Author Topic: This should settle some different opinions (Read 132480 times)

Lizard · « **Reply #750 on:** July 12, 2023, 14:03 »

Quote from: stoker2014 on July 12, 2023, 13:44

Some authors exaggerate russia's ability to use nuclear weapons effectively. russia does not have missiles capable of overcoming the air defense of NATO countries. The United States can destroy the nuclear perimeter of russia in exactly 2 hours. If desired, NATO can turn all of Russia into nuclear ashes Naturally, from a purely environmental point of view, this will not be done, but destroying Russian nuclear weapons is not a problem for NATO. Allegedly, the "second army of the world" is retreating under pressure from the Armed Forces of Ukraine. Therefore, there is no need to scare anyone here with the Russian red button, nuclear suitcase, etc.

This can be written by a kid with no knowledge whatsoever.

Answer this ?

Give me one war in modern history that inculcated modern arms that had less civil vs military casualties level than this in Ukraine ?

They can destroy Ukraine in a day and no world would move a finger.

Secondly, if Russia fired all it has just that what would pass the defense could destroy the civilization and Europe would be thing of the past.

And let me remind you who retreated from Vietnam, who lost in the Bay of Pigs Invasion or how the Korean adventure ended.

Leave your whataboutisms for your friends on the slider, and let adults decide on this. And your adults are fckn afraid cause if not they would addmit Ukraine in NATO today and end the thing but they cant

Lizard · « **Reply #751 on:** July 12, 2023, 14:23 »

Just to debunk the stupidity:

David Barash, who has written about preventing nuclear war, told Newsweek the chance of the U.S. intercepting a nuclear-armed Inter Continental Ballistic Missile (ICBM) is "extremely low."

"We shouldn't be fooled by the moderate success that 'anti-missile defense systems' have been having in Ukraine," Barash said. "The missiles in question have been mostly cruise missiles of one sort or other; they fly about 500 mph, whereas ballistic missiles re-entering the atmosphere are about 15,000 mph."

"Intercepting them is an order of magnitude more difficult: Khrushchev likened it to 'hitting a bullet with a bullet,' and although anti-missile technology has evolved since then, so has offensive tech. The prospects of the U.S., or anyone, successfully intercepting ICBMs are extremely low," he said.

3. Just out of curiosity, how much of the United States could be reached by a Russian nuclear attack?

All of it. Russia deploys at least 1,500 warheads on hundreds of missiles based from air, land, and sea platforms that can strike the entire U.S. homeland.

Russia also is developing brand new “novel” capabilities that can strike the U.S., like hypersonic missiles and a nuclear-powered cruise missile and torpedo. Fortunately, the United States also maintains a nuclear triad that can strike all of Russia, providing a strong deterrent to a Russian attack.

The difference is that while Russia has modernized its nuclear forces about 90% of the way through, the U.S. still relies on platforms built during the Cold War. For instance, the U.S. is still squeezing life out of the Minuteman III intercontinental ballistic missile that was designed in 1960.

Programs to replace these outdated capabilities with modern systems are just getting underway, and each year must overcome opposition from far-left members of Congress.

https://www.newsweek.com/us-safe-nuclear-attack-1753288

https://www.ucsusa.org/nuclear-weapons/missile-defense

https://www.heritage.org/defense/commentary/answers-6-big-questions-about-putins-nuclear-threats

Lizard · « **Reply #752 on:** July 12, 2023, 14:32 »

Frankly, I don't think there's anything that the West can do to stop President Putin from using a tactical nuclear weapon in Ukraine if he chooses to do so.

https://www.rferl.org/a/ukraine-russia-dam-putin-nuclear-threats-kevin-ryan/32449075.html

As I said, your generals share my point of view but you know best

stoker2014 · « **Reply #753 on:** July 12, 2023, 15:10 »

Quote from: Lizard on July 12, 2023, 14:32

Frankly, I don't think there's anything that the West can do to stop President Putin from using a tactical nuclear weapon in Ukraine if he chooses to do so.

https://www.rferl.org/a/ukraine-russia-dam-putin-nuclear-threats-kevin-ryan/32449075.html

As I said, your generals share my point of view but you know best

It's just opinion and fear. According to military experts, tactical nuclear weapons will not stop the Armed Forces of Ukraine.

stoker2014 · « **Reply #754 on:** July 12, 2023, 15:12 »

Quote from: Lizard on July 12, 2023, 14:03

Quote from: stoker2014 on July 12, 2023, 13:44
Some authors exaggerate russia's ability to use nuclear weapons effectively. russia does not have missiles capable of overcoming the air defense of NATO countries. The United States can destroy the nuclear perimeter of russia in exactly 2 hours. If desired, NATO can turn all of Russia into nuclear ashes Naturally, from a purely environmental point of view, this will not be done, but destroying Russian nuclear weapons is not a problem for NATO. Allegedly, the "second army of the world" is retreating under pressure from the Armed Forces of Ukraine. Therefore, there is no need to scare anyone here with the Russian red button, nuclear suitcase, etc.

This can be written by a kid with no knowledge whatsoever.

Answer this ?

Give me one war in modern history that inculcated modern arms that had less civil vs military casualties level than this in Ukraine ?

They can destroy Ukraine in a day and no world would move a finger.

Secondly, if Russia fired all it has just that what would pass the defense could destroy the civilization and Europe would be thing of the past.

And let me remind you who retreated from Vietnam, who lost in the Bay of Pigs Invasion or how the Korean adventure ended.

Leave your whataboutisms for your friends on the slider, and let adults decide on this. And your adults are fckn afraid cause if not they would addmit Ukraine in NATO today and end the thing but they cant

These are all the threats and dreams of Russian propaganda. You need to listen to the alcoholic Dmitry Medvedev, he every morning from a hangover shoots nuclear missiles all over the world.

stoker2014 · « **Reply #755 on:** July 12, 2023, 15:16 »

Quote from: Lizard on July 12, 2023, 14:23

Just to debunk the stupidity:

David Barash, who has written about preventing nuclear war, told Newsweek the chance of the U.S. intercepting a nuclear-armed Inter Continental Ballistic Missile (ICBM) is "extremely low."

"We shouldn't be fooled by the moderate success that 'anti-missile defense systems' have been having in Ukraine," Barash said. "The missiles in question have been mostly cruise missiles of one sort or other; they fly about 500 mph, whereas ballistic missiles re-entering the atmosphere are about 15,000 mph."

"Intercepting them is an order of magnitude more difficult: Khrushchev likened it to 'hitting a bullet with a bullet,' and although anti-missile technology has evolved since then, so has offensive tech. The prospects of the U.S., or anyone, successfully intercepting ICBMs are extremely low," he said.

3. Just out of curiosity, how much of the United States could be reached by a Russian nuclear attack?

All of it. Russia deploys at least 1,500 warheads on hundreds of missiles based from air, land, and sea platforms that can strike the entire U.S. homeland.

Russia also is developing brand new “novel” capabilities that can strike the U.S., like hypersonic missiles and a nuclear-powered cruise missile and torpedo. Fortunately, the United States also maintains a nuclear triad that can strike all of Russia, providing a strong deterrent to a Russian attack.

The difference is that while Russia has modernized its nuclear forces about 90% of the way through, the U.S. still relies on platforms built during the Cold War. For instance, the U.S. is still squeezing life out of the Minuteman III intercontinental ballistic missile that was designed in 1960.

Programs to replace these outdated capabilities with modern systems are just getting underway, and each year must overcome opposition from far-left members of Congress.

https://www.newsweek.com/us-safe-nuclear-attack-1753288

https://www.ucsusa.org/nuclear-weapons/missile-defense

https://www.heritage.org/defense/commentary/answers-6-big-questions-about-putins-nuclear-threats

Nonsense. If in Soviet times the Russians posed some kind of threat, now the Russians have drunk and plundered everything. The latest tests of their ballistic missiles were unsuccessful. No one in that Russia even knows what state their nuclear potential is in, everything is outdated there and the expiration date has expired. Most likely, Russian nuclear weapons will explode faster on Russian territory than even reach Europe. Not to mention that the United States has warned the Russians over the past year that they will launch preemptive strikes first, and these strikes will be serious.
No need to scare here with a wild dying bear.
Are you afraid of Russians? This is your personal problem. Ukraine and Ukrainians are not afraid of the Russians, and the result of the Armed Forces of Ukraine on the battlefield is more than impressive. Yes, many EU countries are ready to fall to their knees and surrender at the sight of a Russian orc, but the example of Ukraine shows that Russians can be quickly and effectively eliminated.

Glory to Ukraine!

stoker2014 · « **Reply #756 on:** July 12, 2023, 15:20 »

Quote from: Lizard on July 12, 2023, 14:03

This can be written by a kid with no knowledge whatsoever.

I see you are a military expert here who knows everything, knows the state of the nuclear arsenal in rotten russia and knows what the USA, Great Britain, and France have and do not have. Nu-nu, make me laugh with your posts again.

Lizard, what country do you live in and why do you post Russian fakes here?

LDV81 · « **Reply #757 on:** July 12, 2023, 15:21 »

Quote from: Lizard on July 12, 2023, 14:23

The difference is that while Russia has modernized its nuclear forces about 90% of the way through, the U.S. still relies on platforms built during the Cold War.

I don't know what you're smoking, but maybe change the dealer.

HIMARS, 40-year old NATO technology, has basically stopped all Russian advances. Has anyone seen the famous Russian Armata tanks in action?

Yes, Russia pumped billions into its military, but it was spent on yachts and hookers.

Russia is now a vassal state of China. China will not allow Russia to use nukes, even if they had some working ones. China has a plan about how to become the No. 1 superpower. And that plan doesn't include some Russian psychopathic-ultrareligious moron shooting nukes, because it makes things very unpredictable. Xi can literally obliterate the Russian economy with a single sentence.

stoker2014 · « **Reply #758 on:** July 12, 2023, 15:33 »

Quote from: Lizard on July 12, 2023, 14:03

They can destroy Ukraine in a day and no world would move a finger.

This is the 500th day of Russia's full-scale invasion of Ukraine. Russia fired all the missiles it had on Ukraine. And what?

LDV81 · « **Reply #759 on:** July 12, 2023, 15:34 »

Quote from: Lizard on July 12, 2023, 14:03

And let me remind you who retreated from Vietnam, who lost in the Bay of Pigs Invasion or how the Korean adventure ended.

Let me remind you then who managed to lose a naval battle against Czechoslovakia, a country without access to sea:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Lake_Baikal

Let me remind you that some 200,000 Russian soldiers are in Finland, but about 1 meter deep in the ground.

Let me remind you how Poland kicked Russians butts:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish%E2%80%93Soviet_War

Zero Talent · « **Reply #760 on:** July 12, 2023, 16:49 »

Quote from: Lizard on July 12, 2023, 13:22

To come as an ally and to come and commit largest genocide in history killing 50 Millions people and stealing their land is now a same thing.

Yeah, the Croats invaded the Balkans as allies of the local population. Riiiight!

They didn't occupy those lands, they didn't murdered the autochthonous tribes, they didn't raid, rape and plunder all the Balkans and the Byzantine empire.
They all came in peace and were welcomed with flowers by the natives Thracian and Illiryian tribes, who joyfully gave them their lands. Riiiight!

Continue to believe these national myths you were brainwashed from childhood with, and never thought to challenge (until today, hopefuly?)

One more thing: the first croat migrants in the US were mentioned as early as 1715. So if I'd be in your shoes, I wouldn't exclude the participation of croats in the genocide against the native American population, the same way I wouldn't exclude the participation of any other ethnicity migrating to the new world, back in those days.

Lizard · « **Reply #761 on:** July 12, 2023, 17:30 »

Quote from: Zero Talent on July 12, 2023, 16:49

Quote from: Lizard on July 12, 2023, 13:22

To come as an ally and to come and commit largest genocide in history killing 50 Millions people and stealing their land is now a same thing.

Yeah, the Croats invaded the Balkans as allies of the local population. Riiiight!

They didn't occupy those lands, they didn't murdered the autochthonous tribes, they didn't raid, rape and plunder all the Balkans and the Byzantine empire.
They all came in peace and were welcomed with flowers by the natives Thracian and Illiryian tribes, who joyfully gave them their lands. Riiiight!

Continue to believe these national myths you were brainwashed from childhood with, and never thought to challenge (until today, hopefuly?)

One more thing: the first croat migrants in the US were mentioned as early as 1715. So if I'd be in your shoes, I wouldn't exclude the participation of croats in the genocide against the native American population, the same way I wouldn't exclude the participation of any other ethnicity migrating to the new world, back in those days.

Those who embraced nazism even used to have a camp for mass killing Serbian children during WWII even Hitler was disgusted about. Then they mostly escaped to America and their children and grandchildren are singing songs glorifying those killings all around the west.

Here is one from Chicago: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L27oCe1lOeg

US and other western countries literary don't have problems with that, they were considered refugees from communism and many of them had a lot of money they stole from ones they killed so they could buy their spot in society.

You will recognize them easily with flags with firs white square on the emblem and their flags will be on their windows on day celebrating birthdays and deaths of their nazi leaders.

Those ones who chased them away...those are the problems of central Europe

Lizard · « **Reply #762 on:** July 12, 2023, 18:03 »

Quote from: stoker2014 on July 12, 2023, 15:20

Quote from: Lizard on July 12, 2023, 14:03
This can be written by a kid with no knowledge whatsoever.
I see you are a military expert here who knows everything, knows the state of the nuclear arsenal in rotten russia and knows what the USA, Great Britain, and France have and do not have. Nu-nu, make me laugh with your posts again.

Lizard, what country do you live in and why do you post Russian fakes here?

Well, as you can see Im quoting your generals who are apparently talking russian fakes

And here is one of the 18 years old me at the end of the front raw after 5 weeks training marching on 100 times more armed Russian puppets Serbian JNA forces in 1992.

I volunteered, so I guess now is your turn, Im sure they would gladly have you against russian on Ukrainian fields at the moment. As I see you wouldn't mind a little fight keep us informed when you arrive

stoker2014 · « **Reply #763 on:** July 13, 2023, 02:03 »

Quote from: Lizard on July 12, 2023, 18:03

Well, as you can see Im quoting your generals who are apparently talking russian fakes

You don't know who I am, and the generals you quoted are not my generals. All that you quoted is very outdated information that is of no value and is Russian fakes. There are many useful idiots in the world who, for money or out of their stupidity, repeat what Russian propaganda tells them.
You better be interested in real events. So, the Russian myth about the Russian army as the second army in the world turned into a fake back in 2022.

Justanotherphotographer · « **Reply #764 on:** July 13, 2023, 03:17 »

Quote from: Lizard on July 12, 2023, 11:00

...

Genetically, on the Y chromosome line, a majority (75%) of male Croats from Croatia belong to haplogroups I (38%-43%), R1a (22%-25%) and R1b (8%-9%), while a minority (25%) mostly belong to haplogroup E (10%), and others to haplogroups J (7%-10%), G (2%-4%), H (0.3-1.8%), and N (<1%).[115][116] The distribution, variance and frequency of the I2 and R1a subclades (>60%) among Croats are related to the medieval Slavic expansion, probably from the territory of present day Ukraine and Southeastern Poland.

...

This is a perfectly normal and sane post. Nothing to worry about here.

zastavkin · « **Reply #765 on:** July 13, 2023, 06:00 »

Quote from: stoker2014 on July 13, 2023, 02:03

You don't know who I am

It doesn't matter who you are. It's important what you are.
Until February 15, 2023, I see no mention of War in your forum posts. But from that moment hate propaganda suddenly poured out of you. Propaganda in which the truth is mixed with fakes. Why such strong changes after a year of war? I may be wrong but it is "highly likely" (as some politicians like to say) that you got a new job in CIPSO (Center for Information and Psychological Operations) troll factory and now you are brainwashing the readers of this forum. Am I right, Keyboard Warrior?
I Have Spoken.

Justanotherphotographer · « **Reply #766 on:** July 13, 2023, 06:34 »

Stocker2014 is clearly not here working for anyone. He is prone to conspiratorial thinking and is very racially prejudiced against Russians. Ironically he may have fallen for some propaganda actually perpetuated by Russian troll farms, for example that Ukraine would be better off if Republicans were in charge in the US. You can bet Russian agents are very present in the areas of the internet where these things are discussed.

His racism is very distasteful, and very wrong; factually and morally. It is also hugely counterproductive as it gives Russians who oppose the invasion no way out. Putin’s biggest problem with Ukraine is it showed Russians a possible future free of him. I am sure he is very happy to see this kind of talk pushing them further towards him.

But at the same time it is easy for “enlightened” people to criticise him in this situation. The Russian state is currently attacking Europe. I don’t know who he is and if he or his loved ones are, or have been, in the firing line.

For example, my mother has a close friend who is very racist against a nationality that invaded her country, took her brother into the woods, and murdered him. She didn’t even know the location of his body for 50 years. It isn’t worth arguing with her. It just isn’t the same/ practical to criticise people for hating a nationality at times of war. You can only gently correct them and hope they get to know good people from that race/ nationality eventually.

I can only say blanket hatred of Russians is not helping Ukraine. At the very least they need to know they can surrender without being attacked.

Zero Talent · « **Reply #767 on:** July 13, 2023, 10:40 »

Quote from: zastavkin on July 13, 2023, 06:00

I Have Spoken.

Now that you have spoken, can you also let us know if you can pass Kasparov's litmus test?

Can you say these three things, in five seconds, without stuttering:
The war is criminal.
The regime is illegitimate.
Crimea is Ukraine
?
🤔

zastavkin · « **Reply #768 on:** July 13, 2023, 11:36 »

Quote from: Zero Talent on July 13, 2023, 10:40

can you also let us know if you can pass Kasparov's litmus test?

No. I'm not a parrot to repeat someone's words.
On these issues, I can say the following:
1. Any violence against man, animals and nature is criminal.
2. I believe that not only regimes, but also states should become a thing of the past for humanity. I am for a legitimately elected global government with clear and effective mechanisms for their control by society.
3. I look at this question realistically. If my memory doesn't fail me, initiallyCrimea belonged to the Taurians. Later, many different nationalities and states were replaced here. Of the existing states, the right of primacy should belong to the Greeks. After the collapse of the USSR, Crimea belonged to Ukraine. Now the laws of the Russian state are in force on the peninsula. Under whose jurisdiction will this territory be in the future - I do not know. I hope that the rapid development of information technologies and the understanding of the need for the peaceful coexistence of all nationalities of the Earth will lead humanity to a single state (see paragraph 2).

Sorry, I can no longer participate in the discussion. And I have no desire to do this, because anyway, everyone will remain with their own opinion and no one will convince anyone.
I'm leaving on an expedition where there won't be any communication now. Look for me somewhere here)) : https://goo.gl/maps/6Dk4ksMpAMRMQFJh8
Watch a couple of relaxing videos from my last expedition:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZTn-FQfSWlk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YJs_Hy5UQ-I

Peaceful sky above everyone's head!

Just_to_inform_people2 · « **Reply #769 on:** July 13, 2023, 14:01 »

Quote from: stoker2014 on July 12, 2023, 07:55

1. Whose Crimea?
2. Should the Russian Empire continue to exist within today's borders? Or do oppressed peoples have the right to secede and create their own nation-states?
3. Should all war criminals who kill Ukrainians or help them be punished?
4. Should Russia withdraw its troops from Ukraine, Crimea, Donbass?
5. Should Russia pay reparations to Ukraine and Ukrainians for those killed, for destroyed cities, destroyed ecology and other losses?[/b]

Here on the forum not a single Russian has answered these questions yet, so for information.

1) Since 1783 Crimea was part of Russia (Soviet Union). Just since 1954 it was part of Ukraine when it was given (as a friendly gesture) to the soviet Republic of Ukraine (created in 1917, only to be independent in 1954). 60% of the inhabitants are Russians and only 24% Ukranian (measurement of 2001). So, according to the inhabitants I would say it's russian since inhabitants of the west of Ukraine staged the coup in 2014 and went another way. Secondly, because Sebastopol is of vital military importance to russia for it's naval fleet I can understand they would not have letten this go.

2) Same as all other countries that have seperatists in their borders. Should the Catalans have their own country in Spain, the Irish, the North of Italy, multiple groups in the US? Or even the Donbass in Ukraine? I actually see the west Ukranians to be the seperatists here.

3) Don't understand the question. What is it, that is asked here?

4) Yes, once the rights are respected of people living in those regions (Crimea and Donbass) according to the Minsk agreements or when they have complete autonomy from the West of Ukraine, it should be time for russian to leave those regions.

5) Maybe, if West Ukraine pays for the damages they have inflicted on the East of Ukraine during the 10 year civil war after their coup they staged in 2014. And maybe the EU, Great Britain, Australia and the US can also pay because they have delivered a lot of weapons helping to destroy the country.

LDV81 · « **Reply #770 on:** July 13, 2023, 15:55 »

Quote from: SVH on July 13, 2023, 14:01

Since 1783 Crimea was part of Russia (Soviet Union). Just since 1954 it was part of Ukraine when it was given (as a friendly gesture) to the soviet Republic of Ukraine (created in 1917, only to be independent in 1954). 60% of the inhabitants are Russians and only 24% Ukranian (measurement of 2001). So, according to the inhabitants I would say it's russian since inhabitants of the west of Ukraine staged the coup in 2014 and went another way. Secondly, because Sebastopol is of vital military importance to russia for it's naval fleet I can understand they would not have letten this go.

The native population of Crimea is Crimean Tatars, and they are very pro-Ukrainian. They consider Ukraine to be their homeland. Russian murderers exterminated their ancestors or forcefully deported them. Russian criminals did the same in the Baltic states, taking the homes of Balts murdered by them. If Russians living in Crimea cannot behave properly, they will have to be expelled. It is not their land. I think Beneš-style decrees will be justified in this case. They can live, for example, in the traditional Russian native territory, i.e. the swamps around Moscow.

LDV81 · « **Reply #771 on:** July 13, 2023, 16:05 »

Quote from: SVH on July 13, 2023, 14:01

Maybe, if West Ukraine pays for the damages they have inflicted on the East of Ukraine during the 10 year civil war after their coup they staged in 2014. And maybe the EU, Great Britain, Australia and the US can also pay because they have delivered a lot of weapons helping to destroy the country.

No, that is not how it is going to work. The frozen funds (AFAIK some $200 bln) will be transferred for the reconstruction of Ukraine. And russians will have to pay for the rest.

If not, the sanctions will remain in place and in the long run the EU will have a border with China. Vladivostok is already treated as an internal Chinese harbor.

https://www.lemonde.fr/en/international/article/2023/05/26/beijing-now-free-to-use-russian-port-of-vladivostok-for-its-domestic-trade_6028059_4.html

I guess, russians may think that paying for the reconstruction of Ukraine is a good deal.

stoker2014 · « **Reply #772 on:** July 13, 2023, 16:15 »

Quote from: zastavkin on July 13, 2023, 11:36

Quote from: Zero Talent on July 13, 2023, 10:40
can you also let us know if you can pass Kasparov's litmus test?
No. I'm not a parrot to repeat someone's words.
On these issues, I can say the following:
1. Any violence against man, animals and nature is criminal.
2. I believe that not only regimes, but also states should become a thing of the past for humanity. I am for a legitimately elected global government with clear and effective mechanisms for their control by society.
3. I look at this question realistically. If my memory doesn't fail me, initiallyCrimea belonged to the Taurians. Later, many different nationalities and states were replaced here. Of the existing states, the right of primacy should belong to the Greeks. After the collapse of the USSR, Crimea belonged to Ukraine. Now the laws of the Russian state are in force on the peninsula. Under whose jurisdiction will this territory be in the future - I do not know. I hope that the rapid development of information technologies and the understanding of the need for the peaceful coexistence of all nationalities of the Earth will lead humanity to a single state (see paragraph 2).

Here is the answer of the most ordinary Russian rashist. Q.E.D. But he does not consider himself a rashist, he wants to be considered a "good" Russian. It is on people like this zastavkin that the Russian empire and Putin rest.

stoker2014 · « **Reply #773 on:** July 13, 2023, 16:20 »

Quote from: Justanotherphotographer on July 13, 2023, 06:34

His racism is very distasteful, and very wrong; factually and morally. It is also hugely counterproductive as it gives Russians who oppose the invasion no way out. Putin’s biggest problem with Ukraine is it showed Russians a possible future free of him. I am sure he is very happy to see this kind of talk pushing them further towards him.

There is a war in Europe, and there are only a few good Russians, in fact there are none. I write the truth as it is. Yes, many do not like the truth, it is an axiom.

I treat the Russians the same way that all normal people treated the * in the last century. Russians in the 21st century are no different from the * in the 20th century. And I don't consider myself a racist.
Yes, there are several hundred Russians, maybe several thousand, who are waging a guerrilla war against the Rashists. I respect these people.

Zero Talent · « **Reply #774 on:** July 13, 2023, 16:24 »

Quote from: LDV81 on July 13, 2023, 15:55

The native population of Crimea is Crimean Tatars, and they are very pro-Ukrainian. They consider Ukraine to be their homeland. Russian murderers exterminated their ancestors or forcefully deported them. Russian criminals did the same in the Baltic states, taking the homes of Balts murdered by them.

Yes, and before that it was Schythic, Greek, Roman, Gothic, Hunnic, Byzantine, Ottoman...

russians are only a recent addition, replacing the natives who were either deported or ran for their life in other places (this is why we can find Crimean Tartars descendents in today's Romania, Bulgaria,Turkey).

What matters is what the international community and even russia recognized (and guaranteed) as official borders, before a paranoid mad man with imperial ambitions decided to kill his way through.

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Author Topic: This should settle some different opinions (Read 132480 times)

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