MicrostockGroup Sponsors


Author Topic: Fotolia's game playing  (Read 12231 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

« on: September 25, 2007, 14:51 »
0
More than two months after Fotolia's re-engineering, my keywords are still useless and most of my images have been invisible to any search. Consequently, my sales have halted. It seems that Fotolia has now captured the market and will discharge us with no explanation.

I have read that the problem is happening to many others and wouldn't have been a big deal if some of us hadn't uploaded so many photos, hundreds of photos, some over thousands.  Fotolia seems to have blocked many photographers  without any explanation, while there are still some, whose keywords were not messed (I checked) that haven't had the same problems as we did.

I believe that if the site belongs to the founders, which are a  group of photographers, they can do as they please, on the other hand, we helped Fotolia to grow, we invested our time uploading photos and we need to know what Fotolia is up to. Are they going to dismiss the ones outside their group? If so, fine, but they should be honest and tell us that instead of blocking our work and wasting our time.

We should, all together, demand a final word from Fotolia




« Reply #1 on: September 27, 2007, 04:50 »
0
I do not know about you, but after V2, and September in particular is great for me on fotolia, I have so many sales, I suprized myself, I didnt expect that good month. I hope this trend will continue. :)

As the keywords issue, fotolia search engine is searching only first 7 keywords of your list, but it should be fixed soon. :)

jsnover

« Reply #2 on: September 28, 2007, 00:34 »
0
FT is on track for a record month in September - which is very welcome after all the turmoil following V2's introduction.

For a long time after V2, searches for images of mine - common keywords - produced pitiful results, but things certainly are returning much better results now.

I have no knowledge of FT doing anything special for me - or "blocking" any group of photographers. Where did you get the idea of some people being "outside their group"? My images are selling and I'm not connected with management or the founders in any way.

Have you contacted support with some specific examples of images that don't show up and asked them to look into it? It seems that's the thing to do if you want outstanding problems fixed...

« Reply #3 on: September 28, 2007, 01:44 »
0
i have tried the search box and there were no results for my images, even when tried the whole title of them...
i have send an email to them and waiting for their answer.

« Reply #4 on: September 28, 2007, 08:57 »
0
Has this improved my sales at FT?  NO. 

But you can make categories in My Files, a folder to place your group of similar theme photos into.  That way, if a buyer happens to find just one of your photos, there is a chance they will click through to see the rest in the series.

« Reply #5 on: September 28, 2007, 11:19 »
0
That is so NOT TRUE! Nobody can open your specific  "FOLDER" unless you give him a link. That means if you have some image that is in a folder with others, nobody can open that folder. It is only done when you provide a link. Fotolia automaticaly finds similar images by groups and keywords.....

« Reply #6 on: September 28, 2007, 11:28 »
0
Ahhhhhh.... really?  So this is why it has not improved my sales! 

When I looked at my similars on a few I thought it was working.

« Reply #7 on: September 28, 2007, 16:45 »
0
I tried to find some of my images in FT, even using different language sites to see if there was some relation to the version.  Anyway, I didn't find images in some very straight searches.

For instance, this one:

In the USA site, I type "french heart" and it's the first result.  Now, in the French site, "coeur franois" doesn't return anything; "coeur france" returns many images, but not this one (most are the Sacre Coeur church); other unsuccessfull searches were "couer bleu blanc rouge", "drapeau bleu blanc rouge" and "france drapeau".  I have no idea how someone from France found it today (unless he used the USA site...)

Regards,
Adelaide

« Reply #8 on: September 29, 2007, 02:42 »
0
just received the following answer from FT:

We apologize for the inconvenience. Our search engine currently displays as a "search result" only the first 7 keywords associated to the image. Try searching your image by entering the first 7 keywords you entered that are associated with that image.

My answer now is why must we then add more than 7 keywords?
The microstock market is growing up day by day.
A few companies hanen't understood it yet.

« Reply #9 on: September 29, 2007, 02:53 »
0
you should add more than 7 keywords, because this bug is temporarily, they will fix that, eventually, and search engine will search all keywords.

« Reply #10 on: September 29, 2007, 03:12 »
0
No - the seven keyword thing also applied under V1.

The fact of the matter is that, at FT, if you do not order your keywords correctly (when uploading the image) you are wasting your time.

This is why I've always commented on the considerable amount of time it takes me to upload to FT - sorting the keywords using their rather slow sort list thing is very time consuming.

But my sales there are very good, so investing the time is worth it.

I don't think they will expand beyond the seven word thing for some considerable time (if ever).

« Reply #11 on: September 29, 2007, 05:03 »
0
I didint know that it was the case in V1.

Why do you think they are keeping onlky 7 keywords in search, what is the reason?

« Reply #12 on: September 29, 2007, 05:48 »
0
It is probably because there is so much keyword spam and if we are restricted to 7, the search should be more accurate.

« Reply #13 on: September 29, 2007, 07:26 »
0
My answer now is why must we then add more than 7 keywords?
Well, I don't upload exclusively to FT anyway, so I would be adding all keywords I find relevant.  With Exifer or Irfanview I can have the best 7 ones on top.

Not that it always works fine in searches, given my tests.

Regards,
Adelaide

« Reply #14 on: September 29, 2007, 08:27 »
0
Putting the keywords in order of importance is a sensible thing to do. Most sites (except FT) rank them alphabetically. If sites in the future would strip the first 7 (FT), 15 (CanStockPhoto), 20, 50 keywords, you can still manage with one single IPTC set in your photos. Made a script for that, but free to use for everybody (use it together with Irfanview):

Tag Sorter (and much more).

« Reply #15 on: October 05, 2007, 08:11 »
0
i spent a few hours to reorder my keywords, but nothing changed in the search results...
it's a pity to spent so many hours to shoot, edit, upload, & keywording my pics if none can find them.

« Reply #16 on: October 05, 2007, 09:01 »
0
I agree with Wander... we need to put some pressure on Fotolia.  Ever since the V2 introduction a full 90% of my images cannot be found on their site.  With respect to the first seven keywords solution this is a load of crap... I sampled at least 30 of my images with the first few keywords and none of them could be found.  Prior to V2 I never had any problems.

Since June 19, 2007 I have brought this to the attention of their technical services group no less than seven times and they just keep blowing me off.  So as a final act of desperation I emailed Fotolia's President (Oleg Tscheltzoff) on 10/1... and as you may surmise I haven't gotten a response from him either.  His email address is newbielink:mailto:oleg@fotolia.com [nonactive] so if any of you want to reinforce the need to resolve this issue give it a shot.  Remember there is power in numbers.

I tried to propose a reasonable argument to plead our case... like this issue is not only costing their photographers sales, but on a larger scale it is costing Fotolia a lot of lost revenue.  But this line of reasoning fell on deaf ears.  I can't help but believe that the keyword search issue is only the tip of the iceberg.

If I ever hear back from Mr. Tscheltzoff I will let the group know!

« Reply #17 on: October 05, 2007, 14:17 »
0
I was recently contaced by FT-BR and took the opportunity to give them a direct feedback about image search problem.  I did the same search in each language (translating the keywords, of course!) and the results were quite curious.  I wished I had saved a copy to post them here.

Regards,
Adelaide

« Reply #18 on: October 05, 2007, 15:00 »
0
I too have been having issues with many of my images not showing up in searches.  And yes, I'm searching on keywords that are listed as the first 7.  After complaining to them twice over a two month period and getting the usual "we're working on it" I have given up.  They obviously aren't interested in those lost revenues.  What a joke.

« Reply #19 on: October 05, 2007, 15:56 »
0
I reallly do feel for all you folks.....
            but I found out what a dead end it was with FT about a year ago.  Every time I racked up sales.... they disappeared in purchases allegedly by me.  I never bought a thing.  I'm not a buyer, just a seller.  This happened a couple times.  Big hassle getting it fixed....  couldn't get any feedback from tech....  I conversed with Chad , I guess in NYC, talked to his assistant, emailed tech support on more than one occassion.....   never got an explanation as to how it was happening.  In the end I felt like they figured me to be a scammer and a pain in the backside.
         I finally yanked all my pix (but one) in January.  To be fair, all those credits were eventually restored to my account... but I'm lightyears from a payout figure and the only pic I have there only sells a couple times a month.... Frankly I fear uploading there again as it may start all over.

  But now, after reading here the last month or so..... seems like pretty much a waste time for a newbie at FT.   I doubt I'll ever upload there again.    -tom
« Last Edit: October 05, 2007, 15:58 by a.k.a.-tom »

« Reply #20 on: October 05, 2007, 16:47 »
0
General question to this thread and group... have any of you pulled your images from Fotolia based on the keyword search problems as well as other issues?

I am seriously considering yanking all my images out of frustration.  The only negative is the amount of time it took me to correct the images, keyword them, and then upload them.  I've only got 251 images on the site... but it still took a while to upload them.

If I thought it would prompt them to resolve some of the issues I would yank my images today.  Unfortunately they have over 300,000 contributors so unfortunately one person wouldn't prompt them to take any action.  Let me know your thoughts... thanks!

« Reply #21 on: October 05, 2007, 17:07 »
0
They have 300,000 customers, but only 15,000 contributors.

« Reply #22 on: October 05, 2007, 17:23 »
0
Good point... still bad odds though!

« Reply #23 on: October 06, 2007, 07:36 »
0
this is the answer after notify them that nothing resolved after i reordered the 7 keywords...
with caps following my answer to FT

>We apologize for the inconvenience. Our search engine currently displays as a "search result" only the first 7 keywords associated to the image. Try searching your image by entering the first 7 keywords you entered that are associated with that image.

THE PROBLEM IS THAT I HAVE SPENT MY TIME TO REORDER THE 7 MAGICAL KEYWORDS, BUT STILL MY PHOTOS DOESNT APPEARS IN THE SEARCHING RESULTS PAGE.
ITS TIME TO TAKE SERIOUS THIS PROBLEM ELSEWHERE IM SURE YOU WILL LOOSE MANY CONTRIBUTORS.

« Reply #24 on: October 06, 2007, 09:57 »
0
I reordered my keywords about 4 months ago and sales came to a grinding halt.  Hard to say what I can blame it on, the reordering or V2.

I'm very optimistic looking forward though, I'm crossing my fingers that something has been fixed because the number of sales I had from Tues-Friday equals half of what I had in total last month.    Has anyone else noticed this trend, or is it just a fluke?

« Reply #25 on: October 06, 2007, 10:17 »
0
Pixart same fot me last week was better than usual with a sale everyday, thing I used to have in July, we will see next week :)

« Reply #26 on: October 06, 2007, 13:46 »
0
Curious, I've had an awful start of month in FT: just ONE sale.  FT is my 9th in earnings this month!!!

Regards,
Adelaide

« Reply #27 on: October 06, 2007, 14:00 »
0
We are lucky that we have phildate as a contributor to this group; his latest observation is that sales are 'almost back to where they were before V2'.  He is of course one of the biggest selling photographers at FT along with Andresr, Yuri and Iryana Kurhan.

My own sales have been improving every week.

It is very difficult to compare the situation now with July and August, simply because V2 coincided with the summer lull; it's impossible to tell whether the improvement is because of increased business activity or 'fixes' to the system.

To be fair to Fotolia, ever since I have been a member there, there has always been a warning notice on the upload confirmation page that 'the most important keywords should appear first' and of course there is the sliding box thing to allow for reordering.  Any contributor who ignored that notice should kick themselves rather than Fotolia.  Of course it isn't made clear that only the first seven words will count.

I suspect that editing keywords after upload doesn't actually work.  To be absolutely sure that an image is in the library with the best keywords in the top seven, the best bet is to delete from the database and upload again.
« Last Edit: October 06, 2007, 14:16 by hatman12 »

« Reply #28 on: October 06, 2007, 16:56 »
0

To be fair to Fotolia, ever since I have been a member there, there has always been a warning notice on the upload confirmation page that 'the most important keywords should appear first' and of course there is the sliding box thing to allow for reordering.  Any contributor who ignored that notice should kick themselves rather than Fotolia.  Of course it isn't made clear that only the first seven words will count.

Hi,

My guess is you are not reading what people are saying... sorry, no offence.
What i read is that most of the 'complainers' are putting the keywords in right order.... as I do in photoshop already when keywording.
when i upload to FT they appear in the right order on the FT page, but neather can i find most of my pictures via the search function.  And trully, i made it my task to put them in right order and checking on submitting in the first place.

So obvious there is something wrong with the search function on FT.  I have great days... i have days without any sale... that with a port of more than 2000 pictures is.................... fill in the blanks.

I'm sure that phildate... andres.... forgiss... etc will have great sale... but we are speaking of big port... portfolios that get priority if something needs te be fixed.

Patrick.

« Reply #29 on: October 06, 2007, 17:04 »
0
Being on FT, it is like playing on the lottery , you never know when you gonna win  ;D

« Reply #30 on: October 06, 2007, 17:38 »
0
You've got a great portfolio there Patrick and I'm really surprised to hear you get days with zero downloads.

Clearly there is a problem.  What the solution is I don't know I'm afraid.

Yes, I see lots of comments from people who say the search function isn't working.  Quite possibly they are correct.  When and how it will be resolved is not something I would like to try to estimate (or even if it will ever be solved).

Fotolia works okay for me.  Perhaps I am just one of the lucky ones.  I sincerely hope it remains that way and that the problems being experienced by others get resolved.
« Last Edit: October 06, 2007, 17:58 by hatman12 »

« Reply #31 on: October 07, 2007, 03:49 »
0
Yes, the search engine is not perfect, but sales are great. First week of october, was better than july and august together for me! On workdays I have 7-15 sales, on weekends 2-3, and I am happy with that. My goal is to earn 300$ in october, and I am keeping my fingers crossed to acomplish that, so we shall see...

« Reply #32 on: October 07, 2007, 06:09 »
0
Those are excellent numbers Chode, even more impressive when one considers that you have achieved all of that without ever owning a DSLR!

I hope you enjoy your new camera and become an even bigger success.

« Reply #33 on: October 07, 2007, 09:26 »
0
Yes, the search engine is not perfect, but sales are great. First week of october, was better than july and august together for me! On workdays I have 7-15 sales, on weekends 2-3, and I am happy with that. My goal is to earn 300$ in october, and I am keeping my fingers crossed to acomplish that, so we shall see...

Congrats on the sales!  Sounds like you are doing great there.  And don't get me wrong, my sales are great there as well.  The first week of Oct. was probably my best there yet.  But think how much better those sales might have been had their search engine worked properly.  For them to just ignore the problem is simply unacceptable.


« Reply #34 on: October 07, 2007, 09:45 »
0
Thank you all, but all that did not fell from the sky, it is all hard work... :) And for the old camera, well, it is a little bit more than just ordinary compact. Canon S3 IS is a good camera, but dSLR is a whole new world... :D

Anyway, I think that sales might be even better if search engine worked 100% correctly, but I do not complain anyway... just shooting images, and hopefully it will work some day fully. :)


« Reply #35 on: October 07, 2007, 17:52 »
0
Yep, their search function is still flawed regardless if your first seven keywords are the most relevant.

« Reply #36 on: October 10, 2007, 05:34 »
0
here's their last answer. With caps on following my answer.

>We apologize for the inconvenience. No changes can be done after the image has been uploaded.

THEN REMOVE THE KEYWORDS REORDER ARROWS FROM EDITING PAGE!!!

PaulieWalnuts

  • On the Wrong Side of the Business
« Reply #37 on: October 10, 2007, 07:20 »
0
I can verify the keyword reorder works. I reordered some of my keywords and downaloads literally came to a dead stop. After a couple of weeks I'm now starting to get downloads again. Seems like it takes a while for their search engine to reindex any changes.

Also seems that it doesn't search keywords that are entered as phrases ("hands typing" as opposed to "hands,typing"). And even if you have individial keywords but are missing one word in a search phrase such as "on" (hands typing on laptop), it doesn't work.

« Reply #38 on: October 10, 2007, 07:30 »
0
Well my payout from them that had been "pending" since mid September has finally been paid and I've started getting sales there again.  But I still can't find my own images by keyword.  Oh well, at least other people do.
rosta

« Reply #39 on: October 10, 2007, 16:15 »
0
This is what I reported to FT, when they contacted me the other day.  I tried the same searches in different languages.

-=-=-=-=-

http://us.fotolia.com/id/4120421 first keywords are "heart" and "German" :
- "German heart" in FT-US or FT-UK, it appears (total two images, one is mine)
- "corazn alemn" in FT-ES, save as above
- "corao alemo" in FT-BR or FT-PT, nothing returns
- "coeur allemand" in FT-FR, also nothing returns
- "deutsche herz" in FT-DE, returns 14 images, none is mine
- "cuore tedesco" in FT-IT, same as FT-DE
 
Another image, older, prior to V2: http://br.fotolia.com/id/884665, where "cereal", "granola" and "strawberry" are among the seven first keywords:
- "granola" in FT-US, none of my images among the 59 that the search tool finds
- "granola" in FT-BR returns 8370 images (none of mine among the first 160, and many don't seem right)
- "cereal strawberry" in FT-US returns 85 images (my 4 in the first page)
- "cereal morango" in FT-BR returns exactly the same images as in FT-US

« Reply #40 on: October 11, 2007, 16:36 »
0
I wonder if some of you have observed also an increase in sales at FT this month.
For me for the first time since 2 months FT is ahead of SS and after 10 days in the month I made already the same number for the whole month of Sept.
Maybe they fixed something after all ???

« Reply #41 on: October 11, 2007, 16:43 »
0
Yes, good views and increasingly buoyant sales.

« Reply #42 on: October 12, 2007, 02:22 »
0
yes i find them getting increasingly better the last 2 months.

« Reply #43 on: October 12, 2007, 02:58 »
0
Sales at FT are going well for me, too. I'm already at $100+ this month - it usually takes about three weeks to reach this point.

« Reply #44 on: October 12, 2007, 03:14 »
0
Yes me too, although I was one of the lucky ones that did better after V2 than before so never did see a decrease in downloads.  Maybe because I always put my 7 most relevant keywords first.

Sales at FT are going well for me, too. I'm already at $100+ this month - it usually takes about three weeks to reach this point.


« Reply #45 on: October 12, 2007, 03:52 »
0
Site is getting faster all the time and sales are picking up to levels before V2. I have always had a soft spot for FT and now upload quite a bit of exclusive stuff for them. I like having the option of setting my own prices for the exclusive stuff.

« Reply #46 on: October 13, 2007, 07:20 »
0
Unfortunately this month FT is very slow for me, only my 5th earner and way behind the 4th.  It may well be my worst month there this year.  I had good results when V2 entered.

Regards,
Adelaide


 

Related Topics

  Subject / Started by Replies Last post
10 Replies
3677 Views
Last post August 27, 2007, 18:26
by ozbandit
5 Replies
2471 Views
Last post April 04, 2011, 09:29
by Sean Locke Photography
46 Replies
5729 Views
Last post January 19, 2015, 16:21
by cascoly
23 Replies
3511 Views
Last post August 02, 2017, 08:31
by Dumc
0 Replies
1850 Views
Last post November 12, 2017, 22:03
by Desintegrator

Sponsors

Microstock Poll Results