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Author Topic: How Many People Do Family Photography on Side?  (Read 10585 times)

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angelawaye

  • Eat, Sleep, Keyword. Repeat

« Reply #25 on: March 19, 2016, 18:00 »
0
That is excellent advice! THANK YOU!!!


« Reply #26 on: March 20, 2016, 11:25 »
+2
Then the problem is they get an unedited image with the old dude that snuck in to feed the birds in the background or the squirming kid.  They always pick the worst one to blow up and hang above the fireplace and this in no way represents your work.  Do you want unedited images on facebook?

For $100 you could offer a 45 minute session, 1 location within 15 miles of your home for a maximum of 4 people.  $25 each additional person.  (But you are such a nice family of 6 I won't charge you the $25/per unless Grandma and Grandpa and sour Auntie Cecile show up.)  That would basically pay for your hour and travel.  But they should also pay for the product.   (You don't pay for a hair cut and leave with a free bottle of shampoo and conditioner).

Free (watermarked) proofing gallery that will be live for 5 days.    If you take 10 shots of the same setup, display the best 1 or 2.  They don't need 10, it confuses them and they can't make a decision.  Make sure the mother looks fabulous in what you select. 

I still offer bundles of sizes of the same photo.  They think wow, that's a really good discount, you will think wow, I only have to retouch a couple photos.


« Reply #27 on: March 20, 2016, 11:43 »
+1
I never give or show unretouched photos. These photos always will be used against photographer to decrease a price or to blame in attempt to not pay at all. Some variants for proofs: collages of thumbs for a choice. In this case editing will not take a lot of time and resources. Watermark on all thumbs. For small projects - upfront payment or not show any thumbs/proofs before. Had cases when client used them in profiles and it was very difficult to receive payment because the sum was less than for small claims court level.
Of course everybody has different environment and different level of precaution is needed. Contract should include all even small details, otherwise they can demand prints for a short session for the same price or something else.

angelawaye

  • Eat, Sleep, Keyword. Repeat

« Reply #28 on: March 20, 2016, 12:46 »
0
Thanks for your feedback. I feel very reluctant to show the clients unedited images. Even if they are watermarked and small.

The problem is I can't choose which ones to edit so I end up editing a whole bunch (60-80). It's funny because the photo I think is the "best" version is not always the one the client likes the best (I see from their facebook profile or cover image). Poeple are very funny about how they look. This one girl was so picky about her face and I thought she looked beautiful.

I know some photographers have clients come over for a "proofing meeting" and go through them but that is another hour of time for me and not worth it when charging $100 for everything.

I just wish I had a better way to streamline the process without editing all of them and showing unedited ones.

« Reply #29 on: March 20, 2016, 16:35 »
0
If you charge more you can sit with the client for an hour and hook up your HDMI cable from your computer to their tv or yours depending on how/where you work and show them a reasonable selection of the unedited images so you help them narrow down their choices. When you project the images like that they are likely to want more of them. Then you don't have to edit 60 or 80 images and you get a sense right away of what the client likes. It's great feedback and it gets the client excited about the images.

I don't give usually clients the unedited images because I don't want some terrible photo showing up, although if I've shot an event like a charity fundraiser I might give them a CD with more than the few they've selected for the press, color balanced and edited so it only includes the better shots but without taking out wrinkles and the like - so just a quick edit. I let them know people can order edited photos from me.

For portraits, I don't quote an hourly rate but get an idea of what they think they want and then quote package prices, as well as options for higher end items such as albums and prints on canvas.

For a family portrait, unless they want an album, you certainly don't need to show them more than 30 photos. If you show them 100 they'll never be able to make a choice.

Talk to other photographers in your area and get a sense of their prices. IMHO $100 is way too low even if you're not in a metropolitan area. I charge way more than that for a simple headshot. Don't sell yourself short.

« Reply #30 on: March 21, 2016, 10:21 »
+1
I know some photographers have clients come over for a "proofing meeting" and go through them but that is another hour of time for me and not worth it when charging $100 for everything.

I just wish I had a better way to streamline the process without editing all of them and showing unedited ones.

You sell WAAYYY more if you have a proof meeting.  If you show a 20x30 canvas, they buy a 20x30 canvas when all they wanted was an 8x10 print in a cardboard folder.

« Reply #31 on: March 21, 2016, 12:53 »
0
i see that you got very good advice here until now...
i will tell you how i work.
Beside stock photography i make boudoir photography... 90% of my work
I have a retoucher that works for me, and his fee i added in my package fee.
In 2 hours i take like 200 photos from which the client can choose 20 or 30 photos, if they want extra, they pay extra.
from this shootings, depends of the woman, i ask for a model release and explain what is stock photography... so from time to time i get also model release from my already paid sessions!

« Reply #32 on: March 21, 2016, 14:54 »
0
I don't do an overabundance of family sessions, but I've got a few under my belt - just had one this morning, in fact.

My rate varies and depends upon the number of subjects. The way I see it, the more different subjects, the more photos you have to take to get one that works - or worse, editing a face from one photo onto another. I specify no destination charges for locations within a certain distance from me.

I had a shoot in December that was 9 adults - 2 locations, both about 45 minutes away from me. I quoted them $400, and they didn't quibble at all. I could have charged more, I'm sure.

I used to have a base price then prices for prints, including package pricing, etc. I didn't sell that many prints, so now I just give them a (higher) price for the session, telling them they will get the photographer's pick of a minimum number of images (varies by the number of subjects) and they can ask me about prints, or they can print wherever they wish. The price includes the session, basic editing, and the on-line, downloadable gallery.

I will usually do one or two of the finished files with extra effects so they can see what some of their options may look like, but I don't advertise that part. If I get motivated, I throw them in.

« Reply #33 on: March 28, 2016, 17:29 »
0
Angela, you're very talented... more than you probably feel.  You need to grow some confidence in yourself, after (how many years have you been doing this stuff now?).  Remember that.  It's not like you just bought your first computer or camera and are figuring this crap out as you go along. 

I would recommend that you start charging hourly for your design work.  Give an initial estimate, but let the clients know they will have to pay you hourly.  Flat rate pricing only works if you're charging A LOT and getting it.  Otherwise you'll get dragged into proofing hell/limbo back and forth just because most people like to change things just for the sake of changing them, JUST because they CAN.  Proofing revisions can turn nightmarish.  Or you can give them an option of up to 1 or 2 revisions and then after that, charge additional hourly.  I've been burned oooooh so many times by quoting a flat rate on design work, only to find out that either I underestimated the length of the job, or because the client was a psycho. 

Worried about your clients being offended?  No worries... there are plenty around, and they will pay you what you want if you have the quality to back it up.  Sometimes people will pay more than average for something just because they think it must be more valuable.  There is a ton of psychology behind consumerism.  It's still an incredible value for them if you chose to charge $100 for a half hour shoot or $150-200 for an hour, with 10-20 images delivered.  Try it out, and see how it goes.  When you get so busy that you're turning away clients, jack up the prices.  You'll give yourself a raise, and you'll be able to make the same, but work less.  Enjoy your family time more!

« Reply #34 on: March 28, 2016, 18:20 »
0
I would recommend that you start charging hourly for your design work.  Give an initial estimate, but let the clients know they will have to pay you hourly.  Flat rate pricing only works if you're charging A LOT and getting it.  Otherwise you'll get dragged into proofing hell/limbo back and forth just because most people like to change things just for the sake of changing them, JUST because they CAN.  Proofing revisions can turn nightmarish.  Or you can give them an option of up to 1 or 2 revisions and then after that, charge additional hourly.  I've been burned oooooh so many times by quoting a flat rate on design work, only to find out that either I underestimated the length of the job, or because the client was a psycho. 


I have found the opposite to be true. I work fixed price, and offer 2 rounds of minor revisions for what i quote. Whenever i talk hourly, the first question from the client is "how many hours will it take?" There are clients, for sure, who think they should get unlimited revisions. I dont take those jobs, otherwise i am working for free. I think its a personal preference, one way isnt any better than the other. A bad client is a bad client.

« Reply #35 on: March 30, 2016, 14:24 »
0
I don't have that problem... because I honestly don't want to be bothered with design work.  I price is high, and long, and hope they go away.  Then sometimes they still want to go forward, so I just buck up and do it.  If something isn't as enjoyable or convenient, or I'm just not in the mood, I quote high.  There are many ways to skin a cat.


 

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