Author Topic: This should settle some different opinions (Read 133206 times)

trucic · « **Reply #2725 on:** February 23, 2024, 12:54 »

… I think that you will be highly dissapointed with any election results in US… time is not working for Ukraine… like Zelenskyi, you are accusing others for not helping you after billions spent in Ukraine and helping millions of Ukrainian refugees…

Zero Talent · « **Reply #2726 on:** February 23, 2024, 13:06 »

Quote from: stoker2014 on February 23, 2024, 12:28

Zero Talent, you are scaring everyone here with some kind of maga faction and what they supposedly for putin and that these maga want to support russia. This is such nonsense. The most you can provide as evidence is someone else's statements, that's all. You have nothing against the maga faction or the republicans. While the Democrats and Biden have been committing political crimes for 2 years, incl. against the USA, and you are trying to blame the Republicans for everything.
Especially for you, read the Republican plan and their real accusations against the Democrats 5 times, and stop defending the Democrats here.

https://foreignaffairs.house.gov/wp-content/uploads/2023/11/Proposed-Plan-for-Victory-in-Ukraine.pdf

As for that daughter in the video, she doesn’t understand at all what politics is, what’s happening in Ukraine, what Ukraine needs and what the democrats are doing. You Democrats are in a bag of propaganda. Once again, Ukraine needs a plan and weapons to support this plan. Just shells, in some small quantity, will not solve the problem at the front. Therefore, it is better not to receive anything at all from the United States and thereby reduce Biden’s rating, than to receive something meager and increase the rating of this freak Biden.

Now we need to remove democrats from power and judge them. And we will see whether or not to judge the maga faction after the Republicans win and what their policy will be. I don't care what those in maga faction say, I'm only interested in real politics.

That freak Biden had 3 years to pursue normal policies. He mediocrely wasted these years and helped the Russians. And no maga faction bothered him these 3 years. Now the time has come for him to answer and I hope he will be put in the electric chair.

I already told you that I tracked the voting records of the 3 authors of that document you are referring to, Michael McCaul, Mike Rogers, and Mike Turner.

https://justfacts.votesmart.org/candidate/key-votes/49210/michael-mccaul/22/defense
https://justfacts.votesmart.org/candidate/key-votes/5705/mike-rogers/22/defense
https://justfacts.votesmart.org/candidate/key-votes/45519/mike-turner/22/defense

While they criticized the current aid levels (as they should), they never voted against Ukraine, like the maga majority.
They are not part of the maga majority who blocked all aid for Ukraine.

They are not part of the "putin wing" of the Republican party, mentioned by Liz Cheney. They are part of the old-school GoP minority who always voted pro-Ukraine (same faction as Nikki Haley).

They simply believe that they can do better than the current administration.
I also believe that more should be done, and I told you that many times already.

But their plan was never voted by the GOP, because the majority of the GOP today, is made of what Liz Cheney called the "putin wing" of the GOP, or trump's maga.

But you burry your head in the sand and refuse to listen and reason.

stoker2014 · « **Reply #2727 on:** February 23, 2024, 13:46 »

At a February 20 briefing, Pentagon Deputy Press Secretary Sabrina Singh explained the Biden administration's refusal to provide military aid to Ukraine, which is at its disposal.

https://www.defense.gov/News/Transcripts/Transcript/Article/3682022/deputy-pentagon-press-secretary-sabrina-singh-holds-a-press-briefing/

A Pentagon spokeswoman confirmed:
1. The Biden administration stopped transferring military aid to Ukraine as of December 27, 2023. It has not transferred it to the victim of aggression for almost two months.
2. The Biden administration is blocking these supplies despite the fact that it has the authority to transfer military aid to Ukraine through the PDA channel in the amount of 4 (actually 4.2) billion dollars.
3. The Biden administration also has funds at its disposal in the amount of $7.9 billion. via the USAI channel, which are intended to be placed as orders for the production of military products for Ukraine, but which have not been placed in two years.
4. Thus, over two years, the Biden administration has not used at least $12.1 billion in military aid to Ukraine as a whole, which is a quarter of the $47.8 billion allocated for these purposes by Congress.
5. The Biden administration cites “the risk of loss of comfort” as the reason for stopping the transfer of military assistance to Ukraine. This term is absent in US legislation, and such justification for non-compliance with US laws by the executive branch is an innovation.
6. The Biden Administration agrees that the additional funding bill voted on in the Senate will ultimately be approved by Congress, allowing funds to replenish military supplies. But even this confidence does not change the administration’s current decision to block military aid to Ukraine, the basis for which is absent in US law.
7. The Biden administration admitted that the price of blocking military assistance to Ukraine was the abandonment of the Ukrainian Armed Forces of the strategic fortified area in Avdiivka, accompanied by significant losses among the armed forces and civilian population of Ukraine.
8. The Biden administration predicts that its continued lack of military assistance to Ukraine will lead to the abandonment of the Armed Forces of Ukraine and other Ukrainian cities and towns.

Fuck Biden!

stoker2014 · « **Reply #2728 on:** February 23, 2024, 13:52 »

Quote from: Zero Talent on February 23, 2024, 13:06

While they criticized the current aid levels (as they should), they never voted against Ukraine, like the maga majority.
They are not part of the maga majority who blocked all aid for Ukraine.

Is that all the accusations you can bring against the Republican Party?

Republicans are not voting against Ukraine, they are voting against the idiotic policies of the Democrats and Biden.
So, you agree with the accusations made by these 3 Republicans. Great, then you must understand that Biden is a criminal, and his place is in prison!
You can't elect a criminal to be president of the United States.

Zero Talent · « **Reply #2729 on:** February 23, 2024, 13:59 »

Quote from: stoker2014 on February 23, 2024, 13:52

Quote from: Zero Talent on February 23, 2024, 13:06
While they criticized the current aid levels (as they should), they never voted against Ukraine, like the maga majority.
They are not part of the maga majority who blocked all aid for Ukraine.
Is that all the accusations you can bring against the Republican Party?
Republicans are not voting against Ukraine, they are voting against the idiotic policies of the Democrats and Biden.
So, you agree with the accusations made by these 3 Republicans. Great, then you must understand that Biden is a criminal, and his place is in prison!

Yes, I agree with the 3 Republicans you mentioned, I agree with Nikie Haley, I agree with Liz Cheney, I agree with Mitt Romney, and I agree with their old-school minority inside the GOP.

I strongly disagree with trump-the-moron and his maga "putin-wing" populist, hyper-nationalist and isolationist majority.

stoker2014 · « **Reply #2730 on:** February 23, 2024, 13:59 »

If that freak Biden came out and said publicly that he wants to transfer a lot of aircraft, medium- and long-range missiles and tanks to Ukraine, I would start looking at him normally. And so... it’s just a lie.

stoker2014 · « **Reply #2731 on:** February 23, 2024, 14:02 »

Zero Talent, How much do the democrats pay you to post their propaganda pictures?

Trump did more for Ukraine in his time than this Biden. Behind Trump is the Republican Party and the US citizens are Republicans. Fuck the Democrats!

Zero Talent · « **Reply #2732 on:** February 23, 2024, 14:03 »

Quote from: stoker2014 on February 23, 2024, 14:02

Zero Talent, How much do the democrats pay you to post their propaganda pictures?

Trump did more for Ukraine in his time than this Biden. Behind Trump is the Republican Party and the US citizens are Republicans. Fuck the Democrats!

Enjoy:

stoker2014 · « **Reply #2733 on:** February 23, 2024, 14:07 »

I won't be surprised if Trump wins. Democrats are the same as Russians with the same low level of propaganda. I think US citizens have long understood this.

Zero Talent · « **Reply #2734 on:** February 23, 2024, 14:10 »

Quote from: stoker2014 on February 23, 2024, 14:07

I won't be surprised if Trump wins. Democrats are the same as Russians with the same low level of propaganda. I think US citizens have long understood this.

You don't even realize how effective russian propaganda is.
They even convinced you that trump is your saviour.

So sad!

RalfLiebhold · « **Reply #2735 on:** February 23, 2024, 14:15 »

Quote from: stoker2014 on February 23, 2024, 12:28

Zero Talent, you are scaring everyone here with some kind of maga faction and what they supposedly for putin and that these maga want to support russia.

Have you now been elected as the forum spokesperson for everyone here? Or was it your thousands of invisible followers?

You're the only one who gets a headwind here and tries to spread fear.

Zero is showering you with comprehensible facts, all of which bounce off you.

Roscoe · « **Reply #2736 on:** February 23, 2024, 16:42 »

Quote from: Zero Talent on February 23, 2024, 14:10

Quote from: stoker2014 on February 23, 2024, 14:07
I won't be surprised if Trump wins. Democrats are the same as Russians with the same low level of propaganda. I think US citizens have long understood this.

You don't even realize e how effective russian propaganda is.
They even convinced you that trump is your saviour.

So sad!

However I don't mind off-topic discussions, this thread has gone way out of line, and it makes no sense anymore.

"OK Sergey" is the only possible reply to him.

You have to realize he's most probably just one of those many Russian trolls wandering online forums (social media and Reddit is full of them) wanting to undermine anything that's pro democracy or not in line with Russian propaganda.

This thread, despite so many people giving valuable information, willing to have fair discussions or debates, should be closed (sorry Pete! I know you had the right intentions here!)

RalfLiebhold · « **Reply #2737 on:** February 23, 2024, 17:27 »

Quote from: Roscoe on February 23, 2024, 16:42

Quote from: Zero Talent on February 23, 2024, 14:10
Quote from: stoker2014 on February 23, 2024, 14:07
I won't be surprised if Trump wins. Democrats are the same as Russians with the same low level of propaganda. I think US citizens have long understood this.

You don't even realize e how effective russian propaganda is.
They even convinced you that trump is your saviour.

So sad!
However I don't mind off-topic discussions, this thread has gone way out of line, and it makes no sense anymore.

"OK Sergey" is the only possible reply to him.

You have to realize he's most probably just one of those many Russian trolls wandering online forums (social media and Reddit is full of them) wanting to undermine anything that's pro democracy or not in line with Russian propaganda.

This thread, despite so many people giving valuable information, willing to have fair discussions or debates, should be closed (sorry Pete! I know you had the right intentions here!)

In the course of the whole discussion, a lot of people have participated here, including Russians. I've gained a lot of knowledge here that I wouldn't have gained anywhere else. This thread is not about Stoker, even if he imagines it is.

The thread here is the most active and longest lasting. You probably haven't even followed it in detail.

That's why I find the question as to why you're rattling in here without prior participation and claiming that you want to close the thread much more interesting.

If you are overwhelmed by all this and not interested (what I can understand), there is a simple solution: Don't read here.

That's why I find your first spontaneous contribution here a little inappropriate and patronizing.

Wilm · « **Reply #2738 on:** February 23, 2024, 18:38 »

Quote from: Roscoe on February 23, 2024, 16:42

Quote from: Zero Talent on February 23, 2024, 14:10
Quote from: stoker2014 on February 23, 2024, 14:07
I won't be surprised if Trump wins. Democrats are the same as Russians with the same low level of propaganda. I think US citizens have long understood this.

You don't even realize e how effective russian propaganda is.
They even convinced you that trump is your saviour.

So sad!

You have to realize he's most probably just one of those many Russian trolls wandering online forums (social media and Reddit is full of them) wanting to undermine anything that's pro democracy or not in line with Russian propaganda.

I have already made this assumption, but that was a few pages ago.

Wilm · « **Reply #2739 on:** February 23, 2024, 18:58 »

Quote from: stoker2014 on February 23, 2024, 12:28

That freak Biden had 3 years to pursue normal policies. He mediocrely wasted these years and helped the Russians. And no maga faction bothered him these 3 years. Now the time has come for him to answer and I hope he will be put in the electric chair.

If you think that Biden should be in the electric chair because he is not helping Ukraine, then you should be in the electric chair too. Because you are doing nothing - absolutely nothing - to help Ukraine. Do you actually realize that?

On the contrary! You insult those who have supported Ukraine with many, many billions and praise those who don't want to give anything.

And ultimately, you are upsetting all those who pay for your support of Ukraine by insulting them. If all Ukrainians (if you are one at all - which I don't believe) acted like you, Ukraine would have gone under months ago.

You are very good at making demands on others. You personally contribute zero percent to an improvement in Ukraine. You don't fight yourself. And yet you write nasty things about your compatriots who have fled. But whether you are on the ground and not helping, or somewhere else, doesn't matter!

Your very personal hope that Ukraine will get the kind of weapons that can be used to attack Moscow or St. Petersburg - and, if you have your way, destroy them - will not be fulfilled. This remains your Trump dream. An absolute illusion - nothing more.

trucic · « **Reply #2740 on:** February 24, 2024, 01:12 »

… he is also very selective in themes - if you say something he doesn’t like or it is not in his favor, then you must be KGB propaganda supporter…

stoker2014 · « **Reply #2741 on:** February 24, 2024, 03:34 »

All Russian genetic slaves and orcs celebrate February 23rd as the day of their Na.zi army. In the Russian Empire this is a big holiday.
Ukraine congratulated the Russian Na.zis on this holiday:

1. Defence Forces destroy another A-50 Russian aircraft – video.

(17 Russian orcs on board were also eliminated.)

https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2024/02/23/7443425/

"Quote: "An A-50 aircraft with the alias Bayan ["Accordion"] has done its time in the sky! Greetings to the occupiers on the [Russian – ed.] Day of the Defender of the Motherland!"

2. Russian Su-34 fighter jet crashes in Kherson Oblast – video.

https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2024/02/24/7443460/

3. Explosions rock Russia's Lipetsk, metallurgical plant on fire – video

https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2024/02/24/7443459/

Glory to Ukraine!

trucic · « **Reply #2742 on:** February 24, 2024, 03:50 »

… then, if this is true, you don’t need any additional help…?! It isn’t important who will win on US elections…?! And can still deny what happened to Poles in Eastern Galicia and Volhynia… and why other can not support your war as much as you need…

stoker2014 · « **Reply #2743 on:** February 24, 2024, 04:48 »

Quote from: Zero Talent on February 23, 2024, 14:10

Quote from: stoker2014 on February 23, 2024, 14:07
I won't be surprised if Trump wins. Democrats are the same as Russians with the same low level of propaganda. I think US citizens have long understood this.

You don't even realize how effective russian propaganda is.
They even convinced you that trump is your saviour.

So sad!

Unlike you, I think and analyze. You are proposing to support the weak and ineffective Biden, who has proven his weakness and ineffectiveness many times over. At the same time, you have already branded and put an end to Trump, who has not even become president yet and has not done anything.
I'm ashamed of you Zero Talent, I had a better opinion of you.
I am sure that you are pursuing personal gain from the victory of the Democrats. That's why I ask, what amounts of money are we talking about, how much did you sell yourself to the Democrats for?

PS.
I don't read Russian propaganda and don't have discussions with Russian trolls. My information field has been cleared of Russian lies.

stoker2014 · « **Reply #2744 on:** February 24, 2024, 05:15 »

Avdiivka, Ukraine. Ukrainian Armed Forces soldiers eliminate Russian orcs.

https://youtu.be/N5XIwcYHDXo

You can configure the translation of subtitles into English, but even without translation everything is clear.

stoker2014 · « **Reply #2745 on:** February 24, 2024, 05:28 »

Explaining complex things in simple words: Two years of Russia's full-scale invasion of Ukraine
23.02.2024 12:00

The Center for Strategic Communication and Information Security pursues efforts to provide a brief explanation to foreign audiences on the current topics of particular interest as regards Ukraine.

MARKING TWO YEARS OF RUSSIA'S FULL-SCALE INVASION OF UKRAINE

● On February 24, 2022, the Kremlin showed its true colours as opposed to the mask of a “peacekeeper,” which it had been using since 2014, talking about the “internal conflict” and the “civil war” in Ukraine.

● From the very beginning, Russia did not intend to implement the Minsk agreements. Simultaneously with the negotiations in the Normandy Format, Moscow was systematically planning a full-scale invasion.

● Russia has become the first country to wage a full-scale aggressive war in Europe in the 21st century.

● Putin's goal is not some territories, but genocide, the destruction of Ukrainian statehood, and the total Russification of Ukrainians. Everything else is propaganda rhetoric aimed at disinformation.

● The aggressor challenged the system of international relations and security, the world based on international law. Russia seeks to destroy democratic alliances for the sake of its own despotic domination.

● Two years ago, Russian troops invaded Ukraine simultaneously from 9 different directions in the north, east, and south. In total, at least 220,000 Russian troops were involved in the invasion.

● Most countries of the world did not believe that Ukraine would survive, giving the Armed Forces a maximum of several days. Some countries even dreamed that Ukraine would fall.

● Thanks to the heroism of warriors and the resilience of society, Ukraine withstood the hardest first weeks of full-scale aggression. Enemy blitzkrieg plans were thwarted.

● Over these two years, Ukraine has achieved a number of significant victories: the expulsion of the occupiers from the north, a counter-offensive in the Slobozhanskyi direction, the liberation of Kherson and the right-bank part of the region. In general, the defence forces of Ukraine liberated more than 50% of the territory occupied after February 24, 2022.

● The defence forces expand control over the sea and methodically destroy the enemy fleet. The war is moving into Russian territory. Russian aviation suffers losses both in the sky and at its airfields.

● The total enemy losses in manpower exceeded 400,000. The occupiers lost more than 6,000 tanks, 12,000 armoured vehicles, almost 10,000 artillery systems, a thousand MLRS, more than 600 air defence systems, almost 700 aircraft and helicopters, 25 ships and boats, 1 submarine.

● After two years of the full-scale war with Russia, the Ukrainian army is the most experienced in Europe, and the only one that has experience of war with the Russian Armed Forces.

● Ukraine is grateful to the international coalition, which has been making a crucial contribution to supporting Ukrainian combat capability for two years.

● Russia is determined to wage a long war of attrition, attracting support from some other authoritarian, aggressive regimes. Democratic states must constantly increase their effectiveness to prevent Ukraine from losing in the long term.

● This war will end either with the defeat of Putinism or the collapse of the existing system of international relations and security. There is no middle ground.

Center for Strategic Communication and Information Security

https://www.ukrinform.net/rubric-ato/3831044-explaining-complex-things-in-simple-words-two-years-of-russias-fullscale-invasion-of-ukraine.html

stoker2014 · « **Reply #2746 on:** February 24, 2024, 06:42 »

Quote from: Wilm on February 23, 2024, 18:58

If you think that Biden should be in the electric chair because he is not helping Ukraine

1. Biden's failure to implement the Budapest Memorandum.
2. Minimal support for Ukraine at all stages of the war. Blocking aid from other countries.
3. Policy aimed at preserving Russia.
4. As a result, thousands of dead Ukrainians and occupied Ukrainian territories.

Do you think that in court Biden will not receive a verdict of going to prison and the electric chair?

As for Russian trolls, they do not write any criticism of Germany. Germany is a good trading partner of the Russians and the Germans do not give Ukraine missiles. This applies not only to Germany, but to the EU as a whole.

trucic · « **Reply #2747 on:** February 24, 2024, 09:43 »

… Ukraine goes to passive, defensive tactics until 2025 just ro survive year 2024…

https://www.politico.eu/article/ukraine-war-hang-on-in-2024-to-win-in-2025-putin-zelenskky-russia-counteroffensive/

Zero Talent · « **Reply #2748 on:** February 24, 2024, 12:24 »

Quote from: stoker2014 on February 24, 2024, 04:48

Quote from: Zero Talent on February 23, 2024, 14:10
Quote from: stoker2014 on February 23, 2024, 14:07
I won't be surprised if Trump wins. Democrats are the same as Russians with the same low level of propaganda. I think US citizens have long understood this.

You don't even realize how effective russian propaganda is.
They even convinced you that trump is your saviour.

So sad!
Unlike you, I think and analyze. You are proposing to support the weak and ineffective Biden, who has proven his weakness and ineffectiveness many times over. At the same time, you have already branded and put an end to Trump, who has not even become president yet and has not done anything.
I'm ashamed of you Zero Talent, I had a better opinion of you.
I am sure that you are pursuing personal gain from the victory of the Democrats. That's why I ask, what amounts of money are we talking about, how much did you sell yourself to the Democrats for?

PS.
I don't read Russian propaganda and don't have discussions with Russian trolls. My information field has been cleared of Russian lies.

Watch your president address the trump and maga crisis using, as you said, diplomatic language.

Jump to 19:57 in this video:
https://youtu.be/oUSglsQ8owU

He is clearly hoping that trump "will change his mind," which, for everyone but you, only means that trump's mind is not in favor of Ukraine.

But putin's propaganda is so effective that you view him as your savior!

Unbelievable, but true! Stockholm syndrome?

Luckily for Ukraine, forum lunatics are not in charge, but wise people who see things as they are: a victory for trump and maga means Ukraine's dismemberment and even annihilation.

stoker2014 · « **Reply #2749 on:** February 24, 2024, 13:29 »

Quote from: Zero Talent on February 24, 2024, 12:24

Watch your president address the trump and maga crisis using, as you said, diplomatic language.

Jump to 19:57 in this video:
https://youtu.be/oUSglsQ8owU

He is clearly hoping that trump "will change his mind," which, for everyone but you, only means that trump's mind is not in favor of Ukraine.

But putin's propaganda is so effective that you view him as your savior!

Unbelievable, but true! Stockholm syndrome?

Luckily for Ukraine, forum lunatics are not in charge, but wise people who see things as they are: a victory for trump and maga means Ukraine's dismemberment and even annihilation.

I Jump to 19:57 so what? What should I hear there? There is simply diplomatic language regarding Trump’s pre-election populism about ending the war in 24 hours. Trump can generally say whatever he wants, he won’t be judged for his words.

And yes, theoretically, Trump could even end the war in 24 hours. To do this you need:
1. Present a strong sanctions ultimatum to the Russians, EU and China.
2. Give consent to the supply to Ukraine of any weapons that Ukraine requests.
3. Make it clear to the Russians that the US Army can use weapons if necessary.

Trump has already voiced point two, and it was discussed in this thread.

Quote from: Zero Talent on February 24, 2024, 12:24

Luckily for Ukraine, forum lunatics are not in charge, but wise people who see things as they are: a victory for trump and maga means Ukraine's dismemberment and even annihilation.

Even if the US supplies 0 weapons, Ukraine will be able to continue to fight, provided that the EU doubles military aid. And the EU will decide whether it needs the Russian army on its borders or not.

I think it’s some kind of syndrome you have, voting for the coward Biden is disgusting.

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Author Topic: This should settle some different opinions (Read 133206 times)

trucic

Zero Talent

stoker2014

stoker2014

Zero Talent

stoker2014

stoker2014

Zero Talent

stoker2014

Zero Talent

RalfLiebhold

Roscoe

RalfLiebhold

Wilm

Wilm

trucic

stoker2014

trucic

stoker2014

stoker2014

stoker2014

stoker2014

trucic

Zero Talent

stoker2014

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