Quote

Excellent article Alex, it is very difficult to earn good money in this business, but maybe not as bad as your article suggests?

In my limited experience (I started selling stock early last year), I earned just over $500 in the last month with a portfolio of 1,500 images and 20 timelapse videos.

I�d say if you are earning $500 a month from 6,000 images then you�re doing something wrong.

Thanks! I painted a sort of bittersweet picture of how I see the industry going forward. Some hard-working and in-pulse contributors earning $3/4 RPI/year, such as yourself, and on the opposite end, plenty of those with a ridiculous amount of similars earning $0.3/0.4 RPI/year at best. The average and majority should be about $1 RPI/year (perhaps on the optimistic side), hence the 6,000 image-port. Speaking hypothetically can be tricky and it's become a bit academic, unfortunately. I've tried to use my port as an example but it's not the most "average", since few people travel internationally as much as I do!

RPI is only part of the equation and as mentioned above by Pauws99, need to look at the cost to produce such images. In my case, probably like yourself, not considerable since we're shooting locally or incidentally. I know some who do very well shooting from a home-studio. In my case, I use a lot of friends/relatives as models and even myself lately ha, that was fun.

The 4K stuff should get you to those nice monthly amounts. I've sold only 8 videos in my life and still have a long ways to go! 4K would be nice and currently eyeing the GoPro7 to capture some urban hyperlapses and perhaps a drone soon, let's see!

No doubt to what you all say.
But you have to admit, if you are living with a partner with 300�, or have a dayjob, or place with extreme cheap living costs,
this subsidizes the possibility to produce images in a way.

And -if all your dayjob money is going to cover the mentioned things-
-> you dont have many time left to produce enough high quality stuff

MY POINT: A fair royalty should finance production costs not a dayjob or partner etc

Anyway i doubt its possible to live and produce images in portugal with 430�/month

Depends where you live, here in Serbia a middle class man has around 300euros (outside Belgrade where cost and wages are higher), now if you are alone without yourown place it is a problem but still doable, but if you have your place and are living with a partner that also has 300euros it's actually very decent and no we are not living in the tent, we have modern cars (thou buying used ones), computers (not the latest and greatest), phones, fast internet, we go on holidays to seaside etc etc.
Also, I don't think anyone in South-east or just generally Europe would write off 500$ a month, that's one nice lens every month or 10 day all-inclussive holiday in hotel in Egypt or used Ford Fiesta in 5-6 months, especially if all your dayjob money is going to things you mentioned.

If you managed here to somehow pull out about $1000 monthly from stock, you'd be the king of the world all while doing what you love the most.

Quote from: qunamax on November 05, 2018, 13:40

Depends where you live, here in Serbia a middle class man has around 300euros (outside Belgrade where cost and wages are higher), now if you are alone without yourown place it is a problem but still doable, but if you have your place and are living with a partner that also has 300euros it's actually very decent and no we are not living in the tent, we have modern cars (thou buying used ones), computers (not the latest and greatest), phones, fast internet, we go on holidays to seaside etc etc.
Also, I don't think anyone in South-east or just generally Europe would write off 500$ a month, that's one nice lens every month or 10 day all-inclussive holiday in hotel in Egypt or used Ford Fiesta in 5-6 months, especially if all your dayjob money is going to things you mentioned.

If you managed here to somehow pull out about $1000 monthly from stock, you'd be the king of the world all while doing what you love the most.

thats why nowadays 80 % of content are produced in eastern europe...russian and ukraine contributor are uploading the bulk...there are thousand of contributor some loading thousand of images a week...new come out everyday...you know why? because outside moscow in russsia u can live with 7 800 dollar...and in ukraine the  median salary is you know how much? 150 dollar att he moment...teache at public school earn 150 dollar...mcdonald worker 100...sale shop 200.....so you understand that even earning 400 dollar is a lot more and you are doing a funny job...take into account that model are cheap as hell...girl are beautiful and they love be photographed for penny same teenager...that's why you see thousand of people shots....sure there are creative studio and some are best one...i think miles studio and see other in stocksy...or some studio in kiev and moscow...but first of all they have ridiculous cost...i shoot in kiev often and model cost from nothing to 10dollar hours...full studio with concept setup come at 1

Hi Brazilnut, thanks for a wonderful blogpost! I't inspired my to dive deeper down into subcategories.
I was wondering if there is a list of "Print on Demand agencies" somewhere?
All my Illustrations are RF. I'm not sure they would be suitable as posters, but maybe a few.

Once again. Thank you for a great blogpost.

Quote from: oooo on November 05, 2018, 15:42

�.

why? no one OWES us a living - and agencies pay what the market requires - stock photography has ceased (if ever) to be a full time job for most;  those who continue just need to have a realistic expectation - for me, stock provides a sizeable chunk of my travel expenses, not a sole source of income

If one (can) like what he does, no problem with that,
so just some thoughts:

For example it makes sense a country have a legal minimum wage,
otherwise you will always find somebody make it cheaper
-> wage will go near to zero
this causes problems, just take a look globally,
if you cant afford a meal, the cook cant afford to buy your work and so on
-> only the biggest will survive (with max power)

furthermore i would suggest a minimum healthcare system etc is not a bad ting.

So, saying no one owes you a living, seems only one side of a point of view.
Think about -from what ever you live at the moment- says this to you tomorrow.

@Brasilnut can you comment on this?

Quote from: qunamax on November 05, 2018, 09:59

Good reading. I was just wondering is it 2018/2019 related or written years before? If it's current it really sparks hope, which is good.
I was wondering what would happen if one sets to upload 100 images a day (back catalog and new shootings, all of excellent quality and decent commercial value)?
If persistent, it would take 3 months to reach about 9000 images online. How would that compare to 6000 in three years in your opinion?

Quote from: jonbull on November 06, 2018, 11:36

Quote from: qunamax on November 05, 2018, 13:40

Depends where you live, here in Serbia a middle class man has around 300euros (outside Belgrade where cost and wages are higher), now if you are alone without yourown place it is a problem but still doable, but if you have your place and are living with a partner that also has 300euros it's actually very decent and no we are not living in the tent, we have modern cars (thou buying used ones), computers (not the latest and greatest), phones, fast internet, we go on holidays to seaside etc etc.
Also, I don't think anyone in South-east or just generally Europe would write off 500$ a month, that's one nice lens every month or 10 day all-inclussive holiday in hotel in Egypt or used Ford Fiesta in 5-6 months, especially if all your dayjob money is going to things you mentioned.

If you managed here to somehow pull out about $1000 monthly from stock, you'd be the king of the world all while doing what you love the most.

thats why nowadays 80 % of content are produced in eastern europe...russian and ukraine contributor are uploading the bulk...there are thousand of contributor some loading thousand of images a week...new come out everyday...you know why? because outside moscow in russsia u can live with 7 800 dollar...and in ukraine the  median salary is you know how much? 150 dollar att he moment...teache at public school earn 150 dollar...mcdonald worker 100...sale shop 200.....so you understand that even earning 400 dollar is a lot more and you are doing a funny job...take into account that model are cheap as hell...girl are beautiful and they love be photographed for penny same teenager...that's why you see thousand of people shots....sure there are creative studio and some are best one...i think miles studio and see other in stocksy...or some studio in kiev and moscow...but first of all they have ridiculous cost...i shoot in kiev often and model cost from nothing to 10dollar hours...full studio with concept setup come at 1

just to say in kiev   cigarette 0,8 cent package taxi 0,8 cent one ride in center.....pizza and coke in good restaurant...4 dollar....renting is the only thing that cost but outside the center is cheap as hell....imagine earning 600 dollar...200 for rent, 50 for electricity gas mobile phone and all, the rest for going out and eat or buy some stuff. then ty can do some photo work to add some more  money... so what seems unsustainable in europe become a great job in kiev compared to many   other 8 hours day job...that's why you see thousand of contributor from ukraine serbbia russia hungary.

i love food photography but cooking has become super expensive were i live....think of raspberry 2,4 euro 100 gram where i live...in kiev i buy raspberry in the street from old woman, half kilo 1 euro. just to emphasize who you and e are competing against.

Quote from: jonbull on November 06, 2018, 11:46

Quote from: jonbull on November 06, 2018, 11:36

Quote from: qunamax on November 05, 2018, 13:40

Depends where you live, here in Serbia a middle class man has around 300euros (outside Belgrade where cost and wages are higher), now if you are alone without yourown place it is a problem but still doable, but if you have your place and are living with a partner that also has 300euros it's actually very decent and no we are not living in the tent, we have modern cars (thou buying used ones), computers (not the latest and greatest), phones, fast internet, we go on holidays to seaside etc etc.
Also, I don't think anyone in South-east or just generally Europe would write off 500$ a month, that's one nice lens every month or 10 day all-inclussive holiday in hotel in Egypt or used Ford Fiesta in 5-6 months, especially if all your dayjob money is going to things you mentioned.

If you managed here to somehow pull out about $1000 monthly from stock, you'd be the king of the world all while doing what you love the most.

thats why nowadays 80 % of content are produced in eastern europe...russian and ukraine contributor are uploading the bulk...there are thousand of contributor some loading thousand of images a week...new come out everyday...you know why? because outside moscow in russsia u can live with 7 800 dollar...and in ukraine the  median salary is you know how much? 150 dollar att he moment...teache at public school earn 150 dollar...mcdonald worker 100...sale shop 200.....so you understand that even earning 400 dollar is a lot more and you are doing a funny job...take into account that model are cheap as hell...girl are beautiful and they love be photographed for penny same teenager...that's why you see thousand of people shots....sure there are creative studio and some are best one...i think miles studio and see other in stocksy...or some studio in kiev and moscow...but first of all they have ridiculous cost...i shoot in kiev often and model cost from nothing to 10dollar hours...full studio with concept setup come at 1

just to say in kiev   cigarette 0,8 cent package taxi 0,8 cent one ride in center.....pizza and coke in good restaurant...4 dollar....renting is the only thing that cost but outside the center is cheap as hell....imagine earning 600 dollar...200 for rent, 50 for electricity gas mobile phone and all, the rest for going out and eat or buy some stuff. then ty can do some photo work to add some more  money... so what seems unsustainable in europe become a great job in kiev compared to many   other 8 hours day job...that's why you see thousand of contributor from ukraine serbbia russia hungary.

i love food photography but cooking has become super expensive were i live....think of raspberry 2,4 euro 100 gram where i live...in kiev i buy raspberry in the street from old woman, half kilo 1 euro. just to emphasize who you and e are competing against.

I don't know from where, and from when you got these figures�
Your numbers are closer to those of 2006 than to the one of 2018.
Since Euro Maidan the prices have grown a lot in Ukraine� A lot a lot.

To retake your examples:
A pack of cigarette costs from $1 to $2 (Marlboro $1.25)
A simple taxi ride cost no less than 150 uah ($5) today
A bad pizza (Celentano restaurant) cost from $6.80. If you go to Napul� restaurant (the best pizza in Kiev) you will pay 2 3 times more.
Renting a 1 room flat (40 sqm) in an external district costs minimum $250 for a descent "Euro-remont" flat. Downtown you will pay $800 - $1000 for a simple "Euro-remont" flat.

Electricity, Gas etc.
Last month the price of gas has grown 60%.
Cost of transports has grown 1600% during the last 10 years - in 2008 a metro ticket costed 0.5 uah, today it costs 8 uah.
In 2018 the official average salary in Ukraine is $300 a month (march 2018). In Kiev it is $480 (march 2018).
The cost of everything grows very fast, but not the salaries.
In Kiev you don't live with less than $500 a month if you have to pay for the rent of a flat�

Also consider that if you want to buy "foreign" goods they cost 20% more (as minimum)
Cars cost more, cameras cost more, computers cost more, etc. (to buy an enough good computer and an average photo camera with a good lens you need 4 - 6 months of full salary�)

The only true thing that you wrote is about red fruits like raspberry, strawberry, etc. Yes they cost very little $1/kg during the season� and they are so tasty.

https://blogs.elenasmodels.com/en/wages-and-salaries-in-ukraine-2018/

Grivna converter here:
http://www.viaggiatori.net/pagine/monete/UAH.php

Quote from: Chichikov on November 08, 2018, 02:03

Quote from: jonbull on November 06, 2018, 11:46

Quote from: jonbull on November 06, 2018, 11:36

Quote from: qunamax on November 05, 2018, 13:40

Depends where you live, here in Serbia a middle class man has around 300euros (outside Belgrade where cost and wages are higher), now if you are alone without yourown place it is a problem but still doable, but if you have your place and are living with a partner that also has 300euros it's actually very decent and no we are not living in the tent, we have modern cars (thou buying used ones), computers (not the latest and greatest), phones, fast internet, we go on holidays to seaside etc etc.
Also, I don't think anyone in South-east or just generally Europe would write off 500$ a month, that's one nice lens every month or 10 day all-inclussive holiday in hotel in Egypt or used Ford Fiesta in 5-6 months, especially if all your dayjob money is going to things you mentioned.

If you managed here to somehow pull out about $1000 monthly from stock, you'd be the king of the world all while doing what you love the most.

thats why nowadays 80 % of content are produced in eastern europe...russian and ukraine contributor are uploading the bulk...there are thousand of contributor some loading thousand of images a week...new come out everyday...you know why? because outside moscow in russsia u can live with 7 800 dollar...and in ukraine the  median salary is you know how much? 150 dollar att he moment...teache at public school earn 150 dollar...mcdonald worker 100...sale shop 200.....so you understand that even earning 400 dollar is a lot more and you are doing a funny job...take into account that model are cheap as hell...girl are beautiful and they love be photographed for penny same teenager...that's why you see thousand of people shots....sure there are creative studio and some are best one...i think miles studio and see other in stocksy...or some studio in kiev and moscow...but first of all they have ridiculous cost...i shoot in kiev often and model cost from nothing to 10dollar hours...full studio with concept setup come at 1

just to say in kiev   cigarette 0,8 cent package taxi 0,8 cent one ride in center.....pizza and coke in good restaurant...4 dollar....renting is the only thing that cost but outside the center is cheap as hell....imagine earning 600 dollar...200 for rent, 50 for electricity gas mobile phone and all, the rest for going out and eat or buy some stuff. then ty can do some photo work to add some more  money... so what seems unsustainable in europe become a great job in kiev compared to many   other 8 hours day job...that's why you see thousand of contributor from ukraine serbbia russia hungary.

i love food photography but cooking has become super expensive were i live....think of raspberry 2,4 euro 100 gram where i live...in kiev i buy raspberry in the street from old woman, half kilo 1 euro. just to emphasize who you and e are competing against.

I don't know from where, and from when you got these figures�
Your numbers are closer to those of 2006 than to the one of 2018.
Since Euro Maidan the prices have grown a lot in Ukraine� A lot a lot.

To retake your examples:
A pack of cigarette costs from $1 to $2 (Marlboro $1.25)
A simple taxi ride cost no less than 150 uah ($5) today
A bad pizza (Celentano restaurant) cost from $6.80. If you go to Napul� restaurant (the best pizza in Kiev) you will pay 2 3 times more.
Renting a 1 room flat (40 sqm) in an external district costs minimum $250 for a descent "Euro-remont" flat. Downtown you will pay $800 - $1000 for a simple "Euro-remont" flat.

Electricity, Gas etc.
Last month the price of gas has grown 60%.
Cost of transports has grown 1600% during the last 10 years - in 2008 a metro ticket costed 0.5 uah, today it costs 8 uah.
In 2018 the official average salary in Ukraine is $300 a month (march 2018). In Kiev it is $480 (march 2018).
The cost of everything grows very fast, but not the salaries.
In Kiev you don't live with less than $500 a month if you have to pay for the rent of a flat�

Also consider that if you want to buy "foreign" goods they cost 20% more (as minimum)
Cars cost more, cameras cost more, computers cost more, etc. (to buy an enough good computer and an average photo camera with a good lens you need 4 - 6 months of full salary�)

The only true thing that you wrote is about red fruits like raspberry, strawberry, etc. Yes they cost very little $1/kg during the season� and they are so tasty.

https://blogs.elenasmodels.com/en/wages-and-salaries-in-ukraine-2018/

Grivna converter here:
http://www.viaggiatori.net/pagine/monete/UAH.php

i know people who   work in bank and earn 10000 gryvna month...in bank!!...your salary statistic is biased towards a small group of people who earn a lot....480 dollar is 12000 gryvna.i doubt shop seller or people working in cafe earn   this.....my friend from zhytomir has mother who work in hospital...she earn 7000 gryvna...your stats are biased towards kiev....mos contributor in ukraien comes from outside kiev.

"If one sets out to upload 100 images/day at "excellent quality and decent commercial value" over 90 days, my prediction would be that after an initial boost as "fresh content", it would then take at least a further 3-5 months until the algos do their thing and those images reach their peak in keyword rankings to earn their peak amounts, before slowly depreciating at about 3% a month until reaching a floor (they'll never become worthless)."


100 images pr day?! HELP DEAR GOD! If I'm good I can do 4 images pr. day. I think you ment 100 images in 90 days? Sorry, I'm not used to MS terms. But thanks again for important insights.

"I recall reading somewhere that uploading slowly and consistently is better than all at once in terms of earnings, plus you wouldn't be want to do keywording for 5 hours a day for the next 3 months as you'll probably drive yourself crazy. Plus you may get a nasty reviewer who will just reject a whole batch. In the end they would probably earn about the same in their lifetime but always keep in mind that some images are more time-sensitive than others!"

I totally agree!