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Author Topic: Goodbye Shutterstock  (Read 53331 times)

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« Reply #100 on: October 14, 2016, 10:51 »
+2
Right in this moment in time SS seems completely dead in the water.

true
From your perspective maybe but for a lot of people its still  #1 declining maybe but not "dead"


FT and IS will very soon be equal  to SS - and after some time - SS will fall behind - it is still no.1 for me too - but - it will not last -


« Reply #101 on: October 14, 2016, 10:54 »
+2
IS really? not sure anyone is seeing much growth there apart from you maybe? Where can I get one of these amazing crystal balls many of you seem to have?

« Reply #102 on: October 14, 2016, 11:11 »
+2
IS will go a little bit up - and SS will go a lot more down - SS plays with search all the time - and now it gets worse and worse... SS lost common sense

lemonyellow

« Reply #103 on: October 14, 2016, 12:09 »
+2
It's a known fact that SS plays with the search all the time. As a result they lose common sense quite often, but luckily they usually regain sense after a while.

The only sensible thing to do in such cases - such as now when new photos are not selling at all, at least in my experience - is to stop uploading for a while. Not in protest, not to boycott but just waiting for their search to return to a more balanced form.

More a see you later than goodbye Shutterstock.

« Reply #104 on: October 14, 2016, 21:14 »
+1
Right in this moment in time SS seems completely dead in the water.

true
From your perspective maybe but for a lot of people its still  #1 declining maybe but not "dead"


FT and IS will very soon be equal  to SS - and after some time - SS will fall behind - it is still no.1 for me too - but - it will not last -

October 15 2016

Shutterstock    80.7
Fotolia    34.6
iStock    27.3

Want to bet $1000 that in one year FT won't be 50% of SS and IS won't be 33% of SS?

Some people complain that uploading new doesn't make an increase in money on SS. Same people I want to know how you are growing on FT and IS for the same number of uploads. Increase, decrease or same? Time to treat all the same, not just pick on SS for disappointing increase, when the rest make no increase on same photos.

Profits do not grow by collection size. We all know that for years and years. Competition grows more then we can feed the beast. Income will go down, based on RPI. Fact of life. Don't act surprised when you knew this all along.

SpaceStockFootage

  • Space, Sci-Fi and Astronomy Related Stock Footage

« Reply #105 on: October 15, 2016, 00:34 »
+7
Always amazes me that considerably less than 0.1% of a site's contributor base, complain about a drop in sales in a forum, and they all see it as a worrying trend or the beginning of the end.

Then the inevitable response is 'well where are all the people having great or steady sales?' Well the main reason is probably that they're not actively seeking out threads about bad sales. Also, they're probably too busy sipping cocktails on the beach and buying swan-skin jackets and drinking bottles of vintage champagne with all their bundles of cash. Or something like that.

I had my BME at SS last month, just so you know. It was about 50% more than August.... so by my calculations, SS is experiencing a 50% increase on sales month on month. Those are the stats... they don't lie!

I'm not sure about here, but I know other forums where such threads have been going on for the last seven years. If everyone is to be believed, then the entire stock industry would have been dead and buried a long time ago.

And what are all these people going to do when they have their BME next month? Are they going to rush back here to report in? Probably not... as somebody who is doing well is less likely to be concerned about a thread on people not doing so well.

Unless their reports are fabrications, Shutterstock is making more and more money year on year. It just happens that not every contributor is making more and more money year on year. These things happen.

But how do you explain a 50% drop over a period of a couple of months? That's just variation. A drop of 50% from one day to the next isn't rare, these things happen, especially on a weekend. The same drop over a week, a month, two... it gets rarer and indicates more of a trend as time goes on, but it's still an exception rather than the norm. There will probably be somebody out there that was getting $1000 a month until June and then they've got $100 a month since. That's going to be very rare... but seeing as we make up less than 0.1% of the total, that could happen to all of us and it would still be an outlier rather than a tend or a worrying pattern.

Anyway, that's the way I see it.

Although I do agree with the whole content saturation, more providers, less slice of the cake etc thing.


« Reply #106 on: October 15, 2016, 01:56 »
+2
Probably the only stats we can rely on in the industry are the SS reports....unless you think the Directors are prepared to risk going to jail! Its the same pattern every month after 3-4 days someone complains its a disastrous month and everyone else having a slow start jumps in. I don't doubt that  there is a slow decline caused by an imbalance of supply and demand that is clear from the figures. I also think that  SS is not being managed as well as it was with bugs in its software becoming more apparent but the idea that its "dead" "doomed" etc etc is a gross exaggeration.
« Last Edit: October 15, 2016, 02:38 by Pauws99 »

Shelma1

  • stockcoalition.org
« Reply #107 on: October 15, 2016, 14:38 »
+9
Always amazes me that considerably less than 0.1% of a site's contributor base, complain about a drop in sales in a forum, and they all see it as a worrying trend or the beginning of the end.

Then the inevitable response is 'well where are all the people having great or steady sales?' Well the main reason is probably that they're not actively seeking out threads about bad sales. Also, they're probably too busy sipping cocktails on the beach and buying swan-skin jackets and drinking bottles of vintage champagne with all their bundles of cash. Or something like that.

I had my BME at SS last month, just so you know. It was about 50% more than August.... so by my calculations, SS is experiencing a 50% increase on sales month on month. Those are the stats... they don't lie!

I'm not sure about here, but I know other forums where such threads have been going on for the last seven years. If everyone is to be believed, then the entire stock industry would have been dead and buried a long time ago.

And what are all these people going to do when they have their BME next month? Are they going to rush back here to report in? Probably not... as somebody who is doing well is less likely to be concerned about a thread on people not doing so well.

Unless their reports are fabrications, Shutterstock is making more and more money year on year. It just happens that not every contributor is making more and more money year on year. These things happen.

But how do you explain a 50% drop over a period of a couple of months? That's just variation. A drop of 50% from one day to the next isn't rare, these things happen, especially on a weekend. The same drop over a week, a month, two... it gets rarer and indicates more of a trend as time goes on, but it's still an exception rather than the norm. There will probably be somebody out there that was getting $1000 a month until June and then they've got $100 a month since. That's going to be very rare... but seeing as we make up less than 0.1% of the total, that could happen to all of us and it would still be an outlier rather than a tend or a worrying pattern.

Anyway, that's the way I see it.

Although I do agree with the whole content saturation, more providers, less slice of the cake etc thing.

It's possible for SS to be doing well while individual contributors do less well.

It's possible for SS to see an increase in sales while contributors see a decrease.

It's possible for monthly variations to exist while overall sales decline. Sure, my October is better than my September...that doesn't mean it's better than October 2015.

It's possible for SS to favor new contributors in the most popular search, for a variety of perfectly logical reasons.

It's possible for spammers to better their positions in the search, to the detriment of non-spammers.

It's possible that people with good sales will post in bad sales threads (you're here, right?)

It's possible that these are not conspiracy theories, but patterns long term contributors notice over time.

« Reply #108 on: October 15, 2016, 21:46 »
+1

It's possible for SS to be doing well while individual contributors do less well.

+ true

It's possible for SS to see an increase in sales while contributors see a decrease.

+ true

It's possible for monthly variations to exist while overall sales decline. Sure, my October is better than my September...that doesn't mean it's better than October 2015.

+ true

It's possible for SS to favor new contributors in the most popular search, for a variety of perfectly logical reasons.

+ true and they do

It's possible for spammers to better their positions in the search, to the detriment of non-spammers.

+ true but it doesn't mean they get more sale from that

It's possible that people with good sales will post in bad sales threads (you're here, right?)

+ true it's possible but makes no sense

It's possible that these are not conspiracy theories, but patterns long term contributors notice over time.

+ true but the conclusions don't match the facts

Noticing something, truths or fact and coming up with some conspiracy are not the same thing.

It's possible and true that my income keeps going up on SS and other sites, while some other people it's going down. Might be they are uploading more and making less or less RPI. There's no direct equation with number of photos and income, which people assume there should be.

Conclusions and conspiracy from possibles like you write are possible but just because it's possible or fact, doesn't make the conclusion fact. Flawed logic, biased emotion, anger over income or imagined what should possibly be, makes for false conclusions.

Facts are just facts. We work harder and make less. We upload more and make less. It's possible that there is a diminishing return and competition has diluted any hope of continued gains. But people don't want the truth? So they make up conspiracy theories and reasons why something else like agency and unfairness controlls the truth. I think it's called denial.

SpaceStockFootage

  • Space, Sci-Fi and Astronomy Related Stock Footage

« Reply #109 on: October 16, 2016, 02:29 »
0
Always amazes me that considerably less than 0.1% of a site's contributor base, complain about a drop in sales in a forum, and they all see it as a worrying trend or the beginning of the end.

Then the inevitable response is 'well where are all the people having great or steady sales?' Well the main reason is probably that they're not actively seeking out threads about bad sales. Also, they're probably too busy sipping cocktails on the beach and buying swan-skin jackets and drinking bottles of vintage champagne with all their bundles of cash. Or something like that.

I had my BME at SS last month, just so you know. It was about 50% more than August.... so by my calculations, SS is experiencing a 50% increase on sales month on month. Those are the stats... they don't lie!

I'm not sure about here, but I know other forums where such threads have been going on for the last seven years. If everyone is to be believed, then the entire stock industry would have been dead and buried a long time ago.

And what are all these people going to do when they have their BME next month? Are they going to rush back here to report in? Probably not... as somebody who is doing well is less likely to be concerned about a thread on people not doing so well.

Unless their reports are fabrications, Shutterstock is making more and more money year on year. It just happens that not every contributor is making more and more money year on year. These things happen.

But how do you explain a 50% drop over a period of a couple of months? That's just variation. A drop of 50% from one day to the next isn't rare, these things happen, especially on a weekend. The same drop over a week, a month, two... it gets rarer and indicates more of a trend as time goes on, but it's still an exception rather than the norm. There will probably be somebody out there that was getting $1000 a month until June and then they've got $100 a month since. That's going to be very rare... but seeing as we make up less than 0.1% of the total, that could happen to all of us and it would still be an outlier rather than a tend or a worrying pattern.

Anyway, that's the way I see it.

Although I do agree with the whole content saturation, more providers, less slice of the cake etc thing.

It's possible for SS to be doing well while individual contributors do less well.

It's possible for SS to see an increase in sales while contributors see a decrease.

It's possible for monthly variations to exist while overall sales decline. Sure, my October is better than my September...that doesn't mean it's better than October 2015.

It's possible for SS to favor new contributors in the most popular search, for a variety of perfectly logical reasons.

It's possible for spammers to better their positions in the search, to the detriment of non-spammers.

It's possible that people with good sales will post in bad sales threads (you're here, right?)

It's possible that these are not conspiracy theories, but patterns long term contributors notice over time.

You seem to have missed the point. Hardly any of my observations contradict the points you've raised. I'm not saying that the people who are having falling sales are lying, I'm saying that it doesn't automatically mean that Shutterstock is on the way out.

« Reply #110 on: October 16, 2016, 03:25 »
+2
Does this discussion make any sense?
Do you expect any positive result?
Will SS make any changes?
Do you feel better after your comments?
Do you realy know what SS is all about?

Would it make sense to stop this dispute for ever?

lemonyellow

« Reply #111 on: October 16, 2016, 06:51 »
+11
Does this discussion make any sense?
some sense

Do you expect any positive result?
not much

Will SS make any changes?
possibly; they won't change policies, but may silently fix glitches if they are reading

Do you feel better after your comments?
about the same as before

Do you realy know what SS is all about?
after a few years with them I have some ideas

Would it make sense to stop this dispute for ever?
maybe

PS: these questions may basically apply to EVERY topic here

« Reply #112 on: October 16, 2016, 06:54 »
+8
Does this discussion make any sense?
Do you expect any positive result?
Will SS make any changes?
Do you feel better after your comments?
Do you realy know what SS is all about?

Would it make sense to stop this dispute for ever?

I take it you're being the devil's advocate here given that you are following and contributing to this thread, but I'll take the bait anyway.

Yes, this discussion does make sense.  As the OP has come to the conclusion uploading new content no longer makes sense it gives us pause for thought and to question if our situation is similar to theirs.  It's always good to reevaluate business activities continuously and the OP's conclusion will be a key point to take into consideration.

A positive result for sure, as even keeping the status quo in my relationship with Shutterstock is best done with my eyes wide open to any new developments and feedback from the forum is often useful to take in and ruminate over.

SS is always making changes, it is not about having input into those changes, but understanding how those changes affect us and the changes we make.   I've seen the figures, Shutterstock continuously improves it's turnover and profits quarter after quarter, year after year and despite increased competition their direction of travel appears set for now.  Contributors on the other hand are in more dodgy waters and I expect to see differing opinions on how to proceed from here.

Feeling better for my comments is not the purpose, this is not therapy and I'm not here to get my ego stroked.  I may feel more comfortable with my comments and decisions if a consensus develops, or I might set my path again the stream of opinion and enjoy the challenge of putting across my perspective, but feeling better or worse is not a relevant consideration to me.

Yes, SS is all about selling images to me and when they make changes that reduces my sales, like the OP I too have to reevaluate them and make a decision on whether or not to continue uploading or not. 

What dispute?  Is Shutterstock dead?  Obviously not, but as a contributor is it productive to continue uploading when new content does not sell, that will always be disputed depending on your perspective and a question that should be evaluated continuously and this thread may provide useful information in that regard if it's not side tracked by philosophical questions.

My position, well it's not the same as the OP's, I work outside the industry.  Non the less, income from my earnings has, when times were hard, fed my cat and if any money was left over fed me as well.  Since then, over the last two years my income from Shutterstock has halved and uploading has decreased.  The stats tell me one eighth  of my earnings for the past two years has come from new content despite few uploads in the last twelve months, so uploading new content may well be on the cards for me, even though closer scrutiny shows only the occasional new image takes off and contributes, most do not sell.  They sell elsewhere so it's no hardship for me to keep Shutterstock going.  The drop in earnings I put down to increased competition, dilution call it what you will.

As for contributors in the OP's position, well you're buggered because they are not only squeezed by open competition like me, but also from the closed competition at the top.  With the Enterprise Team working for the top earners on the Premier Select group those outside that barrier will have noticed a considerable drop in income commensurate to the growth within Shutterstock of the Enterprise Team who will be creaming off all the best customers for the chosen few.

« Reply #113 on: October 17, 2016, 03:26 »
+8
Hello Guys,

I contribute to the stock industry since 2005.
I have seen dozens and dozens of these posts always predicting the apocalypse on the stock industry.

[..insults removed..]

In 2005 you uploaded any (ANY!!) photo and it would sell because there wasn't competition.
Nowadays competition is fierce. You must have great and innovative content or else you'll die.

From 2010 until now I always had better years. This year is 10% better when compared to 2015.
« Last Edit: October 18, 2016, 00:35 by leaf »

Justanotherphotographer

« Reply #114 on: October 17, 2016, 05:09 »
0
.
« Last Edit: October 17, 2016, 05:41 by Justanotherphotographer »

« Reply #115 on: October 17, 2016, 05:51 »
+2
Hello Guys,

I contribute to the stock industry since 2005.
I have seen dozens and dozens of these posts always predicting the apocalypse on the stock industry.

Please let me say something to you. Most of the people here doesn't have link to their portfolios, but judging from the ones I could see... your content is s**t.

In 2005 you uploaded any (ANY!!) photo and it would sell because there wasn't competition.
Nowadays competition is fierce. You must have great and innovative content or else you'll die.

From 2010 until now I always had better years. This year is 10% better when compared to 2015.


Some of my $hit from 2005 still sells well, though.  :)

Overprocessed, overfiltered is the hip new look and larger design firms may love that, but remember, there are smaller companies who use plain old photography as well.

I do agree that the competition is fierce, though, and no, i dont see the stock industry going away...not until the world stops reading publications, both printed and online.
« Last Edit: October 17, 2016, 10:41 by cathyslife »

« Reply #116 on: October 17, 2016, 06:01 »
+3
Always amazes me that considerably less than 0.1% of a site's contributor base, complain about a drop in sales in a forum, and they all see it as a worrying trend or the beginning of the end.
...........
Although I do agree with the whole content saturation, more providers, less slice of the cake etc thing.

Agree fully.

The destruction of the stock industry, the music business and the film industry has been here for 15 years now according to forums... And a new conspiracy is formed against the individual contributor every week.

I think we can agree on this though:

Competition is higher (more as well as better (and worse)).
The need for content is higher than ever.
You have to be better, more unique, and work harder than 10 years ago.

People with a positive outlook will always succeed in the long run. Instead of thinking "wow, this site really has something personal against me and is punishing me in the search", the person thinking "wow, these new guys are really good, I need to really up my game to stay on top, even if I was #1 before" will not give up and continue to improve.
« Last Edit: October 17, 2016, 06:19 by increasingdifficulty »


« Reply #117 on: October 17, 2016, 06:10 »
0
If you dont increase your income year by year and you still continue to upload you must be a fool and better look for another job and stop crying. Thats all about business. Everything else is just a hobby.

« Reply #118 on: October 17, 2016, 07:01 »
+6
If you dont increase your income year by year and you still continue to upload you must be a fool and better look for another job and stop crying. Thats all about business. Everything else is just a hobby.

So if an actor made $10 million per movie in 1996 and can now only get $1 million, should she/he roll over, give up and get a job at Netflix, if acting is what they love to do?

If every business quit the year they were making less money than the previous there wouldn't be many businesses left in this world...
« Last Edit: October 17, 2016, 07:06 by increasingdifficulty »

« Reply #119 on: October 17, 2016, 07:15 »
+4
Get over it, move on does not add to our knowledge or understanding.  Some people seem to want to put a full stop to a thread that appears to have no relevance to them, why?

Shelma1

  • stockcoalition.org
« Reply #120 on: October 17, 2016, 09:03 »
+11
Hello Guys,

I contribute to the stock industry since 2005.
I have seen dozens and dozens of these posts always predicting the apocalypse on the stock industry.

Please let me say something to you. Most of the people here doesn't have link to their portfolios, but judging from the ones I could see... your content is s**t.

In 2005 you uploaded any (ANY!!) photo and it would sell because there wasn't competition.
Nowadays competition is fierce. You must have great and innovative content or else you'll die.

From 2010 until now I always had better years. This year is 10% better when compared to 2015.

You've (supposedly) made one post, and your one and only post is to pop in and tell other people their content is sh!t?

« Reply #121 on: October 17, 2016, 09:26 »
0
The will to believe is strong.

« Reply #122 on: October 17, 2016, 10:40 »
+1
Hello Guys,

I contribute to the stock industry since 2005.
I have seen dozens and dozens of these posts always predicting the apocalypse on the stock industry.

Please let me say something to you. Most of the people here doesn't have link to their portfolios, but judging from the ones I could see... your content is s**t.

In 2005 you uploaded any (ANY!!) photo and it would sell because there wasn't competition.
Nowadays competition is fierce. You must have great and innovative content or else you'll die.

From 2010 until now I always had better years. This year is 10% better when compared to 2015.

You've (supposedly) made one post, and your one and only post is to pop in and tell other people their content is sh!t?


it is because he s IQ is :one, two, three...

SpaceStockFootage

  • Space, Sci-Fi and Astronomy Related Stock Footage

« Reply #123 on: October 18, 2016, 00:25 »
0
Get over it, move on does not add to our knowledge or understanding.  Some people seem to want to put a full stop to a thread that appears to have no relevance to them, why?

They're just trying to make sure the people who think it has relevance to them, understand that it might not actually have all that much relevance to them.

« Reply #124 on: October 18, 2016, 03:29 »
+1
Hello Guys,

I contribute to the stock industry since 2005.
I have seen dozens and dozens of these posts always predicting the apocalypse on the stock industry.

[..insults removed..]

In 2005 you uploaded any (ANY!!) photo and it would sell because there wasn't competition.
Nowadays competition is fierce. You must have great and innovative content or else you'll die.

From 2010 until now I always had better years. This year is 10% better when compared to 2015.

In ideal case. In reality SS restricts majority of contributors to some type of content and type of post processing. Something different will not go through. But i know that many of us don't want to be specialized and sit in a niche defined by ss reviewers.


 

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