MicrostockGroup
Microstock Photography Forum - General => General Stock Discussion => Topic started by: Yuri_Arcurs on September 24, 2012, 05:18
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Read this thread... :(
http://www.dreamstime.com/thread_32460 (http://www.dreamstime.com/thread_32460)
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haha, nothing like being open about your plagiarism. I don't think there is much to be worried about though, Dudau makes a pretty convincing argument. It doesn't generally pay to compete with someone at their own game, especially when they have nearly a 10 year head start. If I were to give advice to a newcommer (and the advice I give myself) .. is to take a look at what Yuri (and others) are shooting and shoot something else. There is no point in trying to compete. The more alone you are in a niche the better.
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Well...I wonder what DT's reaction will be.
On the other hand - looking at this image I'm afraid that this guy is unfit to plead.
http://www.dreamstime.com/stock-photo-butterfly-net-image26227890 (http://www.dreamstime.com/stock-photo-butterfly-net-image26227890)
I'll be looking at all his latest uploads and making the exact same thing. :o
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What an idiot. Sure, be inspired by what other people do, learn what works and sells and what doesn't. Then make your own stuff.
Pablo Picasso: "Bad artists copy, great artists steal."
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Doh! How come nobody thought up such a brilliant idea before? It takes a complete newbie, with a fresh pair of eyes and 'blue sky thinking', to put us all to shame and lead us down the path to guaranteed success.
Now __ what was that bloke's name again? Yuri-something I think Mudplucker said? I need to get to work!
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What Leaf said. Still, it's someone who is brand new and doesn't know any better, how many more established contributors are trying to do this but just not posting about it?
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this resembles me my own adventures on Shutterstock and my efforts fighting copycats. And this is not only newbies (this guy from DT was just stupid enough to post about it ), but I've been riped off by people with 40k+ images in their port.
Shutterstock forum thread (http://submit.shutterstock.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=123774&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0)
Just shameless.
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so there is nothing to worry, next time take some time to make it more interesting, this contributor won´t go anywhere, don´t see why you are so concerned, is it about him knowing that? I guess everybody with 2 finger forehead knows that ;D
I would be more worried about your students and second shooters already contributing to stock, yes they are your friends we know that ;D
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We are all looking at a lot of pictures to get inspiration and to be updated with trends. Sometimes we also study a specific photographer.
At least I do. There are so many great guys out there.
And yes, I have also studied Yuri, and found out his success started when C... baked a bread, -isnt that right Yuri?
Well maybe not.
Now this guy on DT is rather naive to directly say "Making the exact same thing", but then again, the whole stock business is a copy mashine, and many do a lot of copying, and some might even live from it. Just look at alle the girls with headsets and other concepts.
Still its not worthy and nothing to be proud of.
Also Im sure originality and being a step ahead sells better, and also gives you a better sleep at night.
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I 've noticed big change in mentality of new generations!
Arrogance is a right word for that!
You can see arrogance of new members also in microstock...
Yuri, this is a "classic"example...
You may notice that many of new members on this forum have type of conversation like they are almost 10 years in microstock...
They don't want to ask ( probably it is beneath their dignity), they want to provoke older member on debate so then they can collect informations...
They want instant everything, no patience, we all are guilty for them, they are destined for success etc.
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this is nothing new and has been happening since day 1 and will continue to happen..
the thing I found most offensive is the naiveity or just plan lack of intelligence on this newbs part to openly brag about it on the forum - what possible good can come from doing this?
outright plagerism is dead wrong, but for others to shoot similars , well, theres just no stemming that tide.
even when someone comes up with a unique idea ( i.e finger people) it is only a matter of time before there are a boatload of similars, its just part of the business - all you can do is think of the next new idea and make sure your work stands out with regard to quality.
Look at the bigger world of manufacturing - X product is made - not long thereafter imitations crop up for cheaper ( i.e. China) What to do? Make sure your product is superior in quality... thats all
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this is why you don't mix 'Crack' with Microstock- very dangerous thing :o
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Yuri, why don't you photograph a butterfly net over blue and photoshop a couple of fake butterflies onto the background to steal all his sales. That would teach him a lesson!
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Just stunning to see someone be such a shining example of moral bankruptcy and stupidity - the whole package!
I'm sure DT will keep a close eye on this numb nuts
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Why would they need to keep an eye on him. Yuri is a mentor to many, including some here, and myself. To be influenced, and understand the mechanics of the trade, just as Yuri did himself many years ago, is perfectly fine.
In the end, the photo is going to stand up for itself, and if one can "research" the gaps in the market along with Yuri, then kudos, job well done. I for one wouldnt be sharing it on a forum. Id be shooting shitloads to fill the gap.
In the end, if he makes a buck off a few inspired shots good stuff, isnt that why were all here.
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Just stunning to see someone be such a shining example of moral bankruptcy and stupidity - the whole package!
I'm sure DT will keep a close eye on this numb nuts
Are you sure about that? Two admins have commented that you shouldn't copy his work because "Chances are you'll end up being just a bad copy" or "The best way to be successful is to develop your own style.". I would expect a threat to be banned and an unequivocal statement that this kind of thing won't be tolerated.
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Why would they need to keep an eye on him. Yuri is a mentor to many, including some here, and myself. To be influenced, and understand the mechanics of the trade, just as Yuri did himself many years ago, is perfectly fine...
Taking inspiration is one thing - if you read what this person said, it was to make "the exact same thing" which isn't at all the same as learning from or being inspired by. Duplicating shots isn't OK and that's what he's advocating.
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Yuri maybe you've upset this guy in the past, it's a very strange thing to say openly on a forum like that.
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Even makers of physical products, like watches and handbags, can't completely prevent knockoffs - what chance do we have of protecting digital products?
The people doing this see the internet as an opportunity to run any sort of money-making games against people they'll never have to confront in person - people who 'exist' only as anonymous handles or email addresses. But I'm sure the owners of microstock agencies like DT don't feel that way. Not at all. ;)
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Yuri maybe you've upset this guy in the past, it's a very strange thing to say openly on a forum like that.
I thought it was tongue-in-cheek at first, then I wasn't so sure. Very weird if he posted it actually meaning it, and what was the point of the post?
He may be a newbie as in only having 8 files on DT, but he has made over 50 posts, apparently.
Well, he's very carey-sharey, sharing his great new idea with the whole community. :o ::)
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Copying a photographer is a difficult thing to do. Even if you set the same scene and shot the same style. The two photos are going to be vastly different. I hardly see it as plagerism. Now taking a Yuri photo and uploading it as your own, thats plagerism.
We all browse through the libraries looking for things to copy, i mean inspire us.
If the guy is good at his work, and has the equipment to compete, then i honestly dont see any issue. This guys photo is what is going to be the deciding factor, not the fact that he chose to copy a style.
And Yuri shoots alot of stuff with Model Releases, uploads 400 a month to only ONE stock agency, its hardly worth worrying about. The work will either be crap and want pass QC or it will pass and make some money.
Who loses, no one.
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Copying a photographer is a difficult thing to do. Even if you set the same scene and shot the same style. The two photos are going to be vastly different. I hardly see it as plagerism. Now taking a Yuri photo and uploading it as your own, thats plagerism.
No. That would be plain theft, and it's easier to deal with.
Plagiarism is copying.
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At this very moment - an entire city in China is being set up as a microstock factory. Thousands of photographers, assistants and models are being trained to systematically identify and copy every money-making photo on all the big sites. The Chinese government will first deny any knowledge of this operation, then claim to be taking action against it, while all the time collecting 30% of its gross proceeds.
Did I just make this up? I'm not sure.
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Copying a photographer is a difficult thing to do. Even if you set the same scene and shot the same style. The two photos are going to be vastly different. I hardly see it as plagerism. Now taking a Yuri photo and uploading it as your own, thats plagerism.
No. That would be plain theft, and it's easier to deal with.
Plagiarism is copying.
ain't that a little too much? a woman with a headset or a guy behind a desk looking at a laptop? wasn´t that done back in the 70s or 80s? or the famous handshake? Yuri copied them too?
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Let’s get real here. We have a silly naive post from a beginner and the villagers are gathering pitchforks like he was raping babies. The subject matter here is as generic stock as it gets and emulated across all the sites by beginners and established practitioners alike even if the execution doesn’t come close.
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If it comes to Microstock I'm a copycat too, and many people forget that Yuri is a copycat too! (remember the jumping gold fish series this was one if not the top selling file at iStock at around 2004 by a rather unknown contributor then his idea got copied by Lise Gagne and the idea become even more successful and then Yuri copied the serie from Lise Gagne, this is a matter of fact and not made up by me!)
So who is to blame? The Microstock system is encouraging copying because everyone sees which files are selling, my advice if you have an unique idea and you don't want it to be copied - then don't put on Microstock choose the macro way instead!
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Let’s get real here. We have a silly naive post from a beginner and the villagers are gathering pitchforks like he was raping babies. The subject matter here is as generic stock as it gets and emulated across all the sites by beginners and established practitioners alike even if the execution doesn’t come close.
Yes, I flood a market with vast quantities of a product designated as "stock", which I've made as generic as possible, and within which I have tried to exploit every conceivable niche - and I make it clear that I've made a lot of money by doing this - and then I find people talking rather openly about trying duplicate my output. How shocked should I be?
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Understated but true. There's still room for more jumping goldfish? ;D
Jumping Goldfish Stock Photos, Illustrations, and Vector Art
Displaying results 1 - 100 of 1,044.
This guys message is about equal to discovering the wheel. No really, things go around and you can make a cart? Japan, China, Korea and others make flat out re-engineered copies of popular products. I'm amazed, people copy on Microstock sites?
Just why I said I wasn't upset at all when the search at some places didn't show my most popular first. Buyers will find what they want and the uninspired will just copy. That's life...
If it comes to Microstock I'm a copycat too, and many people forget that Yuri is a copycat too! (remember the jumping gold fish series this was one if not the top selling file at iStock at around 2004 by a rather unknown contributor then his idea got copied by Lise Gagne and the idea become even more successful and then Yuri copied the serie from Lise Gagne, this is a matter of fact and not made up by me!)
So who is to blame? The Microstock system is encouraging copying because everyone sees which files are selling, my advice if you have an unique idea and you don't want it to be copied - then don't put on Microstock choose the macro way instead!
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[snip] The Microstock system is encouraging copying because everyone sees which files are selling, my advice if you have an unique idea and you don't want it to be copied - then don't put on Microstock choose the macro way instead!
Microstock sites can discourage copying simply by tooling the search engines so new images are still returned below existing images with good sales. A new image should have to be better enough that searchers search deep and buy it instead of the existing image presented earlier. This would reduce copying and increase contributor creativity (finding a niche with low search returns). The agencies don't happen to favor this kind of Best Match though. Has anyone tried to add some multi-year old images again and compare how the new vs the old sell? Some current Best Match searches encourage this kind of behavior from contributors.
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Do we have to bring our own pitchforks or will they be supplied?
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ain't that a little too much? a woman with a headset or a guy behind a desk looking at a laptop? wasn´t that done back in the 70s or 80s? or the famous handshake? Yuri copied them too?
I'm pretty sure there were no 'looking at a laptop' photos in the 70's. The same goes for headsets by the way ;)
But on a more serious note. This is not about very broad subjects, but copying very specific characteristics of an image. Trying to recreate the same 'look', lighting, colors, composition etc. I think most of us can spot a plagiarism.
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HEHEHE. Getting interesting.
Where to draw the line in determining what is plagiarism and what is not must first start with a consideration of the content. Is the content original? As in... never done before? If that is the case it is quite easy to draw the line. For concepts that are generic or so simple that they simply arrive naturally from engaging with subject you are dealing with, it is VERY hard to claim that they are unique enough to be the subject of plagiarism.
Consider the subject of the jumping goldfish and see this result from google.
https://www.google.dk/search?q=jumping+goldfish&hl=en&tbs=cdr:1,cd_min:1/1/2004,cd_max:12/31/2005&prmd=imvns&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=1otgULjAHcbzsgbO1ICACQ&sqi=2&ved=0CAcQ_AUoAQ&biw=1782&bih=1188 (https://www.google.dk/search?q=jumping+goldfish&hl=en&tbs=cdr:1,cd_min:1/1/2004,cd_max:12/31/2005&prmd=imvns&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=1otgULjAHcbzsgbO1ICACQ&sqi=2&ved=0CAcQ_AUoAQ&biw=1782&bih=1188)
Hardly a unique subject and most definitively not all "invented" by one artist from istock. No in fact, these kind of images arrive naturally from engagement with the concept of shooting goldfish. We even have a saying about "moving to new waters" so shooting goldfish..that come in a bowl... Not exactly a unique idea. The jumping goldfish is a classic.
However. I think the post I am refering to in this thread is a clear intention of systematic efforts to copy. That is different. That is a whole different league and in my eyes not just "naive" or something a newbie would do and we can forgive. This is different entirely.
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..... in my eyes not just "naive" or something a newbie would do and we can forgive. This is different entirely.
The very fact that someone thought this was a great insight and decided to post it is a sure sign that it's a naive beginner. The folks you need to be concerned about are those that keep their heads down, quietly copy the style and content and have the skills to pull it off. Mopic's examples are much more "pitchfork" worthy ;)
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Dreamstime should give a clear statement and ban this guy. We all get inspired and "copy" somehow known concepts, but at least most of us try to do it different, better in the own style.
The difference:
- Copy a concept with own flavour
- Copy the whole picture while trying to reassemble light, perspective, model look etc.
The latter one IMHO is theft and should be banned.
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Dreamstime should give a clear statement and ban this guy. We all get inspired and "copy" somehow known concepts, but at least most of us try to do it different, better in the own style.
The difference:
- Copy a concept with own flavour
- Copy the whole picture while trying to reassemble light, perspective, model look etc.
The latter one IMHO is theft and should be banned.
Banned for what? Making a badly thought out and inappropriate forum post? If that's the case a lot of us would be in big trouble. The guy has 8 pictures, none of which would be remotely mistaken for one of Yuri's so he hasn't actually copied anything.
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Dreamstime should give a clear statement and ban this guy. We all get inspired and "copy" somehow known concepts, but at least most of us try to do it different, better in the own style.
The difference:
- Copy a concept with own flavour
- Copy the whole picture while trying to reassemble light, perspective, model look etc.
The latter one IMHO is theft and should be banned.
Banned for what? Making a badly thought out and inappropriate forum post? If that's the case a lot of us would be in big trouble. The guy has 8 pictures, none of which would be remotely mistaken for one of Yuri's so he hasn't actually copied anything.
In most countries asking people in public to break the law is considered as a criminal act. Trying or asking others to try to produce _exact_ copies of the product of another vendor without right is asking other to commit a copyright violation. I would not allow this in my Agency nor do I think allowing it is constructive.
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The jumping goldfish have been around for years. I've got a book published in 2001 that has the jumping goldfish on the front cover.
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The whole microstock business including all top togs is one big pile of the same. Period. Only a few are unique.
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The whole microstock business including all top togs is one big pile of the same. Period. Only a few are unique.
Totally true. However, legally spoken, with his statement this guy crosses the border from "it was my idea, the similarity is just coincidence, it is my interpretation, ...." to "I want to break the law". The moral side and what is reality is is another thing. Legally he is on the bad side and is publicly asking other to break the law. And you have to draw a line somewhere. If you don`t, as an agency, you just pi55 off good sellers like Yuri and risk to get in legal trouble.
EDIT: If I would be Yuri, I would archive the DT thread of this guy and sue him with the first copy he publishes on the site. Success guaranteed since he is admitting his intention.
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They say imitation is the purest form of flattery. Yuri, you should have the biggest ego out there as lets be honest, your work is imitated on a very regular basis. What you have going for you is your reputation. People recognize your work as brand name, quality imagery and will buy it over the copy cats any time.
This industry attracts a lot of young, naive people that don't fully understand that there are consequences to actions. If this guy is around and uploading in a year I will be absolutely shocked. He is a non-issue but his candor to a problem many face removes the subtle mask from it. This is a good discussion because I am sure that the idea isn't unique to this guy that made the DT post.
I am however very disappointed to learn that you have cut production to just 400 images per month. What have you been doing with your free time you slacker!?!
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I say we ALL copy Yuri stuff and submit them..
the newb will get his ego boosted, Yuri will be extremely flattered, and we can all live happily everafter in Yuritopia
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The whole microstock business including all top togs is one big pile of the same. Period. Only a few are unique.
Totally true. However, legally spoken, with his statement this guy crosses the border from "it was my idea, the similarity is just coincidence, it is my interpretation, ...." to "I want to break the law". The moral side and what is reality is is another thing. Legally he is on the bad side and is publicly asking other to break the law. And you have to draw a line somewhere. If you don`t, as an agency, you just pi55 off good sellers like Yuri and risk to get in legal trouble.
I agree with that as well
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Can you blame the guy? I mean the OP here has actively trained people to duplicate his style and procedures in the past (interns, "boot camps"), and many of them somehow ended up using even the same models and settings when creating "new" images on their own. So it almost seems like it would be an "approved" thing to do to some.
I guess that's the risk you take with that model.
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Consider the subject of the jumping goldfish and see this result from google.
https://www.google.dk/search?q=jumping+goldfish&hl=en&tbs=cdr:1,cd_min:1/1/2004,cd_max:12/31/2005&prmd=imvns&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=1otgULjAHcbzsgbO1ICACQ&sqi=2&ved=0CAcQ_AUoAQ&biw=1782&bih=1188 (https://www.google.dk/search?q=jumping+goldfish&hl=en&tbs=cdr:1,cd_min:1/1/2004,cd_max:12/31/2005&prmd=imvns&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=1otgULjAHcbzsgbO1ICACQ&sqi=2&ved=0CAcQ_AUoAQ&biw=1782&bih=1188)
Hardly a unique subject and most definitively not all "invented" by one artist from istock. No in fact, these kind of images arrive naturally from engagement with the concept of shooting goldfish.
Nonsense. Someone invented that concept and the fact that it has been mercilessly plagiarised by all the big boys and girls doesn't make it a "natural progression" from shooting goldfish let alone goldfish jumping in a way that goldfish never do. Nor is it exactly a "natural progression" from lifestyle to shooting goldfish (did you really spend many hours in your early days focusing on the goldfish bowl before the idea of photoshopping them jumping about suddenly sprang into your mind?). The natural progression is that the big boys and girls keep their eyes open for stuff that sells well and then copy it .... but the guy at DT is being too naively obvious about things.
The silly thing about his idea (reinventing the wheel though it may be) is that he clearly has no idea of the skills that need to be acquired to be able to copy someone like Yuri Arcurs. Or that once you have that skill set you might as well try to use it on something of your own.
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Im amazed how much vigilantism is in this thread, lets hang him.
Yuri, even if there was a clear systematic way to copy you, its is hardly plagerism under the law of copyright which allows you to modify directly your photo into a new work.
This guy hasnt even proposed modifying. It is copying a style, he will use his own equipment, his own camera, his own lights and of course his own model. Youve been in this game 10 years, did you not do exactly the same thing to monitise out of gaps in the market.
You would have a hard time convincing me that your "concept" is unique. Never been done before. Groundbreaking. Why do we watch remakes of old movies, because all the stories have been told before, we rarely see a new idea. The same in photography.
Now consider a musician, if you were to say never use those 12 notes because theyve been used before we would end up with Britney Spears and NKOTB, oh crap that became a reality.
You got dollars Yuri, you got reputation, id say a little of get off your high horse, you would have been in the same shoes, naive and wanting to make a million, you think back to how hard that first million was to make.
His pictures will stand on there own, regardless of the actions he took to create them.
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Im amazed how much vigilantism is in this thread, lets hang him.
Yuri, even if there was a clear systematic way to copy you, its is hardly plagerism under the law of copyright which allows you to modify directly your photo into a new work.
This guy hasnt even proposed modifying. It is copying a style, he will use his own equipment, his own camera, his own lights and of course his own model. Youve been in this game 10 years, did you not do exactly the same thing to monitise out of gaps in the market.
You would have a hard time convincing me that your "concept" is unique. Never been done before. Groundbreaking. Why do we watch remakes of old movies, because all the stories have been told before, we rarely see a new idea. The same in photography.
Now consider a musician, if you were to say never use those 12 notes because theyve been used before we would end up with Britney Spears and NKOTB, oh crap that became a reality.
You got dollars Yuri, you got reputation, id say a little of get off your high horse, you would have been in the same shoes, naive and wanting to make a million, you think back to how hard that first million was to make.
His pictures will stand on there own, regardless of the actions he took to create them.
So then, I could draw the Apple Logo with MY Adobe Illustrator or MY pencil, print it on MY own Laptop and sell it under the name of Apple which is a totally generic word as well? Try to do that, it`ll a good one :D
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Maybe what's left of the Beatles should sue Apple - Apple Corps was there before Steve started up
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His pictures will stand on there own, regardless of the actions he took to create them.
http://www.dpreview.com/news/2012/01/25/Imitated_Image_Copyright_Case (http://www.dpreview.com/news/2012/01/25/Imitated_Image_Copyright_Case)
http://fashionista.com/2011/10/rihanna-settles-out-of-court-with-david-lachapelle-for-copying-his-photos-in-sm-video/ (http://fashionista.com/2011/10/rihanna-settles-out-of-court-with-david-lachapelle-for-copying-his-photos-in-sm-video/)
They stand to get him sued maybe?
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Here, we are all in trouble then
http://www.petapixel.com/2012/01/25/create-a-similarly-composed-photo-in-the-uk-risk-copyright-infringement/ (http://www.petapixel.com/2012/01/25/create-a-similarly-composed-photo-in-the-uk-risk-copyright-infringement/)
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Here, we are all in trouble then
[url]http://www.petapixel.com/2012/01/25/create-a-similarly-composed-photo-in-the-uk-risk-copyright-infringement/[/url] ([url]http://www.petapixel.com/2012/01/25/create-a-similarly-composed-photo-in-the-uk-risk-copyright-infringement/[/url])
That particular case was just insanity. The red bus against mono Houses of Parliament is the equivalent of the yellow taxi against mono skyscrapers.
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so the idea isnt to embrace a student of photography and guide him even if he is taking at style and copying it, we have to all take the American road of patents and lawsuits until the arts is like computers, no single person can get ahead without stepping on the toes of the fortunate.
lets persecute for copying instead of embracing it as his "respresentation" of that work, hes not passing it off as Yuris, hes not copying the image, hes taking the idea and working with it himself.
Lets just sue each other until theres no room to move forward anymore. Copyright allows you to take other peoples work and modify it into your own. A rhianna video is alot more than one still, it opens up much easier claim of direct copying.
I dont agree with this. I copyright my photos because i dont want them to be stolen, but i support a person who wants to follow in my footsteps and recreate what i have done.
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If it comes to Microstock I'm a copycat too, and many people forget that Yuri is a copycat too! (remember the jumping gold fish series this was one if not the top selling file at iStock at around 2004 by a rather unknown contributor then his idea got copied by Lise Gagne and the idea become even more successful and then Yuri copied the serie from Lise Gagne, this is a matter of fact and not made up by me!)
So who is to blame? The Microstock system is encouraging copying because everyone sees which files are selling, my advice if you have an unique idea and you don't want it to be copied - then don't put on Microstock choose the macro way instead!
100% agree
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Big mistake! Well it's not a big deal to copy Yuri's work! Everyone can copy his work but the real "problem" is to do even something close to Elena Vizerskaya' work.
Don't get me wrong I'm against plagiarism but if someone decide to do let it be unique and special like Elena' photos.
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I'm sorry, who are you Drexxle?
so the idea isnt to embrace a student of photography and guide him even if he is taking at style and copying it, we have to all take the American road of patents and lawsuits until the arts is like computers, no single person can get ahead without stepping on the toes of the fortunate.
lets persecute for copying instead of embracing it as his "respresentation" of that work, hes not passing it off as Yuris, hes not copying the image, hes taking the idea and working with it himself.
Lets just sue each other until theres no room to move forward anymore. Copyright allows you to take other peoples work and modify it into your own. A rhianna video is alot more than one still, it opens up much easier claim of direct copying.
I dont agree with this. I copyright my photos because i dont want them to be stolen, but i support a person who wants to follow in my footsteps and recreate what i have done.
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Yuri,
It's funny how you complain about some guy who has nothing but a few crappy images, and who's not even close to being able to copy your work. Yet, you've never complained about laflor, kupicoo, Squaredpixels, Steex, Annebaek , etc, etc, etc... (All of them iStock exclusives)
Come on.... Tell us what's the difference... ;)
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Hi everybody!!! (dr nik)
And since you asked, I come from an IT background, i have been a photographer for about 12 years. I have extensively travelled Australia and have a reasonably large library of images to use. Im a 40 yr old Aussie who has always enjoyed tourism, locations, and the unusual. My biggest photo journey has been taking a 1975 Leyland Mini across the dirt of the Australian Desert.
I have held onto my images for too long. I started fixing computers for professional photographers, and next thing you know im taking more and more photos and being mentored by some great photographers.
Taken me some time to get my stuff together and publish it, im lazy in the post processing department. I got motivated a little while ago, and having been around photographers for the last ten years, i was accepted first go at a few agencies. (i used to prepare stuff for other photographers).
its nice to join a group of like minded people. I came across this blog the other day looking for other agencies, i was looking for more landscape and tourism based agencies.
copyright is something i enjoy learning too, and im for protection of images, but im also aware of how this stumps creation due to how it has in the software industry, you only have to look at apple and samsung of late.
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Watch out Yuri, here comes the mighty Mudplucker with his Canon T2i! ::)
8 files on sale since 25th April, he is a machine.
Be afraid Yuri, be very afraid ... I know i am, well a little bit scared of Mudplucker.
He has 84 posts in the message boards, great to see he's been busy there anyway...asking about payment, hmm, wouldn't you need some sales first before worrying about that??
I hope he is just kidding.
Yuri is King 8)
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A few months back I supplied a picture of a hardhat worker having a luch break inside an industrial plant. I thought the picture was great. This was to the Getty RM.
It ws rejected with the words, too similar to another picture.
Fair enough I did not know. So why cant micros do the same? probably because if they think they can earn 20 cents out of a guy its worth it.
They dont care.
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Six or seven years ago I shot a picture with some newspapers in it and got a rejection from iS with the rejection reason "I don't think so-and-so would like you selling his photo", I didn't know who so-and-so was and I scoured the image to see if part of a photo was visible enough to be a copyright infringement. I couldn't find anything and the rejection kept bothering me. Years later I realised that one of the inspector's chums must have shot the same thing and I was being accused of plagiarism (rolls eyes).
Anyway, I photographed some toast this morning and hereby give notice that I will be putting copyright restrictions on all uses of bits of toast in future.
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Mudplucker is naive but honest.
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Mudplucker is naive but honest.
Yes but its easy to be honest when you are naive.
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Yuri threw out a little bait and everybody jumped on it.
Is there a list of what concepts are acceptable to copy ?
Do they have a time limit ? 10 years ?
If 1000 people beat you to using the concept its okay but a concept from 1 person isn't ?
Is it okay to use a concept from RM ? but not from RF ?
Tip for all serious concept inspired contributors search RM not Istock to find your inspiration.
Gold fish are they fair game ?
computers with chains ?
girls with headphones ?
girls blowing dandelions ?
nests with golden eggs ?
Elephants riding surfboards ?
All very confusing.
I had a photo of landmark refused because it was to similar to "someone elses work." What a massive concept it was to take a photo of one of the worlds most recognisable landmarks from a easily accessible vantage point at lunchtime.
It made sense to reject it for "our database already covers this area" or purely that's hopeless, shoot at a better time of day but to say I was copying was a long bow to draw in my opion. I think that especially when you see how well and how widely some concepts are re-invented.
Maybe the poster wanted to get everybody to copy yuri's work to get them all band so that he could wipe out the competition. Just yuri and himself raking in the cash.
Hey ! that's my concept ! no photos of rakes and money. Oh hang on there's 24 already on istock. Are they 10 years old yet ?
Oh well looks like I bit at Yuri's bait aswell.
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We have to draw the line somewhere. This post shows intent to systematic duplication and advocates other to do so as well.
The keywords here are "systematic", "clear intention" and trying to "get others on board". If this is something we should just dismiss, then there is no grounds for any claims against plagiarism in microstock and we collectively accept all plagiarism attempts as "OK". I think this contributor clearly crosses the line for what we actually should accept.
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We have to draw the line somewhere. This post shows intent to systematic duplication and advocates other to do so as well.
The keywords here are "systematic", "clear intention" and trying to "get others on board". If this is something we should just dismiss, then there is no grounds for any claims against plagiarism in microstock and we collectively accept all plagiarism attempts as "OK". I think this contributor clearly crosses the line for what we actually should accept.
Sure, it's wrong. So what do you want us to do about it? Why post it here instead of taking it up with Serban? What is your solution?
We all know we are being copied and we all know that the micro agencies couldn't care less. SS's best sellers listing is an open invitation for people to seek "inspiration". Most popular/best selling search options do much the same. A large proportion of microstockers seem to want to "research" what sells before they shoot that subject and that is not going to change.
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A few months back I supplied a picture of a hardhat worker having a luch break inside an industrial plant. I thought the picture was great. This was to the Getty RM.
It ws rejected with the words, too similar to another picture.
Fair enough I did not know. So why cant micros do the same? probably because if they think they can earn 20 cents out of a guy its worth it.
They dont care.
Because their business model doesn't allow them to pay the staff to check. Clearly not something Bruce factored in.
That's why rather than contact pinterest about pinned images, it's easier for e.g. istock to say pinterest is an affiliate, end of discussion. (I haven't seen any reports here about what the other micros say about pinterest and its clones.)
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We have to draw the line somewhere. This post shows intent to systematic duplication and advocates other to do so as well.
The keywords here are "systematic", "clear intention" and trying to "get others on board". If this is something we should just dismiss, then there is no grounds for any claims against plagiarism in microstock and we collectively accept all plagiarism attempts as "OK". I think this contributor clearly crosses the line for what we actually should accept.
I was successful with take-downs of images that were plagiarism of my own work (at least @ Shutterstock), so I'm pretty sure you have enough leverage in the industry to protect your work properly. But we need to do something about it. The worst thing to do is to say "that's just the way micros work".
I know some of you think that it's just a guy with 8 pictures, but my work has been copied by people with big, high quality ports. The last case is a guy with 40k+ images. People do this because they think they can get away with it, but the more often we act and send infringement claims, the more chances we have fighting plagiarism.
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A few months back I supplied a picture of a hardhat worker having a luch break inside an industrial plant. I thought the picture was great. This was to the Getty RM.
It ws rejected with the words, too similar to another picture.
Fair enough I did not know. So why cant micros do the same? probably because if they think they can earn 20 cents out of a guy its worth it.
They dont care.
Because their business model doesn't allow them to pay the staff to check. Clearly not something Bruce factored in.
That's why rather than contact pinterest about pinned images, it's easier for e.g. istock to say pinterest is an affiliate, end of discussion. (I haven't seen any reports here about what the other micros say about pinterest and its clones.)
Allow them to pay the staff? . At the Getty original RM they have 22 staff including four qualified Art Directors, highly experienced picture editors and even art buyers and the list goes on, they even call in special editors for medical and scientific material.
They have the staff and the money to pay. They dont like copying, plagiarism and thats that.
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I don't see any point in copying Yuri. Why compete with one of the best? There's lots of others already doing it, hardly an original idea. It shows a complete lack of imagination, probably the one thing you need the most to make money selling images.
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A few months back I supplied a picture of a hardhat worker having a luch break inside an industrial plant. I thought the picture was great. This was to the Getty RM.
It ws rejected with the words, too similar to another picture.
Fair enough I did not know. So why cant micros do the same? probably because if they think they can earn 20 cents out of a guy its worth it.
They dont care.
Because their business model doesn't allow them to pay the staff to check. Clearly not something Bruce factored in.
That's why rather than contact pinterest about pinned images, it's easier for e.g. istock to say pinterest is an affiliate, end of discussion. (I haven't seen any reports here about what the other micros say about pinterest and its clones.)
Allow them to pay the staff? . At the Getty original RM they have 22 staff including four qualified Art Directors, highly experienced picture editors and even art buyers and the list goes on, they even call in special editors for medical and scientific material.
They have the staff and the money to pay. They dont like copying, plagiarism and thats that.
I was answering your question about micros (reference to Bruce), making no comment about Getty.
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Everyone is mentioned, oh they told me it was similar to someone else.
Stop for a second, do you for that second think they are caring about you or copyright. They have a vested interest in their business model. Too many images of one topic, especially if they look "alike" harms their business model.
They have a "unique" and viable set of images to sell into the future, having 30 of that one type of image harms that business model. end of story.
It is very hard to plagerise a picture, it comes down to interpretation and rightful ability to change work into a new copyright, your own.
Interesting discussion, but sometimes its not all about the photographers
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I don't see any point in copying Yuri. Why compete with one of the best? There's lots of others already doing it, hardly an original idea. It shows a complete lack of imagination, probably the one thing you need the most to make money selling images.
That's why I didn't think the person was really serious. Like if someone asked, "What should I shoot for Micros?" and I might answer, "Look at Yuri", which would be totally sarcastic and in no way 'encouraging a crime'. That person said he didn't have lights or models. How long would he take to build up a studio and model list to compete with anyone? Either he's incredibly stupid or it was just a stupid post.
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We have to draw the line somewhere. This post shows intent to systematic duplication and advocates other to do so as well.
The keywords here are "systematic", "clear intention" and trying to "get others on board". If this is something we should just dismiss, then there is no grounds for any claims against plagiarism in microstock and we collectively accept all plagiarism attempts as "OK". I think this contributor clearly crosses the line for what we actually should accept.
Totally agree.
Learning from or being inspired by successful contributors is one thing, calling for systematically copying is totally different thing, regardless how new this guy was in the industry or how serious this guy was, there should be no place for his act.
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Well, flashon, I would say that "learning" and "inspiration" are just somewhat different from outright copying, not "totally different". Unless, of course, you are talking about lighting or processing technique rather than subject matter, but "inspiration" seems to be mostly about trying to mimic what someone else did.
Anyway, I've dusted down my small, portable gallows and got out my pitchfork, and I'm just waiting for Yuri's instructions about what we are to do next, apart from whinging rather pointlessly in a forum thread. Or does the action plan stop here?
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I don't see a problem posting this thread by whomever.
No matter if a noob or a long standing photographer explicitly tries to instruct other contributors on a (somewhat) major microstock agency's forum to copy someone is flat out idiotic.
No matter who the "successful" victim is and no matter who the noob is who gags for some attention on the forums.
This is not even about "copying" concepts. It's about the fact that the noob's spicy wiener is probably too small for this game and can't stand that someone out there is better than him.
He has no competitive skills whatsoever and yet reserves the right to "raise an army or willing contributors" to dissect someone's portfolio and copy every last bit of it to make him feel better about his 8 approved uploads.
I believe Yuri has no need to fear people copying his work because he simply works in his own universe. People concepts which is his thing is not just done by him and that's no news to him either.
There is a big pie, everyone who plays this game professionally can get a nice piece of it.
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I believe Yuri has no need to fear people copying his work because he simply works in his own universe. People concepts which is his thing is not just done by him and that's no news to him either.
There is a big pie, everyone who plays this game professionally can get a nice piece of it.
Pretty much nailed it, a good reason why copyright allows educational use, the modification of works into your own, the interpretation of works into your own.
Plagerism is a find line in art. its not math, 2+2 doesnt equal 4 all the time, it subjective and interpretive and inspirational and my version fo 2+2 might equal 5.
If this were the case, every landscape must be an Ansel, or every baby in a costume must be a Geddes.
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Well, I have to say I've been inspired by this thread. I'm off to do a group of angry villagers wielding pitchforks, torches and sundry agricultural implements isolated on white.
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Im going to copy that idea 8)
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Pardon me but havent all the agencies the ultimate responsibillity by not accepting deliberate plagiarism. Lets face it if people think they are going to make a fast buck and by copying good sellers, they will. Unless the agencies refuse the material.
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I think I am going to draw angry villagers with pitch forks too.
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The whole business is bound to produce a lot of similar pictures, as it is both in the interest of the agencies and the customers, just not in the contributors, so we are fighting an uphill game here.
That reminds me. I have a picture of a copy machine:
(http://image.shutterstock.com/display_pic_with_logo/88729/88729,1272612089,1/stock-photo-stack-of-paper-in-the-copy-machine-52052047.jpg)
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I have a illustration for that:
http://www.istockphoto.com/stock-illustration-17133304-pushing-a-bus-uphill.php?st=825c60c (http://www.istockphoto.com/stock-illustration-17133304-pushing-a-bus-uphill.php?st=825c60c)
you should buy it.
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We all browse through the libraries looking for things to copy, i mean inspire us.
Umm. Actually, no, we don't all do that.
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We all browse through the libraries looking for things to copy, i mean inspire us.
Umm. Actually, no, we don't all do that.
+1
I actually try to not look at anything else and keep my head fresh.
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I actually try to not look at anything else and keep my head fresh.
Exactly. The more time you spend trolling other people's portfolios, or the popular lists, the more likely you are to copy, sometimes without even consciously realizing it.
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I actually try to not look at anything else and keep my head fresh.
Exactly. The more time you spend trolling other people's portfolios, or the popular lists, the more likely you are to copy, sometimes without even consciously realizing it.
Generally the only time I take a look at other work is if I have what I think is a "bright idea" - I do a search on a couple of the big sites to see if it's already been done to death. I'm well aware that a new idea to me might not be an open niche or anything where I have a new take on a concept and it saves a lot of wasted time to check that out first.
But the order is important - idea first then search :)
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I actually just spent time surfing ports and best of weeks and so on, to see if there was something.
But its not so much concepts or ideas I look for, but more techniques.
I must have been inspired, because I came up with this:
http://www.fotostart.dk/usergallery//fullsize/7901-20120925184756.jpg (http://www.fotostart.dk/usergallery//fullsize/7901-20120925184756.jpg)
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I actually try to not look at anything else and keep my head fresh.
Exactly. The more time you spend trolling other people's portfolios, or the popular lists, the more likely you are to copy, sometimes without even consciously realizing it.
Generally the only time I take a look at other work is if I have what I think is a "bright idea" - I do a search on a couple of the big sites to see if it's already been done to death. I'm well aware that a new idea to me might not be an open niche or anything where I have a new take on a concept and it saves a lot of wasted time to check that out first.
But the order is important - idea first then search :)
I do the same when I have an idea and I always find others have done it before me.
It may be that I'm not original at all or that I am very good at searching :-\
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I must have been inspired, because I came up with this:
[url]http://www.fotostart.dk/usergallery//fullsize/7901-20120925184756.jpg[/url] ([url]http://www.fotostart.dk/usergallery//fullsize/7901-20120925184756.jpg[/url])
Oh, Jens, come on, everyone's done half-a-dozen of those already.
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OK, so now out of a sudden it is kind of "frowned" upon to look at other contributors' portfolios?
People, let's be honest.
First of all we (or some of us) are running a business. We would be literally naive to "just do our thing" without having a clue what the competition is doing.
Knowing your competition is key to being successful. You need to be different AND better than the competition. How can you do that by not looking at other successful contributors' portfolios?
It's not primarily to copy concepts or actual photos that already exist, it's about finding out what doesn't exist and what can be done better.
If it was for having fun shooting something I sure wouldn't be running to the store buying a fishbowl with gold fish in it to make them jump from one bowl to the other.
I don't believe it if anyone claims to just be doing their own thing without peaking into other people's portfolios.
Many of us have idols that keep us on our toes that motivate us to improve our work etc. This all wouldn't be happening if we put on some blinders on and just walk straight ahead..
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Well, I have to say I've been inspired by this thread. I'm off to do a group of angry villagers wielding pitchforks, torches and sundry agricultural implements isolated on white.
make sure you put in the description "angry villagers preparing to punish microstock copycats."
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OK, so now out of a sudden it is kind of "frowned" upon to look at other contributors' portfolios?
I don't recall anyone saying that. I'm sure we all look at other people's portfolios. The issue is about copying, not looking.
I tend to do what JSnover does. I have an idea, jot it down and/or sketch it up, then search on the subject to see what's already out there. If it's done to death and done the same way I intended to do it, I either scrap the idea or think of an original way to do it.
As she said though, the idea comes first.
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Copycats or just working for the same boss?
*removed*
Among many others.
Sniff, sniff... It smells fishy
admin edit: we shouldn't link to other's portfolio pointing fingers.
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Well, I have to say I've been inspired by this thread. I'm off to do a group of angry villagers wielding pitchforks, torches and sundry agricultural implements isolated on white.
make sure you put in the description "angry villagers preparing to punish microstock copycats."
The first guy is done (the fat bald guy with the pitchfork and the clenched fist). A few more and I'll combine them in PSP to make a group (just like Yuri does)
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Its hard to come up with something that hasnt been done with over 100 million photos online for sale. I just shoot and submit, I dont check if it hasnt been done. And if it has been, I dont care. I recently submitted walls, accepted everywhere. Do they sell, dont know. You just never know if there is a buyer that will purchase the 120 dollar SOD for my wall. And my wall comes up higher on the new search than a 7 year old wall.
As said before, if I look through the top guys portfolios, all I see is the handshake, the family picnic, the businesswoman with a bunch of documents in her hands, etc etc etc, the only difference is, the models are different.
I dont believe anyone here can find a subject that has HCV and hasnt been done on any one of the agencies out there. Of course no one is going to share that info, because by next week that subject will then have been done to death 8)
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Knowing your competition is key to being successful. You need to be different AND better than the competition. How can you do that by not looking at other successful contributors' portfolios?
(snip)
I don't believe it if anyone claims to just be doing their own thing without peaking into other people's portfolios.
Sorry, but this just isn't how I work, and I've done okay. Believe me or don't, it's up to you.
I'm not saying I NEVER have looked at anyone's portfolio. There are some people who are just so good I enjoy browsing occasionally. But I DON'T go looking to copy concept ideas. In fact, there are a number of concepts I haven't done because someone I respect has done it first and better than I could hope to.
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Sorry, but this just isn't how I work, and I've done okay. Believe me or don't, it's up to you.
I'm not saying I NEVER have looked at anyone's portfolio. There are some people who are just so good I enjoy browsing occasionally. But I DON'T go looking to copy concept ideas. In fact, there are a number of concepts I haven't done because someone I respect has done it first and better than I could hope to.
Looking at someone's portfolio inevitably leaves some sort of inspirational seeds in anyone's brain. Whether you make those seeds grow or not is up to you.
I can't tell anyone how to conduct their business.
Speaking for myself, I check many other contributors portfolios to find holes and niches that aren't covered yet.
I can promise you that once I tap into a niche, I have my "run" for a couple of months until someone else notices the great downloads I get from an under-supplied category. Then others follow uploading that kind of stuff.
I do not copy other peoples concepts. I explore the gaps in between what's already there.
I produce very few images on a monthly basis. I need to make sure whatever I upload will sell. I can't waste my time on stuff that's already been done to death so it's very important to me to know what my competition is doing so I won't shoot myself in the foot.
Everybody approaches this business differently and there is no right or wrong way. This just works for me.
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Well, I have to say I've been inspired by this thread. I'm off to do a group of angry villagers wielding pitchforks, torches and sundry agricultural implements isolated on white.
make sure you put in the description "angry villagers preparing to punish microstock copycats."
The first guy is done (the fat bald guy with the pitchfork and the clenched fist).
But I haven't signed a model release .....
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Copycats or just working for the same boss?
[url]http://www.istockphoto.com/kupicoo[/url] ([url]http://www.istockphoto.com/kupicoo[/url])
[url]http://www.istockphoto.com/Squaredpixels[/url] ([url]http://www.istockphoto.com/Squaredpixels[/url])
[url]http://www.istockphoto.com/steex[/url] ([url]http://www.istockphoto.com/steex[/url])
[url]http://www.istockphoto.com/annebaek[/url] ([url]http://www.istockphoto.com/annebaek[/url])
And of course we can't forget [url]http://www.istockphoto.com/laflor[/url] ([url]http://www.istockphoto.com/laflor[/url])
Among many others.
Sniff, sniff... It smells fishy
Wow ... some of them have the same people in the very same clothes in their ports! Definitely looks like something taken in the same shoot. That's interesting.
As for the "looking at other's ports" I don't think anyone said it's bad in itself. Some of us just stated that it's counter productive and we choose not to do so ... that's all. Look all you want, as long as you don't copy.
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Knowing your competition is key to being successful. You need to be different AND better than the competition. How can you do that by not looking at other successful contributors' portfolios?
(snip)
I don't believe it if anyone claims to just be doing their own thing without peaking into other people's portfolios.
Sorry, but this just isn't how I work, and I've done okay. Believe me or don't, it's up to you.
I'm the same, Lisa. I'm really not interested in what other people may have done that is similar to something I decide to do. I don't want to find myself aping someone else's style and I don't want to feel I shouldn't do something just because someone else has done it.
What I do look at from time to time is the overall quality of images in the niches I work in, since my aim is to be among the best at what I do.
If you go and hunt for the stuff that hasn't been done, the chances are that it is in low demand, so you may make just as much or as little from high-demand done-to-death stuff or low-demand not-been-done-before stuff. The proof of that is from Yuri's home-grown copycats... sorry, I mean apprentices, who seem to be doing very nicely indeed churning out thousands of sincere pieces of flattery.
For 99% of microstockers, trying to copy the leaders is a waste of time. What they should be doing is learning about light. Without that, their efforts to mimic the masters are doomed.
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We all browse through the libraries looking for things to copy, i mean inspire us.
Umm. Actually, no, we don't all do that.
I usually take a look at the existing images AFTER I have come up with an idea, just to see how many similar images are already on sale, and I also want to find out how to make my images better than the existing ones.
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Read this thread... :(
Correct me if i'm wrong but years ago Yuri has been accused from the start by RM photographers to do copycats of the best selling RM business and lifestyle images.
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Copycats or just working for the same boss?
*removed*
Among many others.
Sniff, sniff... It smells fishy
admin edit: we shouldn't link to other's portfolio pointing fingers.
Stupid Censorship!
Ok. No links...
***************************************
Copycats or just working for the same boss?
kupicoo (iStock exclusive)
Squaredpixels (iStock exclusive)
steex (iStock exclusive)
annebaek (iStock exclusive)
And of course we can't forget laflor (iStock exclusive)
Among many others.
Sniff, sniff... It smells fishy
***************************************
;D
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Read this thread... :(
Correct me if i'm wrong but years ago Yuri has been accused from the start by RM photographers to do copycats of the best selling RM business and lifestyle images.
Ah, but there is a difference between being accused and not admitting to it and urging people to do it before anybody even gets round to accusing you :)
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We all browse through the libraries looking for things to copy, i mean inspire us.
Umm. Actually, no, we don't all do that.
I usually take a look at the existing images AFTER I have come up with an idea, just to see how many similar images are already on sale, and I also want to find out how to make my images better than the existing ones.
Same here. I have really no shortage of Ideas. Just watch myself in daily life and I get plenty of them. Afterwards I may check the market.
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If you go and hunt for the stuff that hasn't been done, the chances are that it is in low demand, so you may make just as much or as little from high-demand done-to-death stuff or low-demand not-been-done-before stuff. The proof of that is from Yuri's home-grown copycats... sorry, I mean apprentices, who seem to be doing very nicely indeed churning out thousands of sincere pieces of flattery.
Brilliant! "Sincere pieces of flattery". LOL! I have never heard it so elegantly put, Baldrick :D
I enjoyed the cleverness of your post so much it is almost beside the point that I also agree with it.
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... I don't want to find myself aping someone else's style and I don't want to feel I shouldn't do something just because someone else has done it.
I'm sorry but did you actually read my last post?
Speaking for myself, I check many other contributors portfolios to find holes and niches that aren't covered yet.
What I do look at from time to time is the overall quality of images in the niches I work in, since my aim is to be among the best at what I do.
This is my exact point! I am NOT looking what to copy, I'm looking for niches that are NOT covered yet and to check if my quality is up to par.
If you go and hunt for the stuff that hasn't been done, the chances are that it is in low demand, so you may make just as much or as little from high-demand done-to-death stuff or low-demand not-been-done-before stuff. ...
After many years in the advertising/photography/illustrating industry I kind of "got the hang of it." I'm not perfect and not every image I submit is #1 on each SS search. But I can say I have improved my work and how I approach my new productions. So far I'm satisfied with it. Your mileage may vary.
Doesn't the ratio of 20% of most people images earn 80% of their income still apply?
Again, I can't tell other people how to run their business, I can only speak for myself and express my point of view.
Due to time constraints I cannot attend large shoots therefore most of my images are limited to illustrations. In any case I never understood the concept of uploading 20 or more images from one shoot. It's like shooting birds with canon balls.
I submit few images that need to be commercially very attractive to rake in a minimum amount of money over their lifetime to make it worth my while.
However, Yuri has thousands (if not tens of thousands) of images with no or very few downloads. I understand that his best sellers pay for the shoot but only someone like him who produces a large stream of new content can afford to do that.
For 99% of microstockers, trying to copy the leaders is a waste of time. What they should be doing is learning about light. Without that, their efforts to mimic the masters are doomed.
I hope you didn't address me with this response as I never said anyone should copy someone elses work.
I said checking other peoples work is key because I need to make sure that the buyers will be happy with the quality of my work over the quality from other contributors.
It's called competition which brings out the best of us.
Car, food, electronics and more manufacturers, purchase the competition's products to analyze them and to make their own better. It happens all the time.
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Yuri as 15.000 unsold photos on fotolia
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Yuri as 15.000 unsold photos on fotolia
He really ought to try harder ;)
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Yuri as 15.000 unsold photos on fotolia
Maybe that says more about Fotolia than the photographer.
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Yes, and that the market is oversaturated.
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Yes, and that the market is oversaturated.
Oversaturation will lead to the death of that niche altogether as soon as the earnings will not be enough to repay the production costs.
That means no more than 2-3 years from now.
What happened to all the ones making big sales with Still Life and cutout objects for instance ?
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This was posted in another thread before but I think it's quite suitable here as well
Everything is a Remix Part 1: Watch It Now (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NmwwjikTHxw#ws)
Everything is a Remix Part 2 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z-HuenDPZw0#ws)
Everything is a Remix Part 3 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wq5D43qAsVg#ws)
Everything is a Remix Part 4 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yAmmtCJxJJY#ws)
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quite interesting.
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Read this thread... :(
Correct me if i'm wrong but years ago Yuri has been accused from the start by RM photographers to do copycats of the best selling RM business and lifestyle images.
Really? I find that highly amusing as the total time I have spent in my entire life looking at "best selling RM image" is probably in the minuts. I don't even know where to go to find such images ranked by "best selling". How does one obtain this information MetaStocker? As far as I know RM is not even ranked by sales... Very strange comment.
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Read this thread... :(
Correct me if i'm wrong but years ago Yuri has been accused from the start by RM photographers to do copycats of the best selling RM business and lifestyle images.
Really? I find that highly amusing as the total time I have spent in my entire life looking at "best selling RM image" is probably in the minuts. I don't even know where to go to find such images ranked by "best selling". How does one obtain this information MetaStocker? As far as I know RM is not even ranked by sales... Very strange comment.
True. RM is not ranked by sales.
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For 99% of microstockers, trying to copy the leaders is a waste of time. What they should be doing is learning about light. Without that, their efforts to mimic the masters are doomed.
I hope you didn't address me with this response as I never said anyone should copy someone elses work.
No, it was just a general observation about the subject of the thread.
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Really? I find that highly amusing as the total time I have spent in my entire life looking at "best selling RM image" is probably in the minuts. I don't even know where to go to find such images ranked by "best selling". How does one obtain this information MetaStocker? As far as I know RM is not even ranked by sales... Very strange comment.
I don't know, maybe in their eyes you started copying stuff sold on Getty and other agencies and taking lots of inspiration from the top tier lifestyle photographers and they ended up claiming you were doing low cost copycats.
However, the outrage was much about doing copycats but rather about selling studio shoots for a pittance on micros.
In any case, i fully agree with them.
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Really? I find that highly amusing as the total time I have spent in my entire life looking at "best selling RM image" is probably in the minuts. I don't even know where to go to find such images ranked by "best selling". How does one obtain this information MetaStocker? As far as I know RM is not even ranked by sales... Very strange comment.
I don't know, maybe in their eyes you started copying stuff sold on Getty and other agencies and taking lots of inspiration from the top tier lifestyle photographers and they ended up claiming you were doing low cost copycats.
However, the outrage was much about doing copycats but rather about selling studio shoots for a pittance on micros.
In any case, i fully agree with them.
Really? Who exactly? Sources please (assuming that they exist, of course).
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Really? I find that highly amusing as the total time I have spent in my entire life looking at "best selling RM image" is probably in the minuts. I don't even know where to go to find such images ranked by "best selling". How does one obtain this information MetaStocker? As far as I know RM is not even ranked by sales... Very strange comment.
I don't know, maybe in their eyes you started copying stuff sold on Getty and other agencies and taking lots of inspiration from the top tier lifestyle photographers and they ended up claiming you were doing low cost copycats.
However, the outrage was much about doing copycats but rather about selling studio shoots for a pittance on micros.
In any case, i fully agree with them.
Really? Who exactly? Sources please (assuming that they exist, of course).
I'm not taking sides, making any comment regarding the accusation or passing judgement, but what Metastocker said is right, since microstock was in it's infancy and Yuri climbed to fame (so to speak) he was accused by many RM photographers as copying stuff on sites such as Getty and Corbis, even though some of the comments were made in 'closed RM discussions' I'm sure if you did some internet searching you could find some examples, here's one I found doing a quick search:
http://www.alamy.com/forums/default.aspx?g=posts&t=7512 (http://www.alamy.com/forums/default.aspx?g=posts&t=7512) scroll down to a post by 'Mr Cheeseburger' which was in 2010
I started in microstock in 2006 and I can recall many accusations about Yuri's portfolio along those lines, I use to put it down to the 'old dinosaurs' being bitter about microstock because in those days it was hated even more than now.
I'm not going to comment anymore on what was said, just wanted to back up Metastocker in what he said was true. FTR I took a fair bit of flack at that time, not for copying but for "selling out".
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Everything's been done before. Yuri didn't invent it. Probably even the complaining RM shooters didn't invent it either.
Concepts cannot be copyrighted - get over it. Yes it pi##es you off the first 10 times but then you deal with it and move on.
If someone who shoots concepts with a specific style and succeeds it's not just the concept.
Anyone, try to reshoot Yuri's portfolio and see if you can match his downloads.
Again, there is a huge piece of the pie and we all can get some. Complaining about other contributors "ripping" ideas is not going to change anything but wasting time.
If they do it better then they deserve the downloads.
Otherwise go to the first guy who shot an apple over white and be grumpy with him.
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Otherwise go to the first guy who shot an apple over white and be grumpy with him.
Someone called Samsung lost a recent court case for copying an apple.
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Otherwise go to the first guy who shot an apple over white and be grumpy with him.
Someone called Samsung lost a recent court case for copying an apple.
Good one. ;D
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this guy is getting serious, 10 new files this month and no people so far, no need to get worried for now Yuri ;D
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I still want to know exactly what we are meant to be doing about this, since Yuri said we shouldn't tolerate it.
Any answers?
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I still want to know exactly what we are meant to be doing about this, since Yuri said we shouldn't tolerate it.
Any answers?
pretty much keeping an eye on these highly motivated newbies lmao
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Everybody sees something done by others and it sticks in the back of their mind so one day their subconscious tells them to do this and they do it not knowing it.
Also there are still lots of things that have not been done or if they were done they are a very limited few.
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I still want to know exactly what we are meant to be doing about this, since Yuri said we shouldn't tolerate it.
Any answers?
pretty much keeping an eye on these highly motivated newbies lmao
Only if Yuri pays me for doing it, otherwise I've got better things to do with my time, like working out if goldfish will look natural enough when superglued to a glass sheet between two bowls.
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Only if Yuri pays me for doing it, otherwise I've got better things to do with my time, like working out if goldfish will look natural enough when superglued to a glass sheet between two bowls.
Depends if its an African or European goldfish!
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Fashion goes round in circles so they say. I guess stock does too! I'm waiting for the return of the 60's....... still waiting
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Good point about the 60's there. Maybe they'll never dump our old stuff in case old crappy microstock shots suddenly become the new 'retro'.
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Only if Yuri pays me for doing it, otherwise I've got better things to do with my time, like working out if goldfish will look natural enough when superglued to a glass sheet between two bowls.
Depends if its an African or European goldfish!
Classic!! ;D
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"He who walks in another's tracks leaves no footprints." (Joan L. Brannon) ;)
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"He who walks in another's tracks leaves no footprints." (Joan L. Brannon) ;)
Unless they've told everyone in a forum of their plans.
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Not Yuri standard but isolation is good and they do all have perfect teeth ;)
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Otherwise go to the first guy who shot an apple over white and be grumpy with him.
Someone called Samsung lost a recent court case for copying an apple.
The real news here is that buyers are buying Samsung no matter if it's priced on par with the iPhone.
That's why Apple is scared.
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Has this been posted yet?
What sells in microstock anno 2012?
Posted by Yuri Arcurs on September 19, 2012
http://arcurs.com/2012/09/what-sells-in-microstock-anno-2012/ (http://arcurs.com/2012/09/what-sells-in-microstock-anno-2012/)http://arcurs.com/2012/09/what-sells-in-microstock-anno-2012/ (http://arcurs.com/2012/09/what-sells-in-microstock-anno-2012/)
"Mudplucker" posts in the comments at the bottom.
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Has this been posted yet?
What sells in microstock anno 2012?
Posted by Yuri Arcurs on September 19, 2012
[url]http://arcurs.com/2012/09/what-sells-in-microstock-anno-2012/[/url] ([url]http://arcurs.com/2012/09/what-sells-in-microstock-anno-2012/[/url])http://arcurs.com/2012/09/what-sells-in-microstock-anno-2012/ ([url]http://arcurs.com/2012/09/what-sells-in-microstock-anno-2012/[/url])
"Mudplucker" posts in the comments at the bottom.
yep, check out this thread
http://www.microstockgroup.com/general-stock-discussion/hot-microstock-concepts-for-2012/ (http://www.microstockgroup.com/general-stock-discussion/hot-microstock-concepts-for-2012/)
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I remember this thread as well about Yuri's pic with the pill on Shutterstock :)
http://submit.shutterstock.com/forum/abt47975-0-asc-0.html (http://submit.shutterstock.com/forum/abt47975-0-asc-0.html)
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I remember this thread as well about Yuri's pic with the pill on Shutterstock :)
[url]http://submit.shutterstock.com/forum/abt47975-0-asc-0.html[/url] ([url]http://submit.shutterstock.com/forum/abt47975-0-asc-0.html[/url])
Yes. I remember that one too. We had a good laugh at our office about that post.
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So why not laugh about the post in DT? Just because he said it on a forum its wrong, but actually doing it, is fine?