MicrostockGroup
Microstock Photography Forum - General => Microstock News => Topic started by: georgeflopos on July 03, 2007, 15:53
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I posted some images at www.zymmetrical.com.
Unlike other microstock, you can set your own price to your images. It is great. I already sold a few images since they work closly with a company called flyerstarter.com that makes flyers for parties and DJ. Although they are still in Beta, they have multiple languages already and can handle fonts, video, graphics, you name it.
They also have support for a lot of credit cards and can give back 50% of your sales.
definitely a website to keep an eye on....
My 5 cents.
George
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Is this your site. I am always suspicious when some one promotes a new site with their first post.
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I browsed for a milisecond and saw this... Can't find anything about being either model released or editorial. Surely all those easily identifyable faces can't be released? (http://www.zymmetrical.com/DesktopModules/PortalStore/Files/StoreImages/1/PackageImages/mini-ZYIMGPPLGOGOS00014.jpg)
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Hmmm ... this sound suspiciously like a puff from the management/owner disguised as an independent recommendation.
Can you tell us your relationship with Zymmetrical, George? How do you know so much about the companies they work with, and their marketing strategy?
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Wow, Paranoia runs deep here. I had many exchange with its founder Keith who is very accessible and friendly. He told me about it. You can do the same. also there is information on there wiki and Blog.
I am always on the lookout of new places to sell my images, especially new ones because the less they are contributor, the more i make,.
Istockphoto is full of pros that have both the time and money to make great picture. I cannot compete with that. can you ?
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Hmm. Didn't even bother to change his name after joining the other big micro forum and immediately began promoting this new site on a DT-problems thread. Sheesh!
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Wow, Paranoia runs deep here...
It's not paranoia when it's obvious you're connected with the site and you're trying to pimp your site for financial gain. Flame on! >:(
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I am always on the lookout of new places to sell my images,
Hey there George,
Sorry about all the hostility. I'm sure that if you just offer up one or two portfolio links to the multiple sites for which you are a contributor, it will squash all these nasty suspicions that you are some pathetic site owner using a fake identity to lure contributors to your site.
I know that's not true, is it, George? So, come on, just post those links and then we can get on with this fascinating discussion.
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Wow, Paranoia runs deep here.
No ... not paranoia. It's now pretty obvious that you're somehow connected with Zymmetrical. (And, incidentally, it's pretty easy to fling the word 'paranoia' about in the hope of getting everyone to say, 'Me ... I'm not paranoid.' and back off nervously in case anyone thinks they are paranoid. Go and check the psychological symptoms of paranoia.)
I don't believe anyone on this forum has any objection to individuals who own or work for stock sites posting here. In fact most people welcome it. I know I do. We have Bryan from LO and SteveOh from SX and Achilles from DT plus a number of others and even ... once I believe ... Jon from Shutterstock. It's great and very welcome.
I think what most people object to is someone coming on here, pretending to be an unbiased voice and pushing a stock site as a 'great' place to sell your work without revealing their connection.
And as for ...
Istockphoto is full of pros that have both the time and money to make great picture. I cannot compete with that. can you ?
Yes. I can and I do. Haven't you got any ambition?
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hahaha this is so blatantly a pimping thread!
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Hi all,
Let me jump in. Before anyone accuses me of anything, let me introduce myself. I am the Chief Knowledge Officer of Zymmetrical.
A few thoughts and comment :
- I do not know George and I believe he is one of our members. He is not on the management team. And even if he was, what would be so wrong in informing everyone of a new website that could be interesting? Since we have a very interesting referral program that pays back 10 % of visual sold, including your own, he might be looking to increasing his revenue. Again, what is wrong with that?
- Zymmetrical is not a microstock. Never has been and never will be. It is a visual portal that offers a wide range of content. We have video, fonts, graphics along with stills. Furthermore, we do not price our content, our members do. We leave Microstock to big corporate giants like Getty or Corbis.
- We have not officially launched yet so it would be premature for us to publicize a site that still need some tweaking. And, although we are still in Beta, we already generate sales for some of our members. Not huge numbers, but for a site that hasn't been launched, it is pretty impressive.
- We are not interested in the microstock model and I am surprised that our site was even mentioned here. If some of you had taken the time to look at our site instead of harassing a new member whose only wrongdoing was maybe a little too much enthusiasm, you would have noticed that.
- If any here would like to make comments on our site and make some suggestions, either positive or negative, that would be great. We welcome any feedback at this stage. Since some of you have valuable experience with other similar sites. We do not ask for you to upload images since we have a different business model than yours, only comments and suggestions.
Should you have any questions or would like to check on me and my background, you can visit either www.zymmetrical.com or go to my personal site www.melchersystem.com.
sincerely
Paul Melcher
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Wow! Curiouser and curiouser..... Paul Melcher is the same guy who wrote the blog-article which was the subject of this recent thread here, the one about lords and serfs on microstock:
http://www.microstockgroup.com/index.php?topic=2145.0
He probably wasn't aware of that thread. This may get interesting.....or maybe not.
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Oh boy. Well, if we had any doubts about whether we should join, that should definitely clear them up.
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Istockphoto is full of pros that have both the time and money to make great picture. I cannot compete with that. can you ?
Yea, daily. And more successfully every day. As do many, many members here on MSG. If you think the members here just bought their first camera yesterday, you're sadly mistaken. And as for paranoia, we've all been down this road before. 8)-tom
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Hey Paul Melcher- since your site isnt microstock, and youre surprised that it was mentioned here, and youre (erm) clearly not friends with the guy who started this thread... How come you just happened to stumble upon this thread? Its only been up for a day or so... Bizarre coincidence, if you ask me.
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This forum is like walking in a bar full of drunken rednecks who all believe they are CIA agents.
For those who would like to know how I knew about this post, I suggest they check out "Google Alerts". Not really rocket science but it does imply that you stop checking your miserable earnings for a while and have a curious mind.
I have yet to see a constructive post about what you think about Zymmetrical.com and its functionalities. Instead of judging the product you try and judge the person behind the post, a bit as if you entered a store and would immediately go to a sales person and tell them they suck. I am not sure I understand the process. Do you feel better after that ?
Again, please rest assure that we are not interested in your images . Our site is NOT for cynical microstockers who spend more time on forums that they do shooting images.
We have great members who are passionate about photography. As you might know, freedomsomething , akaTom, vicu, and hughstonelan, it is always a bad idea to mix fine champagne with cheep beer.
Best to you,
Paul Melcher
(my real name , BTW)
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If you are the same Paul Melcher who wrote the blogs of baseless crap that were so far removed from reality as to be surreal, then how surreal it is to come here and speak of folks being judgmental.
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From the home page of Zymm.
The most balanced collection of royalty-free stock photos, graphics, fonts and video all available for instant download.
How is this not microstock? And if the image posted above is any indication it's clear which one is the cheap beer.
But you're right, the world needs another place to upload cell phone photos and videos.
Also, you may want to polish your marekting skills. You just told 739 people to piss off.
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Also, you may want to polish your marekting skills. You just told 739 people to piss off.
No need for that. Unless they have reallllly deep pocketbooks. As soon as one of those celebrities gets wind that their image is being sold without their permission for commercial usage... well, let's just say it will all be over but the girl in the cowboy hat with the discolored pixels all over her body finally falling off that barstool.
Then all we "indescribably wealthy" hobbyists can go about practicing our pastime and eating our bon-bons while others get rich off our ignorance. ::)
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I don't think the post even deserves a reply. His emotional ranting speaks for itself. I did have an idea, though, after looking over their site. It looks like it would be a great place to dump your MS rejected shots if you have no other use for them, as long as you sold under a different name of course. From what I saw, the rejects of many folks on this site would put their stuff to shame. You might actually make a $ or 2.
Well, I gotta mosey outta here and check on my "miserable earnings." Y'all "cynical redneck" microstockers have a nice day!
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Hey folks ... maybe this would be a good point to cool it a bit :)
What set everyone off (myself included) was an apparent 'puff' for a new site - a first posting from a complete newcomer, in a matey tone, extolling the virtues of a new site. "Hey guys and gals, get a load of this! I'm tellin' ya, Zymmetrical is going to be the best thing since sliced bread!"
Of course, the internet being what it is, everyone was immediately suspicious and said 'This is some new microstock site creator, trying to drum up images for his/her business'.
Why did we say that? Because it's not the first time this has happened. And it got up my nose ... and maybe others' too ... because I like people to be open. I mean, why not just say, "I've started this new site and I want you to join." We'd probably all check it out and join, or not, as the inclination took us.
Well ... maybe George is connected with the Zymmetrical. Maybe he isn't. It's all water under the bridge now.
And, okay, Zymmetrical doesn't have an awful lot of images yet. We've all got to start somewhere.
And there could be copyright/model release problems with some of them. That's Zymmetrical's and the individual photog's problem.
And the 'Chief Knowledge Officer' (whatever that title means) has written a contentious article on a blog somewhere. Well, we're all entitled to express our views (and have whatever job titles we're given).
I've taken a look at Zymmetrical and, it seems to me they do have some interesting ideas and a fair approach.
Maybe it's time to give them an even break :)
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It´s hard to my to understand a person o have a company how need to have the work of another people and came to the place were he can find this kind of peoples and instead of be kind, try to promote the best features of his company. Try to make us believe in the best intentions of the company, and no!! He call us names and make fun of the work of every body in here.
With that kind of attitude you (Paul Melcher) and Zymmetrical don´t go far!
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Hi Guys,
Thought i'd jump in, because Paul mentioned this discussion and it's not really a scenario that makes me happy.
I'm the creator of the business. I actually posted here (http://www.microstockgroup.com/index.php?topic=876.msg6859) last January because I use the same method that I passed on to Paul for monitoring our 'branding' as it is, using Google Alerts to see where the name comes up. Since Zymmetrical is a unique name, it's pretty easy to track it's buzz on the net.
This forum is great as it seems to be the first honest 3rd party discourse on the Microstock industry. Mind you, just as Paul is, I am of an opinion that Microstock in it's present (if such a new genre can be 'present') form is unsustainable in the long run. That's neither here nor there; on the Zymmetrical beta you can see how we are working towards a compromise between the 2 extremes of the industry.
Bateleur, thank you for your cool head. Paul is originally from France and I think they message forum/blog like they drive: very opinionated. ;)
Some of those older photos, like the 'Flyerstarter.com' watermarked one, are a crossover from the earlier site roots at Flyerstarter - will they be axed in the future? Lot's of them, yes. Right now we are focusing 110% on the system itself. Big photo counts are great but this will come naturally when the system is fine tuned.
I can honestly say at present the rejection rate is around 75% for photos - no matter what you do, how bold you make the text, if you accept photos from the general public, the vast majority are just like - 'ughhhh.. come on, another grainy shot of your dog!!'. This is why we are at 50% commission and not 90% or such, it really is labor-intensive work by people with a lifetime of photography/design involvement.
For the particular gogo girl cowboy hat picture crucified already; the photog is good friend of mine from Bremen, Germany, and the particular scenario was an MTV event where every last person signed a waiver to be on TV/Photographed.
'Chief Knowledge Officer' - check it on Wikipedia. I brought Paul on the board of directors and figured, what ., why give him a stuffy old title. It describes him acutely: a decades-long career worth of knowledge in this industry, guiding myself who is younger, and a child of the digital age. When I was 12 in '91 I ran digital art groups making ASCII and nouveau VGA art for hacker groups, it's just something i've always been into. Back then, no money was involved in creative design on the BBS's, just respect and prestige.
Now business is completely entrenched on online communications, and everything has a price - this business does not forget the respect part, I urge anyone reading this message to give Zymmetrical a fair shake and share an opinion or two.
Cheers,
Keith
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Hi Guys,
'Chief Knowledge Officer' - check it on Wikipedia.
I checked it. The very first thing written is:
This article or section appears to contain a large number of buzzwords and may require cleanup.
Sorry ... couldn't resist that. ;) Now back to the discussion in hand ...
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'Chief Knowledge Officer' - check it on Wikipedia. I brought Paul on the board of directors and figured, what ., why give him a stuffy old title. It describes him acutely: a decades-long career worth of knowledge in this industry, guiding myself who is younger, and a child of the digital age. When I was 12 in '91 I ran digital art groups making ASCII and nouveau VGA art for hacker groups, it's just something i've always been into. Back then, no money was involved in creative design on the BBS's, just respect and prestige.
I did check it out on wikipedia and here's what I found:
"CKOs must have skills across a wide variety of areas. They must be good at developing/understanding the big picture, advocacy (articulation, promotion and justification of the knowledge agenda, sometimes against cynicism or even open hostility), ...and interpersonal skills."
Any CKO that tells a bunch of potential customers and contributors they're not welcome in an extremely rude way needs to go wiki their own job title. Just my opinion.
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Do you see us as being "cheap beer", Keith? I think that most people who see that the "Chief Knowledge Officer" of a company has that little respect for what they do would be unlikely to give the company a much-needed lifeline by contributing. The man has said very little here- and has already called microstockers "cheap beer" and "serfs". It shows not only a lack of respect for what we do, but also a lack of understanding.
As was said before, this is pretty bad marketing. When a few dick heads in the forums with anonymous names like "freedom something something" wind you up you should ignore it and focus on what you want to do- get contributors and build a brand. All the other people who were silent during the conversation are now thinking "theres no way Im going to contribute there..."
I leant a lot from that exchange- and theres no way that I, as "cheap beer" or "a serf" that already makes over 100 dollars a day from this is going to put my hard work on a site which I do not, and will not trust. The kind of people who speak like that to contributors are just the kind of people who would reduce our cut the moment they have a million images. I recommend getting a new "Chief Knowledge Officer".
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I'm not losing much sleep over how Paul communicates; posters in this thread, after trying to roast a member of our site, proceeded to try and roast Paul, based on the opinions that he blogs in his private time.
As with the scenario he depicted, he did walk into a bar and get a pretty rude reception. Of course ones going to think that bar is full of jerks. Probably some decent folks sitting in the back that'd be fine to talk to but there's some rowdies blocking the way.
I'd walk away muttering some stuff too if it was a real bar, irregardless if it's 'business related'. No one needs to put up with microbullying.
No, i'm not calling anyone anything here. I've never met you. And no ones been sour to me yet. :) For this 'serfs' label coming from his blog post, I happen to agree with the label used for microstockers - any business that is top-heavy on the profit distribution among employees/manufacturers could probably be labeled 'feudal'.
Yes I realize microstockers are not chained to a manufacturing line in 18th century England churning out isolated shots of businessman shaking hands (or...hmm), but there really is big room for improvement in this business, especially in the area of artist compensation.
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I had a quick look at the site. The prices look similar to imagevortex. That site doesn't seem to have many sales, even though the image quality is superior to most microstock sites.
Perhaps 80% of contributors don't make much money from microstock but that is probably the same for most photographers. At least microstock lets most people have a go and see how well they can do. I applied to a macrostock site many years ago and was turned down. Had no problems with microstock and I am pleased with my earnings after just one year.
Now I am trying macrostock again. This time, I know that my photographs are good enough to sell and I have a lot more confidence.
Microstock is here to stay. Will designers go back to paying large fees for royalty free images? That is not likely to happen. Midstock is the market that seems to be failing. istock tried it and it didn't work. Several sites have folded and those that are still going don't seem to have many sales.
Can Zymmetrical make this work when so many others have failed?
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There a few things we need to clear up here:
- I wrote that this forum was "like" entering in a bar. I was using an analogy. If I offended someone, I truly apologize, it was not my intent. There are a few members on this forum that are quick to respond with negative personal attacks, like bullies in a schoolyard. When you spend so many years building a product as sophisticated as Zymmetrical, it can be very frustrating to read such useless and groundless negativism.
- When I wrote that we are not interested in microstock shooters, I was referring to those who are not serious about their passions. The ones that seem satisfied with a quick buck and could be selling widgets. We are looking for the passionate photographers who would like to see more revenues for their images, as a factor of quality and not quantity. No one has a problem paying more for quality.
- Protecting companies like Istock is ludicrous when they sold for $50 million and not one contributor happened to see a cent. After all, besides the technology and the market share, they also sold the content. your images, your work.
- I will let those of you continue making fun of my title. It is irrelevant.
- My post on my blog, which is not related to Zymmetrical, is also irrelevant to the service we offer. However, if you have the time, please ask the 23 million Americans that live below the line of poverty if they shoot for microstock. Or those that have 2 jobs and commute for hours to get to work. Be thankful of what you have.
- Finally, as I wrote before, Keith and I would love to have creative and constructive criticism of zymmetrical.com. You are all welcome to try it, test it and report your findings here, good or bad.
Sincerely,
Paul Melcher
CKO
Zymmetrical
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I'm not losing much sleep over how Paul communicates; posters in this thread, after trying to roast a member of our site, proceeded to try and roast Paul, based on the opinions that he blogs in his private time.
As with the scenario he depicted, he did walk into a bar and get a pretty rude reception. Of course ones going to think that bar is full of jerks. Probably some decent folks sitting in the back that'd be fine to talk to but there's some rowdies blocking the way.
I'd walk away muttering some stuff too if it was a real bar, irregardless if it's 'business related'. No one needs to put up with microbullying.
Keith,
as much as I appreciated your first go at damage control seeing it as balanced, polite and cool-headed, this part I quoted above is a bit misguided. Here is a suggestion: take a look at three posts between Paul's first entrance and his second response. Do you see anything rude or personal in those? A bit skeptical at most, but what in them warranted the following:
"This forum is like walking in a bar full of drunken rednecks who all believe they are CIA agents...
...you stop checking your miserable earnings for a while and have a curious mind.
...Again, please rest assure that we are not interested in your images . Our site is NOT for cynical microstockers who spend more time on forums that they do shooting images.
... As you might know, freedomsomething , akaTom, vicu, and hughstonelan, it is always a bad idea to mix fine champagne with cheep beer."
There was one poster whop called his blog "useless crap", yes, but as you said yourself it was his personal blog irrelevant to his post and run in his private time. Yet he responds on this forum in his official capacity and speaks in a manner quoted above of your site and related topics, not about his blog content.
I also appreciate his last post attempting at more balanced approach but it's still defensive and somewhat aggressive. I see some points in it that deserve calm discussion but don't you think that the sequence of exchange I cited above would require an apology from Paul first in order to restore normal communication? Really, he entered that bar calling people names before they gave him as much as first glance.
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There was one poster whop called his blog "useless crap"
No, that is not what I said. I said "BASELESS" which means unfounded in fact or reality. The two blog posts that were linked from this forum were very insulting and condescending in attitude towards anyone who contributes to microstock sites. Surely he did not expect to come here (on MICROSTOCKgroup.com) and get an overly warm reception. All he managed to do was confirm what many of us already suspected about him from reading the ideas put forth in his blog. Fair or not, the actions and behaviors that one attaches one's name to in one's personal time DO reflect on entities with which that same name is also linked.
As for what started the whole thing, the OP had the misfortune of posting nearly immediately following another similar incident in which the poster was proven to be the CEO (or whatever) of the site in question. Therefore the response here was measurably more skeptical than necessary.
Maybe the site is a worthy venture. Maybe it's the answer to all our microwhoknowswhatstock dreams. I shall never know because I can't bring myself to put my trust in a company who would exalt someone who behaves in such a manner in their "official" capacity. Maybe others feel the same. Maybe my portfolio is "cheap beer" in your opinion, Paul Melcher, but like so many other of your opinions, this opinion is founded on complete blind speculation.
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Vicu, sorry for misquoting, "baseless" was what you used, not "useless"... and it's not like I disagree with you on that, lol. I just tried to find anything in responses that could justify those insults Paul hurled at us, and couldn't. Cited your words rather in order to demonstrate that even the harshest thing said here wasn't even remotely enough to warrant his response. Hope I cleared that up.
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Vicu, sorry for misquoting, "baseless" was what you used, not "useless"... and it's not like I disagree with you on that, lol. I just tried to find anything in responses that could justify those insults Paul hurled at us, and couldn't. Cited your words rather in order to demonstrate that even the harshest thing said here wasn't even remotely enough to warrant his response. Hope I cleared that up.
No problem. I didn't think it was intentional.
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I'm not losing much sleep over how Paul communicates; posters in this thread, after trying to roast a member of our site, proceeded to try and roast Paul, based on the opinions that he blogs in his private time.
This kind of got to me. When I owned my small business (yes I sold it to go back to school) I would have been very upset with anyone from my organization making rude comments on behalf of my company, even if they were in response to rude comments and made on his "private time". In fact, I would have probably let them go if they were in charge of communications.
Also, iStock didn't sell my "my content, my work" for $50 million and anyone that thinks so doesn't really understand the business of selling content. They don't own the works, they're an agent for the content owners. For $50 million Getty purchased the right to sell my work, nothing more.
Anyway good luck in your endeavor. As for suggestions about your site as you originally asked for:
(1) when I went to your site the drop menus weren't timed long enough (they disappeared before I could click on things)
2) hire someone familiar with business communications (a good bs slinger) and have them be the only person allowed to make statements on behalf of the company.
(3) hire someone with real knowledge of the industry you're in from one of the big boys (the big six to the right) or perhaps from your true competition Alamy. I know you don't consider yourself a "microstock" site, but you're selling royalty-free licenses so call it what you want but they are your competition.
(4) your content is not on par with your prices. This is the key think you should reconsider. Either lower the prices or recruit the best of the best from each site and have them contribute shots that are exclusive to your site. Otherwise your model is doomed to fail.
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Wow. Just wow. I'm just shaking my head in disbelief.
Keith, you seem relatively level-headed. Copy and paste this entire discussion and show this to someone experienced in business that you respect, and he/she can explain the sort of horrid damage that Paul Melcher is doing to your business.
Remember, it's difficult to aid the success of a business while you are brimming with contempt for a key stakeholder (in this case, your suppliers). As for me personally, I don't think I'll be contributing to a company with this sort of attitude to customer service. But then again, you guys don't want me or my kind either.
By the way, I do agree that the initial reactions from the group were somewhat abrasive. However, it doesn't matter who is right or wrong, or who started the fight. This is not kindergarten; this is business. If you do not act professionally, you will not be treated professionally.
yingyang0: point 2 had me laughing out loud
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Modified. removed.
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(3) hire someone with real knowledge of the industry you're in from one of the big boys (the big six to the right) or perhaps from your true competition Alamy. I know you don't consider yourself a "microstock" site, but you're selling royalty-free licenses so call it what you want but they are your competition.
(4) your content is not on par with your prices. This is the key think you should reconsider. Either lower the prices or recruit the best of the best from each site and have them contribute shots that are exclusive to your site. Otherwise your model is doomed to fail.
Id like to add to this. Things have got personal already (so lets move on)- but this has shown up some problems with the initial idea behind the site. Ive heard the owners of this site saying that "the microstock model isnt sustainable". Personally, I disagree- I just think that it isnt being sustained. Istock and the rest are raising prices because they are able to, as they have such high quality. They assume that people wont leave because of that quality. They could keep the system as it is and continue. One thing that Paul Melcher doesnt seem to understand is that selling images for a dollar- or less- is actually a perfectly viable idea. And most contributors do not contribute because we are amateurs-or money isnt important. We contribute because we sell every image many times over. This allows us to make a lot of money. It is, in fact, very lucrative. So, it is entirely sustainable. What youre doing, is selling at a very high cost- without first raising quality. No one who has heard of istock is going to go to you- even with their dodgy search engine. The only new customers will be people who move straight from buying from getty, onto your site, somehow hearing of you, but not istock. I dont think thats going to work.
You have made the same mistake my father made "a dollar?! Oh come on, youll never make money selling things for a dollar! Its just a hobby..." This, I think, is why you dont show any respect for microstockers. You think we re all a bunch of amateurs who do this as a hobby. You think "Lets do the same as istock, but with REAL artists, not silly hobbyists." The problem, really, is that you dont understand the industry. I suspect neither of you have really contributed much to any sites, or worked for any of these sites. This is why your business will fail.
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Hmpfff, this thread leaves me flabbergasted. I have to admit I like this guy's (Paul Melcher) style and guts. I also read his blog extensively. He's French, so maybe I should say about what he wrote in this thread: ce n'est que la vérité qui blesse (only truth hurts).
About business communication, well, I have some experience with the (American) corporate world and sometimes I had to puke in silence about those slick hurray hoohoo guys that have it all worked out, business plans, road to success, profit projections, blabla.
They get good notes from their supervisor, get promoted, move on to the next "challenge" ("problems" don't belong in the corporate newspeak) and leave the carnage they caused behind, up to the next one.
The worst that can happen is the failure of the Peter's Principle (everybody gets stuck at a level where they are incompetent) and move on to the top. That's how things like Enron happened. Slick feelgood language is not always the right way to get your point accross and get to the meat.
Now enters Paul Melcher, with a big mouth and a number of truths we conveniently ignore. Why not give the guy a chance?
My main critique at this point to Paul Melcher is that he seems to be quite ignorant about microstock. Sure he mentions Getty, but I didn't see anything about Shutterstock and Dreamstime.
He claims not to run a microstock site, but when you look closely at zymmetrical, it is a microstock site. I challenge Mr. Melcher to explain exactly what the difference is between zymmetrical and any other microstock venture. If it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, walks like a duck, well... I have to assume that it is a duck, until proven wrong.
Maybe Mr. Melcher will claim artists can set their own prices. I wonder if he ever heard about Featurepics? [I love Featurepics, especially since I got a payout last week - I will reach payout on LuckyOliver in 2011]. The content of zymmetrical right now is rather mediocre and overpriced, sure, but it's still in beta, right? At least his beta is more functional than Snapvillage's beta. There are some glitches on the site and I will mail Mr. Melcher those, that's what he asked for.
If Mr. Melcher will be as aggressive and determined in marketing his site and his artists as he was on this forum, he's a winner. I'm sceptical, but let's see...
Basically, I signed up. Shoot me ;D
Update - Just uploaded 5 shots. I get thrown back at a page that lists my file names + the note "waiting review". Can't see any thumbnail, no tags, no IPTC info. Don't have any idea how and where to upload MRF's and how to attach them. Can't either edit nor review. Thrown back at the home page when trying to access "help". I guess for now, I just leave the link with the other dead sites. Sorry zymmetrical, I'm just a rich redneck that likes cheep bear ;) but doesn't have that much time to waste. I try again later, who knows.
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IMHO, I think we've had enough confrontation, reaching a point were nothing good comes from it.
Our forum, although focused on microstock, has always had space for discussions about macro or "non-micro" stock sites - ImageVortex, Alamy, Getty, etc - and even merchandise sites - Cafepress, Zazzle, etc. So I think it's of everybody's interest to discuss Zymmetrical for what it offers to us and what it's not good about it.
Regards,
Adelaide
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IMHO, I think we've had enough confrontation, reaching a point were nothing good comes from it.
Regards,
Adelaide
You are correct, madelaide!!! I have always respected your opinions and observations here.
In my part, I did not realize that I offended, insulted, inflamed, defamed, whatever. All I did was answer the question of the original poster, George Flopos. Next thing I know, I'm being insulted by the Zymm-folks.
Like the majority of the MSG family, I am on IS, I can compete there and I am making money there!!
Just stating a fact.
Like this thread started out, we have had threads like this before and it turned out it was someone other than a mere contributor, we had been down that road before. Some owner or manager or CKO trying to bobo us all.
Just stating a fact.
Then, ............I became 'cheap beer' according to the CKO.
Well, I do have time and I do have money and I do like beer. And those that think they insulted me can rest assured, I will swill and cry in that beer......... all the way to the bank.... to make another deposit.
Whatever. If I offended Mr. George Flopos or any of the officers of Zymmetrical.com.. I apologize. -a.k.a. tom
p.s. Why do I use a 'photog handle' (aka tom)? For just this very reason, you never know what kind of people you are going to run into on the web.
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FWIW, tom. I don't think you have "offended, insulted, inflamed, defamed or whatever" anyone. The only person acting unreasonably here was (this is where I shut up in order not to add to flames).
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Update - Just uploaded 5 shots. I get thrown back at a page that lists my file names + the note "waiting review". Can't see any thumbnail, no tags, no IPTC info. Don't have any idea how and where to upload MRF's and how to attach them. Can't either edit nor review. Thrown back at the home page when trying to access "help". I guess for now, I just leave the link with the other dead sites. Sorry zymmetrical, I'm just a rich redneck that likes cheep bear ;) but doesn't have that much time to waste. I try again later, who knows.
Thanks for giving us a whirl. The older version of our submissions system did indeed show thumbnails, but until we get to a production stage, server resources are unfortunately limited. Resizing images that are up to 100 MB, that we don't even know are going to be accepted (like I said earlier, the rejection rate is around 70%), is a strain on the system that has been removed for now.
If you notice on the photo upload form, (currently IE browser only), you actually get a thumbnail of the files selected on your HD -before- you upload. So this will hopefully lessen the problem of accidental dupes and such being uploaded.
Rest assured, when we go on with our server expansion the list will again display thumbnails.
The EXIF/IPTC data is stored in our submissions database tables, up till now I haven't seen a need for this information to be displayed in the Artist's Submission queue page - after all, you know what camera you use, right? It's an easy change to make to have it shown, I just need a reason why - otherwise it's just extra KB slowing down the pageload (130 EXIF/IPTC fields x 3 submissions per page adds up to a fair chunk of page bloat).
No tags or editting capability until the files are approved, this is by design. Why tag a file that get's rejected in the end?
Model Release page is visible on your Account Page at http://www.zymmetrical.com/Account/tabid/93/Default.aspx (http://www.zymmetrical.com/Account/tabid/93/Default.aspx). Direct link the the Model Release page is http://www.zymmetrical.com/Account/ModelReleases/tabid/1424/Default.aspx (http://www.zymmetrical.com/Account/ModelReleases/tabid/1424/Default.aspx).
For now, they are disconnected systems. You have a series of 10 pics of a particular model, upload the PDF or JPG etc. to the model release form, and we put two and two together and match them up to your approved submissions. Don't want to enforce a 'one-photo, one release form' rule because this would mean uploading duplicate releases.
On our roadmap is to simplify the connection, probably ending up saving our sanity more than the photogs: when the submission/approval process is going full steam, playing 'match the model release to the pic' is going to lose it's charm pretty quickly. Planned is a dropdown box next to each file in the Art Manager, with a thumbnail and filename link for each model release, so one can quickly select from any uploaded releases.
Thanks again for checking us out, things really are being improved daily - don't let us sink too deep in your bookmarks.
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new blog entry for those who are interested:
http://www.zymmetrical.com/Blog/tabid/95/Default.aspx
best to all.
PM