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Author Topic: A new kind of attack on Pirates  (Read 7262 times)

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« on: March 17, 2012, 19:37 »
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http://news.cnet.com/8301-31001_3-57397452-261/riaa-chief-isps-to-start-policing-copyright-by-july-1/

Comcast, Time Warner, and Verizon are among the ISPs preparing to implement a graduated response to piracy by July
"...this could become the most effective antipiracy program ever. Since ISPs are the Internet's gatekeepers, the theory is that network providers are in the best position to fight illegal file sharing...ISPs send out one or two educational notices to those customers who are accused of downloading copyrighted content illegally. If the customer doesn't stop, the ISP is then asked to send out "confirmation notices" asking that they confirm they have received notice.

"At that time, the accused customers will also be informed of the risks they incur if they don't stop pirating material. If the customer is flagged for pirating again, the ISP can then ratchet up the pressure. Participating ISPs can choose from a list of penalties, or what the RIAA calls "mitigation measures," which include throttling down the customer's connection speed and suspending Web access until the subscriber agrees to stop pirating."

So looks like maybe some of the people in the US who are 'sharing' copyrighted stuff could lose their broradband someday.


« Reply #1 on: March 17, 2012, 20:24 »
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Won't work. They can just switch providers, and I guarantee you providers will be very reluctant to actually cut off paying customers, furthermore, they can always just connect to the web and then use a VPN to totally blackout what they do.

« Reply #2 on: March 17, 2012, 21:16 »
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Won't work. They can just switch providers, and I guarantee you providers will be very reluctant to actually cut off paying customers, furthermore, they can always just connect to the web and then use a VPN to totally blackout what they do.
Good points. Although I think that in many places, such as where I live, there is only one provider of high speed internet access (DSL here is too slow to be useful for a lot of downloading, really).

I wonder if the measures in the article might discourage the casual infringers who might not want to switch ISPs just to copy a file now and then and are not tech savvy enough to hide what they do? Maybe the actual intent is to scare people by sending the letters.

« Reply #3 on: March 17, 2012, 21:26 »
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I think this is more of an attempt to get the government to stay the heck out of their business. They create a mechanism, send tons of letters ect... and then argue the government can go get lost.

« Reply #4 on: March 17, 2012, 22:11 »
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I guess my question is how do they determine who is a pirate? Is it flagged sites or just people that upload or download a lot? If it is just quantity of activity, I could see a lot of false positives for the customers they want to eliminate or charge more.  :-\

« Reply #5 on: March 17, 2012, 22:46 »
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Aren't they already doing this in France?

I cannot imagine this happening here in the US... People would be frantic. The companies are somewhat slaves the customers that they have, why would they want to drop them? They would shoot themselves in the foot.

« Reply #6 on: March 17, 2012, 23:00 »
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I guess my question is how do they determine who is a pirate? Is it flagged sites or just people that upload or download a lot? If it is just quantity of activity, I could see a lot of false positives for the customers they want to eliminate or charge more.  :-\
The article doesn't say. It must be a 'details to follow' announcement. I can see privacy advocates being disturbed if the ISPs are spying too much on their customers.

And I think click_click is right, I doubt that the ISPs would take it as far as really losing customers.

It might be that Hollywood and the big entertainment distributors like Disney have a lot of clout with the cable companies who distribute their movies and TV shows. Maybe the content producers are putting pressure on the cable companies to at least look like they are trying to do something to stop the pirates from stealing movies and music.

antistock

« Reply #7 on: March 18, 2012, 03:05 »
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publishing on the web must become very expensive, that's the only solution i can see.

if you must pay hefty taxes to run a web site you will be forced to have a business plan, to run a company, to be registered, to pay taxes and be fully legal and finally you will think twice before publishing stolen images, video, warez or whatever, just as it happens for newspapers and magazines.

it's just crazy that nowadays anyone can publish pirated content in a few clicks and get away in total impunity.
any possible song ever published can be found on youtube for instance ! even Murdoch acknowledged that google is nr.1 in piracy and yet nobody so managed to get those thieves in jail !

i'm all in favor of the destruction of the web as we know it.
death to facebook, youtube, flickr, etc etc
it will become a better and cleaner place.

« Reply #8 on: March 18, 2012, 08:53 »
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Time Warner Cable and the MPAA sent these notices to me.  They claimed I was uploading stolen movies or TV programs... and demanded I remove them from my computer.  I called and explained that I never downloaded a movie or TV program in my life (I get DVD's in the mail) so there are none to remove.  Then they said my router was being broken into... could be... except I dont own a router.  Then they said my mac must have a virus.  It does not.  I checked. 

The first two times I clicked through the notices.  Called Time Warner to explain their mistake.  The first person transfered me to a (infringement case) phone machine where I left a detailed message.... and was supposed to get a call back.  I never did get a call back. 

The third time I could not click through the warning.  I called and explained the situation again.  I also explained that I will not be wrongly accused of thievery by a vendor three times and remain a customer.  I cancelled my account and switched to mobile wifi.  No problems since then.

I was shooting a lot of HD videos at the time so I was using tons of bandwith.  I believe I was flagged for bandwith use alone.  Time Warner never provided details regarding what movie or program I allegedly stole or where I supposedly sent it.  They showed no interest in doing the right thing or fixing their mistakes. These notices are not ment to protect content providers like us.  It is a badly managed attempt to protect declining DVD sales... nothing more.   

« Reply #9 on: March 18, 2012, 09:15 »
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How much is it going to cost to administer this?  They're trying to get something similar in the UK and the ISP's have spent a lot fighting it in the courts.

If it did work, people would go back to swapping pirated CD's, DVD's etc. offline.  I would prefer a system where people that create popular content are paid to upload to the internet, given that it's inevitably going to be copied and shared illegally by someone.

wut

« Reply #10 on: March 18, 2012, 09:18 »
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It is a badly managed attempt to protect declining DVD sales... nothing more.   

They should realize the recession affects them as well. It's obvious they don't know what they're doing and are in way over their heads. Someone like you should slap a lawsuit on them, that's what ppl do best and often in the states.

OM

« Reply #11 on: March 18, 2012, 09:36 »
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Time Warner Cable and the MPAA sent these notices to me.  They claimed I was uploading stolen movies or TV programs... and demanded I remove them from my computer.  I called and explained that I never downloaded a movie or TV program in my life (I get DVD's in the mail) so there are none to remove.  Then they said my router was being broken into... could be... except I dont own a router.  Then they said my mac must have a virus.  It does not.  I checked. 

The first two times I clicked through the notices.  Called Time Warner to explain their mistake.  The first person transfered me to a (infringement case) phone machine where I left a detailed message.... and was supposed to get a call back.  I never did get a call back. 

The third time I could not click through the warning.  I called and explained the situation again.  I also explained that I will not be wrongly accused of thievery by a vendor three times and remain a customer.  I cancelled my account and switched to mobile wifi.  No problems since then.

I was shooting a lot of HD videos at the time so I was using tons of bandwith.  I believe I was flagged for bandwith use alone.  Time Warner never provided details regarding what movie or program I allegedly stole or where I supposedly sent it.  They showed no interest in doing the right thing or fixing their mistakes. These notices are not ment to protect content providers like us.  It is a badly managed attempt to protect declining DVD sales... nothing more.   

Deemed guilty by arbitrary decision of a provider until proven innocent...........that's the trouble with these sorts of 'laws'. Try fighting them through judicial process and they'll tie you up in legal knots for ever and any victory will be impecuniously Pyrrhic.

« Reply #12 on: March 18, 2012, 17:10 »
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Time Warner Cable and the MPAA sent these notices to me.  They claimed I was uploading stolen movies or TV programs... and demanded I remove them from my computer...
The article says that the companies, including Time Warner, are not supposed to start this policy until July 1. But I guess it has been going on already, unless they got you with some kind of test or pilot program. Maybe Time Warner is more aggressive since they own companies which produce music and movies, while some of the other cable companies do not.

helix7

« Reply #13 on: March 18, 2012, 17:22 »
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This stinks as badly as those mass mailings going out from law firms demanding settlements from people they've already decided are guilty of piracy. They get a list of IP addresses connected with downloading a movie owned by their client, they get the ISPs to turn over lists of names and addresses connected with those IP addresses, and then blast out thousands of letters demanding large sums of money or else they'll take the case to court.

Only they never take the case to court because they know they don't have a case, and they just hope for lots of unquestioned settlements. And in some cases, the people getting these letters never pirated a thing in their lives. Someone could have cracked their wifi and used their connection to illegally download files. Or in some cases, the victims aren't computer-savvy enough to even password-protect their wifi, let alone participate in bit torrents and such.

It's all just another "guilty without a chance to prove innocence" policy by the MPAA, RIAA, and ISPs.

I get a letter like this from my ISP, and I'm on the phone canceling service that same day.

OM

« Reply #14 on: March 18, 2012, 20:01 »
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This stinks as badly as those mass mailings going out from law firms demanding settlements from people they've already decided are guilty of piracy. They get a list of IP addresses connected with downloading a movie owned by their client, they get the ISPs to turn over lists of names and addresses connected with those IP addresses, and then blast out thousands of letters demanding large sums of money or else they'll take the case to court.

Only they never take the case to court because they know they don't have a case, and they just hope for lots of unquestioned settlements. And in some cases, the people getting these letters never pirated a thing in their lives. Someone could have cracked their wifi and used their connection to illegally download files. Or in some cases, the victims aren't computer-savvy enough to even password-protect their wifi, let alone participate in bit torrents and such.

It's all just another "guilty without a chance to prove innocence" policy by the MPAA, RIAA, and ISPs.

I get a letter like this from my ISP, and I'm on the phone canceling service that same day.

Course, the best protection is to deliberately not 'password-protect' your wifi.  ;D

« Reply #15 on: March 19, 2012, 11:42 »
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Time Warner Cable and the MPAA sent these notices to me.  They claimed I was uploading stolen movies or TV programs... and demanded I remove them from my computer...
The article says that the companies, including Time Warner, are not supposed to start this policy until July 1. But I guess it has been going on already, unless they got you with some kind of test or pilot program. Maybe Time Warner is more aggressive since they own companies which produce music and movies, while some of the other cable companies do not.

Comcast has had a monitoring and notification policy for years.  It's nothing new...just looks like they are going to step up efforts industry wide.

« Reply #16 on: March 19, 2012, 12:02 »
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How much is it going to cost to administer this?  They're trying to get something similar in the UK and the ISP's have spent a lot fighting it in the courts.

If it did work, people would go back to swapping pirated CD's, DVD's etc. offline.  I would prefer a system where people that create popular content are paid to upload to the internet, given that it's inevitably going to be copied and shared illegally by someone.

Trading off offline is very limited and, although being a problem, would be a minor one.


« Reply #17 on: March 19, 2012, 14:18 »
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^^^I disagree.  It was a big problem pre-internet, before most people had a computer and could copy DVD's and CD's.  It would be a much bigger problem now.

antistock

« Reply #18 on: March 21, 2012, 01:15 »
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^^^I disagree.  It was a big problem pre-internet, before most people had a computer and could copy DVD's and CD's.  It would be a much bigger problem now.

we already crossed the point of non return.
how many are still renting DVDs for instance ?

in one side you have successful companies like Netflix but in the other side you have Blockbuster going bankrupt last year and tons of local small shop who were renting movies and CDs, even in my city there all went down the drain a part a couple ones who are in business since 30 yrs.

fact is, people is pirating like never before in history, now it's really a matter of few clicks, the quality is very very good if not pixel-perfect as there's already people sharing whole blue-ray movies.

as much as i hate hollywood and the music industry with passion i can't defend people pirating for fun.

Microbius

« Reply #19 on: March 21, 2012, 02:38 »
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You hate Hollywood? I love Hollywood! I like indy stuff too but I can't wait for the next Batman flick or the Hobbit to come out.


 

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