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Author Topic: Pros and cons of revenue sharing model vs flat percentage of sale price  (Read 1778 times)

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SpaceStockFootage

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« Reply #25 on: November 30, 2019, 23:24 »
0
You should check it out, it's pretty good!


SpaceStockFootage

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« Reply #26 on: November 30, 2019, 23:39 »
+1
So "fair %50 revenue for all" or is it "bonuses for the best sellers" ?
Cause these 2 at the same time can't exist. %50 equal revenue means %50 equal.
It's that simple.

They only can't exist at the same time if you don't understand it. They do pay out 50% of all revenue... but surprisingly enough, if the Envato revenue is $1m in a month, you don't get $500,000. If you were the only contributor you would, or if there were 100 contributors and only your content was downloaded... then you would. That's how the revenue share works. The bonus also works that way, but the money that makes up the bonus scheme comes from the revenue generated by people who have a subscription but haven't downloaded anything.

Which is another thing that makes it fair... they've paid Envato and not downloaded anything. There would be nothing stopping Envato from just keeping that money, but they share it out at 50% as well.

Fact is, only @ Envato Elements you don't get to see how many downloaded your item!
Why don't you ever mention that? How is that "fair" ??

Pretty sure all subscription services work that way. Adobe, Shutterstock and Getty don't hide that information because they don;t offer unlimited subscription services. Why didn't I bring it up? Because the thread is about revenue share, my answers have been about revenue share, I'm attempting to explain revenue share to people who refuse to believe how it works and nobody brought up the lack of sales stats.

You mentioned Getty... why didn't you mention their super-low commission rate? The same reason I didn't mention the payout dates, review process, acceptance rates, sales taxes, VAT, review process, item removal, search rankings, management, staff, marketing, social media approach, upload process, subscription price.... It's got screw-all to do with what we're talking about. You just brought it up because you're possibly finally accepting that they actually pay out 50%, so you need to throw something else into the mix that you can be unhappy about, and continue to hate Envato for!

« Reply #27 on: December 01, 2019, 04:06 »
+1
The problem with Elements is not the 50% share of earnings. The problem is the unlimited downloads, which in my case resulted in almost half of my sales earning me nothing, while the rest only earned me between $0.01 and $0.20.  Now last time I check 50% of zero is still zero.  Now, if there was a cap on downloads, resulting in an acceptable earnings per download I would not have a problem with the 50% share of earnings. 
 
I believe those contributors doing well on Elements by receiving the majority of the bonus payments are not photographers. They are selling other media types. I do not see any future for photographers on Elements where a subscriber for $16 can potentially download your whole portfolio in one month. Sites like Elements are the real danger to the stock photography industry and I strongly encourage photographers not to support them.
 
If you request withdrawal from Elements, be very careful of their games. I requested my withdrawal from Elements middle September.  I received confirmation that all my images will be removed by 31 October (why not 30 September?). They then proceed to immediately block my access to my Elements author page to prevent me from seeing my daily sales stats.  Come 31 October and my images are still available on Elements and they ignore my e-mail messages. By middle November out of desperation I proceeded to delete all my images manually to protect them from further exploitation. After several more messages, my one image left was removed from Elements on 28 November and my PhotoDune page also closed (almost a month later than agreed). They say they will pay me the outstanding amount, but since they blocked my access to my author page I have no idea how much is owned to me.

« Reply #28 on: December 02, 2019, 10:53 »
0
@Noedelhap apologis for the offtopic.

@Bad Robot

if you don't mind can you share your envato sales number  for May -Jun vs Jul - Aug 2019?

Quote

May 2019 $267.89 bonus
June 2019 $224.41 bonus

then
 
July 2019 $9.43 bonus
August $10.63 bonus
Sept. $0.00
Oct. $0.00

The revenue share scheme is a joke "based on my own actual observation of what they actually did"

Oh and they sold 80 of my images in October and I made a grand total of $13.67
or $0.17 per sale which is way below par compared to other agencies.

« Reply #29 on: December 02, 2019, 14:08 »
0
@Noedelhap apologis for the offtopic.

@Bad Robot

if you don't mind can you share your envato sales number  for May -Jun vs Jul - Aug 2019?

Quote

May 2019 $267.89 bonus
June 2019 $224.41 bonus

then
 
July 2019 $9.43 bonus
August $10.63 bonus
Sept. $0.00
Oct. $0.00

The revenue share scheme is a joke "based on my own actual observation of what they actually did"

Oh and they sold 80 of my images in October and I made a grand total of $13.67
or $0.17 per sale which is way below par compared to other agencies.

Hi George any reason why you want to know?




« Reply #30 on: December 02, 2019, 15:00 »
0
Guess from own curiosity. Reading older threads and opinions, I am trying to understand if bonus is linked to selling numbers?

« Reply #31 on: December 02, 2019, 15:38 »
+1
Guess from own curiosity. Reading older threads and opinions, I am trying to understand if bonus is linked to selling numbers?

The Envato/Photodune bonus is linked to how many images are accepted by them in a 90 day period i.e. 10 images per 90 days.

But even if you get the required number of images accepted you certainly do not get anything like the 50% bonus they provided up to June 2019.

Now its a few dollars if that.

And even though I uploaded images and they were accepted I still didn't get any bonus in September or October.


« Reply #32 on: December 02, 2019, 15:51 »
0
Got it. Thanks for answering :)

SpaceStockFootage

  • Space, Sci-Fi and Astronomy Related Stock Footage

« Reply #33 on: December 02, 2019, 16:33 »
+2
Whether you get the bonus or not is linked to how many images are accepted... but how much bonus you get is linked to selling numbers.

« Reply #34 on: December 03, 2019, 19:07 »
+1
Quote
how much bonus you get is linked to selling numbers.
it's not linked to selling numbers, because you are not the one selling the images. (what happened to your obsession with "facts" now?, the taxation is with the Australian Tax Treaty since Envato is selling the images)
Unlike Envato Market, in Envato Elements you're basically granting them the right to sell the images.
That's why they don't claim Elements is a "Platform" like Envato Market is.

They are downloaded as part of an unlimited plan, and the bonus is in relativity to others.
So lets say your image was downloaded 10k times, but others' images were downloaded a million.
You'll get a tiny fraction, if you're lucky, since it could be $0.001 you might've just given away your work for free, 10 thousand times.


Now that's just with images, but in reality, you're competing with Videos / Website themes / Sound files etc...
Let's not even mention the fact everything on elements gets pirated in seconds to illegal websites.

Good luck to Elements contributors, you're going to need it.


This is exactly what Spotify did to music, they've succeeded to some extent, but many musicians still refuse and reject their idea.
Envato just "copied" Spotify's concept into the Stock Image/Video/Template world.
« Last Edit: December 04, 2019, 00:33 by vectorblazer »

SpaceStockFootage

  • Space, Sci-Fi and Astronomy Related Stock Footage

« Reply #35 on: December 04, 2019, 23:16 »
+1
That's as may be. But absolutely none of that relates to the fact that... yes, how much bonus you get is linked to selling numbers. That's a fact. None of that is influenced by how much you dislike Elements, how many people may download your content, how much you may get per download, how much you get taxed, who is selling your content etc etc.

I just find it weird that I say something like "the bonus is linked to selling numbers" and you seem to read that as "the bonus is linked to selling numbers and Elements is amazing, and super perfect... the best platform to sell your work in the universe! They don;t charge you any taxes, they pay out 200% of revenue and you get about $1000 per download. Yay!"

If you want to complain about, dispute, argue or debate what I'm saying... that's fine. But you seem to want to complain about, dispute, argue or debate a whole bunch of stuff... that I haven't said!

« Reply #36 on: Yesterday at 01:30 »
+1
again. it's not linked to selling numbers.
you aren't selling your content, nor is Envato.
The content is included within the unlimited subscription.
The only "selling numbers" are subscriptions. That's the only financial transaction that's being made.
Financial transactions are what "sales" and "selling" are.
The bonus is linked to downloads. not sales, not selling numbers. stop lying.

If it was really linked to "selling numbers" than it wouldn't matter how many people download your photos or website template. Because Envato had X amount of new subscribers.
So if there was a huge amount of new subscribers, then you'd have a big bonus, regardless of downloads, just because of incredible "selling numbers".
But its not, how many people OUT of those selling numbers end up downloading your content is what makes the bonus.

The rest of your reply is once again, a total exaggeration and off-topic, just like that hitler example earlier.
« Last Edit: Yesterday at 01:42 by vectorblazer »

SpaceStockFootage

  • Space, Sci-Fi and Astronomy Related Stock Footage

« Reply #37 on: Yesterday at 04:27 »
0
again. it's not linked to selling numbers.
you aren't selling your content, nor is Envato.
The content is included within the unlimited subscription.
The only "selling numbers" are subscriptions. That's the only financial transaction that's being made.
Financial transactions are what "sales" and "selling" are.
The bonus is linked to downloads. not sales, not selling numbers. stop lying.

If it was really linked to "selling numbers" than it wouldn't matter how many people download your photos or website template. Because Envato had X amount of new subscribers.
So if there was a huge amount of new subscribers, then you'd have a big bonus, regardless of downloads, just because of incredible "selling numbers".
But its not, how many people OUT of those selling numbers end up downloading your content is what makes the bonus.

The rest of your reply is once again, a total exaggeration and off-topic, just like that hitler example earlier.

He said selling numbers, I just used his turn of phrase. Of course it's downloads. Downloads, selling numbers... same thing. You don't honestly believe that I was insinuating (or that anybody thinks) that the bonus (and by extension the actual earnings) are just shared out to everyone equally... which is how it would have to be done if it was based on the selling numbers, i.e. the revenue generated from subscription sales?! So somebody who has one item on Elements and zero downloads would get the same as somebody who has loads of items and gets thousands of downloads?   

« Reply #38 on: Yesterday at 05:16 »
0
Quote
None of that is influenced by how much you dislike Elements, how many people may download your content,


SpaceStockFootage

  • Space, Sci-Fi and Astronomy Related Stock Footage

« Reply #39 on: Yesterday at 14:03 »
0
I was referring to this part...

So lets say your image was downloaded 10k times, but others' images were downloaded a million.
You'll get a tiny fraction, if you're lucky, since it could be $0.001 you might've just given away your work for free, 10 thousand times.

But just to clarify... are you still disagreeing that Envato pay out 50% of their Elements revenue? If anyone wants an abridged version of this conversation, then htye should just read this (well, it;s how it feels like anyway):

Envato pay out 50% of all Elements revenue to contributors.
No they don't, they hide the download numbers.
Yeah ok, but they do pay out 50% of all Elements revenue to contributors.
No, they pay next to nothing per download.
Yeah, they might... but they do pay out 50%
No, they charge withholding tax so you don't even get all that much.
Yeah right, but that doesn't change the fact that they pay out 50%.
Yeah but you don't get 50% because you're competing with videos and websites.
Sure you are, but they still pay out 50%.

Apart from the mixup with the whole 'selling numbers' / 'downloads' thing (and maybe the bit above that I admit could be misconstrued)... when have I said anything in this thread that was untrue?
 


 

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