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Author Topic: More than usual rejections from Dreamtime  (Read 22755 times)

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WarrenPrice

« Reply #25 on: December 22, 2009, 09:48 »
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I discovered ShutterStock.  I still get rejections but after less than one week, I have sold more there than this entire month at DT. 
Free at Last. 


« Reply #26 on: December 22, 2009, 10:11 »
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Of all the sites DM makes the least sense to upload multiples of similars since you make more money when a file sells more often.  Let the buyer contact you directly.  You can negotiate a RM license then.

Dan

« Reply #27 on: December 22, 2009, 10:56 »
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  I  had  one  that   was  accepted  /  put  in  a  collection  /  started  to  get  more  views  /  then  was  told  it  was  acccepted  by  accident  /had   a  fellow  poster  make  a  discrimatory  remark  about  it  /that  left  me  with  2  accepted  and  1  sale  /  dt  said  it  wasn't  discrimination  /  i  quit  their  site  in  a  hurry  /  i  was  treated  fairly  at  the  beginning  but  they  ticked  me  off  /  i  don't   need  them  to  be  successful  at  stock.

« Reply #28 on: December 22, 2009, 11:05 »
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  I  had  one  that   was  accepted  /  put  in  a  collection  /  started  to  get  more  views  /  then  was  told  it  was  acccepted  by  accident  /had   a  fellow  poster  make  a  discrimatory  remark  about  it  /that  left  me  with  2  accepted  and  1  sale  /  dt  said  it  wasn't  discrimination  /  i  quit  their  site  in  a  hurry  /  i  was  treated  fairly  at  the  beginning  but  they  ticked  me  off  /  i  don't   need  them  to  be  successful  at  stock.

what was the file subject? it was some kind of sensitive photo or so? maybe some that must be in editorial section? :-\

« Reply #29 on: December 22, 2009, 11:06 »
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My rejection rate has been a lot lower the last few months but for a while there they were rejecting unique, one of a kind photos of isolated feathers such as barred owl and osprey wing feathers as being too similar when there were 0 feathers like that uploaded anywhere. Whatever.

ap

« Reply #30 on: December 22, 2009, 14:06 »
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 I  had  one  that   was  accepted  /  put  in  a  collection  /  started  to  get  more  views  /  then  was  told  it  was  acccepted  by  accident  /had   a  fellow  poster  make  a  discrimatory  remark  about  it  /that  left  me  with  2  accepted  and  1  sale  /  dt  said  it  wasn't  discrimination  /  i  quit  their  site  in  a  hurry  /  i  was  treated  fairly  at  the  beginning  but  they  ticked  me  off  /  i  don't   need  them  to  be  successful  at  stock.

is this a goodbye poem? like 'i quit thee, dt'.
« Last Edit: December 22, 2009, 14:11 by ap »

« Reply #31 on: December 22, 2009, 14:47 »
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 I  had  one  that   was  accepted  /  put  in  a  collection  /  started  to  get  more  views  /  then  was  told  it  was  acccepted  by  accident  /had   a  fellow  poster  make  a  discrimatory  remark  about  it  /that  left  me  with  2  accepted  and  1  sale  /  dt  said  it  wasn't  discrimination  /  i  quit  their  site  in  a  hurry  /  i  was  treated  fairly  at  the  beginning  but  they  ticked  me  off  /  i  don't   need  them  to  be  successful  at  stock.

Oh, you are that one? I remember the thread full of melodrama, and Achilles pointed the original thread out too. It was about a reject.
Quote
Komar: I remember the photo. It would get a lot of views for sure, because of it's unusual nature. It really wasn't pleasant to look at though.
You: Komar - it's on 8 other sites so your opion don't count
You: type in "cheating at golf" and you'lll see 15 simular pics
Komar: Yes similar, but yours was also quite different, unique shall we say. Unique enough for me to remember it after seeing it months ago. Anyway, the opinions of the 8 other sites which accepted it are of course more important than mine. However, I don't disagree with Dt's opinion on this one. I hope the image does well for u elsewhere.
Niseyb: Can't imagine??? I couldn't find it on the "eight other sites" either!
You: Komar - keep your opions to yourself.
Nisey - you didn't look hard enough
DT - please keep these two away!!!

It was a great read, and DT must be in deep mourning to see your port of 2 go.  ;)
Lesson: if you can't stand the heath, stay out of the kitchen.  :P
Achilles:
Quote
You may dislike other users' opinions, but once you post on a public forum, you should expect some of the comments to be different than your opinions. And everyone to post, that is the rationale of a public forum.
As long as they are polite, you should respect other opinions and avoid replying like you did: "keep your opions to yourself." or "your opion don't count ".
Furthermore you asked admin afterwards to ban those users because of their remarks, none of which was derogatory. How fair is that?

« Last Edit: December 22, 2009, 14:53 by FD-amateur »

CCK

« Reply #32 on: January 04, 2010, 12:50 »
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I just got the result of my latest bach, with 66% rejected! I've never experienced anything like that at DT, most of the time my batched are 100% approved. All rejections except one is for composition. Perhaps Mr Hun is working there for the holidays.

« Reply #33 on: January 04, 2010, 16:03 »
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-Of all the sites DM makes the least sense to upload multiples of similars since you make more money when a file sells more often. 
-Let the buyer contact you directly.  You can negotiate a RM license then.

to answer in  2 parts:

=first part of your comment : 
yes, i agree. in fact , it was sjlocke who gave me that advice a while back when i PM'ed him directly on a comment he made to this regard.( it was about some dude who prides himself he had 3000 samey images and almost little or sales. woo hoo, lol.)
i think Mr. Locke said, "2... and no more. give them too many choices and you water down the value of your portfolio". i feel that was very kind of him to cue me in on this.

=second part of your comment :
isn't that against your contributors' agreement?

« Reply #34 on: January 04, 2010, 16:10 »
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I just got the result of my latest bach, with 66% rejected! I've never experienced anything like that at DT, most of the time my batched are 100% approved. All rejections except one is for composition. Perhaps Mr Hun is working there for the holidays.

rofl but.. if i recall, Atilla is actually a Ms. :D
but seriously, i think we should bury Atilla , and not enigmatize her into 2010  ;D

Yuri_Arcurs

  • One Crazy PhotoManic MadPerson
« Reply #35 on: January 05, 2010, 07:50 »
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Report from "DT in trouble!"

I have had some bad experiences with DT lately. Beside being the only agency in the world that does not allow you to submit images on the Getty generic release, which results in massive extra paperwork, they also seem to be rejecting images based on similarity so much these days that it is almost not worth uploading to them. Having uploaded more than 6000 images over the last 6 months, my income is slightly dropping with them which is not a good sign either.
I addressed these issues with DT SEO and actually got a slightly unpleasant email back. I was very surprised by this.
We must remember that DT has an otherwise generous photographer commission and should be respected for that. Some tolerance seems in place because of this.

Lev

« Reply #36 on: January 05, 2010, 08:10 »
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i have my monthly acceptance ratio at DT dropped from nearly 100% to about 20% last few months. all for "too similar".

i've tried to negotiate the issue with DT CEO some time ago too and got sort of "we love all our contributors and care a lot, but please back off, boy" communication. i really had an idea Yuri still gets some more special care but as i see he doesn't either.

i believe it's a wrong way to go for DT and falldown we see now is a result of very big mistake in acceptance policy. the gap between good fresh content quantity available at DT and available from others will grow. i actually used to send buyers to DT saying "most of my works are available at DT. go and buy there whichever you need". now the situation is rather "some of my recent works are available at DT". or maybe even "very few of them", so i've started to send customers elsewhere.

i believe i will probably stop submitting my newer works there very soon. no point in submitting when it all gets rejected. i don't think any argue will help, so i just have to silently wait a bit until it will be worth submitting again.

i hope DT will understand this policy is wrong and make some changes. then we will see DT coming up. i really enjoyed working with DT for latest years and really want things to normalize.


« Last Edit: January 05, 2010, 08:25 by dolgachov »

Xalanx

« Reply #37 on: January 05, 2010, 08:12 »
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Having uploaded more than 6000 images over the last 6 months, my income is slightly dropping with them
Now this is really scary, to say the less.

Quote from: Yuri_Arcurs
actually got a slightly unpleasant email back. I was very surprised by this.
I am not.

« Reply #38 on: January 05, 2010, 09:23 »
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I wonder where's Achilles, he was registered at this MSG forum and in the past answered users questions, I'd like him to answer to this post with his POV

« Reply #39 on: January 05, 2010, 09:40 »
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In theory, having a high rejection rate might improve the quality of the collection and make DT stand out from the crowd.  The problem is, that doesn't work in practice.  Look at Image Vortex, superb quality but hardly any buyers use the site, crestock reject more and after spending lots on marketing, they still have relatively low sales.  

I'm convinced that buyers want as much choice as possible, even if it means having to look through some sub par images.  With DT rejecting more, wont the buyers just go to the other sites?  It looks like this is already happening.  I just don't get this policy, istock and SS have the most sales and they have a much higher acceptance rate, letting the buyers decide if an image is right for them.

« Reply #40 on: January 05, 2010, 10:50 »
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i have my monthly acceptance ratio at DT dropped from nearly 100% to about 20% last few months. all for "too similar".

i've tried to negotiate the issue with DT CEO some time ago too and got sort of "we love all our contributors and care a lot, but please back off, boy" communication. i really had an idea Yuri still gets some more special care but as i see he doesn't either.

I don't know if it is still this way, but at one time I think DT figured your acceptance percentage into search results placement. In addition to the waste of time uploading, if this is still the case their behavior will affect sales of the images they do accept.

I thought the whole notion of including acceptance percentage was insane anyway - how does it help a buyer find the best images? - but it'd be interesting to see if the threads about reduced sales at DT and acceptance problems are related in any way

« Reply #41 on: January 05, 2010, 10:58 »
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I thought the whole notion of including acceptance percentage was insane anyway - how does it help a buyer find the best images? 

Surely it is not as 'insane' as Istock's various best match factors which have included exclusivity status, ratings (spawning rating clubs), limiting the number of images from a single contributor (within the first 100) and burying all the best-selling stuff miles down the search order. How did those things help the buyers find the best images?

Xalanx

« Reply #42 on: January 05, 2010, 12:38 »
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i have my monthly acceptance ratio at DT dropped from nearly 100% to about 20% last few months. all for "too similar".

i've tried to negotiate the issue with DT CEO some time ago too and got sort of "we love all our contributors and care a lot, but please back off, boy" communication. i really had an idea Yuri still gets some more special care but as i see he doesn't either.

I don't know if it is still this way, but at one time I think DT figured your acceptance percentage into search results placement. In addition to the waste of time uploading, if this is still the case their behavior will affect sales of the images they do accept.

I thought the whole notion of including acceptance percentage was insane anyway - how does it help a buyer find the best images? - but it'd be interesting to see if the threads about reduced sales at DT and acceptance problems are related in any way

My acceptance rate is above 80%, in fact last month was around 95%. However, the sales went down. Lower than 123RF, as I said. So I don't think it's the acceptance rate what is affecting Dolgachov's revenue.

My opinion is that they have not one, but more problems. Beginning with low acceptance rate and ending with SEO. At some time it was a glitch that for half a day I couldn't see my portfolio. I also PM'ed a contributor here who's portfolio was gone as well. They were back after a few hours but...

And I also think that things started to move downward when they made the last change to their best match. Some of you might remember lots of complains for pages of similar results, even from the same photographer.

And if Yuri says that after 6000 new uploads in half an year his income went down, well that's obviously not encouraging. Add all the pieces to this... puzzle and the general image of DT doesn't look pretty.

« Reply #43 on: January 05, 2010, 13:06 »
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I thought the whole notion of including acceptance percentage was insane anyway - how does it help a buyer find the best images? 

Surely it is not as 'insane' as Istock's various best match factors which have included exclusivity status, ratings (spawning rating clubs), limiting the number of images from a single contributor (within the first 100) and burying all the best-selling stuff miles down the search order. How did those things help the buyers find the best images?

HEAR HEAR !!

i never thought i'd live to agree with you gostwyck;
at least not so early in the new decade !   :D

Lev

« Reply #44 on: January 05, 2010, 13:09 »
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i don't believe acceptance rate affects sales. no way. i never said my sales are directly affected by latest moths acceptance ratio. if some of you got it this way - YOU'RE WRONG. forget it.

what i believe is constant massive rejecting of hi-quality images with high commercial value leads to much lower variety of choice for customers than competing agencies have. which leads to sales dropdown as customers will switch to other providing sources. that's my point.

« Reply #45 on: January 05, 2010, 13:14 »
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I thought the whole notion of including acceptance percentage was insane anyway - how does it help a buyer find the best images? 

Surely it is not as 'insane' as Istock's various best match factors which have included exclusivity status, ratings (spawning rating clubs), limiting the number of images from a single contributor (within the first 100) and burying all the best-selling stuff miles down the search order. How did those things help the buyers find the best images?

I didn't say I thought IS's best match was sane - I was commenting about DT's. I believe at one point Achilles had defended via a forum post their inclusion of this factor, tacitly admitted that it was one.

I'm an exclusive contributor at IS, not the author of all their software :)

However, I will note that when I try some sample searches these days with Best Match (not on subjects where I have any files so I'm not biasing my view) I see a lot of relevant files in the first few pages, and I think it's much better than it used to be in delivering useful results.

vonkara

« Reply #46 on: January 05, 2010, 13:15 »
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i have my monthly acceptance ratio at DT dropped from nearly 100% to about 20% last few months. all for "too similar".

i've tried to negotiate the issue with DT CEO some time ago too and got sort of "we love all our contributors and care a lot, but please back off, boy" communication. i really had an idea Yuri still gets some more special care but as i see he doesn't either.

I don't know if it is still this way, but at one time I think DT figured your acceptance percentage into search results placement. In addition to the waste of time uploading, if this is still the case their behavior will affect sales of the images they do accept.

I thought the whole notion of including acceptance percentage was insane anyway - how does it help a buyer find the best images? - but it'd be interesting to see if the threads about reduced sales at DT and acceptance problems are related in any way
It's still in place, Achille told that long time ago... and it's insane, because of some weird rejections you get there

Edit: I can't find the quote anymore...
« Last Edit: January 05, 2010, 13:25 by Vonkara »

« Reply #47 on: January 05, 2010, 13:23 »
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Two things:
1. Economic situation which lead to layoffs so there are no reviewers to handle volume
2. Mentioned above volume, they do not need more photos

« Reply #48 on: January 05, 2010, 14:12 »
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Two things:
1. Economic situation which lead to layoffs so there are no reviewers to handle volume
2. Mentioned above volume, they do not need more photos

ah, we have an economist in our midst !  well said mela!
it's like the stocking (no pun intended) shelves in the local shops these days. shops are stocking small inventory and keeping counter space to the "cream of the crop"  and the "new ideas".

 it cannot be any different from micro stock.  we buy less, only now we buy what we don't already have.
i don't see any flaw in that thinking.
does anyone? ... cast aside the fact that some/most of us are getting more rejections to cloud our comments...  8)
« Last Edit: January 05, 2010, 14:14 by Persue-d »

« Reply #49 on: January 05, 2010, 17:03 »
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if rejects were solely on quality it wouldnt much matter - but most of my rejects at dt, BigStock and ss are for subjective reasons like "not suitable for stock" or "we didnt like your framing of the shot", etc

Its not a trivial issue since the process is SO arbitrary, we cant pick 1 or 2 best images as recommendedd, since our best wont necessarily coincide with a particular reviewers notions and sometimes, a series of similar shots ARE accepted eg, what if I had only submitted the 4 shots that were rejected?  Instead we have to submit any shots that are technically correct and not dupes of others, resulting in more work for all of us, and reducing sales when salable images are rejected

My simple[!] solution is to err on the side of accepting MORE images, not less, and let the buyers decide.  These days theres no real costs for storing all these images.  The problem instead is in generating relevant  results for searches one fairly easy algorithm would be to limit the number of images from any photographer displayed in a search result, but mark those shown with a comment more images from this photographer] 

steve


 

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