Quote from: Wilm on June 23, 2022, 15:40

Quote from: cascoly on June 23, 2022, 14:32

RPD is irrelevant -- i'd rather have a low RPD for a site earning $100/mo than a high RPD that generates $10/mo.  actual income is what matters.

for me, SS still outperforms AS by 2-3x every month (and canva now rivals SS most months with their su bscription distirubtion payments)

Sorry, I have to disagree. It does play a big role if you have significantly more downloads at one agency than at another - but the significantly more downloads only bring in a fifth of the revenue. Because at the agency with the significantly more downloads and the significantly lower revenue, money is earned at my expense, which arrives at the agency, but not at me.....

we agree because you're shifting the goalposts now to include # of DL which is not part of RPD,  RPD alone tells you nothing  - it's the actual income that matters - it can come from either high RPD & few DL or low RPD and many DL - therefore RPD is irrelevant as a measure

cascoly,

for me, RPD is to the microstock business what hourly wages are to industry or the service sector.

And, of course, you're right: if you work 80 hours a week for $10, you'll have double that in your bank account at the end of the month than if you work 10 hours a week for $40.

But in the microstock business, we're heading toward the point where soon you'll have to work 24 hours 7 days a week to get to the income you used to earn with one-tenth the work. That's sick. And not common anywhere in industry or the service sector.

And that's why the RPD is a very definitive factor for me. It shows us how "healthy" or how "sick" our business is. It's an indication of which agency is "a fair employer."

Those who, with a lot of work, manage to increase revenues, must realize that not so long ago they would have earned four times as much.

Everyone talks about and is afraid of inflation. In microstock, inflation has been devastating for years! And at some point, even the most diligent contributor runs out of energy to make any more increases. You can't feed the beast forever. At some point it will eat you.

Quote from: cascoly on June 24, 2022, 04:32

Quote from: Wilm on June 23, 2022, 15:40

Quote from: cascoly on June 23, 2022, 14:32

RPD is irrelevant -- i'd rather have a low RPD for a site earning $100/mo than a high RPD that generates $10/mo.  actual income is what matters.

for me, SS still outperforms AS by 2-3x every month (and canva now rivals SS most months with their su bscription distirubtion payments)

Sorry, I have to disagree. It does play a big role if you have significantly more downloads at one agency than at another - but the significantly more downloads only bring in a fifth of the revenue. Because at the agency with the significantly more downloads and the significantly lower revenue, money is earned at my expense, which arrives at the agency, but not at me.....

we agree because you're shifting the goalposts now to include # of DL which is not part of RPD,  RPD alone tells you nothing  - it's the actual income that matters - it can come from either high RPD & few DL or low RPD and many DL - therefore RPD is irrelevant as a measure

cascoly,

for me, RPD is to the microstock business what hourly wages are to industry or the service sector.

And, of course, you're right: if you work 80 hours a week for $10, you'll have double that in your bank account at the end of the month than if you work 10 hours a week for $40.

But in the microstock business, we're heading toward the point where soon you'll have to work 24 hours 7 days a week to get to the income you used to earn with one-tenth the work. That's sick. And not common anywhere in industry or the service sector.

And that's why the RPD is a very definitive factor for me. It shows us how "healthy" or how "sick" our business is. It's an indication of which agency is "a fair employer."

Those who, with a lot of work, manage to increase revenues, must realize that not so long ago they would have earned four times as much.

Everyone talks about and is afraid of inflation. In microstock, inflation has been devastating for years! And at some point, even the most diligent contributor runs out of energy to make any more increases. You can't feed the beast forever. At some point it will eat you.

My favourite subject 

RPIs vs RPDs vs Total Income. These are some of the ways I've been able to use these stats in the past:

RPIs (Return per Image, total income/total number of images). This was the most valuable ratio for me because it told what to shoot. I used to divide my port into sets and calculate the RPIs for each set, every 3 or 4 months. And then compare the rise or fall of each compared to the last period. If the percentages went up, then I knew I could shoot more for that set and not oversaturate. If it went down, then I would stop shooting for that subject, it was oversaturated.

RPDs (Return per Download, total income/number of downloads). I used these to compare value between agencies, or compare the average price between types of subjects.

Taken from my older spreadsheets, here are some examples:

Food (non-holiday) photography vs Mother's Day photos vs Christmas photos.  Food had the highest RPD, which told me that I was more likely to receive ODDs and SODs sales than the others, but it had a low RPI, and the lowest total income. Mother's Day photos had very high income, and the highest RPI which was still rising, so there was room for more images. Christmas had low RPI and RPD, but the highest total income (because it had the most images).

My decision: Shoot more Mother's Day. Forget non-holiday food because my time was better spent shooting other subjects. I decided to keep shooting Christmas, even though it was oversaturated, mainly because I enjoy Christmas photography and styling, and still had lots of ideas for some of the niche subsets of Christmas.

In summary, my recommendation is to use them in conjunction with each other to get a broader picture, and to guide you on what to shoot, what to stop shooting, and what agencies to upload to or not.  If you only use total income as a guide, you may be missing out on some better opportunities, or important useful data.

...

To answer the OP. My total income on AS this month is almost the same as the exact same period in 2021. So no difference for me.

The problem is that as istock already did, in 2020 shutter leaves fair payments to contributors on the shoulders of other agencies, leaving the burden of decent commissions on adobe. It is a matter of time before Adobe lowers our commissions, perhaps in my case this movement is no longer necessary to put aside the professional microstock and send them photos of my cat.
 
Adobe is my 1st earner...because Shutter is at 50%-60% with the 0.10 trick

Quote from: MxR on June 27, 2022, 04:49

The problem is that as istock already did, in 2020 shutter leaves fair payments to contributors on the shoulders of other agencies, leaving the burden of decent commissions on adobe. It is a matter of time before Adobe lowers our commissions, perhaps in my case this movement is no longer necessary to put aside the professional microstock and send them photos of my cat.
 
Adobe is my 1st earner...because Shutter is at 50%-60% with the 0.10 trick

But it looks like AS gets more revenue from each sale than SS?

Supposing we gets $0.10 and that is 15% of image's price. That means SS gets $0.57 (85%) per image.

At AS, the lowest we gets is $0.33 (33% of image's price). That means AS gets $0.67 (67%) per image. And there are also more frequent medium-value sales at AS.

The next factor is number of sales between AS and SS. And it looks like AS is gaining much more downloads than before? For me, it is. And from the forum's poll results (62.4 vs 31.9), it probably is.

Not necessarily.
For example, my SS RPD for May was $1.46/dl, while my AS RPD for May was $1.40/dl.
For June, my SS RPD is $1.42/dl, while my AS RPD dropped to $0.99/dl

You forget to include the big sales that are more frequent on SS than on AS.

Quote from: Zero Talent on June 27, 2022, 12:14

Quote from: flywing on June 27, 2022, 11:45

Quote from: MxR on June 27, 2022, 04:49

The problem is that as istock already did, in 2020 shutter leaves fair payments to contributors on the shoulders of other agencies, leaving the burden of decent commissions on adobe. It is a matter of time before Adobe lowers our commissions, perhaps in my case this movement is no longer necessary to put aside the professional microstock and send them photos of my cat.
 
Adobe is my 1st earner...because Shutter is at 50%-60% with the 0.10 trick

But it looks like AS gets more revenue from each sale than SS?

Supposing we gets $0.10 and that is 15% of image's price. That means SS gets $0.57 (85%) per image.

At AS, the lowest we gets is $0.33 (33% of image's price). That means AS gets $0.67 (67%) per image. And there are also more frequent medium-value sales at AS.

The next factor is number of sales between AS and SS. And it looks like AS is gaining much more downloads than before? For me, it is. And from the forum's poll results (62.4 vs 31.9), it probably is.

Not necessarily.
For example, my SS RPD for May was $1.46/dl, while my AS RPD for May was $1.40/dl.
For June, my SS RPD is $1.42/dl, while my AS RPD dropped to $0.99/dl

You forget to include the big sales that are more frequent on SS than on AS.

Big Sales on SS? You must be lucky! I don�t know what you are talking about!

I am talking about stuff like this (recorded this month on SS):
 

Quote from: Zero Talent on June 27, 2022, 12:31

Quote from: Wilm on June 27, 2022, 12:26

Quote from: Zero Talent on June 27, 2022, 12:14

Quote from: flywing on June 27, 2022, 11:45

Quote from: MxR on June 27, 2022, 04:49

The problem is that as istock already did, in 2020 shutter leaves fair payments to contributors on the shoulders of other agencies, leaving the burden of decent commissions on adobe. It is a matter of time before Adobe lowers our commissions, perhaps in my case this movement is no longer necessary to put aside the professional microstock and send them photos of my cat.
 
Adobe is my 1st earner...because Shutter is at 50%-60% with the 0.10 trick

But it looks like AS gets more revenue from each sale than SS?

Supposing we gets $0.10 and that is 15% of image's price. That means SS gets $0.57 (85%) per image.

At AS, the lowest we gets is $0.33 (33% of image's price). That means AS gets $0.67 (67%) per image. And there are also more frequent medium-value sales at AS.

The next factor is number of sales between AS and SS. And it looks like AS is gaining much more downloads than before? For me, it is. And from the forum's poll results (62.4 vs 31.9), it probably is.

Not necessarily.
For example, my SS RPD for May was $1.46/dl, while my AS RPD for May was $1.40/dl.
For June, my SS RPD is $1.42/dl, while my AS RPD dropped to $0.99/dl

You forget to include the big sales that are more frequent on SS than on AS.

Big Sales on SS? You must be lucky! I don�t know what you are talking about!

I am talking about stuff like this (recorded this month on SS):
 

Yes, I know! I had already seen that.   

I don't have to explain it to you - we've known each other long enough for that now, but I actually had exactly one download for an impressive $6.95 this month. The rest were in the minimum range.

It's not only that Wilm. Last month I got these image sales like this:
These are more frequent and more valuable than what I get on AS, hence the higher SS RPD.

Quote from: Wilm on June 27, 2022, 12:53

Quote from: Zero Talent on June 27, 2022, 12:31

Quote from: Wilm on June 27, 2022, 12:26

Quote from: Zero Talent on June 27, 2022, 12:14

Quote from: flywing on June 27, 2022, 11:45

Quote from: MxR on June 27, 2022, 04:49

The problem is that as istock already did, in 2020 shutter leaves fair payments to contributors on the shoulders of other agencies, leaving the burden of decent commissions on adobe. It is a matter of time before Adobe lowers our commissions, perhaps in my case this movement is no longer necessary to put aside the professional microstock and send them photos of my cat.
 
Adobe is my 1st earner...because Shutter is at 50%-60% with the 0.10 trick

But it looks like AS gets more revenue from each sale than SS?

Supposing we gets $0.10 and that is 15% of image's price. That means SS gets $0.57 (85%) per image.

At AS, the lowest we gets is $0.33 (33% of image's price). That means AS gets $0.67 (67%) per image. And there are also more frequent medium-value sales at AS.

The next factor is number of sales between AS and SS. And it looks like AS is gaining much more downloads than before? For me, it is. And from the forum's poll results (62.4 vs 31.9), it probably is.

Not necessarily.
For example, my SS RPD for May was $1.46/dl, while my AS RPD for May was $1.40/dl.
For June, my SS RPD is $1.42/dl, while my AS RPD dropped to $0.99/dl

You forget to include the big sales that are more frequent on SS than on AS.

Big Sales on SS? You must be lucky! I don�t know what you are talking about!

I am talking about stuff like this (recorded this month on SS):
 

Yes, I know! I had already seen that.   

I don't have to explain it to you - we've known each other long enough for that now, but I actually had exactly one download for an impressive $6.95 this month. The rest were in the minimum range.

It's not only that Wilm. Last month I got these image sales like this:
These are more frequent and more valuable than what I get on AS, hence the higher SS RPD.

Yes, when the bigger SODs come in at SS, there's more there.

I had a few Enhanced this month at AS, but nothing at SS. And then it comes down to the BME.

But I'm happy for you! Well deserved!