Author Topic: Upload 4K and HD seperately? Your thaughts... (Read 34806 times)

KB · « **Reply #25 on:** December 11, 2015, 12:43 »

Quote from: Mantis on December 11, 2015, 09:03

I finally received a response from Shutterstock regarding the video filters. At least they were honest.

Paraphrase: it's by design and not going away.

This doesn't surprise me, but does greatly disappoint me.

I asked about this issue last December, and was quoted a post on the SS forum which said, in part, that they have taken my "concern to heart and will actively work to resolve it". Specifically:
" ... we are gearing up to qualitatively and quantitatively test an updated logic - users selecting HD will not only see original HD videos, but all videos that are available in HD. Same for SD and 4K. [snip] Rest assured, you will love the new filter experience that we hope to roll out sometime in January next year. " (Please note that "January next year" meant January, 2015.)

So they've been aware of this as an issue for well over a year, but do not GAD. In fact, that same post strongly discouraged uploading duplicate clips of the same video in different sizes.

Mantis · « **Reply #26 on:** December 11, 2015, 13:33 »

Quote from: Benozaur on December 11, 2015, 11:56

Quote from: Mantis on December 11, 2015, 09:03
I finally received a response from Shutterstock regarding the video filters. At least they were honest.

Paraphrase: it's by design and not going away.

So, even though 4K is ALSO AVAILABLE IN HD, 4K content and its HD purchasing option go away if a buyer clicks the HD filter. This means that your 4K content, which is also available in HD by default, is not available when the HD filter is clicked.

So for those of us who believe that we are losing sales via filters we must upload two versions if we want to have the strategic advantage of selling our work in both formats.

For me, I am going to reprocess my 4k clips into HD and upload them. I suppose it will be 3-6 months before I know if it makes any difference.

I suggest that you upload them in seperate batches, they don't like parallel uploads of the same content at different resolutions at the same time...

Totally agree.

Zero Talent · « **Reply #27 on:** December 11, 2015, 17:19 »

I usually wait for a week between the HD and the 4k versions. However, it is rather hard to belive that customers don't know about the possibility to get the HD version of a 4k clip.
It might still be about quality, some could prefer an original PhotoJPEG/ProRes HD to a downsized H.264, originating from a 4k clip.

Sent from my SM-N910T using Tapatalk

click_click · « **Reply #28 on:** December 12, 2015, 03:58 »

So, there are contributors already uploading both versions AND getting them approved?

Besides being a solution to this search filter issue are there other problems that might reduce sales for example since most buyers do not use the filter and when they see duplicate clips they might unknowingly buy the same clip in HD 50/50 as original and downsized from 4K which reduces the ranking in search results.

I hope I could get this point across. English is not my mother tongue.

stockmn · « **Reply #29 on:** December 12, 2015, 13:42 »

Quote from: click_click on December 12, 2015, 03:58

So, there are contributors already uploading both versions AND getting them approved?

Besides being a solution to this search filter issue are there other problems that might reduce sales for example since most buyers do not use the filter and when they see duplicate clips they might unknowingly buy the same clip in HD 50/50 as original and downsized from 4K which reduces the ranking in search results.

I hope I could get this point across. English is not my mother tongue.

Yes, if you're uploading duplicate versions you're going to negatively effect the rankings for both resolutions. I don't think that uploading multiple clips is the solution. Although, if the collection becomes more of a mess because people are doing this it might encourage SS to fix the problem.

Micro4 · « **Reply #30 on:** December 12, 2015, 17:58 »

Quote from: stockmn on December 12, 2015, 13:42

Quote from: click_click on December 12, 2015, 03:58
So, there are contributors already uploading both versions AND getting them approved?

Besides being a solution to this search filter issue are there other problems that might reduce sales for example since most buyers do not use the filter and when they see duplicate clips they might unknowingly buy the same clip in HD 50/50 as original and downsized from 4K which reduces the ranking in search results.

I hope I could get this point across. English is not my mother tongue.

Yes, if you're uploading duplicate versions you're going to negatively effect the rankings for both resolutions.

What 'rankings' are you referring to?

stockmn · « **Reply #31 on:** December 12, 2015, 18:29 »

Quote from: Micro4 on December 12, 2015, 17:58

Quote from: stockmn on December 12, 2015, 13:42
Quote from: click_click on December 12, 2015, 03:58
So, there are contributors already uploading both versions AND getting them approved?

Besides being a solution to this search filter issue are there other problems that might reduce sales for example since most buyers do not use the filter and when they see duplicate clips they might unknowingly buy the same clip in HD 50/50 as original and downsized from 4K which reduces the ranking in search results.

I hope I could get this point across. English is not my mother tongue.

Yes, if you're uploading duplicate versions you're going to negatively effect the rankings for both resolutions.

What 'rankings' are you referring to?

I'm referring to the rankings of the individual clips. Each agency has there own secret algorithm that determine what order they show the clips when a search is performed. While we may not know all the specifics of the algorithm it's generally agreed upon that the more times a clip is downloaded for a given keyword the higher up that clip appears in the results when someone searches for that keyword.

Theoretically, if you have separate HD and 4k versions of a clip and they each get downloaded 5 times, each clip will have 5 downloads instead of the 10 downloads the single clip would have had. Over time a clip with 10 downloads is going to appear higher in the search results than a clip with 5 downloads for a given search term.

If the search term has very few results then it really doesn't matter but if it is a competitive term it may make the difference between your clip ever being seen or not.

Micro4 · « **Reply #32 on:** December 12, 2015, 19:43 »

Quote from: stockmn on December 12, 2015, 18:29

Quote from: Micro4 on December 12, 2015, 17:58
Quote from: stockmn on December 12, 2015, 13:42
Quote from: click_click on December 12, 2015, 03:58
So, there are contributors already uploading both versions AND getting them approved?

Besides being a solution to this search filter issue are there other problems that might reduce sales for example since most buyers do not use the filter and when they see duplicate clips they might unknowingly buy the same clip in HD 50/50 as original and downsized from 4K which reduces the ranking in search results.

I hope I could get this point across. English is not my mother tongue.

Yes, if you're uploading duplicate versions you're going to negatively effect the rankings for both resolutions.

What 'rankings' are you referring to?

I'm referring to the rankings of the individual clips. Each agency has there own secret algorithm that determine what order they show the clips when a search is performed. While we may not know all the specifics of the algorithm it's generally agreed upon that the more times a clip is downloaded for a given keyword the higher up that clip appears in the results when someone searches for that keyword.

Theoretically, if you have separate HD and 4k versions of a clip and they each get downloaded 5 times, each clip will have 5 downloads instead of the 10 downloads the single clip would have had. Over time a clip with 10 downloads is going to appear higher in the search results than a clip with 5 downloads for a given search term.

If the search term has very few results then it really doesn't matter but if it is a competitive term it may make the difference between your clip ever being seen or not.

And what happens to your rankings theory when a 4K clips is filtered out and not even shown in the listings?

Your theory is correct if both clips were treated equally but they are not.

Harvepino · « **Reply #33 on:** January 13, 2016, 06:18 »

I've recently uploaded couple of hundreds aerials to SS. All but one were in 4K. I had to downsize one video due to technical problems. I've just had my first sale and it was THE one video uploaded in HD! The batch contained similar videos in 4K which in my opinion looked better. Why would the customer pick the only HD video? This raises suspicion that the customer filtered out 4K versions, possibly unknowingly.

The way SS filter works is really really bad for 4k producers. I'm puzzled. I really don't want to upload HD versions and duplicate my content. But we might be losing out on sales... bummer.

click_click · « **Reply #34 on:** January 13, 2016, 06:54 »

Quote from: Harvepino on January 13, 2016, 06:18

I've recently uploaded couple of hundreds aerials to SS. All but one were in 4K. I had to downsize one video due to technical problems. I've just had my first sale and it was THE one video uploaded in HD! The batch contained similar videos in 4K which in my opinion looked better. Why would the customer pick the only HD video? This raises suspicion that the customer filtered out 4K versions, possibly unknowingly.

The way SS filter works is really really bad for 4k producers. I'm puzzled. I really don't want to upload HD versions and duplicate my content. But we might be losing out on sales... bummer.

That is sad to hear although it's impossible to know for sure what exactly the reason was for the HD sale.

It simply makes no sense whatsoever to not include the HD versions of 4K clips into the HD filtered results (which provide even better image quality as native HD).

Just the lower resolutions should be filtered out - not the better ones.

KB · « **Reply #35 on:** January 13, 2016, 20:35 »

Quote from: Harvepino on January 13, 2016, 06:18

This raises suspicion that the customer filtered out 4K versions, possibly unknowingly.

The way SS filter works is really really bad for 4k producers. I'm puzzled. I really don't want to upload HD versions and duplicate my content. But we might be losing out on sales... bummer.

Suspicions were raised long ago. I'd say this all but confirms that some sales are lost for those files that are UL'd only as 4K.

I'm equally puzzled why SS refuses to address this. It's been over a year now that I've been very reluctant to UL 4K clips to them. I UL a few, but mostly I skip them entirely. Probably stupid (but not as stupid as their filtering out 4K content on HD searches).

click_click · « **Reply #36 on:** January 14, 2016, 02:03 »

I've already written to Shutterstock asking them about the current situation or plans on changing this system.

I urge everyone who is annoyed to send an email to SS to let them know that there is a number of contributors who experience questionable sales as the one mentioned above or if you don't believe this to be a good system the way it is now.

If they don't get (enough) feedback about it - they definitely won't change anything.

Mantis · « **Reply #37 on:** January 14, 2016, 08:13 »

Quote from: click_click on January 14, 2016, 02:03

I've already written to Shutterstock asking them about the current situation or plans on changing this system.

I urge everyone who is annoyed to send an email to SS to let them know that there is a number of contributors who experience questionable sales as the one mentioned above or if you don't believe this to be a good system the way it is now.

If they don't get (enough) feedback about it - they definitely won't change anything.

I've already done this. It's by design and they have no intention of changing it. But I do encourage everyone to send them some constructive emails about this. In the meantime I have uploaded hundreds of videos that I converted to HD from 4K and then since I downsized I added some motion paths and zooms to give them a more unique look. But it took weeks to do. I haven't seen jack in sales uptick. HD versions only up for 8 weeks though.

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Author Topic: Upload 4K and HD seperately? Your thaughts... (Read 34806 times)

KB

Mantis

Zero Talent

click_click

stockmn

Micro4

stockmn

Micro4

Harvepino

click_click

KB

click_click

Mantis

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