pancakes

MicrostockGroup Sponsors


Author Topic: The Fall Of An Empire  (Read 31108 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

rubyroo

« Reply #175 on: December 13, 2012, 14:55 »
+2
Crikey Christian.  Couldn't you just change your position on SS without verbally clobbering everyone that holds the same view you held until a short time ago? 

Calm down me ol' matey.  :)


rubyroo

« Reply #176 on: December 13, 2012, 15:06 »
+2
Great points Cobalt.  They do express a very different outlook and a very different sense of where they are right now.

I think it's perfectly rational, with such an uncertain future all-round, to feel more positive about an agency that has shown incredible stability and growth through rocky times - and which hasn't given us any nasty and unwelcome surprises.

It's just nice to feel positive, frankly... and at least SS isn't being swamped with wholly-owned content to compete with our efforts.
« Last Edit: December 13, 2012, 15:08 by rubyroo »

« Reply #177 on: December 13, 2012, 15:15 »
+1
Nobody is exclusive at SS. I really dont think you can compare any praise heaped on Oringer to the way we wooyayed at istock.

The independents can just sit back and relax and see which agency rises and falls. their files are everyhwere.

That's definitely true. But when you see people saying SS is over 50% of their income, it definitely looks like they are setting themselves up for the same situation regardless of exclusivity.

« Reply #178 on: December 13, 2012, 15:25 »
+1
Once a company goes public, the founders inevitably lose control - that's what "going public" means. It's not about opening the doors to tour groups - it's about surrendering control in exchange for money.  First-round investors don't just want profits - they want increasing profits, in fact increasing at a certain rate.  That's how they intend to make money on their investment - by boosting the share price.  They're not in it for the dividend checks.   THis is a web company, not an electric utility.  It's not a long-term holding.

Corporate America eventually arrives at the same end result regardless of the starting conditions.   It's a mill that grinds slowly, but grinds exceedingly fine. 
 

« Reply #179 on: December 13, 2012, 15:26 »
+2
Jon Oringer at least said in one of his recent interviews that SS currently has 600 000 customers and he estimates that there are another 70 million out there.

Rebecca tells us that the market as ended, new contributors and new files will mean we inevtably lose sales and that there is no future. Also the traffic at gettyimages itself keeps going down. So they have no organic expansion, unless they buy other peoples businesses.

Like others have said "meeting expectations" is not growing.

SS sees a huge world market, Getty doesnt.

Who do you think will have more growth in the next few years?

Well said Jasmine. There's only one way that the market's heading.

That crown you're wearing doesn't seem to fit though. Crowns are so 2006 nowadays. Get up to date, get rid of it and look like a proper 'modern independent content provider'. Because you're worth it.

« Reply #180 on: December 13, 2012, 15:29 »
0
[That's definitely true. But when you see people saying SS is over 50% of their income, it definitely looks like they are setting themselves up for the same situation regardless of exclusivity.

I'd agree but it really isn't something we have any control of __ it's just where all the customers are choosing to buy.

« Reply #181 on: December 13, 2012, 15:30 »
0
No business grows forever. Take Tesco for example. Until recently they were so successful that 1 in every 8 spent by UK consumers was spent with them. Where do they go from there? Can they get to 1 in every 1? Of course not. They've tried to expand into the US but had to retreat in embarassing defeat.

Just been to Shanghai and shot Chinese consumers pushing Tesco trolleys full to the brim out of Tesco's. There's no stopping them.

« Reply #182 on: December 13, 2012, 15:32 »
0
Nobody is exclusive at SS. I really dont think you can compare any praise heaped on Oringer to the way we wooyayed at istock.

The independents can just sit back and relax and see which agency rises and falls. their files are everyhwere.

Exactly!

I don't know why people are making such a big deal about SS :)

I mentioned it before, and saying it again.. I have been in this business long enough to know that there is always an agency to compensate the possible fall of another.. Because customers leave one agency to go to another one.. They don't just stop buying..

for example depositphotos is on the rise and I see them as a major player in 2 years.. I have been with them from the start and they now make 10 times the amount they did 2 years ago.. regardless of how many contributors joined, depositphotos did not slow down at all.. at current growth rate, they will be number 2 agency in 2 years time.. I have no doubt..

I make 6 times less on IS with 4 times more files, compared to 3 years ago.. You would think I am losing money.. Nope, I actually make %30 more thanks to the rise of the likes of 123rf, depositphotos, canstockphoto, clipartof, veer, yaymicro, zazzle etc.

It's so obvious where istock customers ended up..

One thing about non-exclusivity is that it is definitely stable.. even if there is going to be a downward trend, it will come with a warning, it will happen slowly so you can produce faster to compensate.. it's not like istock's best match changes that suddenly kill your earnings..

« Reply #183 on: December 13, 2012, 15:34 »
+1
For now I am video independent and looking at all my options carefully ;).

If I really want to move out, there is a lot of work to do. I have seen too many people drop the crown out of emotion with no proper planning what to do next.

Before Rebecca came into the forum and when I thought best match was truly broken, not intentionally working against us, I was very excited about E+ on Getty.

That excitement has cooled off considerably because it is obvious they can dial our content up and down, however it suits them.

The pessimistic attitude towards sales and growth speaks volumes of their intentions. I cannot base my life on whatever "secret expectations" they might have.

So yes, I am looking at options, like I suppose are most exclusives. Unfortunatly not everyone is as talented as Sean. I wish I could build something like accordstock.

« Reply #184 on: December 13, 2012, 15:36 »
0
No business grows forever. Take Tesco for example. Until recently they were so successful that 1 in every 8 spent by UK consumers was spent with them. Where do they go from there? Can they get to 1 in every 1? Of course not. They've tried to expand into the US but had to retreat in embarassing defeat.

Just been to Shanghai and shot Chinese consumers pushing Tesco trolleys full to the brim out of Tesco's. There's no stopping them.

Sshhh __ I know! They're all over Thailand like a rash too. 'Tesco Lotus' they call themselves there and pay their employees about 8000Bt (roughly $200) per month for 12 hours a day, 7 days per week.

« Reply #185 on: December 13, 2012, 15:44 »
+2
So yes, I am looking at options, like I suppose are most exclusives. Unfortunatly not everyone is as talented as Sean. I wish I could build something like accordstock.


accordstock? this is accordstock: http://www.ktools.net/photostore/

functional out of the box.. Edit the looks of it, which is pretty easy, and you will have your own accordstock..
no need to be a genius..

« Reply #186 on: December 13, 2012, 16:05 »
0
Thank you! I will look into this with someone who is more computer literate than me. My humble website needs an overhaul anyway. Maybe we could include this.

I guess as an exclusive I really know nothing about the world out there, do I?


Poncke

« Reply #187 on: December 13, 2012, 16:13 »
0
Once a company goes public, the founders inevitably lose control - that's what "going public" means. It's not about opening the doors to tour groups - it's about surrendering control in exchange for money.  First-round investors don't just want profits - they want increasing profits, in fact increasing at a certain rate.  That's how they intend to make money on their investment - by boosting the share price.  They're not in it for the dividend checks.   THis is a web company, not an electric utility.  It's not a long-term holding.

Corporate America eventually arrives at the same end result regardless of the starting conditions.   It's a mill that grinds slowly, but grinds exceedingly fine.
Do you watch The Dragons Den? Here in the UK its a program about 5 investors and entrepreneurs pitch their idea or business  to them and when the investors see a profitable pitch they will invest. But what I get from them is that they want a is a good working relationship, get their money back as fast as possible, but they never want to run a business into the ground to make a quick buck. What good is it do them do get their profits and then run it into the ground? They want to get that % equity for as long as they can. They invest their money, expertise and resources and work with the entrepreneurs to build a successful sustainable business. So why would SS investors ruin a business? Because its done over at IS doesnt mean all investors work like that. Plus he is still majority stake holder so he calls the final shots. If he doesnt want his business to be run into the ground, it wont happen.
« Last Edit: December 13, 2012, 16:26 by Poncke »

« Reply #188 on: December 13, 2012, 16:16 »
+2
Yes, you can include it and it works fine, mostly, out of the box.  You'll be limited a bit if you can't program a little and have lots of time to fiddle.  Also the existing management options and controls can be confusing.

Everyone seems to like the 'zoom' which is in the regular code.  It isn't great for bandwidth tho, because it sucks down a large file with every detail page load - I think the image on the page is just the larger image resized with CSS.

« Reply #189 on: December 13, 2012, 16:21 »
0
Yes, you can include it and it works fine, mostly, out of the box.  You'll be limited a bit if you can't program a little and have lots of time to fiddle.  Also the existing management options and controls can be confusing.

Everyone seems to like the 'zoom' which is in the regular code.  It isn't great for bandwidth tho, because it sucks down a large file with every detail page load - I think the image on the page is just the larger image resized with CSS.

The day I have to worry about bandwidth because thousands of people are looking at and buying my images will be a day I don't have to worry about the extra charges!

« Reply #190 on: December 13, 2012, 16:43 »
+1
Jon Oringer at least said in one of his recent interviews that SS currently has 600 000 customers and he estimates that there are another 70 million out there.

Rebecca tells us that the market as ended, new contributors and new files will mean we inevtably lose sales and that there is no future. Also the traffic at gettyimages itself keeps going down. So they have no organic expansion, unless they buy other peoples businesses.

Like others have said "meeting expectations" is not growing.

SS sees a huge world market, Getty doesnt.

Who do you think will have more growth in the next few years?

Venture Capitalist's like to see a return on their investment and if they can grow to the point they no longer see future growth you can be sure they and Mr. Oringer will cash out before the company starts it's decline. The VC's seem to have placed key people in SS management to assure that they maximize their investment.

Now if you were trying to sell stock... what would you be telling potential investors about your potential market?

« Reply #191 on: December 13, 2012, 16:50 »
0
Once a company goes public, the founders inevitably lose control - that's what "going public" means. It's not about opening the doors to tour groups - it's about surrendering control in exchange for money.  First-round investors don't just want profits - they want increasing profits, in fact increasing at a certain rate.  That's how they intend to make money on their investment - by boosting the share price.  They're not in it for the dividend checks.   THis is a web company, not an electric utility.  It's not a long-term holding.

Corporate America eventually arrives at the same end result regardless of the starting conditions.   It's a mill that grinds slowly, but grinds exceedingly fine.
Do you watch The Dragons Den? Here in the UK its a program about 5 investors and entrepreneurs pitch their idea or business  to them and when the investors see a profitable pitch they will invest. But what I get from them is that they want a is a good working relationship, get their money back as fast as possible, but they never want to run a business into the ground to make a quick buck. What good is it do them do get their profits and then run it into the ground? They want to get that % equity for as long as they can. They invest their money, expertise and resources and work with the entrepreneurs to build a successful sustainable business. So why would SS investors ruin a business? Because its done over at IS doesnt mean all investors work like that. Plus he is still majority stake holder so he calls the final shots. If he doesnt want his business to be run into the ground, it wont happen.

There are all kinds of investors and  many do not set out to deliberately ruin a business. 

Yes, Oringer is still the majority owner and he might stay directly involved for quite a while.   

Various outcomes are possible, at least in the short term.  My point is that SS is now on a whole new track - and I think the current outpouring of praise for Oringer, and confidence in SS, is just a bit over the top.  It's often been said in politics: we vote for rich people because we think they're going to make us rich, too.

 Of course I'll be happy to be proven wrong.

« Reply #192 on: December 13, 2012, 17:19 »
+1
Jon Oringer at least said in one of his recent interviews that SS currently has 600 000 customers and he estimates that there are another 70 million out there.

Rebecca tells us that the market as ended, new contributors and new files will mean we inevtably lose sales and that there is no future. Also the traffic at gettyimages itself keeps going down. So they have no organic expansion, unless they buy other peoples businesses.

Like others have said "meeting expectations" is not growing.

SS sees a huge world market, Getty doesnt.

Who do you think will have more growth in the next few years?

Venture Capitalist's like to see a return on their investment and if they can grow to the point they no longer see future growth you can be sure they and Mr. Oringer will cash out before the company starts it's decline. The VC's seem to have placed key people in SS management to assure that they maximize their investment.

Now if you were trying to sell stock... what would you be telling potential investors about your potential market?

What VC's? It was an IPO. Oringer himself retains 56% of the business. End of.

« Reply #193 on: December 13, 2012, 17:43 »
0
Jon Oringer at least said in one of his recent interviews that SS currently has 600 000 customers and he estimates that there are another 70 million out there.

Rebecca tells us that the market as ended, new contributors and new files will mean we inevtably lose sales and that there is no future. Also the traffic at gettyimages itself keeps going down. So they have no organic expansion, unless they buy other peoples businesses.

Like others have said "meeting expectations" is not growing.

SS sees a huge world market, Getty doesnt.

Who do you think will have more growth in the next few years?


Venture Capitalist's like to see a return on their investment and if they can grow to the point they no longer see future growth you can be sure they and Mr. Oringer will cash out before the company starts it's decline. The VC's seem to have placed key people in SS management to assure that they maximize their investment.

Now if you were trying to sell stock... what would you be telling potential investors about your potential market?


What VC's? It was an IPO. Oringer himself retains 56% of the business. End of.


http://www.glassdoor.com/Reviews/Employee-Review-Shutterstock-RVW1046893.htm

It used to be better
Current Shutterstock Employee Reviewed Aug 2, 2011

Pros Perks: food, chair massages, yoga (for tech only) in the elevator bay, espresso machine, get to browse photos at work when bored, innovative, awesome coworkers, the view from the bathroom.

Cons Negatives: Management secrecy and poor communication, lack of opportunities, very limited equity, located in Fi Di, top positions filled by VC picks, fun lookin hallways lead to drab cube farms

Advice to Senior Management The company is either a start up or larger company with corporate structure and people in 3 piece suits. It is presently the latter dressed as the former.

« Reply #194 on: December 13, 2012, 17:55 »
+2
^^^ Too late mate. The VC's may have provided funding until the IPO. They won't be there afterwards. Their job is done, their money is made and will now be ploughed into new ventures. The clue's in the name.

PaulieWalnuts

  • We Have Exciting News For You
« Reply #195 on: December 13, 2012, 18:11 »
+2
Thank you! I will look into this with someone who is more computer literate than me. My humble website needs an overhaul anyway. Maybe we could include this.

I guess as an exclusive I really know nothing about the world out there, do I?

You can also go with something like Photoshelter which you just turn on and load images for an instant website. Because you're exclusive you could start by using it for prints or RM and build up traffic through SEO or social media. So if you decide to go indie at some point you can just flip on the RF licensing immediately and you'll already have traffic.

« Reply #196 on: December 13, 2012, 18:45 »
0
I have thought about Photoshelter but I dont know how many potential customers would know them in Europe. I could probably customize my website through them as well.

Thank you all. There is a lot to think about and learn.

It is good to know there are well tested options.

PaulieWalnuts

  • We Have Exciting News For You
« Reply #197 on: December 13, 2012, 18:56 »
+1
There's also Photodeck which I believe is on your side of the pond.

http://www.photodeck.com

« Reply #198 on: December 13, 2012, 19:03 »
0
That looks great! Thank you very much. :)

« Reply #199 on: December 14, 2012, 12:52 »
0
^^^ Too late mate. The VC's may have provided funding until the IPO. They won't be there afterwards. Their job is done, their money is made and will now be ploughed into new ventures. The clue's in the name.

LOL, they will not be gone if they think there is still money to be had!  There are a few key people who know what the long term plans are but everyone else will be kept in the dark!  Most people believe what they want to believe and most often their beliefs have nothing to do with reality. Unpleasant facts are most often overlooked and swept out of the minds eye, so that we can keep our picture of the how we want life proceed.


 

Sponsors

Mega Bundle of 5,900+ Professional Lightroom Presets

Microstock Poll Results

Sponsors

3100 Posing Cards Bundle