MicrostockGroup
Microstock Photography Forum - General => General Stock Discussion => Topic started by: gostwyck on August 01, 2010, 05:13
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The summer slump continued for me with the total for last month being 6% down compared to July 09, basically the same as May & June. The percentages for each agency are as follows (with 09);
IS 35.3 (39.5)
SS 26.5 (22.3)
FT 25.1 (17.7)
DT 9.2 (13.2)
BS 2.8 (1.8 )
All agencies seem to be affected fairly equally by the apparent reduced demand although, over the year, FT continue to grow their market share whilst DT falls ever further behind. Earnings at DT were down 34% compared to July 09 whilst earnings at FT were up 35% over the same period.
Interesting to see that SS appear to have strengthened their market share, despite the competition from TS. Istock on the other hand have slipped a little perhaps due to the price increases and/or because they've been directing volume customers to TS.
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I've dropped out of these types of topics for psychological reasons. Much too depressing to dwell upon.
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It's my first month as an exclusive at IS and I'm happy so far. My july earning is better than what I had hoped for. I did not have time to submit a lot of photo (3rd baby is due this week) but my revenues on IS were more than 3 times what they were in june for about the same number of sales. My total earnings are on par with what I had in april and may this year when I was still with all the major agencies but it's at 65% of what I made in july 09. The biggest difference is my RPD who shot up to 3.41$.
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I'm not going to give individual stats, but here's the high level overview:
My overall earnings for July 2010 were down 60% from July 2009, despite having increased my portfolio size by about 30%. Compared to July of 2008, I am down 70%.
It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out where this is going. My days in this business are numbered, whether I like it or not.
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-30% from previous month...
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I am small peanuts so maybe it don't count , but for me;;
Shutterstock was consistent 3 months same earnings.
IStock was second best
Fotolia was a big surprise after many months no sales to come in with one Extended Licence .
Dreamstime was consistent although I still only get downloads for my oldest stuff.
I wonder whether it is going to make any difference if I stop giving them new stuff because for many months no downloads for the new stuff.
The amazing thing is for Shutterstock, even though I make so little por download
my earning is now as much as what I earn for the others. Even though for the others I have been with them for many many many more months with many many
more pictures in my portfolio.
Shutterstock I am only 3 months old and tiny portfolio.
But cash per download is still Istock the best.
But this month Fotolia pay the best due to Ext Lic.
But dreamstime still made me most money. I wonder if I go exclusive I make more with them. But I like Shutterstock and Istock too, but Istock is too diificult
to catch up on submission because Shutterstock is no limit.
Thank you for chance to my view :)
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3rd best month overall. Not bad for summer :)
IS - 39%
SS - 25%
DT - 14%
FT - 8%
Veer - 8%
CanStockPhoto - 2%
123RF - 2%
BS - 2%
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Small fish alert (+- 300imgs).
SS has been doing exceptionally well, close to BME.
DT nicely on track.
iS disastrous, RPI until march was over $3, last months it slumped down with this month being a new low: around $1.
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I did not have time to submit a lot of photo (3rd baby is due this week) but my revenues on IS were more than 3 times what they were in june for about the same number of sales.
A very valuable piece of information that deserves a heart. Good luck with the new little photographer ;)
(don't be as sick as me to smuggle a Nikon with strobes into the delivery room).
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-25% compared to last month, If I don't count the EL's
-60% compared to my 2 first months average as exclusive (which was February and March)
Now I challenge anyone to beat that...
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July was down 13% vs. June and down 28% vs. July 09. Not good.
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-25% compared to last month, If I don't count the EL's
-60% compared to my 2 first months average as exclusive (which was February and March)
Now I challenge anyone to beat that...
Out of curiosity are the %s based on DLS or $$? Is the -60% also including ELs?
Are you finding that you have more EL downloads as an exclusive compared to previously?
For this month my stats are pretty meaningless seeing as I took up exclusivity around about the 22nd. That resulted in an overall BME in $$ terms on Istock, but overall sales numbers seem slightly lower so far.
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-25% compared to last month, If I don't count the EL's
-60% compared to my 2 first months average as exclusive (which was February and March)
Out of curiosity are the %s based on DLS or $$? Is the -60% also including ELs?
Are you finding that you have more EL downloads as an exclusive compared to previously?
For this month my stats are pretty meaningless seeing as I took up exclusivity around about the 22nd. That resulted in an overall BME in $$ terms on Istock, but overall sales numbers seem slightly lower so far.
EL's excluded and in term of earning. Downloads are a little more down than earnings, since I included my files in Exclusive+ after March
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10% increase from last month in sales overall.
Gains were from continuous uploading at SS which accounts for 50% of total sales. IS stable, but FT and DT down. DT showing the worst continued trend. 123 missed 2nd place off IS by 1 cent.
Al''s well.
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| Period_______ | SS___ | DT___ | IS___ | FT___ | Total___ | Total-DT___ |
| Jul 10-09 | +36 | -35 | +56 | +28 | +12 | +39 |
| LaQ 10-09 | +28 | -41 | +25 | +37 | +02 | +29 |
| % share Jul10 | 45 | 21 | 20 | 14 | 100 | - |
| % share Jul09 | 37 | 36 | 14 | 13 | 100 | - |
| Portsize (N) | 1051 | 1136 | 566 | 587 | - | - |
Earnings ($) as % difference over "period".
Period: July 2010-2009, Last Quarter (LaQ) (July+June+May) 2010-2009.
Sites with < 25$/mo not considered.
Formula %: (($@10-$@09) / $@09) * 100
Personal conclusion: DT is losing grip big time, the other 3 of the FabFour are doing OK if you keep uploading steadily. IS is flattered by 25% port increase over the past year + high AR (cam upgrade >5DII).
Now I'm waiting for Lisa... ;)
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Now I'm waiting for Lisa... ;)
LOL. I am with LouOats. If I don't stop keeping track of these stats I run the risk of serious psychological damage :'(
June'10 July'09
ISP 36% -15% -25%
SS 18% -3 % -2%
DT 13% -7% -13%
Fot 20% -9% -5%
BigStock 5% +8% +23%
123 2% -7% -18%
Crest 0% -49%
CanStockPhoto 2% -3% -38%
Almy 4% +11% =
Overall revenues are down 8% from last month, continuing a 3 month decline, and down 21% from last year. Portfolio grew 36% over the past year, so these are really, really grim stats. If I had any doubt about the "hitting the wall" theory, I don't anymore.
For me, IS has taken by far the worst hit of the major agencies. SS has remained nearly steady, so I will count that as a big success for them considering how Getty have been gunning for them. Seems like all Getty's attempts to unseat SS have backfired and damaged IS instead ::)
Of the smaller agencies, BigStock has shown substantial gains since being taken over. Another win for SS in my book.
I left Crestock the end of last year for poor sales and the sales are down 50% from that, so I may have made a mistake reactivating my port with them. Will give them until the end of the year to turn things around.
The good news, I guess, is that this year the IRS sure won't get much from me. ;D
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For me, IS has taken by far the worst hit of the major agencies. SS has remained nearly steady, so I will count that as a big success for them considering how Getty have been gunning for them. Seems like all Getty's attempts to unseat SS have backfired and damaged IS instead
I would bet that sales are not significantly down at IS against previous summers (I have no info) just ever more shared out as everyone's portfolio gets relatively only slightly larger whilst IS itself grows ever more quickly. So many people competing in the same space at roughly the same level. People at SS are less affected by this because SS has always been about keeping at it.
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This is my stock photography sales statistic for July 2010. You can find a complete list of stock photography agencies (http://stock.hlehnerer.com/SA.html) that I work with here (http://stock.hlehnerer.com/SA.html).
(http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u97/hlehnerer/SalesStat/201007px550.jpg)
These are for me the best 4 performing stock agencies for July 2010:
1. Shutterstock
2. 123rf
3. Fotolia
4. Zazzle
July was my 2nd best month of all time with an increase of 111% compared to June. June was the best month ever for Shutterstock, 123rf, PantherMedia, ClipArtOf, Zoonar, and Zazzle.
(http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u97/hlehnerer/SalesStat/201007Timeline550px.jpg)
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I would bet that sales are not significantly down at IS against previous summers (I have no info) just ever more shared out as everyone's portfolio gets relatively only slightly larger whilst IS itself grows ever more quickly. So many people competing in the same space at roughly the same level. People at SS are less affected by this because SS has always been about keeping at it.
You may very well be right. It sounds like a funeral over at Istock's July stats thread. Gold and above canisters seem to be suffering the worst. No way to know if the site's overall sales are down, but for individual contributors who are seeing massive drops, it may not matter.
Not sure what you mean about "keeping at it" on SS. I have always uploaded the same images at the same time to all sites, including SS and IS, so my portfolios everywhere are practically identical at any given moment.
With SS having 2 or three times the contributors IS does, and virtually no upload limits, you would think the dilution effect would be more keenly felt there.
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Depends how important new files are there.
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Depends how important new files are there.
Sorry, still not following your meaning ???
Wouldn't a portfolio that has large numbers of new and older images negate any differences in the importance of new vs. old in overall download numbers?
Maybe if you can offer more than a one sentence explanation I can figure out what you mean...
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I think SS subscription model benefits new files and solid portfolios with new files. So size of the whole collection relative to your uploads is less significant when you carry on uploading. As fractions or ratios: (the size of IS / the size of your portfolio at IS) is increasing much faster than (all new uploads at SS / your new uploads at SS). At SS you are competing more with new members. You have solid body of work so you carry on ok. At IS you are competing much more with the total size.
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Okay, I see what you mean. Makes sense. Thanks for breaking it down for me :)
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I think I will skip adding up my earnings for July and do it at the end of August. I had a spectacular month in July 09 and I know this one is well down. Istock is down and it is so hard to tell if it is just seasonal and a bad best match change or if the buyers are leaving because of the higher prices. I am amazed they have made so many changes to what was the market leader, are they killing the golden goose?
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I think I will skip adding up my earnings for July and do it at the end of August. I had a spectacular month in July 09 and I know this one is well down. Istock is down and it is so hard to tell if it is just seasonal and a bad best match change or if the buyers are leaving because of the higher prices. I am amazed they have made so many changes to what was the market leader, are they killing the golden goose?
Getty will be happy to kill the golden goose and bring their customers over to ThinkStock, where they can mix in their wholly owned content which has a pay out of 0, while at the same time paying exclusives significantly less. So far they've even maintained a handle on exclusive's frustration by upping the prices to account for the obvious migration of customers, mission accomplished.
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it is so hard to tell if it is just seasonal and a bad best match change or if the buyers are leaving because of the higher prices. I am amazed they have made so many changes to what was the market leader, are they killing the golden goose?
I have tried to explain why some people are reporting lower sales. I believe it is about IS growing much faster than the portfolios. Would you disagree ?
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it is so hard to tell if it is just seasonal and a bad best match change or if the buyers are leaving because of the higher prices. I am amazed they have made so many changes to what was the market leader, are they killing the golden goose?
I have tried to explain why some people are reporting lower sales. I believe it is about IS growing much faster than the portfolios. Would you disagree ?
Yes, because this hasn't happened as much with the strong growth in uploads in previous years, why now? Also only a small percentage of images on any site make a significant amount of money and new contributors have found it hard with istock.
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I think I will skip adding up my earnings for July and do it at the end of August. I had a spectacular month in July 09 and I know this one is well down. Istock is down and it is so hard to tell if it is just seasonal and a bad best match change or if the buyers are leaving because of the higher prices. I am amazed they have made so many changes to what was the market leader, are they killing the golden goose?
Getty will be happy to kill the golden goose and bring their customers over to ThinkStock, where they can mix in their wholly owned content which has a pay out of 0, while at the same time paying exclusives significantly less. So far they've even maintained a handle on exclusive's frustration by upping the prices to account for the obvious migration of customers, mission accomplished.
I'm not sure about that theory because I don't think they will make more money from thinkstock than istock. I just think there have been a lot of bad decisions made in the last few years and they need to change that quick or they might not have the microstock market domination they could easily of had.
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Yeah, it was a pretty awful month at IS and SS has been fairly static or slow growth all year. It's a shame because everyone underneath seems to have somewhat steady growth, but my big two are kind of lagging and killing my overall earnings.
I have trouble pushing the panic button yet because the summer can occasionally be pretty grim. And as my portfolio gets larger, it is prone to bigger fluctuations. If things look like this in September and October, then I'll have to start with the conspiracy theories.
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this hasn't happened as much with the strong growth in uploads in previous years, why now?
Tipping point. Rate of increase is very sharp now.
Also only a small percentage of images on any site make a significant amount of money and new contributors have found it hard with istock.
Beyond a certain point many small medium portfolios > than fewer large portfolios. Millions and millions of images selling 1 or 2 maybe becomes significant. Everyone has at least 1 great file.
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Getty will be happy to kill the golden goose and bring their customers over to ThinkStock, where they can mix in their wholly owned content which has a pay out of 0, while at the same time paying exclusives significantly less. So far they've even maintained a handle on exclusive's frustration by upping the prices to account for the obvious migration of customers, mission accomplished.
What utter nonsense. You think it would be sensible to kill a business with about $200M annual sales which is expanding and highly profitable ... in favour of a start-up, almost certainly with less than 5% of the sales of the former? Even if TS were to be as successful as SS (which it never get close to) the profits would still be a fraction of those at IS. If Getty (aka H&F) wanted to get rid of IS they could probably sell it on for well over $1B. TS is a joke in comparison, even with their dated wholly-owned content which nobody actually wants.
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And many businesses are keeping cash fearing a double dip recession. They are not hiring, they are not spending, they are waiting to see if the economy is really going to grow and at what rate in the near future.
So:
nervous recession (recovery) + summer time + more contributors + bloated collections = slow until happy times are here again
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Getty will be happy to kill the golden goose and bring their customers over to ThinkStock, where they can mix in their wholly owned content which has a pay out of 0, while at the same time paying exclusives significantly less. So far they've even maintained a handle on exclusive's frustration by upping the prices to account for the obvious migration of customers, mission accomplished.
What utter nonsense. You think it would be sensible to kill a business with about $200M annual sales which is expanding and highly profitable ... in favour of a start-up, almost certainly with less than 5% of the sales of the former? Even if TS were to be as successful as SS (which it never get close to) the profits would still be a fraction of those at IS. If Getty (aka H&F) wanted to get rid of IS they could probably sell it on for well over $1B. TS is a joke in comparison, even with their dated wholly-owned content which nobody actually wants.
Do you have any sense of reading comprehension? Obviously my post was referring to a migration of IStock customers to TS. Not killing off of IStock and going with TS tomorrow. Are you telling me that Getty wouldn't love to move all of it's customers to TS business model? Pay a flat 20%, and mix in their wholly owned content and pay 0. What utter nonsense.ThinkStock is barely off the ground, give it time.
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this hasn't happened as much with the strong growth in uploads in previous years, why now?
Tipping point. Rate of increase is very sharp now.
I'm not buying it. If it was the competition among contributors the decline would not be so sharp, sales really fell of a cliff. TS was announced and launched in march, after march for most of us sales on istock have been going down and down, add some summerslump and it makes sense. Strange if it is the economic recession it only seems to hit hard on istock and far less on for example SS. i wholeheartedly hope sales on istock will pick up again in september, but i'm pretty pessimistic.
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I'm not buying it. If it was the competition among contributors the decline would not be so sharp, sales really fell of a cliff. TS was announced and launched in march, after march for most of us sales on istock have been going down and down, add some summerslump and it makes sense. Strange if it is the economic recession it only seems to hit hard on istock and far less on for example SS. i wholeheartedly hope sales on istock will pick up again in september, but i'm pretty pessimistic.
I am open to all theories, but I tend to agree with you Artemis. The timing seems more than just coincidental. And the drop has been extreme, as you say, rather than gradual.
I understand the point Alias is making about the preference for new files on SS skewing comparisons, but that doesn't explain why FT (like SS) is also making such a good showing. I don't believe their search engine favors new images, nor are they mainly a subscription site. Yet independents seem to be reporting that FT is either increasing or staying level while Istock sales are plummeting.
Something is definitely up at IS. Not sure what it is, but the other big sites don't seem to be particularly affected.
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I can't say I've seen a pattern between lower IS earnings and TS opening in my numbers. My April was amazing at IS and May & March were good. It's only been June and July at IS that have been low. SS has been low as well those two months, so I'm thinking more of a slump. It could be more, but so many things have changed in the last year at IS. I can't see how anyone could pin an explanation on any one particular cause.
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Maybe FT has more potential for growth where it is so far Lisafx.
My opinion is not definitive. Perhaps what I have said is some of the story.
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One more possibility.
The "Great Recession" here in the US started sometime in 2007. Not sure about other parts of the world. My earnings have been strong up until May 2010 when they starting taking a major dip. This also seems to be around the time everybody else has been talking about a major drop.
I always wondered why micro seemed somewhat immune to the economy. Maybe micro is now finally feeling the effects.
Macro buyers with less budget move to micro. Micro buyers with less budget move to the unemployment line. The cycle continues repeating even after the macro buyers dry up. New buyer growth plateaus while the image collections continue to grow.
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So:
nervous recession (recovery) + summer time + more contributors + bloated collections = slow until happy times are here again
Call me pessimistic, but the part highlighted in bold gives me reason to believe that the good times may never return. For the individual contributor, microstock has already peaked. The agencies, however, are laughing all the way to the bank.
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Do you have any sense of reading comprehension? Obviously my post was referring to a migration of IStock customers to TS. Not killing off of IStock and going with TS tomorrow. Are you telling me that Getty wouldn't love to move all of it's customers to TS business model? Pay a flat 20%, and mix in their wholly owned content and pay 0. What utter nonsense.ThinkStock is barely off the ground, give it time.
So when you use the expression "Getty will be happy to kill the golden goose ..." you mean they don't want to kill Istock. Thank you __ that's much clearer now.
TS hasn't got a snowball's chance in hell of making any real impact in today's marketplace without the full support of contributors and an extraordinary investment in hard cash from Getty. Trouble is the more they promote it the more they stand to lose out on their highly-profitable Istock business.
Istock generates roughly the same amount of cash and profit as all the other agencies combined __ and they're the only significant agency that doesn't have a subscription option in any meaningful way. Ergo ... subscription models are less profitable than ppd.
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Do you have any sense of reading comprehension? Obviously my post was referring to a migration of IStock customers to TS. Not killing off of IStock and going with TS tomorrow. Are you telling me that Getty wouldn't love to move all of it's customers to TS business model? Pay a flat 20%, and mix in their wholly owned content and pay 0. What utter nonsense.ThinkStock is barely off the ground, give it time.
So when you use the expression "Getty will be happy to kill the golden goose ..." you mean they don't want to kill Istock. Thank you __ that's much clearer now.
TS hasn't got a snowball's chance in hell of making any real impact in today's marketplace without the full support of contributors and an extraordinary investment in hard cash from Getty. Trouble is the more they promote it the more they stand to lose out on their highly-profitable Istock business.
Istock generates roughly the same amount of cash and profit as all the other agencies combined __ and they're the only significant agency that doesn't have a subscription option in any meaningful way. Ergo ... subscription models are less profitable than ppd.
You fail to answer my question genius, I will repeat it again, for you, try to follow along. Are you telling me that Getty wouldn't love to move all of it's customers to TS business model? Pay a flat 20%, and mix in their wholly owned content and pay 0. You do realize that TS also has PPD, or ummm Image Packs, no?
"Trouble is the more they promote it the more they stand to lose out on their highly-profitable Istock business." Yeah that makes sense, except they are promoting it like crazy, maybe they know something you don't...hmmm
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2 months before dropping is about 10%, last mont it will be the same but somehow Veer pump up results on - few %. Anyhow second month in droppings, bed, bed, bed........
Grrrrrrrrrrr
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... Something is definitely up at IS. Not sure what it is, but the other big sites don't seem to be particularly affected.
Here is the answer: http://www.microstockgroup.com/istockphoto-com/new-istockphoto-web-design-coming-up/ (http://www.microstockgroup.com/istockphoto-com/new-istockphoto-web-design-coming-up/)
I'm sure they already started screwing around behind the scenes. Not to mention all the problems they had before the re-design was even announced...
I'm particularly concerned about the development in the footage department and the big release of the new video processor which immediately took a dump right after the release. I do feel for the Jim in the footage department as somewhere, there must be lurking a big, big troublemaker that nails iStock a couple times a year with the bug-hammer.
By now, under Getty's wings I thought the IT-side would be not such a huge issue anymore but if you have reached such a status in any given industry you better be employing people who know what the fudge they are doing.
It's especially sad, since iStock performed extremely well at the beginning of this year (at least for me) and the dive it took was out of this world. So there must be something else going on (as mentioned above).
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Istock can promote thinkstock as much as they like but it is flawed. It reminds me of snapvillage, Corbis spent lots promoting that but it never had a chance. If they really want thinkstock to succeed, they need to match shutterstock's commissions until they have great sales volume. There is no motivation for us to use them with the lowest subs commission and low sales volume. How can they get enough buyers when they have such a poor collection? Some people don't care how much commission they earn but they already have enough portfolios missing to make a big difference. Then there are all the other problems like not having the contributors name with the image, not being able to search by user and images not being transferred over to the site etc. As Corbis found out the hard way, throwing money at it wont work, they need to treat their contributors with more respect and make the site more appealing to buyers.
What I don't understand is they already had a great subs site with StockXpert and photos.com with much more high quality content and good sales volume. Closing that was a big mistake, it would of been much easier to let istock exclusives upload there and I am sure that would of damaged shutterstock.
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Shutterstock as usual remains stable and my top earner by a long way
IStock still dropping but hanging on to second position in my earnings chart for the month ahead of Dreamstime and Fotolia
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July was my BME. It was helped by some ELs, but still may have been a BME without the ELs. I had BME on SS (42%), IS (32%), DT (9%) and Veer (7%).
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I've dropped out of these types of topics for psychological reasons. Much too depressing to dwell upon.
And I'm just boring. ;D
Earlier in the year was 60/40 SS/IS
May/June changed to about 50/50
last month was 60/40 IS over SS.
Next month it could be back to 50/50 again. No complaints, the two best agencies, no fooling with wacko reviews, changing policies, obscure rejections. I'm very happy to have two places where I have an idea what they want and expect. Read this as SS sales are consistent (no new uploads in July), IS had an increase in sales last month.
Edit: July - BigStock $0, ThinkStock 25c in StockXpert sales, they don't count and are next to be cut. I'd say November so it clears in 2010, fresh books for 2011. Gone at last waiting for final payout FT, which they have notified me is in process. Polite requests and they gave polite answers. :) All the rest are closed or have one name holder photo and should have been closed, but I didn't.
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July was my BME.
Says who? Worthless info since you have no port links. Sorry. I had a BMW and a Ferrari at CrapMyStock but I won't show my links of course. Grrrr. (you may block me now).
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July was my BME.
Says who? Worthless info since you have no port links. Sorry. I had a BMW and a Ferrari at CrapMyStock but I won't show my links of course. Grrrr. (you may block me now).
lol I was looking for the same the other day but no links!
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I think SS subscription model benefits new files and solid portfolios with new files. So size of the whole collection relative to your uploads is less significant when you carry on uploading. As fractions or ratios: (the size of IS / the size of your portfolio at IS) is increasing much faster than (all new uploads at SS / your new uploads at SS). At SS you are competing more with new members. You have solid body of work so you carry on ok. At IS you are competing much more with the total size.
akias, thank you for wisdom explanation. Now I also understand importance to regular upload to Shutterstock.
But I do that anyway because each time download arrives same day with approved status.
Last week was big surprise for me Istock also one download instantly with approved status, but for
little money, still same commission as Shutterstock. I think maybe Thinkstock is beginning to take affect.
Istock also slowly giving me confidence with some more download lately. I like Shutterstock for regular download
and big numbers, but I prefer IStock for dollar per download is more attractive. Except unless Thinkstock.
Lucky , my little download is Istock $ and hope this continue because although small number to download,
the money go up faster with IStock.
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July was my BME.
Says who? Worthless info since you have no port links. Sorry. I had a BMW and a Ferrari at CrapMyStock but I won't show my links of course. Grrrr. (you may block me now).
lol I was looking for the same the other day but no links!
I think he got mad, Luis ;)
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July was my BME.
Says who? Worthless info since you have no port links. Sorry. I had a BMW and a Ferrari at CrapMyStock but I won't show my links of course. Grrrr. (you may block me now).
lol I was looking for the same the other day but no links!
I think he got mad, Luis ;)
lol beside this I had a slightly decrease after a few very good months but August is going strong, gotta work hard now before vacations to Greece :P
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Sales are so bad right now I simply cannot get motivated to upload anything. I tried editing some photos yesterday and just gave up in disgust.
Maybe I should take August off like so many designers seem to. :P
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Sales are so bad right now I simply cannot get motivated to upload anything. I tried editing some photos yesterday and just gave up in disgust.
Maybe I should take August off like so many designers seem to. :P
It's not just me then! Not a good start to August, to say the least. The July reports on the IS forum were extraordinary too especially considering the payrise that exclusives got this year. Earlier I saw that SS 'new photos added this week' was down to 66K which must be the lowest I've seen it for at least 18 months, possibly longer. Maybe this is when the going gets tough and we see who is tough enough (or foolhardy enough) to keep going.
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It's not just me then! Not a good start to August, to say the least. The July reports on the IS forum were extraordinary too especially considering the payrise that exclusives got this year. Earlier I saw that SS 'new photos added this week' was down to 66K which must be the lowest I've seen it for at least 18 months, possibly longer. Maybe this is when the going gets tough and we see who is tough enough (or foolhardy enough) to keep going.
I figured Istock's raised UL limits might be in response to a decrease in new submissions. Didn't notice SS is experiencing the same thing. Looks like the summertime blahs are widespread.
Agree with your statement (that I bolded).
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I got one word for July sales.....TERRIBLE
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Sales are so bad right now I simply cannot get motivated to upload anything. I tried editing some photos yesterday and just gave up in disgust.
+ 1
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my earnings are still very low but I am having a very good month, a lot better than July...!
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my earnings are still very low but I am having a very good month, a lot better than July...!
Come on Luis. The play isn't over till the Fat Lady sings. The August lady will sing on August 31. :P
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my earnings are still very low but I am having a very good month, a lot better than July...!
Come on Luis. The play isn't over till the Fat Lady sings. The August lady will sing on August 31. :P
you are right :)
SS is going crazy (good way), that's it!
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June was very bad and July is slightly below. At least SS has recovered from disaster but others need to follow.
http://melastmohican.net/wordpress/2010/08/02/july-2010-earnings-breakdown/ (http://melastmohican.net/wordpress/2010/08/02/july-2010-earnings-breakdown/)
http://melastmohican.net/wordpress/2010/07/02/june-2010-earnings-breakdown/ (http://melastmohican.net/wordpress/2010/07/02/june-2010-earnings-breakdown/)
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Yep, sales are way way down, DT sales are horrible 2 month after I had a BME with them. Fotolia is pretty good as always, really the exception.
and iS a couple of hundred $$ less /month than in the beginning of the year :'(
Shutterstock is still going somehow, have not seen such a big decrease in earnings compared to DT and IS, but it is still disappointing. Looks like not a good future with microstock.
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Shutterstock is still going somehow, have not seen such a big decrease in earnings compared to DT and IS, but it is still disappointing.
I think I just may be the only person who is getting extremely poor sales at SS lately. I used to do very well there (2007-2008), and I was able to consistently earn much more there than anywhere else.
But so far this year, it's like they are intentionally hiding my photos from buyers or something. Lol... My SS sales have been scary bad all year, and it just keeps getting worse. :-\
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Maybe this is when the going gets tough and we see who is tough enough (or foolhardy enough) to keep going.
I've got a feeling that we may count many of us - which are actively posting in this forum - in that number. Who else?
Not necessarily bad in the long term.
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I don't think I've ever published my stats here before. I thought it would be interesting to look at the 2010 trend compared to July. Forgive me if it's not interesting to anyone else ;)
2010 so far:
SS - 53%
iS - 23%
DT - 8%
123 - 5%
FT - 4%
Veer - 3%
BS - 3%
CanStockPhoto - 1%
July 2010
iS - 40%
DT - 16%
SS - 15%
FT - 12%
Veer - 10%
123 - 4%
BS - 2%
CanStockPhoto - 1%
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I think I just may be the only person who is getting extremely poor sales at SS lately. I used to do very well there (2007-2008), and I was able to consistently earn much more there than anywhere else.
But so far this year, it's like they are intentionally hiding my photos from buyers or something. Lol... My SS sales have been scary bad all year, and it just keeps getting worse. :-\
Are you still uploading there regularly Norebbo?
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I think I just may be the only person who is getting extremely poor sales at SS lately. I used to do very well there (2007-2008), and I was able to consistently earn much more there than anywhere else.
But so far this year, it's like they are intentionally hiding my photos from buyers or something. Lol... My SS sales have been scary bad all year, and it just keeps getting worse. :-\
I feel your pain. I can't say it's been awful there, but my growth there this year has been weak to non existent compared to how much I've added. DT was like that last year, and I had to downgrade its RPI for future estimates. While I don't think it's as drastic as DT last year, I think I'll have to do the same for SS this year. Even though it is still my number 2 agency, I'm definitely disappointed in it lately.
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I feel your pain. I can't say it's been awful there, but my growth there this year has been weak to non existent compared to how much I've added.
When did you sign up there? SS has a honeymoon period for new contributors that expires after a while. Then, it's just marriage. ;) You'll have to keep feeding the beast regularly after that, or sales might go down by 50%.
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When did you sign up there? SS has a honeymoon period for new contributors that expires after a while. Then, it's just marriage. ;) You'll have to keep feeding the beast regularly after that, or sales might go down by 50%.
December 2006. Does that mean my honeymoon is over? ;D
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SS has a honeymoon period for new contributors that expires after a while. Then, it's just marriage. ;) You'll have to keep feeding the beast regularly after that, or sales might go down by 50%.
This is yet another 'Microstock Myth' that keeps being endlessly regurgitated!
It so happens I'm one of the contributors currently beta-testing a new submitter front page on SS. The new page contains statistical data that basically explodes that myth, at least in my case. Since Jan 31 I have increased my portfolio by 10.8%. My earnings from those new images to date are 11.3% of my total earnings since Jan 31 __ essentially my earning have increased almost exactly in proportion to the increase in my portfolio.
I'm sure there must be others here doing the beta-test and if so it'll be interesting to see how their figures for new uploads compare.
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This is yet another 'Microstock Myth' that keeps being endlessly regurgitated!
I'm not sure about that. Most of my new referral artists make income for me in their first couple of months, then fade after that. There could be other explanations like they upload their best stuff the first month, lose interest or something else. But a honeymoon period seems just as likely. I guess like most things in the micros there is always an alternate theory. ;)
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I kept daily stats for my first 6 months and my sales with SS exploded at the start then fell back and it took me a long time to get a BME again. Perhaps I had an image in the new artists lightbox? I didn't look at the time. I also think when most people start they upload like crazy for the first month, then the uploads tail off, exaggerating any honeymoon period effect.
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Are you still uploading there regularly Norebbo?
I've been uploading 25 images a week there for the past couple of years. As bad as my sales are becoming there, I'm starting to wonder if it's even worth it any more. Looking at a chart of my SS sales for the past two years, it's headed nowhere but down - and it seems pointless to continue to "feed the beast" if I'm not getting anything from it.
I'll give it a few more months to see what happens, but I think I could be done producing micro images by the end of the year.
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Wow, 25 images a week and still sales dropping like that. Can't say you aren't feeding the beast!
I upload about the same amount weekly to all sites and am experiencing similar drops at IS, but fortunately SS is holding steady for me so far... (fingers crossed)
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This is yet another 'Microstock Myth' that keeps being endlessly regurgitated!
It so happens I'm one of the contributors currently beta-testing a new submitter front page on SS. The new page contains statistical data that basically explodes that myth, at least in my case. Since Jan 31 I have increased my portfolio by 10.8%. My earnings from those new images to date are 11.3% of my total earnings since Jan 31 __ essentially my earning have increased almost exactly in proportion to the increase in my portfolio.
Last year I did correlation statistics between downloads and uploads over 3 years. At least for me, the correlation was significant. (the method was based on time series covariances).
About the honeymoon period, your critique might be right since I just got it from hearsay.
I will know more later this year since I stopped doing microstock 7 weeks ago and not motivated to do edits of the last 4 shoots just for cents.
I'll see if the graph goes down...
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Last year I did correlation statistics between downloads and uploads over 3 years. At least for me, the correlation was significant. (the method was based on time series covariances).
What did the correlation statistics show?
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What did the correlation statistics show?
That there was a clear covariance between uploads and subsequent downloads. It took me a lot of time since I had to go back over 4 years to fill in all the uploaded batches. The variation was good enough since I had some periods of no uploads at all, and periods of high uploads.
Caveat: this is about the past. If they are in beta for a new search engine, it might all change.
(http://cjoint.com/data/ihtObl21eq_ssearn.jpg)
With the risk of being a bore, I had to use that method in one my PhD sections in order to demonstrate a lagged effect of food intake on gut hormones release. Basically, you do a normal Spearman Rank r between the two datasets while shifting one dataset day by day. I think the optimum was 5 days later but I didn't check for weekend artifacts. To be really valid, this should be done over larger ports than mine and from several people.
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What did the correlation statistics show?
That there was a clear covariance between uploads and subsequent downloads. It took me a lot of time since I had to go back over 4 years to fill in all the uploaded batches. The variation was good enough since I had some periods of no uploads at all, and periods of high uploads.
Thanks for this FD, I doubt that you will have a steady income if you do not upload regulary.
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Thanks very much for posting this FD! Looks like a lot of work went into it. :)
If I am reading your chart correctly, it looks like rate of uploading has a more direct impact on earnings than overall portfolio size does.
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Thanks very much for posting this FD! Looks like a lot of work went into it. :)
If I am reading your chart correctly, it looks like rate of uploading has a more direct impact on earnings than overall portfolio size does.
Lisa (or FD)
By "rate of uploading" are you talking about frequency or quantity? I'm uploading regularly, just not very much. :-\
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This chart is regarding all agencies? It is a portfolio average?
FORGET! SS ok... I have never stop the uploading there but once I have a week without uploading I feel it for sure..
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If I am reading your chart correctly, it looks like rate of uploading has a more direct impact on earnings than overall portfolio size does.
Yes, well, both seem to be important. There are a couple of caveats though. Earnings in general seem to follow portfolio size up till late spring 2008, then hit a ceiling. I saw exactly the same pattern on BigStock. Some people here reported this glass ceiling too, but later.
It makes me suspicious that this is (also?) a side effect of my portfolio composition since in May 2008 I settled down; my travel/nature shoots stopped and I started models. With model concepts there is the problem that (a) you have a lot of competition from much better photographers and (b) your best concepts are copied like hell. I'm also handicapped by the age group and ethnicity of my models, mainly because they are my students and Asian. [My top sales on SS are still niche landmarks (difficult to copy) like "Waterloo battle field" where I dominate the top 20, or "Chinese sweatshop" where I'm alone.]
A second caveat is that the correlation has been done over the full 4 year period. People here reported around end 2009 that new uploads didn't seem to work as good any more on SS like before. You can see that at the end of the graph. But the correlation is of course over the full 4 year period and just one statistic (number) so changes in time are not accounted for. I'm hesitating to do the analysis over the past year since I had steady uploads, and obviously you can't do a proper correlation then, since there will be no variance in one of your datasets. [example: suppose you do a study about success in business and body height: you will have zero correlation if all your subjects are 5ft9]
A note about my method (for Luis): samples (rows) were per month and filled in an Excel spreadsheet. Columns were: earnings (light blue graph) and uploads per month (count # of images over all approved batches that month) (dark purple graph). The port size (light yellow graph) was just a cumulative sum of the uploads.
Conclusion: to have real hard evidence about the "beast feeding" hypothesis you need to have several portfolios (to get rid of the port composition bias) and larger ones. Also, the past is no guarantee for the future since SS can change the algorithm as they like.
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thanks :) I would do the same but my stock experience is really small and I have never stopped the uploading but I repeat that I feel the same about SS, but actually is the only one that has nice earnings :)
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A bit late, but here are my July stats for photo/video/audio:
http://microstockexperiment.blogspot.com/ (http://microstockexperiment.blogspot.com/)
Cheers
L
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Maybe this is when the going gets tough and we see who is tough enough (or foolhardy enough) to keep going.
I've got a feeling that we may count many of us - which are actively posting in this forum - in that number. Who else?
Not necessarily bad in the long term.
I've thought for a long time that falling returns per file coupled with rising quality demands would ultimately freeze out new contributors and most of the long tail, leaving a few hundred or a few thousand of us sharing the cake with portfolios that either become very large or are have very high commercial value, or both. The sooner that happens, the better.
In the summer of 2004 I was making between 80c and $1 per file per month on iStock, with a tiny portfolio. Today I make just 15c per file per month there (about 50c per file from all sites combined - of course, it would be about 45c on iS if I went exclusive ... but for a newbie the non-exclusive rate would apply), so the return has halved while the effort has multiplied several-fold.
At the same time, I have had to learn a hell of a lot about photography, just to get where I am, and I've also invested more than $10,000 in cameras, lenses, lighting gear, computers etc. . It has all turned out very satisfactorily for me but I think it would be insane to contemplate doing it seriously, starting out at 5 uploads a week on iS with two or three likely to get rejected so you build your port at a rate of 10 files a month and maybe hit bronze after two or three years. SS is better, of course, but that's the only site offering a decent chance of a return without restrictive upload rules.
Even so, it seems likely that the only people who stand a chance of breaking through these days are those who really understand the stock business and are already highly proficient photographers or illustrators, maybe with a back catalogue of useful images. And it's still going to be tough to make an impression.
Am I wrong about this? Would any of us like to be starting from scratch now?
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Am I wrong about this? Would any of us like to be starting from scratch now?
I think I even wouldn't get in any more at SS and IS. In 2005 it was much easier, and the technical requirements were less. In 5 years, suffering rejections and learning what sells and doesn't sell, we oldies have grown with the sites. If you want to enter now, you need to have that skill acquired outside stock or you can't pass the high threshold. There will always be fresh photographers with loads of talents, but the avalanche of 1-2 years ago is over, I guess.