MicrostockGroup
Agency Based Discussion => Adobe Stock => Topic started by: Ron on May 29, 2014, 01:15
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Either because I contacted an affiliate asking where they got my images, or for my involvement in against DPC. Not sure if Matt is involved. I expect more people to have their accounts closed.
From: Chad Bridwell [mailto: [email protected] ]
Sent: 29 May 2014 00:33
To: xxxx@ semmick.com
Subject: Fotolia account closed
Dear Mr. Ron Bxxxxxx,
In accordance with Fotolia's terms and conditions we have closed your account. Please forward the Paypal or Moneybooker address where we shall send the remaining funds in your account.
Sincerely,
Chad Bridwell
Director of Operations
Fotolia.com
Cant say I am upset, I feel more relieved if anything
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Seems mine is closed too, though I did not receive any e-mail from them.
Fotolia is my second earner. I opted out, but did not delete any images from Fotolia.
You might not be upset Ron, but I am.
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its curious how FT doesn't think of the future, they know how active you are in the forum here and that you would post if anything happened with your account, I cannot understand how they believed this would be positive for them, its also curious how powerful agencies feel with others hard work...
so I can only think they wanted you to open a topic about this matter, they want us to be afraid, things can't get any better...
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well, I guess that is one way to opt out of DPC...
Unfortunately this sort of action seems to be par for the course for this "agency"
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Seems mine is closed too, though I did not receive any e-mail from them.
Fotolia is my second earner. I opted out, but did not delete any images from Fotolia.
You might not be upset Ron, but I am.
I am really sorry to hear this Anyka, honestly, I know for me it doesnt hurt, but I can only imagine how you must feel. It seems freedom of speech is punished by Fotolia. I can only hope they do down asap.
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its curious how FT doesn't think of the future, they know how active you are in the forum here and that you would post if anything happened with your account, I cannot understand how they believed this would be positive for them, its also curious how powerful agencies feel with others hard work...
so I can only think they wanted you to open a topic about this matter, they want us to be afraid, things can't get any better...
Good point, and I think it might even work.
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its curious how FT doesn't think of the future, they know how active you are in the forum here and that you would post if anything happened with your account, I cannot understand how they believed this would be positive for them, its also curious how powerful agencies feel with others hard work...
so I can only think they wanted you to open a topic about this matter, they want us to be afraid, things can't get any better...
Good point, and I think it might even work.
Yep, it worked. I'm too afraid to upload more images now. ;D
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its curious how FT doesn't think of the future, they know how active you are in the forum here and that you would post if anything happened with your account, I cannot understand how they believed this would be positive for them, its also curious how powerful agencies feel with others hard work...
so I can only think they wanted you to open a topic about this matter, they want us to be afraid, things can't get any better...
Good point, and I think it might even work.
If there was ever a case for annonimity on public forums :)
If this industry is so morally bankrupt and self-serving (which I think it has become btw) surely we're better equipped to fight them from a anonymous position whereas they are unable to take it out on specific individuals and punish them as they are appearing to do?
First it was Sean that was pubilically crucified for making a stand (and I know there were others too) and now Ron and others too.
I think it is very clear to all what we're up against with these scum bags.
If ever there was time to dig in and fight back.
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Ow I will write a nice public blog about this and make sure it has perfect SEO to show high in search results. Make sure Chads email is mentioned a few times so that it attracts a lot of spam. ;)
I am with 3 agencies left now, and I dont have much negativity about them so I should be fine for now. 8)
I was going to upload to DT, but I am not sure how this new deal is going to work out so I am holding off.
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Spiteful, vindictive, unethical, immoral, hateful....and above all typical. Good to see them live up to their reputation.
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I opted out, account still active... and yes this is a good example why I for example am anonymous, and not so that I can 'just criticize' people, as some trolls would like to assume.
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Do they pay out money if less than 50 C ?
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Do they pay out money if less than 50 C ?
I had 32 credits at the time, so yes.
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The cowards dont even have the balls to tell me why
Hello Mr XXXXXX,
For various business reasons we decided to close your account. Your final payment has been submitted for payment.
We wish you the best for the future.
Sincerely,
Chad Bridwell
Director of Operations
Fotolia.com
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The cowards dont even have the balls to tell me why
Hello Mr XXXXXX,
For various business reasons we decided to close your account. Your final payment has been submitted for payment.
We wish you the best for the future.
Sincerely,
Chad Bridwell
Director of Operations
Fotolia.com
They stated in the first email it was due to the T&C's, now it's various 'business reasons'.
O'boy can you have some fun with these low-life cowboys.
Their breaching their own terms of practice, don't let them get away with it! Sing it from the rooftops and keep posting on public forums.
Their customers will hear about it and won't like the stink thats being associated with DPC, FT are clearly rattled by what is happening to their scheming master-plan as it's probably 'going south' fast, hence them lashing out in retaliatory fashion.
If they're on the ropes the time is now to go in for the knockout punch and finish them off for good.
And good riddance.
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They are probably scared that under American law if they give you a reason then they might provide you with ammunition for a court case. I believe it is quite standard in US businesses not to get specific.
I think it does show that they are really feeling the effects of the opt-out campaign, which is good. I'm not really surprised that they acted like this, if you look at the real (non-Internet) world, most companies would not continue their relationship with a product supplier who was actively campaigning to undermine their business strategy. After what happened to Sean I'm a little surprised that people are surprised by this, especially with Fotolia's past record of responding nastily to critisim on MSG.
Certainly, if you want to keep your Fotolia account active and you want to campaign here you would be wise to be anonymous - I don't know if it is possible to open a second account to overcome this.
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I think it does show that they are really feeling the effects of the opt-out campaign, which is good. I'm not really surprised that they acted like this...
No? And I'm surprised. If FT (any other agency) feels that is doing something wrong, why not stop it (and say sorry, our mistake)? It just doesn't make sens :) They are very hard to learn, no conclusions...
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Ow I am not surprised, I would expect this to happen sooner or later. I just hope I am the only one they get jiggy with.
I am thinking of going back to anonymity though.
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Wow, how childish of them to do that. Sorry.
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I think it does show that they are really feeling the effects of the opt-out campaign, which is good. I'm not really surprised that they acted like this...
No? And I'm surprised. If FT (any other agency) feels that is doing something wrong, why not stop it (and say sorry, our mistake)? It just doesn't make sens :) They are very hard to learn, no conclusions...
Business isn't really about right or wrong, is it? It's about money. Greed is Good! DPC is designed to make them more money at the expense of everyone else. They have decided to follow a path that pits their interests against ours, so they aren't going to say they are wrong because we are causing them problems. In their eyes, we are wrong if we do anything that hurts a money-making scheme. The Google Drive deal iStock set up was for their benefit, not ours. DT is being coy about the latest "great deal" it's trying to involve us all in.
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Business isn't really about right or wrong, is it?
You could ask - is it good to take care of reputation?
;)
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Business isn't really about right or wrong, is it?
You could ask - is it good to take care of reputation?
;)
I think you will find there are two points of view on that .... one is the Fotolia type of view, the other is the view of companies that you respect.
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Ron, I'm sorry to hear about that. I am not surprised though.
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You have all my sympathy Ron!
I really hate this way to behave.
They are no more than little fascists!
___
I am sorry for you too Anyka.
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I think it does show that they are really feeling the effects of the opt-out campaign, which is good. I'm not really surprised that they acted like this...
No? And I'm surprised. If FT (any other agency) feels that is doing something wrong, why not stop it (and say sorry, our mistake)? It just doesn't make sens :) They are very hard to learn, no conclusions...
I see no indication that they (or any pf the others) feel they are doing anything wrong.
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Sorry to hear this Ron. Not a shocker, I suppose.
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Seems mine is closed too, though I did not receive any e-mail from them.
Fotolia is my second earner. I opted out, but did not delete any images from Fotolia.
You might not be upset Ron, but I am.
No matter how terms and conditions are, it is legal to close an account in this way? I think not. You have done a lot of work for them... think of the hours invested in uploading and keywording, let's say, 10.000 images;in exchange, they were commited to have these images on sale. Then, all of a sudden, they delete all the images, and with them all the work you did for them just because they feel like that.
Get an attorney, sue them and ask for a monetary compensation.
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Thank you guys for all your support. Just know that I dont really care about my account at FT. It just shows that they are still a fox in sheep clothes. I only made 20-40 dollar per month there. So no big deal. I stopped uploading last November when my sales dropped by 50%.
I can now fully focus on writing the EU and keep pestering Chad on email. LOL
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Seems mine is closed too, though I did not receive any e-mail from them.
Fotolia is my second earner. I opted out, but did not delete any images from Fotolia.
You might not be upset Ron, but I am.
No matter how terms and conditions are, it is legal to close an account in this way? I think not. You have done a lot of work for them... think of the hours invested in uploading and keywording, let's say, 10.000 images;in exchange, they were commited to have these images on sale. Then, all of a sudden, they delete all the images, and with them all the work you did for them just because they feel like that.
Get an attorney, sue them and ask for a monetary compensation.
International lawyers are prohibitively expensive.
I wonder how many US-based submitters have been dropped? (I know US lawyers are also very expensive, before you ask.)
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Whow, what a shocker!
I thought after istock created a martyr out of Sean, the agencies had learned that turning against individual contributors in spiteful emotional reactions when it is they themselves that have messed up, is extremely destructive for their reputation.
It only benefits Shutterstock as the "Agency that can be trusted"
This is bad, really shortsighted and bad.
I opted out of DPC, but didnīt delete images from Fotolia. If they offered individual opt ins I probably would consider opting in files that I deem 1 Dollar worthy.
Fotolia made a mistake in the way they opened DPC and took our files without our consent. By targeting individuals they make it clear that they still donīt understand at all why the artists are opting out content.
Everybody understands if someone cheats and uploads stolen content or something like that, that a portfolio will be deleted. But longterm contributors who spend years building and maintaining their portfolios, putting up links on their websites for Fotolia etc
they will now all get "the message".
Looks like opening a second anonymous account on msg will become a necessary option for all artists to be able to discuss freely what is going on in the industry.
The only message they are sending is that Fotolia is not safe. I really donīt understand why anyone would want to do that?
Kicking out Sean, Rob Sylvan, Alex, Ivar, Nuno and probably a few others obviously didnīt help istock recover any business after they created the drama of the Getty Google Deal. Wasnīt that enough to see how NOT to handle a public relation disaster?
Ron and Anyka, I am so sorry. I really donīt understand what their goals are. DPC must be much more important than I thought for their future plans. What will happen to Fotolia? :(
Do they really believe that now there will be more people opting into DPC?
I really donīt understand.
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No matter how terms and conditions are, it is legal to close an account in this way? I think not.
What are the terms and conditions for, then? There may be some terms that are so biased they don't count but I doubt if the right to end a business relationship is among them. Elsewhere, we have Axel looking for lawyers to sue DT because he feels that they have not closed his account the way he wanted.
Sometimes it seems that people here think we should have the right to close our accounts any time we like but those we have the agreement with shouldn't have the right to close the account from their side. It doesn't make sense to me. And hiring a lawyer sounds a very expensive way of finding that contracts can be terminated.
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I am sure I did something to piss them off, I just would like to know what it is. I am well aware that any agency can close my account at any time.
All I am worried about is that they keep selling my stuff or their affiliates keep selling my stuff, without me getting any money for it.
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They are probably scared that under American law if they give you a reason then they might provide you with ammunition for a court case. I believe it is quite standard in US businesses not to get specific.
I think it does show that they are really feeling the effects of the opt-out campaign, which is good. I'm not really surprised that they acted like this, if you look at the real (non-Internet) world, most companies would not continue their relationship with a product supplier who was actively campaigning to undermine their business strategy. After what happened to Sean I'm a little surprised that people are surprised by this, especially with Fotolia's past record of responding nastily to critisim on MSG.
Certainly, if you want to keep your Fotolia account active and you want to campaign here you would be wise to be anonymous - I don't know if it is possible to open a second account to overcome this.
+1
I have received considerable criticism on these boards for anonymity. Much of that criticism has come from Ron and friends. My reason for anonymity is in good part due to the fact that I have watched this same scenario play out in the past at various agencies. In my opinion there are very good reasons for anonymity. We need to be able to discuss business honestly without fear of retaliation on the part of the micros.
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In the UK, there is such a thing as unfair contracts, and unfair waivers etc, so the mere fact that you signed a paper doesn't always mean you're held to it or that the other party can ride roughshod over you.
But maybe that doesn't apply in the US, where having a signature seems to count for much more. ([?] I don't know.)
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In the UK, there is such a thing as unfair contracts, and unfair waivers etc, so the mere fact that you signed a paper doesn't always mean you're held to it or that the other party can ride roughshod over you.
But maybe that doesn't apply in the US, where having a signature seems to count for much more. ([?] I don't know.)
Do you mean that in USA someone signs a contract allowing another one to be his master and to have him as a slave is legal? (it's an example)
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Wish you all the best at the other agencys you are with Ron.
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In the UK, there is such a thing as unfair contracts, and unfair waivers etc, so the mere fact that you signed a paper doesn't always mean you're held to it or that the other party can ride roughshod over you.
But maybe that doesn't apply in the US, where having a signature seems to count for much more. ([?] I don't know.)
Do you mean that in USA someone signs a contract allowing another one to be his master and to have him as a slave is legal? (it's an example)
I know nothing about US law, as I said.
It seems to be that signing a waiver is far more likely to bind you in the US than here.
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I am not going to get into an argument with Gbalex, but my criticism is not about you being anonymous, but for the things you say/claim whilst being anonymous.
And there are people here who are anonymous for valid reasons, but at the same time use that anonymity to insult and troll. I can point them out, but I wont.
I used to be anonymous, but figured it would only be fair to make myself known to the community here, but I might reverse that decision now, as some others did lately.
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Do you mean that in USA someone signs a contract allowing another one to be his master and to have him as a slave is legal? (it's an example)
I'm pretty sure there would be laws trumping any such contract - maybe even something in their Constitution - but a contract that says both parties have the right to terminate it at any time for any reason is perfectly normal. Indeed, having one side banned from terminating it would be closer to a master-slave relationship.
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I am sure I did something to piss them off, I just would like to know what it is. I am well aware that any agency can close my account at any time.
All I am worried about is that they keep selling my stuff or their affiliates keep selling my stuff, without me getting any money for it.
I bet they got a call from one of those agencies, or a related agency.
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Seems mine is closed too, though I did not receive any e-mail from them.
Fotolia is my second earner. I opted out, but did not delete any images from Fotolia.
You might not be upset Ron, but I am.
Sorry to hear. I hope lots of sales for you in other companies.
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Anyone else with closed accounts?
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Anyone else with closed accounts?
I just checked and still open. But I sent several nasty grams to them last week and opted out my images, so anything can happen. I am in the same boat as Ron, meaning I don't make sh!t there with 3000 images, so losing FT isn't a big deal. But why Ankya? Is it that they knew she made a lot from FT? I know of another high end photographer who had like 8,000 images there and they closed his account because he was critical of their policies. It was a big chunk of income he lost as I recall.
Oh and for those of you who want to voluntarily close your accounts at FT, do it smarter. Deactivate a few images at a time, verify they fall off partner sites, kill some more, verify, etc. Then close your accounts in totality. You can make up any excuse. I sold the right to these images, putting them in RM, etc.
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I'm not sure mine is really closed. It's blocked, and my images are gone. I do not know if this is permanent or not, as I have not received any message from Fotolia yet.
If there's no message in the next few days, I'll contact support.
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I'm not sure mine is really closed. It's blocked, and my images are gone. I do not know if this is permanent or not, as I have not received any message from Fotolia yet.
If there's no message in the next few days, I'll contact support.
Well you have a fantastic port and they would be stupid to kill it.
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I'm not sure mine is really closed. It's blocked, and my images are gone. I do not know if this is permanent or not, as I have not received any message from Fotolia yet.
If there's no message in the next few days, I'll contact support.
I`ll contact support right now. Using the Opt-out button in the account settings and publicly stating so should not be a reason for a closed account. I haven`t seen any specifically critical post from you towards FT, but I do not read everything
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I'm not sure mine is really closed. It's blocked, and my images are gone. I do not know if this is permanent or not, as I have not received any message from Fotolia yet.
If there's no message in the next few days, I'll contact support.
Well you have a fantastic port and they would be stupid to kill it.
Don't we already know that they're stupid?
@Anyka - I'm sorry you'll have to suffer a big financial hit.
@ the others - you're probably better off out of there.
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In the UK, there is such a thing as unfair contracts, and unfair waivers etc, so the mere fact that you signed a paper doesn't always mean you're held to it or that the other party can ride roughshod over you.
But maybe that doesn't apply in the US, where having a signature seems to count for much more. ([?] I don't know.)
1) they ask you us to sign a contract to seal a deal
2) you we sign the contract
3) they change the deal
4) and you we should accept that?
I think that in none country it could be legal.
Even if in the contract there is a clause saying they can change the deal without our permission (this should not be legally acceptable too)
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Anyone else with closed accounts?
Looks like FT is doing huge favour to their contributors ;)
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I'm not sure mine is really closed. It's blocked, and my images are gone. I do not know if this is permanent or not, as I have not received any message from Fotolia yet.
If there's no message in the next few days, I'll contact support.
I'm so sorry - both for you and Ron - but I'm not surprised.
I know I've said several times that Fotolia threatened to close my account back in June 2008 for organizing contributors to protest the lousy deal when they introduced subscriptions. They backed off then but closed it after I went exclusive and refused to have me back - actually wrote in an e-mail that they did not want to do business with me - when I returned to independence in 2011. They shut down Bobby Deal's account too (he was pretty blunt in his public criticism of them).
Things are different now - largely iStock's free fall - but even without Fotolia, by the 4th quarter of 2012 I had matched my 4th quarter 2010 exclusive income. It's no consolation in the short term I know.
Back in 2008 when Chad passed on the threat from his bosses, he said in an e-mail that he was a nice guy, just trying to give me the lay of the land. But here he still is, putting his names to letters that are trying to bully everyone by harming a few chosen individuals. I find the attempt to separate personal nice-ness from the actions of one's employer done under his name pretty hard to swallow.
What Fotolia reminds me most of are the businesses a century ago hiring Pinkerton's thugs to beat up union organizers and fire at strikers. And Getty's public hanging of Sean and Rob Sylvan.
Fotolia should be ashamed of itself. They know no shame, but they've scraped off any remaining veneer of respectability and ethics with this move.
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https://twitter.com/joannsnover/status/472025923135741952
Other than avoiding libel, there's not much Fotolia can do to me by hollering about their actions. If I get time I'll do a blog post later too.
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I'm not sure mine is really closed. It's blocked, and my images are gone. I do not know if this is permanent or not, as I have not received any message from Fotolia yet.
If there's no message in the next few days, I'll contact support.
I'm so sorry - both for you and Ron - but I'm not surprised.
I know I've said several times that Fotolia threatened to close my account back in June 2008 for organizing contributors to protest the lousy deal when they introduced subscriptions. They backed off then but closed it after I went exclusive and refused to have me back - actually wrote in an e-mail that they did not want to do business with me - when I returned to independence in 2011. They shut down Bobby Deal's account too (he was pretty blunt in his public criticism of them).
Things are different now - largely iStock's free fall - but even without Fotolia, by the 4th quarter of 2012 I had matched my 4th quarter 2010 exclusive income. It's no consolation in the short term I know.
Back in 2008 when Chad passed on the threat from his bosses, he said in an e-mail that he was a nice guy, just trying to give me the lay of the land. But here he still is, putting his names to letters that are trying to bully everyone by harming a few chosen individuals. I find the attempt to separate personal nice-ness from the actions of one's employer done under his name pretty hard to swallow.
What Fotolia reminds me most of are the businesses a century ago hiring Pinkerton's thugs to beat up union organizers and fire at strikers. And Getty's public hanging of Sean and Rob Sylvan.
Fotolia should be ashamed of itself. They know no shame, but they've scraped off any remaining veneer of respectability and ethics with this move.
http://tinyurl.com/owg724t (http://tinyurl.com/owg724t)
Hmmm. I wonder why would they risk alienating a lot of their existing contributors to go after what appears to be a fairly small group of new contributors?
And the fact that maybe only a small percentage of that small group will bite.
Why the would risk alienating ther existing contributors?
That's simple.
Because they have done time and time again in the past without any noticeable impact on their bottom line. Sure, there will be some ranting and complains in the forums, maybe even a few contributors may leave, but after a few weeks it's back to business as usual...
That's why they'll do it.
SOP for Fotolia is if you complain loudly about the way they treat you as a contributor they delete your account and deny you any further referral earnings even when you still have 2 years of referral earnings left from referring top contributors to them.
Fair and honest treatment of the contributor base has never been part of the company credo. I spent many hours consulting (for free) back and forth with Oleg when he was first launching FT and in my personal opinion in the end as in the beginning he never showed any true concern for anything other then his own profit position in the operation. The contributors are simply a means to an end for him and that end is personal profit. Of course we all get into business with profit as the goal but in the case of FT it would seem to be the only true aspiration of the company. I expect that were I to sit down and extrapolate my potential earnings at FT over the past year had I not been railroaded off the site for standing up for contributor rights that I have lost out on $12,000 or more in royalty and referral earnings that would have come as the result of the elevated ranking which I was denied in the last ranking fiasco. Fotolia has a long and well documented track history of mistreating their contributor base yet the staus quo is maintained there. This change will no doubt go forward as has every other change in the history of the agency. In the end a handful will suffer the closing of their accounts and involuntary deleting of their portfolios and after a short time the roar will quiet and it will be business as usual at Fotolia until they announce their next scheme meant to further trample the rights of their contributor base.
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What about the Russian artists? Are they affected as well or is this action focussed on msg?
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https://twitter.com/joannsnover/status/472025923135741952
Other than avoiding libel, there's not much Fotolia can do to me by hollering about their actions. If I get time I'll do a blog post later too.
I'll blog about it too, and retweet that too when I get home :)
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Wow. This is definitely a case for keeping anonymous on this forum. Sorry to read about that... :P
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Wow. This is definitely a case for keeping anonymous on this forum. Sorry to read about that... :P
anonymous is okay as long as we don't troll.
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Wow. This is definitely a case for keeping anonymous on this forum. Sorry to read about that... :P
anonymous is okay as long as we don't troll.
Agreed.
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I think its a combination of things, I was a gnat in their fur annoying them and they squashed me.
I have been in Matts hair for a while, he probably had enough of me
I have contacted these guys http://wallsheaven.de (http://wallsheaven.de) asking them where they got my images from
I have been actively fighting DPC by sending letters to the EU and other parties
I have been tweeting about boycotting Fotolia
I would ban myself too.
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I always thought FT is the worst of all (yes worse than iStock/Getty) I think they proved it finally!
Really sorry for you Ron and Anyka time to fight them harder.
Any ideas for more actions?
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I think its a combination of things, I was a gnat in their fur annoying them and they squashed me.
I have been in Matts hair for a while, he probably had enough of me
I have contacted these guys [url]http://wallsheaven.de[/url] ([url]http://wallsheaven.de[/url]) asking them where they got my images from
I have been actively fighting DPC by sending letters to the EU and other parties
I have been tweeting about boycotting Fotolia
I would ban myself too.
I think that humanly you were in your right to do it Ron.
If we let these companies sit on our heads it is the end of everything.
And you can continue the fight, they cannot ban you another time!
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I have contacted these guys [url]http://wallsheaven.de[/url] ([url]http://wallsheaven.de[/url]) asking them where they got my images from
Off-Topic: Where i can find the list of agencies partner sites?
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I have contacted these guys [url]http://wallsheaven.de[/url] ([url]http://wallsheaven.de[/url]) asking them where they got my images from
Off-Topic: Where i can find the list of agencies partner sites?
50 for FT
http://www.microstockgroup.com/general-stock-discussion/a-list-of-partner-programs/ (http://www.microstockgroup.com/general-stock-discussion/a-list-of-partner-programs/)
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Do you mean that in USA someone signs a contract allowing another one to be his master and to have him as a slave is legal? (it's an example)
I'm pretty sure there would be laws trumping any such contract - maybe even something in their Constitution - but a contract that says both parties have the right to terminate it at any time for any reason is perfectly normal. Indeed, having one side banned from terminating it would be closer to a master-slave relationship.
Yes/No. The US Constitution is about the relationship between a free citizen and the Federal Govt. It restricts the scope of the Federal Govt. My understanding of it is that beyond this it does not specifically enshrine rights.
The Constitution, for example, prohibits The Congress from enacting any law which inhibits freedom of speech. But two parties can voluntarily sign a legally binding NDA. The govt is not involved.
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I have contacted these guys [url]http://wallsheaven.de[/url] ([url]http://wallsheaven.de[/url]) asking them where they got my images from
The images are sourced from fotolia for sure.
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I think its a combination of things, I was a gnat in their fur annoying them and they squashed me.
I have been in Matts hair for a while, he probably had enough of me
I have contacted these guys [url]http://wallsheaven.de[/url] ([url]http://wallsheaven.de[/url]) asking them where they got my images from
I have been actively fighting DPC by sending letters to the EU and other parties
I have been tweeting about boycotting Fotolia
I would ban myself too.
I think that humanly you were in your right to do it Ron.
If we let these companies sit on our heads it is the end of everything.
And you can continue the fight, they cannot ban you another time!
you can continue the fight, they cannot ban you another time!
+1
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I think its a combination of things, I was a gnat in their fur annoying them and they squashed me.
I have been in Matts hair for a while, he probably had enough of me
I have contacted these guys [url]http://wallsheaven.de[/url] ([url]http://wallsheaven.de[/url]) asking them where they got my images from
I have been actively fighting DPC by sending letters to the EU and other parties
I have been tweeting about boycotting Fotolia
I would ban myself too.
Probably more that list than anything said here - pretty upfront & being anonymous here would not have helped. Bad action from FT but not surprising.
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People who post anonymously have less credibility. That's all there is to it. I don't have a problem with people doing that, but I have no frame of reference to judge their opinions.
For example, if the next big boycott is against Shutterstock and people with 50 images on there are telling me to delete my port because they did too, I'm going to call BS.
Sometimes you're going to get backlash when people know who you are, but that makes you watch what you say as well. It's a matter of accountability and being an adult. If I say something, I stand by it. Now if Fotolia banned my friend, Ron, for his forum postings, that's a * cheap shot and quite petty. I don't think they'd do that, but I could be wrong.
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People who post anonymously have less credibility. That's all there is to it. I don't have a problem with people doing that, but I have no frame of reference to judge their opinions.
For example, if the next big boycott is against Shutterstock and people with 50 images on there are telling me to delete my port because they did too, I'm going to call BS.
Sometimes you're going to get backlash when people know who you are, but that makes you watch what you say as well. It's a matter of accountability and being an adult. If I say something, I stand by it. Now if Fotolia banned my friend, Ron, for his forum postings, that's a * cheap shot and quite petty. I don't think they'd do that, but I could be wrong.
Fotolia "banned" me for public forum postings and nothing more. Likewise Bobby Deal. Why do you think that what they just did to Ron is any different?
It's clearly a very hard thing to see an agency that makes you money behave very, very badly, but you have to be clear headed about how it could just as easily be you next as any of the rest of us.
I don't blame anyone for being anonymous here because of Fotolia. You can spot the trolls a mile off and ignore them.
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If it's just stock photographer forum posts, then I think it's petty.
But if I were running a site and people were posting negative stuff on my Twitter feed where I'm trying to market my business, that'd be a different story.
Also, y'all need to be careful. I have no idea how litigious these stock companies are. Hate to see someone hit with a libel suit. You'd be OK in a U.S. court, but some other countries have libel laws that are much more favorable to plantiffs in libel cases.
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If it's just stock photographer forum posts, then I think it's petty.
But if I were running a site and people were posting negative stuff on my Twitter feed where I'm trying to market my business, that'd be a different story.
Also, y'all need to be careful. I have no idea how litigious these stock companies are. Hate to see someone hit with a libel suit. You'd be OK in a U.S. court, but some other countries have libel laws that are much more favorable to plantiffs in libel cases.
It's only libel if it's false.
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Hypothetically, if you were to say one of these sites was 'stealing' from photographers or 'ripping off' photographers or some other similar language, would that be true or false? All I'm saying is be careful what language you use. Make sure it's true and not up for interpretation.
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I'd love to see the discovery documents in a case about if a site was ripping off photographers.
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For example, if the next big boycott
"The next big boycott." Isn't it great that we can act together like that? Who'd a thunk it?
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blog
http://www.digitalbristles.com/first-and-last-warning/ (http://www.digitalbristles.com/first-and-last-warning/)
tweet
https://twitter.com/joannsnover/status/472278753549115392 (https://twitter.com/joannsnover/status/472278753549115392)
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^ Most excellent :)
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Good stuff, Jo Ann. Very well said.
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I can understand why they kicked me out, but hadn't they been the crooks they are in the first place I wouldnt have kicked up a shitstorm. Action = reaction, I fully accept the consequences, but thats easily said as they werent a big earner for me.
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^ still it doesn't make it right. Any corporation that uses it's 'muscle' to try administer punitive actions against a specific individual sucks.
With their actions Fotolia have firmly established themselves as the new bottom feeders in this business, and that's saying something when you consider some of the other scum-bag corps out there.
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^ still it doesn't make it right. Any corporation that uses it's 'muscle' to try administer punitive actions against a specific individual sucks.
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If these corporations were not corporations but countries we could call them dictatorships
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Besides the topic, but what do you expect? Democracy in a private entreprise? There is no such thing. You don't get to vote who your boss is. You freewillingly join an entreprise, sign a contract, do what your boss asks you to do, resign if you don't want to do it or get fired, sue them if the ask is illegal. It never was an it will never be a democracy.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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If you had read my comments, you would have known I was expecting it in someway. I am not playing the victim card in any way.
PS: I have emailed Chad about 5 times to get a reason, but he is ignoring the question which I find childish. Big bad Fotolia dont have the balls to tell me why. That I find more annoying than anything else. LOL.
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I read the story and I feel for you. I only replied to the dictatorship comment made by Beppe Grillo. Besides the topic.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Besides the topic, but what do you expect? Democracy in a private entreprise? There is no such thing. You don't get to vote who your boss is. You freewillingly join an entreprise, sign a contract, do what your boss asks you to do, resign if you don't want to do it or get fired, sue them if the ask is illegal. It never was an it will never be a democracy.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
The frustration is very heavy, and beppes comment was really around behaviors with our content. We can pull that content....sometimes fully...but the result is loss of income and for some of us that's important. Most if us are very angry that FT is shunning their suppliers in exchange for cheating practices. What is cheating you may ask? How about calling DPC a subscription site when it is od but they pay us sub prices. We have every right to vent and share our frustrations and call them for what they are.
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If these corporations were not corporations but countries we could call them dictatorships
Besides the topic, but what do you expect? Democracy in a private enterprise? There is no such thing. You don't get to vote who your boss is. You free-willingly join an enterprise, sign a contract, do what your boss asks you to do, resign if you don't want to do it or get fired, sue them if the ask is illegal. It never was an it will never be a democracy.
I couldn't quote from this Tapatalk app, so here is the missing quote from a PC
Not that I care, but it looks funny to see -6 for an obviously true statement. All "corporations" exercise their "muscles" against individuals since the age of time, in all societies. This is called downsizing, re-organization, firing, dismissal, etc.
Nobody likes these things, but this doesn't make my statement false. This is why I don't understand people giving a minus to a true statement. >:( What do you expect "minus people"? Lies that make you feel good? :o
One more time, I am sorry to see Ron being punished for speaking up.
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If these corporations were not corporations but countries we could call them dictatorships
Besides the topic, but what do you expect? Democracy in a private enterprise? There is no such thing. You don't get to vote who your boss is. You free-willingly join an enterprise, sign a contract, do what your boss asks you to do, resign if you don't want to do it or get fired, sue them if the ask is illegal. It never was an it will never be a democracy.
I couldn't quote from this Tapatak app, so here is the missing quote from a PC
Not that I care, but it looks funny to see -6 for an obviously true statement. All "corporations" exercise their "muscles" against individuals since the age of time, in all societies. This is called downsizing, re-organization, firing, dismissal, etc.
Nobody likes these things, but this doesn't make my statement false. This is why I don't understand people giving a minus to a true statement. >:( What do you expect "minus people"? Lies that make you feel good? :o
One more time, I am sorry to see Ron being punished for speaking up.
FYI I didn't vote you down.
But I would also say that there is a reciprocal to your scenario. It's the company stealing from and manipulating their suppliers. There should be legal action against Fotolia but most of us, if not all, do not have the financial means to tackle this and Fotolia knows it, so Oleg keeps smoking his f@cking cigars and laughing at the situation. By the way by opting in all images into a completely new site should technically have shut down FT legally I believe. By not informing ALL contributors of an opt out option he is forcing our content into a scheme we did not sign up for. He's a crook and this discussion should be about how to stop him, shut down DPC and make restitution to contributors who were blindly forced into this scheme and to this day have no idea their images are being used.
All that you say is true, though. But this really isn't a case of a corporation parting ways with a supplier, it's a corporation trying to punish suppliers for exposing corruption.....FOTOLIA's corruption.
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FYI I didn't vote you down.
But I would also say that there is a reciprocal to your scenario. It's the company stealing from and manipulating their suppliers. There should be legal action against Fotolia but most of us, if not all, do not have the financial means to tackle this and Fotolia knows it, so Oleg keeps smoking his f@cking cigars and laughing at the situation. By the way by opting in all images into a completely new site should technically have shut down FT legally I believe. By not informing ALL contributors of an opt out option he is forcing our content into a scheme we did not sign up for. He's a crook and this discussion should be about how to stop him, shut down DPC and make restitution to contributors who were blindly forced into this scheme and to this day have no idea their images are being used.
All that you say is true, though. But this really isn't a case of a corporation parting ways with a supplier, it's a corporation trying to punish suppliers for exposing corruption.....FOTOLIA's corruption.
Right! And I'm with you on this.
But when it comes to breaking the relation with a partner, there is nothing really Fotolia specific. All companies do this, either according to a contractual clauses, or not.
If not, the individual can always sue the company independently or through an union, if part of it.
I've fired once a a guy because he came in the office arrogantly wearing a competitor's t-shirt. He refused to go home and change it, arguing that he lives in a "free country".
I'm sorry, a company is not a democracy.
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Fotolia paid my earnings. Quicker then any other time they paid out. I guess they really wanted to get rid of me. LOL.
Chad still not telling me why. Maybe I should email these guys and ask:
[email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
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Fotolia paid my earnings. Quicker then any other time they paid out. I guess they really wanted to get rid of me. LOL.
Chad still not telling me why. Maybe I should email these guys and ask:
[email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
Nice list. I'm sure mat could let you know.
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Fotolia paid my earnings. Quicker then any other time they paid out. I guess they really wanted to get rid of me. LOL.
Chad still not telling me why. Maybe I should email these guys and ask:
[email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
Haha, we could also e-mail these guys our opinions, that DPC is bad and unnecessary idea and they should not support it :D
Just to keep them entertained.
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^ still it doesn't make it right. Any corporation that uses it's 'muscle' to try administer punitive actions against a specific individual sucks.
With their actions Fotolia have firmly established themselves as the new bottom feeders in this business, and that's saying something when you consider some of the other scum-bag corps out there.
At this point I can only hope that Fotolia reaps what it sows. Can you imagine the fun we'd have with the thread....FOTOLIA CLOSES ITS DOORS. And poor Oleg would have to find a way to live on his meager multiple millions of dollars while his employees are now unemployed.
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If you had read my comments, you would have known I was expecting it in someway. I am not playing the victim card in any way.
PS: I have emailed Chad about 5 times to get a reason, but he is ignoring the question which I find childish. Big bad Fotolia dont have the balls to tell me why. That I find more annoying than anything else. LOL.
Did IS tell you why they close your account?
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No, I told IS why I closed my account there. Skumzak.
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Fotolia paid my earnings. Quicker then any other time they paid out. I guess they really wanted to get rid of me. LOL.
Chad still not telling me why. Maybe I should email these guys and ask:
[email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
Haha, we could also e-mail these guys our opinions, that DPC is bad and unnecessary idea and they should not support it :D
Just to keep them entertained.
Would they care or listen? FT is a dictatorship not trying to pretend to be a friendly agency. Money makes them all powerful.
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Fotolia paid my earnings. Quicker then any other time they paid out.
How long did you wait? I'm waiting now.
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Fotolia paid my earnings. Quicker then any other time they paid out.
How long did you wait? I'm waiting now.
Maybe 10 days or so
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Fotolia paid my earnings. Quicker then any other time they paid out.
How long did you wait? I'm waiting now.
Almost 2 months but I had sales and 1000s of files, not 600 like Ron. Worth the wait to leave FT.
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I don't know what to think - had a phone call from FT, they asked me about the reason why I left and if I can come back! :o ::) ???
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I don't know what to think - had a phone call from FT, they asked me about the reason why I left and if I can come back! :o ::) ???
They are desperate. They play nice by sending these emails like they "truly care" but are STILL GLADLY GOING TO RIP YOU OFF LIKE THIS MODEL ORIGINALLY INTENDED TO DO. If you are seeking opinions to your email, avoid them like the plague.
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I don't know what to think - had a phone call from FT, they asked me about the reason why I left and if I can come back! :o ::) ???
In almost every other case, I would think of this as a good sign. A business that wants to know why, if they messed up, things went wrong and if there's something they could do to improve is often a good one. These are the sorts of behaviors typically seen in someone that cares about the business, its long term prospects and that it meets its own high standards for performance.
I think that seeing how a business handles a messed up situation often tells you more about them than when everything is humming along smoothly.
However...
When a company has a long track record of just about every bad thing you can imagine in dealing with their suppliers (i.e. us) - the biggest and most recent sign being that they told contributors initially that they had to leave Fotolia to opt out of the DPC - I'd be inclined to view such contact negatively.
If a business only does the right thing under severe pressure, once the pressure's off, they'll likely revert to type and start mistreating suppliers again.
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They owe me 4,62 dollars since several weeks. Have not heard one word about it.
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They said it should be paid in one week, but can take up to two weeks sometimes. I'm already waiting 11 days, they are not hurry to much.
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They closed my account with no appeal or recourse, and they kept the money they owed me. Since there's no shortage of photographers, I guess that's one way to add to your bottom line. :P
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They closed my account with no appeal or recourse, and they kept the money they owed me. Since there's no shortage of photographers, I guess that's one way to add to your bottom line. :P
Why did they close your account if you don't mind me asking or did you close it and they didn't push back and ask why?
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It took my a few mails to close my account at Fotolia. They appeared to misunderstand me and thought I wanted out of DPC. They wanted to know what they had done that made me want to close. Finally they understood I really wanted out of Fotolia and closed my account. Bye, Bye!
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They closed my account with no appeal or recourse, and they kept the money they owed me. Since there's no shortage of photographers, I guess that's one way to add to your bottom line. :P
Why did they close your account if you don't mind me asking or did you close it and they didn't push back and ask why?
A model with whom I had shot a few years ago changed her mind for some unknown reason and demanded that I remove all photos of her from the stock sites. When I refused, she contacted the stock sites, all of which except one referred her to me as the photographer, since I had uploaded a valid, signed, and witnessed model release. That one was Fotolia. They simply closed my account! I asked if they'd reopen my account if I removed the photos of the model in question, and they said they would not. They said the only way they'd reopen my account is if the model withdrew her request. They even acknowledged the validity of the model release, but it made no difference to them. Thus, any photographer who has photographs of people on fotolia is in a very tenuous position.
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They're a total disgrace. What a cowboy outfit Fotolia is :)
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They're a total disgrace. What a cowboy outfit Fotolia is :)
I am waiting to see how the promotion of DPC affects FT. They clearly are desperate to gain back share. You can see it by all the constant last minute changes they make. The most laughable is adding the opt out. My guess is that they learned the law wasn't on their side and had to add it, or that they felt it would create that warm and fuzzy for contributors......but unfortunately it was well after the fact and done as a result of this forum. I would give you all raises if I could!!! :)
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Don't trust Fotolia, that's for sure. I am also anonym in this forum, because I am afraid.
Some years ago, I had some questions about something (tax related), so I politely asked in the support section. They answered with a standard answer, with not really reading my question and definitely not answering it. So I asked again, politely. I received the same standard answer, not about my problem. I finally got a little angry and asked again...not very polite, I have to admit. But I wanted to get noticed without getting again the same wrong answer. I also told the story in the official forum, that the people working in the support-section are not really helping, maybe they are idiots or so.
Next thing was, I was banned from the forum and got an E-Mail, that I want to delete my account, I should name the paypal account. I apologised, because I am exclusive on Fotolia and make a good income on this site - I can't afford to be kicked out. So they didn't closed my account, but I'm still banned from the forum.
I certainly reacted not professional and good to their unprofessionalism. I shouldn't get angry, thats true. But their reaction also just shows, they piss on you. No matter how much you make (and they get more than 50% of it
) they don't care about you, they don't listen to you and don't take you seriously. The one thing I learned about Fotolia in this matter is: Don't trust them. The next lowering of your income will come. The next change of their terms will come (against you of course).
The only reason why I'm still working "with" them is, because I don't have the time right now to re upload all my images on another site. But sooner or later I probably have to do it. Maybe they kick me out, maybe they lower the income more, or change the search algorithm...I don't know yet *g*
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With such a specific story and Fotolia personnel present on this forum, you might have given away your identity.
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With such a specific story and Fotolia personnel present on this forum, you might have given away your identity.
This may not be such a unique story. Perhaps it happened to others too.
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I hadn't gotten a sale at FT in a few days (very odd) when I check today my account has "Blocked" next to my Rank Icon.
I tried searching for my images but apparently they have been deleted as well.
I have received no notice from them of their action, but I can imagine it has something to do with the 150+ emails I sent out to contributors urging them to opt out of DPC. Obviously I sent one to a loyal FT minion who outed me to the PTB.
Oh well - fun while it lasted - I'll be out a couple hundred a month but feels good to be done with them.
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Still waiting for my money. How can I trust agency that says I'll be paid in 1 week or it may take to two weeks, but waiting third now with no "sorry for late"...
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I hadn't gotten a sale at FT in a few days (very odd) when I check today my account has "Blocked" next to my Rank Icon.
I tried searching for my images but apparently they have been deleted as well.
I have received no notice from them of their action, but I can imagine it has something to do with the 150+ emails I sent out to contributors urging them to opt out of DPC. Obviously I sent one to a loyal FT minion who outed me to the PTB.
Oh well - fun while it lasted - I'll be out a couple hundred a month but feels good to be done with them.
Welcome to the dark side, PhotoBomb. I too was excommunicated. And I am very happy I am no longer affiliated with such an unethical agency. I may now make a little less each month, but the warm and fuzzy I have now as a result of our separation far outweighs the loss of revenue. To be honest, IT'S THEIR LOSS, not mine.
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Update:
I sent FT a message asking why.
They replied, rather quickly, that the issue was being escalated to a higher level for response.
I got a 2nd email telling me I had a new message in my account and to login to view.
Went to log into my acct but I am now not able to login.
Sent another message via contact us to ask them to forward me their response or let me login to read it.
We'll see what happens.
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I hadn't gotten a sale at FT in a few days (very odd) when I check today my account has "Blocked" next to my Rank Icon.
I tried searching for my images but apparently they have been deleted as well.
I have received no notice from them of their action, but I can imagine it has something to do with the 150+ emails I sent out to contributors urging them to opt out of DPC. Obviously I sent one to a loyal FT minion who outed me to the PTB.
Oh well - fun while it lasted - I'll be out a couple hundred a month but feels good to be done with them.
If you still have those 150+ e-mail addresses, you could always let them know what happens to photographers who try to protect their interests at Fotolia.
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Don't trust Fotolia, that's for sure. I am also anonym in this forum, because I am afraid.
Some years ago, I had some questions about something (tax related), so I politely asked in the support section. They answered with a standard answer, with not really reading my question and definitely not answering it. So I asked again, politely. I received the same standard answer, not about my problem. I finally got a little angry and asked again...not very polite, I have to admit. But I wanted to get noticed without getting again the same wrong answer. I also told the story in the official forum, that the people working in the support-section are not really helping, maybe they are idiots or so.
I remember in 2010? when the question of US tax reporting was introduced. Support was worse than useless and gave completely wrong advice about which form was required for European residents. That little farce involved some submitters in costs to obtain notarized copies of forms they never needed in the first place. At that point, I decided never again to have anything to do with their 'support' which I reckon, in reality, was probably 'Son of HAL9000' installed somewhere in Mumbai. ;D
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Don't trust Fotolia, that's for sure. I am also anonym in this forum, because I am afraid.
Some years ago, I had some questions about something (tax related), so I politely asked in the support section. They answered with a standard answer, with not really reading my question and definitely not answering it. So I asked again, politely. I received the same standard answer, not about my problem. I finally got a little angry and asked again...not very polite, I have to admit. But I wanted to get noticed without getting again the same wrong answer. I also told the story in the official forum, that the people working in the support-section are not really helping, maybe they are idiots or so.
I remember in 2010? when the question of US tax reporting was introduced. Support was worse than useless and gave completely wrong advice about which form was required for European residents. That little farce involved some submitters in costs to obtain notarized copies of forms they never needed in the first place. At that point, I decided never again to have anything to do with their 'support' which I reckon, in reality, was probably 'Son of HAL9000' installed somewhere in Mumbai. ;D
I'm not saying this in excuse for Fotolia's poor support, but to be fair a lot of sites gave wrong advice about the (supposed) need for an ITIN for foreigners on that occasion. Poor support is a constant across the board in microstock.
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I hadn't gotten a sale at FT in a few days (very odd) when I check today my account has "Blocked" next to my Rank Icon.
I tried searching for my images but apparently they have been deleted as well.
I have received no notice from them of their action, but I can imagine it has something to do with the 150+ emails I sent out to contributors urging them to opt out of DPC. Obviously I sent one to a loyal FT minion who outed me to the PTB.
Oh well - fun while it lasted - I'll be out a couple hundred a month but feels good to be done with them.
Silly move from Fotolia. Now you can continue the campaign against DPC just as before, as they can't do anything else to you, no more risk. Yet your interests of being against DPC didn't get any lesser. (Actually it being against DPC is the interest of all contributors who have images on other sites...)