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Author Topic: Best Match 2.0  (Read 39246 times)

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« Reply #50 on: December 10, 2008, 22:39 »
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There's no saying that any exclusive/independent factor is or isn't going to change.


traveler1116

« Reply #51 on: December 10, 2008, 22:44 »
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Doesn't it necessarily need to change if the criteria for the best match is getting the best image for the buyer?  An exclusive image has no additional value to the buyer, by that I mean the exclusive image can still have been sold thousands of times to other buyer just like a nonexclusive image.  The best match now gives a boost to exclusives, if the new best match does what they say it should don't exclusives lose a lot?  About the same as nonexclusives just lost.

« Reply #52 on: December 10, 2008, 22:48 »
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This change is about adding in the relevancy factor.  Nothing was stated about changing anything else, although they normally do.  However, if a conscious exclusive/independent weighting was made, I don't see why they'd tweak it too much, especially since they want us to be happy about the new collection.

traveler1116

« Reply #53 on: December 10, 2008, 22:53 »
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I am guessing you are right about that they won't change it too much but if this new best match is going get the best search results they need to change it so exclusive or nonexclusive images are equal because there is nothing better for the buyer about exclusive images.  Something has to give, either it isn't the best search or exclusives and nonexclusives need the same best match treatment and that will hurt exclusives now.

I thought it was more than adding a relevancy factor, didn't they say "massive shift"?
« Last Edit: December 10, 2008, 22:56 by traveler1116 »

vonkara

« Reply #54 on: December 10, 2008, 23:02 »
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For artists it means a massive shift. The results for everyone, are going to be very, very different. Taken from the best match 2.0 announcement

« Reply #55 on: December 10, 2008, 23:02 »
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It's ok quoting MrThompson but has anyone thought about WHY istockphoto is changing best match and tiering the collection.
IMO they are nervous... are you sitting down ....$1.1 million payed a week to contributors which is about 30%-40% payout.So we can assume istock makes$ 2 million from OUR work.
I have looked through the other micro sites collections these past 2 months and if istock still thinks it offers the best images at the best prices they are mistaken.
I can only keep uploading what i consider to be stock worthy images to istockphoto but i certaintly dont view the company through 'rose titnted spectacles ' anymore.

I am still reeling over this comment ...  ;)

jsnover

« Reply #56 on: December 10, 2008, 23:53 »
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Do you think a lot of exclusives will quit being exclusive if the search actually finds the real best match?  A lot of exclusives have had a pretty big jump in sales since the best match change so this "massive shift", I think thats what they are saying, would probably hurt the exclusives much more than nonexclusives. 

I don't have any more data than you do, but what I saw in the IS forums was a lot of diamond exlusives who'd been whacked by an earlier best match shift report that their sales had gone up a lot as a result of the last big change. I don't think if I saw my sales cut in half and then a few months later restored to their previous levels, I'd think of that as a "big jump" in sales.

The one thing you lose as an exclusive is the ability to measure your images saleability given other search engines. It's therefore a bit harder to know what's a leap and a slump as you don't really have anything independent to measure againt.

« Reply #57 on: December 11, 2008, 04:54 »
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They're incorporating other buyers' satisfaction with a keyword/image relationship to present future buyers with the images that may actually best suit their needs. 

Won't this favour images that had sales already and have been "okayed" by a buyer?

Regards,
Adelaide

« Reply #58 on: December 11, 2008, 05:17 »
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Is that wrong?  What better way to see if a keyword is valid for an image, than if a buyer spent money on an image after finding it through that keyword?

lagereek

« Reply #59 on: December 11, 2008, 06:26 »
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Is that wrong?  What better way to see if a keyword is valid for an image, than if a buyer spent money on an image after finding it through that keyword?


DITTO!!  100%

lisafx

« Reply #60 on: December 11, 2008, 12:35 »
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I am guessing you are right about that they won't change it too much but if this new best match is going get the best search results they need to change it so exclusive or nonexclusive images are equal because there is nothing better for the buyer about exclusive images.  Something has to give, either it isn't the best search or exclusives and nonexclusives need the same best match treatment and that will hurt exclusives now.

I thought it was more than adding a relevancy factor, didn't they say "massive shift"?

I wonder if the new Premium Collection for exclusive images may be a way to address this exclusive vs. non bias in the best match.  I agree that to actually put forward the BEST Match that exclusivity should not be a relevant factor. 

Is it likely that since the premium collection automatically showcases the best of exclusive imagery that the best match in the standard and value collections would be based on the objective standards, regardless of exclusive status? 


jsnover

« Reply #61 on: December 11, 2008, 13:02 »
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I wonder if the new Premium Collection for exclusive images may be a way to address this exclusive vs. non bias in the best match. 

I can't see how that would happen. My expectation is that a very small portion of content will end up in the premium collection - I don't expect anything of mine will be put there. Those people with professional setups (studio or location) are, I think, the ones who'll see their content there. I believe the notion is to provide some incentive to produce the more costly stuff, which is a great idea, but it isn't going to change how a large number of us part timers work.

So that leaves a huge portion of the content in either the bargain bin or the regular collection. I think the exclusive queue, which gives new images an edge of a few days, is probably a fine bias to keep in the best match-v2 results, but otherwise images should sink or swim based on their saleability.

What I have really disliked is watching images that sell move back in the best match ranking, especially if they just sold versus attracted a lot of looky-loos. That seems to be the polar opposite of what should be happening. What was Joe Gough's lovely analogy? Something about taking the hot selling items away from the front of the store and hiding them in a store room in the back so you couldn't find them.

« Reply #62 on: December 11, 2008, 15:22 »
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Is that wrong?  What better way to see if a keyword is valid for an image, than if a buyer spent money on an image after finding it through that keyword?

Well, if image A has keyword 1 that the buyer wanted, it doesn't mean image B doesn't have it too, nor it means that keyword 2 is really ok for image A.  New images may have a more difficult way to find their way up if previous results get too much importance.

Regards,
Adelaide

shank_ali

« Reply #63 on: December 11, 2008, 15:39 »
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none exclusives will NEVER EVER have parity with exclusives  on istockphoto...PERIOD.
Now in regards of the new proposal for best match.It will be excatly as it is now... annoying alot of contributors who continually try work it out rather than having alot of different images to temp a broad spectrum of sales so enabling the contributor to  have steady regular sales whatever the best match may be.

vonkara

« Reply #64 on: December 11, 2008, 15:49 »
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Is that wrong?  What better way to see if a keyword is valid for an image, than if a buyer spent money on an image after finding it through that keyword?
I'll repeat it. At Dreamstime, each keywords used for downloading an image is showing in our image stats. 40% of my sales are made from irrelevent keywords or without any keywords. Probably because of some sort of exposure, lightboxes or collections... I don't know?

I simply hope they calculated this in their new best match

bittersweet

« Reply #65 on: December 11, 2008, 16:27 »
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In case any of you missed Bitter's latest input into the discussion:

Quote
Posted By bitter:
Quote

Posted By mikemcd:
I don't know better than anyone else what this new best match shift will do to our sales, but let's take a quick look back at the original message here:

"With best match, we have one, clear goal: to put the best content in front of our clients. We have finite slots on the first page and tens-of-thousands of files vying for those spots."

As always, best match changes are done with the buyers in mind, rightfully so. I think istock is making the right move here, but that often means that many of us end up disappointed with the result. best match changes have been and will remain to be done for the buyers, not for us.

I'm as hopeful as anyone that this works out positively for everyone. But as a contributor I'm not singing istock's praises for this move and giving them the standing ovation, and I'm baffled as to why anyone else is. Some of the same people complaining about slow sales since the last best match change are now here saying "Yay, best match change!" Sure it's possible that things could get better for those who suffered because of the last change. But there's an equal chance that things will take another dive for those same people after this one.

Fingers crossed, I am cautiously optimistic about this. If it works out, great.  But if it doesn't, I won't be back here in the forums next month with the same group who will be scratching their heads saying "What happened to my sales?," as if no one could see that potential result coming.


I'm happy you noticed how carefully I chose my words. We are not promising everyone will like the new best match, nor promising increased royalties to anyone or group in particular. Our goal is to improve the search experience for clients. That's all. We have to assume that the theory of well keyworded files being found and purchased more often than poorly keyworded files is true in this endeavor.

CofkoCof

« Reply #66 on: December 11, 2008, 16:32 »
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In case any of you missed Bitter's latest input into the discussion:

Quote
Posted By bitter:
Quote

Posted By mikemcd:
I don't know better than anyone else what this new best match shift will do to our sales, but let's take a quick look back at the original message here:

"With best match, we have one, clear goal: to put the best content in front of our clients. We have finite slots on the first page and tens-of-thousands of files vying for those spots."

As always, best match changes are done with the buyers in mind, rightfully so. I think istock is making the right move here, but that often means that many of us end up disappointed with the result. best match changes have been and will remain to be done for the buyers, not for us.

I'm as hopeful as anyone that this works out positively for everyone. But as a contributor I'm not singing istock's praises for this move and giving them the standing ovation, and I'm baffled as to why anyone else is. Some of the same people complaining about slow sales since the last best match change are now here saying "Yay, best match change!" Sure it's possible that things could get better for those who suffered because of the last change. But there's an equal chance that things will take another dive for those same people after this one.

Fingers crossed, I am cautiously optimistic about this. If it works out, great.  But if it doesn't, I won't be back here in the forums next month with the same group who will be scratching their heads saying "What happened to my sales?," as if no one could see that potential result coming.


I'm happy you noticed how carefully I chose my words. We are not promising everyone will like the new best match, nor promising increased royalties to anyone or group in particular. Our goal is to improve the search experience for clients. That's all. We have to assume that the theory of well keyworded files being found and purchased more often than poorly keyworded files is true in this endeavor.

Woo Yay!!!  ::) ;D

vonkara

« Reply #67 on: December 13, 2008, 21:12 »
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I saw small changes everyone! It mixed some files from one page to another. Nothing extreme but it started like the said by this week...

« Reply #68 on: December 13, 2008, 21:17 »
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My test case for the istock best match is to type 'business' into the search field and check out the first page (100) results. There are a few changes there from a couple of weeks ago, but not sure that the overall relevance has improved significantly.

bittersweet

« Reply #69 on: December 13, 2008, 21:20 »
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My test case for the istock best match is to type 'business' into the search field and check out the first page (100) results. There are a few changes there from a couple of weeks ago, but not sure that the overall relevance has improved significantly.

You are never going to see significant improvements in a search that broad. I doubt that very many real buyers use one word searches that return thousands and thousands of results and don't ever enter additional words to narrow them down.

vonkara

« Reply #70 on: December 13, 2008, 21:31 »
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My test case for the istock best match is to type 'business' into the search field and check out the first page (100) results.
I use my own portfolio sorted by best match. Easier to follow and lot less exhausting to look at (Vaumit face :P)

« Reply #71 on: December 13, 2008, 22:54 »
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My test case for the istock best match is to type 'business' into the search field and check out the first page (100) results. There are a few changes there from a couple of weeks ago, but not sure that the overall relevance has improved significantly.

Funny - that's exactly what I do as well ... it's the best test IMHO!!

vonkara

« Reply #72 on: December 13, 2008, 23:06 »
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You guys really browse the "business" shot !!! Next time if you want a good laugh, browse the "business" videos.

I can't handle when they look at me with their smiles

bittersweet

« Reply #73 on: December 13, 2008, 23:30 »
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What exactly are you testing for? If it is supposed to be indicative of which images might actually be sold, shouldn't it at least be remotely close to the reality of what a buyer might search for? No designer in their right mind is going to come to a site, enter "business" into a search engine, see that their search has yielded 255,328 results, and start flipping pages.

I'm guessing you must not ever actually use the search engine for the purpose of finding a file to purchase which serves a specific need?

« Reply #74 on: December 14, 2008, 00:00 »
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However broad the search may be, one would hope that a good best match algorithm would return 100 very relevant images on the first page. A few of the current selection look a bit marginal to me.

BTW, I'm not a designer, but I am the veteran of six steel cage matches on istock, so I do have some experience with the search engine from a buyers perspective.
« Last Edit: December 14, 2008, 00:03 by averil »


 

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