Author Topic: What is a contributor's cut? (Read 3489 times)

Orchidpoet · « **on:** May 23, 2019, 23:23 »

Suppose a photographer reported a copyright infringement to his photo to a stock photo agency, the agency's lawyer went after the infringer, and the agency was later awarded $1 million as damages by the court.

What will the photographer's cut be?

marthamarks · « **Reply #1 on:** May 23, 2019, 23:30 »

Way too hypothetical even to consider.

Steveball · « **Reply #2 on:** May 24, 2019, 02:16 »

Not Today · « **Reply #3 on:** May 24, 2019, 02:28 »

Probably 0$ unless you hire a lawyer and your lawyer teams up with the agency's lawyer.

Me · « **Reply #4 on:** May 24, 2019, 05:09 »

An agency would be more likely to go to court for a license issue rather than copyright - they don't own the copyright so why would they pursue it? It would be down to you as copyright owner to pursue.

Orchidpoet · « **Reply #5 on:** May 24, 2019, 09:32 »

It's not a hypothetical situation at all.

One of my images, which has never been uploaded to any stock photo agencies fortunately, has been used extensively for promotional purposes by a company.

Will pursue the infringer through a lawyer.

Had I uploaded the image to any agencies, I would not be able to determined if it is a legal use. If the agency recovers any money, I wonder if I would get any cuts.

dpimborough · « **Reply #6 on:** May 24, 2019, 09:56 »

Quote from: Orchidpoet on May 23, 2019, 23:23

Suppose a photographer reported a copyright infringement to his photo to a stock photo agency, the agency's lawyer went after the infringer, and the agency was later awarded $1 million as damages by the court.

What will the photographer's cut be?

A lawyer is not a stock agency there is no cut so to speak.

You sit down with the lawyer and determine what fees they will charge.

If you think you'll get $1million then you need to get that sorted with the lawyer before you proceed.

Orchidpoet · « **Reply #7 on:** May 24, 2019, 10:07 »

How much I am spending on legal fees is a different matter, and irrelevant to this topic.

The issue is, if an agency is able to get damages through the court, will a contributor benefit from the litigation?

This issue is important because many of the contributors will likely encounter the situation during our career.

marthamarks · « **Reply #8 on:** May 24, 2019, 10:32 »

Quote from: Orchidpoet on May 24, 2019, 09:32

It's not a hypothetical situation at all.

Sorry to disagree, but suggesting that anyone could get $1,000,000 in damages for the unauthorized use of a single image is hypothetical in the extreme.

georgep7 · « **Reply #9 on:** May 24, 2019, 10:33 »

Quote from: Orchidpoet on May 24, 2019, 09:32

It's not a hypothetical situation at all.

One of my images, which has never been uploaded to any stock photo agencies fortunately, has been used extensively for promotional purposes by a company.

Will pursue the infringer through a lawyer.

Had I uploaded the image to any agencies, I would not be able to determined if it is a legal use. If the agency recovers any money, I wonder if I would get any cuts.

Sorry for my curiosity.
You never submitted this image to an agency? Or you did?
I cannot understand.

Orchidpoet · « **Reply #10 on:** May 24, 2019, 10:36 »

I think how much I get is not important. Maybe someone will get a million or more. You never know.

It's important that we are aware of our rights. If you don't care, that's ok with me.

I am not seeking advice. The information is shared with the community for those who want to preserve their rights.

Orchidpoet · « **Reply #11 on:** May 24, 2019, 10:38 »

No, I have never submitted the image to any agencies. It is only available on my own site as prints.

georgep7 · « **Reply #12 on:** May 24, 2019, 11:02 »

Thanks for the clarification.

Offtopic. 1 million is perhaps too much, but on the other hand you seem to do great work.

In the link below, Niagara falls one is yours?

https://www.in2life.gr/escape/infoguide/article/604016/ta-oraiotera-fthinoporina-topia-toy-kosmoy.html

Not Today · « **Reply #13 on:** May 24, 2019, 11:13 »

Quote from: Orchidpoet on May 24, 2019, 10:38

No, I have never submitted the image to any agencies. It is only available on my own site as prints.

You can do a Google reverse image search to see where this specific image is offered.

It could be thieves stealing images from print on demand previews and offering them for free on one of these scam websites.

Tenebroso · « **Reply #14 on:** May 24, 2019, 11:23 »

I understand your position and that you see the possibility of compensating what you consider an outrage.

You can go with the best specialist in the country in these subjects to percentage. I understand that when talking about important amounts of money, the company is solvent.

But, there is the possibility of wasting time and money for years.

My intuition tells me that if the company is solvent, it will not risk an image in an important campaign.

Conclusion, everything points to the company paid for that image and is a victim like you, theft of Imagen. Organized band or teenager without resources.

ShadySue · « **Reply #15 on:** May 25, 2019, 10:46 »

Quote from: Orchidpoet on May 23, 2019, 23:23

Suppose a photographer reported a copyright infringement to his photo to a stock photo agency, the agency's lawyer went after the infringer, and the agency was later awarded $1 million as damages by the court.

What will the photographer's cut be?

It will depend on the T&C of each agency.
For example: Alamy's contract says,
"16.2.1. If Alamy takes action Alamy may (but shall not be obliged to):
16.2.2. make such claims and take such action as may be necessary (in the opinion of Alamy) in connection with it. A percentage, equal to the applicable commission rate for that Image, of all amounts recovered by Alamy in connection with such claims or actions (after first deducting collection fees and reasonable legal expenses incurred by Alamy) shall be paid to you.
16.2.3. If you take action then Alamy's sole obligations shall be to at your request and cost, provide testimony in any action which may be brought by you by verifying the terms of the contract entered. Prior to giving this assistance Alamy may require you to have indemnified Alamy for all of the costs and expenses of any such action including at Alamy's discretion providing and securing the costs of Alamy's legal and other advisers.
16.3. You agree that where Alamy incurs legal and/or other specific costs relating to an outstanding amount owed by a Customer then these costs will be recouped by Alamy first before accounting to you. ..."

I thought iS's contract said something similar, but when trying to find it just now, I might have skimmed over it (or maybe I was wrong, or maybe it has gone from the current contract).

Orchidpoet · « **Reply #16 on:** May 25, 2019, 11:57 »

Quote from: ShadySue on May 25, 2019, 10:46

Quote from: Orchidpoet on May 23, 2019, 23:23
Suppose a photographer reported a copyright infringement to his photo to a stock photo agency, the agency's lawyer went after the infringer, and the agency was later awarded $1 million as damages by the court.

What will the photographer's cut be?

It will depend on the T&C of each agency.
For example: Alamy's contract says,
"16.2.1. If Alamy takes action Alamy may (but shall not be obliged to):
16.2.2. make such claims and take such action as may be necessary (in the opinion of Alamy) in connection with it. A percentage, equal to the applicable commission rate for that Image, of all amounts recovered by Alamy in connection with such claims or actions (after first deducting collection fees and reasonable legal expenses incurred by Alamy) shall be paid to you.
16.2.3. If you take action then Alamy's sole obligations shall be to at your request and cost, provide testimony in any action which may be brought by you by verifying the terms of the contract entered. Prior to giving this assistance Alamy may require you to have indemnified Alamy for all of the costs and expenses of any such action including at Alamy's discretion providing and securing the costs of Alamy's legal and other advisers.
16.3. You agree that where Alamy incurs legal and/or other specific costs relating to an outstanding amount owed by a Customer then these costs will be recouped by Alamy first before accounting to you. ..."

I thought iS's contract said something similar, but when trying to find it just now, I might have skimmed over it (or maybe I was wrong, or maybe it has gone from the current contract).

I always admire you for being an excellent researcher!

Thank you so much!

Orchidpoet · « **Reply #17 on:** May 25, 2019, 12:07 »

This is how I see it when assessing if a legal action should be taken:

1. Have an open mind, don't assume anything, because you just don't know.

2. If you don't see value in your work and protect your rights, then who cares?

3. If a theft is not dealt with, there will be more thefts. Remember it can happen to you too.

As to the costs and so on, that's between me and my lawyer.

obj owl · « **Reply #18 on:** May 25, 2019, 14:25 »

Quote from: Orchidpoet on May 25, 2019, 12:07

This is how I see it when assessing if a legal action should be taken:

1. Have an open mind, don't assume anything, because you just don't know.

2. If you don't see value in your work and protect your rights, then who cares?

3. If a theft is not dealt with, there will be more thefts. Remember it can happen to you too.

As to the costs and so on, that's between me and my lawyer.

1. You can assume that you will get little to no support from you partners the agencies. With each additional agency you use the difficulties will grow exponentially.

2. If you care about your mental health stick to one agency, once you sell RF on several agencies you will go mad chasing wild geese.

3. If you are worried about theft microstock is not the place for you.

The costs and time are prohibitive if you are chasing hundreds if not thousands of infringements. You may just find a golden goose if you get lucky.

pancaketom · « **Reply #19 on:** May 25, 2019, 20:31 »

A while ago SS determined that a company producing calendars was using images with a regular license that should have had an EL. I have no idea if the company paid more than EL license fees, but I got an EL sale for an image that they had used (back when EL meant $28 for the contributor).

If you are going to lose a lot of sleep over potential fraudulent uses then microstock is not the place for you. If it has never been for sale on microstock and a big company based somewhere that gives more than lip service to intellectual property is using it then good luck, you might actually get something from them.

Pauws99 · « **Reply #20 on:** May 26, 2019, 06:45 »

Whilst the costs are private to you the potential return vs cost is pretty essential for most people and indeed the agencies. Its not simply they don't care its a business judgement that the outlay for chasing down most infringements isn't economically justified business wise. If they could make millions doing it they would. We might like things be be different but they arent.

Orchidpoet · « **Reply #21 on:** May 26, 2019, 12:02 »

While I agree that the costs is an important part of any litigation decisions, the topic is if an agency is pursuing an infringer, do we get a cut?

I thank those who have answered this question. For instance, I now know Alamy and SS may give the contributor some compensation. That's good to hear.

My situation is not really relevant, because the image has never been a part of the microstock business.

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Author Topic: What is a contributor's cut? (Read 3489 times)

Orchidpoet

marthamarks

Steveball

Not Today

Me

Orchidpoet

dpimborough

Orchidpoet

marthamarks

georgep7

Orchidpoet

Orchidpoet

georgep7

Not Today

Tenebroso

ShadySue

Orchidpoet

Orchidpoet

obj owl

pancaketom

Pauws99

Orchidpoet

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