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Author Topic: Vector Graphics, why so expensive?  (Read 10227 times)

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« on: January 07, 2008, 22:55 »
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Here is a general question.
I suppose that I am showing my ignorance here... but why are vector graphics so expensive?

I was looking over at a few in IS and the minimum price that I see is 5 credits.
One I looked at goes for 15 credits. Only one size available, I assume that is because vector graphics are infinitely scaleable?

No offense to the illustrative artists meant, but why are photographs so poorly valued?

Factoring in our investment in equipment (cameras, lenses, lights, studio, props, computer, etc) plus the skills required to post process, not to mention MUA costs and model fees (if you use pro or semi-pro models).... photos should cost a lot more.

It would seem to me that the only up front costs a computer artist has is the computer and time.

So what? Am i wrong?

Anyone have the answer?


« Reply #1 on: January 07, 2008, 23:16 »
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IMHO, it is because they are more like a "raw" image.  The client could not only scale them, but change color, change shapes, remove/add other objects, etc.  Thus, they can end up with many more versions from only one image.

In a way, it would be more like selling the client a RAW photo format (instead of a JPG).

« Reply #2 on: January 07, 2008, 23:23 »
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Artists just require a computer and software, and years of training and practice. But it's mainly reward for the time spent. Now I'm pretty slow in Illustrator, and pretty fast in photoshop, but I can do a shoot and process and upload a reasonable quantity of shots with an afternoon's effort, where I'd be lucky to turn out a single illustration (and that's an illustration where I already have a reference photograph to scan or a set of drawings/watercolor to base it on already done.)

So for 15 credits a designer is purchasing an image that would take them maybe 2-3 hours to construct themselves - in the case of the complex 15 credit vectors, maybe more.  I  don't know what the going hourly rate for a designer is? Maybe 25-50$ per hour?  Do the maths  as to why people pay the money.

 You also have a supply and demand thing affecting the price. Anyone with half an eye and a digital camera and Photoshop Elements can upload photographs to microstock (I'm not saying they will do well, but they do affect the total supply of images). There is a much smaller pool of suppliers who can use vector drawing software and can actually draw a bit.

« Reply #3 on: January 07, 2008, 23:26 »
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Interesting...my step son is a very good artist, although he mainly draws anime.

I should get him illustrator and let him at it!

« Reply #4 on: January 08, 2008, 05:16 »
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As an artist I'm wondering why photo's are so expensive? Just buy a digi camera for a couple hundred bucks, point, shoot and wallah! Next, sort through the dross, do some auto levels with some pirated software, upload the images and keep your fingers crossed. Spray and pray. Who cares if the review list is weeks long. Fill that baby up, with dozens of similar looking images, hey they might accept them all! Woohoo!
Easy peasy. Like takin' candy from a baby. Don't know what the fuss is all about. what? Or am I wrong???

Now for a digital artist, you've probably been drawing since you were 4 years old, you develop some talent (hopefully), plus years learning design at college, then spend a blummin' fortune to buy the software and upgrades, many hundreds of hours learning multiple pieces of software, have a very high spec machine and OS that has to be upgraded frequently to keep up with that software.
Oh and the time. It normally takes me at least a couple of days to produce ONE image. ONE IMAGE! Then you gotta hope that an inspector doesn't turn down the image because they think its not suitable stock ('cos to be honest some inspectors DON'T like anything but photo's for stock, its true).
Grrrrrrr!

And for your information, I don't do Illustrator images by the way. All my stuff tends to be 3D, and are classed as photo's, so I get the same mullah as you photographer guys. Ain't microstock great?

Please take the above rant with a smile, and know I was being a bit sarcy, I've had a bad week (and its only Tuesday). Personally I think we should all be getting way more for an image. Have a good download day.

« Reply #5 on: January 08, 2008, 10:57 »
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Now for a digital artist, you've probably been drawing since you were 4 years old, you develop some talent (hopefully), plus years learning design at college, then spend a blummin' fortune to buy the software and upgrades, many hundreds of hours learning multiple pieces of software, have a very high spec machine and OS that has to be upgraded frequently to keep up with that software."
Interesting observation, so here is my history. Took my first people portrait at age three (honest, used my dad's twin lens reflex camera).
Cut my teeth in dad's darkroom at age five. Had my own darkroom by age twelve. Worked as annual staff photographer for my high school yearbook.
Studied photojournalism, commercial and industrial photography in college.
Ditto everything you said above about software and computers (Mac Pro 2.66gh dual with four drives).

Putting together a shoot: Set up my $3000 lighting set. Arrange and coordinate for the model, make-up artist and hair person to show up on the same day and at approx. the same time (time invested, several days). Put up with flaky models that often call at the last minute with a lame reason for not comming or don't even bother to call. Feed everyone that does come. Pay them. If everything comes together, shoot the session with my $10, 000 plus photo gear (camera body, lenses, lighting modifiers, remote flash triggers). Time invested in actual shoot, five hours.

Go through several hundred photos to cull out the 30 or so real winners.
Post process, including (depending on the models skin quality) 20 to 30 minuted of retouching.

And for all of this, I get to sell a web size image that nets me $0.20?

OK, end of MY rant.

« Reply #6 on: January 08, 2008, 15:58 »
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I think both type of images can be too time and money-consuming to obtain, and in those cases they can be very underpaid.  My type of vector, for instance, is very basic.  I don't hire models or have studio lights for my photos.

There are some amazing and complex vector images out there, and they do deserve a high payment.  One aspect however is that is very common to see the same basic elements used over and over to create new vectors, so this would be the equivalent of a photo series of the same subject under different angles. 

Here is my own example of vector "recycling". And  another example.

Regards,
Adelaide

« Reply #7 on: January 09, 2008, 17:41 »
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Resellers' pricing is not based on how much it costs to produce an image (that is the producer/contributor's problem). It is based on how much the reseller can charge.  Supply and demand.

If making a good illustration were easier (as some posters have claimed) than taking a good photo, then the supply the supply of photos would be less than the supply of vectors, which it is not.

The illustrator's skills are more in demand, because those skills are harder to acquire than a photographer's skills, so they are in shorter supply. This is simply a fact. And the prices in the marketplace prove it.

I started out in microstock submitting photos. I knew 3D and I learned AI (it took me 2 years to get passably good at it). It takes at least ten times longer to learn to make a good illustration with AI or a good 3D render with 3DS Max (which costs about $3000, by the way) than it does to make an equivalently good photo. Maybe 20 times as long.

« Reply #8 on: January 10, 2008, 01:54 »
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Your supply and demand theory makes good sense and I will accept that as the definitive answer to my question.

Best Regards,

Joe

helix7

« Reply #9 on: January 10, 2008, 12:15 »
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Also in line with the supply/demand of illustrator skills is the simple demand for vector images in microstock. Check the "Top" lists at any site and vectors dominate the lists despite being significantly fewer in number compared to photos.

I'm not sure who really puts in more time, photogs or illustrators. A single photo can be produced much quicker than a single illustration, illustrations earn more, photographers may spend more money on equipment and models, illustrators assume more risk with rejections by spending so much time on a single image, photographers have larger portfolios, illustrators have smaller portfolios but their images sell for more money, etc., etc., etc. In the end, it's probably all pretty even.


« Reply #10 on: January 10, 2008, 23:21 »
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why are vector graphics so expensive?....
minimum price that I see is 5 credits.
One I looked at goes for 15 credits....

This is not expensive... even at 15 credits.

And yes, photographers are undervalued... But that's something we did to ourselves.

« Reply #11 on: January 10, 2008, 23:36 »
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As an artist I'm wondering why photo's are so expensive? Just buy a digi camera for a couple hundred bucks, point, shoot and wallah! Next, sort through the dross, do some auto levels with some pirated software, upload the images and keep your fingers crossed. Spray and pray. Who cares if the review list is weeks long. Fill that baby up, with dozens of similar looking images, hey they might accept them all! Woohoo!
Easy peasy. Like takin' candy from a baby. Don't know what the fuss is all about. what? Or am I wrong???

Now for a digital artist, you've probably been drawing since you were 4 years old, you develop some talent (hopefully), plus years learning design at college, then spend a blummin' fortune to buy the software and upgrades, many hundreds of hours learning multiple pieces of software, have a very high spec machine and OS that has to be upgraded frequently to keep up with that software.
Oh and the time. It normally takes me at least a couple of days to produce ONE image. ONE IMAGE! Then you gotta hope that an inspector doesn't turn down the image because they think its not suitable stock ('cos to be honest some inspectors DON'T like anything but photo's for stock, its true).
Grrrrrrr!
I agree that vectors are not overpriced but I found one disparaging point in this post that I couldn't let go (not that the others shouldn't be challenged). Saying that photographers pirate software while "artists" pay a blummin' fortune is highly offensive. First off CS3 Photoshop costs the same as Illustrator, and secondly I'm willing to bet that both can be pirated.

« Reply #12 on: February 07, 2009, 04:57 »
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I registered in this forum only to tell all of you just one thing. Illustrator, Photoshop, 3D studio max or whatever it may be , all these software's pirated versions are available in my country, India. I have all of these pirated versions.I think we don't want to spend a single cent or paise  for these softwares. But Cameras are expensive.Really expensive. So i am not using one. I am with illustrations! haha :D

« Reply #13 on: February 24, 2009, 04:35 »
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JE, this one ended quickly. I guess everybody went to India...

Microbius

« Reply #14 on: February 24, 2009, 04:57 »
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I think it ended quickly because the question was so clearly based on a false premise. Vectors are obviously not at all expensive for what they are.
Aside from everything else there's the fact that you can scale them to any size without any loss of quality. They need to be priced equivalent to the largest available photo size at a minimum.
I'm ignoring the disgusting post from Vivian.

« Reply #15 on: February 24, 2009, 11:15 »
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JE, this one ended quickly. I guess everybody went to India...
:D

« Reply #16 on: February 24, 2009, 14:02 »
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I bet most of people who rant about pirated software use tools from their daytime jobs :-)


« Reply #17 on: February 24, 2009, 14:50 »
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I bet most of people who rant about pirated software use tools from their daytime jobs :-)
I suspect you are right but I hope not. We who make money from selling IP licenses become not only crooks but also hypcrites when we stiff other people who trying to make their livings selling IP licenses. Still I have to admit that getting $3500 3DS Max for free would tempting. How much is airfare to Calcutta?

« Reply #18 on: February 27, 2009, 09:29 »
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First of all vector art is not expensive. But I guess compared to digital photos you might say that. You could also say a rocket ship is more expensive than an airplane. The present pricing more than a buck because it takes time to make the files.

Probably one of the longest times for me to make a vector illustration for a client was 70 hours for which they paid $3500. Granted that was a custom technical vector illustration created from blueprints but to make great stock vector art is nevertheless a very time intensive process.

Try it. It is a very humbling experience. The skill takes years to master. I've been making vector art since 1988 and I'm still honing my craft.


 

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