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Author Topic: Sigma DP1 suitable for stock?  (Read 9023 times)

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« on: June 18, 2009, 09:30 »
hi there, what do you think? It might has to less pixels

« Reply #1 on: June 18, 2009, 11:14 »
It has no bayer mask = no interpolation = really effective pixels, not those "effective pixels" all other manufacturers claim, while they use bayer mask and thus each pixel is for only ONE of the three RGB colors (on Sigmas DP1 Foveon each pixel records all 3 colors per pixel). Sigma claims to be equivalent of 16Mpix sensor with Bayer mask, because of the square RGGB color mask in front of those sensors - in fact it bahaves more like 12Mpix to be honest, but all those reviews saying "its just 4Mpix" are simly complete nonsense. Many of 10Mpix DSLRs with average lenses (and I dont mean cheap kit lenses with word average) will be in big trouble against Sigmas result.

It has superb optics and picture quality, however fixed focal length and its pretty slow. I can imagine DP1 for landscape shots, but definitely walkaround camera. Its definitely well above cheap setups like cheap DSLRs with kit lenses, I would place it about semi-pro. I also saw some reviews and tests (I think it was on Popco), where guys tested Sigma DP1 against Canon 5D + 17-40/4L and Sigma was obviously winner in the colors, detail and dynamic range. There were some issues with green color cast on higher iso, but I think it was later solved with firmware update.

Conclusion: Yep, pretty good for landscapes or other uses, where the slow speed and wide fixed focel length arent problem. It delivers excelent picture quality.

« Reply #2 on: June 19, 2009, 05:32 »
that sound good. I also thought about to use this camera especially  for landscape shots and for architecture (pros: focal length, details, small & lightweighted in comparison to a DSLR)

but only a max. size of 2640 x 1760 pixels (RAW)  could be to less for selling pics through micro.  ???

« Reply #3 on: June 19, 2009, 05:43 »
Most microstock agencies accept this size. More is obviously better, but occassionally I still submit a 4 MP image.

« Reply #4 on: June 19, 2009, 08:33 »
To get the same result from DP1 and from other common now-a-days cameras, you need to upsize the raw picture from DP1 about 3-4x! If you would like to use it for stock, then I would go for interpolation to 12 or even 16 MPix and it will still be excellent. There is no reason not to use fully DP1s potential... Beware that its fully different approach to counting pixels and you cannot directly compare DP1s resolution to other cameras! To get the same result, you need 3-4 pixels on every pixel in Sigma!

« Reply #5 on: June 20, 2009, 08:28 »
but interpolation is not allowed.


« Reply #6 on: June 20, 2009, 09:44 »
It is not good idea to shoot stock with that small sensors, in general. Your acceptance ratio will be much smaller, thats for sure.

« Reply #7 on: June 22, 2009, 04:15 »
You probably missed the point - EVERY sensor except Foveon uses brutal firmware interpolation in camera - every pixel records ONLY one from RGB color so you must interpolate the rest to get normal picture! So in fact Foveon is the only one widely available non-interpolated sensor. You guys better do some reading about how it works. Interpolation is not allowed? Then you should not post any picture from any camera except Sigmas Foveon sensor equipped ones, right? I will tell it once again - to get the same size of the picture as from any other sensor, you need to interpolate image recorded by Sigma DP1 4x and its roughly the same interpolation and size recorded by common camera. Its impossible to get uninterpolated picture from anything else, you just do that in PC later and not in camera! Every other camera DOES interpolate during firmware trasformation of raw data into picture. Even raw is interpolated, if not, you will get just crazy map of red, green and blue dots!   

DP1 will very likely smash any low end DSLR with kit or average lenses in detail, colors, dynamic range and sharpness, so what are you talking about? Its completely different technology and much more advanced in some points, you cannot compare that based on common "sensor size" myths. Eg. "small" 4/3 sensor in E-3 has about same noise as "large" 40D up to iso800 - which is far beyond the iso you should use for stock. So what is the advance of "larger" sensor? None, right? Its not that simple as just comparing megapixels or sensor size. It depends on many more things then just this.

« Reply #8 on: June 22, 2009, 04:49 »
Sorry Basti, but I am pretty sure they will not accept any interpolated stuff. Colors are interpolated on a DSLR, but sharpness should be native. I read a discussion about that on istock somewhere that interpolation even if you have these sensors is not allowed.

« Reply #10 on: June 22, 2009, 05:19 »
Frrezingpictures: Yep, it might be rejected based on senzor size, I would strip all exif info. Reviewers should judge the picture quality, not senzor type/resolution.
« Last Edit: June 22, 2009, 09:42 by basti »

« Reply #11 on: June 22, 2009, 05:29 »
It is not good idea to shoot stock with that small sensors, in general. Your acceptance ratio will be much smaller, thats for sure.

Do you even have a clue what the sensor size is on DP1 ? (Hint: It's 7X bigger than in Canon G-series, and same size as in some DSLRs)

edit: DSLR!
« Last Edit: June 22, 2009, 06:33 by Perry »

« Reply #12 on: June 22, 2009, 05:31 »
It is not good idea to shoot stock with that small sensors, in general. Your acceptance ratio will be much smaller, thats for sure.

Do you even have a clue what the sensor size is on DP1 ? (Hint: It's 7X bigger than in Canon G-series, and same size as in some DLSRs)

Agree. ~4 megapixels on only slighlty smaller area than APS-C (much bigger than other PSs). That's much lower density than almost any other camera. Given the pixel count gives actually larger area per pixel than any other DSLR including full frame.

« Reply #13 on: November 12, 2009, 21:00 »
lets revitalize this old post. I want to buy used Canon 5D until end of this year but today my friend put bug in my ear about Sigma SD14 with Foveon chip.
In my first look at forum at iStock, and they vision of this camera is more than disaster.
I really dont know if there "big" guys are scared of cheap price of that camera and always pointing at they TOS that enlargement is not allowed (maybe because they invest big money on they toys for "big" guys).
From my POW enlargements in Foveon or Color Cmos interpolation in camera is the same thing, result is what is count at the end.
I am not max pixel fanatic, I just want to make very big, technically and stockworhty images with cheap gear (I think you too want that). For now I have plastic Canon 350D with 8Mpix and last year most of my shoots are panoramic simple studio shots (to get more Mpixs for Alamy) shooted with 2 or more images and joined in PTGui.
After that joining images in PTGui there is no exif or other data whit camera is that image shooted and they are accepted on all sites (I mean iStock too).
I even try much more perversion to shoot very close up in 3 and more focus ranges and for every focus range shoot different EV from -3 to +3, then make HDR of every focus range and finally join them in multifocus application to get full focus with HDR tone range of big CloseUp and 2, 3 or more time bigger than resolution what my camera can bring (also approved on iStock so there is no problems with that issue about they TOS, only if after this post they reviewers look first in exif or first Exif scrip scan camera model and reject it without any human view on image).

I would bee happy if someone of you can tell me can I give with that camera same quality like on Canon 5D.
Last year I was shooting few days with 5D and from my POW I am impressed.

Normally before buying I will make my own tests samples with that Sigma.
For now before go to shopping I dont want to make any prejudice. I am so nervous to compare this two cameras.

Price comparison is on Sigmas side, new one is double cheaper than 5 or more years used 5D with 20000-30000 or more shoots or with fairy tales for kids from second hand sellers that model is from shop window with few hundreds of shoots?!?
THNX for reply
« Last Edit: November 12, 2009, 21:13 by Suljo »

« Reply #14 on: November 12, 2009, 23:46 »
lets revitalize this old post. I want to buy used Canon 5D until end of this year but today my friend put bug in my ear about Sigma SD14 with
THNX for reply

Hey Suljo,

See this link

If you ask me, 5D wins


« Reply #15 on: November 14, 2009, 22:00 »
I just realize that this Faveon chip and this story is too old, I think its somehow new story about max year old.
Anyhow I will test it for free but for now 5D is better option as I see.


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