MicrostockGroup
Agency Based Discussion => iStockPhoto.com => Topic started by: bunhill on May 05, 2011, 16:25
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Photo+ (http://www.istockphoto.com/forum_messages.php?threadid=328522&page=1)
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Looks like it's exclusive pricing for files 2-5-10-15-20-etc. for a portion of an independent's portfolio.
It's a tempting thought...
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Just what istock needs is another collection at another price point. They are just trying to suck people back in so they can stick it to them somewhere down the road. Hmmmm, maybe treating indies like crap didn't go over so well?
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*, *another* stinking collection? Let's just keep making things more and more confusing over there. Ridiculous.
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Looks like it's exclusive pricing for files 2-5-10-15-20-etc. for a portion of an independent's portfolio.
It's a tempting thought...
If that's right it could reverse the effects of the cuts - it would also add to the RC tally, which might be necessary. My allowance for nominating these things is huge, about a fifth of my entire portfolio which would easily allow all my good sellers in.
Does this effectively reverse the hit we took last year when exclusives got their files repriced and we didn't (we got some slight cuts, as I remember)?
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Doesn't sound too bad. I do notice the word photo on it though. Are the redheaded step children of iStock being left out again? :'(
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Doesn't sound too bad. I do notice the word photo on it though. Are the redheaded step children of iStock being left out again? :'(
Consider yourself lucky. :)
If they don't change the Best Match, and as many buyers are using Best Match as "they" would have you believe, it really doesn't matter, as non-exclusive files are stuck in the back anyway.
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Basically this is Istock's attempt to charge exclusive prices ... whilst paying out independent level commissions. Istockphoto's greed is truly boundless.
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There are millions of photographs on istock and 50 000 plus new ones coming every week. The plus collection allows you to identify the best images from a series. These should then get preference in the search, at least that is what would make sense.
I see this first of all as content management solution that gives the artist the choice and control.
Yes, you will earn more. You will get more RCīs. So the next levels will be...well, we will see.
I hope they have something coming for the buyers as well.
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And from what I can tell looking at the icon page (http://www.istockphoto.com/icons.php), there doesn't seem to be an icon for it. So is there no way for buyers to tell between regular and Photo+ other than when they get to the image detail page and see the pricing?
Trying to sneak in a price increase?
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Basically this is Istock's attempt to charge exclusive prices ... whilst paying out independent level commissions. Istockphoto's greed is truly boundless.
But isn't it just unifying the price structure for a percentage of files, the way it used to be? They were still being greedy back then and we never considered customers should pay a different rate for exclusive files back then. Independents weren't pleased when exclusives got a rise from higher credit prices and we didn't.
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In thinking about why they'd make this change, it seems to me the most likely thing is trying to keep revenues up in the face of declining sales volume. So while it might be fine (and possibly to buyers not so big a shock if they're already willing to pay for exclusive files - when the can find them) in the short term, if the downloads keep dropping, it won't be more than a short term band aid.
The fact that it was some admin I don't remember hearing from before who announced it and they clearly had no idea what an announcement typically would be like - I suppose I should be glad they updated the front page prices - makes it seem rather hasty and not thoroughly planned out. "Could you let me know what kinds of details you are all looking for?" doesn't instill confidence in me that this admin is the right person to handle this launch's communication.
I don't yet see the answer to how the search results will show these files (http://www.istockphoto.com/forum_messages.php?threadid=328522&messageid=6369542)- which seems like a huge deal to me. If buyers can't see these are more expensive from the search results, they're going to be even more upset than they already are
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Hmmm...anyone trying this? It's tempting to try with a few good sellers. Unfortunately, the buyers may just buy something cheaper and the best sellers may stop selling - I don't like the idea of a 6 month lock if it doesn't work. Then again, my sales probably can't get much worse.
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Hmmm...anyone trying this? It's tempting to try with a few good sellers. Unfortunately, the buyers may just buy something cheaper and the best sellers may stop selling - I don't like the idea of a 6 month lock if it doesn't work. Then again, my sales probably can't get much worse.
I'm going throw a few of my better sellers into this and see what happens. Any prospect of offsetting my drop to a 15% commission rate is worth the try. At least iStock is giving us a choice.
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There are millions of photographs on istock and 50 000 plus new ones coming every week. The plus collection allows you to identify the best images from a series. These should then get preference in the search, at least that is what would make sense.
It might make sense, it's even what was promised with E+, but as you know, it hasn't happened, even though the thread on that very issue hasn't 'settled'.
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I think it would make a lot more sense to do this now when all the artist can choose their best files. At least if they want this to be primarily to help manage the huge collection.
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Forgive the cross post, but here are my concerns about this:
A year ago I would have jumped all over this. Now I am not so sure. I worry about adding to customer confusion, and falling sales for my best sellers if I were to do add anything to P+. The reports I have read about sales of E+ images aren't at all promising.
I would need to know more about best match placement before considering putting anything in P+. Also, the 6 month commitment worries me. I have a 6 month commitment elsewhere, but no other site changes as dramatically or as often as Istock. 6 months is a long time if there is no stability.
Also, I don't see where the royalty % question has been answered. Would we be receiving our same (unfortunate) royalty for the P+ images, or even lower royalty?
Another question - will the P+ images, with their 6 month lock-in, be forced onto partner sites? If so, would there be any boost in the royalty rates paid through the PP, or the same pitiful .28?
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That photo+ shows only for images, and does not show for vectors...So i guess vectors are not included ....
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I wouldn't be surprised if they lock a bunch of images in for at least 6 months, then surprise - they are all getting moved over to thinkstock. Then after 6 months if you pull the plug, it will still take months for them to come off of their subs site...
If it seems like a nefarious idea, that is probably what they are going to do. (this is the new kind of trust that IS has now, I trust them to try to screw us).
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I'm astonished that people are even considering this, especially with a 6-month lock! A new round of koolaid must have been passed out.
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Geez, I think it was just a week ago when I started the thread "No crisis du jour at istock?" I knew they couldn't go too long without creating some sort of drama (or scam).
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I'm astonished that people are even considering this, especially with a 6-month lock! A new round of koolaid must have been passed out.
I wouldn't touch that offer with a 12-inch turd, especially with the way they have lied, misled and cheated their contributors out of hard earned and well deserved commissions.
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That photo+ shows only for images, and does not show for vectors...So i guess vectors are not included ....
They aren't for exclusive vectors either - i.e. E+ is photos only. I think there was a promise of vectors "soon" or "later", but it hasn't happened yet.
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I'm astonished that people are even considering this, especially with a 6-month lock! A new round of koolaid must have been passed out.
I'd be interested in hearing your reasoning.
Here's mine for opting a few in:
1.The possibility of better best match placement: mine are near the end of the stack so why not see if there's a boost?
2. I'm getting 15% as it is now. I'd rather take a chance on getting 15% on 10 credits than 15% on 5 credits, for example.
3. Will it result in lower sales for those images? Perhaps but with 1 and 2 above I probably won't notice the difference as my income is virtually meaningless as it is now. Guess I'm willing to take the chance.
4. 6-month lock....again, with sales the way they are for me personally a potential dip in income over 6 months for a select few images isn't significant.
I look at this as an experiment, one which may fail. If it proves to be beneficial then good for me and I'll opt more in, if not then at least I'll know not to continue after 6 months. Nothing ventured, nothing gained and, in my case, little lost.
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Maybe reread the Epic Fail thread. There's a whole bunch of reasons.
Everyone is free to do what they choose. If you don't see any downside, go for it. Maybe you will be right.
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So I wonder how long it will take them to cut commissions again. And then suggest that you can use this to increase prices to make the same money as before.
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I'm astonished that people are even considering this, especially with a 6-month lock! A new round of koolaid must have been passed out.
I wouldn't touch that offer with a 12-inch turd, especially with the way they have lied, misled and cheated their contributors out of hard earned and well deserved commissions.
ROFL at both of you.
"a 12-inch turd" *snigger*
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Forgive the cross post, but here are my concerns about this:
A year ago I would have jumped all over this. Now I am not so sure. I worry about adding to customer confusion, and falling sales for my best sellers if I were to do add anything to P+. The reports I have read about sales of E+ images aren't at all promising.
I would need to know more about best match placement before considering putting anything in P+. Also, the 6 month commitment worries me. I have a 6 month commitment elsewhere, but no other site changes as dramatically or as often as Istock. 6 months is a long time if there is no stability.
Also, I don't see where the royalty % question has been answered. Would we be receiving our same (unfortunate) royalty for the P+ images, or even lower royalty?
Another question - will the P+ images, with their 6 month lock-in, be forced onto partner sites? If so, would there be any boost in the royalty rates paid through the PP, or the same pitiful .28?
I'm with you, Lisa. I'm too gun shy to even give this a try. this announcement didn't even get my heart started. I just keep thinking "great, another reason to piss off buyers"
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The best match!!! the best match, must change! whats the matter with some of you? have you gone soft in the head or something? photo+ and all that, whats the point if the best match stays the same.
The whole, entire problem is the present best match! which at the moment pushes non-exclusives as far back as possible.
After 5 minutes, buyers will start getting even more confused, their heads will spin in circles and they will start to complain even more about this labyrint of differant pricings.
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If IS was a "normal" site, I would opt in my best sellers immediately, just like I set all files on Fotolia at higher possible price, with no negative effects.
But at IS I am scared of touching my best sellers for now: there MUST be a catch sometime, somewhere.
I'm tempted to add some of my non sellers to the Photo+ collection, just to see what will happen:
nothing to lose, my "worst" files sold at an higher price point, and - just in case they will boost search results a bit - at the top of their search, funny!
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Doesn't sound too bad. I do notice the word photo on it though. Are the redheaded step children of iStock being left out again? :'(
yep, sounds like it. On the photo+ page
Right now, Photo+ is for photos only. We may introduce other file types at a later date.
I think this is a good thing though and will be opting my images into the collection. If a buyer doesn't want the expensive version there is probably plenty more in the series at the cheaper price. The prices are still not crazy high and I am happy to receive a better price for my images.
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Forgive the cross post, but here are my concerns about this:
A year ago I would have jumped all over this. Now I am not so sure. I worry about adding to customer confusion, and falling sales for my best sellers if I were to do add anything to P+. The reports I have read about sales of E+ images aren't at all promising.
I would need to know more about best match placement before considering putting anything in P+. Also, the 6 month commitment worries me. I have a 6 month commitment elsewhere, but no other site changes as dramatically or as often as Istock. 6 months is a long time if there is no stability.
Also, I don't see where the royalty % question has been answered. Would we be receiving our same (unfortunate) royalty for the P+ images, or even lower royalty?
Another question - will the P+ images, with their 6 month lock-in, be forced onto partner sites? If so, would there be any boost in the royalty rates paid through the PP, or the same pitiful .28?
On the first post, spazerd says the royalties will stay the same...
Royalties for will remain the same.
...
http://www.istockphoto.com/forum_messages.php?threadid=328522&page=1 (http://www.istockphoto.com/forum_messages.php?threadid=328522&page=1)
I think this will have a different price consequence than Exclusive+ because the pricing will just be the same as most of their entire collection. It isn't really another 'tier' it is just more images at the exclusive tier pricing. Of course, the real determining factor is going to be the best match placement.
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I think this will have a different price consequence than Exclusive+ because the pricing will just be the same as most of their entire collection. It isn't really another 'tier' it is just more images at the exclusive tier pricing. Of course, the real determining factor is going to be the best match placement.
aren't exclusives complaining for competition from lower-priced non-exclusive files? it that is true, why should we indipendents join them voluntarily and lose the only advantage we have?
of course, a better placement may put things in a different perspective
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I will opt in. It cannot get much worse at iS anyway. And just think about it. If files cost too much at iS buyers are slowely migrating to the other microstock agencies. It is the perfect deal for non- exclusives :-)
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I will opt in. It cannot get much worse at iS anyway.
Yes, it can. Should our best sellers stop selling after putting in the Photo+ collection, 6 months are enough to ruin their placement forever.
I am not ruling out opting in anyway, just still evaluating.
And just think about it. If files cost too much at iS buyers are slowely migrating to the other microstock agencies. It is the perfect deal for non- exclusives :-)
This is the good part indeed. As an independent, the whole IS issue is already resulting in higher overall earnings for me across all sites.
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I'll give it try with a few files (some best sellers, and some non-sellers).
Will see if it's better or worse. My total sales from IS dropped so much that the risk isn't high, even if I ruin some of my best sellers.
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...but files attached to 'the + collection' are locked in it for 6 months... fortunately, it doesn't make them exclusive.
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Forgive the cross post, but here are my concerns about this:
A year ago I would have jumped all over this. Now I am not so sure. I worry about adding to customer confusion, and falling sales for my best sellers if I were to do add anything to P+. The reports I have read about sales of E+ images aren't at all promising.
I would need to know more about best match placement before considering putting anything in P+. Also, the 6 month commitment worries me. I have a 6 month commitment elsewhere, but no other site changes as dramatically or as often as Istock. 6 months is a long time if there is no stability.
Also, I don't see where the royalty % question has been answered. Would we be receiving our same (unfortunate) royalty for the P+ images, or even lower royalty?
Another question - will the P+ images, with their 6 month lock-in, be forced onto partner sites? If so, would there be any boost in the royalty rates paid through the PP, or the same pitiful .28?
Like with E+, it's really up to the contributor. As for reports of falling sales, many exclusives have also said that their E+ files have worked very well for them, and the ones I have opted in seem to work well for me. I think it's important to be very selective though; don't opt a good seller in unless it is either (a) Unique in some way and/or (b) has performed well against similar files. But that's just my strategy.
As for the 6 month lock in, if you're not comfortable with it, don't opt in; my assumption though is that the lock in is so that buyers don't find the same files changing price all the time from day to day, which seems reasonable.
I doubt there will be any benefit coming in best match placement. It has been asked for with E+ but there is no real indication of it being implemented, though of course that could change.
As already said, you'll get the same royalty percentage, but on the higher price, so more $$s.
As for the PP, assuming it's just like E+, it's up to you whether or not you opt a file into the PP as well as making it Photo+. But you won't get any extra royalty from the PP sales, that stays the same.
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So,
1: no better placement in best match ?
2: locked in for 6 months?
3: no, or just minimal price change?
So the photo+ , is just a pretty word then?
Surely, if they want lots of good independants and resigned exclusives to re-think and come back? surely they can come up with something at least a little bit better?
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I will opt in. It cannot get much worse at iS anyway.
Yes, it can. Should our best sellers stop selling after putting in the Photo+ collection, 6 months are enough to ruin their placement forever.
I am not ruling out opting in anyway, just still evaluating.
And just think about it. If files cost too much at iS buyers are slowely migrating to the other microstock agencies. It is the perfect deal for non- exclusives :-)
This is the good part indeed. As an independent, the whole IS issue is already resulting in higher overall earnings for me across all sites.
My best sellers already kind of stopped selling. My income at iStockphoto has fallen so much dollarwise it cannot fall the same amount again. If it would , I would have to pay iStockphoto each month. Thats why I think what ever, give it a try, not much to loose anyway.
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It seems to me that every single change that has happened in past few months has been to line IS's pockets, not to help out the contributor. If you don't think you have anything to lose, I guess it doesn't hurt to try. But if you're thinking that this is going to magically bring back all of your lost sales, I don't believe that will ever happen. They are doing this for a reason that will help THEM, not you.
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It seems to me that every single change that has happened in past few months has been to line IS's pockets, not to help out the contributor. If you don't think you have anything to lose, I guess it doesn't hurt to try. But if you're thinking that this is going to magically bring back all of your lost sales, I don't believe that will ever happen. They are doing this for a reason that will help THEM, not you.
Yes they have been lining their pockets and that is also the point of this. But this time they are incidentally willing to line ours a bit, too. I reckon it amounts to about a 50% pay hike, minus any defections of buyers going to other iStock independents instead of buying our files. If 20% of buyers switch, that would still leave me 20% better off. (80% the number of sales at 150% of the price). The loss of sales would need to hit 33% before it would be quits.
If there is any rationality in iStock, they are doing this because they realise that our files are now underpriced and that we will not hit significant customer resistance by putting them at a price that equals that of the exclusive collection. Istock also has an incentive - whether it acts on it or not - to promote Photos+ files at the expense of ordinary independent ones, so non participation might lead to even worse search placement.
If photos+ files are too expensive to sell, then so is the entire exclusive collection but I've never heard anybody complain that exclusivity makes their files too expensive, they all see the price hike as a benefit of turning exclusive. I've heard people say that going exclusive doesn't increase your sales, I don't recall hearing them say that it causes them to fall.
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If photos+ files are too expensive to sell, then so is the entire exclusive collection but I've never heard anybody complain that exclusivity makes their files too expensive, they all see the price hike as a benefit of turning exclusive. I've heard people say that going exclusive doesn't increase your sales, I don't recall hearing them say that it causes them to fall.
You can ask a premium for E+ by the mere fact that they are not available elsewhere, let alone a thousand elsewheres at much lower prices.
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If photos+ files are too expensive to sell, then so is the entire exclusive collection but I've never heard anybody complain that exclusivity makes their files too expensive, they all see the price hike as a benefit of turning exclusive. I've heard people say that going exclusive doesn't increase your sales, I don't recall hearing them say that it causes them to fall.
You can ask a premium for E+ by the mere fact that they are not available elsewhere, let alone a thousand elsewheres at much lower prices.
I don't think that applies, Sean. My files are already available at other places cheaper than they are at iStock but people still choose to buy them at iStock because that is where they are shopping. The same applies to Yuri and it sure as hell hasn't stopped people spending extra to buy his at iS.
In any case, the price comparison is not with E+, it is with ordinary E. E+ is actually making the same "its worth more" claim twice over, once for being exclusive and again for being exclusive and super good.
The question is, does pricing files at ordinary E level put off customers at iS? I don't see that it does. A lot of exclusive files are generic, anyway, so uniqueness is irrelevant and if people were THAT price sensitive they would only buy their isolated apple shots from independents. But they don't.
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I agree that uniqueness (and exclusivity) is irrelevant: if the same picture has been sold hundreds of times on a single site, what difference does it make for a buyer? It's not exclusive anyway.
And I agree - from my experience at Fotolia and Dreamstime - that setting prices a little higher doesn't hurt in general.
But what I fear is that in the current situation at IS - with a lot of distrust - anything that has a tag identifying it as a "super" file may be skipped by buyers.
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But what I fear is that in the current situation at IS - with a lot of distrust - everything that has a tag identifying it as a "super" file may be skipped by buyers.
Interesting thought. On the other hand, it could be a selling point ... if something costs a bit more people think it is worth more. It's all just guesswork now but I'll find out soon enough.
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If photos+ files are too expensive to sell, then so is the entire exclusive collection but I've never heard anybody complain that exclusivity makes their files too expensive, they all see the price hike as a benefit of turning exclusive. I've heard people say that going exclusive doesn't increase your sales, I don't recall hearing them say that it causes them to fall.
You can ask a premium for E+ by the mere fact that they are not available elsewhere, let alone a thousand elsewheres at much lower prices.
Don't agree. What happens when there are a ton of similar images on IS? If there are 1,000 almost identical handshakes and you price yours as E+ why would a buyer just not buy the almost identical cheaper one next to it?
I think independents would have better success using Photos+ because, used in large enough volume, it would raise the overall average for pricing making it a bit more consistent. For exclusives, E+ seems to be best used sparingly for unique images or concepts without much competition.
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Somewhat ironic. I opted a few files in last night and already had sales with the new + commission.
XS = 50 cents. I like it.
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Somewhat ironic. I opted a few files in last night and already had sales with the new + commission.
XS = 50 cents. I like it.
Good for you. If this trend continues and it's not just random statistical noise, then it's a clear sign that either those files have a better placement or people are not so price sensitive.
I opted in a few real non-sellers (0 sales) this morning as a test. Will see in the next few days.
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...What happens when there are a ton of similar images on IS? If there are 1,000 almost identical handshakes and you price yours as E+ why would a buyer just not buy the almost identical cheaper one next to it?...
If you would price your generic hand shake as a + file then you don't understand the benefits of the new collection.
Naturally you would put images into the + collection that have almost none to none competition...
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I think what i might try is to NOT put the best sellers into photo+, but put images that sell well elsewhere and have gotten lost in the snarf at IS into photo+ . This way they might get a new life at IS, having already proven their worth elsewhere. The best sellers are already selling, so why jinx that?
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Is it just an accident that we independents now have a getty images sales button or is it preparation for something in the pipeline?
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Is it just an accident that we independents now have a getty images sales button or is it preparation for something in the pipeline?
Either way it looks like an attempt to get the non-exclusives excited and get the "community" engine humming again. Probably successfully unless their IT-experts pushed the wrong button (again).
Nonetheless, maybe they will offer image-exclusivity at Getty. I'm sure we'll see, just a matter of time.
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...What happens when there are a ton of similar images on IS? If there are 1,000 almost identical handshakes and you price yours as E+ why would a buyer just not buy the almost identical cheaper one next to it?...
If you would price your generic hand shake as a + file then you don't understand the benefits of the new collection.
Naturally you would put images into the + collection that have almost none to none competition...
Exactly.
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Is it just an accident that we independents now have a getty images sales button or is it preparation for something in the pipeline?
It's IS jumping the gun for whatever reason and once again, being unprepared. Sigh.
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I am not sure why they require the files to be locked-in for 6 months in this collection. Anyone has any idea?
I am reluctant to trust Istock... big surprise. In their Photo+ explanation, they definitely put a lot of emphasis on this 6 months lock-in. As if they about to reveal something else after enough people lock in their files there. Or am I being paranoid?
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I am not sure why they require the files to be locked-in for 6 months in this collection. Anyone has any idea?
Maybe just to stop people changing their minds constantly and confusing buyers even more. I can't think of another reason.
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I am not sure why they require the files to be locked-in for 6 months in this collection. Anyone has any idea?
I am reluctant to trust Istock... big surprise. In their Photo+ explanation, they definitely put a lot of emphasis on this 6 months lock-in. As if they about to reveal something else after enough people lock in their files there. Or am I being paranoid?
You can be forgiven for being paranoid with Istock __ due to their recent history we all are. I think the lock-in however is simply to stop contributors from changing their minds. I beleive it has always been the same for Exc+.
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You don't have to like it or opt in, but at least you have one more option, don't you? I don't understand why it sounds so bad to some.
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I am not sure why they require the files to be locked-in for 6 months in this collection. Anyone has any idea?
I am reluctant to trust Istock... big surprise. In their Photo+ explanation, they definitely put a lot of emphasis on this 6 months lock-in. As if they about to reveal something else after enough people lock in their files there. Or am I being paranoid?
Nope, not paranoid. Your reasoning makes perfect sense to me. I was almost taken in by their "preserve your canister" scam. Some little voice in the back of my mind said let's wait and see. I am glad I listened to that intuition.
With Istock, there's always another shoe about to drop.
I am not sure why they require the files to be locked-in for 6 months in this collection. Anyone has any idea?
Maybe just to stop people changing their minds constantly and confusing buyers even more. I can't think of another reason.
I would bet there's some other reason for the lockin. Just because it hasn't been revealed yet doesn't mean it's not coming.
My guess is that all images opted in to P+ will automatically go to the PP. For those of you with images on PP anyway it's probably no big deal, but for those of us who have stayed out of the PP, that would be a sticking point.
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I am not sure why they require the files to be locked-in for 6 months in this collection. Anyone has any idea?
Maybe just to stop people changing their minds constantly and confusing buyers even more. I can't think of another reason.
And the problem is that istock gives plenty of reasons to change one's mind on a daily/weekly basis. There does seem to be a lot of contributors that stand by IS no matter what, so for those contributors I guess the six-month lock is moot.
A lot of folks seem to think that IS is being prepped for a sale. And a lot of folks seem to think that the big swing is towards moving those who qualify over to midstock and the rest to Thinkstock. So, if that's the case, this latest scheme just to be some sort of short-term, stop-gap, desperation move to infuse yet more capital. To me, it doesn't seem like it should be viewed as any sort of long-term goal for non-exclusives, especially with istock's past and the general feeling of mistrust towards them by contributors. Just my 2 cents.
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Being paranoid or not, what else is there to lose at iStock?
We finally moved on, accepting the fact that this awesome iStock we once knew has become something else.
As a newbie or hobby contributor I'd have left them a long time ago but like other long time contributors I cannot afford to leave, no matter if they give me 15%, 10% or 5% commission.
I still would be making more there than at most other sites. What am I supposed to do? Tell my wife that we can't afford health insurance anymore because of my pride?
I opted a few files in and see what happens. With the downward trend so many have talked about (I repeat), what else is there to lose?
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I am not sure why they require the files to be locked-in for 6 months in this collection. Anyone has any idea?
Maybe just to stop people changing their minds constantly and confusing buyers even more. I can't think of another reason.
I would bet there's some other reason for the lockin. Just because it hasn't been revealed yet doesn't mean it's not coming.
My guess is that all images opted in to P+ will automatically go to the PP. For those of you with images on PP anyway it's probably no big deal, but for those of us who have stayed out of the PP, that would be a sticking point.
Why would you think that? Surely if anything like that were contemplated, it would be more likely that images NOT in P+ would be put in the PP?
I don't see any reason to suppose any such thing myself. The 6 month lock-in applied to E+ as well, I'd agree with Baldrick and his trousers, it's just for a little stability. And God knows, they need a little stability...
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My guess is that the images are going to made available the Getty site. That would explain the sudden appearance of the G.I. sales button and the emphasis on the the lock in.
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Having given this some thought I believe this is a win-win opportunity for independent contributors.
Price-wise our P+ images will be no more expensive than all basic exclusive images and the evidence we have suggests that buyers aren't particularly sensitive at that level.
I'm sorting My Uploads by DL/month and, with a few exceptions, moving most of my best-sellers over to P+. At the very least I'm hoping that the gain in higher-priced sales will offset the 10% reduction in commission I had in January. It is usually the case that 60% of a contributor's sales will come from just 10% of their portfolio so having those all P+ should make a big difference to income.
Not only that but we should gain additional RC's too. More to the point you could be putting yourself at a significant disadvantage RC-wise if you don't take this opportunity and most others do.
I'm struggling to cope with the concept that we have apparently just had some good news from Istock but at the moment I can't see a downside to P+.
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I'm going to go for it and move files into the P+ category. I have a full time job so it doesn't matter if I get more or less sales. Already sold one of my top sellers that was moved into P+ last night so I'm hoping for the best and hope to see improvement in overall sales soon.
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I also think that this may be positive.. I have placed a few of mine so far (not that I have big sales but why not trying..) but we do need to actually think of some because a buyer can go to look in cheaper pics, maybe not.. But I do believe that pictures that have less competition should be all photo +
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You guys are very persuasive :)
I am going to lay down my natural skepticism and add some P+ files.
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You guys are very persuasive :)
I am going to lay down my natural skepticism and add some P+ files.
Lisa, I know how you feel.
I'm still removing my port a few at a time. The way I'm going it'll take another year and a half to get them all gone, and of course I'm deleting the non- and slow sellers first. So I can't see any harm in moving some better sellers to P+. I wouldn't get to them for removal until long after the six months is up. Unless of course they decide that that's the wrong timeframe and up it to a year or more. But they wouldn't do that. They wouldn't, would they? :P
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I went from making about $500 a month on IS to right around $100. So, for me, it's worth the gamble. My IS earnings are so pathetic, what's the risk, really? I doubt it'll make me much - if any - more, but what the heck. I'll throw a few files in. These days, if anyone buys anything from me via IS it's a miracle.
That said, am I excited about this new program? No. For many reasons others have already outlined.
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I moved 68 files over, but on next try, I got an "Unfortunately, we are unable to move this file into the desired collection. Please try again later."
Is there a 68 file cap?
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I moved 68 files over, but on next try, I got an "Unfortunately, we are unable to move this file into the desired collection. Please try again later."
Is there a 68 file cap?
How many files you are allowed is listed at the top right of the page where you opt images in. Perhaps 68 images was your max?
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Forgive the cross post, but here are my concerns about this:
...
I would need to know more about best match placement before considering putting anything in P+. ...
Trouble is, even if you're questions were answered, you couldn't trust them. Not in the 'old meaning' of trusting them, at least.
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donīt know I had 78 so I had 10% of my port.. all in, getting excited to see how it goes, worst perhaps donīt care
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I sorted my images by my best sellers and added a selection to the Photos+ collection. I also took a screen shot of their current downloads/day so I can compare in a month or two to see if it has changed for the worse or better. Then I'll decide what to do with other images.
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I'm still removing my port a few at a time. The way I'm going it'll take another year and a half to get them all gone, and of course I'm deleting the non- and slow sellers first. So I can't see any harm in moving some better sellers to P+. I wouldn't get to them for removal until long after the six months is up. Unless of course they decide that that's the wrong time frame and up it to a year or more. But they wouldn't do that. They wouldn't, would they? :P
As far as I know, you can still deactivate E+ files if you choose to. If you thrown in the crown, your E+'s soon go to base. So I'm pretty sure your files wouldn't be tied in if you wanted to leave altogether. Unless they change the rules on a whim, which happens a lot. E&OE.
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I have opted in just a few best sellers and some other images that don't have that much competition, since they're very specific, so the buyer in reality doesn't have the choice to buy the lower priced image. We'll see how that works out. :)
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I still don't see the icon that the admin who announced this program said would identify images in the P+ program. I see "Stock photo +" on the detail page and some have the new pricing, but others have the words but not the new prices.
Does anyone see it?
Without an identifier that shows the price, aren't we just setting things up for another round of complaints from buyers who feel ambushed by the price hike? They had images in their lightbox, carefully selected because they were all non-exclusive and now suddenly the price has doubled...?
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I still don't see the icon that the admin who announced this program said would identify images in the P+ program. I see "Stock photo +" on the detail page and some have the new pricing, but others have the words but not the new prices.
Does anyone see it?
Without an identifier that shows the price, aren't we just setting things up for another round of complaints from buyers who feel ambushed by the price hike? They had images in their lightbox, carefully selected because they were all non-exclusive and now suddenly the price has doubled...?
The "Stock Photo +" text is about as obscure as it can get. If people aren't noticing the camera, they are certainly not going to see (or even know what) the '+' means. Another epic fail by iStock. Anyone want to add it to the other thread?
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I sorted my images by my best sellers and added a selection to the Photos+ collection. I also took a screen shot of their current downloads/day so I can compare in a month or two to see if it has changed for the worse or better. Then I'll decide what to do with other images.
Yep, similar to what I did. I'll give it three months and try to see is there a trend with DLs/month for "normal" images and the ones added to the collection and try to see if there is a difference and if it's statistically significant.
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I threw a few average sellers but included one best seller - lets see how it goes...
This is kind of interesting, from the photo + selection window: "Some of your files may have already been moved into Photo+ by our inspectors or admins. The six-month lock does not apply to these files and you can remove them immediately by un-checking the box below."
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I still don't see the icon that the admin who announced this program said would identify images in the P+ program. I see "Stock photo +" on the detail page and some have the new pricing, but others have the words but not the new prices.
Does anyone see it?
Without an identifier that shows the price, aren't we just setting things up for another round of complaints from buyers who feel ambushed by the price hike? They had images in their lightbox, carefully selected because they were all non-exclusive and now suddenly the price has doubled...?
Has there been any indication that they care what (?a few?) buyers think?
Seems like the P+ and png introduction are the 'suggestions of the week', implemented without preamble to contributors or buyers.
This seems to be the modus operandi.
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I threw a few average sellers but included one best seller - lets see how it goes...
This is kind of interesting, from the photo + selection window: "Some of your files may have already been moved into Photo+ by our inspectors or admins. The six-month lock does not apply to these files and you can remove them immediately by un-checking the box below."
They did that when they introduced Exc+. If you had nominated a file for Vetta but it was rejected as Vetta, it was imediately ingested to Exc+, but you could take it out if you wanted at any time. If you added any yourself, they were locked in for the six months, if you were still exclusive.
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I sorted my images by my best sellers and added a selection to the Photos+ collection. I also took a screen shot of their current downloads/day so I can compare in a month or two to see if it has changed for the worse or better. Then I'll decide what to do with other images.
This is really good thinking. I will do the same.
Looks like I can add over 1k to the Photos+ collection. I'm not that brave. I will probably put in a few hundred and see what happens.
Kind of nervous, though, because I have put a lot of my best sellers in there. If this destroys my sales I will be so pi$$ed!
If doubling prices on FT and higher level prices on DT are any indication, simply going up to regular exclusive collection prices shouldn't cause too big a drop in sales. But with all the shenanigans at IS I hope this isn't the last straw for some remaining price-sensitive buyers.
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I am not sure why they require the files to be locked-in for 6 months in this collection. Anyone has any idea?
I am reluctant to trust Istock... big surprise. In their Photo+ explanation, they definitely put a lot of emphasis on this 6 months lock-in. As if they about to reveal something else after enough people lock in their files there. Or am I being paranoid?
Nope, not paranoid. Your reasoning makes perfect sense to me. I was almost taken in by their "preserve your canister" scam. Some little voice in the back of my mind said let's wait and see. I am glad I listened to that intuition.
With Istock, there's always another shoe about to drop.
I am not sure why they require the files to be locked-in for 6 months in this collection. Anyone has any idea?
Maybe just to stop people changing their minds constantly and confusing buyers even more. I can't think of another reason.
I would bet there's some other reason for the lockin. Just because it hasn't been revealed yet doesn't mean it's not coming.
My guess is that all images opted in to P+ will automatically go to the PP. For those of you with images on PP anyway it's probably no big deal, but for those of us who have stayed out of the PP, that would be a sticking point.
Yes! sigh. there is always and have always been a method behind the madness and this is one of them.
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You guys are very persuasive :)
I am going to lay down my natural skepticism and add some P+ files.
Im not and frankly I dont really care about this IS business anymore, yeah you might earn a bit more but thats just about it. Im trying to cut a deal here, moving over most of the industry shots from IS to RF and for a really good percentage as well.
Be careful though your shots doesnt end up in the PP or whatever, you should look out for this 6 months lock-up, doesnt make sense.
take care Christian
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I now see a Photos plus icon - this is what I posted in the IS thread. Doesn't look to me as if they've really thought this through.
The reason I think this matters is that buyers need to be able to look at files and see what price things fall into. The ability to choose collections in search is important, but so is the visual confirmation shown with the thumb in search results
So now I see a new icon in the iStock firmament here (http://www.istockphoto.com/icons.php). The Photos+ icon is separate from the file type icons - it's listed with the crown and other collections icons.
(a) I don't see this show up on images that are already showing Photo+ pricing
(b) Will images in P+ have both a camera icon and a camera+ icon?
(c) If the P+ images will have only one icon - camera with a plus - then wouldn't it be logical to have E+ images switch to a camera with a plus as well (and drop the plus on the crown)?
It just seems that the iconography is getting so complex - with file types that have a color to designate collection; file types with an add on that designate a collection; but then one collection (E+) doesn't change the file type at all?
As Vetta will now come to video and illustrations, I assume those file type icons will be changing color too? If E+ extends to video and illustrations you could continue with the crown and a plus. If P+ extends to I+ and V+ in the future (for independent video and illustrations in a "Plus" collection) will you then have little pluses on the pen and the TV?
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I now see a Photos plus icon - this is what I posted in the IS thread. Doesn't look to me as if they've really thought this through.
The reason I think this matters is that buyers need to be able to look at files and see what price things fall into. The ability to choose collections in search is important, but so is the visual confirmation shown with the thumb in search results
So now I see a new icon in the iStock firmament here ([url]http://www.istockphoto.com/icons.php[/url]). The Photos+ icon is separate from the file type icons - it's listed with the crown and other collections icons.
I don't see an icon. It's a blank space. Nor do I see an icon for Vetta Video. Weird.
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I see a blank space as well.
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This is what I see:
(http://digitalbristles.com/temp/p-plus.jpg)
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I'd label that a fail. You can barely see the '+'. Couldn't they have picked a little lighter color?
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I wonder if the reason this rollout is so scattered is that after KK said that only .1% were seriously affected and that people had calmed down they quick needed a diversion so they brought this up early...
Although looking at all their other problems lately I suppose this is nothing special.
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that's what I dont get. is it my imagination or don't they usually announce these things a little farther ahead of time and tell us when it's going live and what we need to do to get ready?
I don't frequent the IS forums much these days at all but didn't this just get announced the day it launched? weird.
as for the icon.. it is probably a cache issue as I recall a lot of people saw blank spaces when they added the exlusive+ icon too.
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cut on royalties back in September (a few months early announced) this one is just insane, we wake up and see this but this time looks like IS is going to share some of his greediness!
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I'd label that a fail. You can barely see the '+'. Couldn't they have picked a little lighter color?
+1that's what I dont get. is it my imagination or don't they usually announce these things a little farther ahead of time and tell us when it's going live and what we need to do to get ready?
I don't frequent the IS forums much these days at all but didn't this just get announced the day it launched? weird.
+ another 1
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as for the icon.. it is probably a cache issue as I recall a lot of people saw blank spaces when they added the exlusive+ icon too.
Why do they seem to have so many caching issues.
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as for the icon.. it is probably a cache issue as I recall a lot of people saw blank spaces when they added the exlusive+ icon too.
Why do they seem to have so many caching issues.
cash or cache.. it has something to do with sustainability, doesn't it?
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Just checked in and saw that I've had several P+ sales already this afternoon. Doesn't look like the price point (equal with exclusive regular) is a deterrent.
Also, sorting my personal lightboxes by best match, looks like the P+ images have some advantage. I am not positive about this because I added a lot of my best DL/mo. sellers to P+, so that might account for the best match placement.
In general searches, though, I notice that V/A don't seem, as dominant in the front pages today.
Or maybe it's all just wishful thinking :-\
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Snip
In general searches, though, I notice that V/A don't seem, as dominant in the front pages today.
Or maybe it's all just wishful thinking :-\
I think the best match has been tweaked to a more reasonable mix. I was helping someone today learn the ropes of how to search (by NOT using best match) and when I showed her the results of best match vs downloads, etc. the first couple of pages were not as heavy on V+A files.
I would like to think that IS was listening to the complaints of both contribs and buyers. Any other theories? Or am I just deluded?
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I think this sounds like higher RC targets in the make ("all is going so well and we keep growing, whooyay, therefore we must..yadayada").
Opted a couple in nevertheless; like many here i dont have to lose much anymore either since sales dried up mostly anyways.
If this turns out to be a nasty PP - TS trick my portfolio will be gone lightning fast.
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I just made the decision to opt in about 500 files to photos+, out of a possible 800. These are a lot of my best sellers. Given that sales on IS seem to be in freefall, I figure this surely can't do any more harm.. ??? I guess it all depends on the best match placement.
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I wonder if the reason this rollout is so scattered is that after KK said that only .1% were seriously affected and that people had calmed down they quick needed a diversion so they brought this up early...
Although looking at all their other problems lately I suppose this is nothing special.
I'd wondered that, too. In a way that would be the most benign explanation. It is transparently obvious that this was rushed out with scarcely any preparation at all. Bits of "Exclusive +" wording have just been cut and pasted so hurriedly that they didn't think to replace the word "exclusive collection" with "main collection", the sidebar now lists GI sales and the link to photos+ says "exclusive+", so that must have been pasted from the exclusives' code.
It was announced by somebody who never makes announcements - presumably because of the London jolly - without going through the normal process of putting it in the announcements section and I've not been notified in any other way, so presumably 95% of submitters have no idea that anything happened.
All this suggests a panicked knee-jerk reaction to something, so if it wasn't the C-net public relations blunder, what was it? The April sales thread? Pressure from the top to "for God's sake, do something to get the profits back on track and do it NOW"? Something else?
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I would like to think that IS was listening to the complaints of both contribs and buyers. Any other theories? Or am I just deluded?
I am less optimistic, and think they are just realising they are losing money - anyway if result is the same... it's fine
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I have just opted-in, 100 files, good sellers and all. I mean seriously, Im against it but what the heck, it cant get any worse? or at least thats what I keep telling myself.
Funny going through ones own shots really, I am actually a great photographer!! possibly the best! well at least among the 3 best, globally I mean.
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I have just opted-in, 100 files, good sellers and all. I mean seriously, Im against it but what the heck, it cant get any worse? or at least thats what I keep telling myself.
Funny going through ones own shots really, I am actually a great photographer!! possibly the best! well at least among the 3 best, globally I mean.
You too? Welcome to the club! :D
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I have just opted-in, 100 files, good sellers and all. I mean seriously, Im against it but what the heck, it cant get any worse? or at least thats what I keep telling myself.
Funny going through ones own shots really, I am actually a great photographer!! possibly the best! well at least among the 3 best, globally I mean.
You too? Welcome to the club! :D
I'm the third one!
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:D
Dang! All three slots were already taken when I got here... :D
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:D
Dang! All three slots were already taken when I got here... :D
nah, you are welcome to creep in between me and the others, I am reserving the 1.5, slot for Lisa! :D
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OK, thanks. I'll take 2.75 ;) :D
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:D
Dang! All three slots were already taken when I got here... :D
Hey, you can have my slot. In fact I am really a painter masquerading as a good photographer.
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Funny going through ones own shots really, I am actually a great photographer!! possibly the best! well at least among the 3 best, globally I mean.
Camera equipment companies must be falling over themselves just to get you to sign with them :o
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Funny going through ones own shots really, I am actually a great photographer!! possibly the best!
Yeah, I know, I think you've been telling us that all along.
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Yep! I got Haselblad, Nikon, Canon, Mamiya, Sinar, Linhoff, *, the list is endless, wanting to sponsor my ventures , bit I turned them all down in favor of jumping on Commercial Directing insted, turns out they want to hire me for Gladiator-2.
Now I cant turn that down, can I ?
PS/
I am actually joiking around, in case anybody should take all this mumbo-jumbo seriously. :P
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A lot of push back here.
PS Of course we know you were kidding . . . . . . . . right?
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If I was a interested buyer, I would surely verify on Shutterstock if I can find the same file for cheaper.
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I think this sounds like higher RC targets in the make ("all is going so well and we keep growing, whooyay, therefore we must..yadayada").
Opted a couple in nevertheless; like many here i dont have to lose much anymore either since sales dried up mostly anyways.
If this turns out to be a nasty PP - TS trick my portfolio will be gone lightning fast.
I agree. It is possible that they are paving the way for higher RC targets and soften the blow. Perhaps that's why they have not announced the new RC numbers.
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All this suggests a panicked knee-jerk reaction to something, so if it wasn't the C-net public relations blunder, what was it? The April sales thread? Pressure from the top to "for God's sake, do something to get the profits back on track and do it NOW"? Something else?
I suspect it must be the latter. I don't think they care about grumbling contributors but they do care about the bottom line __ big time. Basically it is a back-door way of imposing yet another price increase on customers, probably hoping that most of them won't notice.
If overall sales are falling, as most of us suspect, then it has very serious implications for any upcoming sale of the business. The P+ change goes entirely against previous policy and the justification for charging more for exclusive images. Totally. It also makes it less attractive to remain/become exclusive and more attractive to be independent. If enough customers do notice then the plan could really backfire. Sales then falling further would result in more crowns being abandoned ... and the downwards spiral ever accelerating.
On the positive side I've P+'d the top selling 10% of my portfolio and have been got plenty of immediate sales at the new higher prices. I think this could easily add 20% or more to monthly earnings if sales remain stable.
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If I was a interested buyer, I would surely verify on Shutterstock if I can find the same file for cheaper.
thatīs a good one, I guess IS should be only open for exclusives!
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nah, you are welcome to creep in between me and the others, I am reserving the 1.5, slot for Lisa! :D
LOL! I knew I liked you Chris! Thanks for putting me in such lofty company ;D
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On the positive side I've P+'d the top selling 10% of my portfolio and have been got plenty of immediate sales at the new higher prices. I think this could easily add 20% or more to monthly earnings if sales remain stable.
Same experience here. Spent yesterday P+ing about 10% of my port - mostly best sellers or things I considered outstanding but undiscovered. Have already sold more than a dozen or so just Friday afternoon and Saturday morning. The higher prices make a big difference. $3.45 for a large and $2.70 for medium is very welcome!
I have some more slots available. Didn't want to go hog wild right off the bat. After a month or so of seeing where sales go I may use those additional slots.
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Is there any more info on this Photo+ thing other than the message in the forum? I just want to be sure that the 6-month lock-in doesn't come with a catch that I'm failing to see.
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Is there any more info on this Photo+ thing other than the message in the forum? I just want to be sure that the 6-month lock-in doesn't come with a catch that I'm failing to see.
That's it, and it wasn't even that detailed when it was first posted :)
E+ has been around for a while and as they're modeling so much of P+ on E+ (including all the mistakes in P+ when they didn't edit what they copied for descriptive text and including the bugs in files sometimes not repricing) there aren't any gotchas other than what happens to a file in best match placement if sales don't keep pace over time.
Some people have had great success with E+ and others view it as a total disaster - I think it probably has to do with how you pick the files. For those who've had some E+ sales, but not the same amount as before, even though the money is good, the best match position erodes over time because of the lower sales. In time, the lower best match position reduces the overall $$ the file earns and isn't compensated for by the initial boost in higher royalties.
It's possible that IS is going to make the partner program mandatory at some point, but I don't think P+ will have anything to do with that one way or the other.
Even with E+, you can deactivate the file any time you want, so the "lock" isn't quite the same as DT's 6 month lock on content.
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E+ has been around for a while and as they're modeling so much of P+ on E+ (including all the mistakes in P+ when they didn't edit what they copied for descriptive text and including the bugs in files sometimes not repricing) there aren't any gotchas other than what happens to a file in best match placement if sales don't keep pace over time.
Good to know how things have gone with E+. Thanks for sharing that. :)
I am hoping that the P+ files don't face as much price resistance as the E+ ones did, because the prices are still in line with the very lowest exclusive prices. Comparing the prices of my newly assigned P+ images to what they cost on other sites - DT, FT, etc., they are still extremely reasonable. Same top sellers would cost considerably more at DT, but they still sell there.
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Thanks JoAnne. Very useful info. :)
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Snip
In general searches, though, I notice that V/A don't seem, as dominant in the front pages today.
Or maybe it's all just wishful thinking :-\
I would like to think that IS was listening to the complaints of both contribs and buyers. Any other theories? Or am I just deluded?
Listening to complaints? Have you packed your bags? Cuz you're going to fantasy land.
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A girl can dream, can't she? ...sigh...
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Listening to complaints? Have you packed your bags? Cuz you're going to fantasy land.
;D
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On the positive side I've P+'d the top selling 10% of my portfolio and have been got plenty of immediate sales at the new higher prices. I think this could easily add 20% or more to monthly earnings if sales remain stable.
Same experience here. Spent yesterday P+ing about 10% of my port - mostly best sellers or things I considered outstanding but undiscovered. Have already sold more than a dozen or so just Friday afternoon and Saturday morning. The higher prices make a big difference. $3.45 for a large and $2.70 for medium is very welcome
So this is a good thing after all?
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You guys are very persuasive :)
I am going to lay down my natural skepticism and add some P+ files.
@made aide
Yep. I think we convinced Lisa at around post 67 ;)
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On the positive side I've P+'d the top selling 10% of my portfolio and have been got plenty of immediate sales at the new higher prices. I think this could easily add 20% or more to monthly earnings if sales remain stable.
Same experience here. Spent yesterday P+ing about 10% of my port - mostly best sellers or things I considered outstanding but undiscovered. Have already sold more than a dozen or so just Friday afternoon and Saturday morning. The higher prices make a big difference. $3.45 for a large and $2.70 for medium is very welcome
So this is a good thing after all?
I think so too... good for non-exclusives because their income should go up; good for exclusives because it makes dropping exclusivity even more attractive ;D
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Can somebody explain this to me...
Is it way to put image exclusively and ONLY on IS, or possibility for non-exclusive contributors to make prices higher for their photos and also you can have same photos on other sites???
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Can somebody explain this to me...
Is it way to put image exclusively and ONLY on IS, or possibility for non-exclusive contributors to make prices higher for their photos and also you can have same photos on other sites???
You can make more AND keep the same photos on other sites.
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borg, thanks for asking that question - I couldn't figure it out either and felt too dumb to ask. :)
So the idea is we agree to higher prices for our image, and a six month commitment for those images, and we accept the risk that this might reduce sales? And IS maybe - just maybe - gives you better search placement - no guarantee, and of course it all seems to be changing by the hour - is that all correct?
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Yup! they are beginning to sell! and thats on a bloody Sunday.
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borg, thanks for asking that question - I couldn't figure it out either and felt too dumb to ask. :)
So the idea is we agree to higher prices for our image, and a six month commitment for those images, and we accept the risk that this might reduce sales? And IS maybe - just maybe - gives you better search placement - no guarantee, and of course it all seems to be changing by the hour - is that all correct?
yes, that sounds correct.
and just to be clear about the exclusive thing. The images in the Photo+ collection are not exclusive in any way. They are just regular images from a non-exclusive photographer that the photographer decides are better than the rest for some reason and wants to double the prices. Nothing more.
iStock has no image exclusive options. Photographers must be entirely (for their royalty free images) exclusive or not exclusive at all.
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I used to have "Exclusive+" files on IS, what happen is this: (Higher price with less downloads=Lower price with more downloads)
The first three months, they bring more money, then the total amount of downloads (and the best match rank) get lower, and it give the same money as the regular photos.
So I removed everyones of them...
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What would be the explanation for these sales? Was there any promotion for buyers?
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I used to have "Exclusive+" files on IS, what happen is this: (Higher price with less downloads=Lower price with more downloads)
The first three months, they bring more money, then the total amount of downloads (and the best match rank) get lower, and it give the same money as the regular photos.
So I removed everyones of them...
But what about when Exclusive prices were introduced at the beginning of 2010 (which P+ is the equivalent of). There wasn't much evidence of buyer resistence then as far as I recall. Maybe IS have hit the 'sweet spot' with Exc/P+ pricing?
Exc+ may just have been too much too soon, especially after a series of other increases and introductions of 'new collections'.
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Trouble is, the best match has to tweaked a bit in favour, or else we wont notice too much differance, long term that is. Now in the beginning, buyers might just be curious.
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borg, thanks for asking that question - I couldn't figure it out either and felt too dumb to ask. :)
No problemo!
Perhaps I am a bit dumber, so I asked why ... ;D ;)
P.S.
ŧ
If you go to Aspen with small motorcycle....!? We can go together, as "dumb and dumber" ... :P :D
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I'm thinking this probably doesn't make sense unless we're promised better search placement - and of course there would be no way to verify whether we even got it.
I'm sure that if IS thought that this plan would boost their numbers and actually cut ours, they'd still be pushing it.
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I'm thinking this probably doesn't make sense unless we're promised better search placement - and of course there would be no way to verify whether we even got it.
I'm sure that if IS thought that this plan would boost their numbers and actually cut ours, they'd still be pushing it.
How can it increase istock's profits without increasing the profits for the photographers?
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I'm thinking this probably doesn't make sense unless we're promised better search placement - and of course there would be no way to verify whether we even got it.
I'm sure that if IS thought that this plan would boost their numbers and actually cut ours, they'd still be pushing it.
How can it increase istock's profits without increasing the profits for the photographers?
Oh, I have no idea. I was just making the point that there's no reason to assume IS even cares if we'd benefit. Maybe they want to reduce the price spread between vetta/exclusives and the rest of us peasants so their plan to push the high-priced stuff meets less resistance. Maybe, like Buzbuzzer says, it boosts the short term at the expense of the long term. I would just look at anything they offer contributors right now with the highest degree of suspicion.
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I'm thinking this probably doesn't make sense unless we're promised better search placement - and of course there would be no way to verify whether we even got it.
I'm sure that if IS thought that this plan would boost their numbers and actually cut ours, they'd still be pushing it.
How can it increase istock's profits without increasing the profits for the photographers?
A buyer realises Photo+ costs more than regular.
Either he/she buys image anyway, or buys another image from another contributor.
As a result some photographers earn more, some less - but IS wins on average.
Furthermore - should they decide to push Photo+ in search - they pay a non-exclusive percentage for an high price image - IS wins again.
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A buyer realises Photo+ costs more than regular.
Either he/she buys image anyway, or buys another image from another contributor.
As a result some photographers earn more, some less - but IS wins on average.
letīs think a little, 15% IS are exclusives, how many files in there?? 1/4 of all collection? buyers are used to exclusives files and their price so I guess they wonīt noticed that much unless they have lightboxes of pictures they want to buy or a really looking for cheaper ones (not that easy) unless they travel along pages as we know exclusives are on the first pages (not saying they donīt deserve, heck they deserve!)
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with Photo+, without Photo+ .... sales on Istock suck these days. I opted in some files but Istock is way behind Fotolia and Shutter for me this month. Significantly.
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I'm thinking this probably doesn't make sense unless we're promised better search placement - and of course there would be no way to verify whether we even got it.
I'm sure that if IS thought that this plan would boost their numbers and actually cut ours, they'd still be pushing it.
How can it increase istock's profits without increasing the profits for the photographers?
Oh, I have no idea. I was just making the point that there's no reason to assume IS even cares if we'd benefit. Maybe they want to reduce the price spread between vetta/exclusives and the rest of us peasants so their plan to push the high-priced stuff meets less resistance. Maybe, like Buzbuzzer says, it boosts the short term at the expense of the long term. I would just look at anything they offer contributors right now with the highest degree of suspicion.
I agree with you. I think it's a short term push and very soon the other shoe is going to fall, as in something will be taken back. Just as an example, you won't be able to deactivate any Photo+s even though they say yes now (from what I understand...haven't actually seen that in writing...haven't looked either) or all those photos automatically go to TS, or something sucky.
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Some of the files that I opted in for Photo+ don't show updated prices. The checkbox is checked (so I can't re-add them), but they are not showing under Photo+ ... Is this the bug people were talking about? Is there a workaround for it?
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Some of the files that I opted in for Photo+ don't show updated prices. The checkbox is checked (so I can't re-add them), but they are not showing under Photo+ ... Is this the bug people were talking about? Is there a workaround for it?
there was something on the iStock forums about that. said that you need to go to the admin area for the file then hit the "save" button and it shoudl work. try that - I am not yet opting any in so can't verify it for you.
here's the istock thread:
http://www.istockphoto.com/forum_messages.php?threadid=328522&messageid=6373046 (http://www.istockphoto.com/forum_messages.php?threadid=328522&messageid=6373046)
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Mine started to show after 24+ hours, I guess it's the usual caching problem due to sync between servers
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Well Ive had plenty of P+ sales from morning up till now. Dont get it? why would they suddenly buy more expensive when they were hard pressed buying the ordinary? and I cant see any best match tweak?
I mean it great! just pondering over this.
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Well Ive had plenty of P+ sales from morning up till now. Dont get it? why would they suddenly buy more expensive when they were hard pressed buying the ordinary? and I cant see any best match tweak?
I mean it great! just pondering over this.
Me too. P+ selling very well, even over the weekend!
I assume it is because those were my best sellers and were selling anyway, but I didn't pay so much attention when they were mixed in with 6k other photos in my portfolio. Now I am paying attention to those files and noticing when they sell.
I'll say this for Istock. If income continues to pick up due to P+, I will feel less inclined to be critical of them (until the next disaster). More money in my account takes a lot of the fight out of me. YES, I CAN be bought!! ;D
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Some of the files that I opted in for Photo+ don't show updated prices. The checkbox is checked (so I can't re-add them), but they are not showing under Photo+ ... Is this the bug people were talking about? Is there a workaround for it?
there was something on the iStock forums about that. said that you need to go to the admin area for the file then hit the "save" button and it shoudl work. try that - I am not yet opting any in so can't verify it for you.
here's the istock thread:
[url]http://www.istockphoto.com/forum_messages.php?threadid=328522&messageid=6373046[/url] ([url]http://www.istockphoto.com/forum_messages.php?threadid=328522&messageid=6373046[/url])
YES this did work. Thank you very much for the info.
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Some of the files that I opted in for Photo+ don't show updated prices. The checkbox is checked (so I can't re-add them), but they are not showing under Photo+ ... Is this the bug people were talking about? Is there a workaround for it?
there was something on the iStock forums about that. said that you need to go to the admin area for the file then hit the "save" button and it shoudl work. try that - I am not yet opting any in so can't verify it for you.
here's the istock thread:
[url]http://www.istockphoto.com/forum_messages.php?threadid=328522&messageid=6373046[/url] ([url]http://www.istockphoto.com/forum_messages.php?threadid=328522&messageid=6373046[/url])
YES this did work. Thank you very much for the info.
that's great. I just may try it out later this week. I'm still trying to decide if I want to be locked in for 6 months or not.
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I was looking through my portfolio and decided that my "istock exclusive images" I will put into the photo+ and see how they do. these are all the images that I took at the several minilypses that I've attended. any image taken at an istock-sponsored minilypse is exclusive to istock - even though they don't really have an 'exclusive image' category at istock, this is something that you agree to when you sign the release forms to attend an istock-sponsored minilypse. I dont really have a problem with that personally. :)
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I still have some time to think about this - and see how others are doing - but it might be a good idea (a) to do what you did with the 'lypse images which can't be anywhere else and (b) soften the blow a little of the cut in both price and commission by putting some proven sellers that I don't think have obvious on-site competition.
I can rationalize it with respect to buyers by thinking that they can easily get the files elsewhere if they wish and the files aren't any more expensive than they are now (as exclusive files) :)
Edited to add that JJRD just locked a thread in the exclusive forum asking about the (long-ago promised) boost in best match placement for E+ images. In the way he said that it would be coming when they were good and ready and that contributors had to realize that this recent best match change was the biggest they'd ever made, he tacitly acknowledged that there hasn't been any E+ boost yet.
Given how long ago E+ was introduced (at which point this boost in search placement was promised) his comments that some contributors expected things to happen with the flick of a switch seems disingenuous to me - being impatient over one year later (E+ was introduced in April 2010) is hardly expecting things with the flick of a switch.
Bottom line: don't base any decision about putting files into P+ on an assumption of improved search results placement.
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I still have some time to think about this - and see how others are doing - but it might be a good idea (a) to do what you did with the 'lypse images which can't be anywhere else and (b) soften the blow a little of the cut in both price and commission by putting some proven sellers that I don't think have obvious on-site competition.
I can rationalize it with respect to buyers by thinking that they can easily get the files elsewhere if they wish and the files aren't any more expensive than they are now (as exclusive files) :)
Edited to add that JJRD just locked a thread in the exclusive forum asking about the (long-ago promised) boost in best match placement for E+ images. In the way he said that it would be coming when they were good and ready and that contributors had to realize that this recent best match change was the biggest they'd ever made, he tacitly acknowledged that there hasn't been any E+ boost yet.
Given how long ago E+ was introduced (at which point this boost in search placement was promised) his comments that some contributors expected things to happen with the flick of a switch seems disingenuous to me - being impatient over one year later (E+ was introduced in April 2010) is hardly expecting things with the flick of a switch.
Bottom line: don't base any decision about putting files into P+ on an assumption of improved search results placement.
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Bottom bottom line: Don't take anything JJRD ever says at face value :-\
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Some of the files that I opted in for Photo+ don't show updated prices. The checkbox is checked (so I can't re-add them), but they are not showing under Photo+ ... Is this the bug people were talking about? Is there a workaround for it?
there was something on the iStock forums about that. said that you need to go to the admin area for the file then hit the "save" button and it shoudl work. try that - I am not yet opting any in so can't verify it for you.
here's the istock thread:
[url]http://www.istockphoto.com/forum_messages.php?threadid=328522&messageid=6373046[/url] ([url]http://www.istockphoto.com/forum_messages.php?threadid=328522&messageid=6373046[/url])
Give it another 24 hours and the new price will kick in.
As for Cathy's idea that they could suddenly decide never to let the files out again - I think that would be illegal unless we were notified and given the chance to remove them at the point where the new policy was announced.
One crowdsourced website tried to screw me with "new rules" they hadn't informed me about but they backpedalled super-fast once I got heavy with them. It ended up with the site owner emailing me direct and agreeing that the rules I signed up to applied, not those that had been brought in a year or two ago.
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Well Ive had plenty of P+ sales from morning up till now. Dont get it? why would they suddenly buy more expensive when they were hard pressed buying the ordinary? and I cant see any best match tweak?
I mean it great! just pondering over this.
Me too. P+ selling very well, even over the weekend!
I assume it is because those were my best sellers and were selling anyway, but I didn't pay so much attention when they were mixed in with 6k other photos in my portfolio. Now I am paying attention to those files and noticing when they sell.
I'll say this for Istock. If income continues to pick up due to P+, I will feel less inclined to be critical of them (until the next disaster). More money in my account takes a lot of the fight out of me. YES, I CAN be bought!! ;D
Only trouble is, our better stuff would probably have sold anyway, regardless. In the long run an identical but cheaper image would probably sell more often? evens out really in my books. What do you say?
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Edited to add that JJRD just locked a thread in the exclusive forum asking about the (long-ago promised) boost in best match placement for E+ images. In the way he said that it would be coming when they were good and ready and that contributors had to realize that this recent best match change was the biggest they'd ever made, he tacitly acknowledged that there hasn't been any E+ boost yet.
Given how long ago E+ was introduced (at which point this boost in search placement was promised) his comments that some contributors expected things to happen with the flick of a switch seems disingenuous to me - being impatient over one year later (E+ was introduced in April 2010) is hardly expecting things with the flick of a switch.
... and who can blame JJRD? Don't people realise that he's been putting his donkey on the line for each and every one of us ungrateful contributors? We know this because he keeps telling us.
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I still have some time to think about this - and see how others are doing - but it might be a good idea (a) to do what you did with the 'lypse images which can't be anywhere else and (b) soften the blow a little of the cut in both price and commission by putting some proven sellers that I don't think have obvious on-site competition.
I can rationalize it with respect to buyers by thinking that they can easily get the files elsewhere if they wish and the files aren't any more expensive than they are now (as exclusive files) :)
Edited to add that JJRD just locked a thread in the exclusive forum asking about the (long-ago promised) boost in best match placement for E+ images. In the way he said that it would be coming when they were good and ready and that contributors had to realize that this recent best match change was the biggest they'd ever made, he tacitly acknowledged that there hasn't been any E+ boost yet.
Given how long ago E+ was introduced (at which point this boost in search placement was promised) his comments that some contributors expected things to happen with the flick of a switch seems disingenuous to me - being impatient over one year later (E+ was introduced in April 2010) is hardly expecting things with the flick of a switch.
Bottom line: don't base any decision about putting files into P+ on an assumption of improved search results placement.
this is the sort of stuff that really irritates me. these statements that continue to spew out of them is unbelievable. This is why I'm rarely in the forums anymore and only care about my own bottom line. (as dismal as that is after they royally screwed me with the RC system).
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I'm thinking this probably doesn't make sense unless we're promised better search placement - and of course there would be no way to verify whether we even got it.
I'm sure that if IS thought that this plan would boost their numbers and actually cut ours, they'd still be pushing it.
How can it increase istock's profits without increasing the profits for the photographers?
For now this is the way I see it. I just don't trust them.
Oh, I have no idea. I was just making the point that there's no reason to assume IS even cares if we'd benefit. Maybe they want to reduce the price spread between vetta/exclusives and the rest of us peasants so their plan to push the high-priced stuff meets less resistance. Maybe, like Buzbuzzer says, it boosts the short term at the expense of the long term. I would just look at anything they offer contributors right now with the highest degree of suspicion.
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Only trouble is, our better stuff would probably have sold anyway, regardless. In the long run an identical but cheaper image would probably sell more often? evens out really in my books. What do you say?
I could be wrong, and of course it's a gamble, but I am betting that the difference between a main collection image and a P+ image is not enough for most buyers to change their choice of image. The difference between regular exclusive and E+ might be.
Bear in mind that the same top sellers already sell at DT for higher prices than P+ on Istock, as do the images of anyone emerald or higher on FT. Even on my own site the prices are much more comparable to the P+ prices than the regular Istock ones.
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Only trouble is, our better stuff would probably have sold anyway, regardless. In the long run an identical but cheaper image would probably sell more often? evens out really in my books. What do you say?
When the price for exclusive images increased (to the same as P+ now) there was no loss of sales reported by exclusives or increase in sales of cheaper independent images.
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deleted because it's irrelevant
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i thought the best match was skewed towards price. If P+ files are the same price as regular exclusive files, wouldnt it mean that it is essentially on the same best match placement as exclusive files? anyone do some tests on this yet?
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i thought the best match was skewed towards price. If P+ files are the same price as regular exclusive files, wouldnt it mean that it is essentially on the same best match placement as exclusive files? anyone do some tests on this yet?
I would assume that. Mine are sure selling like hotcakes today. Maybe Gostwyck, the testmeister, will come through with some info...?
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Bottom line: don't base any decision about putting files into P+ on an assumption of improved search results placement.
this is the sort of stuff that really irritates me. these statements that continue to spew out of them is unbelievable. This is why I'm rarely in the forums anymore and only care about my own bottom line. (as dismal as that is after they royally screwed me with the RC system).
+1!
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Lisa my sales are low low but I had already 3 on photo+
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Lisa my sales are low low but I had already 3 on photo+
Congrats Luis! Let's see it as a hopeful sign :)
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i thought the best match was skewed towards price. If P+ files are the same price as regular exclusive files, wouldnt it mean that it is essentially on the same best match placement as exclusive files? anyone do some tests on this yet?
If this were correct, then E+ files would have a noticeable boost over regular, exclusive files. From everything I've read and seen, this has not been the case (despite the fact that it was indeed a promised benefit).
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Lisa and Gotswyck!
What would happen in this scenario? I have 8 blue flames and around 20 dark-red ones at IS, industrials, that is. Now Dreamstime is the only agency that offers " image-exclusivity" what would happen if I remove these and stick them all into Dreamstime, image-exclusivity?
Lisa is reporting great exclusivity sales at Dreamstime and so are many others. Im curious about this.
P+, is doing fine but Im still unhappy about the best match, in my categories, too much generic rubbish on first pages, you know chimneys, smoke and all that and theyre not going to tweak the best match any further, creates too much troubles.
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My sales over the last 3 days, since I bumped about 500 of my best-selling images to P+, have resulted in an RPD of $1.69. That's almost a 50% increase over my previous RPD which averaged $1.13. Very nice indeed.
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My sales over the last 3 days, since I bumped about 500 of my best-selling images to P+, have resulted in an RPD of $1.69. That's almost a 50% increase over my previous RPD which averaged $1.13. Very nice indeed.
That's excellent. Did it result in increased downloads of those images or any other obvious pattern shift ?
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That's excellent. Did it result in increased downloads of those images or any other obvious pattern shift ?
It's far too early to tell for sure but it appears that sales have continued at about the same rate. It seems that the "60-10 rule" certainly applies to my portfolio though. The vast majority of my sales are from the top-selling 10% of my port.
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i thought the best match was skewed towards price. If P+ files are the same price as regular exclusive files, wouldnt it mean that it is essentially on the same best match placement as exclusive files? anyone do some tests on this yet?
I would assume that. Mine are sure selling like hotcakes today. Maybe Gostwyck, the testmeister, will come through with some info...?
I am not the testmeister but I noticed that a couple of my best sellers which were half way in the first page for a certain word, are now in the first line for the same word. Not sure if it's due to Photo+ or other tweaks, but it's nice.
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Its too early to tell or judge anything yet. Maybe after a couple of weeks it will give us some guideline. A couple of good days means nothing, yet.
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So iStock wants contributors that contribute to multiple sites to increase their prices? That seems like a great way to drive off customers. Sure makes me wonder if the value of Exclusiveness has further decreased as I think this will decrease the number of customers that use iStock, regardless of the types of images they buy. JMHO
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Im already having second thoughts about this, so a couple of good days, so what? today apart from Photo+, some 5 buyers bought some of my oldest and in fact what i consider average stuff that hasnt been downloaded for years, files that I had forgotten about.
I dont think thats a good sign at all.
Im actually beginning to think was once was unthinkable, that IS, does suffer from lack of serious traffic and thats really the worst that could happen.
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i thought the best match was skewed towards price. If P+ files are the same price as regular exclusive files, wouldnt it mean that it is essentially on the same best match placement as exclusive files? anyone do some tests on this yet?
I would assume that. Mine are sure selling like hotcakes today. Maybe Gostwyck, the testmeister, will come through with some info...?
I am not the testmeister but I noticed that a couple of my best sellers which were half way in the first page for a certain word, are now in the first line for the same word. Not sure if it's due to Photo+ or other tweaks, but it's nice.
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Maybe Istock in its rush to get P+ out the door has inadvertantly granted the exclusive best match bonus to P+ files?
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This of course is just my opinion, but I don't find it surprising to hear that people's photo+ files are selling already. istock has proven they can manipulate files any way they want to get any return they want, so if this stands to benefit them, I can totally see them moving things around so that these files appear in front of whatever buyers they have left.
I agree, I think it will take more than a few days or a week to see how it all pans out. They are all about short term results...unfortunately for contributors who are still playing the istock game, I just don't think it is going to be a long term thing that anybody can bank on. Except maybe istock, of course.
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So iStock wants contributors that contribute to multiple sites to increase their prices? That seems like a great way to drive off customers. Sure makes me wonder if the value of Exclusiveness has further decreased as I think this will decrease the number of customers that use iStock, regardless of the types of images they buy. JMHO
I think what you are missing is that Istock's allowing us to raise the prices of our best sellers is merely bringing them in line with what they cost at the other top PPD sites (DT and FT). And it is not another price point. It is just the existing exclusive regular price point.
A budget conscious PPD buyer who finds one of my P+ images and wants it cheaper would save more money by buying one of my main collection similars linked in the description, than they would by going to another website to download it.
From what I can see, this is one of the FEW changes Istock has implemented lately that isn't likely to drive buyers elsewhere.
Lisa and Gotswyck!
What would happen in this scenario? I have 8 blue flames and around 20 dark-red ones at IS, industrials, that is. Now Dreamstime is the only agency that offers " image-exclusivity" what would happen if I remove these and stick them all into Dreamstime, image-exclusivity?
Lisa is reporting great exclusivity sales at Dreamstime and so are many others. Im curious about this.
Bad, BAD idea Chris! I would not take a blue or red flamed PROVEN SELLER off of Istock and make it exclusive anywhere else. DT is picking up some of Istock's disaffected buyers, but not enough to compensate for completely removing images from IS.
I am happy with the sales of the several dozen or so exclusive images I have at DT, but nearly all were uploaded during an Assignment contest, so they have all sorts of benefits, like extra visibility, and automatic Level 5 status. Just making an existing image exclusive will not be likely to compensate for lost sales of an Istock best seller.
If you want to try out DT exclusive images, I suggest responding to an upcoming Assignment.
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My sales over the last 3 days, since I bumped about 500 of my best-selling images to P+, have resulted in an RPD of $1.69. That's almost a 50% increase over my previous RPD which averaged $1.13. Very nice indeed.
That's great. Let's hope it lasts ... until they they inevitably tweak back-end :)
I've dumped a bunch in as well. I already make so little now from IS, I don't really have anything to lose. Worth the 6-month gamble!
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My guess is that iStock is going to see how this "price increase" of the P+ photos affects sales. If they see minimal to no change, there will be a price increase across the board with the P+ prices being the new base and everything will go up from there.
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My guess is that iStock is going to see how this "price increase" of the P+ photos affects sales. If they see minimal to no change, there will be a price increase across the board with the P+ prices being the new base and everything will go up from there.
Good thinking but I'm not sure they need to. Assuming most independents uprate the best-selling 10% of their portfolios to P+ then those will capture about 60% of sales anyway. Istock will then still have plenty of cheap images to market themselves as a low cost supplier ... but of course those cheap images will be at the back of searches because they're the ones that get largely ingored.
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My guess is that iStock is going to see how this "price increase" of the P+ photos affects sales. If they see minimal to no change, there will be a price increase across the board with the P+ prices being the new base and everything will go up from there.
Good thinking but I'm not sure they need to. Assuming most independents uprate the best-selling 10% of their portfolios to P+ then those will capture about 60% of sales anyway. Istock will then still have plenty of cheap images to market themselves as a low cost supplier ... but of course those cheap images will be at the back of searches because they're the ones that get largely ingored.
Never underestimate their greed. ;D
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I can't shake off the feeling that this P+ is a sneak preview of how our files could perform if sold exclusively.
I'm positively surprised how P+ is starting off. Apparently the price increase is no issue for the buyers and as cclapper mentioned IS can rig the search results any way they want just to make certain sales happen.
I only have a fraction of files with IS as I joined very late, so I have not much data what this P+ is capable for bigger ports with 5000+ images but we have some contributors like that here that hopefully keep reporting about their experiences. I could imagine they see some nice increase this month (no idea how this will effect/compensate (for) the summer slow-down coming up).
Either way, I think that IS has another agenda behind the P+ thing. It's certainly not to satisfy non-exclusive as everyone knows:
"Money doesn't make us happy". My guess is that they try fishing for new exclusives (also to make up for the loss of those who left).
But what do I know...
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^^^
The only agenda is to make more money for themselves (nothing wrong with that) and on the way, you make some money too.
Since this is not a mandatory program, I don't see any down sides.
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Sure makes me wonder if the value of Exclusiveness has further decreased as I think this will decrease the number of customers that use iStock, regardless of the types of images they buy. JMHO
It's incredible how quickly people forget. For five years there was no price differential between exclusive and independent files. Sixteen months ago they decided to give a pay hike to exclusives and a cut to independents. Now partial restoration of the status quo ante (i.e. unified pricing) is seen as undermining exclusiveness.
At the same time, even some exclusives admit that the amazing range of price points has become a problem.