Author Topic: Changes to your contributor contract (Read 11241 times)

Steveball · « **on:** October 15, 2018, 06:58 »

So we agree to give away images!

9.1. In addition to the promotion rights set out in 8.3 above you grant Alamy permission to sell your Images at any price and by any method we feel appropriate and to supply Images to third parties without Alamy having to consult you, including but not limited to trials with new Customers, prototypes/proof of concept and high volume low unit price licences. Where Alamy does not make a charge to these third parties, you will not receive payment.

BaldricksTrousers · « **Reply #1 on:** October 15, 2018, 07:08 »

The "high volume low unit prices" bit might be worse. There's little incentive for Alamy to give away images but package deals for massive usage at low cost could be lucrative for alamy but produce tiny returns for suppliers.

dpimborough · « **Reply #2 on:** October 15, 2018, 07:16 »

Alamy already had this clause in the contract

"9.3. Where Alamy does not make a charge to these third-parties, the Contributor will not receive payment. "

angelawaye · « **Reply #3 on:** October 15, 2018, 07:23 »

Just keeps getting worse ... I'm thinking it may be time to remove my port from them. Not a huge earner anyway.

MysteryShot · « **Reply #4 on:** October 15, 2018, 07:27 »

They will sell our images on the black market, on the street with dvd and usb sticks

Brasilnut · « **Reply #5 on:** October 15, 2018, 08:18 »

Et tu, Alamy?

angelawaye · « **Reply #6 on:** October 15, 2018, 08:27 »

I just deleted all my top-selling popular photos on Alamy and left a few that I wouldn't be too upset if given away for free. Too bad it takes 180 days to have them removed.

Justanotherphotographer · « **Reply #7 on:** October 15, 2018, 08:48 »

Quote from: Sammy the Cat on October 15, 2018, 07:16

Alamy already had this clause in the contract

"9.3. Where Alamy does not make a charge to these third-parties, the Contributor will not receive payment. "

Yes, not a change, they just combined clauses 9.1 and 9.2

Uncle Pete · « **Reply #8 on:** October 15, 2018, 08:52 »

Quote from: angelawaye on October 15, 2018, 08:27

I just deleted all my top-selling popular photos on Alamy and left a few that I wouldn't be too upset if given away for free. Too bad it takes 180 days to have them removed.

They aren't giving your photos away for free. If they don't charge for a demo, prototype, or proof of concept, you don't get paid. Poorly worded, because the rest could be misread as they can give away our work. That's not the intent of the clause.

Not the first time someone at Alamy has re-written something and made it impossible to understand clearly.

Zero Talent · « **Reply #9 on:** October 15, 2018, 08:52 »

Quote from: Brasilnut on October 15, 2018, 08:18

Et tu, Alamy?

Et eos!

BTW, here is my latest sale on Alamy:
I get only 30% of it, or $0.66

If they lowered prices so much, down to micro levels, I would at least expect to see micro level volume, but it's not happening.

ravens · « **Reply #10 on:** October 15, 2018, 08:57 »

There are several bits changed to more readable English. The "high volume low unit price licences. " looks new. What if you're selling Rights Managed? Would imagine they can't sell RM images, or editorial as bulk, not as easily anyway?

ravens · « **Reply #11 on:** October 15, 2018, 08:59 »

Quote from: Uncle Pete on October 15, 2018, 08:52

Quote from: angelawaye on October 15, 2018, 08:27
I just deleted all my top-selling popular photos on Alamy and left a few that I wouldn't be too upset if given away for free. Too bad it takes 180 days to have them removed.

They aren't giving your photos away for free. If they don't charge for a demo, prototype, or proof of concept, you don't get paid. Poorly worded, because the rest could be misread as they can give away our work. That's not the intent of the clause.

Not the first time someone at Alamy has re-written something and made it impossible to understand clearly.

What does it mean then?

stockastic · « **Reply #12 on:** October 15, 2018, 09:03 »

Just like all the other so-called 'agencies': they can make the real money via up-front fees or 'plans' without paying the contributor anything - except a token amount on a discounted 'sale' when and if an image is used in a publicly discoverable way and a license is granted.

ShadySue · « **Reply #13 on:** October 15, 2018, 09:05 »

Quote from: ravens on October 15, 2018, 08:57

There are several bits changed to more readable English. The "high volume low unit price licences. " looks new. What if you're selling Rights Managed? Would imagine they can't sell RM images, or editorial as bulk, not as easily anyway?

I can assure you, they can, and do. I had 4 of these in August.

Uncle Pete · « **Reply #14 on:** October 15, 2018, 09:40 »

Quote from: ravens on October 15, 2018, 08:59

Quote from: Uncle Pete on October 15, 2018, 08:52
Quote from: angelawaye on October 15, 2018, 08:27
I just deleted all my top-selling popular photos on Alamy and left a few that I wouldn't be too upset if given away for free. Too bad it takes 180 days to have them removed.

They aren't giving your photos away for free. If they don't charge for a demo, prototype, or proof of concept, you don't get paid. Poorly worded, because the rest could be misread as they can give away our work. That's not the intent of the clause.

Not the first time someone at Alamy has re-written something and made it impossible to understand clearly.

What does it mean then?

Many things, all mixed in together. First off what it doesn't mean: they will give away your work for free and you get nothing.

Second it's under

9. Novel use licences {participation in novel use is optional}
If you grant novel use rights;

If you aren't enrolled in Novel Use #9 doesn't exist!

Like Sue says, they will reduce prices to what they want for high volume customers or special use. I've had some of that too. Zero Talents example, distributor, to low price, one month web. That's a ball of strange. We get 50% of the what's left.

1) you grant Alamy permission to sell your Images at any price
2) and by any method we feel appropriate
3) and to supply Images to third parties without Alamy having to consult you
4) including but not limited to trials with new Customers, prototypes/proof of concept
5) and high volume low unit price licences.

6) Where Alamy does not make a charge to these third parties, you will not receive payment.

Alamy needs to buy an OR

to replace some of these ANDs. No we don't agree to give away images.

9.1. In addition to the promotion rights set out in 8.3 above you grant Alamy permission to sell your Images at any price OR by any method we feel appropriate OR to supply Images to third parties without Alamy having to consult you, including but not limited to trials with new Customers, prototypes/proof of concept OR high volume low unit price licences. Where Alamy does not make a charge to these third parties, you will not receive payment.

Now that we have covered Novel Use, what does the contract actually say?

8. Pricing and promotion

8.1
.
Alamy offers Custom Pricing to some of its Customers in relation to Rights Managed Images with or without exclusivity and
Royalty Free Images i.e. pricing contracts entered into with Customers where Images are licensed for set amounts, dependent upon
usage or dependent upon volumes of Images purchased. These licence prices may vary from those of the Alamy licence calculator
and you agree that your Images can be licensed at these rates without Alamy having to consult you.

8.2
.
Alamy offers its Customers the ability to price up all Images on its site by using a licence calculator. You agree that Alamy can sell Images at the prices from this calculator without Alamy having to consult you.

8.3
.
Promotion - Alamy shall have the right to offer Customers promotions on Images to promote the Alamy service without Alamy
having to consult you, including, but not limited to acquiring new Customers or stimulating buying from existing Customers by offering
discounts.

8.4
.
If you are an Agency Contributor you may set your own prices for your Royalty Free Images (but not for Rights Managed Images
or novel use licences). Agency Contributors can supply pricing via spreadsheet or via any other means agreed with Alamy. Alamy is still entitled to discount these prices in accordance with the preceding clauses, without reference to you.

ravens · « **Reply #15 on:** October 15, 2018, 10:57 »

Quote from: Uncle Pete on October 15, 2018, 09:40

Quote from: ravens on October 15, 2018, 08:59
Quote from: Uncle Pete on October 15, 2018, 08:52
Quote from: angelawaye on October 15, 2018, 08:27
I just deleted all my top-selling popular photos on Alamy and left a few that I wouldn't be too upset if given away for free. Too bad it takes 180 days to have them removed.

They aren't giving your photos away for free. If they don't charge for a demo, prototype, or proof of concept, you don't get paid. Poorly worded, because the rest could be misread as they can give away our work. That's not the intent of the clause.

Not the first time someone at Alamy has re-written something and made it impossible to understand clearly.

What does it mean then?

Many things, all mixed in together. First off what it doesn't mean: they will give away your work for free and you get nothing.

Second it's under

9. Novel use licences {participation in novel use is optional}
If you grant novel use rights;

If you aren't enrolled in Novel Use #9 doesn't exist!

Like Sue says, they will reduce prices to what they want for high volume customers or special use. I've had some of that too. Zero Talents example, distributor, to low price, one month web. That's a ball of strange. We get 50% of the what's left.

1) you grant Alamy permission to sell your Images at any price
2) and by any method we feel appropriate
3) and to supply Images to third parties without Alamy having to consult you
4) including but not limited to trials with new Customers, prototypes/proof of concept
5) and high volume low unit price licences.

6) Where Alamy does not make a charge to these third parties, you will not receive payment.

Alamy needs to buy an OR to replace some of these ANDs. No we don't agree to give away images.

9.1. In addition to the promotion rights set out in 8.3 above you grant Alamy permission to sell your Images at any price OR by any method we feel appropriate OR to supply Images to third parties without Alamy having to consult you, including but not limited to trials with new Customers, prototypes/proof of concept OR high volume low unit price licences. Where Alamy does not make a charge to these third parties, you will not receive payment.

Now that we have covered Novel Use, what does the contract actually say?

8. Pricing and promotion

8.1
.
Alamy offers Custom Pricing to some of its Customers in relation to Rights Managed Images with or without exclusivity and
Royalty Free Images i.e. pricing contracts entered into with Customers where Images are licensed for set amounts, dependent upon
usage or dependent upon volumes of Images purchased. These licence prices may vary from those of the Alamy licence calculator
and you agree that your Images can be licensed at these rates without Alamy having to consult you.

8.2
.
Alamy offers its Customers the ability to price up all Images on its site by using a licence calculator. You agree that Alamy can sell Images at the prices from this calculator without Alamy having to consult you.

8.3
.
Promotion - Alamy shall have the right to offer Customers promotions on Images to promote the Alamy service without Alamy
having to consult you, including, but not limited to acquiring new Customers or stimulating buying from existing Customers by offering
discounts.

8.4
.
If you are an Agency Contributor you may set your own prices for your Royalty Free Images (but not for Rights Managed Images
or novel use licences). Agency Contributors can supply pricing via spreadsheet or via any other means agreed with Alamy. Alamy is still entitled to discount these prices in accordance with the preceding clauses, without reference to you.

Thanks for explaining, Uncle Pete! I can see it is actually under Novel Use. Makes more sense now.

Jo Ann Snover · « **Reply #16 on:** October 15, 2018, 11:45 »

I agree that they really should be more clear that they may not give away our work for use by customers (versus use for promoting the agency in their own ads), but has there been any specific example of Alamy behaving badly, making money for themselves through some means other than a license for specific works while "giving away" licenses for use of our images? I'm not aware of any, so I put this in the sloppy contract terminology bucket versus slimy business practices bucket.

I also noticed a new clause that lets them give balances away to a charity of their choosing, in certain circumstances. My concern is there is nothing stating they have any obligation to try and contact the contributor prior to taking this action:

"12.7. If you have not supplied payment details or any supplied details are incorrect or you have chosen a payment method that we no longer support then (i) if your cleared balance is over the payment threshold specified in clause 12.3 Alamy may remit any cleared balance that is over 2 years old to a charity of our choice; or (ii) if your cleared balance is under the payment threshold specified in clause 12.3 Alamy may remit any such cleared balance that is over 5 years old to a charity of our choice."

I would also like to be clear on whether opting out of distributor sales (which I have) means anything with respect to offering my images for sale via third parties - which I wouldn't want for the same reason I don't want distributor sales:

"9.1. In addition to the promotion rights set out in 8.3 above you grant Alamy permission to sell your Images at any price and by any method we feel appropriate and to supply Images to third parties without Alamy having to consult you, including but not limited to trials with new Customers, prototypes/proof of concept and high volume low unit price licences. Where Alamy does not make a charge to these third parties, you will not receive payment."

If I have no control over these third-party schemes, it could include other agencies I already have images with, plus I'm splitting low unit price fees with both Alamy and whoever the third party is - so just like distributor sales but worse because the customer price is very low.

Uncle Pete · « **Reply #17 on:** October 15, 2018, 20:39 »

Quote from: ravens on October 15, 2018, 10:57

Thanks for explaining, Uncle Pete! I can see it is actually under Novel Use. Makes more sense now.

I'm not insisting that I know all or have all the answers, just that, reading this kind of contract leaves much to be desired. We're in a business where agents like Alamy and Shutterstock and Adobe and I'm sure others, are strictly above board and trying to be honest. But then artists read, free or no commission, and jump out of our chairs.

This says just what it says: "9.3. Where Alamy does not make a charge to these third-parties, the Contributor will not receive payment. "

If they don't receive money, we don't get money. They aren't going to pay us for examples or marketing.

And it's under novel use which is mysterious enough on it's own.

Martin Carlsson · « **Reply #19 on:** October 19, 2018, 04:43 »

Quote from: angelawaye on October 15, 2018, 08:27

I just deleted all my top-selling popular photos on Alamy and left a few that I wouldn't be too upset if given away for free. Too bad it takes 180 days to have them removed.

- There are way faster ways, at least to make them invisible to buyer's searches - just remove caption (might have to have "Abc") and keywords before hitting delete.

- Don't think that Alamy would have any great interest in giving images away for free. Sensibility tells me that it is for marketing purposes, to sell more. That is like eh what do they call it - the business idea?

- So where does your "top-selling popular photos" fetch better prices than at Alamy? It won't be Getty and I presume if they were placed on Alamy they are not suitable at any of the specialists. So where?

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Author Topic: Changes to your contributor contract (Read 11241 times)

Steveball

BaldricksTrousers

dpimborough

angelawaye

MysteryShot

Brasilnut

angelawaye

Justanotherphotographer

Uncle Pete

Zero Talent

ravens

ravens

stockastic

ShadySue

Uncle Pete

ravens

Jo Ann Snover

Uncle Pete

Alamy

Martin Carlsson

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