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Author Topic: Video interviews with Lee Torrens and Jonathan Ross from STOCKinRUSSIA'10  (Read 22488 times)

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Microbius

« Reply #50 on: October 22, 2010, 05:26 »
0
I'm proud that I can pay my bills with my work.  I don't need to train people so I can eventually not be able to pay my bills to put a smile on my face.

Like I said, I know I'm evil that I don't want Russian photographers to put food on their table - lol...

I think there is a misunderstanding about what is going on here.
There is no altruism going on here.
Lee makes most of his living not from selling on micro directly but as a facilitator, referring others, from ads on MD and other indirect routes. The more marketing he can do the more he makes.
With Jonathan he is building his brand in micro and doing a very good job of it. It may be hurting the rest of us but the good it does him getting his name known and out there is far greater then the damage he personally receives from letting in more competition. It makes good business sense.
It's something like the "tragedy of the commons", the good of the action is to the individual while the cost is spread over the whole community.
Getting one more person into the market damages everyone's income by a tiny fraction of a cent, while the one who actually gets the referral or the publicity gains far more than this. It always makes sense selfishly to make the referral, because you can't stop others doing it and the result of that single referral is net gain for you; the nail in the coffin of all submitters from that one referral is tiny.
It's only when you add up all the fractions you end up with a cluster f*ck.
C'est la vie
« Last Edit: October 22, 2010, 05:33 by Microbius »


« Reply #51 on: October 22, 2010, 06:19 »
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^
Indeed, as in many apparent acts of folly, follow the money.

« Reply #52 on: October 22, 2010, 07:32 »
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I think there is a misunderstanding about what is going on here.

I'm not misunderstanding ;) .  Only thing is, when you "brand" yourself to photographers, all you get is a bunch of photographer fans.

« Reply #53 on: October 22, 2010, 09:57 »
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I think there is a misunderstanding about what is going on here.


I'm not misunderstanding ;)Only thing is, when you "brand" yourself to photographers, all you get is a bunch of photographer fans.


I am sure that you are aware that Jonathan is one of co-founders of Blend Images and the newly formed http://www.spacesimages.com

Most photographers I know who routinely go to lengths to share incentive financial or educational info are involved in; for pay workshops, per click info site, selling books or training materials or they own or are heavily affiliated with stock agencies which will benefit from fostering new talent .

They stand to gain from sharing information that will not be beneficial to their fellows and some of them make far more holding workshops and such than they ever would shooting.

Microbius

« Reply #54 on: October 22, 2010, 10:39 »
0
I think there is a misunderstanding about what is going on here.


I'm not misunderstanding ;)Only thing is, when you "brand" yourself to photographers, all you get is a bunch of photographer fans.


I am sure that you are aware that Jonathan is one of co-founders of Blend Images and the newly formed http://www.spacesimages.com

Most photographers I know who routinely go to lengths to share incentive financial or educational info are involved in; for pay workshops, per click info site, selling books or training materials or they own or are heavily affiliated with stock agencies which will benefit from fostering new talent .

They stand to gain from sharing information that will not be beneficial to their fellows and some of them make far more holding workshops and such than they ever would shooting.

Most, or all?  ;)
@ Sean, yeah photographer fans paying for lessons, or to hear you speak, or giving you referral earnings, or signing up to your image library, or clicking your ads on your blog, or throwing your name around as a "guru" to potential buyers, or buying your books etc. etc. etc.

« Reply #55 on: October 22, 2010, 12:27 »
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Hi Microbus,

 Thank you for the explanation and support. Just to make it clear to everyone I did not make any form of monetary reward or otherwise for presenting in Russia, just like I will not receive any form of profit not even the airfare or hotel, for the upcoming PhotPlus panel I am on next week in N.Y. For me it is about meeting new people in the business. I am really not trying to even build a following I just want to educate people in the field I am in and rub shoulders with the agencies and people at the top to advance my agency and the others I am owner in. It is an important part of building an agency to speak directly with those you have only been e-mailing, it strengthens the relationship and the spoken word is so much clearer than e-mails.
 If and when I want to start building a Micro following I will probably produce a Blog, right now it's just about sharing and meeting influential people in the industry.

Thanks,
Jonathan
« Last Edit: October 22, 2010, 13:02 by Jonathan Ross »

Microbius

« Reply #56 on: October 22, 2010, 15:17 »
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It's a good policy. I wish you all the best. You have clearly got the skills to back it.

« Reply #57 on: October 27, 2010, 09:27 »
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While I don't necessarily agree it is advantageous to the collective whole to produce educational information which propagates and increases competition; in an fiercely competitive market that is becoming more so every day.

I must say I am really tickled about the response to offering that educational help to Russia/Russians. Some of the most talented and prolific artist in micro are Russian and they have been working in micro from the start. They could teach most of us a great deal.

On another note artist who are talented can easily earn a decent living from micro in countries where the cost of living is lower.  I expect to see more and more of the most talented among us cropping up or migrating to countries where living expenses are not prohibitive.

Why do you think, Russia is more cheeper place for a living?
For example food and clothes costs much more expensive in Russia then in Spain!! Really much more expensive)) And also we still have here a lot of speculators who make their living on newbies.

For example - this conference StockinRussia with Lee and Jonathan was about 9000rub or 300$ - this is good price!! It was very useful and interesting)) But we also have a lot of courses which costs about 400-500$ from photographers who earn 100-300$ monthly from Micro without any interesting persons like Lee and Jonathan! Also funny is that they giving information which you can find with help of google for free)) No extra info or something really useful.

so i don`t think that Russia is very cheep place for a living. We have really bad transportation costs system. In europe you must pay one time for 2 hours of bus or subway.. But in Russia you must pay about 1$ for subway even if you are going on next station!! and about ,5 or ,7$ for bus.
So if you need to move one station on subway and then one or two stations on bus you`ll pay 1,5$ or more.. i think it is not so cheap)) And so on and so on))

« Reply #58 on: October 27, 2010, 09:31 »
0
Hi Microbus,

 Thank you for the explanation and support. Just to make it clear to everyone I did not make any form of monetary reward or otherwise for presenting in Russia, just like I will not receive any form of profit not even the airfare or hotel, for the upcoming PhotPlus panel I am on next week in N.Y. For me it is about meeting new people in the business. I am really not trying to even build a following I just want to educate people in the field I am in and rub shoulders with the agencies and people at the top to advance my agency and the others I am owner in. It is an important part of building an agency to speak directly with those you have only been e-mailing, it strengthens the relationship and the spoken word is so much clearer than e-mails.
 If and when I want to start building a Micro following I will probably produce a Blog, right now it's just about sharing and meeting influential people in the industry.

Thanks,
Jonathan

Much thank you, Jonathan again and again - it is a big deal))

« Reply #59 on: October 27, 2010, 12:57 »
0
They can also earn barely 40% more incomes from microstock due to their low value money...
Maybe 20 years ago. Moscow is amongst the most expensive cities in the world right now.

« Reply #60 on: October 27, 2010, 14:17 »
0
While I don't necessarily agree it is advantageous to the collective whole to produce educational information which propagates and increases competition; in an fiercely competitive market that is becoming more so every day.

I must say I am really tickled about the response to offering that educational help to Russia/Russians. Some of the most talented and prolific artist in micro are Russian and they have been working in micro from the start. They could teach most of us a great deal.

On another note artist who are talented can easily earn a decent living from micro in countries where the cost of living is lower.  I expect to see more and more of the most talented among us cropping up or migrating to countries where living expenses are not prohibitive.

Why do you think, Russia is more cheaper place for a living?
For example food and clothes costs much more expensive in Russia then in Spain!! Really much more expensive)) And also we still have here a lot of speculators who make their living on newbies.

For example - this conference StockinRussia with Lee and Jonathan was about 9000rub or 300$ - this is good price!! It was very useful and interesting)) But we also have a lot of courses which costs about 400-500$ from photographers who earn 100-300$ monthly from Micro without any interesting persons like Lee and Jonathan! Also funny is that they giving information which you can find with help of google for free)) No extra info or something really useful.

so i don`t think that Russia is very cheep place for a living. We have really bad transportation costs system. In europe you must pay one time for 2 hours of bus or subway.. But in Russia you must pay about 1$ for subway even if you are going on next station!! and about ,5 or ,7$ for bus.
So if you need to move one station on subway and then one or two stations on bus you`ll pay 1,5$ or more.. i think it is not so cheap)) And so on and so on))

You misunderstand me, I do not think and did not say Russia is a cheap place to live, in any case it is all relative to where you live now.  The point I was attempting to make is that royalty rates have dropped to the point that we will see (it is already happening) photographers move to countries with very low living expenses and good internet access so that they can continue to make a living shooting stock and I expect some of the people who will be moving to those counties to be Russian.

And yes the predatory speculators are disgusting.
« Last Edit: October 27, 2010, 14:22 by gbalex »

Dook

« Reply #61 on: October 27, 2010, 14:24 »
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Your theory of people migrations is so unrealistic.  ???

« Reply #62 on: October 27, 2010, 14:30 »
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Your theory of people migrations is so unrealistic.  ???

Really, I have at least 6 friends who have already moved and I am considering it myself.

Dook

« Reply #63 on: October 27, 2010, 14:40 »
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Sorry, but I'm just not the type that likes to travel. Maybe that's why I can't understand it. There are two British photographers here in Bosnia, but they married local girls during the war and stayed here. Now they enjoy the benefits of lower costs doing stock, in fact. Where did your friends go?

vonkara

« Reply #64 on: October 27, 2010, 15:29 »
0
They can also earn barely 40% more incomes from microstock due to their low value money...
Maybe 20 years ago. Moscow is amongst the most expensive cities in the world right now.

Yea right, I just see the prices. About 50 000 roubles each month for a 3 rooms apartment. If you don't live in Moscow or St-Petersburg it might be worth it though, they still get 30 roubles for each american dollar

« Reply #65 on: October 27, 2010, 16:20 »
0
They can also earn barely 40% more incomes from microstock due to their low value money...
Maybe 20 years ago. Moscow is amongst the most expensive cities in the world right now.

Yea right, I just see the prices. About 50 000 roubles each month for a 3 rooms apartment. If you don't live in Moscow or St-Petersburg it might be worth it though, they still get 30 roubles for each american dollar

Is that cheap or expensive? How much is the heating?

vonkara

« Reply #66 on: October 27, 2010, 20:18 »
0
They can also earn barely 40% more incomes from microstock due to their low value money...
Maybe 20 years ago. Moscow is amongst the most expensive cities in the world right now.

Yea right, I just see the prices. About 50 000 roubles each month for a 3 rooms apartment. If you don't live in Moscow or St-Petersburg it might be worth it though, they still get 30 roubles for each american dollar

Is that cheap or expensive? How much is the heating?

It's quite expensive to me. A 3 or 4 rooms apartment here in Montreal is about 800$ a month or 24 000 roubles.


« Reply #67 on: October 27, 2010, 20:55 »
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I don't care how much a hamburger costs in Moscow. The point is, as usual, training your competition is a silly thing to do, regardless of how chipper it makes you feel.

« Reply #68 on: October 31, 2010, 22:23 »
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I don't care how much a hamburger costs in Moscow. The point is, as usual, training your competition is a silly thing to do, regardless of how chipper it makes you feel.

Competition always means higher quality so keep shooting and stop wasting your time here speaking about russian competitors)) Make a deal))


 

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