MicrostockGroup

Agency Based Discussion => iStockPhoto.com => Topic started by: vphoto on February 27, 2008, 13:54

Title: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: vphoto on February 27, 2008, 13:54
Today i had 4  XSmall sells and the result is less than $1. that is where 20% shows its unfairness.
Title: Re: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: sharply_done on February 27, 2008, 15:24
My record low XS price is 10 cents.
I had to look twice just to be sure.
Title: Re: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: madelaide on February 27, 2008, 17:44
The lowest I got was 19c, and gladly that was unusual.  Most of my XS are getting me now about 24c.

Regards,
Adelaide
Title: Re: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: louoates on March 02, 2008, 10:42
Today i had 4  XSmall sells and the result is less than $1. that is where 20% shows its unfairness.

I don't see anything as "unfair." We upload. The site does their marketing to maximize their profits. Our percentage is dependent on how well they do their job. If we don't like their results we can upload elsewhere. I can't see how they established xsmall to minimize their (and our) profits.

As an aside, I've seen many times where a xsmall of a seldom downloaded image is followed up by a xlarge shortly thereafter. I suspect that the xsmall is used for presentation use and the production size is then downloaded.
Title: Re: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: thesentinel on March 02, 2008, 13:38
Today i had 4  XSmall sells and the result is less than $1. that is where 20% shows its unfairness.

If there hadn't been people that had been happy to make less than that on full size images five years ago you wouldn't even be here complaining !
Title: Re: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: vphoto on March 02, 2008, 14:22
blind loyalty of iStock exclusive photographers disgusts me even more than Xsize prices.

Title: Re: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: sharply_done on March 02, 2008, 15:16
blind loyalty of iStock exclusive photographers disgusts me even more than Xsize prices.
You're calling thesentinel blindly loyal to IS? Hardly!

If you think IS is unfair, why do you continue to sell your images there?
Title: Re: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: vphoto on March 02, 2008, 15:32
because i am stubborn and intend to make iStock work for me even though not everything there pleases me.

Title: Re: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: RT on March 02, 2008, 18:36
If every image in your portfolio sold every day for 24 cents would you be unhappy?

Title: Re: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: digitalfood on March 03, 2008, 06:46
blind loyalty of iStock exclusive photographers disgusts me even more than Xsize prices.



AGREED
Title: Re: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: rene on March 03, 2008, 08:13
I have no problem with selling 400px x 300px images for $0.20-0.25 at IS.
Selling 10-12MP for 0.25-0.30 at all subscription sites (especially level 3  at DT) make me sick.
Title: Re: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: HughStoneIan on March 03, 2008, 13:16
blind loyalty of iStock exclusive photographers disgusts me even more than Xsize prices.


Why let that bother you?  If they want to be blindly loyal that's their problem, not mine.  I don't give them a second thought and really couldn't care less.

On the subject of XS sales:  Unfortunately I don't have the time to keep up with technology like I want to.  What's the latest in upsizing (a.k.a. uprezzing) technology?  If it's much better than the past, then wouldn't it make sense that buyers would buy the smallest usable sizes and then just uprez them themselves, in spite of the time factor?  I guess batch processing would make it a breeze.  Perhaps right now the money/cost factor is more important than it was in the recent past and would outweigh the time involved in buyer post-editing.  Any thoughts?
Title: Re: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: madelaide on March 03, 2008, 14:43
What's the latest in upsizing (a.k.a. uprezzing) technology?  If it's much better than the past, then wouldn't it make sense that buyers would buy the smallest usable sizes and then just uprez them themselves, in spite of the time factor?

I don't think prices justify the time and maybe final quality.  Through FT's sales report I was able to find many of my images in websites, and only one was large enough for S size.   If you see any website that is heavily built on microstock images (sometimes designers give the URL in the site forums), you will see that smaller images are the rule.

Regards,
Adelaide
Title: Re: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: yingyang0 on March 03, 2008, 19:36
Today i had 4  XSmall sells and the result is less than $1. that is where 20% shows its unfairness.
Since you're new to istock I'm sure that you'd be surprised that x-small is a new thing. Before "small" was the smallest and the commission was $0.20 on a small sale in 2006. Now it's 2008 and a small sale has a commission of about $1.06.

What bugs me is when people enter into a contract knowing what they're agreeing too and then turn around and complain about the terms.

P.S. I'm not a blind loyalist. I'm pretty upset about the spring sale price drop that came out of no where. I also don't like the dramatic shifts in best match that happen monthly.
Title: Re: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: vphoto on March 03, 2008, 20:38
signing the contract did not imply that I should be dancing cheek to cheek with iStock to the rest of my microstok life. I may disagree with them, may I ?
Title: Re: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: yingyang0 on March 04, 2008, 00:23
signing the contract did not imply that I should be dancing cheek to cheek with iStock to the rest of my microstok [sic] life. I may disagree with them, may I ?
You joined six months ago, hardly a lifetime (even in "microstock years"). It is fine to disagree with them, but I found it weird that you were complaining about a few .20 commissions when you're also on at least one other site where they are all .25-.30 commissions.
Title: Re: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: sensovision on March 04, 2008, 01:50
The lowest I got was 19c, and gladly that was unusual.  Most of my XS are getting me now about 24c
So is price of XSmall image is fluctuating all the time or they simply pay different percentage each time, or maybe there some sort of discounts for customers?

I also got one image sold two times with period in few days with different price:
Quote
Sunday March 02, 2008, 12:57 PM      XSmall     Regular     0.18
Wednesday February 27, 2008, 07:41 AM    XSmall    Regular    0.23
Title: Re: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: madelaide on March 04, 2008, 16:33
So is price of XSmall image is fluctuating all the time or they simply pay different percentage each time, or maybe there some sort of discounts for customers?
The % is always the same (20%), but prices vary with credits packages.  If I remember it right, one credit can cost from 95c to $1.30, depending on the amount of credits purchased (more credits, cheaper $/credit).  Therefore a XS pays like 19c to 26c.

Regards,
Adelaide
Title: Re: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: sensovision on March 04, 2008, 16:38
So is price of XSmall image is fluctuating all the time or they simply pay different percentage each time, or maybe there some sort of discounts for customers?

The % is always the same (20%), but prices vary with credits packages.  If I remember it right, one credit can cost from 95c to $1.30, depending on the amount of credits purchased (more credits, cheaper $/credit).  Therefore a XS pays like 19c to 26c.

Thanks, Adelaide, you're 100% right, soon after posting this I've checked IStock forums and saw this thread (http://www.istockphoto.com/forum_messages.php?threadid=45268&page=1) which confirm your what you just said.
Thanks for response!
Title: Re: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: lisafx on March 04, 2008, 17:18
Since you're new to istock I'm sure that you'd be surprised that x-small is a new thing. Before "small" was the smallest and the commission was $0.20 on a small sale in 2006. Now it's 2008 and a small sale has a commission of about $1.06. 

I believe you are comparing apples to oranges here.  The commission a few years ago on a small was indeed .20 for non-exclusive, and now it is about .60-.70. 

I believe the 1.06 commission for a small must be with an exclusive bonus included because I have never gotten that much for a small. 

However now with XS available I have gotten commissions as low as .16

I am not one of the ones you will find regularly complaining about istock's XS commissions because usually they are offset by the lucrative large and XL sales, but not as much with this current sale going on.
Title: Re: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: yingyang0 on March 04, 2008, 19:38
I believe you are comparing apples to oranges here.  The commission a few years ago on a small was indeed .20 for non-exclusive, and now it is about .60-.70.
I'm not sure I'm comparing apples to oranges. The commission for a small has indeed gone up exclusive or not, No? Now, comparing the commission on an x-small to a small, that is more like comparing apples to oranges.

Did you contact IS about getting .16? From what I've seen the worst possible commission you can receive is .97x.2= $0.19

I'm not a fan of the sale either.
Title: Re: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: lisafx on March 05, 2008, 11:08
Did you contact IS about getting .16? From what I've seen the worst possible commission you can receive is .97x.2= $0.19

It has happened more than once, so I assume it is a legitimate royalty amount under some discount or other. 

But no, I don't see any reason to bother support with piddly stuff like that.  It's a very disappointing commission, but from what I have seen it is not a mistake. 
Title: Re: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: jcphoto on March 05, 2008, 12:38
Could it be Old credits still hanging around out there?
That has happened to me over the last couple of years, I assume it is a correct amount and agree that it is not worth bothering support with.
Title: Re: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: michealo on March 05, 2008, 12:45
And dls count towards improved placement in "best match" and towards canisters, so they are an advantage no matter how little the amount
Title: Re: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: sensovision on March 05, 2008, 13:49
And dls count towards improved placement in "best match" and towards canisters, so they are an advantage no matter how little the amount
is there any source I can read more on their ranking methods e.g. how acceptance rate is affecting ranking and how downloads count improve SERPs?
Title: Re: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: CofkoCof on May 07, 2008, 16:03
Got 16c today for an xs image  ::) ;D
Title: Re: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: epantha on May 07, 2008, 16:34
Quote
On the subject of XS sales:  Unfortunately I don't have the time to keep up with technology like I want to.  What's the latest in upsizing (a.k.a. uprezzing) technology?  If it's much better than the past, then wouldn't it make sense that buyers would buy the smallest usable sizes and then just uprez them themselves, in spite of the time factor?  I guess batch processing would make it a breeze.  Perhaps right now the money/cost factor is more important than it was in the recent past and would outweigh the time involved in buyer post-editing.  Any thoughts?

I work at an ad agency and have a lot of experience with print layout and web graphics. I'm pretty sure the XS size will only work on the internet. You can resize the 72 dpi photo to 300 dpi but then it would only be 1.5" wide and would basically be useless for print. Also, I would never try upsizing a 72 dpi photo. The quality is already at a very low level and upsizing it would make it much worse. You can successfully upsize 300 dpi photos but should use tifs, not jpegs to do this.
Title: Re: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: cshack on May 07, 2008, 16:41
Now let's think about this.  If everyone who reads this and pulls their images from IS what will that do to IS?  Nothing if you ask me.  I would be willing to bet that if a site pops up selling images for 10 cents each and pay a commission of 2 cents people will upload there too.  They will upload their images and come over here and complain about the super low commission.

None of these sites would be as low as they are if folks like us didn't upload their images for them to sell.  If you want to make good money form stock the only way to go is Alamy, Getty and Corbis.  However Alamy has over 11 million images so if you decide to sell your images at a premium price you'd * well be on top of your game.  Otherwise you'll just have a portfolio to show off to your friends.

The only thanks we owe the microstock agencies is "Thanks for creating 100,000 photo whores"  Which I'm one of them.  Bottom line is we are greedy by nature and want instant gratification for our work.  Microstock sites are built on that.  I've seen this here more than a few times, "I don't worry about the money, I just love the fact that people download my images"  ...... "It makes me feel good that people like my photos"  The sad thing is it's not going to change either.  For every one who pulls out, there are 5 standing in line to get their share of the low commissions.

Either stop uploading to the micro sites or shut up about low commissions.  It is what it is and the small numbers here aren't going to change it.
Title: Re: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: leaf on May 08, 2008, 02:25
the fact that there are a good number of people who work with microstock as a full time job (myself included) goes to show you that there ARE people concerned with what they make at microstock and it is important.  Microstock has been proven to be a viable business model for both the agency AND the photographer.
Title: Re: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: Adeptris on May 08, 2008, 02:46
take your Istock total Revenue to date and divide it by the total downloads, mine comes in with an average of $0.98 per download, compared to SS $0.25 a download, I have pulled all my work from SS because of this very point.

A lot of designers might prefer to download a xSmall rather than a watermarked comp, then thier client do not know the image source, so think that the xSmall could be used for a mockup, and if the designers client goes for it, you may get a medium, large or xlarge sale later, thus getting two downloads for the one piece of work

Also think that if the xSmall option was not there the designer may have brought a large download of the same image over on SS or any other subscription based site that has your images, and you would not be here complaining about that, although it may have cost you revenue.

I try to look at all perspectives to balance any post, and in conclusion think that xSmall images may lead to a bigger future sale, so if I get any I am quite content.

If them 4 xSmall downloads turn into large downloads come back and complain that the poor customer was unable to trade in the xSmall download as part exchange.

David   
Title: Re: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: Contakt on May 08, 2008, 02:52
Today i had 4  XSmall sells and the result is less than $1. that is where 20% shows its unfairness.


Getty call it a comping image and don't even charge for it so count your blessings.
Title: Re: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: fotografer on May 08, 2008, 03:19
That data isn't relevant to me, what is relevant to me is the paycheck at the end of the month and my SS one is 50% higher than the one I get off IS.
take your Istock total Revenue to date and divide it by the total downloads, mine comes in with an average of $0.98 per download, compared to SS $0.25 a download, I have pulled all my work from SS because of this very point.

Title: Re: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: Adeptris on May 08, 2008, 04:17
That data isn't relevant to me, what is relevant to me is the paycheck at the end of the month and my SS one is 50% higher than the one I get off IS.
take your Istock total Revenue to date and divide it by the total downloads, mine comes in with an average of $0.98 per download, compared to SS $0.25 a download, I have pulled all my work from SS because of this very point.


Yes and for 400% more downloads, the RPI is more important to me, each to thier own, I have decided that it is better to sell 1 image for $1.00 than 4 images for $1.00, 1/4 of the effort.

I have also sold an image 1 download for $54 elsewhere, that would be 216 downloads at SS :)
Title: Re: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: lisafx on May 08, 2008, 16:50
the fact that there are a good number of people who work with microstock as a full time job (myself included) goes to show you that there ARE people concerned with what they make at microstock and it is important.  Microstock has been proven to be a viable business model for both the agency AND the photographer.

Agreed!  I have read the charts and surveys on what trad photographers make on average, and also the polls here about what micro photographers are making and I think the micro photographers are coming out way ahead, for the most part. 
Title: Re: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: RT on May 09, 2008, 06:35
Agreed!  I have read the charts and surveys on what trad photographers make on average, and also the polls here about what micro photographers are making and I think the micro photographers are coming out way ahead, for the most part. 

Combine the two and you're laughing , although for the record I make more each month on the trads, it's a balance of time and effort, one day I hope to find the right balance.  :D
Title: Re: iStock XSmall price is a joke
Post by: lisafx on May 09, 2008, 14:19
Am I right in assuming you need some particular niche to make money on the trads?  I don't see how general stock stuff could surface among all the gazillions of images on Alamy for example...