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Author Topic: best match Churn  (Read 5778 times)

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« on: May 02, 2010, 23:39 »
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What's up with current best match at IS?
About a third of my downloads last week were from really old files that never sold very well to begin with.

I know I cannot be the only one who has noticed this strangeness.
Why put in a best match algorithm that favors the crummy stuff?  :-\


« Reply #1 on: May 03, 2010, 09:59 »
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+1.

Last DL: uploaded - 02/22/08, downloads - 1

April results - worst in > 2 years

:(

« Reply #2 on: May 03, 2010, 10:56 »
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we should all be used to these temporary best match changes by now. They seem to occur at least once per year. I suspect the temporary changes are meant to give newer images a chance to get discovered by buyers. If the newer images sell, they rise in the search criteria once the best match goes back to normal. Of course, that's just a theory of mine based on my own very small port of less than 300 images...

RacePhoto

« Reply #3 on: May 03, 2010, 12:12 »
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What's up with current best match at IS?
About a third of my downloads last week were from really old files that never sold very well to begin with.

I know I cannot be the only one who has noticed this strangeness.
Why put in a best match algorithm that favors the crummy stuff?  :-\

I PM'ed someone who was commenting on the changes in the best match, never got an answer. How do you tell if it changed from month to month? Maybe the buyers just needed something that was sitting for years? It seems that since last year, people keep seeing changes.

My theory is that IS has a revolving best match based on different weighting of things like: downloads for time on site, numbers of sales per view, newness, old photos with views but no sales, size, total sales of member... make up your own.  :) It's alive and always changing.

The point is, they get a rotation in the images that come up, so the buyers don't see the same images in the same order, every time they search. Maybe it doesn't change monthly or weekly, it could change at random or based on some formula, each day!

What people see or don't see is a rotation of images to keep the results fresh.

« Reply #4 on: May 03, 2010, 13:14 »
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Well yes, I am fully aware that the best match changes several times a year. I also know that my sales usually tank when the best match changes. But this is the first time that I can recall where the change somehow managed to dredge up some really old files that never moved in the first place.

In other words stuff that probably should be in the dollar bin but isn't because they had one sale.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2010, 13:17 by nosaya »

« Reply #5 on: May 03, 2010, 19:21 »
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Well yes, I am fully aware that the best match changes several times a year. I also know that my sales usually tank when the best match changes.
The best match changes are always in one direction: From Bad to Worse.

I don't know how IS manages this, but they do. Of course, I am non-exclusive so what happens to me doesn't matter.

« Reply #6 on: May 03, 2010, 23:24 »
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I dont think its neccessarily a bad thing to have longer shelf life for your files

RacePhoto

« Reply #7 on: May 04, 2010, 00:10 »
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I dont think its neccessarily a bad thing to have longer shelf life for your files

Also it's impossible to have everyone go down, when someone has to go up. I'm speaking of the pages and Best Match appearance order. I guess some people will always find the dark side, especially when they are selling files, but now the complaint is which files?  ???

I suppose that would explain why I sold a Christmas wreath in April?  ;D Something wrong with the best match caused the buyer to find a file way out of season.
« Last Edit: May 04, 2010, 00:14 by RacePhoto »

« Reply #8 on: May 04, 2010, 00:27 »
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@ Race, please don't misunderstand, I'd rather get some downloads than none  ;D
In the case of your xmas file being sold in April... its pretty obvious that the buyer searched for something specific.

My old files... well they usually are pushed so far down the best match that no one ever sees them.
Also there are many, many better files on the same subject matter at IS.

I suppose my gripe, if I have one is that my newer files are Vetta and E+.
I would much rather that these show up in the best match before the tired old not-my-best-work images.  ;)

RacePhoto

« Reply #9 on: May 04, 2010, 00:52 »
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@ Race, please don't misunderstand, I'd rather get some downloads than none  ;D
In the case of your xmas file being sold in April... its pretty obvious that the buyer searched for something specific.

My old files... well they usually are pushed so far down the best match that no one ever sees them.
Also there are many, many better files on the same subject matter at IS.

I suppose my gripe, if I have one is that my newer files are Vetta and E+.
I would much rather that these show up in the best match before the tired old not-my-best-work images.  ;)

I know I'm a hard sell, but you aren't the only one over the last year who's said they are getting strange changes and sales from the best match. Some people saw a change with version 2 a clear month before it was instituted. That's more of the viewpoint of my comments than anything specific. My best sellers are still the same files, and one of them has always been a mystery why anyone would buy it just once? :)

Same file that sells a few times a month on SS has sold once on IS?

Where I'm headed is there's no way to make sense out of why some buyers will pick one photo over another, and being on the first page isn't always the answer to everything. Last time I looked for a photo to buy I went 12 pages, 40 per page, before I found the one I wanted. I tend to think that being on the first page is over-rated. Just like spamming keywords for some people, claim that "maybe a buyer will see something they like." OK so If I'm looking for a herd of cattle and I come across a cat eating pizza, I'm suddenly supposed to buy it?  ;D

That's why I keep asking how people test their ranking so I can watch mine for changes. No one has ever answered what the scientific method is for observing changes in Best Match? Does it happen every day, every week, every month? Or did it change last year and we are seeing the effects? Does having an image sell, suddenly make a change in the rank and placement? I'd like to have something besides. "ever since they changed the best match my views and sales have dropped."

Repeating, everyone can't drop. For someone to move down to page four from page one, someone else has to move up to page one!

lagereek

« Reply #10 on: May 04, 2010, 00:52 »
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Well,  shrinks have a clinical word for something that spastically changes all the time and especially for the worse but since Im a polite guy I wont mention it.

However from a business point of view its not really a good advocate for turning exclusive,  is it?

« Reply #11 on: May 04, 2010, 08:58 »
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I guess some people will always find the dark side, especially when they are selling files, but now the complaint is which files?  ???

I believe you did not understand. I'd never complain about selling old file, but I cannot be happy with selling one old instead of several new

RacePhoto

« Reply #12 on: May 04, 2010, 12:23 »
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I guess some people will always find the dark side, especially when they are selling files, but now the complaint is which files?  ???

I believe you did not understand. I'd never complain about selling old file, but I cannot be happy with selling one old instead of several new

Of course that's a good point if true. But we don't know if the old files are instead of the several new or in addition to them. There's no way to know that and old file sale has replaced a new file, unless we asked the buyer. I think that assuming something that's not provable, based on a short term observation, doesn't make sense.

I still don't know how the best match has changed since last time it changed, or if it's always changing or if we are just seeing some oddball purchases of old files. I don't see any way to prove that one sale is at all related to another not selling, based on best match? How do we track that?

Did the best match change again recently or is in a constant state of change, based on some unknown factors running the search at IS?

« Reply #13 on: May 04, 2010, 12:49 »
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I'd never complain about selling old file, but I cannot be happy with selling one old instead of several new
[/quote]

Why wouldnt it be one old and one new... lets say you have a bunch of really good sellers that gives you consistent downloads. wouldnt you want them to have a longer shelf life so that whatever happens in the future, you would still be making money off them even if you are not uploading anymore? I would rather have a best match that always brings older files up instead of burying them with age so that i can keep getting money from my useful files no matter how old they are

« Reply #14 on: May 04, 2010, 14:02 »
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Old files that sell well stay near the front of the best match.
Files that do not get pushed further and further back in the search results.

So, if you have great quality & unique files they should continue to sell year after year.

SNP

  • Canadian Photographer
« Reply #15 on: May 08, 2010, 23:19 »
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my downloads have been more or less steady and somewhat predictable since 2.0 was implemented. this past week has me very worried, with a 40% + drop in dl numbers. I hope whatever is happening with the best match is changed soon. I can't get my head around the lack of comment lately from HQ, the database upheaval and the search screw ups of late with little forum activity on the part of admins, with the exception of posting in the Cannes thread, which seems a little inappropriate given the long queue and the lag in contributor relation support response.

I just hope this best match shake up is nothing like the one in 2008. so many things could be factors, but it is too early for summer slowdown.

« Reply #16 on: May 08, 2010, 23:32 »
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my downloads have been more or less steady and somewhat predictable since 2.0 was implemented. this past week has me very worried, with a 40% + drop in dl numbers. I hope whatever is happening with the best match is changed soon. I can't get my head around the lack of comment lately from HQ, the database upheaval and the search screw ups of late with little forum activity on the part of admins, with the exception of posting in the Cannes thread, which seems a little inappropriate given the long queue and the lag in contributor relation support response.

I just hope this best match shake up is nothing like the one in 2008. so many things could be factors, but it is too early for summer slowdown.

Maybe a combination of Ebb and Flow and tens of thousands E+ files with the extra artifical best match push. This E+ experiment doesnt hurt istocks bottom line at all but it could really hurt some contributors. E+ sort of negates BM2. I think the majority of the bestsellers will benefit from E+ but the files with mediocre dl ratio (if you have lots of them that makes up more than 50% of your sales) will suffer from this E+ algorithm.  i agree, so many factors...

lagereek

« Reply #17 on: May 09, 2010, 03:51 »
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my downloads have been more or less steady and somewhat predictable since 2.0 was implemented. this past week has me very worried, with a 40% + drop in dl numbers. I hope whatever is happening with the best match is changed soon. I can't get my head around the lack of comment lately from HQ, the database upheaval and the search screw ups of late with little forum activity on the part of admins, with the exception of posting in the Cannes thread, which seems a little inappropriate given the long queue and the lag in contributor relation support response.

I just hope this best match shake up is nothing like the one in 2008. so many things could be factors, but it is too early for summer slowdown.

Maybe a combination of Ebb and Flow and tens of thousands E+ files with the extra artifical best match push. This E+ experiment doesnt hurt istocks bottom line at all but it could really hurt some contributors. E+ sort of negates BM2. I think the majority of the bestsellers will benefit from E+ but the files with mediocre dl ratio (if you have lots of them that makes up more than 50% of your sales) will suffer from this E+ algorithm.  i agree, so many factors...

Yep!  I think youre right there,  only from what Ive seen so far these E+files, are no better or worse then any other files. Some little perks for exclusives I suppose.
Again files should advance in best match on merit, commercial value, quality and DLs,  not for being excl or non-excl, thats irrelevant. Hell!  buyers dont care as long as they find what theyre after.
« Last Edit: May 09, 2010, 03:59 by lagereek »

ShadySue

  • There is a crack in everything
« Reply #18 on: May 09, 2010, 05:24 »
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Maybe a combination of Ebb and Flow and tens of thousands E+ files with the extra artifical best match push.

There has been no evidence, at least as far as Thursday evening, of any best match push for Exc+ files. In fact, some exclusives have complained about them shooting down in the best match, but that was in the bizarre shakeup of a fortnight ago (contributers, exclusive or independent who had a high dl/ul ration were getting a high rating, which was screwing the best match search, because they were appearing at the top of searches they'd spammed, so the best match results were throwing up a lot of irrlevant searches and the BM2 'advantage' was lost. Thankfully, they realised the error of that scheme fairly quickly and are back to nearly where they were before.
Still, some exclusives have complained that their Exc+ files have been getting fewer sales. I've been quite lucky so far, but I had a distinct strategy, and have only used up 25% of my allocation.


 

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