Author Topic: Exclusive VS indie for beginners? (Read 17873 times)

entheo · « **on:** September 28, 2017, 08:58 »

I haven't used microstocks yet. Now I try to earn a little money (say 500/month), as soon as possible.
Pick one site and go exclusive or submit to a few sites? which is a better stratage?
Mainly micro photos and some illustrations.

disorderly · « **Reply #1 on:** September 28, 2017, 09:14 »

Submit to a few sites. You will learn which ones will accept your work, and which ones have customers who want it. I don't believe exclusivity is a good deal for most creators in the microstock world. I know it would have been bad for me. But how can you know which agency will be the one to devote all your resources to supplying without getting some experience first?

Pauws99 · « **Reply #2 on:** September 28, 2017, 09:40 »

Quote from: entheo on September 28, 2017, 08:58

I haven't used microstocks yet. Now I try to earn a little money (say 500/month), as soon as possible.
Pick one site and go exclusive or submit to a few sites? which is a better stratage?
Mainly micro photos and some illustrations.

A little money 500 a month? as soon as possible?.......Good luck with that one

Sean Locke Photography · « **Reply #3 on:** September 28, 2017, 09:44 »

Quote from: entheo on September 28, 2017, 08:58

I haven't used microstocks yet. Now I try to earn a little money (say 500/month), as soon as possible.
Pick one site and go exclusive or submit to a few sites? which is a better stratage?
Mainly micro photos and some illustrations.

A better strategy would be to convince yourself you're going to build a time machine, and then wait for yourself to come pick you up from 2030 and take you back to 2004.

ShadySue · « **Reply #4 on:** September 28, 2017, 10:07 »

Quote from: Pauws99 on September 28, 2017, 09:40

Quote from: entheo on September 28, 2017, 08:58
I haven't used microstocks yet. Now I try to earn a little money (say 500/month), as soon as possible.
Pick one site and go exclusive or submit to a few sites? which is a better stratage?
Mainly micro photos and some illustrations.

A little money 500 a month? as soon as possible?.......Good luck with that one

Maybe s/he meant cents.

Pauws99 · « **Reply #5 on:** September 28, 2017, 10:45 »

Quote from: Sean Locke Photography on September 28, 2017, 09:44

Quote from: entheo on September 28, 2017, 08:58
I haven't used microstocks yet. Now I try to earn a little money (say 500/month), as soon as possible.
Pick one site and go exclusive or submit to a few sites? which is a better stratage?
Mainly micro photos and some illustrations.

A better strategy would be to convince yourself you're going to build a time machine, and then wait for yourself to come pick you up from 2030 and take you back to 2004.

Yeah but if they had built a time machine they would have done that already..........

increasingdifficulty · « **Reply #6 on:** September 28, 2017, 11:31 »

H. J. Farnsworth: "That * time machine alone set me back 15 years."
Dr. Zoidberg: "If only it had worked, you could go back and not waste your time on it".

Some of the greatest dialogue ever written.

Sean Locke Photography · « **Reply #7 on:** September 28, 2017, 11:58 »

Quote from: Pauws99 on September 28, 2017, 10:45

Quote from: Sean Locke Photography on September 28, 2017, 09:44
Quote from: entheo on September 28, 2017, 08:58
I haven't used microstocks yet. Now I try to earn a little money (say 500/month), as soon as possible.
Pick one site and go exclusive or submit to a few sites? which is a better stratage?
Mainly micro photos and some illustrations.

A better strategy would be to convince yourself you're going to build a time machine, and then wait for yourself to come pick you up from 2030 and take you back to 2004.
Yeah but if they had built a time machine they would have done that already..........

You have to decide at some point you're actually determined to do it. That's when it happens.

Jo Ann Snover · « **Reply #8 on:** September 28, 2017, 15:37 »

Quote from: entheo on September 28, 2017, 08:58

I haven't used microstocks yet. Now I try to earn a little money (say 500/month), as soon as possible.
Pick one site and go exclusive or submit to a few sites? which is a better stratage?
Mainly micro photos and some illustrations.

I think you've put the cart before the horse - have you applied to any agencies yet? How big is your portfolio of images ready to upload? Have you become familiar with submission guidelines (particularly model and property releases) so you know how many of your images could be used for RF stock?

If you want to keep your options open, just submit to those agencies that permit you to (a) delete your own images and (b) do not have a minimum length of time you must leave the images online

Shutterstock and Adobe Stock would both qualify and are the top two earners for many. If you use those two to learn enough about the business, you'll probably then know what you want to do next.

Good luck

cthoman · « **Reply #9 on:** September 28, 2017, 22:42 »

Is there actually a good exclusive deal anymore? I haven't really heard anybody talk about being exclusive in a while. Although, I guess people probably hold their cards a little closer to vest now too.

entheo · « **Reply #10 on:** September 29, 2017, 00:02 »

Quote from: disorderly on September 28, 2017, 09:14

Submit to a few sites. You will learn which ones will accept your work, and which ones have customers who want it. I don't believe exclusivity is a good deal for most creators in the microstock world. I know it would have been bad for me. But how can you know which agency will be the one to devote all your resources to supplying without getting some experience first?

Thanks, that makes sense.

entheo · « **Reply #11 on:** September 29, 2017, 00:08 »

Quote from: ShadySue on September 28, 2017, 10:07

Quote from: Pauws99 on September 28, 2017, 09:40
Quote from: entheo on September 28, 2017, 08:58
I haven't used microstocks yet. Now I try to earn a little money (say 500/month), as soon as possible.
Pick one site and go exclusive or submit to a few sites? which is a better stratage?
Mainly micro photos and some illustrations.

A little money 500 a month? as soon as possible?.......Good luck with that one
Maybe s/he meant cents.

Really？ I read somewhere said $5 per image for a year? So I figure 1200 ok images would do, wouldn't them?

entheo · « **Reply #12 on:** September 29, 2017, 00:11 »

Quote from: Sean Locke Photography on September 28, 2017, 09:44

A better strategy would be to convince yourself you're going to build a time machine, and then wait for yourself to come pick you up from 2030 and take you back to 2004.

what's the new game nowadays?

entheo · « **Reply #13 on:** September 29, 2017, 00:16 »

Quote from: Jo Ann Snover on September 28, 2017, 15:37

I think you've put the cart before the horse - have you applied to any agencies yet? How big is your portfolio of images ready to upload? Have you become familiar with submission guidelines (particularly model and property releases) so you know how many of your images could be used for RF stock?

If you want to keep your options open, just submit to those agencies that permit you to (a) delete your own images and (b) do not have a minimum length of time you must leave the images online

Shutterstock and Adobe Stock would both qualify and are the top two earners for many. If you use those two to learn enough about the business, you'll probably then know what you want to do next.

Good luck

Thanks. I was thanking about IS, but heard it went crazy...

Pauws99 · « **Reply #14 on:** September 29, 2017, 01:31 »

Quote from: entheo on September 29, 2017, 00:08

Quote from: ShadySue on September 28, 2017, 10:07
Quote from: Pauws99 on September 28, 2017, 09:40
Quote from: entheo on September 28, 2017, 08:58
I haven't used microstocks yet. Now I try to earn a little money (say 500/month), as soon as possible.
Pick one site and go exclusive or submit to a few sites? which is a better stratage?
Mainly micro photos and some illustrations.

A little money 500 a month? as soon as possible?.......Good luck with that one
Maybe s/he meant cents.

Really？ I read somewhere said $5 per image for a year? So I figure 1200 ok images would do, wouldn't them?

1200 excellent images maybe but its relative I suppose if you think your definition of "OK" is as good as the best 20% out there....I'm not sure how much research youv'e done but take a look at the sites and ask yourself honestly "will my images compete". But yes only even consider exclusive when you've got some experience under your belt.

ShadySue · « **Reply #15 on:** September 29, 2017, 04:54 »

Quote from: entheo on September 29, 2017, 00:08

Quote from: ShadySue on September 28, 2017, 10:07
Quote from: Pauws99 on September 28, 2017, 09:40
Quote from: entheo on September 28, 2017, 08:58
I haven't used microstocks yet. Now I try to earn a little money (say 500/month), as soon as possible.
Pick one site and go exclusive or submit to a few sites? which is a better stratage?
Mainly micro photos and some illustrations.

A little money 500 a month? as soon as possible?.......Good luck with that one
Maybe s/he meant cents.

Really？ I read somewhere said $5 per image for a year? So I figure 1200 ok images would do, wouldn't them?

I never saw $5 per image per year posited. $1 was the most bandied-about figure in the Glory Days, but of course it all depends on your port, the competition, the agency, and the whim of the search algorithms.

Pauws99 · « **Reply #16 on:** September 29, 2017, 11:25 »

Quote from: ShadySue on September 29, 2017, 04:54

Quote from: entheo on September 29, 2017, 00:08
Quote from: ShadySue on September 28, 2017, 10:07
Quote from: Pauws99 on September 28, 2017, 09:40
Quote from: entheo on September 28, 2017, 08:58
I haven't used microstocks yet. Now I try to earn a little money (say 500/month), as soon as possible.
Pick one site and go exclusive or submit to a few sites? which is a better stratage?
Mainly micro photos and some illustrations.

A little money 500 a month? as soon as possible?.......Good luck with that one
Maybe s/he meant cents.

Really？ I read somewhere said $5 per image for a year? So I figure 1200 ok images would do, wouldn't them?

I never saw $5 per image per year posited. $1 was the most bandied-about figure in the Glory Days, but of course it all depends on your port, the competition, the agency, and the whim of the search algorithms.

I remember $1 an image a year posted re Alamy...didn't believe that one for an average photographer either!

ShadySue · « **Reply #17 on:** September 29, 2017, 11:55 »

Actually, when I think about it, there must have been lots of iS exclusives back in the day who were earning a lot more than $5 per image per annum. My port was never 'commercial' and in my best years I was earning c$2.50 pipa, so the highly commercial togs must have been earning several times more. I don't even want to think about how ~~much~~ little it is nowadays.

To the OP, don't go exclusive unless things change greatly. If you have found that elusive niche which others don't have access to, so can't copy, andwhich lots of buyers want (otherwise go macro for your niche, not micro), you could do well. Otherwise, even if your work is highly commercial, you are very late to the party, and you have lots of well-established competition. Perhaps modify your expections, at least for the first few years.

StanRohrer · « **Reply #18 on:** September 29, 2017, 13:05 »

At one point about 10 years ago I was at US$12-15 PIPY (Per Image Per Year) at iS. Now about $1.28 PIPY and I'm still at the 30% RF Exclusive payout bracket. You need exceptional images to get anywhere at the beginners 15%. Moving up through the iS payout ranks is nearly impossible with today's lower sales and large competition. For me Alamy RM has dropped to $0.35 PIPY or lower. My opinion is there is no future in going exclusive these days. The few perks at iS (_maybe_ some images get forwarded to Getty) are much better covered by submitting to the top 4 or 5 Microstock sites and Alamy. A minor tweak of the search engine at one exclusive site these days can kill your sales and you have no recourse. For beginners today, spreading images across multiple sites reduces the exposure of search engine whims and site politics.

The $1 PIPY was tossed around back in 2002 when I started looking at stock photography. It had apparently been around for years before that. Today, I suspect $1, though still often quoted, is to high for the average calculations. Maybe $0.25 or $0.50 USD.

graphicV · « **Reply #19 on:** September 29, 2017, 14:56 »

Quote from: StanRohrer on September 29, 2017, 13:05

At one point about 10 years ago I was at US$12-15 PIPY (Per Image Per Year) at iS. Now about $1.28 PIPY and I'm still at the 30% RF Exclusive payout bracket. You need exceptional images to get anywhere at the beginners 15%. Moving up through the iS payout ranks is nearly impossible with today's lower sales and large competition. For me Alamy RM has dropped to $0.35 PIPY or lower. My opinion is there is no future in going exclusive these days. The few perks at iS (_maybe_ some images get forwarded to Getty) are much better covered by submitting to the top 4 or 5 Microstock sites and Alamy. A minor tweak of the search engine at one exclusive site these days can kill your sales and you have no recourse. For beginners today, spreading images across multiple sites reduces the exposure of search engine whims and site politics.

The $1 PIPY was tossed around back in 2002 when I started looking at stock photography. It had apparently been around for years before that. Today, I suspect $1, though still often quoted, is to high for the average calculations. Maybe $0.25 or $0.50 USD.

Hmmm, maybe I did not understand it best... You earn 1.28 per image per year on Istock exclusive? I always thought that figure was a lot bigger than that. I am non-exclusive, and I earn about 3$ per image per year on Istock. Overall (all sites), 5.2$ per image per year. I really thought that Istock exclusives earn at least as much as non-exclusives on all sites.

ShadySue · « **Reply #20 on:** September 29, 2017, 16:02 »

Quote from: graphicV on September 29, 2017, 14:56

Hmmm, maybe I did not understand it best... You earn 1.28 per image per year on Istock exclusive? I always thought that figure was a lot bigger than that. I am non-exclusive, and I earn about 3$ per image per year on Istock. Overall (all sites), 5.2$ per image per year. I really thought that Istock exclusives earn at least as much as non-exclusives on all sites.

It's never going to be the same for everyone, as all ports are different.

StanRohrer · « **Reply #21 on:** September 29, 2017, 16:03 »

Quote from: graphicV on September 29, 2017, 14:56

Quote from: StanRohrer on September 29, 2017, 13:05
At one point about 10 years ago I was at US$12-15 PIPY (Per Image Per Year) at iS. Now about $1.28 PIPY and I'm still at the 30% RF Exclusive payout bracket. You need exceptional images to get anywhere at the beginners 15%. Moving up through the iS payout ranks is nearly impossible with today's lower sales and large competition. For me Alamy RM has dropped to $0.35 PIPY or lower. My opinion is there is no future in going exclusive these days. The few perks at iS (_maybe_ some images get forwarded to Getty) are much better covered by submitting to the top 4 or 5 Microstock sites and Alamy. A minor tweak of the search engine at one exclusive site these days can kill your sales and you have no recourse. For beginners today, spreading images across multiple sites reduces the exposure of search engine whims and site politics.

The $1 PIPY was tossed around back in 2002 when I started looking at stock photography. It had apparently been around for years before that. Today, I suspect $1, though still often quoted, is to high for the average calculations. Maybe $0.25 or $0.50 USD.

Hmmm, maybe I did not understand it best... You earn 1.28 per image per year on Istock exclusive? I always thought that figure was a lot bigger than that. I am non-exclusive, and I earn about 3$ per image per year on Istock. Overall (all sites), 5.2$ per image per year. I really thought that Istock exclusives earn at least as much as non-exclusives on all sites.

I think you understood correctly. My iS portfolio was mostly built in 2003 through 2007. I do not shoot lifestyle or people for iS. So content and age are always determining factors in the payback money. The mix of low cost subs also plays in heavily with the math. But my point is that high returns earlier are certainly not the same now.

graphicV · « **Reply #22 on:** September 29, 2017, 16:11 »

Quote from: ShadySue on September 29, 2017, 16:02

Quote from: graphicV on September 29, 2017, 14:56
Hmmm, maybe I did not understand it best... You earn 1.28 per image per year on Istock exclusive? I always thought that figure was a lot bigger than that. I am non-exclusive, and I earn about 3$ per image per year on Istock. Overall (all sites), 5.2$ per image per year. I really thought that Istock exclusives earn at least as much as non-exclusives on all sites.
It's never going to be the same for everyone, as all ports are different.

I agree with you, but frankly, I do not consider my port as high quality. I am vector artist tough. I guess I need to be very happy.

Sean Locke Photography · « **Reply #23 on:** September 29, 2017, 16:54 »

Quote from: StanRohrer on September 29, 2017, 13:05

At one point about 10 years ago I was at US$12-15 PIPY (Per Image Per Year) at iS.

Mine was higher than that. I can't imagine where I'd be today.

StanRohrer · « **Reply #24 on:** September 29, 2017, 16:59 »

I've not researched vector sales (I don't have that artist ability) but I've often thought that vectors had a little more longevity than photos. I may be wrong and certainly the subjects come into play as well, I'm sure.

Over the years iS has pushed the Exclusive content as higher quality. I'm not convinced. There are very good contributors in both camps - for any number of personal reasons. I'd bet a side by side comparison today of the libraries would be much closer in quality than what most people have been led to believe.

I've been exclusive since the first day I could (2003? 2004?) but my port also includes a lot of zero to 5 sales images (or at least average less than 1 sale per year now) that are "junk" and will never see the light of day again. I had a bit of a niche going for years in selling clipped hotrods and cars. There were only a couple other contributors in the space. Through the good years iS paid for about half of 2 kids in private college. Then iS decided they would not accept cars anymore. I made sure to include clipping paths because that added feature was useful to some buyers and iS was the only site that would pass through the clipping paths in the original upload size being sold. Through some periods of history iS also brought the clipping paths through their downsize process when selling smaller file sizes. Hence exclusivity made sense for my clipped work where iS was the only clipping path compatible site. Now I don't even know if iS still carries through clipping paths. So my reason to stay exclusive is the higher percentage of payout as relative to non-ex. But new contributors today may have to find their own set of reasons why going exclusive makes sense. In my mind it doesn't. In my mind it is better to spread out across multiple sales sites to reduce the volatility of site changes and impact on sales. Recently iS said they were starting to shift the search engine back towards newer files so I may take more hits in my remaining sales of old stuff.

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Author Topic: Exclusive VS indie for beginners? (Read 17873 times)

entheo

disorderly

Pauws99

Sean Locke Photography

ShadySue

Pauws99

increasingdifficulty

Sean Locke Photography

Jo Ann Snover

cthoman

entheo

entheo

entheo

entheo

Pauws99

ShadySue

Pauws99

ShadySue

StanRohrer

graphicV

ShadySue

StanRohrer

graphicV

Sean Locke Photography

StanRohrer

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