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Microstock Photography Forum - General => General Stock Discussion => Topic started by: PixelsAway on August 01, 2020, 08:21

Title: RPD in SS and AS
Post by: PixelsAway on August 01, 2020, 08:21
RPD - last 3 months in my portfolio (20K+ files, 97% still images)

           SS      AS
May     0.73    0.95
Jun      0.84    1.00
Jul       0.65    0.92

In June SS was outperforming AS in total earnings, May and July almost the same.
Title: Re: RPD in SS and AS
Post by: PixelsAway on August 01, 2020, 08:35
total microstock earnings from the first 7 months of 2020 compared to 2019:
-1% with ~1800+ files uploaded this year

It's actually much better than in previous 3 years or so.
I am just trying to find some good news here ...
Title: Re: RPD in SS and AS
Post by: Uncle Pete on August 01, 2020, 09:28
total microstock earnings from the first 7 months of 2020 compared to 2019:
-1% with ~1800+ files uploaded this year

It's actually much better than in previous 3 years or so.
I am just trying to find some good news here ...

Right, RPD is better at AS, but earnings are better at SS.

While I'm easily down 60% and that's all agencies, not the latest protest hate site  ;) some people have been doing better. From a superficial, (opinion not scientific) general read, more people are not. I honestly think the answer is down to current news or trending materials, newer images, trending colors and designs and what's needed now, not old worn out Microstock cliche images.

What's odd for me, is the Editorial hasn't lost anything, some are years old, out of date, but my personal stock "best sellers", have lower downloads, everywhere.

I'm tired...  :-\ Unmotivated, with little energy to push on regardless and make new images. That's not just the 10¢ slap, but everywhere for everything stock, for me.

Nice to hear a few people are holding up. I know some personally who are maintaing, and the only reason I can see is this. They do exceptional, well thought out work.
(https://i.postimg.cc/Wb1BsjkY/cool-up.gif)
Title: Re: RPD in SS and AS
Post by: Pauws99 on August 01, 2020, 10:20
"I'm tired...  :-\ Unmotivated, with little energy to push on regardless and make new images. That's not just the 10¢ slap, but everywhere for everything stock, for me." I've got a few images waiting to be keyworded I really can't be bothered right now. Realistically I'm not good enough or motivated enough to make it feel worthwhile.
Title: Re: RPD in SS and AS
Post by: PixelsAway on August 01, 2020, 11:47
Staying motivated is a challenge!

If stock photography is your job you need a hobby or personal project - I am just starting medium format film photography.
Title: Re: RPD in SS and AS
Post by: cascoly on August 01, 2020, 19:16
total microstock earnings from the first 7 months of 2020 compared to 2019:
-1% with ~1800+ files uploaded this year

It's actually much better than in previous 3 years or so.
I am just trying to find some good news here ...

Right, RPD is better at AS, but earnings are better at SS.

While I'm easily down 60% and that's all agencies, not the latest protest hate site  ;) some people have been doing better. From a superficial, (opinion not scientific) general read, more people are not. I honestly think the answer is down to current news or trending materials, newer images, trending colors and designs and what's needed now, not old worn out Microstock cliche images.

What's odd for me, is the Editorial hasn't lost anything, some are years old, out of date, but my personal stock "best sellers", have lower downloads, everywhere.

I'm tired...  :-\ Unmotivated, with little energy to push on regardless and make new images. That's not just the 10¢ slap, but everywhere for everything stock, for me.
...

partly it's covid - there's mental toll that flies under our personal radar: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/09/opinion/sunday/coronavirus-depression-anxiety.html (https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/09/opinion/sunday/coronavirus-depression-anxiety.html)

i don't track RPD, but my # of downloads is off about30% across all agencies, so it's not just SS policy, that makes it worse, but the problem is deeper and likely related to the economic devastation - millions more unemployed and federal benefits stopped yesterday, millions losing health case, no-eviction mandates expiring, ...

given this, it's not surprising that the image market has imploded - a similar but smaller process took place during the 200+ financial crisis; this time any recovery looks to be much slower
Title: Re: RPD in SS and AS
Post by: Pauws99 on August 02, 2020, 02:02
total microstock earnings from the first 7 months of 2020 compared to 2019:
-1% with ~1800+ files uploaded this year

It's actually much better than in previous 3 years or so.
I am just trying to find some good news here ...

Right, RPD is better at AS, but earnings are better at SS.

While I'm easily down 60% and that's all agencies, not the latest protest hate site  ;) some people have been doing better. From a superficial, (opinion not scientific) general read, more people are not. I honestly think the answer is down to current news or trending materials, newer images, trending colors and designs and what's needed now, not old worn out Microstock cliche images.

What's odd for me, is the Editorial hasn't lost anything, some are years old, out of date, but my personal stock "best sellers", have lower downloads, everywhere.

I'm tired...  :-\ Unmotivated, with little energy to push on regardless and make new images. That's not just the 10¢ slap, but everywhere for everything stock, for me.
...

partly it's covid - there's mental toll that flies under our personal radar: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/09/opinion/sunday/coronavirus-depression-anxiety.html (https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/09/opinion/sunday/coronavirus-depression-anxiety.html)

i don't track RPD, but my # of downloads is off about30% across all agencies, so it's not just SS policy, that makes it worse, but the problem is deeper and likely related to the economic devastation - millions more unemployed and federal benefits stopped yesterday, millions losing health case, no-eviction mandates expiring, ...

given this, it's not surprising that the image market has imploded - a similar but smaller process took place during the 200+ financial crisis; this time any recovery looks to be much slower
Covid is often accelerating a trend that is already there from 5 years to three months. In the UK this is things like closures of bland "me too" Restaurant chains. Mstock has been on a downward path for contributors for some time. Strangely though my image sales are holding up numbers wise and with the obvious exception of SS RPD too.
Title: Re: RPD in SS and AS
Post by: mino216 on August 02, 2020, 05:21
In my case, for the last five months

SS: 0.54 0.64 0.61 0.33 0.38
AS: 0.89 0.87 0.75 1.28 0.97

Total earnings difference for AS:
+35% +43% -11% +187% +132%

AS used to have 40% higher RPD, now it is +216% (approx. +160% if I subtract ELs at AS from June).
Title: Re: RPD in SS and AS
Post by: Snow on August 02, 2020, 09:06
There is someone over at SS forum who is thrilled to have 33 x $5.22 clip sales and others seem to be in awe. If it was one or two clip or image sales (SOD) for that total amount then sure not bad but 33 clips. I've noticed over the years that many don't even have a clue how much they could or should be making. They even think they are doing well with this kind of performance.

The next generation of Microstockers I guess and it looks like this is the kind of contributors SS want to go forward with, the clueless.
Title: Re: RPD in SS and AS
Post by: Clair Voyant on August 02, 2020, 09:52
There is someone over at SS forum who is thrilled to have 33 x $5.22 clip sales and others seem to be in awe. If it was one or two clip or image sales (SOD) for that total amount then sure not bad but 33 clips. I've noticed over the years that many don't even have a clue how much they could or should be making. They even think they are doing well with this kind of performance.

The next generation of Microstockers I guess and it looks like this is the kind of contributors SS want to go forward with, the clueless.

That is how microstock took off... the clueless.
Title: Re: RPD in SS and AS
Post by: Snow on August 02, 2020, 10:24
There is someone over at SS forum who is thrilled to have 33 x $5.22 clip sales and others seem to be in awe. If it was one or two clip or image sales (SOD) for that total amount then sure not bad but 33 clips. I've noticed over the years that many don't even have a clue how much they could or should be making. They even think they are doing well with this kind of performance.

The next generation of Microstockers I guess and it looks like this is the kind of contributors SS want to go forward with, the clueless.

That is how microstock took off... the clueless.

Hah I guess you're right!
But then that would make me one of them  :-\
For me it never felt right submitting to Microstock and I'm still trying to cut down on time and effort to make it still worth it. Funny thing is they expect you to do the opposite ::)
Title: Re: RPD in SS and AS
Post by: Clair Voyant on August 02, 2020, 11:31
There is someone over at SS forum who is thrilled to have 33 x $5.22 clip sales and others seem to be in awe. If it was one or two clip or image sales (SOD) for that total amount then sure not bad but 33 clips. I've noticed over the years that many don't even have a clue how much they could or should be making. They even think they are doing well with this kind of performance.

The next generation of Microstockers I guess and it looks like this is the kind of contributors SS want to go forward with, the clueless.

That is how microstock took off... the clueless.

Hah I guess you're right!
But then that would make me one of them  :-\
For me it never felt right submitting to Microstock and I'm still trying to cut down on time and effort to make it still worth it. Funny thing is they expect you to do the opposite ::)

I came quite late to the party of microstock mainly due to the financial pressure it was placing on a once wonderful sustainable industry. I ended up submitting as IS exclusive selling rejects from GI and it was okay for a while considering I was selling myself short, but I could never understand why anyone in their right mind would give their work to a subscription site notably SS and sell themselves even shorter. Oddly enough... and people forget this, IS was the only microstock agency holding out for higher prices and finally succumbed to subscription pressures and racing to the bottom. IMHO the genie is out of the bottle and there is no going back. It's all way too corporate to make it beneficial to any contributor.

Title: Re: RPD in SS and AS
Post by: Lola Ginabrigeta on August 02, 2020, 14:10
There is someone over at SS forum who is thrilled to have 33 x $5.22 clip sales and others seem to be in awe. If it was one or two clip or image sales (SOD) for that total amount then sure not bad but 33 clips. I've noticed over the years that many don't even have a clue how much they could or should be making. They even think they are doing well with this kind of performance.

The next generation of Microstockers I guess and it looks like this is the kind of contributors SS want to go forward with, the clueless.

That is how microstock took off... the clueless.

Hah I guess you're right!
But then that would make me one of them  :-\
For me it never felt right submitting to Microstock and I'm still trying to cut down on time and effort to make it still worth it. Funny thing is they expect you to do the opposite ::)

I came quite late to the party of microstock mainly due to the financial pressure it was placing on a once wonderful sustainable industry. I ended up submitting as IS exclusive selling rejects from GI and it was okay for a while considering I was selling myself short, but I could never understand why anyone in their right mind would give their work to a subscription site notably SS and sell themselves even shorter. Oddly enough... and people forget this, IS was the only microstock agency holding out for higher prices and finally succumbed to subscription pressures and racing to the bottom. IMHO the genie is out of the bottle and there is no going back. It's all way too corporate to make it beneficial to any contributor.

The old subscription model is dead, now we have Freepix Payment per Download.
Title: Re: RPD in SS and AS
Post by: Snow on August 02, 2020, 14:51
There is someone over at SS forum who is thrilled to have 33 x $5.22 clip sales and others seem to be in awe. If it was one or two clip or image sales (SOD) for that total amount then sure not bad but 33 clips. I've noticed over the years that many don't even have a clue how much they could or should be making. They even think they are doing well with this kind of performance.

The next generation of Microstockers I guess and it looks like this is the kind of contributors SS want to go forward with, the clueless.

That is how microstock took off... the clueless.

Hah I guess you're right!
But then that would make me one of them  :-\
For me it never felt right submitting to Microstock and I'm still trying to cut down on time and effort to make it still worth it. Funny thing is they expect you to do the opposite ::)

I came quite late to the party of microstock mainly due to the financial pressure it was placing on a once wonderful sustainable industry. I ended up submitting as IS exclusive selling rejects from GI and it was okay for a while considering I was selling myself short, but I could never understand why anyone in their right mind would give their work to a subscription site notably SS and sell themselves even shorter. Oddly enough... and people forget this, IS was the only microstock agency holding out for higher prices and finally succumbed to subscription pressures and racing to the bottom. IMHO the genie is out of the bottle and there is no going back. It's all way too corporate to make it beneficial to any contributor.

Oh but people don't want to hear that anymore, they only want to hear positive stories!
It doesn't matter if it's bad, just cover it up and make it good news.
Micro truly is all about happy smiling people isn't it.

I forgot about IS being the last to succumb to the subscription model.
I've quit them years ago and most likely won't go back. For those already in and still making good money (more then a few hundred) it would probably make sense for them to stick around.

It's sad that to read all the negative but it's the truth.

ps. sorry to hijack your thread PixelsAway. I'll refrain from posting here to keep things positive.
Title: Re: RPD in SS and AS
Post by: Pauws99 on August 03, 2020, 01:00
There is someone over at SS forum who is thrilled to have 33 x $5.22 clip sales and others seem to be in awe. If it was one or two clip or image sales (SOD) for that total amount then sure not bad but 33 clips. I've noticed over the years that many don't even have a clue how much they could or should be making. They even think they are doing well with this kind of performance.

The next generation of Microstockers I guess and it looks like this is the kind of contributors SS want to go forward with, the clueless.
Does $100 earnt in Sods buy more burgers than $100 from subscriptions?
Title: Re: RPD in SS and AS
Post by: Snow on August 03, 2020, 02:35
There is someone over at SS forum who is thrilled to have 33 x $5.22 clip sales and others seem to be in awe. If it was one or two clip or image sales (SOD) for that total amount then sure not bad but 33 clips. I've noticed over the years that many don't even have a clue how much they could or should be making. They even think they are doing well with this kind of performance.

The next generation of Microstockers I guess and it looks like this is the kind of contributors SS want to go forward with, the clueless.
Does $100 earnt in Sods buy more burgers than $100 from subscriptions?

Ah yes another smartass. Instead of ignoring I will satisfy your needs for today, here goes:

33 x $5,22 = $172,26

Are you with me so far?

I said it would be worth it if it was one or two sales: $172,26 / 2 = $86,13

Do you prefer one sale at $86,13 or $5,22?

It’s not the total amount I am talking about, it’s the price per product or the royalty we receive from it. Don’t care? only total earnings count? well you should because that is the reason this business is going down. Not going down for you? well goodie! it is though for the other 95% of contributors but that’s probably irrelevant.

Why not take 172 x 1 dollar clips and then receive nothing but dollar clips, no matter the volume?
Title: Re: RPD in SS and AS
Post by: Pauws99 on August 03, 2020, 03:12
You are not comparing like with like of course one sale worth more is better. Yes if I sold more than  172 times as many at that price I'd take it.
Title: Re: RPD in SS and AS
Post by: Snow on August 03, 2020, 03:19
You are not comparing like with like of course one sale worth more is better. Yes if I sold more than  172 times as many at that price I'd take it.

Oh I know you would  ::)
Title: Re: RPD in SS and AS
Post by: WD3 Photography on August 03, 2020, 06:54
July 2020

Adobe Stock RPD $1.48 (from 20 sales)

Shutterstock RPD $0.29 (from 73 sales)
Title: Re: RPD in SS and AS
Post by: Brasilnut on August 03, 2020, 12:15
SS = 10,424 images
AS = 3,469 images
Title: Re: RPD in SS and AS
Post by: Morphart on August 03, 2020, 12:18
RPD - last 3 months in my portfolio (90% illustration, very large portfolio). SS July had a lot of SOD (more than 100 during the weeke-end) at the end of the month which made the RPD jump up, I was not expecting any miracle from SS.

           SS      AS
May     0.77    0.88
Jun      0.66    0.87
Jul       0.86    0.99
Title: Re: RPD in SS and AS
Post by: Cobra on August 03, 2020, 19:02
SS = 10,424 images
AS = 3,469 images

You're a raising star amongst us! Plus a good author- great monthly articles and book for newbie's to learn how to make $$$ in this tough business! keep up the super work sir!
Title: Re: RPD in SS and AS
Post by: cascoly on August 03, 2020, 19:05
July
SS $0.289
AS $0.893

but actual $ from SS were 3x AS
Title: Re: RPD in SS and AS
Post by: wds on August 03, 2020, 21:23
There is someone over at SS forum who is thrilled to have 33 x $5.22 clip sales and others seem to be in awe. If it was one or two clip or image sales (SOD) for that total amount then sure not bad but 33 clips. I've noticed over the years that many don't even have a clue how much they could or should be making. They even think they are doing well with this kind of performance.

The next generation of Microstockers I guess and it looks like this is the kind of contributors SS want to go forward with, the clueless.

That is how microstock took off... the clueless.

Hah I guess you're right!
But then that would make me one of them  :-\
For me it never felt right submitting to Microstock and I'm still trying to cut down on time and effort to make it still worth it. Funny thing is they expect you to do the opposite ::)

I came quite late to the party of microstock mainly due to the financial pressure it was placing on a once wonderful sustainable industry. I ended up submitting as IS exclusive selling rejects from GI and it was okay for a while considering I was selling myself short, but I could never understand why anyone in their right mind would give their work to a subscription site notably SS and sell themselves even shorter. Oddly enough... and people forget this, IS was the only microstock agency holding out for higher prices and finally succumbed to subscription pressures and racing to the bottom. IMHO the genie is out of the bottle and there is no going back. It's all way too corporate to make it beneficial to any contributor.

The only way "there is no going back" may not be true is if ultimately, the agencies find they have pushed pricing so low that they themselves can no longer sustain a business.
Title: Re: RPD in SS and AS
Post by: cascoly on August 03, 2020, 22:01

The only way "there is no going back" may not be true is if ultimately, the agencies find they have pushed pricing so low that they themselves can no longer sustain a business.

whole point is they HAVEN'T reduced prices, just the amt paid to contributors - they continue to make the same as before
Title: Re: RPD in SS and AS
Post by: Pauws99 on August 04, 2020, 01:17

The only way "there is no going back" may not be true is if ultimately, the agencies find they have pushed pricing so low that they themselves can no longer sustain a business.

whole point is they HAVEN'T reduced prices, just the amt paid to contributors - they continue to make the same as before
A pricing model based on a percentage paves the way for doing that..and we don't really know whether they've cut prices or not with the various deals they flog.
Title: Re: RPD in SS and AS
Post by: wds on August 04, 2020, 07:52

The only way "there is no going back" may not be true is if ultimately, the agencies find they have pushed pricing so low that they themselves can no longer sustain a business.

whole point is they HAVEN'T reduced prices, just the amt paid to contributors - they continue to make the same as before

I  understand that. But "big picture"wise generally speaking, it's a lot cheaper for someone to purchase stock photography than it was 10+ years ago. That's really the root of the problem in addition to the agencies very low payouts. The agencies are responsible for that decline in value via their pricing policies and they themselves may ultimately fall victim to it...pricing themselves out of business.
Title: Re: RPD in SS and AS
Post by: DallasP on August 04, 2020, 15:59
I  understand that. But "big picture"wise generally speaking, it's a lot cheaper for someone to purchase stock photography than it was 10+ years ago. That's really the root of the problem in addition to the agencies very low payouts. The agencies are responsible for that decline in value via their pricing policies and they themselves may ultimately fall victim to it...pricing themselves out of business.

That only happens in businesses with real fixed costs ... SS financials are pretty solid (especially now).
Title: Re: RPD in SS and AS
Post by: cascoly on August 04, 2020, 16:19

The only way "there is no going back" may not be true is if ultimately, the agencies find they have pushed pricing so low that they themselves can no longer sustain a business.

whole point is they HAVEN'T reduced prices, just the amt paid to contributors - they continue to make the same as before

I  understand that. But "big picture"wise generally speaking, it's a lot cheaper for someone to purchase stock photography than it was 10+ years ago. That's really the root of the problem in addition to the agencies very low payouts. The agencies are responsible for that decline in value via their pricing policies and they themselves may ultimately fall victim to it...pricing themselves out of business.

the 'lower' prices have come mostly from subscriptions while single image sales have remained constant - they rely on many/most buyers not to use their full quota, there by reducing number of sales they have to pay to contributors while retaining most of the subscription price

canva leads the way on this -at the end of the month, they pay a subscription commission  based on each artists sub dl.