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Author Topic: Is E+ proving to be benificial?  (Read 11436 times)

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« on: July 13, 2012, 10:45 »
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Hello.

I had decided to keep all of my images available at the lowest price possible a while back because I thought Istock would be killing sales by increasing the price. Much time has passed since then and I would be gratefull of your opinions/results in adding images to the E+ collection.

Should it only be for images that you feel worth the extra?
Has anybody had positive results from making all their files E+ (less DL more )?
Does it work best to make you best sellers E+ or are they best sellers because they are kept to a low price point etc

Hopefully this will guide me in maximising my profitability at IS.

Thank you
« Last Edit: July 13, 2012, 10:55 by malamus »


Lagereek

« Reply #1 on: July 13, 2012, 11:18 »
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It was beneficial, at least in the beginning but since then the best match is so screwed up, nothing seems beneficial anymore.

« Reply #2 on: July 13, 2012, 11:36 »
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Beneficial to me. I moved all of my best sellers to E+, and those are still the ones that get downloaded the most. I think at the dirt cheap prices buyers are getting, a few dollars more isn't a deal breaker. Especially at the big advertising agencies, where thousands of dollars are poured into a campaign.

Wish I could add more.

« Reply #3 on: July 13, 2012, 13:03 »
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Very beneficial - certainly my DLs have reduced year on year, though whether that is due to my elevating files to E+ or just a result of other factors I cannot tell - but I do find I am making a lot more in royalties.

As for which files to choose, I go for the best sellers, which are not necessarily the ones I think are the best images.  But you do need to bear in mind that if they are fairly generic there may be competition from cheaper files, either independent or regular Exclusive, so best check before committing to the six month lock in.

lisafx

« Reply #4 on: July 13, 2012, 13:39 »
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I'm non-exclusive, so no E+, but my P+ images are doing very well.  I'd say more than half my sales are of the + images, even though they are only a small fraction of my total portfolio. 

I selected mine by sorting my port by DL/mo and filling my slots with the best sellers.  Only exception was a few simple isolations with lots of competition which I though were better left in the regular collection. 

« Reply #5 on: July 13, 2012, 13:41 »
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from last 20 sales 13 are P+

« Reply #6 on: July 13, 2012, 13:43 »
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Wait, I'm not exclusive. I meant P+.

« Reply #7 on: July 13, 2012, 14:09 »
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I'm not exclusive. I put my best sellers in P+ and they have continued being my best sellers. I don't think the increased price is an issue with buyers - they're the same price or less than an exclusive file the same size.

Because of the six month lock-in I keep a few P+ slots available to use when a new good seller comes along.

« Reply #8 on: July 13, 2012, 14:17 »
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Definitely beneficial.

Lagereek

« Reply #9 on: July 13, 2012, 14:24 »
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Same here, not exclusive, I also meant P+.  in any case thats what see but not overwhelmingly. In fact, I dont really care about IS anymore, its going to TS anyway so when I upload, I upload with TS, etc, in mind.

« Reply #10 on: July 13, 2012, 14:33 »
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The OP is exclusive. He can opt out of TS, if he likes.  ;)

« Reply #11 on: July 15, 2012, 08:06 »
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I am also interested in this topic, however only E+ since I am exclusive. Maybe exclusives can give their opinion.

ShadySue

  • There is a crack in everything
« Reply #12 on: July 15, 2012, 08:09 »
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I am also interested in this topic, however only E+ since I am exclusive. Maybe exclusives can give their opinion.
Like anything else, someone else's experience won't necessarily be yours, as it depends on portfolio, popularity and opposition on the site and strange, unfathomable factors.

« Reply #13 on: July 15, 2012, 09:08 »
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I am also interested in this topic, however only E+ since I am exclusive. Maybe exclusives can give their opinion.
Like anything else, someone else's experience won't necessarily be yours, as it depends on portfolio, popularity and opposition on the site and strange, unfathomable factors.
I am exclusive and probably like many others, I have been moving more and more images to E+ in hopes to profit when these are moved to Getty's Stockbye collection. My E+ downloads have increased quite a bit, although hard to tell if that makes up for potential losses from less sales overall. It is nice to make $15 for a medium download, so that is a definite plus.

I've noticed that the E+ files have been given a definite best match boost. The first two pages of my portfolio best match sort is now loaded with E+ files. This worries me that with so many exclusives having huge portfolios - many with 6 to 20 thousand files - there are going to be tons of E+ files rising in the searches. When one file moves up another one has to move down. This could kill off a lot of my non E+ files that are borderline successful.

« Reply #14 on: July 15, 2012, 09:27 »
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It's interesting you said that. I just looked at my port best match, hardly any E+ in the first page although there seems to be a boost for Vetta. Perhaps it explains why my July is so terrible. If IS is boosting E+ in best match but excluding mine, it only makes sense that my sales are down.

I am exclusive and probably like many others, I have been moving more and more images to E+ in hopes to profit when these are moved to Getty's Stockbye collection. My E+ downloads have increased quite a bit, although hard to tell if that makes up for potential losses from less sales overall. It is nice to make $15 for a medium download, so that is a definite plus.

I've noticed that the E+ files have been given a definite best match boost. The first two pages of my portfolio best match sort is now loaded with E+ files. This worries me that with so many exclusives having huge portfolios - many with 6 to 20 thousand files - there are going to be tons of E+ files rising in the searches. When one file moves up another one has to move down. This could kill off a lot of my non E+ files that are borderline successful.

« Reply #15 on: July 15, 2012, 09:45 »
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Yes, very strange. I doubt though that they are singling out individual contribs to give or not give best match boosts. Possibly because many of my E+ images have just recently been designated as E+, they get an initial boost. Who knows. BTW, my July sales overall are pretty lousy also.

It's interesting you said that. I just looked at my port best match, hardly any E+ in the first page although there seems to be a boost for Vetta. Perhaps it explains why my July is so terrible. If IS is boosting E+ in best match but excluding mine, it only makes sense that my sales are down.

I am exclusive and probably like many others, I have been moving more and more images to E+ in hopes to profit when these are moved to Getty's Stockbye collection. My E+ downloads have increased quite a bit, although hard to tell if that makes up for potential losses from less sales overall. It is nice to make $15 for a medium download, so that is a definite plus.

I've noticed that the E+ files have been given a definite best match boost. The first two pages of my portfolio best match sort is now loaded with E+ files. This worries me that with so many exclusives having huge portfolios - many with 6 to 20 thousand files - there are going to be tons of E+ files rising in the searches. When one file moves up another one has to move down. This could kill off a lot of my non E+ files that are borderline successful.

« Reply #16 on: July 15, 2012, 09:50 »
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Quote
It's interesting you said that. I just looked at my port best match, hardly any E+ in the first page although there seems to be a boost for Vetta. Perhaps it explains why my July is so terrible. If IS is boosting E+ in best match but excluding mine, it only makes sense that my sales are down.


You got to remember that what you see in the best match is NOT what others see. After Aprils HQ Update I asked a couple friends to look at my portfolio, one was a buyer and another was not, each of us saw a totally different selection of images in the best match sort.

Here is a link to that thread http://www.istockphoto.com/forum_messages.php?threadid=343053&page=1

"All of these factors also affect the searches that contributors are doing as well, making it difficult for you to assess what you're seeing or to understand how it might look from the perspective of a specific customer. So bear in mind when you look at a set of results that it won't be the same across different segments. "

« Reply #17 on: July 15, 2012, 09:53 »
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I knew. I read all these. Just trying to figure out why my July has been so terrible.

I am also interested in this topic, however only E+ since I am exclusive. Maybe exclusives can give their opinion.
Like anything else, someone else's experience won't necessarily be yours, as it depends on portfolio, popularity and opposition on the site and strange, unfathomable factors.
I am exclusive and probably like many others, I have been moving more and more images to E+ in hopes to profit when these are moved to Getty's Stockbye collection. My E+ downloads have increased quite a bit, although hard to tell if that makes up for potential losses from less sales overall. It is nice to make $15 for a medium download, so that is a definite plus.

I've noticed that the E+ files have been given a definite best match boost. The first two pages of my portfolio best match sort is now loaded with E+ files. This worries me that with so many exclusives having huge portfolios - many with 6 to 20 thousand files - there are going to be tons of E+ files rising in the searches. When one file moves up another one has to move down. This could kill off a lot of my non E+ files that are borderline successful.

ShadySue

  • There is a crack in everything
« Reply #18 on: July 15, 2012, 09:55 »
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I've noticed that the E+ files have been given a definite best match boost. The first two pages of my portfolio best match sort is now loaded with E+ files.

The best match in your own portfolio doesn't necessarily correspond with a sitewide best match.
Also your best match isn't necessarily the same as anyone else's. Within my own port, I'd say recent uploads are weighted high, and the rest is a sprinkling of E+ and files with more than 'my' average of recent sales.
Remember that sitewide best match isn't the same for everybody. There's a debatably-useful geographic bias, and according to KelvinJay, a bias according to your 'previous sales'. There must be other factors as well.
Example, here are screenshots I've made in the last five minutes. The top two are the top of my own port sorted by best match, one logged in, the other logged out. The next two are the top of a sitewide search on 'horse', one logged in, one logged out.

BTW, can anyone find the 'horse' in that Olympic flag? Just sayin'

« Reply #19 on: July 15, 2012, 09:57 »
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Hey that is my Olympic flag from the "Equestrian" venue during the 2004 Olympics

ShadySue

  • There is a crack in everything
« Reply #20 on: July 15, 2012, 10:06 »
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Hey that is my Olympic flag from the "Equestrian" venue during the 2004 Olympics
So, where's the 'horse'?

« Reply #21 on: July 15, 2012, 10:09 »
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Hey that is my Olympic flag from the "Equestrian" venue during the 2004 Olympics
So, where's the 'horse'?
There was a couple hundred under that flag. Just following the editorial captioning rules ;-)

Your examples fits with my post above yours about what IS said about the best match results.

ShadySue

  • There is a crack in everything
« Reply #22 on: July 15, 2012, 10:19 »
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Hey that is my Olympic flag from the "Equestrian" venue during the 2004 Olympics
So, where's the 'horse'?
There was a couple hundred under that flag. Just following the editorial captioning rules ;-)
The editorial keywording rules are no different from the main collection rules. Sorry, that sort of thing just drives me nuts, especially when I've had 'nobody' pulled out of two inspections this week which had nobody in them, and panoramic composition pulled from a 'letterbox' photo.

ShadySue

  • There is a crack in everything
« Reply #23 on: July 15, 2012, 10:37 »
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Your examples fits with my post above yours about what IS said about the best match results.
Yeah, sorry, I was screendumping and pasting, so you beat me to it!

« Reply #24 on: July 15, 2012, 11:19 »
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Yes I am perfectly aware of this. My post was my own personal anecdotal experience in response to the opening post that asked if E+ files are beneficial.

My own personal experience on this date at this time is that my first 100 files sorted by best match contain almost 75 E+ files, as opposed to a couple months ago when there were only about 10 E+ files on the first page, IIRC. I highly suspect that this is due to the fact that I just added about 200 files to E+. I also highly suspect that this is why I am getting more E+ downloads. So yes, for me, at this time, E+ files appear to be beneficial. Hopefully, when and if these files are mirrored on Getty, they will prove even more beneficial.

Admittedly, my surmise that E+ files are getting a best match boost, was unfounded, as applied to all contributors, since I am only aware of my own circumstances.

I am also aware that my own personal best match sort on this day will have almost no correlation with any best match search on any given keyword to any one else's best match search results.

I've noticed that the E+ files have been given a definite best match boost. The first two pages of my portfolio best match sort is now loaded with E+ files.
The best match in your own portfolio doesn't necessarily correspond with a sitewide best match.
Also your best match isn't necessarily the same as anyone else's. Within my own port, I'd say recent uploads are weighted high, and the rest is a sprinkling of E+ and files with more than 'my' average of recent sales.
Remember that sitewide best match isn't the same for everybody. There's a debatably-useful geographic bias, and according to KelvinJay, a bias according to your 'previous sales'. There must be other factors as well.

KB

« Reply #25 on: July 15, 2012, 16:13 »
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Hey that is my Olympic flag from the "Equestrian" venue during the 2004 Olympics
So, where's the 'horse'?
There was a couple hundred under that flag. Just following the editorial captioning rules ;-)

Your examples fits with my post above yours about what IS said about the best match results.
No offense intended, but it's disappointing to read this from someone who I think should know better. The rest of the keywords in that file are perfectly relevant, but 'horse'? Do you really think that a buyer who searches for 'Horse' AND 'Summer Olympic Games' would be looking for this image (or 'Horse' AND anything, for that matter)?

« Reply #26 on: July 15, 2012, 16:49 »
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Hey that is my Olympic flag from the "Equestrian" venue during the 2004 Olympics
So, where's the 'horse'?
There was a couple hundred under that flag. Just following the editorial captioning rules ;-)

Your examples fits with my post above yours about what IS said about the best match results.
No offense intended, but it's disappointing to read this from someone who I think should know better. The rest of the keywords in that file are perfectly relevant, but 'horse'? Do you really think that a buyer who searches for 'Horse' AND 'Summer Olympic Games' would be looking for this image (or 'Horse' AND anything, for that matter)?

I went back and looked and I did NOT put in "horse", that came up because I put in "equestrian" and the CV added "horse"

ShadySue

  • There is a crack in everything
« Reply #27 on: July 15, 2012, 16:54 »
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Hey that is my Olympic flag from the "Equestrian" venue during the 2004 Olympics
So, where's the 'horse'?
There was a couple hundred under that flag. Just following the editorial captioning rules ;-)

Your examples fits with my post above yours about what IS said about the best match results.
No offense intended, but it's disappointing to read this from someone who I think should know better. The rest of the keywords in that file are perfectly relevant, but 'horse'? Do you really think that a buyer who searches for 'Horse' AND 'Summer Olympic Games' would be looking for this image (or 'Horse' AND anything, for that matter)?

I went back and looked and I did NOT put in "horse", that came up because I put in "equestrian" and the CV added "horse"
I'm not sure the actual photo represents anything 'equestrian' either.
If I submit a photo of a pen on a desk, should I put 'house' because I took it in my house, or 'Scotland' because I took it in Scotland?

« Reply #28 on: July 15, 2012, 16:57 »
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Fine, hear you two and I have removed "equestrian" which also removed "horse", but because it was taken at the "Markopoulo Equestrian Center", I left that in.
HAPPY???

ShadySue

  • There is a crack in everything
« Reply #29 on: July 15, 2012, 17:00 »
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Fine, hear you two and I have removed "equestrian" which also removed "horse", but because it was taken at the "Markopoulo Equestrian Center", I left that in.
HAPPY???
;D

KB

« Reply #30 on: July 15, 2012, 17:58 »
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Fine, hear you two and I have removed "equestrian" which also removed "horse", but because it was taken at the "Markopoulo Equestrian Center", I left that in.
HAPPY???
I am.  ;D

As for "Markopoulo Equestrian Center", that's to me more legitimate than 'horse'. Besides, it's unlikely anyone is going to search using that term, so it doesn't really hurt others as 'horse' does. (If a buyer did search on it, well, they probably wouldn't be happy with it, but at least they should understand it, unlike someone who was searching on 'horse'.)

However, the fact that you wrote: I have removed "equestrian" which also removed "horse" sounds to me as if perhaps you don't fully understand the DA process? 'Equestrian' DAs to 'horse', therefore it IS horse. 'Equestrian' was not in your keyword terms (even though you put it in) because it DAs to 'horse'. (Note I'm not saying I necessarily agree with that DA, just that that's the way it works.)

« Reply #31 on: July 15, 2012, 18:16 »
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Fine, hear you two and I have removed "equestrian" which also removed "horse", but because it was taken at the "Markopoulo Equestrian Center", I left that in.
HAPPY???

I am.  ;D

However, the fact that you wrote: I have removed "equestrian" which also removed "horse" sounds to me as if perhaps you don't fully understand the DA process? 'Equestrian' DAs to 'horse', therefore it IS horse. 'Equestrian' was not in your keyword terms (even though you put it in) because it DAs to 'horse'. (Note I'm not saying I necessarily agree with that DA, just that that's the way it works.)


All I can say is when I went into edit the Keywords, the only one I deleted was "Equestrian" which removed "horse".

I have been an Equestrian Photographer for over 25 years and have gone by this

Definition of EQUESTRIAN
1
a : of, relating to, or featuring horseback riding <equestrian Olympic events>
b : archaic : riding on horseback : mounted
c : representing a person on horseback

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/equestrian

With "Equus" meaning 'horse'

Definition of EQUUS
: a genus of the family Equidae that comprises the horses, asses, zebras, and related recent and extinct mammals

Also, please don't hide behind anonymity when you are criticizing someones elses work.
« Last Edit: July 15, 2012, 18:48 by cmannphoto »

ShadySue

  • There is a crack in everything
« Reply #32 on: July 15, 2012, 18:37 »
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Also, please don't hide behind anonymity when you are criticizing someones elses work.
What difference does my non-anonymous criticism or KB's anonymous criticism make in this particular case?
I know what equestrian means, and accept that your flag was been taken at an equestrian centre, but it's an Olympic flag photo, not any sort of equestrian photo.

Sometimes the CV/DA system forces you to spam, whereby you can SM ducksandwich to add the DA you need. I've just emailled him about an exact issue of that nature. He's usually very accommodating about it. But this wasn't one of these cases.
However, if you feel strongly about it, why not try to get an official opinion, or a range of non-official opinions, on the keywords forum over there. Duck usually pops in to contentions threads or difficult questions.

BTW, kudos for pointing up the 'no support by phone' issue on the help thread.

« Reply #33 on: July 15, 2012, 18:45 »
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Yes, I have used the Keyword thread and Dave has been very helpful.

In this case it was an accident, not intentional. Once I read your post I understood where you where coming from and corrected my error.

As far as the "anonymity" comment, I don't appreciate KB criticizing my keywording. I guess I am to assume that all their keywords are 100% correct, I doubt that. 

I am always willing to learn and I am man enough to admit I made an error.

KB

« Reply #34 on: July 15, 2012, 19:02 »
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Yes, I have used the Keyword thread and Dave has been very helpful.

In this case it was an accident, not intentional. Once I read your post I understood where you where coming from and corrected my error.

As far as the "anonymity" comment, I don't appreciate KB criticizing my keywording. I guess I am to assume that all their keywords are 100% correct, I doubt that. 

I am always willing to learn and I am man enough to admit I made an error.
I was not meaning to be critical, I was trying to explain that I don't think you understand the DA process. By what you just wrote:
All I can say is when I went into edit the Keywords, the only one I deleted was "Equestrian" which removed "horse".
I think that verifies it.  That isn't meant as a criticism; I think many, many contributors don't understand how it works.

As for whether my keywords are 100% correct, there's no need to wonder: They absolutely are not, I guarantee it. Besides those that I intentionally "spam", I'm sure that I probably have some terms that are inadvertently wrong. No one is perfect, especially me.

vonkara

« Reply #35 on: July 15, 2012, 20:07 »
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This is the last sales of one of my exclusive plus file at Istock. I quit being independent about 2 years ago to stop selling pictures at 25 to 35 cents. I think it worked quite well and the only time I spent on the website in the last 2 years was for requesting payments.


« Reply #36 on: July 15, 2012, 21:04 »
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1 picture / 1 year
- 182.77$ in 19 sales (9.62$ rpd)
- 1.58 times per month

interesting numbers, I am sure you would have made that on SS only (I also believe its better to sell only 19 times than perhaps 360)

I know you havent questioned anything but I found this curious

wut

« Reply #37 on: July 16, 2012, 04:56 »
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This is the last sales of one of my exclusive plus file at Istock. I quit being independent about 2 years ago to stop selling pictures at 25 to 35 cents. I think it worked quite well and the only time I spent on the website in the last 2 years was for requesting payments.



That's a pretty sight, especially after looking at peanut sales all the time myself (OK save for occasional ELs and big SODs at SS)

« Reply #38 on: July 16, 2012, 07:17 »
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Besides, you can make higher percentage if your RC rank is higher.

ShadySue

  • There is a crack in everything
« Reply #39 on: July 16, 2012, 08:11 »
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interesting numbers, I am sure you would have made that on SS only (I also believe its better to sell only 19 times than perhaps 360)
Absolutely: 341 fewer places to have your image stolen from.  :)

« Reply #40 on: July 16, 2012, 08:24 »
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I have been wrestling moving some good sellers to E+, because I have read mixed reviews on how well people are doing.

I have a file (17764850) that has done pretty well over the last 10 months.
It has earned $405.88 in the 76 DLs for and average of $5.34 per DL. Out of those 76 DLs only 6 have been XSmall.

The six month lock it the biggest deterrent. Also the slow migration to Getty is not helping either.

« Reply #41 on: July 16, 2012, 08:32 »
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The six month period is my biggest deterrant, one or two months and I think you could gage how it was working without risking much, (thats one hard working retrever BTW!)

« Reply #42 on: July 16, 2012, 11:11 »
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The six month period is my biggest deterrant, one or two months and I think you could gage how it was working without risking much, (thats one hard working retrever BTW!)


I could live with a 3 month long lock, but in my example it could be a whole season with fewer DLs. Yet it could be a nice jump in $$$ and RCs you never now. Right now I will leave it alone until I see more concrete stats and the moving of files to Getty working smoothly.

Thanks, any dog in my house has to work for their food and a roof over their head  ;D
I have to say they are doing a good job.  ;)

« Reply #43 on: July 17, 2012, 07:55 »
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I think there are two important things about E+. One is whether the increasing price will make for the (if happens) decreasing DL numbers. The other one is the Redemeed Credits on the long run. E+ downloads produce more RCs. This means even your DL numbers can decrease, if it helps you to reach the next level you can make more money and be on the profit side.

ShadySue

  • There is a crack in everything
« Reply #44 on: July 17, 2012, 08:01 »
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I think there are two important things about E+. One is whether the increasing price will make for the (if happens) decreasing DL numbers. The other one is the Redemeed Credits on the long run. E+ downloads produce more RCs. This means even your DL numbers can decrease, if it helps you to reach the next level you can make more money and be on the profit side.
Two other imponderables are what the best match will do (sometimes it seems to penalise E+ files) and whether a similar-enough will be put up, and priced at E or Indie rates. If it happens just after you've nominated a file as E+, you're stuck for six months while they get all the sales you might have got a share of.

wut

« Reply #45 on: July 17, 2012, 09:21 »
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The other one is the Redemeed Credits on the long run. E+ downloads produce more RCs. This means even your DL numbers can decrease, if it helps you to reach the next level you can make more money and be on the profit side.

If they're going to set the 2013 RC targets according to that, indies will loose out big time

« Reply #46 on: July 25, 2012, 20:54 »
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My 2 cents;
I only put a few dozen into E+ way back when it started, I continue to let it roll.  I selected a fairly wide variety and also a few "similars", putting one in, leaving one out.  Sale numbers dropped dramtically, income stayed about the same.  I really like it whenever an E+ sale occurs like today. Small file $8.20.  Looks better than the many other pre E+ sales of less than $1.00.


 

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