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Author Topic: model and property releases  (Read 16128 times)

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eyeCatchLight

  • Imagination is more important than knowledge.
« on: September 16, 2009, 11:24 »
0
Hello,

I am new to microstock... and totally confused about all the model and property release things. I hope I don't post into the wrong section, but I found no section for this...

So at first, when exactly do you need a model release? I have two examples of photos below where you don't see the person's face, hence...no model release? Even if the person is the main subject of the photo? (I won't actually use those, they're just snapshots of my friends ;-)), just as an example)

And then what makes me much more confused are all the property releases..... I mean I can never be sure to be alright if I don't go into each of the buildings of my pictures and ask... For example I took a picture of the Alaska railway. Is it protected, do I have to remove their logo from the train, etc etc...... :-(

I also took a good picture of New York Times Square. But with all the logos....brand names, etc. Can I upload it?? Even if I remove them all (which is practically impossible), that would not be Times Square then...

Thank you so much for your answers!
S.


« Reply #1 on: September 16, 2009, 12:28 »
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Istock recently posted an article regarding model releases that may be helpful.

http://www.istockphoto.com/article_view.php?ID=648

eyeCatchLight

  • Imagination is more important than knowledge.
« Reply #2 on: September 16, 2009, 13:34 »
0
Oh thanks! Reading this I conclude that for both pictures I'd need model releases. Right?

What about the logo on a railway?

And Times Square?

Thank you so much! :-))

« Reply #3 on: September 16, 2009, 13:36 »
0
Read around here for a bit:
http://www.danheller.com/model-release.html

All sites have different levels of concern for risk as to what you will need a release for.

« Reply #4 on: September 16, 2009, 14:21 »
0
What about the logo on a railway?

And Times Square?


Logo (any) remove them or submit as editorial.
Times Square: Submit as editorial.

-Larry

« Reply #5 on: November 22, 2009, 13:37 »
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On a tangent (I didn't want to start a new thread for this), does the witness on a Model Release need to be a third person, not the Model or Photographer? Its a simple question, but I would like to clarify.

« Reply #6 on: November 22, 2009, 14:13 »
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On a tangent (I didn't want to start a new thread for this), does the witness on a Model Release need to be a third person, not the Model or Photographer? Its a simple question, but I would like to clarify.

Yes.  And if it's a release for a minor, it needs to be a fourth person (not the model, the signing parent or guardian or the photographer).

« Reply #7 on: November 22, 2009, 14:23 »
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On a tangent (I didn't want to start a new thread for this), does the witness on a Model Release need to be a third person, not the Model or Photographer? Its a simple question, but I would like to clarify.

Yes.  And if it's a release for a minor, it needs to be a fourth person (not the model, the signing parent or guardian or the photographer).

Thankyou.

« Reply #8 on: November 22, 2009, 18:42 »
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Yes.  And if it's a release for a minor, it needs to be a fourth person (not the model, the signing parent or guardian or the photographer).
On the Getty/iStock release (which I use now with site logo removed) and for a minor model, the name of the model should be filled in but the model doesn't have to sign. Only 3 signatures are still needed: photog, parent/guardian, witness.

« Reply #9 on: November 22, 2009, 19:16 »
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On the Getty/iStock release (which I use now with site logo removed) and for a minor model, the name of the model should be filled in but the model doesn't have to sign. Only 3 signatures are still needed: photog, parent/guardian, witness.

True, and I never suggested otherwise.  My point is that there are now four people involved: a model, a parent/guardian, a photographer and a witness.  For every release but iStock's, only two of the four sign.

« Reply #10 on: November 23, 2009, 04:39 »
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True, and I never suggested otherwise.  My point is that there are now four people involved: a model, a parent/guardian, a photographer and a witness.  For every release but iStock's, only two of the four sign.

But that has always been like that: also DT and SS ask a witness (third person) to sign. The only PITA of iStock's release is that they require the bday of the model and a photo ID.

RT


« Reply #11 on: November 23, 2009, 06:02 »
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The only PITA of iStock's release is that they require the bday of the model and a photo ID.

You don't have to supply a photo ID, just attach a photo of the model that's all.

« Reply #12 on: April 20, 2010, 05:22 »
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...On the Getty/iStock release (which I use now with site logo removed) ....
You can still use this for Dreamstime? Mine got rejected.

« Reply #13 on: April 20, 2010, 07:27 »
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...On the Getty/iStock release (which I use now with site logo removed) ....
You can still use this for Dreamstime? Mine got rejected.
Really? Mine got all accepted. What was the remark?

« Reply #14 on: April 20, 2010, 07:37 »
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...On the Getty/iStock release (which I use now with site logo removed) ....
You can still use this for Dreamstime? Mine got rejected.
Really? Mine got all accepted. What was the remark?
Rejection reason: "Your MR document is governed by the laws of a different country than the model's or photographer's and other than US..."

« Reply #15 on: April 20, 2010, 08:15 »
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...On the Getty/iStock release (which I use now with site logo removed) ....
You can still use this for Dreamstime? Mine got rejected.
Really? Mine got all accepted. What was the remark?
Rejection reason: "Your MR document is governed by the laws of a different country than the model's or photographer's and other than US..."

I just uploaded the IS release, with logo and address removed, last week to the other sites and it got accepted. In the second paragraph on the left in the IS release it says "...this release is irrevocable. worldwide and perpetual, and will be governed by the laws (excluding...etc). Change it to read "I agree that this release is irrevocable, worldwide and perpetual, and will be governed by the laws of the country/state." That should do it.

« Reply #16 on: April 20, 2010, 09:33 »
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...On the Getty/iStock release (which I use now with site logo removed) ....
You can still use this for Dreamstime? Mine got rejected.
Really? Mine got all accepted. What was the remark?
Rejection reason: "Your MR document is governed by the laws of a different country than the model's or photographer's and other than US..."
I just uploaded the IS release, with logo and address removed, last week to the other sites and it got accepted. In the second paragraph on the left in the IS release it says "...this release is irrevocable. worldwide and perpetual, and will be governed by the laws (excluding...etc). Change it to read "I agree that this release is irrevocable, worldwide and perpetual, and will be governed by the laws of the country/state." That should do it.
Thanks for your help.
Few questions:
Did iStock accept the altered MR or did you post it there as original unaltered?
Did you alter the document digitally after signing or do you get your models to sign 2 versions of it??


« Reply #17 on: April 20, 2010, 10:02 »
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For IS, you use exactly as it appears on their release. Then I altered to use for the other sites, BEFORE the model signs, as I may have different models. This serves as a master. Then I had my model sign 2 different releases, one for IS and one for other sites, so I have originals on file.

« Reply #18 on: April 20, 2010, 10:16 »
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For IS, you use exactly as it appears on their release. Then I altered to use for the other sites, BEFORE the model signs, as I may have different models. This serves as a master. Then I had my model sign 2 different releases, one for IS and one for other sites, so I have originals on file.
Thank You.

« Reply #19 on: April 20, 2010, 10:50 »
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...On the Getty/iStock release (which I use now with site logo removed) ....
You can still use this for Dreamstime? Mine got rejected.
Really? Mine got all accepted. What was the remark?
Rejection reason: "Your MR document is governed by the laws of a different country than the model's or photographer's and other than US..."
Yes, I had that too once. The country you fill in should be either (a) your own (as photographer), (b) that of the model, (c) the US+state. In my case it was a mistake of them since I filled in 'Belgium' (my official country of residence) but they couldn't read my address well (font too small, pt 7.5). They accepted the release anyways after my explanation. I changed my address now to pt. 9 which shows well on the release (I upload 1024px small side).
The reason I put in 'Belgium' (my country of residence) as jurisdiction is that in the very unlikely case of litigation, I don't want to travel to the US and I certainly don't want any case before a Filipino court.
« Last Edit: April 20, 2010, 12:26 by FD-amateur »

« Reply #20 on: April 20, 2010, 10:55 »
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For IS, you use exactly as it appears on their release. Then I altered to use for the other sites, BEFORE the model signs, as I may have different models. This serves as a master. Then I had my model sign 2 different releases, one for IS and one for other sites, so I have originals on file.

It's such a mess... My generic release (IS/Getty logos removed) has been accepted by all sites, included IS (of course). I just enlarged some fonts on their release and added more space for the signature. Download here (MS-word format converted from PDF).

« Reply #21 on: April 20, 2010, 11:56 »
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My generic release (IS/Getty logos removed) has been accepted by all sites, included IS (of course).

That's good to know. That will at least get it down to just one release used by all sites. So if I understand you correctly...I am in the US, so for the country language in the second paragraph I could just change to "I agree that this release is irrevocable, worldwide and perpetual, and will be governed by the laws of the United States"?

« Reply #22 on: April 20, 2010, 12:19 »
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That's good to know. That will at least get it down to just one release used by all sites. So if I understand you correctly...I am in the US, so for the country language in the second paragraph I could just change to "I agree that this release is irrevocable, worldwide and perpetual, and will be governed by the laws of the United States"?
I guess you will have to add the US state too, since laws might be different per state. IS mentions "New York".
I just had a look at the DT and SS releases, and there is no mentioning of any country of jurisdiction. So perhaps it's overkill, but the simplest way to go is follow the IS release since they are the strictest.

« Reply #23 on: April 20, 2010, 12:50 »
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OK thanks.

« Reply #24 on: April 20, 2010, 13:47 »
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That's good to know. That will at least get it down to just one release used by all sites. So if I understand you correctly...I am in the US, so for the country language in the second paragraph I could just change to "I agree that this release is irrevocable, worldwide and perpetual, and will be governed by the laws of the United States"?
I guess you will have to add the US state too, since laws might be different per state. IS mentions "New York".
I just had a look at the DT and SS releases, and there is no mentioning of any country of jurisdiction. So perhaps it's overkill, but the simplest way to go is follow the IS release since they are the strictest.
Thanks!

« Reply #25 on: July 12, 2010, 14:22 »
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So what if we take pictures in a public park?

« Reply #26 on: July 12, 2010, 20:18 »
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...On the Getty/iStock release (which I use now with site logo removed) ....
You can still use this for Dreamstime? Mine got rejected.

I've twice had rejections for model release since using my version of istock's (mine is reformatted with logo and ethincity parts removed so that I get 2 per a4 page). Both rejections were from istock :) - your model release is not valid please use the istock release. Both times (about 3 weeks apart) I reuploaded the same release and went through fine. For the other sites I put "N/A - generic release" in shoot description and that has been fine.


« Reply #27 on: July 19, 2010, 21:09 »
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Ive had several photos rejected because of the  Model Releases of people with no last name.

My family is from Indonesia and many if not most people there dont have last names.

Even my wifes US Immigration visa used her first name as her last name. For the first name they put FNU.
I called her FNU for a while, (first name unknown).

Shutterstock, Dreamtime, Veer will not accept the model release of people who signed a release with only one name.
I asked shutterstock Customer Service and they just said don't resubmit the photo with the same MR.

Fotolia, canstock, Alamy, BS, 123, Snapixel don't seem to care about not having both a first and last name.


Any ideas?
« Last Edit: July 19, 2010, 21:13 by have none »

« Reply #28 on: July 19, 2010, 21:46 »
0
Ive had several photos rejected because of the  Model Releases of people with no last name.

My family is from Indonesia and many if not most people there dont have last names.

Even my wifes US Immigration visa used her first name as her last name. For the first name they put FNU.
I called her FNU for a while, (first name unknown).

Shutterstock, Dreamtime, Veer will not accept the model release of people who signed a release with only one name.
I asked shutterstock Customer Service and they just said don't resubmit the photo with the same MR.

Fotolia, canstock, Alamy, BS, 123, Snapixel don't seem to care about not having both a first and last name.


Any ideas?

I'd try with FNU :)

(or just call everyone Brian :))

« Reply #29 on: July 22, 2010, 07:55 »
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I really didn't want to lie, but if some of these editor's can not understand that some people just don't have last names, What else can I do?


I just have another photo rejected for not having a models phone number on a release. The model in the photo is a poor villager in a remote part of Indonesia.

That person doesn't even have electricity or running water.


Do you guys just fill in the blanks spaces on the releases to satisfy the editors  ??? 

« Reply #30 on: July 22, 2010, 09:19 »
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Is a person with no phone number, electricity or running water able to read and fully comprehend the implications of a release?

You can make it work at IS:
http://www.istockphoto.com/article_view.php?ID=648&Page=2

RacePhoto

« Reply #31 on: July 23, 2010, 17:32 »
0
Ive had several photos rejected because of the  Model Releases of people with no last name.

My family is from Indonesia and many if not most people there dont have last names.

Even my wifes US Immigration visa used her first name as her last name. For the first name they put FNU.
I called her FNU for a while, (first name unknown).

Shutterstock, Dreamtime, Veer will not accept the model release of people who signed a release with only one name.
I asked shutterstock Customer Service and they just said don't resubmit the photo with the same MR.

Fotolia, canstock, Alamy, BS, 123, Snapixel don't seem to care about not having both a first and last name.


Any ideas?

I'd try with FNU :)

(or just call everyone Brian :))

Or call everything and everyone Eric (for the Monty Python Fans)

What's funny is my Indonesian friends not only have both names, but some have their Chinese Names, and their America names as well. That would be quite a collection of names to choose from. :) Daliana is Chen and also Jean.

So lets see, no models with one name? Where do I start? Twiggy? Iman? Fabio? Verushka?

« Reply #32 on: July 24, 2010, 07:40 »
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I guess the editors have not heard of people with only one name before and don't know how to deal with it.

Most of the Chinese Indonesians and the Christians Indonesians have more than one name. The native Indonesians are the ones that generally only have a first name.

There are places still today in Indonesia where people live without running water, telephones or electricity and live normal lives. Well normal for them.
They own business, work, go to school.

So, they can and do understand what they are signing when explained to them in their native language. 
 

Nobody has come out and said it but I might be easier just to fill in the blanks for the editors.

« Reply #33 on: July 25, 2010, 20:35 »
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There are places still today in Indonesia where people live without running water, telephones or electricity and live normal lives. Well normal for them.

Living most of the time in Northern Mindanao, I can witness this kind of situations. They are quite normal in the rural areas, and those people don't walk around like savages in tribal outfit at all.

"No running water" means nothing. This is the tropics and it rains all the time. It's easy to catch and store it. Everybody has "nannies", unemployed girls that do all the washing by hand, the cooking, the cleaning and fetching water at a totally clean mountain stream (many of those!) for 30$ a month (if you feed them too).

Telephone? Landlines are scarce and only in the cities. Who needs them with all the area covered by cellphone antennas? If they don't have a cellphone themselves, their mom or dad has one, a cousin in the extended family that lives in the group or the barangay captain has one. That cellphone is shared in the group.

No electricity? Well even in my suburban gated compound, we have rotating brownouts of 6hrs per day. The money for the maintenance of the hydroelectric power stations ended up in the pockets of some politicians. I heard things like that are standard practice in Indonesia too. I run on a home generator then which is a PITA since the fuel costs me as much as a month's rent. When in Rome, do as the Romans.

Street names and house numbers? Hahaha. Everybody knows were everybody lives so why would you need that? Poverty? They live better and more relaxed than many people in the West, having to rush around to get by.

The dad of my models is the mayor of one of these rural places. Everybody can find him and he gets his snail mail but he has no street name nor house number. iStock accepted the release without problems, you just have to mention it clearly. Of course, I attached a photo with her holding the completed release and her school ID next to her head.

« Last Edit: July 25, 2010, 20:46 by FD-regular »

« Reply #34 on: July 26, 2010, 13:47 »
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Thanks for the Tip FD

Very helpful and will give it try.

« Reply #35 on: August 05, 2010, 14:56 »
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Hello Friends!

3 times the model release for minor was rejected by Fotolia.

My images were not accepted because not proper models release.

I'm really confused how to create the model release in order to pass their editor control. Can you give me an example of model release for Fotolia, please?

Please see attachment.

Thank you in advance,

George
« Last Edit: August 05, 2010, 15:32 by usruss »

« Reply #36 on: August 05, 2010, 16:01 »
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I'm really confused how to create the model release in order to pass their editor control. Can you give me an example of model release for Fotolia, please?


I found Fotolia's model release for a minor at http://us.fotolia.com/Info/Release/View/release_minor.  It requires an address, which is missing from your example.  The one I use came from Shutterstock; it also requires a telephone number.  I've had it accepted at all the other agencies to which I submit.

I would also note that the release you included has separate locations for the date the release was signed and the date of the shoot.  That second date field is blank, which may be your problem.


« Reply #37 on: August 05, 2010, 16:13 »
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Thank you very much disorderly! I guess I'm getting old not to notice that the date and address are missing.

Thanks again!


 

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