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Author Topic: Twitter now banning photographers for asking for license fees  (Read 7133 times)

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Just_to_inform_people2

« Reply #25 on: March 07, 2023, 18:00 »
0
Elon Musk may tweet my photo's without any credit any day. It will bring a lot of attention to your portfolio for free. But just him and any other person with millions of followers. Don't really see the downside here, only the upside.

I do not like to read your words. In the past, it did not help any farmer if his potatoes were praised by the lord of the manor, as long as the lord of the manor earned money from them and not the farmer.
With this attitude and thinking Elon Musk increases his wealth on the back of other people. This is absolutely unacceptable!

It is also not about promoting a portfolio on Twitter. It's about the illegal use of images. Without paying.

I cannot understand how one can approve of a person with such global market power leveraging copyrights. That is illegal!

I also don't know until today why everyone picks on Bill Gates and worships Elon Musk so much. This man is dangerous from my point of view.



You are getting a bit to emotional here and political as well. Totally unnecessary. The only point I'm making here is that if anyone with such a great audience place your art work it's worth thousands of dollars of promotion. Sure he doesn't pay for using your art but lot's of people will because he promoted your work and you will get a lot of attention of paying customers. And yes you can nag about things not being right but I personally would welcome something like this. And I will bet the artist in question will not be so unhappy as well. Even though she complains about not getting paid by Musk himself or being credited. C'mon think twice :)
But then still you can have another opinion. It's a free world still where we live, isn't it?

I think you misunderstand.

Someone has a supermarket that makes him a lot of money. He goes to the neighboring bakery store and steals a few rolls there, which then lie in the display of his supermarket. No one will wonder where you can legally buy these rolls. They only serve to make the thief's offer more interesting. And if the baker comes and says that the Rolls are stolen, he will be banned from the supermarket.

Sorry, my conception of right looks different!
Really, you can't find your own photo? I have no problem at all finding it at all the agencies I placed them with if I do a google image search. But maybe my photos are more special then?


« Reply #26 on: March 07, 2023, 18:02 »
+3
Okay, so help me out here.

Suppose someone on Twitter ... Elon Musk or someone else .... posts my photo. How does anyone know who I am or where my portfolio is?


Do they credit me? Do they post a link to my port?
Customers that would like to use your art and know that they have to respect copyright will find your art and pay for it. Sure some blogger will fetch it from Elon Musk's tweet but who cares? I think both artists mentioned (I was reacting to the latter case) will have seen their income increase multifold by this commotion. But that is a guess because I don't know them personally offcourse.

Sounds hit and miss to me. Mostly miss. I think I'll pass.
Sure thing. So president Biden places my photo and not yours on a tweet without credits. Let's see who's income gets boosted. I am pretty sure it will be me and not you. But you go ahead with your own reasoning.

You really think President Biden is going to use one of your photos? Can I have some of what you are smoking?

Just_to_inform_people2

« Reply #27 on: March 07, 2023, 18:06 »
0
Okay, so help me out here.

Suppose someone on Twitter ... Elon Musk or someone else .... posts my photo. How does anyone know who I am or where my portfolio is?


Do they credit me? Do they post a link to my port?
Customers that would like to use your art and know that they have to respect copyright will find your art and pay for it. Sure some blogger will fetch it from Elon Musk's tweet but who cares? I think both artists mentioned (I was reacting to the latter case) will have seen their income increase multifold by this commotion. But that is a guess because I don't know them personally offcourse.

Sounds hit and miss to me. Mostly miss. I think I'll pass.
Sure thing. So president Biden places my photo and not yours on a tweet without credits. Let's see who's income gets boosted. I am pretty sure it will be me and not you. But you go ahead with your own reasoning.

You really think President Biden is going to use one of your photos? Can I have some of what you are smoking?
It's a hypothetical statement. Djeez, what are you on?

« Reply #28 on: March 07, 2023, 18:31 »
+6
Same hypothetical delusion as those who plan to become rich by playing the lottery 🙄
« Last Edit: March 07, 2023, 18:39 by Zero Talent »

« Reply #29 on: March 07, 2023, 19:28 »
+4
that is a very good example.

« Reply #30 on: March 07, 2023, 20:41 »
+7
Elon Musk may tweet my photo's without any credit any day. It will bring a lot of attention to your portfolio for free. But just him and any other person with millions of followers. Don't really see the downside here, only the upside.

Are you serious?  The obvious downside is that nobody is going to pay for your image if they can get it for free.  With no attribution, potential buyers won't know who you are and certainly won't bother to look you up.  By broadcasting it free to millions of people it could be argued it was in the public domain and nobody would have to pay for it, ever.  So no downside at all unless you actually wanted to make some money.  Now if he posted a low-resolution image with a link to your portfolio that would be good advertising, otherwise nothing but negatives.

Some agencies used to (maybe still do?) offer to make your images available for free with the idea that the increased exposure will lead to more sales.  I never signed up for any of those so not sure how they worked out but I suspect the only people who made money out of those deals were the agencies.  Adobe has a free section too but at least they pay you for the deal so it is a way to get something out of less-productive images.

Musk is a dangerous psychopath with way too much power.  He (and his ilk) provides a prime example of why we need to dramatically increases taxes on the richest people so they can't destroy civil society.

« Reply #31 on: March 07, 2023, 20:47 »
+3
There was a time I believed Musk was a brilliant guy.

Me too.  He does have some great ideas but also many others that are just plain stupid and he seems to be becoming a right-wing fascist.  He is incapable of empathy and almost certainly lacks a conscience.  Not anyone I want to see with power for sure.

But he is just a whiny  weasel with a tiny  ego

I think you meant someone with a huge ego and a thin skin.  Definitely a whiny weasel.

« Reply #32 on: March 08, 2023, 03:17 »
+7
Elon Musk may tweet my photo's without any credit any day. It will bring a lot of attention to your portfolio for free. But just him and any other person with millions of followers. Don't really see the downside here, only the upside.

I do not like to read your words. In the past, it did not help any farmer if his potatoes were praised by the lord of the manor, as long as the lord of the manor earned money from them and not the farmer.
With this attitude and thinking Elon Musk increases his wealth on the back of other people. This is absolutely unacceptable!

It is also not about promoting a portfolio on Twitter. It's about the illegal use of images. Without paying.

I cannot understand how one can approve of a person with such global market power leveraging copyrights. That is illegal!

I also don't know until today why everyone picks on Bill Gates and worships Elon Musk so much. This man is dangerous from my point of view.



You are getting a bit to emotional here and political as well. Totally unnecessary. The only point I'm making here is that if anyone with such a great audience place your art work it's worth thousands of dollars of promotion. Sure he doesn't pay for using your art but lot's of people will because he promoted your work and you will get a lot of attention of paying customers. And yes you can nag about things not being right but I personally would welcome something like this. And I will bet the artist in question will not be so unhappy as well. Even though she complains about not getting paid by Musk himself or being credited. C'mon think twice :)
But then still you can have another opinion. It's a free world still where we live, isn't it?

I think you misunderstand.

Someone has a supermarket that makes him a lot of money. He goes to the neighboring bakery store and steals a few rolls there, which then lie in the display of his supermarket. No one will wonder where you can legally buy these rolls. They only serve to make the thief's offer more interesting. And if the baker comes and says that the Rolls are stolen, he will be banned from the supermarket.

Sorry, my conception of right looks different!
Really, you can't find your own photo? I have no problem at all finding it at all the agencies I placed them with if I do a google image search. But maybe my photos are more special then?

Why would anyone bother doing a search on Google to find paid images when you can seemingly get them for free on Twitter.

Who gives an individual - in this case Elon Musk - the right to put himself above the law? That's exactly the danger I was talking about before. Don't you recognize this danger?

« Reply #33 on: March 08, 2023, 03:31 »
+6

You are getting a bit to emotional here and political as well. Totally unnecessary. The only point I'm making here is that if anyone with such a great audience place your art work it's worth thousands of dollars of promotion. Sure he doesn't pay for using your art but lot's of people will because he promoted your work and you will get a lot of attention of paying customers. And yes you can nag about things not being right but I personally would welcome something like this. And I will bet the artist in question will not be so unhappy as well. Even though she complains about not getting paid by Musk himself or being credited. C'mon think twice :)
But then still you can have another opinion. It's a free world still where we live, isn't it?

Can you tell me how in the world a microstock artist profits, when their work is stolen and published without mentioning the artist and linking to  their portfolio?

Justanotherphotographer

« Reply #34 on: March 08, 2023, 03:52 »
+3
Musk posting images without permission or crediting has been going for a while. Zero Talents link shows he was even actively encouraging others to do the same. Hes really stepping up the attacks now. Banning creatives when they use DMCAs or even ask for payment is going to have a huge chilling effect and discourage people from any attempt to protect their work. Be happy for scraps or lose the channel to promote yourself at all.

« Reply #35 on: March 08, 2023, 04:15 »
+2
-musk-doesnt-learn-posts-uncredited-artwork-delet-1835562881

He is even against "crediting" artists (like it matters anyway), let alone paying them....
 
[/quote]
I really wish someone would bring this Musk down a few pegs and needs to be sued bigtime. He may be bright0 (in his own strange way) but trying to prevent artists from earning money is totally reprehensible. Many artists (including myself) are struggling to pay bills while geeks like him don't even have to think about it.

Justanotherphotographer

« Reply #36 on: March 08, 2023, 04:29 »
+6

I really wish someone would bring this Musk down a few pegs and needs to be sued bigtime. He may be bright0 (in his own strange way) but trying to prevent artists from earning money is totally reprehensible. Many artists (including myself) are struggling to pay bills while geeks like him don't even have to think about it.

Good luck. He's been breaking environmental and labour laws for years and been untouchable. The system isnt made to deal with billionaires who can just keep throwing unlimited cash at a problem until it goes away.

« Reply #37 on: March 08, 2023, 08:35 »
+4
Elon Musk may tweet my photo's without any credit any day. It will bring a lot of attention to your portfolio for free. But just him and any other person with millions of followers. Don't really see the downside here, only the upside.

I am normally a friendly person. The two of us have already had one or two arguments here.
But this is now the biggest nonsense that I have read here from you.
How should a portfolio be pushed into any wise if Musk uses your images?
Published images can be downloaded directly from twitter in acceptable quality.

Agree with Wilm, Musk is dangerous and makes his own laws and rules in his own weird world without reference to reality.
Also you Ralf are getting way to political correct here. Again completely unnecessary. I think it's a German problem and you can't help yourselves I guess.
Obviously you can not agree with what I am saying but I did explicitly mention that it is my opinion on the matter. I did not insult anyone here but actually you are now. As I remember we are still in a world where everyone can make up his own opinion and express it. I guess you want to change that? Maybe you should take it up with Leaf then and set new rules for what you think is right that people may or may not write here. I am not worshipping Musk here. I am only noting that if someone with such a big audience shows your art it can be very lucrative and that me, myself and I, would not be unhappy about it if it would happen to me. Get it?

thinking stealing is bad is Political?

« Reply #38 on: March 08, 2023, 08:38 »
+1
Okay, so help me out here.

Suppose someone on Twitter ... Elon Musk or someone else .... posts my photo. How does anyone know who I am or where my portfolio is?


Do they credit me? Do they post a link to my port?
Customers that would like to use your art and know that they have to respect copyright will find your art and pay for it. Sure some blogger will fetch it from Elon Musk's tweet but who cares? I think both artists mentioned (I was reacting to the latter case) will have seen their income increase multifold by this commotion. But that is a guess because I don't know them personally offcourse.

Sounds hit and miss to me. Mostly miss. I think I'll pass.
Sure thing. So president Biden places my photo and not yours on a tweet without credits. Let's see who's income gets boosted. I am pretty sure it will be me and not you. But you go ahead with your own reasoning.

oh course it will be you, as you are the one entitled to claim infringement and bill/sue said person for it,  Why should i gain from someone stealing your image?

Uncle Pete

  • Great Place by a Great Lake - My Home Port
« Reply #39 on: March 08, 2023, 13:12 »
0
Same hypothetical delusion as those who plan to become rich by playing the lottery 🙄

You can't win if you don't buy a ticket?  ;D Planning to win is a fools mission, but people do win?

Aside from all the hate and politics and how much rich people make a year, or if they are lefty or rightly, a socialist or a fascist and other name calling and personal attacks. How about the issue at the bottom of this without the loaded finger pointing. (I mean overall, not you Zero, of course)

1)


What a dumb statement for anyone anywhere to be making? There's the answer to photo credit or someone knowing. They don't know.

2) If it's some homeless guy with a cell phone he got free from the Government, posting on social media or some wealthy billionaire, doing the same, image theft is "what it is" and that's copyright infringement and it's against the law. Small point but collecting from Elon Musk is much easier, if someone sues and wins, than bothering to sue someone who lives in an appliance carton, under an overpass. And try collecting a dime from the later.

3) We don't work for likes, views, or free exposure. Some people may work for an ego boost, but still, that's not going to pay a bill or put food on the table. (or buy me a bottle of Single Malt)

"Twitter now banning photographers for asking for license fees" is as bad as the click bait on the Internet that says one thing to get views and a reaction, but really isn't totally honest? Twitter banned one artist who had his design and image, used illegally, when that artist had his lawyer ask for payment for the use.

Musk is doing the usual weasel waffle now, blaming someone else for everything and criticizing a creative artist for defending his legal rights. He owns the company, people got approval somewhere down the line and Musk himself used the image, personally. One way or another this is infringing and should be brought to court by the artist.

DMCA is stupid and worthless. If you catch someone stealing your work and you can find them and send notice, they can answer "Oh sorry" take it back and you get nothing. Nothing happens, no penalty, no deterrent = No Protection. Under the current regulations, all Musk has to do is say, Oops, sorry, I'll stop doing this, and he's off free.



The artist is Tom Edwards, and I wanted to give him proper credit. And maybe help with a link to his website? https://wallypots.com/

Annie2022

« Reply #40 on: March 08, 2023, 13:15 »
+11


There was a time I believed Musk was a brilliant guy.

But he is just a whiny  weasel with a tiny  ego



ShadySue

  • There is a crack in everything
« Reply #41 on: March 08, 2023, 14:01 »
+5

I really wish someone would bring this Musk down a few pegs and needs to be sued bigtime. He may be bright0 (in his own strange way) but trying to prevent artists from earning money is totally reprehensible. Many artists (including myself) are struggling to pay bills while geeks like him don't even have to think about it.

Good luck. He's been breaking environmental and labour laws for years and been untouchable. The system isnt made to deal with billionaires who can just keep throwing unlimited cash at a problem until it goes away.

He's, at the very least, a loose cannon.
I hope Haraldur Thorleifsson successfully sues him within an inch of his life.

Just_to_inform_people2

« Reply #42 on: March 08, 2023, 14:45 »
0

You are getting a bit to emotional here and political as well. Totally unnecessary. The only point I'm making here is that if anyone with such a great audience place your art work it's worth thousands of dollars of promotion. Sure he doesn't pay for using your art but lot's of people will because he promoted your work and you will get a lot of attention of paying customers. And yes you can nag about things not being right but I personally would welcome something like this. And I will bet the artist in question will not be so unhappy as well. Even though she complains about not getting paid by Musk himself or being credited. C'mon think twice :)
But then still you can have another opinion. It's a free world still where we live, isn't it?

Can you tell me how in the world a microstock artist profits, when their work is stolen and published without mentioning the artist and linking to  their portfolio?

Let me try one last time :)

If you want to be succesful, with any product you sell, you have to reach a large audience. In that audience there are potential buyers. That is why we have advertisement on almost all media you use. You can make Coca Cola but if you don't tell people you have made this product nobody will buy your product.

So, if some lame ass with millions of followers tweets your photo then you get an enormous exposure.
In this audience you will have people that like this photo and will want to use it.
Among these people you have small players that might rip the photo of the tweet and use it and you get nothing. Not correct and a pity.

There will also be people that work for companies that have responsible policies and that obey the law of copyright. They will go and purchase the photo from the artist itself, or, in our case, from one of the agencies that sell our photo. Your photo will not be difficult to find and sales will be coming in.
Sales that never would have happened unless you would have spent a lot of money promoting your own work.

So that's why, even if it's fraudelent, wrong or whatever you want to call it, I (and again this is my personal opinion and you keep yours) would welcome any person that has millions of followers to expose my photo to his/her/it's audience, without them having bought the photo or credited me in the tweet.

Ask the artists in question if their revenues have gone up or down because of this. I am pretty sure that they will respond, if there are truthful, that it has gone up big time, even though they are whining about the wrongdoing.

edit:
So if this happens. You may want to sue the person, ask for a DMCA and get your photo as soon as possible of Twitter. I, on the other hand would let it stay there as long as possible. I might cause some trouble, to get even more exposure, but I would see it as a God given present.

« Last Edit: March 08, 2023, 14:59 by SVH »

« Reply #43 on: March 08, 2023, 15:41 »
+6

You are getting a bit to emotional here and political as well. Totally unnecessary. The only point I'm making here is that if anyone with such a great audience place your art work it's worth thousands of dollars of promotion. Sure he doesn't pay for using your art but lot's of people will because he promoted your work and you will get a lot of attention of paying customers. And yes you can nag about things not being right but I personally would welcome something like this. And I will bet the artist in question will not be so unhappy as well. Even though she complains about not getting paid by Musk himself or being credited. C'mon think twice :)
But then still you can have another opinion. It's a free world still where we live, isn't it?

Can you tell me how in the world a microstock artist profits, when their work is stolen and published without mentioning the artist and linking to  their portfolio?

Let me try one last time :)


Your long text does not make your argument any more coherent.

How . are you going to profit from someone using (stealing)  your picture without citing the source?

And even if the source is mentioned. Do you really think that if Biden Trump, Musk etc. steal your pictures, millions of people will buy them afterwards? Why? Do they sign up for Shutterstock, Adobe, etc. because of your portfolio?

Why are you defending totally unacceptable criminal behavior here?



« Reply #44 on: March 08, 2023, 15:49 »
+1

You are getting a bit to emotional here and political as well. Totally unnecessary. The only point I'm making here is that if anyone with such a great audience place your art work it's worth thousands of dollars of promotion. Sure he doesn't pay for using your art but lot's of people will because he promoted your work and you will get a lot of attention of paying customers. And yes you can nag about things not being right but I personally would welcome something like this. And I will bet the artist in question will not be so unhappy as well. Even though she complains about not getting paid by Musk himself or being credited. C'mon think twice :)
But then still you can have another opinion. It's a free world still where we live, isn't it?

Can you tell me how in the world a microstock artist profits, when their work is stolen and published without mentioning the artist and linking to  their portfolio?

Let me try one last time :)

If you want to be succesful, with any product you sell, you have to reach a large audience. In that audience there are potential buyers. That is why we have advertisement on almost all media you use. You can make Coca Cola but if you don't tell people you have made this product nobody will buy your product.

So, if some lame ass with millions of followers tweets your photo then you get an enormous exposure.
In this audience you will have people that like this photo and will want to use it.
Among these people you have small players that might rip the photo of the tweet and use it and you get nothing. Not correct and a pity.

There will also be people that work for companies that have responsible policies and that obey the law of copyright. They will go and purchase the photo from the artist itself, or, in our case, from one of the agencies that sell our photo. Your photo will not be difficult to find and sales will be coming in.
Sales that never would have happened unless you would have spent a lot of money promoting your own work.

So that's why, even if it's fraudelent, wrong or whatever you want to call it, I (and again this is my personal opinion and you keep yours) would welcome any person that has millions of followers to expose my photo to his/her/it's audience, without them having bought the photo or credited me in the tweet.

Ask the artists in question if their revenues have gone up or down because of this. I am pretty sure that they will respond, if there are truthful, that it has gone up big time, even though they are whining about the wrongdoing.

edit:
So if this happens. You may want to sue the person, ask for a DMCA and get your photo as soon as possible of Twitter. I, on the other hand would let it stay there as long as possible. I might cause some trouble, to get even more exposure, but I would see it as a God given present.

It is your personal view on things, and that's fine, but it is irrelevant in this little controversy Musk created amongst photographers or creatives.

What you are saying is that some people can use your work for free and uncredited under certain conditions.
I can only hope for you that you still think that it's up to you to define the people or companies that may use your work for free and uncredited, and that you still would like to have something to say about the conditions in which they use it.

It's the old work-for-free-in-return-for-exposure-to-get-more-future-deals trick. And it surely can make sense. Careers were built on that.
But it's up to you to decide what you do or give away for free, and what you don't. Not the other way around.

So back to the initial discussion: you might not mind Musk using your content for free and uncredited. But others do, and their opinion is worth as much as yours, with the only difference being that they have the law on their side.

That's why people here are telling you that your opinion on the matter from a factual point of view doesn't make any sense.
You can still have it though, and as far as I'm concerned you can voice it as much as you want, but don't act surprised that they try to tell you in a convincing way that your point of view is factually wrong.

« Reply #45 on: March 08, 2023, 15:56 »
+4
Same hypothetical delusion as those who plan to become rich by playing the lottery 🙄

and worse are those who actively promote that delusion

« Reply #46 on: March 08, 2023, 16:00 »
+3

But he is just a whiny  weasel with a tiny  ego

I think you meant someone with a huge ego and a thin skin.  Definitely a whiny weasel.
i object to this defamation of weasels!

« Reply #47 on: March 08, 2023, 16:09 »
+6

You are getting a bit to emotional here and political as well. Totally unnecessary. The only point I'm making here is that if anyone with such a great audience place your art work it's worth thousands of dollars of promotion. Sure he doesn't pay for using your art but lot's of people will because he promoted your work and you will get a lot of attention of paying customers.   

Can you tell me how in the world a microstock artist profits, when their work is stolen and published without mentioning the artist and linking to  their portfolio?
...
So that's why, even if it's fraudelent, wrong or whatever you want to call it, I (and again this is my personal opinion and you keep yours) would welcome any person that has millions of followers to expose my photo to his/her/it's audience, without them having bought the photo or credited me in the tweet...
 

ok, post a link to your portfolio and we can test this theory by posting your images w/o credit - the combined audience of MSG followers on twitter is enormous

Just_to_inform_people2

« Reply #48 on: March 08, 2023, 16:10 »
0
So back to the initial discussion: you might not mind Musk using your content for free and uncredited. But others do, and their opinion is worth as much as yours, with the only difference being that they have the law on their side.

That's why people here are telling you that your opinion on the matter from a factual point of view doesn't make any sense.
You can still have it though, and as far as I'm concerned you can voice it as much as you want, but don't act surprised that they try to tell you in a convincing way that your point of view is factually wrong.

Good to see that at least someone accepts a different opinion here and not gets completely nuts about it. I am not surprised that people don't agree with me, I am just surprised that people get so upset and get all personal about it if I say I wouldn't mind it happening to me. I understand and respect views from others, I just don't like it when they start insulting and then I will snap back at them. I do and will not turn the other cheek.

I enjoy differences of opinion. Some people not, I guess, and then they get all weird. But I really don't care that much. It's just a pity they can't stay on topic and go and make it a personal thing, risking the topic to be removed at some point.

« Reply #49 on: March 08, 2023, 16:24 »
+1

You are getting a bit to emotional here and political as well. Totally unnecessary. The only point I'm making here is that if anyone with such a great audience place your art work it's worth thousands of dollars of promotion. Sure he doesn't pay for using your art but lot's of people will because he promoted your work and you will get a lot of attention of paying customers.   

Can you tell me how in the world a microstock artist profits, when their work is stolen and published without mentioning the artist and linking to  their portfolio?
...
So that's why, even if it's fraudelent, wrong or whatever you want to call it, I (and again this is my personal opinion and you keep yours) would welcome any person that has millions of followers to expose my photo to his/her/it's audience, without them having bought the photo or credited me in the tweet...
 

ok, post a link to your portfolio and we can test this theory by posting your images w/o credit - the combined audience of MSG followers on twitter is enormous

 ;D ;D


 

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