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Microstock Footage Forum => Video Equipment / Sofware / Technique => Topic started by: MaZvone on January 25, 2019, 03:13

Title: After Effects or Premiere
Post by: MaZvone on January 25, 2019, 03:13
Hello, in which program edit videos for stock. I am now on Adobe After Effects. What are your experiences?
Title: Re: After Effects or Premiere
Post by: increasingdifficulty on January 25, 2019, 04:41
After Effects is the slowest, but also capable of doing the most detailed work. I have done a lot of stock clips in AE but it's frustrating how slow it is.

If you're just doing clips with color correction and grading DaVinci Resolve is faster, and Premiere also. After Effects allows for the most control of every little detail.

If you're on Mac Final Cut Pro X is by far the fastest of them all. A 1 hour export in After Effects is about 10-15 minutes in Final Cut. With the same plug-ins.
Title: Re: After Effects or Premiere
Post by: ForrestBrown on January 25, 2019, 13:34
I used Premiere to edit my clips and After Effects to color correct and do other stuff to them. My workflow is to import my clips from a shoot into Premiere, add them to a timeline and go through and edit that into the clips I plan to submit for stock. I then select all of the footage in the timeline and convert that into an After Effects project. In After Effects I'll take the comp with all of the footage and use a script that converts each shot into it's own comp. From there I go through each of the comps and do whatever color correction or other things I want to do with the shot. Then render all of the comps out and submit to the different stock footage sites.

 
Title: Re: After Effects or Premiere
Post by: ODesigns on January 28, 2019, 11:43
AE all the way for me.  I'm always covering up logos or license plates, and that would be mind-numbing work in PPre.
Title: Re: After Effects or Premiere
Post by: georgep7 on January 29, 2019, 10:46
They both have the job done but if i may, I suggest Premiere as an actual non linear editing program and it might be useful in the future to know how to work with it. But if you master AE and obviously have a computer that can handle working there, why not? It it your choise :)
Title: Re: After Effects or Premiere
Post by: Dennis Radeke on January 30, 2019, 02:29
Dennis from Adobe here.  8)

Prior to joining the Stock team, I worked with clients and primarily taught, evangelized and lectured on Premiere Pro and After Effects.

No simple answer here, but both tools will work here.  The challenge for Ae is sometimes perceived as complicated.

For most people, if you're clipping and adding a grade or color correction to the clips, then I would use Premiere Pro.  It's easier and more dedicated to the task. 

Lumetri inside of Premiere Pro is a very capable color grading tool that is intuitive.  If you want to blur out stuff, Premiere Pro has a very capable tool to track and blur as well.

For the very fine and specific work, Ae is an unparalleled tool.  "If you can think it, you can do it with After Effects." ;-)

Feel free to ask specific questions, though I am traveling abroad at the moment.

Best,
Dennis
Title: Re: After Effects or Premiere
Post by: increasingdifficulty on January 31, 2019, 06:17
For the very fine and specific work, Ae is an unparalleled tool.  "If you can think it, you can do it with After Effects." ;-)

While I do love what I can do with After Effects, my biggest concern is that it is so painfully slow. Any idea if the code will ever be updated? I realize this might never happen and would require writing a completely new application, but one can dream...

I speed up footage all the time, and with that comes adding motion blur. I export the same clip, with pretty much identical looking motion blur 20 times faster in FCP X. Yes, twenty times. That difference is just beyond reason.

Is AE just painfully unoptimized on Mac, and that's not a priority perhaps? Could be. But a 20x difference in export time is just beyond imagination.  ;)

Rant over. I love AE. But I do also have to finish clips faster than 2 hours sometimes.
Title: Re: After Effects or Premiere
Post by: Brightontl on January 31, 2019, 15:48
Generally speaking, I tend to use AE for individual clips and Premiere when I am putting together several clips to make a short movie.
But I agree with everybody here: there is a lot of overlapping, in other worlds situations when you could use both of them.
I also agree with other posters: AE can be painfully slow, but I still love it
Title: Re: After Effects or Premiere
Post by: Dennis Radeke on February 03, 2019, 01:17
For the very fine and specific work, Ae is an unparalleled tool.  "If you can think it, you can do it with After Effects." ;-)

While I do love what I can do with After Effects, my biggest concern is that it is so painfully slow. Any idea if the code will ever be updated? I realize this might never happen and would require writing a completely new application, but one can dream...

I speed up footage all the time, and with that comes adding motion blur. I export the same clip, with pretty much identical looking motion blur 20 times faster in FCP X. Yes, twenty times. That difference is just beyond reason.

Is AE just painfully unoptimized on Mac, and that's not a priority perhaps? Could be. But a 20x difference in export time is just beyond imagination.  ;)

Rant over. I love AE. But I do also have to finish clips faster than 2 hours sometimes.

Well, we could share a few beers and probably just scratch the surface of such a complex topic...  There's no way I can adequately answer this either via a forum post or via in person.  However, I will say this:

1) We've been working on speeding up an unspeedable application for the last several years and have made good progress.  That's the key - Ae by design is "import anything, do anything to it, export any format."  Because of that, it's impossible to make it 'real-time' like an NLE - simply impossible
2) Our investments into improving ram preview, speculative rendering, taking more effects to GPU, etc. have yielded fruit
3) You can count on us to continue to improve and speed up Ae.  Now if only we wouldn't leave HD, no 4k, no 8k, ummmm...  This is part of the problem too - frame sizes have exploded in the last 10-15 years with no end in sight.

I know this is probably just lip service, but please know that we're sincerely always focused on trying to improve performance for a plurality of users.

Hope this helps,
Dennis
Title: Re: After Effects or Premiere
Post by: Sean Locke Photography on February 03, 2019, 13:33
My goal is to import a bunch of clips, cut their length, and do color correction.

I've use AE before for this, but the mere headache of importing a folder full of 4k and trying to make proxies for them so I can see them at speed has forced me over to Premiere, where at least the ingest function will do that automatically.  I can't believe AE can't do something so basic.
Title: Re: After Effects or Premiere
Post by: Dennis Radeke on February 05, 2019, 11:49
My goal is to import a bunch of clips, cut their length, and do color correction.

I've use AE before for this, but the mere headache of importing a folder full of 4k and trying to make proxies for them so I can see them at speed has forced me over to Premiere, where at least the ingest function will do that automatically.  I can't believe AE can't do something so basic.

This is because your use case is designed for Premiere Pro and not Ae.  After Effects is primarily for two basic kinds of work 1) Motion Graphics design 2) Visual FX.  Your workflow is definitely designed for Premiere Pro.  Be sure to check out the Lumetri color workflow.

Dennis
Title: Re: After Effects or Premiere
Post by: Sean Locke Photography on February 05, 2019, 18:17
The other wrench is that I canít queue up clips in AME.  I queue them up and AME randomly decides to output the same file for different jobs.  Could be one, could be five.  So I have to sit there and output them one by one in PP.
Title: Re: After Effects or Premiere
Post by: Dennis Radeke on February 06, 2019, 09:25
The other wrench is that I canít queue up clips in AME.  I queue them up and AME randomly decides to output the same file for different jobs.  Could be one, could be five.  So I have to sit there and output them one by one in PP.

Best thing to do is trash your preferences and that should clean it up

https://forums.adobe.com/thread/2126506 (https://forums.adobe.com/thread/2126506)
Title: Re: After Effects or Premiere
Post by: izzikiorage on February 06, 2019, 21:59
My goal is to import a bunch of clips, cut their length, and do color correction.

I've use AE before for this, but the mere headache of importing a folder full of 4k and trying to make proxies for them so I can see them at speed has forced me over to Premiere, where at least the ingest function will do that automatically.  I can't believe AE can't do something so basic.

This is because your use case is designed for Premiere Pro and not Ae.  After Effects is primarily for two basic kinds of work 1) Motion Graphics design 2) Visual FX.  Your workflow is definitely designed for Premiere Pro.  Be sure to check out the Lumetri color workflow.

Dennis
I think I've been making this mistake as well. My flow is loading multiple videos, cutting them, stabilizing, color correction and grading and then using AME to export. Would this end up working better on premier as well?

Second, have an issue with the warp stabilizer. I leave it for encoding overnight, however i have to ensure the warp stabilizer has run before i drag drop them into AME otherwise that stabilization blue bar gets encoded into the video. Is there a way to set this up better so that i don't have to sit through the stabilization process.
Title: Re: After Effects or Premiere
Post by: izzikiorage on February 13, 2019, 07:32
Gave Premiere a shot, it has its challenges but i love the fact that i can play my clips in a non RAM preview sort of way. Seems to render really fast as well. Guess I'll need to learn this a little better now
Title: Re: After Effects or Premiere
Post by: Dennis Radeke on February 14, 2019, 11:24
Gave Premiere a shot, it has its challenges but i love the fact that i can play my clips in a non RAM preview sort of way. Seems to render really fast as well. Guess I'll need to learn this a little better now

And there is a warp stabilizer effect to help create stabilized content when there is no tripod. ;-) Glad you found Premiere Pro accessible.

Dennis
Title: Re: After Effects or Premiere
Post by: izzikiorage on February 16, 2019, 08:25
My goal is to import a bunch of clips, cut their length, and do color correction.

I've use AE before for this, but the mere headache of importing a folder full of 4k and trying to make proxies for them so I can see them at speed has forced me over to Premiere, where at least the ingest function will do that automatically.  I can't believe AE can't do something so basic.

This is because your use case is designed for Premiere Pro and not Ae.  After Effects is primarily for two basic kinds of work 1) Motion Graphics design 2) Visual FX.  Your workflow is definitely designed for Premiere Pro.  Be sure to check out the Lumetri color workflow.

Dennis
I think I've been making this mistake as well. My flow is loading multiple videos, cutting them, stabilizing, color correction and grading and then using AME to export. Would this end up working better on premier as well?

Second, have an issue with the warp stabilizer. I leave it for encoding overnight, however i have to ensure the warp stabilizer has run before i drag drop them into AME otherwise that stabilization blue bar gets encoded into the video. Is there a way to set this up better so that i don't have to sit through the stabilization process.
Yup, have found warp stabilizer a little bit of a challenge as given above
Title: Re: After Effects or Premiere
Post by: seamless on February 17, 2019, 02:59
I started doing stock in Premiere but went to After Effects pretty soon since I ended there anyway with my clips. Mainly I do a lot of multilayer masking to emphasize parts of the image in a subtle way, just like in a darkroom in the old days.

Cutting goes pretty fast too, since I first overnight render 4K ProRes files plus 720p proxies from my H.264 encoded 4K camera files or 6K RAW timelapse still sequences.
Editing on the 720p proxy and then color correcting with Synthetic Aperture on the 4k or 6K file.

Still working on a 2012, i7 16GB MacMini and I can easily do 20 - 30 4K clips in an evening and let them render while I sleep.
Title: Re: After Effects or Premiere
Post by: Dennis Radeke on February 19, 2019, 12:42
I started doing stock in Premiere but went to After Effects pretty soon since I ended there anyway with my clips. Mainly I do a lot of multilayer masking to emphasize parts of the image in a subtle way, just like in a darkroom in the old days.

Cutting goes pretty fast too, since I first overnight render 4K ProRes files plus 720p proxies from my H.264 encoded 4K camera files or 6K RAW timelapse still sequences.
Editing on the 720p proxy and then color correcting with Synthetic Aperture on the 4k or 6K file.

Still working on a 2012, i7 16GB MacMini and I can easily do 20 - 30 4K clips in an evening and let them render while I sleep.

Great workflow(!), but probably not one 99% of all Stock contributors would want to employ.
Title: Re: After Effects or Premiere
Post by: MEYER47 on February 21, 2019, 08:18
I recommend Adobe Premiere. Personally that's what I use I import all my clips cut them, calibrates them with lumetri which is very powerful and exports everything with media encoder.
Title: Re: After Effects or Premiere
Post by: izzikiorage on February 21, 2019, 11:03
Do you also stabilize them with the warp stabilizer? What is the best way to build workflow around it?
Title: Re: After Effects or Premiere
Post by: MEYER47 on February 21, 2019, 13:35
generaly, i use warp stabilizer yes he works nice !
but when it doesn't t work I create a dynamic composition on after effect and do the stabilization on after

my workflow is planned to handle a lot of video a day, i can explain you by mp ;)
Title: Re: After Effects or Premiere
Post by: izzikiorage on February 21, 2019, 21:36
generaly, i use warp stabilizer yes he works nice !
but when it doesn't t work I create a dynamic composition on after effect and do the stabilization on after

my workflow is planned to handle a lot of video a day, i can explain you by mp ;)
Dropping you a message.
Title: Re: After Effects or Premiere
Post by: georgep7 on February 26, 2019, 05:46
Do you also stabilize them with the warp stabilizer? What is the best way to build workflow around it?

No matter the software or technology, steady shots save a lot of time in post.

I know, I didn't just reinvented the wheel with this statement above

but I had and still many times take shaky shots that could be just be shot better.
Even handheld ones. Now on in my mind it seems better to lose a shot or drop it than stabilizing in post.

Warp Stabilizer and similar are good usefull tools.
but.
It is different to repair someones else's clips
and correcting own clips knowing that I didn't try hard enough.

:)