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Author Topic: Istock being absorbed into Getty ...  (Read 37891 times)

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ShadySue

  • There is a crack in everything
« Reply #125 on: December 02, 2014, 12:25 »
+1
The last few months of the year have always been a bit slow for me, and I'm hoping for at least some pick up in sales at the start of next year.
November has always been my best month, but even 2 ELs couldn't raise last month's $$ for credit sales above 4th bottom. Well under half what I earned in Nov 2008. So I really don't see any reason for optimism for my port.

However, I was shown that iS exclusive (and SS) poll figures here seem to have shot up, so some must be doing well.


« Reply #126 on: December 02, 2014, 13:31 »
+2
The last few months of the year have always been a bit slow for me, and I'm hoping for at least some pick up in sales at the start of next year.
November has always been my best month, but even 2 ELs couldn't raise last month's $$ for credit sales above 4th bottom. Well under half what I earned in Nov 2008. So I really don't see any reason for optimism for my port.

However, I was shown that iS exclusive (and SS) poll figures here seem to have shot up, so some must be doing well.
It's not any (or at least many) of the exclusives I can see in the monthly thread over there. [size=78%] [/size]
As I said there my overall income for this calendar year is looking to be about a third down. A fair bit of money.
There are of course no easy answers from our side of the fence.

Uncle Pete

« Reply #127 on: December 02, 2014, 15:56 »
+1
Which will be a raise for me.  8)

As for the rest, you mean they didn't collect taxes before? How did they get away with that for so long? Yes Canada but owned by a USA Corp.

I'm not sure if automated payments make any difference to me? I can see how others wouldn't like that.

Does this mean IS images will be sold on Getty as a collection?

I predict this is just the cloud coming in from the distant horizon, before the storm of changes and more changes.

First step to your %20 flat rate.
« Last Edit: December 02, 2014, 16:01 by Uncle Pete »

ShadySue

  • There is a crack in everything
« Reply #128 on: December 02, 2014, 16:05 »
+1
As for the rest, you mean they didn't collect taxes before? How did they get away with that for so long? Yes Canada but owned by a USA Corp.
Apparently they were counted as a Canadian entity for tax purposes.
So e.g. I simply pay tax here, without having had to fill out any US forms etc.

« Reply #129 on: December 03, 2014, 01:53 »
0
As for the rest, you mean they didn't collect taxes before? How did they get away with that for so long? Yes Canada but owned by a USA Corp.

How do Apple, Google, Starbucks and many others get away with making profits all around the world without paying taxes on those? They only pay taxes to the IRS for profits they actually made within the US.

Does this mean IS images will be sold on Getty as a collection?

No. Not soon at least. That would mean that Getty would have to deal directly with a) an active contributor community and b) small and medium customers. They showed enough disdain for both of these groups in the past, so I believe it is unlikely they want to take over those tasks anytime soon. Getty prefers to make business with businesses (corporate media and advertising agencies as customers, other agencies and image factories as producers). They never showed any understanding of this "crowd thing".

« Reply #130 on: December 03, 2014, 06:39 »
+2
That would mean that Getty would have to deal directly with a) an active contributor community and b) small and medium customers. They showed enough disdain for both of these groups in the past, so I believe it is unlikely they want to take over those tasks anytime soon. Getty prefers to make business with businesses (corporate media and advertising agencies as customers, other agencies and image factories as producers). They never showed any understanding of this "crowd thing".

Unwashed peasants is the term they use I believe.

« Reply #131 on: December 03, 2014, 07:26 »
0
many others get away with making profits all around the world without paying taxes on those? They only pay taxes to the IRS for profits they actually made within the US.

When Shutterstock announced their quarterly results in November, one of the issues which they specifically talked about was the relatively high level of taxes that they are currently paying despite, they said, 70% of their business being done outside of the US. This is something which investors have commented on previously.

I wondered at the time whether that implied that they were looking at relocating some of the business outside of the US. Or can anyone here think of any other ways in which they could reduce their tax liability whist remaining solely based in the US ?

« Reply #132 on: December 04, 2014, 03:24 »
0

Quote
How do Apple, Google, Starbucks and many others get away with making profits all around the world without paying taxes on those? They only pay taxes to the IRS for profits they actually made within the US.

Irish Dutch sandwich, or something like that.

« Reply #133 on: December 04, 2014, 04:21 »
0
many others get away with making profits all around the world without paying taxes on those? They only pay taxes to the IRS for profits they actually made within the US.

When Shutterstock announced their quarterly results in November, one of the issues which they specifically talked about was the relatively high level of taxes that they are currently paying despite, they said, 70% of their business being done outside of the US. This is something which investors have commented on previously.

I wondered at the time whether that implied that they were looking at relocating some of the business outside of the US. Or can anyone here think of any other ways in which they could reduce their tax liability whist remaining solely based in the US ?

Yes. And investors at Apple are complaining that the company is sitting on a huge amount of cash they can not bring back into the US because then it would become taxable... Even as a corporation, apparently you can't have it all and make everyone happy.  ;)

« Reply #134 on: December 04, 2014, 06:20 »
0
Has nobody mentioned this?  Do Getty insist on non-US residents getting an ITIN number?  A few sites have insisted on that, most of them have found a way around it.  If they insist on it, I think it will be time to remove my portfolio.  I'm against it on principle, why should I have to get an Individual Tax Identification Number for a country where I don't live and don't have to pay tax?  It looks like a load of unnecessary hassle and expense that other sites have managed to circumvent.

If they do insist on the ITIN number, I could pay the US tax but I'm not doing that, I would rather sell my work elsewhere.

« Reply #135 on: December 04, 2014, 06:30 »
+1
Has nobody mentioned this?  Do Getty insist on non-US residents getting an ITIN number?  A few sites have insisted on that, most of them have found a way around it.  If they insist on it, I think it will be time to remove my portfolio.  I'm against it on principle, why should I have to get an Individual Tax Identification Number for a country where I don't live and don't have to pay tax?  It looks like a load of unnecessary hassle and expense that other sites have managed to circumvent.

If they do insist on the ITIN number, I could pay the US tax but I'm not doing that, I would rather sell my work elsewhere.

No, they don't. And it's not that "some have found a way around it", the IRS has changed some requirements over the past few years. In 2009/2010 when lots of iStockers were invited to submit directly to Getty, it was mentioned very often that an ITIN was required to avoid withholding tax. When I got a Getty contract through Flickr in 2012, it was already moved to an electronic W8-BEN solution that does not ask for an American tax number. I don't have an ITIN, never had one but I still do not pay any withholding tax on any agency.

However, this does not apply to everyone. It depends on the specifics of the treaty between the US and your home country. Some people will be required to get an ITIN number, others do not need to. But that seems not to be a decision made by Getty/iStock but by the IRS based on the tax treaties. (for what it's worth, I am based in Germany, so that's all I can talk about in this regard)

« Reply #136 on: December 04, 2014, 06:46 »
+1
I know several sites like SS and FT initially insisted on us getting an ITIN number but changed their minds when they realised that many of us would rather leave than get one.

I just told Saatchi Art to close my account, don't see any reason for a UK citizen to get an ITIN number or pay withholding tax when most other sites don't ask for it.

« Reply #137 on: December 04, 2014, 07:03 »
0
However, this does not apply to everyone. It depends on the specifics of the treaty between the US and your home country. Some people will be required to get an ITIN number, others do not need to. But that seems not to be a decision made by Getty/iStock but by the IRS based on the tax treaties. (for what it's worth, I am based in Germany, so that's all I can talk about in this regard)

I think but may be wrong that some aspects of the technicalities have been even further simplified by the US:

I believe that the issue with respect to whether or not you need a US tax reference code depends upon whether or not your home (tax residency jurisdiction) issues you with a unique tax code which is recognized internationally by the IRS as a TIN (tax identifier number).

I believe that those people in countries which do not issue a recognised TIN may today need a US EIN (employer identifier number) rather than the old ITIN. This would apply to people in countries with a tax treaty.

According to Lobo at the iStock forum, those of us in non-treaty countries should be able to complete the tax interview without needing a TIN or equivalent US code. Completing the tax interview should then mean that we will only be taxed on US sales.

Amazon via Google has a certain amount of usefully up to date and pertinent information about the tax interview and withholding taxes - since this also relates to people selling Kindle content. The Amazon documentation goes some way to explaining the thinking behind the tax interview process.

One thing I now understand as a result of reading more is that from the IRS perspective there are two aspects to this: yes - on the one hand they may want to know whether we are in a treaty country and if so which one. On the other hand the interview is also about them determining whether we are US citizens (including US citizens abroad) ... and therefore US tax payers. One aspect of the interview as it applies to non-US citizens is for us to demonstrate that we are not US citizens perhaps living abroad. The 'interview' is as much about that as anything else.

@Sharpshot: surely it makes sense for all of us to complete the tax interview and minimise our US tax liabilities. As Lobo has pointed out - even people in non treaty countries will then only be taxed on US sales. Also - do UK citizens even need to get a ITIN EIN ? Isn't the UK issued 10 digit UTR going to be enough (and if not is it really such an issue having to get an EIN ?)
« Last Edit: December 04, 2014, 07:05 by bunhill »

vielleicht

« Reply #138 on: December 04, 2014, 07:53 »
0

I think but may be wrong that some aspects of the technicalities have been even further simplified by the US:

I believe that the issue with respect to whether or not you need a US tax reference code depends upon whether or not your home (tax residency jurisdiction) issues you with a unique tax code which is recognized internationally by the IRS as a TIN (tax identifier number).

I believe that those people in countries which do not issue a recognised TIN may today need a US EIN (employer identifier number) rather than the old ITIN. This would apply to people in countries with a tax treaty.


That's what I understand as well, but it's weird anyway: all other agencies are NOT requiring a local TIN, and that field can simply be left blank.

One of them must be wrong, and I'd rather avoid dubious situations regarding taxes.
« Last Edit: December 05, 2014, 03:06 by vielleicht »

« Reply #139 on: December 04, 2014, 10:50 »
0
Someone mentioned Saatchi.  Perhaps they were structured a bit differently...  I earn royalties at SS, I am from Canada so they are tax exempt.  Perhaps Saatchi has it setup that Saatchi takes a commission from your earnings - therefore, I do believe U.S. sales may be taxable - even with a tax treaty.

And when I still worked in the corporate world 10+ years ago (maybe it's changed) whenever we opened up a U.S. business it was registered in the State of Delaware because the taxes were considerably lower.  Maybe SS should move their head office to a mail box in Delaware if they are complaining about New York taxes!

« Reply #140 on: December 04, 2014, 10:56 »
+2
Maybe SS should move their head office to a mail box in Delaware if they are complaining about New York taxes!

Or Alberta maybe. Calgary for example has a combined corporate rate of appx 25% - it's known for its business friendly, low drag, 21st century approach to competitive corporate taxation.

:-)

I cannot think of any reason why an online company would be in New York - apart from Wall St etc

« Reply #141 on: December 04, 2014, 15:53 »
+4
Am I hearing some screwing happening?

Ah no... It is multiple screwing:

1. Canada lost tax income.
2. Some Contributors lost money due to withholding taxes.
3. All Contributors have delayed payments.
4. No Skrill means for some that their money coming on more expensive way via Payoneer.
4a. Contributors lost their Skrill paying buyers.

All in all - not so bad to have such new terms... Who cares? I don't. I am not even with GI or iStock due to known UNSUSTAINABILITY with them!
Ah... One more thing: When this screwing gains momentum then there will be more screwing after this...

Cheers S U C K E R S!

« Reply #142 on: December 04, 2014, 15:59 »
0
Maybe SS should move their head office to a mail box in Delaware if they are complaining about New York taxes!

Or Alberta maybe. Calgary for example has a combined corporate rate of appx 25% - it's known for its business friendly, low drag, 21st century approach to competitive corporate taxation.

:-)

I cannot think of any reason why an online company would be in New York - apart from Wall St etc

That is something what will never happen. Most of SS holders are financial capitalist groups. They don't like to do such things as paying taxes to other countries. For such people Paying taxes means directing state policies. And, those with US passports can not direct Canadian government what to do!

« Reply #143 on: December 04, 2014, 18:00 »
0
...@Sharpshot: surely it makes sense for all of us to complete the tax interview and minimise our US tax liabilities. As Lobo has pointed out - even people in non treaty countries will then only be taxed on US sales. Also - do UK citizens even need to get a ITIN EIN ? Isn't the UK issued 10 digit UTR going to be enough (and if not is it really such an issue having to get an EIN ?)
No idea about an EIN but when I looked in to it before, the ITIN is going to cost money and take time.  I refuse to get one and I don't want to pay withholding tax, so the only option is to leave sites that insist on it.  Hopefully istock will be like the other big sites and it wont be required.

ShadySue

  • There is a crack in everything
« Reply #144 on: December 04, 2014, 18:14 »
0
...@Sharpshot: surely it makes sense for all of us to complete the tax interview and minimise our US tax liabilities. As Lobo has pointed out - even people in non treaty countries will then only be taxed on US sales. Also - do UK citizens even need to get a ITIN EIN ? Isn't the UK issued 10 digit UTR going to be enough (and if not is it really such an issue having to get an EIN ?)

No idea about an EIN but when I looked in to it before, the ITIN is going to cost money and take time.  I refuse to get one and I don't want to pay withholding tax, so the only option is to leave sites that insist on it.  Hopefully istock will be like the other big sites and it wont be required.


From what's been said over there, the UK UTR will be enough. Getty is following US tax regulations, but some countries like the UK have reciprocal agreements.
Try here and the other FAQs. http://www.istockphoto.com/forum_messages.php?threadid=364057&messageid=7066105#post7066105

Hobostocker

    This user is banned.
« Reply #145 on: December 04, 2014, 23:30 »
0
How do Apple, Google, Starbucks and many others get away with making profits all around the world without paying taxes on those? They only pay taxes to the IRS for profits they actually made within the US.

considering their net gain margin is 10-20% with peaks of 25-30% on a good quarter they couldn't stay in business if they were to pay the same taxation as anyone else.

actually this is true for a good part of the whole US economy, most of the Nasdaq listed companies would go bankrupt if they were based in mainland Europe where taxation can be up to 40%.

same goes for so many asian enterprised that use any possible legal loophole to end up being based in tax havens like HongKong and Singapore, without HK and SG it would be game over for all these companies barely making 10% profits and this is the standards in many areas of consumer electronics for instance, there's an obvious reason why cheap stuff is produced in china and not in germany while Leica or Hasselblad and Phase One are still based in very expensive countries as they net margin is high and they can afford it, i mean selling a 8000$ Leica M-9 or a 10000$ Noctilux lens you don't care if taxes are 40% you still make fat profits.








Hobostocker

    This user is banned.
« Reply #146 on: December 04, 2014, 23:40 »
-1
taxation is high everywhere because it's a tool to control population, without taxation everyone could just work hard for 10-15 yrs and retire at 35 and this is not what capitalism is designed for, we're meant to be enslaved and squeezed like a lemon,  not to enjoy the fruits of our work, in the eyes of the lawmakers we're a resource to be exploited and not human beings.

modern capitalism is nothing more than the natural evolution of piracy and feudalism.


« Reply #147 on: December 05, 2014, 14:13 »
0
I've got a few images with iStock (very few) and $95 on account, but I didn't get the email. I wonder how many iStock contributors have not been notified of this change.

stockuser

« Reply #148 on: December 05, 2014, 14:46 »
0
Has nobody mentioned this?  Do Getty insist on non-US residents getting an ITIN number?  A few sites have insisted on that, most of them have found a way around it.  If they insist on it, I think it will be time to remove my portfolio.  I'm against it on principle, why should I have to get an Individual Tax Identification Number for a country where I don't live and don't have to pay tax?  It looks like a load of unnecessary hassle and expense that other sites have managed to circumvent.

If they do insist on the ITIN number, I could pay the US tax but I'm not doing that, I would rather sell my work elsewhere.

No, they don't. And it's not that "some have found a way around it", the IRS has changed some requirements over the past few years. In 2009/2010 when lots of iStockers were invited to submit directly to Getty, it was mentioned very often that an ITIN was required to avoid withholding tax. When I got a Getty contract through Flickr in 2012, it was already moved to an electronic W8-BEN solution that does not ask for an American tax number. I don't have an ITIN, never had one but I still do not pay any withholding tax on any agency.

However, this does not apply to everyone. It depends on the specifics of the treaty between the US and your home country. Some people will be required to get an ITIN number, others do not need to. But that seems not to be a decision made by Getty/iStock but by the IRS based on the tax treaties. (for what it's worth, I am based in Germany, so that's all I can talk about in this regard)
that is not quite correct there are two legal statuses some belongs to Getty International some belongs to Getty US. Flickr/Moment is Getty International therefore you don't need an ITIN  Getty House collections are still Getty US therefore you still need an ITIN  if you submit via a Getty House contract.

« Reply #149 on: December 05, 2014, 17:46 »
+7
It seems I will finally start taking the step I have been postponing: leave the microstock sites.


 

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