MicrostockGroup

Agency Based Discussion => iStockPhoto.com => Topic started by: WarrenPrice on July 07, 2012, 19:40

Title: Eight Cents...
Post by: WarrenPrice on July 07, 2012, 19:40

There should be a rule ... "No Images Can Be Sold for Less Than at Thinkstock."   >:(
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: ShadySue on July 07, 2012, 19:58
There should be a rule ... "No Images Can Be Sold for Less Than at Thinkstock."   >:(
Sounds reasonable.
 :(  >:(
I still wonder about the legality of selling images for prices below that indicated on the site, i.e. so that contributors don't have 'informed consent' about the price they might get for their images unless they happen to trawl round this site or iStock's forums to find out about the heavy discounts, especially the hidden ones given to big buyers.
At the moment, the Royalty Schedule page you are taken to from the page Sell Stock says:
"The royalty is based on the net price of iStock credits used to license a file. iStock credit prices vary depending on when they were purchased (as our prices change over time) and how many were purchased at once (as we discount bulk packages)"
Then if you click on the 'View Credit Prices" you see a minimum price of $1.04 per credit for a bundle of 30000 credits. So you could 'reasonably' assume from that that you would never get less than 15c per credit.
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: luissantos84 on July 07, 2012, 20:04
I agree! (but I just had a XXL for 6.4$ (photo+))
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: Jo Ann Snover on July 07, 2012, 20:11
All that will encourage them to do is drop the royalties paid to independents at Thinkstock, so I'm not sure that rule is "sustainable" :)

Yesterday I had an XXXL for $7.28 (also P+) which balances out the 10 cent XS sales and is the reason the monthly tallies at IS stay reasonable
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: Mantis on July 08, 2012, 15:05
Warren I agree with you.  I also had an eight center this week.  Not very encouraging when my production costs for that particular image was substantially more.
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: Poncke on July 08, 2012, 17:55
How can you get 8 cents for a photo? I thought it was a bug or something. I would stop submitting altogether if the commission was  8 cent. For how much is that photo sold? 40 cents or what?
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: Mantis on July 08, 2012, 18:07
How can you get 8 cents for a photo? I thought it was a bug or something. I would stop submitting altogether if the commission was  8 cent. For how much is that photo sold? 40 cents or what?

Please do your research.  The explanation is old credit packages.  No bug. Please stop submitting.  Commissions are, sometimes, .08 cents.
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: ShadySue on July 08, 2012, 18:07
How can you get 8 cents for a photo? I thought it was a bug or something. I would stop submitting altogether if the commission was  8 cent. For how much is that photo sold? 40 cents or what?

Apparently, there are loads of credits going around from early days at iStock.
There are discounts given for different reasons, e.g. if the site goes down, and the discount codes are very quickly disseminated all over the web.
There are apparently huge discounts given for people who buy way over the 30,000 credits, not mentioned on the buy credits page.
There are subscription sales, again with huge discounts available, which are indicated by a butterfly rather than a leaf  symbol on your downloads page.
Any combination of the above, e.g. a 25% discount combined with a huge number of credits bought.
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: stockastic on July 08, 2012, 19:07
Ironic as I'd just been thinking about submitting to IS again - I stopped last year.   Then I saw this thread, and looked back over my recent sales and saw all the ones for 21 cents, and decided to forget about it.  I'm not supporting any agency, large or small, that thinks they can pay me 8 cents for a use of an image.  And they can just stuff all that "old credits" and "special discounts" BS.    End of discussion.
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: Poncke on July 09, 2012, 02:23
How can you get 8 cents for a photo? I thought it was a bug or something. I would stop submitting altogether if the commission was  8 cent. For how much is that photo sold? 40 cents or what?

Apparently, there are loads of credits going around from early days at iStock.
There are discounts given for different reasons, e.g. if the site goes down, and the discount codes are very quickly disseminated all over the web.
There are apparently huge discounts given for people who buy way over the 30,000 credits, not mentioned on the buy credits page.
There are subscription sales, again with huge discounts available, which are indicated by a butterfly rather than a leaf  symbol on your downloads page.
Any combination of the above, e.g. a 25% discount combined with a huge number of credits bought.
So the discounts given by the agency, are paid by the agency and the contributor? SMH... starting to sound much like slave labour or prisoner labour. Should be illegal for agencies to transfer discounts to the contributor.
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: ShadySue on July 09, 2012, 05:18
So the discounts given by the agency, are paid by the agency and the contributor? SMH... starting to sound much like slave labour or prisoner labour. Should be illegal for agencies to transfer discounts to the contributor.
on iStock, yes, even if the discount was given because of the site being down. I have no idea if the IT wallahs have their salaries docked by 15% if they give a 15% discount, or whether they only penalise the innocent.
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: heywoody on July 09, 2012, 08:10
This is a really irritating feature of IS and DT.  On SS and even FT, the commissions are transparent and consistent so, for a certain size with a certain licence, you always get the same commission. 
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: Jo Ann Snover on July 09, 2012, 08:59
The downside of the fixed payout system is that when the site is collecting income in other currencies, they are sometimes making out like bandits by paying you the fixed amount.

I think the percentage model works as long as marketing expenses - promotional and "I'm sorry" discounts are paid for by the site and as long as there's no games being played. In IS's case, one of the games I suspect happened was that they gave out huge discounts to large angry customers who weren't happy about Vetta/Agency/E+ price hikes. The problem was those cheapo credits then got spent on regular files as well.

There's no automatic "win" for contributors with either system - an ethical, honest and fair agency is the only way we win.
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: ShadySue on July 09, 2012, 09:05
In IS's case, one of the games I suspect happened was that they gave out huge discounts to large angry customers who weren't happy about Vetta/Agency/E+ price hikes. The problem was those cheapo credits then got spent on regular files as well.
I hadn't thought of that, but yes, it seems extremely likely, now that you point it out

Quote
There's automatic "win" for contributors with either system - an ethical, honest and fair agency is the only way we win.
Yeah, but the 'new kind of trust' doesn't necessarily cover 'ethical', 'honest' or 'fair'.
I suspect that any agency trying to be ethical and fair to its contributors, unless it has unique niche images, with a proven market that no-one else provides (as if!), would just find their customers voting with their feet.
But there's a big gap between what we have just now and an ideal scenario. Surely we could narrow the gap, at least.
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: Jo Ann Snover on July 09, 2012, 14:32
I left out the "no" in "no automatic win" - I've edited to fix my goof.

I think it's simple to make things fair for contributors and have the agency make a profit - all of the current micros used to come pretty close before they started cutting percentages for contributors, jacking up prices for buyers, etc. Both sides can be profitable and offer buyers a fair deal. We can't generate enough cash to (a) support "dividends" for the vulture capital firms (H&F and I assume KKR will do the same to Fotolia) or (b) prop up other parts of a business that aren't making as much money.

I don't think you have to be a niche or even have unique images to succeed. Good choice, fair prices, great search engine, working site with little/no downtime and simple, straightforward purchase systems.
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: stockastic on July 13, 2012, 09:30
I joined the "8 Cent Club" today!
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: Mantis on July 13, 2012, 09:45
I joined the "8 Cent Club" today!

Congrats.  Now go enjoy that jellybean.
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: fotografer on July 24, 2012, 06:41
I joined the "8 Cent Club" today!
Me too.  I don't usually look at the price an image sells for but as it was the first sale on new upload which is a favourite image of mine I had a look only to find it had sold for 8c. I wish that I hadn't looked now!!!
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: wut on July 24, 2012, 08:03
I joined the "8 Cent Club" today!

Yesterday
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: click_click on July 24, 2012, 08:12
$2.70 for Big Web footage today - usually I get at least more than double for that...  :-X
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: loop on July 24, 2012, 09:44
On the other hand I've got 39 $ for a big E+, and I have a 250 $ personal record for an EL.
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: heywoody on July 24, 2012, 12:14
I joined the "8 Cent Club" today!
Me too.  I don't usually look at the price an image sells for but as it was the first sale on new upload which is a favourite image of mine I had a look only to find it had sold for 8c. I wish that I hadn't looked now!!!

How can this be?  Look like diamond level from the dial, possibly even exclusive.  Surely you must be on a higher %.  Does this mean us lowly peons can look forward getting even less than 8c?  :'(
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: traveler1116 on July 24, 2012, 12:36
I joined the "8 Cent Club" today!
Me too.  I don't usually look at the price an image sells for but as it was the first sale on new upload which is a favourite image of mine I had a look only to find it had sold for 8c. I wish that I hadn't looked now!!!

How can this be?  Look like diamond level from the dial, possibly even exclusive.  Surely you must be on a higher %.  Does this mean us lowly peons can look forward getting even less than 8c?  :'(
I'm pretty sure the lowest royalty for a base level exclusive is 46 cents and 6 or 7 cents for independents depending on how the numbers are rounded.
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: ShadySue on July 24, 2012, 13:31
I joined the "8 Cent Club" today!
Me too.  I don't usually look at the price an image sells for but as it was the first sale on new upload which is a favourite image of mine I had a look only to find it had sold for 8c. I wish that I hadn't looked now!!!

How can this be?  Look like diamond level from the dial, possibly even exclusive.  Surely you must be on a higher %.  Does this mean us lowly peons can look forward getting even less than 8c?  :'(
I'm pretty sure the lowest royalty for a base level exclusive is 46 cents and 6 or 7 cents for independents depending on how the numbers are rounded.
Do we know the actual 'lowest credit value'?
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: traveler1116 on July 24, 2012, 13:36
I joined the "8 Cent Club" today!
Me too.  I don't usually look at the price an image sells for but as it was the first sale on new upload which is a favourite image of mine I had a look only to find it had sold for 8c. I wish that I hadn't looked now!!!

How can this be?  Look like diamond level from the dial, possibly even exclusive.  Surely you must be on a higher %.  Does this mean us lowly peons can look forward getting even less than 8c?  :'(
I'm pretty sure the lowest royalty for a base level exclusive is 46 cents and 6 or 7 cents for independents depending on how the numbers are rounded.
Do we know the actual 'lowest credit value'?
Not for sure but that's the lowest I've heard of.  Looking through my lowest sales for the last 30 days I found about 4 sales for 65 or 66 cents per credit but nothing lower.
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: ShadySue on July 24, 2012, 14:00
I joined the "8 Cent Club" today!
Me too.  I don't usually look at the price an image sells for but as it was the first sale on new upload which is a favourite image of mine I had a look only to find it had sold for 8c. I wish that I hadn't looked now!!!

How can this be?  Look like diamond level from the dial, possibly even exclusive.  Surely you must be on a higher %.  Does this mean us lowly peons can look forward getting even less than 8c?  :'(
I'm pretty sure the lowest royalty for a base level exclusive is 46 cents and 6 or 7 cents for independents depending on how the numbers are rounded.
Do we know the actual 'lowest credit value'?
Not for sure but that's the lowest I've heard of.  Looking through my lowest sales for the last 30 days I found about 4 sales for 65 or 66 cents per credit but nothing lower.
I had an EL for $12 (75 credits), so if it was XS, it was 50c per credit, and if L it was 44c.
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: ShadySue on July 26, 2012, 13:49
Worse still, I just had a Vetta/Getty sale in from June, which netted me $1.19.
 :( >:(
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: ShadySue on August 12, 2012, 06:14
.
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: Mantis on August 12, 2012, 07:53
Last week I had my third 8 cent sale.  I just laugh now.  Not much I can do about it but practice a little forced humility.
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: luissantos84 on August 14, 2012, 17:13
Last week I had my third 8 cent sale.  I just laugh now.  Not much I can do about it but practice a little forced humility.

just had one too (8 cents), when will those credits end?
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: Mantis on August 14, 2012, 17:15
Last week I had my third 8 cent sale.  I just laugh now.  Not much I can do about it but practice a little forced humility.

just had one too (8 cents), when will those credits end?

I think they last forever, until they are used up by the buyers. I am just glad it isn't too frequent of an occurrence.
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: stan on August 14, 2012, 18:35
I'm getting them almost every day this past few weeks.
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: BaldricksTrousers on August 15, 2012, 02:51
It's blindingly obvious that they've discounted credits to 50c to some large buyer or other and these are current credits, not 2004 ones.
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: traveler1116 on August 15, 2012, 09:19
It's blindingly obvious that they've discounted credits to 50c to some large buyer or other and these are current credits, not 2004 ones.

The corporate accounts page:  http://www.istockphoto.com/corporate-accounts.php (http://www.istockphoto.com/corporate-accounts.php)  credits on there are posted as being as low as 24 cents although I've still never seen one lower than 46 cents.
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: ShadySue on August 15, 2012, 09:40
It's blindingly obvious that they've discounted credits to 50c to some large buyer or other and these are current credits, not 2004 ones.

The corporate accounts page:  [url]http://www.istockphoto.com/corporate-accounts.php[/url] ([url]http://www.istockphoto.com/corporate-accounts.php[/url])  credits on there are posted as being as low as 24 cents although I've still never seen one lower than 46 cents.

24c is for corporate subs; the lowest posted payg price on that page is $1.04.
However, on this page, http://www.istockphoto.com/help/buy-credits (http://www.istockphoto.com/help/buy-credits), 29c is offered for corporate payg and lowest 'ordinary' payg is posted as 95c.
They don't even have the same minimum price on two different pages of their own site!
(http://www.lizworld.com/prices.jpg)
(If anybody wondered what "all the corporate perks" are, don't bother: the link just takes you to a pricing table. No other 'perks', sorta like the current exclusive 'perks'.)
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: BaldricksTrousers on August 15, 2012, 11:07
If anybody imagines that iStock will announce the super-mega-discounts it might offer to a million dollar customer then they are living in cloudcuckooland.

As soon as it announces "corporate special, only 50c a credit" every half-baked corporation will be screaming for the same deal.

However, the increasing incidence of these 8c commissions = to 50c credits makes it perfectly clear that new ones are being issued at that price.

Remember how the 10c sales faded to nothing over the years? Suddenly they come back again - and we are supposed to believe this is just as a result of lots and lots of people suddenly turning up ancient accounts with credits on them that they had forgotten about.

Yeah, righhhhttttt.... you believe that if you wish to.
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: stan on August 18, 2012, 08:31
On top of getting this 8c sales almost every day (and they're always in XS size) there's the indie price decrease. It really looks like they're taking a lot of, especially when you think about constant price rises, "last resort" actions. If I remember correctly E+ prices went down as well. Combine it with earnings threads and it really looks like their business is nosediving in the last few months.
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: Lagereek on August 18, 2012, 09:13
Well better that!  remember the new pricing!  all pics at all sites are sold for 0.5.c. and thats from the 1st of January. 2013. Dont know how we are going to survive here? :-\
Title: Re: Eight Cents...
Post by: stan on August 27, 2012, 11:23
My last 3 today's sales were all sold for 8c. Well one was for 16c since it was a P+.