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Messages - Mrblues101

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1
once again, you neither understand how these generators work, nor the massive programming involved. have you worked on such huge projects?

if everyone can optout at any time the training would have to be continuous, and there's no indication original images used would still be available - where are those billions going to be fud and how would they be able to identify your work?

but again, you dont understand how these work -; once trained, there is NO way to trace back to original training set.

What AIs do, they do from our work. From my point of view it is a much more sophisticated form of copyright infringement, but in essence it is the same.

Our work (copyrighted material) was used to produce something new, and that "something new" is sold without giving us royalties.

The semantics of "training" an AI and the definition of "training a machine", which must be expressed in thousands of words, do not change the essence of what is being done.

2
I totally agree

Our years of work was used without our authorization to train the "system" that now leaves us without a job.

We should receive a percentage of the royalties produced by AI images (no matter how little money it was).

3
Stop working on Microstock and doing something else...

4
His answer:

"Did we really pay you that much? It must be a bug in the system, you should have only received a few cents."

5
Shutterstock.com / Re: Shutterstock "Contributor Fund"
« on: December 31, 2022, 13:59 »
Original content is NOT modified or used, so I'd say, that's not important or relevant. Images and descriptions are only used to train the AI.

Exactly, in the same way your brain changes when you read a book and you learn about globalization (for example) being able to talk about it, or write about it, but without this meaning that you are infringing the copyright of the original book. You learn about something, and now you are able to create something new by using the new learning.

This is how machine learning works, and law now understand that new creations by AI based on machine learning, owe nothing to the elements they have used to learn.


6
Shutterstock.com / Re: Shutterstock "Contributor Fund"
« on: December 29, 2022, 16:18 »
Is there any chance of we keeping getting this payment day by day, week by week or month by months??

After all, soon the AI will create images based in our work.

By the way... who is the owner of the copyright when AI creates something?? And specially when this "something" is based in previous copyrighted creations??

Is there any copyright law about AI creating things???

I'm just guessing, like everyone else, that these are make up payments for past licensing in 2022. I don't think they will become daily or anything else, but maybe every six months as SS has told us. Most of that is irrelevant, isn't it? I mean if we get payments twice a year from what's accumulated or once a month, what's the difference.

More important questions are about who owns the rights.

New images are not created based on something previously copyrighted. The new images are based on Machine Learning and the images are new creations. AI doesn't use our images, it uses what the machines has learned about something.

So if the machine has been fed 2,000 images of a Banana, it learns that a banana is is basically, black, or brown, or green or yellow. Then the machine learns what a banana shape is. The machine also learns characteristics of the middle and ends and lines and other parts, maybe the insides as well as other parts or slices or variations of a banana. When someone says they want an image, created by AI that includes a banana, the computer uses everything it knows and creates a new banana. Our images are not directly used.

Who owns the results? That depends on the service someone uses. Open AI / DALL-E2 we own the rights and the images can be used commercially. But Open AI also retains the right to use the image, if they want.

Others you can only use commercially if you paid for the service. And I'm surer there are other versions of the contract.

This will have to go into the courts and be decided, and this is new territory, so there isn't much case law to use for an answer. TBD. One case the courts decided that an AI creation, can't be copyrighted.

However because we enter the words and the software is only a tool, those results are argued to be different.

If anyone wants to read the involved details:  https://www.lexology.com/library/detail.aspx?g=4f5fb5fa-b968-4049-8297-0cff617917b5#:~:text=In%202014%20the%20US%20Copyright%20Office%20expressly%20established,IT%20system%20could%20not%20qualify%20for%20copyright%20protection.

"Therefore, it would seem that AI works autonomously produced by the IT system could not qualify for copyright protection. In other words, protection could be granted only when there is human intervention in the process carried out by the AI. After all, one has to bear in mind that the approach toward AI should be based on the key principle according to which the center and focus of the protection is and remain the human being. "

Thank you for your very complete answer.

This is a very new topic and laws are clearly being created now.

I used OpenAI a while ago, but to see the potential of AI writing. It's very impressive as it was able to create some short stories with the information I put. However, as far as I understand this AI was trained with books and texts in the public domain.

This time they used our images that are not in public domain... perhaps this whole issue stems from the fact that SS used our work without proper authorization from us. They have the clearance due to a devious legal trick by updating the terms and conditions and put this new condition on it, but I don't think anyone would have agreed to this deal if we had been explicitly asked.

7
Shutterstock.com / Re: Shutterstock "Contributor Fund"
« on: December 28, 2022, 22:02 »
Is there any chance of we keeping getting this payment day by day, week by week or month by months??

After all, soon the AI will create images based in our work.

By the way... who is the owner of the copyright when AI creates something?? And specially when this "something" is based in previous copyrighted creations??

Is there any copyright law about AI creating things???

8
DepositPhotos / Re: W9 issues with Depositphoto
« on: December 28, 2022, 16:46 »
I am a little confused about this and I am also interested in all this issues because I am trying to incorporate a LLC as non resident in US (not related to MicroStock).

So, you are trying to sell images by using your company?? Or they became crazy and are asking you to fill taxes papers as company??

9
DepositPhotos / Re: W9 issues with Depositphoto
« on: December 27, 2022, 15:21 »
What about using ITIN?

10
Shutterstock.com / Re: Shutterstock "Contributor Fund"
« on: December 23, 2022, 20:37 »
What's the justification for not telling the contributor which images were purchased for this usage?

Probably nowhere near enough space to list them all.

Are you implying that these line items we see correspond to more than one asset?
No images were "purchased".  Parts of our collections were used in training AI in generating new content.  So yes, more than one "asset".

Exactly, the portfolio that took us a lifetime to make was used to make our profession obsolete.

Welcome to the future.

11
Shutterstock.com / Re: Shutterstock "Contributor Fund"
« on: December 22, 2022, 19:46 »
What's the justification for not telling the contributor which images were purchased for this usage?

I think images wasn't purchased in the traditional way, but they sell the right for the AI to check all of them to get info from them.

12
Shutterstock.com / Re: Shutterstock "Contributor Fund"
« on: December 22, 2022, 13:09 »
They will pay this just one time?? Or every month/year??

13
Shutterstock.com / Re: Shutterstock "Contributor Fund"
« on: December 21, 2022, 11:46 »
The amount is proportional to the sympathy the AI has for you.

In the case of a possible apocalypse by robots and AI, we must send a congregation made up of those who receive the most money in the contributor column, to conduct peace negotiations.

14
General Stock Discussion / Re: About taxes and specially US forms
« on: December 18, 2022, 08:39 »
I think once I open my LLC in US, after I get my ITIN, then I should include the ITIN in my W8BEN form. What I don't want is that royalties in microstock agencies made the company taxes papers more complicated, but I think this will not affect the forms.

15
General Stock Discussion / Re: About taxes and specially US forms
« on: December 16, 2022, 07:17 »
You need to apply to the IRS to get a ITIN... but you don't really need one, as a non-US individual you should be using your Foreign Tax Identification Number, which is your tax ID in your own country. Although if you have, or do, set up a US company then you'll be using the ITIN instead, which should be provided to you at some point during the setup.

Thank you for your reply SpaceStockFootage.

Yes, I was unable to formulate the question properly due to my ignorance of the US tax system.

Now I research more, my original question is: did I get an ITIN by filling the microstocks tax forms??

And the reply is actually NO.

And I actually don't want an ITIN now, because as non-US resident if I already have one, then the process is apparently more complicated.

16
Hello everyone,
                recently I started with vectors and I would like to know whether I can submit the same vector to more stockagencies? I already submitted a few vectors to SS and I want to be sure before I submit elsewhere. I plan to Adobe, SS, Dreamstime and that is. Can you recommend some other vectorstock? These days I dont expect much, but every dime counts. Thanks a lot.

Hello Maxop-plus.

Yes, you can. It is what we are doing since years. But if you upload an image to an agency under the "exclusive" status, then you can't upload this image to another agency.

I never use it, but there is a software that upload to multiple agencies. This could be time saving.

17
General Stock Discussion / Re: About taxes and specially US forms
« on: December 14, 2022, 12:50 »
Ok, I just keep researching about it, and I realize that the "number" I was talking about is the ITIN (Individual Tax Identification Number).

So, by filling the SS and DT tax forms, did this assignated me an ITIN??

18
General Stock Discussion / Re: About taxes and specially US forms
« on: December 07, 2022, 15:24 »
I am not as active in MicroStock business since SS change the payment rates in 2019... anyway sometimes I still upload some pics and I also get a floor incoming from my previous work...

Anyway, I am considering creating a new company within USA being non-resident.

I just want to ask, did my old SS and DreamsTime US tax payer status make this process more complicated? After all, I am a tax payer within USA.

In the other hand, I always have two different forms, one for DreamsTime and one for SS, this was ok?? Or should I see the way to use the same number and same forms for both agencies??
you'll need to check with the IRS website for details on any changes

but old statements shouldn't matter - you would just report the 1099 you receive for current tax year

not sure which 'number' you're referring to

I also don't know about the 'number' I am refering, I just never pay attention to tax thing up to now. My point with the 'number' is that by filling the form I get a "US tax payer ID" or something, and once I get I should use the same for each agency (??).

I never do nothing with the 1099 form I get from SS, my interpretation was that by not being US recident I should use this in my country for local taxes proposes, I am wrong?

19
General Stock Discussion / About taxes and specially US forms
« on: December 07, 2022, 09:19 »
I am not as active in MicroStock business since SS change the payment rates in 2019... anyway sometimes I still upload some pics and I also get a floor incoming from my previous work...

Anyway, I am considering creating a new company within USA being non-resident.

I just want to ask, did my old SS and DreamsTime US tax payer status make this process more complicated? After all, I am a tax payer within USA.

In the other hand, I always have two different forms, one for DreamsTime and one for SS, this was ok?? Or should I see the way to use the same number and same forms for both agencies??

20
Site Related / Re: Where is Everybody?
« on: December 02, 2020, 11:40 »
Shutterstock killed my motivation...But i still read messages here...sometimes.

Same here

21
Public domain means some form that belongs to everyone and that anyone can use.

In publications as books, unless the laws of the country where it was published say otherwise, your book belongs to the public domain 70 years after the death of the author. It was 50 years, but Walt Disney pressured the US government to change this to 70 so as not to lose the rights to Winnie Pooh (true story).

During those 70 years your family (or those to whom you have sold the rights to your work) will continue to benefit from it.

You can also voluntarily place your book in the public domain, but I don't know how to do it.

If a book is in the public domain, you can do whatever you want with it, except say it is from your authorship. Think of Shakespeare's books, they will always be his work, but anyone can print and sell them, anyone can make a movie based on his story without paying any rights to anyone, and even modify the story in any way they want. The best example is Dickens's "Christmas Carol".

These laws apply to books and everything else, but with images I don't know how it works (i don't know the specific details).

22
Dreamstime.com / Re: Would like some advice on Dreamstime. Thanks
« on: November 14, 2020, 21:07 »
Edit: I just realize payment minimum is 100$ instead of 50$ so my advice will not work.

My advice... maybe illegal, maybe not... i don't know the legal status of what i am going to suggest...

Anyway... my advice, check payment rate per pic and ask a friend to buy some of your pics at DT... once you have your payout then you can give your friend the money back. By using this way you will not get a 43$ earining but maybe 20-25$... better that nothing.

But please, if you do this just check in deep what % you get per sale, i never understand this part in DT.

23
Try Payoneer

24
It depends on what you are doing with the editorial use image. Newspapers have stories with accompanying images on the same page as ads, so putting mixed content types in one place is not a problem.

If you are writing infomercial blog posts - in the style of a news or magazine story, but it's just a marketing/sales pitch - then stay away from editorial use only stock images.

Focus on the story the editorial use image is used with, not what else is on the same page or other parts of a blog, to decide if it's appropriate

Well, my project involves information on sports science, and I am looking to sell related info products, but the articles will be on neutral topics, not on products.

(For this project many of the editorial photos look much more attractive, especially those during sporting events)

25
I just realized that some blog posts I've been reading use SS images that are EDITORIAL ones ...

It is a proper use? May i use them for blog article, even if in same page i am promoting a commercial product / service ??

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