all Kelly "money isn't going to be what makes you happy" Thompson.   

They are only doing this in response to the majority, who opted out of their insulting, cheapo PP royalties in the first place.  Believe me, if they could get away with keeping your royalties low and just sweetening the pot for the holdouts, they would do it.   ::)

Lisa, why don't you just tell it as it is, instead of beating around the bush? I just want to say thank you Kelly for this raise, I know we have helped line your pockets beyond belief, but it is a small price to pay for enriching our lives. I would not be half the person I am today without iStock, thank you Kelly and may God bless you and all your children and all your children's children, you have truly touched the lives of so many and indeed you are a truly noble and gracious person. Thank you Kelly, thank you!!!  ::)

You guys are awesome!   ;D

Money doesn't make me happy?  BS.   ::)  I'd love to read Kelly's post where he says that. 

What doesn't make me happy is watching my monthly income decrease month after month after month and increasingly worrying whether I'll be able to pay the electric bill or rent, all because of Getty's cannibalistic decisions.  I used to routinely earn $500 per month at IS.  Now I'm lucky if I break $100.  TS earnings through StockXpert and IS combined are less than half of what my StockXpert earnings alone were before Getty bought Jupiter.  None of the other agencies...not one of them!...has been losing money for me.  Only Getty...and now they have the audacity to preach how money doesn't make people happy?  F* 'em.  Getty isn't profiting me one bit and I'll be ending my relationship with them in the next few months once I have my new revenue streams up and running.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: lisafx on March 01, 2011, 15:18
I used to routinely earn $500 per month at IS.  Now I'm lucky if I break $100.  TS earnings through StockXpert and IS combined are less than half of what my StockXpert earnings alone were before Getty bought Jupiter.  None of the other agencies...not one of them!...has been losing money for me.  Only Getty...and now they have the audacity to preach how money doesn't make people happy?  F* 'em.  Getty isn't profiting me one bit and I'll be ending my relationship with them in the next few months once I have my new revenue streams up and running.

Wow, 20% of your former earnings at IS?!  That is a shocking drop!  Certainly there are a large combination of factors at work, but I have to wonder if migration of your sales to PP may be involved?

Don't blame you for developing other revenue streams.  I think that's the smart thing for any of us who rely on our photography income to pay our bills.  Hope they work out well for you :)
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: gostwyck on March 01, 2011, 16:18
Wow, 20% of your former earnings at IS?!  That is a shocking drop!  Certainly there are a large combination of factors at work, but I have to wonder if migration of your sales to PP may be involved?

(My bold) I was wondering the same. I can't help noticing that several contributors to the PP, including some of our learned and outspoken members here, appear to be complaining of particulary severe drops in income at IS.

Coincidence or could it be 'cause and effect'?
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: jamirae on March 01, 2011, 16:22
Can I just say how nauseating it is to read all the "thank you Kelly" posts on the Istock thread about this?!  

Note to the fawning sycophants confused and misguided - Kelly/Istock/Getty, aren't responsible for getting you this "raise".  Nobody at HQ "fought" for you - least of all Kelly "money isn't going to be what makes you happy" Thompson.   

They are only doing this in response to the majority, who opted out of their insulting, cheapo PP royalties in the first place.  Believe me, if they could get away with keeping your royalties low and just sweetening the pot for the holdouts, they would do it.   ::)


Lisa, why don't you just tell it as it is, instead of beating around the bush? I just want to say thank you Kelly for this raise, I know we have helped line your pockets beyond belief, but it is a small price to pay for enriching our lives. I would not be half the person I am today without iStock, thank you Kelly and may God bless you and all your children and all your children's children, you have truly touched the lives of so many and indeed you are a truly noble and gracious person. Thank you Kelly, thank you!!!  ::)


You guys are awesome!   ;D

Money doesn't make me happy?  BS.   ::)  I'd love to read Kelly's post where he says that. 

What doesn't make me happy is watching my monthly income decrease month after month after month and increasingly worrying whether I'll be able to pay the electric bill or rent, all because of Getty's cannibalistic decisions.  I used to routinely earn $500 per month at IS.  Now I'm lucky if I break $100.  TS earnings through StockXpert and IS combined are less than half of what my StockXpert earnings alone were before Getty bought Jupiter.  None of the other agencies...not one of them!...has been losing money for me.  Only Getty...and now they have the audacity to preach how money doesn't make people happy?  F* 'em.  Getty isn't profiting me one bit and I'll be ending my relationship with them in the next few months once I have my new revenue streams up and running.


Kelly's post where he says "But money isn’t going to be what makes you all happy."  is here:
http://www.istockphoto.com/forum_messages.php?threadid=253522&page=1 (http://www.istockphoto.com/forum_messages.php?threadid=253522&page=1) 

it is in the 3rd to the last paragraph of the first post in the thread. 
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Starbucks on March 01, 2011, 16:58

Kelly's post where he says "But money isn’t going to be what makes you all happy."  is here:
[url]http://www.istockphoto.com/forum_messages.php?threadid=253522&page=1[/url] ([url]http://www.istockphoto.com/forum_messages.php?threadid=253522&page=1[/url]) 

it is in the 3rd to the last paragraph of the first post in the thread. 


...and that's when I realized that iStock was completely out of touch with it's contributor base.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: BaldricksTrousers on March 01, 2011, 17:37
Wow, 20% of your former earnings at IS?!  That is a shocking drop!  Certainly there are a large combination of factors at work, but I have to wonder if migration of your sales to PP may be involved?

(My bold) I was wondering the same. I can't help noticing that several contributors to the PP, including some of our learned and outspoken members here, appear to be complaining of particulary severe drops in income at IS.

Coincidence or could it be 'cause and effect'?

I've taken a nasty hit at iS in the last two months and I rather thought that might end up getting linked to the PP. However, why would cannibalisation take place this year and not last year as the system was already up and running then? Or has there been a massive surge in PP sales in the last two months (despite the conclusion being touted that the commission rise shows that TS is suffering)?

The 15% pay cut obviously has to be taken into consideration this year, as well as the broken search and the impact of the various price hikes on buyers between last Feb and this one. In terms of downloads, which are a better indicator than earnings, I am down 28% year-on-year for regular sales. But last February I was already 50% below my peak sales volume in 2006, as the decline has been going on for years.

I also see other well-established suppliers who have not contributed to the PP complaining of similar or worse year-on-year declines to mine and other people who are happy with the month.

So the data don't seem to support any conclusions.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: sharpshot on March 01, 2011, 17:40
I used to regularly make over $500 a month with istock and I stopped uploading when they announced the commission cuts and now I make just over $300 a month there.  I never opted in to the PP.  

I'm seeing record pay per download sales with shutterstock, it looks like some of the people who used to buy from me with istock are now there.

I really wonder if istock's greed is going to lose them money?  If a lot of us are going to eventually lose thousands of dollars a year there, they are losing 4x more.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Karimala on March 01, 2011, 20:33
I used to routinely earn $500 per month at IS.  Now I'm lucky if I break $100.  TS earnings through StockXpert and IS combined are less than half of what my StockXpert earnings alone were before Getty bought Jupiter.  None of the other agencies...not one of them!...has been losing money for me.  Only Getty...and now they have the audacity to preach how money doesn't make people happy?  F* 'em.  Getty isn't profiting me one bit and I'll be ending my relationship with them in the next few months once I have my new revenue streams up and running.

Wow, 20% of your former earnings at IS?!  That is a shocking drop!  Certainly there are a large combination of factors at work, but I have to wonder if migration of your sales to PP may be involved?

Don't blame you for developing other revenue streams.  I think that's the smart thing for any of us who rely on our photography income to pay our bills.  Hope they work out well for you :)

My drop from $500 to $100 per month has been occurring over a period of a few years and started with iStock's first search engine tweak.  That alone dropped my earnings by about 1/3 and it's never recovered.  Slowly but surely, with every little search engine tweak, every little price increase, every freakin' new "Woo yay" moment, my income has slowly been whittled away.  The latest drop may very well be due to my participation in the PP program, but it's just one drop out of many.  It's just not worth it anymore to stay with IS.  Paying them 84% of a license sale is simply too costly for my business, and they have effectively priced themselves out of my market.   
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Karimala on March 02, 2011, 03:04

Kelly's post where he says "But money isn’t going to be what makes you all happy."  is here:
[url]http://www.istockphoto.com/forum_messages.php?threadid=253522&page=1[/url] ([url]http://www.istockphoto.com/forum_messages.php?threadid=253522&page=1[/url]) 

it is in the 3rd to the last paragraph of the first post in the thread. 


Oh, THAT post.  I remember that one.  Although I skimmed over the specifics, I sure as heck didn't miss how it was all about Kelly's pocketbook and the supposedly hard decisions he's had to make during his career.  Who does he think he's talking to?  People who have never had to make a hard decision?

In my opinion, it's a hard decision when a company decides to forgo some its profits at the top for the benefit of their workers/suppliers at the bottom.  Not the other way around. 
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: lisafx on March 02, 2011, 10:39


My drop from $500 to $100 per month has been occurring over a period of a few years and started with iStock's first search engine tweak.  That alone dropped my earnings by about 1/3 and it's never recovered.  Slowly but surely, with every little search engine tweak, every little price increase, every freakin' new "Woo yay" moment, my income has slowly been whittled away.  The latest drop may very well be due to my participation in the PP program, but it's just one drop out of many.  It's just not worth it anymore to stay with IS.  Paying them 84% of a license sale is simply too costly for my business, and they have effectively priced themselves out of my market.   

Ah.  I didn't realize it had been a gradual decline.  Things have been going downhill there for some time, definitely.  Certainly they have accelerated since September, though. 

One disaster after another.  How long can Istock sustain this? 
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: disorderly on March 02, 2011, 19:21
Guess iStock didn't lie.  They said they'd deliver PP payouts by the 30th, and here they come.  I've seen two of them already, at a munificent .28 per.
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: RacePhoto on March 03, 2011, 03:42
Guess iStock didn't lie.  They said they'd deliver PP payouts by the 30th, and here they come.  I've seen two of them already, at a munificent .28 per.

Wow, me too. I thought I had 25 cent sales but I'm so happy that I got 3 cents more each. Celebration time! <where's that sarcastic font when I need it> Yup, Feb 30th. here we are.

Now we can wait for March and see if it's going to be Wed. the 30th or the Tuesday after the last Friday, or ?
Title: Re: Istock raises payouts to partner program
Post by: Noedelhap on March 04, 2011, 12:58
I'm not sure if opting in to the PP cannibalizes my sales at iStock itself. I'll stay opted-in. knowing that it isn't a lot of money (and I'm certainly NOT grateful for the raise, since their decision to cut commissions earlier), but if I opt-out of the PP, I'd gain nothing.