Author Topic: Model Release for travel photos (Read 9470 times)

Photo_grapher · « **on:** March 18, 2012, 00:55 »

Hello

I am a travel photographer and take all types of related photos. But I can not submit these to stock agencies (except landscapes) as because none of these has model release. I face a similar problems if I visit a market place and photograph human behavior and interaction. I am referring to photos like these: http://www.istockphoto.com/stock-photo-18783154-arrogant-gunners.php?isource=EN_PHOTOFMA [nofollow]
How am I suppose to obtain Model releases in these cases?

Thank you

traveler1116 · « **Reply #1 on:** March 18, 2012, 01:40 »

Quote from: Photo_grapher on March 18, 2012, 00:55

How am I suppose to obtain Model releases in these cases?

Seems pretty straight forward, you have to ask your model to sign a release.

Photo_grapher · « **Reply #2 on:** March 18, 2012, 02:15 »

Quote from: traveler1116 on March 18, 2012, 01:40

Quote from: Photo_grapher on March 18, 2012, 00:55
How am I suppose to obtain Model releases in these cases?
Seems pretty straight forward, you have to ask your model to sign a release.

Thank you.
Did you have any experience like this where you have obtained model releases from total strangers? What about those who can not sign and moreover can not sign in English?

grp_photo · « **Reply #3 on:** March 18, 2012, 02:29 »

You can submit those images to Alamy as Editorial/RM without Modelrelease. Getty has Modelreleases in many languages including Mandarin for example. There isn't much commercial need for RF-pictures like this if an Ad-agency would make a campaign around photography like this they go to Getty/Corbis and buy these pictures RM with exklusive rights. For all other uses books (travelbooks), magazines you don't need releases I would recommend Alamy to you for this kind of stuff.

Sean Locke Photography · « **Reply #4 on:** March 18, 2012, 09:33 »

Quote from: Photo_grapher on March 18, 2012, 00:55

Hello

I am a travel photographer and take all types of related photos. But I can not submit these to stock agencies (except landscapes) as because none of these has model release. I face a similar problems if I visit a market place and photograph human behavior and interaction. I am referring to photos like these: http://www.istockphoto.com/stock-photo-18783154-arrogant-gunners.php?isource=EN_PHOTOFMA
How am I suppose to obtain Model releases in these cases?

Thank you

Sounds like you are a guy who likes to travel and take photos, not a travel photographer. Either you need to make the effort to secure releases by asking after the fact, or hiring models beforehand, or submit them as editorial without a release. But, be aware, everyone who travels and takes pictures of things they see without the effort of securing releases will submit editorial, so essentially, you're just another guy with a camera.

microstockphoto.co.uk · « **Reply #5 on:** March 18, 2012, 11:08 »

Regarding uploading as editorial without releases...

not that I support kidnapping tourists and photographers, but these guys may have a point:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-india-17421561

Are they talking about us when they say tribespeople are being "exhibited like monkeys and chimpanzees"?

We wouldn't like being photographed in public in a European or American town and described as typical western people, or not? (I mean being the main subject of a picture - I am not that paranoid to worry about being photographed in a crowd)

Photo_grapher · « **Reply #6 on:** March 18, 2012, 12:15 »

Thanks again.....

Well, I am not really another guy with the camera

I like to document my travel and to tell the story.
What worries me most is the language problem and there are also some locals who do not know how to read or write. So about them?

grp_photo · « **Reply #7 on:** March 18, 2012, 12:33 »

Quote from: Photo_grapher on March 18, 2012, 12:15

Well, I am not really another guy with the camera

Well I'm sure you are, otherwise you would know more about the legal aspects of photography before you even press the shutter. All photographers overestimate their work the more mediocre and average they are the more they think that their work is special, it's normal.

cascoly · « **Reply #8 on:** March 18, 2012, 13:37 »

Quote from: grp_photo on March 18, 2012, 12:33

Quote from: Photo_grapher on March 18, 2012, 12:15

Well, I am not really another guy with the camera

Well I'm sure you are, otherwise you would know more about the legal aspects of photography before you even press the shutter. All photographers overestimate their work the more mediocre and average they are the more they think that their work is special, it's normal.

well, that certainly added to the conversation - how about giving some useful advice rather than ad hominem attacks,

cascoly · « **Reply #9 on:** March 18, 2012, 13:41 »

Quote from: Photo_grapher on March 18, 2012, 00:55

Hello

I am a travel photographer and take all types of related photos. But I can not submit these to stock agencies (except landscapes) as because none of these has model release. I face a similar problems if I visit a market place and photograph human behavior and interaction. I am referring to photos like these: How am I suppose to obtain Model releases in these cases?

despite the advice to get signed releases while traveling, you probably already know that's just not feasible in many cases, esp'ly when there are multiple people involved, such as a ski resort or market.

so either crop your images [in camera preferably] to eliminate faces, or submit them as editorial -- SS used to accept editorial easily, but has become harder over the last year; but you can good editorial results at DT, Big, 123 and several of the smaller sites like Yay, Most

ShadySue · « **Reply #10 on:** March 18, 2012, 14:11 »

Quote from: Photo_grapher on March 18, 2012, 12:15

Thanks again.....

Well, I am not really another guy with the camera
I like to document my travel and to tell the story.
What worries me most is the language problem and there are also some locals who do not know how to read or write. So about them?

If in an area where they can't read or write, it's very unlikely they will have access to the sort of media which would enable them to envisage the sort of uses their images can be put to. Also, releases generally say that an image can be manipulated: in very remote areas, how many people would have a clue what that means?
Some people pay money for signatures without worrying about whether the person has a clue what they're signing.

One thing I've noticed with travel photos is that there is often a surprising amount of material which would need either PRs or an awful lot of cloning even in very remote areas e.g. you often find people wearing branded or merchandise t-shirts, e.g. second hand or old stock dumped in markets.
Also, with a lot of travel, real life type photos, what would a commercial use for them be anyway? The market is much more editorial, other than travel companies brochures/adverts - and they often get their images free from local tourist offices.

I discussed the issue with my guide in Madagascar, and he agreed that out of the towns, people would not be able to give 'fully-informed consent' to an iStock MR, and suggested he tell people I was a 'photo-journalist', which he thought they would understand, so I guessed that was 'near enough' to an editorial photography.

fotoVoyager · « **Reply #11 on:** March 18, 2012, 15:02 »

Quote from: Photo_grapher on March 18, 2012, 00:55

Hello

I am a travel photographer and take all types of related photos. But I can not submit these to stock agencies (except landscapes) as because none of these has model release. I face a similar problems if I visit a market place and photograph human behavior and interaction. I am referring to photos like these: http://www.istockphoto.com/stock-photo-18783154-arrogant-gunners.php?isource=EN_PHOTOFMA
How am I suppose to obtain Model releases in these cases?

Thank you

Getting strangers to sign a model release is a special talent entirely unrelated to your skill as a photographer. Some people are just really good at it, have the charm and chat to pull it off, others don't.

Many photographers in a place foreign to them will work with a local fixer who will translate and cajole for you. I'm not entirely convinced that some of the shots you see from developing countries have properly informed consent and some photographers are just lying and filling in the m.r. - especially with kids I think.

Don't disregard selling your images as editorial, there's definitely a market for this.

If you look at the work of the guy you use as an example I would guess that he's a Chinese Canadian with either roots in that region, the connections or language skills to let him get those shots model released. Using the advantages you have is a great way to get ahead!

mtkang · « **Reply #12 on:** March 18, 2012, 20:46 »

I think it is always better to send your travel photos to RM agencies..with model release or without. For example the istock image u link to, it is with 7k view, but only 2 downloads, it could be only sold as less than $1 in combine.

for travel images, sometimes i think a model release is good but not a must, for example the tribes in china I will assume they can be used in a travel guidebook or printed as a poster..both are considered editorial use.

ShadySue · « **Reply #13 on:** March 18, 2012, 21:27 »

Quote from: mtkang on March 18, 2012, 20:46

I think it is always better to send your travel photos to RM agencies..with model release or without. For example the istock image u link to, it is with 7k view, but only 2 downloads, it could be only sold as less than $1 in combine.

for travel images, sometimes i think a model release is good but not a must, for example the tribes in china I will assume they can be used in a travel guidebook or printed as a poster..both are considered editorial use.

More than $1, as it is an Agency file; but not rushing off the site either. Couldn't agree more that it would be better in an RM agency.

Unreleased Poster, I'm not sure about. Educational poster: yes, if that tribe should happen to come into any syllabus, it might be used as a poster.
"Come to China" poster e.g. for a travel agent's office, I'm not sure if that's editorial. But some of my editorial in-uses are like that (used by travel companies) - it's a grey area.

grp_photo · « **Reply #14 on:** March 19, 2012, 06:26 »

Quote from: cascoly on March 18, 2012, 13:37

- how about giving some useful advice

well I actually did if you look four posts above that one, but you are right I am loosing my patience easily with all these great photographers which pop up every second.

ruxpriencdiam · « **Reply #15 on:** March 19, 2012, 06:34 »

Any and everyone should know the rules concerning Model Releases and Property Releases.

They should be carried at all times and should be a universal release that will work on any site they submit to.

ShadySue · « **Reply #16 on:** March 19, 2012, 06:37 »

Quote from: ruxpriencdiam on March 19, 2012, 06:34

Any and everyone should know the rules concerning Model Releases and Property Releases.

They should be carried at all times and should be a universal release that will work on any site they submit to.

Most sites will only accept releases in a very small range of languages, none of which will be understood in many, many places, which is the issue the OP brought up.
Would you sign a contract in a language you didn't understand, simply on the 'explanation' of a person you'd only just met? If so, can I interest you in a timeshare ...?

ruxpriencdiam · « **Reply #17 on:** March 19, 2012, 07:12 »

Quote from: ShadySue on March 19, 2012, 06:37

Quote from: ruxpriencdiam on March 19, 2012, 06:34
Any and everyone should know the rules concerning Model Releases and Property Releases.

They should be carried at all times and should be a universal release that will work on any site they submit to.

Most sites will only accept releases in a very small range of languages, none of which will be understood in many, many places, which is the issue the OP brought up.
Would you sign a contract in a language you didn't understand, simply on the 'explanation' of a person you'd only just met? If so, can I interest you in a timeshare ...?

I missed that part somewhere then because the OP just asked

Quote

How am I suppose to obtain Model releases in these cases?

There was nothing stated about language.

ShadySue · « **Reply #18 on:** March 19, 2012, 07:16 »

Quote from: ruxpriencdiam on March 19, 2012, 07:12

Quote from: ShadySue on March 19, 2012, 06:37
Quote from: ruxpriencdiam on March 19, 2012, 06:34
Any and everyone should know the rules concerning Model Releases and Property Releases.

They should be carried at all times and should be a universal release that will work on any site they submit to.

Most sites will only accept releases in a very small range of languages, none of which will be understood in many, many places, which is the issue the OP brought up.
Would you sign a contract in a language you didn't understand, simply on the 'explanation' of a person you'd only just met? If so, can I interest you in a timeshare ...?
I missed that part somewhere then because the OP just asked
Quote
How am I suppose to obtain Model releases in these cases?
There was nothing stated about language.

It was surely one of the main implied issues. What issues would you expect there to be? I don't know about the people in the exact photo the OP referenced, but when travelling in many places the issues would be language and knowledge of the uses to which the image could be put and of image manipulation, therefore putting the notion of 'fully-informed consent' at risk.
Yes, you could get a copy of an MR in different languages (but what if the people are illiterate?), but again, would you sign a contract in a language you didn't know just because a stranger provided you with an alleged 'translation' in your own language?

ShadySue · « **Reply #19 on:** March 19, 2012, 09:13 »

Another issue is whether a particular image has more likelihood to sell as serious editorial (e.g. textbooks, guide books) than commercial. Some textbook publishers won't touch micro main collection stuff as they have no way of knowing if it's genuine or just some random people posing to represent something. E.g. I was astonished about a particular photo series when I started iStock, as I couldn't see how a MR could be obtained, and discovered that the the American tog's son was a set up model. not what it purported to be in the description. Which is not OK if authenticity/reality is what is needed.

ShadySue · « **Reply #20 on:** March 19, 2012, 14:44 »

Quote from: ruxpriencdiam on March 19, 2012, 07:12

Quote
I missed that part somewhere then because the OP just asked
Quote
How am I suppose to obtain Model releases in these cases?
There was nothing stated about language.

"What about those who can not sign and moreover can not sign in English?" (the OP's second post, above)

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Author Topic: Model Release for travel photos (Read 9470 times)

Photo_grapher

traveler1116

Photo_grapher

grp_photo

Sean Locke Photography

microstockphoto.co.uk

Photo_grapher

grp_photo

cascoly

cascoly

ShadySue

fotoVoyager

mtkang

ShadySue

grp_photo

ruxpriencdiam

ShadySue

ruxpriencdiam

ShadySue

ShadySue

ShadySue

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