MicrostockGroup
Agency Based Discussion => Dreamstime.com => Topic started by: blvdone on March 07, 2024, 06:37
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It sucks on Dreamstime they have $100 payout minimum. I'm at $91 now, but what if they go out of business? They may just get away with not paying any contributors below $100 sales balance in a broad daylight. Sales revenue is rightfully ours. Any amount should be claimed by us. It would be a flat-out theft of our money if that happens.
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I do agree. 100 is way too much. 25 will be reasonable.
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Same here. Currently waiting at 85.78 USD. After the payout I will delete all content and delete the account.
20 or 25 USD would be acceptable. I would even accept a small payout fee like paypal does since you would be save not loosing bigger amounts if they become insolvent.
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Same here. Currently waiting at 85.78 USD. After the payout I will delete all content and delete the account.
20 or 25 USD would be acceptable. I would even accept a small payout fee like paypal does since you would be save not loosing bigger amounts if they become insolvent.
Bad thing is, sales on Dreamstime is slow. It'll take till the end of year or more to make it to $100 from my current $91. I added some photos to my portfolio recently to hopefully speed up my sales there to reach $100. After that, I may delete my port too. It's ridiculous.
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I hope it won't turn into Nightmaretime.
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Totally agree. 25 would be ok payout sum. I am waiting with my 88 dollars. At least a week with no sales. Then usually few days in a row and again week with no sales. Weir pattern. Give me my money :P!
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I'm paid every 1.5 months or so. But a smaller payout threshold is better, of course.
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And this where the Microstock Forum has lost a lot of its usefulness. There was a time when top tier earnings ratings were legitimate. You can't tell me Stocksy or Self-Hosted are in the top four category. Where does Dreamstime actually rate? They were always in the top six when I first visited this site 10 years ago. If Dreamstime is actually sinking in ratings, there would be time for concern. Personally, Dreamstime and DepositPhotos are my top earners. Regardless, I agree with everyone else. Dreamstime has got to lower their minimum payout level if they don't want to deter contributors from staying on board or joining the agency.
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Dreamstime won't go out of business, but 100 is indeed too high considering that even Alamy has $50 threshold which can be reached with single sale. They do pay you though; last time I waited (for no specific reason) till balance was ~450 and no problems, they even said "thank you".
In my view largest reason for slow sales is virtually no QA. Everything is accepted which caused swamp of sub-standard images much larger than elsewhere.
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... It's a flat-out theft of our money.
No. It's not.
I completely understand the frustration with the too-high payout threshold - although it was what everybody used back when DT, iStock, CanStock, Shutterstock etc. started.
You signed up with the site when these payment terms were clearly stated - no changes, no subterfuge. Making totally false statements about the agency doesn't help anyone.
I have no idea how DT is still puttering along - it's a shadow of its former self - but during the pandemic, when the loathsome Pavlovsky was cutting royalties at SS, Dreamstime gave a small bonus to contributors. They're not going to make anyone rich, but they are a decent agency.
For a while, Fotolia allowed you to request a payout below the threshold but would then charge a fee, which seems very reasonable as they have to process the payments and that takes someone's time. They need to have some way to avoid getting drowned in nuisance requests.
I've been getting paid regularly by them, but the days of getting a monthly payout from them (for me) are long gone. I think they should drop the payout level and institute payout on account closure with a (small) fee to cover the payout if it's below the minimum. I don't expect that they'll be rushing to do that though :)
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You signed up with the site when these payment terms were clearly stated - no changes, no subterfuge. Making totally false statements about the agency doesn't help anyone.
Thank you Jo Ann, that's exactly the point.
Dreamstime pays me on time several times a year.
If one is struggling to reach the payout limit, it might be the wrong agency for the portfolio.
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I can only say that I have never had any problems with a payout at dreamstime. No matter how you feel about the agency - it has always been fair!
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It sucks on Dreamstime they have $100 payout minimum. I'm at $91 now, but what if they go out of business? They may just get away with not paying any contributors below $100 sales balance in a broad daylight. Sales revenue is rightfully ours. Any amount should be claimed by us. It would be a flat-out theft of our money if that happens.
Probably they will do as CanStock did!
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While I agree with everyone else here that the minimum pacout of $100 is too high for a small agency like Dreamstime, I do not understand your argumentation? Theft? Because they could go out of business and you might not be getting your money? Accusing an reliable company that has been around for 24 years and has always paid their contributors on time of theft, just because it could potentially go out of business is taking it a bit far, especially since you could say the exact same thing about every other agency.
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Dreamstime is the ONLY agency that paid us more during the pandemic. For that alone they will always get content from me.
I do believe a threshhold of 50 would be better.
Has anyone written to them and asked them to consider lowering it?
Perhaps in a version where we pay a small fee if we want to pay out at lower values?
Because the 100 dollars might be fee related, that it is cheaper for them to payout at that level.
They are a very decent artist friendly agency with a loyal community and even many exclusive artists and exclusive content.
My sales are slow, but growing, now that I started uploading again. All of last year was 35 dollars, this year I already reached that in early march. They also sometimes have image sales for 15 dollars.
So I hope with regular content I will be able to get a payout several times a year. Once a month as the ultimate goal.
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Has anyone written to them and asked them to consider lowering it?
I haven't written them, but I have seen statements by them in their forum, here is a direct quote:
"We cannot accommodate requests of $50 for the simple reason this would increase the payment requests volume considerably."
I have no idea why in 2024 some companies still claim an online payment process cannot be automated.
Of course it is possible, other agencies can do it after all, I just think they don't want to. I know of people who say they have not been able to reach minimum payout for years. And in the meantime Dreamstime gets to keep that money, can invest it and gets interests. It's probably part of the business mode.
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Well, $100 made sense years ago when DT worked well and could be reached in a few weeks/months, but this situation has changed. While it is true that they are within their rights since it is known and agreed information, it would be good if they knew how to adapt to their new situation and lower that limit, especially given that payment is an automatic and cost-free process.
And if they are not able to automate, it is because they are outdated and out of the market, and therefore they will die little by little, ergo it would make no sense to continue uploading content there.
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I made a mistake once (8 years ago) DT I deleted all the content when I had 65 dollars, then I asked for my money, they said they can't give it to me without 100 dollars.
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I haven't written them, but I have seen statements by them in their forum, here is a direct quote:
"We cannot accommodate requests of $50 for the simple reason this would increase the payment requests volume considerably."
I have no idea why in 2024 some companies still claim an online payment process cannot be automated.
Even automated online payments are not free. You need software, a payment service provider or payment gateway. This costs money and the prices usually depend on the invoice volume.
In this respect, Dreamstime's argument is understandable.
I prefer the high payout limit to lower sales revenue ;)
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Guess what? I had a huge $2.00 photo sale yesterday and am closer to the $100 payout threshold now. I may be able to cash out before they may go out in the worst case scenario. Fingers crossed!! But it's a tough decision to either immediately cash out once my balance hits $100 or keep going above $100. Because if I cash out at $100, I don't know how long it'll take to get to $100 again. If I keep it going above $100, if Dreamstime suddenly cease the operation, there's no guarantee I'll get my balance back. I'll probably cash out at $100 and delete my port to be safe. I can get like 20 Big Mac for $100. Can't risk that. If the payout minimum was $25, I would definitely keep going.
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Even automated online payments are not free. You need software, a payment service provider or payment gateway. This costs money and the prices usually depend on the invoice volume.
In this respect, Dreamstime's argument is understandable.
I prefer the high payout limit to lower sales revenue ;)
Payment companies offer these transfers, services and free software to many sender, as they take a good cut in the currency exchange, with the loss of the recipient of course.
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It sucks on Dreamstime they have $100 payout minimum. I'm at $91 now, but what if they go out of business? They may just get away with not paying any contributors below $100 sales balance in a broad daylight. Sales revenue is rightfully ours. Any amount should be claimed by us. It would be a flat-out theft of our money if that happens.
Probably they will do as CanStock did!
So far, Dreamstime always has been one of the more respectable agencies. At least, that's how I experience them.
Yes, the $100 payout limit is very high compared to other agencies, but on the other hand, I'm not worried too much about not getting paid.
Either they pull the plug and cease operations, like canstock did. Clean closure, everyone gets paid.
Or, in case of bankruptcy, there's always a fair chance that another company takes over and eventually pays the contributors. It's not a tiny nitwit agency, they do have quite a big and diverse library and still a fair customer base. Same happened with EyeEm by the way. A lot of struggles and a lot of uncertainty, but in the end, we all got our coffee money and some of us even more. Speaking of coffee money: most you can lose (or not being paid) is $ 99.99. And that's not the end of the world.
I hope none of that happens, and Dreamstime stays around.
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Even automated online payments are not free. You need software, a payment service provider or payment gateway. This costs money and the prices usually depend on the invoice volume.
In this respect, Dreamstime's argument is understandable.
I prefer the high payout limit to lower sales revenue ;)
Payment companies offer these transfers, services and free software to many sender, as they take a good cut in the currency exchange, with the loss of the recipient of course.
In my opinion, this is not correct.
If you look at the price structures of payment gateways such as Ayden, Stripe (payment service for Airbnb) etc., the client (sender) pays the costs and not the the recipient.
This is comparable to card payments. As a businessman, you pay the fees for the transfer and use of the devices.
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I agree $100 is much too high especially when the majority of downloads are .35 I think $50 would be much fairer. We may have agreed to the terms but how many of us would think it would take so long to reach payout? In three years I'm up to $87and it doesn't look like I'm going to reach $100 any time soon. And I think it is wrong and maybe even unethical not to pay accumulated earnings to those who want to close their account.
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Clearly contributor numbers achieving $100 minimum payout back when the policy was first put in place were much higher than what it is now so everyone's on the same page with reducing the minimum payout. I've actually achieved minimum payout but haven't claimed it as I feel I may as well close the port down once I do. Maybe I can just leave it and one day when I make it to $200 I can claim $100 (if they allow that probably not but anyway) and then I can always know I can with draw money with at least $100 sitting in there. Point is really, Dreamstime is not worth it for me.
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Generally speaking, it seems a fair payout system would be something like meeting a minimum amount in $$$$ or a minimum amount in time (e.g. a payout once a month if you do not meet a $$ minimum).
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Redbubble is the only place I know of that will pay you whatever is in your account at the end of the year even if the minimum has not been reached, which I think is pretty decent of them
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You signed up with the site when these payment terms were clearly stated - no changes, no subterfuge. Making totally false statements about the agency doesn't help anyone.
Thank you Jo Ann, that's exactly the point.
If one is struggling to reach the payout limit, it might be the wrong agency for the portfolio.
Both good points, and when I reach $100 in 2027 I'm cashing out. :)
DT has always been upfront and fair to us.
I suspect they have so many people at between $50 and $100 that it would be a great burden to change and have all those people, decide to cash out and leave, at the same time. That's all just how Microstock has changed, but DT holds their original contract TOS. Their choice.
As far as past experience, accounting and the laws, money held for commissions, cannot be invested or used, and is a liability, not an asset. The recent changes to the public corporations like Adobe and SS, are better for their bottom line on the annual and quarterly reports. DT reports to no one. But either way, holding our money is not something they would want to do, for financial gains. In the US and DT says they are in the US, it's illegal to use escrow money for any other purpose, you can only hold it for the person that owns the money. So the repeated accusations that somewhere isn't paying us, because they invest or get interest, is flawed.
What we consider fair or not fair, in 2024, I signed up in 2009 and that's what the terms were. DT has changed nothing.
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Who says the money is in escrow? And if we really owned it DT would have a legal obligation to pay it out if we close our account
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I tend to agree with Liz. In my view outstanding balance, be it 1 USD or 99 USD, should be paid out when contributor requests that his account is closed.
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I know this might sound funny, but why not just make more money? :)
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While I think that $ 50 would be a more convenient payout limit at DT, I really see no reason to complain about them. They were No. 5 for me last year, and so far No. 3 this year, they frequently sell for good prices, and never below $ 0.33. Upload procedure is fast and simple, and they accept more or less all of what I submit. The key as always is regular uploads.
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I tend to agree with Liz. In my view outstanding balance, be it 1 USD or 99 USD, should be paid out when contributor requests that his account is closed.
You signed a contract when you joined that says otherwise. We can agree what's right and what should be, but you can't blame DT or accuse them of anything illegal.
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Who says the money is in escrow? And if we really owned it DT would have a legal obligation to pay it out if we close our account
The money is owed as payment or commission. Go ask your accountant or read some law. You signed a contract, now you want to change, you must earn $100 to be paid, which means owed money is not payable until you reach $100. If you quit before earning $100, you get nothing.
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Interesting to read that many are currently similarly stuck at 80 to 90 USD.
Dreamstime states as of March 2024 there are more than 1.2 million contributing photographers.
Assuming there are probably 200 thousand contributors in the same situation like us, this would equal almost 20 million USD in unpaid revenues.
With the current high interest rates on the market this is a good sum to invest.
Sounds like a kind of business model.
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Interesting to read that many are currently similarly stuck at 80 to 90 USD.
Dreamstime states as of March 2024 there are more than 1.2 million contributing photographers.
Assuming there are probably 200 thousand contributors in the same situation like us, this would equal almost 20 million USD in unpaid revenues.
With the current high interest rates on the market this is a good sum to invest.
Sounds like a kind of business model.
Only if it is legal to invest the money. If it's illegal or they make bad investments, we're even more screwed. Investments aren't always profitable. I don't agree that it's a good business model and I don't think it's legal either.
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Interesting to read that many are currently similarly stuck at 80 to 90 USD.
Dreamstime states as of March 2024 there are more than 1.2 million contributing photographers.
Assuming there are probably 200 thousand contributors in the same situation like us, this would equal almost 20 million USD in unpaid revenues.
With the current high interest rates on the market this is a good sum to invest.
Sounds like a kind of business model.
Only if it is legal to invest the money. If it's illegal or they make bad investments, we're even more screwed. Investments aren't always profitable. I don't agree that it's a good business model and I don't think it's legal either.
Yes, legally and in accounting terms it would be most likely at least a grey area, as they are obligations.
I think they have to account unpaid "outstandings of contributors" as reserves, comparable to pension liabilities for company pensions.
On the other hand, pension liabilities for company pensions may be invested in safe investments such as funds, bonds, fixed-term deposits, etc.
Currently you would get over 5% yield for 1Y US Bonds, what's not that bad if you think that S&P 500 is performing not much better.
https://www.bloomberg.com/markets/rates-bonds/government-bonds/us (https://www.bloomberg.com/markets/rates-bonds/government-bonds/us)
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Interesting to read that many are currently similarly stuck at 80 to 90 USD.
Dreamstime states as of March 2024 there are more than 1.2 million contributing photographers.
Assuming there are probably 200 thousand contributors in the same situation like us, this would equal almost 20 million USD in unpaid revenues.
With the current high interest rates on the market this is a good sum to invest.
Sounds like a kind of business model.
Only if it is legal to invest the money. If it's illegal or they make bad investments, we're even more screwed. Investments aren't always profitable. I don't agree that it's a good business model and I don't think it's legal either.
Yes, legally and in accounting terms it would be most likely at least a grey area, as they are obligations.
I think they have to account unpaid "outstandings of contributors" as reserves, comparable to pension liabilities for company pensions.
On the other hand, pension liabilities for company pensions may be invested in safe investments such as funds, bonds, fixed-term deposits, etc.
Currently you would get over 5% yield for 1Y US Bonds, what's not that bad if you think that S&P 500 is performing not much better.
https://www.bloomberg.com/markets/rates-bonds/government-bonds/us (https://www.bloomberg.com/markets/rates-bonds/government-bonds/us)
Thank you for your thoughtful insight!!
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So I reached $100 payout and got paid recently. Now I want to delete my account, but only way to do is to delete all my photos one by one and then they'll allow you to delete account. Meanwhile, if you have sales, anything less than $100 will be donated to Dreamstime when you delete your account. This really sucks.
https://www.dreamstime.com/faq2030-how-can-i-delete-my-account (https://www.dreamstime.com/faq2030-how-can-i-delete-my-account)
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In three years I'm up to $87and it doesn't look like I'm going to reach $100 any time soon. And I think it is wrong and maybe even unethical not to pay accumulated earnings to those who want to close their account.
If you've made $87 in three years then you're averaging $29 per year and should reach payout in less than six months if downloads continue as they have.
So far almost all the agencies that have closed have paid out at the end and DT seems to be doing OK. No sense spending time worrying about something that likely will not happen, or at least not anytime soon.
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So I reached $100 payout and got paid recently. Now I want to delete my account, but only way to do is to delete all my photos one by one and then they'll allow you to delete account. Meanwhile, if you have sales, anything less than $100 will be donated to Dreamstime when you delete your account. This really sucks.
https://www.dreamstime.com/faq2030-how-can-i-delete-my-account (https://www.dreamstime.com/faq2030-how-can-i-delete-my-account)
I don't remember exactly how it works but I'm pretty sure that you can only first disable a certain percentage of content and then over time you can delete all of it.
anyway yes,this is an agency that should have a minimum payout of 25 usd.
but they are agencies that are really useless,you need to have thousands of contents to make maybe 10usd a month!
I also have about 50usd there but I've already deleted almost everything,at a certain point I thought about going back to uploading contents there,thank goodness I thought better of it! :D
I will never see my money that is there!
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So I reached $100 payout and got paid recently. Now I want to delete my account, but only way to do is to delete all my photos one by one and then they'll allow you to delete account. Meanwhile, if you have sales, anything less than $100 will be donated to Dreamstime when you delete your account. This really sucks.
https://www.dreamstime.com/faq2030-how-can-i-delete-my-account (https://www.dreamstime.com/faq2030-how-can-i-delete-my-account)
I don't remember exactly how it works but I'm pretty sure that you can only first disable a certain percentage of content and then over time you can delete all of it.
anyway yes,this is an agency that should have a minimum payout of 25 usd.
but they are agencies that are really useless,you need to have thousands of contents to make maybe 10usd a month!
I also have about 50usd there but I've already deleted almost everything,at a certain point I thought about going back to uploading contents there,thank goodness I thought better of it! :D
I will never see my money that is there!
Thank you for your donation to Dreamstime!!!
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Guess what? I had a huge $2.00 photo sale yesterday and am closer to the $100 payout threshold now. I may be able to cash out before they may go out in the worst case scenario. Fingers crossed!! But it's a tough decision to either immediately cash out once my balance hits $100 or keep going above $100. Because if I cash out at $100, I don't know how long it'll take to get to $100 again. If I keep it going above $100, if Dreamstime suddenly cease the operation, there's no guarantee I'll get my balance back. I'll probably cash out at $100 and delete my port to be safe. I can get like 20 Big Mac for $100. Can't risk that. If the payout minimum was $25, I would definitely keep going.
in another attempt to call out these silly 'worst case' scenarios - i'll bet you $100 that DT is still here a year from now
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another reason for staying with DT is they're one of the few agencies that accepts AI images
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@blvdone :D I save time,and time is money,better to lose 50usd than continue to waste time there!
@cascoly I'm more than sure they will never lower the minimum payout,but tell me if I may ask,how much content do you have there,and how much do you earn in a year?Do you sell a lot of AI there?
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another reason for staying with DT is they're one of the few agencies that accepts AI images
Yes, accept but not really selling for me compare to Adobe
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So I reached $100 payout and got paid recently. Now I want to delete my account, but only way to do is to delete all my photos one by one and then they'll allow you to delete account. Meanwhile, if you have sales, anything less than $100 will be donated to Dreamstime when you delete your account. This really sucks.
https://www.dreamstime.com/faq2030-how-can-i-delete-my-account (https://www.dreamstime.com/faq2030-how-can-i-delete-my-account)
You only partially read the terms and conditions:
Q: I am a contributor, how do I close my account?
You can disable all files approved more than six months ago at any time. You are allowed to disable 30% of files uploaded in the recent six months however 70% must be kept online for six months from their approval date. You can disable the remaining 70% after six months pass. Once the files are disabled, nobody is able to view/access them, except for you. The files will remain in our offline database for 12 months until all liabilities (refunds, potential copyright infringements, etc) concerning them are cleared off, then they are automatically deleted. The account cannot be closed until the above requirements of the contract expire. Accounts with activity (license/download) cannot be deleted, as they can be referenced internally in regards to past licensing. However, they can be blocked from public access. More account closure details can be found in our Terms and Conditions. https://www.dreamstime.com/terms#contributors (https://www.dreamstime.com/terms#contributors)
But still, if you are making so little, your donation to DT will also be little. :) Small price to pay, if your goal is to close the account.
The alternative is, keep the account, ignore, don't upload and when you make $100, take the money and be happy that you did nothing to earn that? 8)
in another attempt to call out these silly 'worst case' scenarios - i'll bet you $100 that DT is still here a year from now
Make it $10 maybe that's low enough that you can collect in a year? DT isn't going away for a long time.
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@blvdone :D I save time,and time is money,better to lose 50usd than continue to waste time there!
@cascoly I'm more than sure they will never lower the minimum payout,but tell me if I may ask,how much content do you have there,and how much do you earn in a year?Do you sell a lot of AI there?
i've got about 30K images, only about 150 ai so far. upload i easy, so i continue even though returns are low
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in another attempt to call out these silly 'worst case' scenarios - i'll bet you $100 that DT is still here a year from now
Make it $10 maybe that's low enough that you can collect in a year? DT isn't going away for a long time.
i'm not so much interested in making a few bucks as in exposing how little confidence they has in their claim. made it $100 so they won't lose money when DT goes under!
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@blvdone :D I save time,and time is money,better to lose 50usd than continue to waste time there!
@cascoly I'm more than sure they will never lower the minimum payout,but tell me if I may ask,how much content do you have there,and how much do you earn in a year?Do you sell a lot of AI there?
i've got about 30K images, only about 150 ai so far. upload i easy, so i continue even though returns are low
ok thanks,and thanks also to "fotoroad"
my decision remains unchanged,they can keep the 50 usd,too bad it's not possible to actually give them to charity,instead of leaving them to dreamstime!
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my decision remains unchanged,they can keep the 50 usd,too bad it's not possible to actually give them to charity,instead of leaving them to dreamstime!
Actually you can donate to Ukraine directy from your account if this charity still exists at Dreamstime:
-> https://de.dreamstime.com/donate-for-ukraine
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my decision remains unchanged,they can keep the 50 usd,too bad it's not possible to actually give them to charity,instead of leaving them to dreamstime!
Actually you can donate to Ukraine directy from your account if this charity still exists at Dreamstime:
-> https://de.dreamstime.com/donate-for-ukraine
yes,you are right,I just checked,it still exists,I make the donation,I will never collect this money anyway,it's better to donate to Ukraine!
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in another attempt to call out these silly 'worst case' scenarios - i'll bet you $100 that DT is still here a year from now
Make it $10 maybe that's low enough that you can collect in a year? DT isn't going away for a long time.
i'm not so much interested in making a few bucks as in exposing how little confidence they has in their claim. made it $100 so they won't lose money when DT goes under!
Oh I see, you'll cover their loss if DT goes under, kind of like a one year insurance policy for the amount of the protection. I wouldn't pay $5,000 in insurance for a $5,000 car.
Here's a plan? You bet blvdone $10 that DT will still be open in a year, and if they shut down, you pay him $100. If they are still open, he pays you $10 for the disaster coverage policy? Make it nice and inviting. $10 covers his loss until July 31st 2025. He gets a couple months free.
There's a simple confidence tester and it only costs him Ten Bucks.
(If there's any doubt, I'll back you, for half the $100 loss, no charge, that's my level of confidence) $10 vs $100.
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in another attempt to call out these silly 'worst case' scenarios - i'll bet you $100 that DT is still here a year from now
Make it $10 maybe that's low enough that you can collect in a year? DT isn't going away for a long time.
i'm not so much interested in making a few bucks as in exposing how little confidence they has in their claim. made it $100 so they won't lose money when DT goes under!
Oh I see, you'll cover their loss if DT goes under, kind of like a one year insurance policy for the amount of the protection. I wouldn't pay $5,000 in insurance for a $5,000 car.
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There's a simple confidence tester and it only costs him Ten Bucks.
(If there's any doubt, I'll back you, for half the $100 loss, no charge, that's my level of confidence) $10 vs $100.
but i'm not offering insurance - i'm calling his bluff about DT going under - if they're right they're protected but if DTs still here, maybe they'll forgo silly chicken-little predictions in the future -- and the bet is open for a few others who think DT will be gone
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in another attempt to call out these silly 'worst case' scenarios - i'll bet you $100 that DT is still here a year from now
Make it $10 maybe that's low enough that you can collect in a year? DT isn't going away for a long time.
i'm not so much interested in making a few bucks as in exposing how little confidence they has in their claim. made it $100 so they won't lose money when DT goes under!
Oh I see, you'll cover their loss if DT goes under, kind of like a one year insurance policy for the amount of the protection. I wouldn't pay $5,000 in insurance for a $5,000 car.
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There's a simple confidence tester and it only costs him Ten Bucks.
(If there's any doubt, I'll back you, for half the $100 loss, no charge, that's my level of confidence) $10 vs $100.
but i'm not offering insurance - i'm calling his bluff about DT going under - if they're right they're protected but if DTs still here, maybe they'll forgo silly chicken-little predictions in the future -- and the bet is open for a few others who think DT will be gone
Just trying to help you make some "Free Money" when DT doesn't go out of business. ;D
(https://i.postimg.cc/J72T3M5p/chicken-running-wolf-80.gif)
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I am waiting for a year now , still at 79! :-X
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I am waiting for a year now , still at 79! :-X
I make more on DraftKings now than DT. Honest. That's how bad things have gotten. $78.21 right now, want to race to the end? :)