It doesnt just mean fulltime Microstock, its in everything, neckbraking competition, no matter how "friendly and fair"  in the end of day its the balance sheeth that counts and all love flies out the window.

Averil makes another point though about community, etc. possibly the entire Micro concept is more suitable and geared towards the Amateur and part-timer and with a safe, cushy job on the side. Im sure the Agencies themselves just wants peace and quiet, not a bunch of screaming Pros, as soon as anything goes wrong.
I also think that the days are gone where you have to be a professional photographer, I mean you can see little Neewbie and Bronze cannisters within IS, producing work which is clearly good enough for customers to buy and they do.
I keep seeing more and more signs and especially within the Micro, that the small guys are getting looked after more and far better then the minority of people depending on it and ofcourse! there in the tens of thousands and tomorrows artists.

Most of us fulltime photographers I presume are involved in commisioned work and stock, RM, RF, Micro, etc, but I will say this much though, couple of years back it was OK but today?  I would be dead-scared having to rely on Micro as a sole income, it could change to disaster just over a night, regardless of agencies.

Quote from: lagereek on May 02, 2010, 01:34

I keep seeing more and more signs and especially within the Micro, that the small guys are getting looked after more and far better then the minority of people depending on it and ofcourse! there in the tens of thousands and tomorrows artists.

Hmm, I'm only in iStock, but I'm interested in why you think the small guys are getting looked after "more and far better". I can't see but that everyone is treated the same, and with the same chance. Sure on iStock, exclusives have a few more opportunities, like best match in some iterations, Vetta, Exc+, but that option is open to almost everyone from the newest Bronze who took seven years to get there to the fastest-reaching full-time Black Diamond.
I'm interested to hear your perspective on this.

Well I dont mean they are treated better as such, what I mean is that enforced changes, structuring within an agency, for better or worse?  obviously has much less effect on a part-timer then say somebody who is dependant entirely as a sole income.
You cant compare exclusive vs non-excl, etc, thats beside the point, If an agecy, any agency was forced out of business tomorrow for example, the casualties would ofcourse be the Exclusive and especially the ones depending on the income.

It strikes me however that the entire Micro concept is very well suited for part-time photographers who is not dependant on ebb and flow, who can take it in their stride, relaxing, not being forced to produce top-notch all the time and often in order to stay ahead or at leat on par.

best.

I think there is one thing that everyone avoids to see (probably on purpose). As we stated many times already, amateur took a big part in microstock industry, and this won't change soon (if ever). So, pro photographer have to wake up already, and to stop living in utopia, cause they will probably never be able to afford to live only out of microstock earnings. The fact that only few (very few) photographers can live only out of microstock earnings. Other ones (vast majority), no matter how professional they are will never come to the point to depend only on microstock earnings. So, they should start thinking about going back to what most photographers do, which is weddings, and other celebrations.... I know that many pro's hate doing that, but that's how things are now.
Photography business, like many other businesses, is much older than internet. Only jobs born with, and after internet can survive only on internet. Other jobs have base in real world, and depend on it.
How many doctors you know that provide only online medical help? Almost no one.

well here in Sweden, many doctors provide on-line help and advice, ofcourse for a fee but its there.

Its not a Pro vs Amateur issue, thats been argued since the 70s,  its the entire concept of Micro which is almost hand-tailored to the amateur and part-timer and yes, as you say, because of the Internet, ofcourse. Selling shot for peanuts is not exactly the dream of the Pro.
Right now I know of two highly prolific Micro shooters with really great incomes from Micros who after summer will terminate all their Micros and stick it all into RM instead, not because of the monies but because of the preassure of always having  to produce, add to that the constant changes within agencies in whatever direction.
With the RM being pretty dead at the moment, they dont care, at least they can wake up in the morning and the place is still there.
With Micro, at least at present, everything is too fragile, places come and go, shut-down or owned at geared by others, etc.
Its to put it mildly:  very, very unstable.

best.

The community side remains important because the microstock economic model is very solidly based on a crowd sourced model. It is the economics of microstock which has so fundamentally shifted the stock image market in general.

It is not only that the images are crowd sourced. Also, for example, image inspection and the structures built around that. Community based.

I guess I'm arguing that community is an important part of the crowd sourced model. That community has economic value. No actually I'm not arguing with anyone just raising the point.

As Sean says,  sure the community is important, but its a business and a fierce one as well. Thats the bottom line.

I agree with you lagereek. What I was trying to say is, there is a flood of amateurs, semi-pro, and pro photographer from poor countries who submit thousands of images every week. That flood cannot be stopped, at least not very soon. So, I think the only solution for every pro photographer who lives in a country with high standard is to find something more, besides microstock photography, to make living. Microstock can be always done part time.

A flood of useless images just requires higher wading boots to find the right image for your project.  That's why having a good search engine is one of the most important features of any stock site.

Now before people scream, I said useless, not worthless.  I'm not talking about the quality of the photography simple the availability of correct subject matter, locations and accessories for those photographers.
Clothing styles, architecture, furniture, etc. all vary from country to country and designers do care about those details.

Quote from: fullvalue on May 02, 2010, 12:21

I'm not talking about the quality of the photography simple the availability of correct subject matter, locations and accessories for those photographers.
Clothing styles, architecture, furniture, etc. all vary from country to country and designers do care about those details.

I'm guessing that markets in other countries will be targetted as time goes on. Any time I've looked actually to buy (very seldom, to be honest) I haven't found what I wanted because the 'look' is too American. That's understandable as it's the main market. But the style doesn't translate, even to the UK a lot of the time, far less other cultures.

True.  And you prove my point.  There may be openings for more microstock photographers around the world but a single low cost source "flooding the market" isn't going to happen.