MicrostockGroup
Agency Based Discussion => Cutcaster => Topic started by: johngriffin on May 08, 2009, 16:09
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WOW. These scammer guys piss me off more than anything and waste my time.
We just had a guy from Vietnam (sorry if you are from there but I am sorry to say they have a problem with people from there using stolen credit cards or not nice things, not everyone is like that, only a few bad apples) try to upload stolen/copyrighted content to Cutcaster that he obviously either bought with a fake credit card or ripped off of istock. Istock needs to look into this person who purchased that image (use the IP address I provided below to track it if you can) and do something about catching him. I will do whatever I can to help stop this guy. I did a search for him by the username he chose at CC using google and found that he was selling on ImageCatalogue. IC has no idea that he is a fraud and they arent his images and is probably selling these images for the scammer.
http://www.imagecatalog.com/photographer_profile.php?pID=1930
And then we checked TinEye and saw that the photos he said were his on IC were actually an istock exclusive member AND an istock admin (http://www.istockphoto.com/user_view.php?id=71254) so this scammer stole them from istock it looks like.
http://www.imagecatalog.com/image_details.php?iID=96456&icsid=255e27b2353c1faad2fce4b089d3948a
http://www.istockphoto.com/stock-photo-380844-earth-in-a-box.php
http://www.istockphoto.com/stock-photo-7185445-environmental-conservation.php
I'm trying to write to both ImageCatalogue and iStock to alert them to this thief. It looks like they could be targeting istock exclusives because their images wont be on other sites or have the potential to be recognized as much and will most likely sell better. Any other ideas? We checked two of the images and they were both from istock exclusives.
Here is some info on the guy who tried to upload it to our site.
Name
: Nguyen The Dinh
: [email protected]
IP ADRESS
: 123.18.232.113
This is absolutely a nightmare. I am so pissed about this because it is wasting my time, money and stealing peoples money.
WHAT CAN WE DO ABOUT THIS? What can istock do to protect you guys as photographers and me as an agency that is getting stolen content uploaded to my site that came from istock in the first place?
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Technology exists to put hidden watermarks in jpgs. Of course pixels have to be altered, but it can be done in such a subtle way that the human eye couldn't distinguish it. This is not new and I'm surprised that IStock and other microstocks aren't doing it. It would let you filter out images that were purchased at other agencies.
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you mean like a form of digital rights management DRM. we embed info into the IPTC data so a buyer knows where they purchased it from but someone who steals it normally strips out the IPTC. If they are really dumb or lazy they leave it in there. what do you think we, as agencies, can do to better protect you as a seller and then on the other hand a buyer who purchases stolen content from a site that doesnt have authorization to sell it from the copyright holder.
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perharps a bit OT but related in a way,...
wait till the nigerian scammer run out of scamming craigslist, kijiji, etc.. and you'll find them here too, JG. the latest we've heard was they prey on ads for tutors, relay (deaf and hard at hearing), spamming and flooding calls to moms and pops store asking to place orders from encyclopedia to lingerie. one anecdote came like this, "sorry sir, this is the cancer society you just called!" . response, "so what do you sell, we like to spend about $1000 today". another from a music instructor, "have a couple of twin who needs urgent tuition for 3 months while stopping over in your part of the world. we like to reserve you as a tutor and will need your bank account so we can send a bank transfer for your special training. we are in a hurry and need to confirm this so we will gladly send you full payment ASAP. all we need is your bank account info".
i am sure very soon, you will hear from them , in one form or another. as you probably already know, similar scammer have been mailing literally everyone with faked bank links to get your password telling you if you don't verify, you could have your account frozen. as well, you get the telephone call, "this is mayberry (replace any name) calling about your credit card, there is no need to worry but please stay on the line for one of our agents to speak with you. it is very important , please have your credit card , PIN and personal infos ready".
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I'm talking about information embedded in the image pixels itself. This technology is already used to, for example, detect image tampering. It can no doubt be beaten somehow, although probably not without degrading the image.
http://netzreport.googlepages.com/hidden_data_in_jpeg_files.html
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Luckily a lot of these people get caught by other contributors who see the images were stolen. Hopefully most of them get caught before they reach a payout, so they are also wasting their time. I no some don't get caught for a while, so more needs to be done.
Perhaps the sites should state that they will do a check on portfolios of people reaching their first payouts to make sure they are legitimate? There needs to be some deterrent to stop this happening.
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Technology exists to put hidden watermarks in jpgs.
I've heard of this before, but I wonder if it works if an image is resaved or downsized.
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Thanks for the heads up, have reported my stolen images.
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I don't know if you already did, but I sent a link to this post to mevans via sitemail.
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madelaide - downsizing, or resampling, would very likely destroy it. Maybe there's some black-hat stuff that NSA uses, that distributes the "watermark" data around the image.
I don't think there's a simple answer to this problem.
Bottom line, I think, is establishing the identity of contributors. If I just create a login and start submitting photos by FTP, the site has no leverage on me. If they know and have verified my identity, and I submit someone else's copyrighted material, then it's a law enforcement matter. The problem of identifying such material still exists.
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https://www.digimarc.com/solutions/images_pro.asp (https://www.digimarc.com/solutions/images_pro.asp)
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Thank you for alerting me to this. I have sent a message to the compliance department at istock. They will take care if it.
I really am sick of these thieves. >:(
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Thank you for alerting me to this. I have sent a message to the compliance department at istock. They will take care if it.
I really am sick of these thieves. >:(
I'll bet you are mate. Unfortunately it's the perk of having so many truly outstanding images in your port. Good luck with getting it sorted.
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Yes... Digimarc... But it is expensive for authors... Maybe agencies can do some arrangements about that!
BTW, check this address too:
http://www.zcool.com.cn/
I don't understand Chinesee but, it seems many of images from many sites are there.
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WHAT CAN WE DO ABOUT THIS? What can istock do to protect you guys as photographers and me as an agency that is getting stolen content uploaded to my site that came from istock in the first place?
Delayed payment for new contributors.Let's say 2 months. It's enough to find stolen images and block an account. If thiefs have no chance to be payed thay will stop to do it. Then the blocked money can be given to the right artist.
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perharps something to do with submitting RAW originals?
although this may be not so ideal, as i wouldn't want to give away my digital negatives. but if it's to prove that i am the creator of the images, and that the sites will not sell the RAW to buyers giving them only post processed jpgs?
not sure. just thinking out of the box. does anyone know if it's possible to counterfeit a RAW original? and, can any one trust a stock site not to abuse the RAW image?
with all these incidents of some stock sites screwing contributors, (one latest that's been preoccupying most of us here... case in a nutshell: exclusives of site Xbeing boned ,,,)
it's also difficult to trust anyone.
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Technology exists to put hidden watermarks in jpgs. Of course pixels have to be altered, but it can be done in such a subtle way that the human eye couldn't distinguish it. This is not new and I'm surprised that IStock and other microstocks aren't doing it. It would let you filter out images that were purchased at other agencies.
Just having my own jab at shadows here, John,,,
I think this may seem a crazy idea, but stockastic is on the right track. It requires a confidential agreement between each stock agency. So only you John and say Keith of Zymm, Achilles of DST,etc... know the location where each of the agencies embeds a digital trademark like the old stamp you see on diplomas of the universities . except it is invisible to the naked eye . No one knows the chosen location on the print except you guys. Each time we submit our originals, you won't see it in that spot because it is the original.
But if ScammerX bought the image or copied the images published by the sites, and then submits them to you , you will know instantly it doesn't belong to them as each of these images bears the hidden digital trademark of the agency from where they were stolen .
I think stockastic has a genius idea. This , or a general registry of images. The latter idea is a more difficult to implement.
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yeah this is really a pain in the ass (excuse my french) for everyone involved and ends up costing a lot of money to the photog (lost revenue), the agency (having to police it and paying chargebacks or refunds) and the buyer (legal issues).
what can istock do to prevent anyones images from being stolen and then reuploaded to other sites like ours? Did anyone get a response from them? And if I can give another agency the IP address of a thief would they be able to track down that thief on their site and stop them?
I like that digimarc product but it does look expensive. I will try to talk to them to see if there is something they can do through Cutcaster.
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John, Re Digimarc:
In order to get this to work, every stock site has to implement it, not just Cutcaster. Or else, your expenditure for this is accountingly unwise and the desired objective ineffective .
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i just filed a complaint with www.ic3.gov which helps to solve these crimes.
The Internet Crime Complaint Center (IC3) is a partnership between the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI), the National White Collar Crime Center (NW3C),
and the Bureau of Justice Assistance
(BJA).
IC3's mission is to serve as a vehicle to receive, develop, and refer criminal complaints
regarding the rapidly expanding arena of cyber crime. The IC3 gives the victims
of cyber crime a convenient and easy-to-use reporting mechanism that alerts authorities
of suspected criminal or civil violations. For law enforcement and regulatory agencies
at the federal, state, local and international level, IC3 provides a central referral
mechanism for complaints involving Internet related crimes.
If you guys see more of this rampant stealing and copyright issues please report it to this service. Anyone else know of any other government services you can use to stop these thieves. Its a huge pain in the butt.
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also looks like IC hasnt taken this guys port down yet and has it marked as exclusive to its marketplace. Not sure if they dont care or dont know but not good stuff.
http://www.imagecatalog.com/photographer_profile.php?pID=1930
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wow, John Griffin you are one pro-active CEO. Wish the others will follow suit.
Is this a global jurisdication network? Does this blanket include China, Africa ie. Nigeria,India, Eastern Europe,Australia, SE Asia,South America,etc... or just USA, UK, Western Europe? Do you know?
Jolly good show indeed, Mr. Griffin.
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i just filed a complaint with [url=http://www.ic3.org]www.ic3.org[/url] which helps to solve these crimes.
Better use this link: www.ic3.gov (http://www.ic3.gov) !
;)
Claude
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I would not be surprised if other stock agencies were already marking their images in some way. BUT I would be surprised if they'd talk about it, even to the owner of another agency. They'd use one of the more sophisticated hidden watermarking schemes that supposedly will survive resizing or crropping - so they'd have it in place in case they found someone ripping them off in a major way.
It seems to me this is only going to get worse. Subscription pricing would let a crook cherry-pick thousands of highest-quality images that would, over time, bring in much more than he paid for them when re-posted as new portfolios elsewhere.
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Great job John, lets just hope your prompt action will be able to put a stop to these thieves.
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here is a copy of the email that i got back from ic3.gov when i filed it. i will let you know what happens with it and we can use it as a test to see if we can deter or, long shot, prosecute them.
Thank you for filing a complaint with the Internet Crime Complaint Center (IC3).
Your complaint has been successfully submitted. Please retain the following information for future contacts with the IC3:
Complaint Id: I0905132052001691
The IC3's mission is to serve as a vehicle to receive, develop, and refer criminal complaints regarding the rapidly expanding arena of cyber crime. The IC3 aims to give the victims of cyber crime a convenient and easy-to-use reporting mechanism.
Complaint Status
The IC3 receives thousands of complaints each month and does not have the resources to respond to inquiries regarding the status of complaints. It is the IC3's intention to review all complaints and refer them to law enforcement and regulatory agencies having jurisdiction. Ultimately, investigation and prosecution are at the discretion of the receiving agencies.
Evidence
It is important that you maintain any evidence you may have relating to your complaint. Evidence may include canceled checks, credit card receipts, phone bills, mailing envelopes, mail receipts, a printed copy of a website, copies of emails, or similar items. Please keep the items in a safe location, in case you are requested to provide them for investigative purposes.
Additionally, to learn more about Internet schemes and ways to protect yourself, please visit www.lookstoogoodtobetrue.com.
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great initiative John.
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Crestock should really remove this guys account. He is a full on fraud and has sold a bunch of licenses at crestock using other peoples files.
http://www.crestock.com/portfolio/namlehoang22.aspx
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looks like he has sold 49 images. i wonder what that does to the buyers who bought those images. is that license agreement void and could they be in violation.
http://www.crestock.com/profile/namlehoang22.aspx
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49 sales on crestock wont reach payout, so hopefully they will do something before he gets any money. I hope the money from fraudulent sales is returned to the buyers and they are informed that they need to buy a license for the image from the copyright holder.
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completely agree. the only part that stinks is that the scammer has the high res original and can just do this again to another site. something needs to be done bc this is a lot of lost revenue for the actual copyright holder and lots of an agencies time and money is lost due to this. looks like he is still there at crestock.