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Pond5 Contributor Poll - I'd like to see _____ at Pond5

No Changes at all
34 (35.8%)
Exclusive - Artist (just announced)
3 (3.2%)
Exclusive - Per Clip (contributor decides which clip)
48 (50.5%)
Stick a fork in 'em... I'm done
10 (10.5%)

Total Members Voted: 94

Voting closed: March 31, 2019, 12:14

Author Topic: Letter to pond5 and quick Poll for contributors  (Read 9081 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

« Reply #25 on: March 21, 2019, 15:10 »
+1
It's not just marketing though.  If you need a specific video and it's only on Pond5 then you need to go to Pond5 to get it.

Obviously. But that doesn't make it more valuable to the customer. Or us.


« Reply #26 on: March 21, 2019, 15:12 »
0
It's not just marketing though.  If you need a specific video and it's only on Pond5 then you need to go to Pond5 to get it.

Obviously. But that doesn't make it more valuable to the customer. Or us.
If they pay 60% rather than 30,35, or 40% it does.

« Reply #27 on: March 21, 2019, 15:14 »
+4
It's not just marketing though.  If you need a specific video and it's only on Pond5 then you need to go to Pond5 to get it.

Obviously. But that doesn't make it more valuable to the customer. Or us.
If they pay 60% rather than 30,35, or 40% it does.

Really? Since you have to remove your clips from every other site it definitely does not.

About 90% of my earnings comes from other sites. So would that 60% suddenly increase my P5 sales to astronomical levels? I think not.

But of course this was more about the "higher value for the CUSTOMER". Which is just bull****.
« Last Edit: March 21, 2019, 15:16 by increasingdifficulty »

« Reply #28 on: March 21, 2019, 15:18 »
+1
It's not just marketing though.  If you need a specific video and it's only on Pond5 then you need to go to Pond5 to get it.

Obviously. But that doesn't make it more valuable to the customer. Or us.
If they pay 60% rather than 30,35, or 40% it does.

Really? Since you have to remove your clips from every other site it definitely does not.

About 90% of my earnings comes from other sites. So would that 60% suddenly increase my P5 sales to astronomical levels? I think not.
If you're happy getting 90% of sales at 30-35% then what's the problem getting the last ten at 40%?  How many people will quit uploading to a site that pays better than most?  By putting the same clips at sites that pay 30-35% you've told them that is how much they should pay out.

« Reply #29 on: March 21, 2019, 15:19 »
+1
It's not just marketing though.  If you need a specific video and it's only on Pond5 then you need to go to Pond5 to get it.

Obviously. But that doesn't make it more valuable to the customer. Or us.
If they pay 60% rather than 30,35, or 40% it does.

Really? Since you have to remove your clips from every other site it definitely does not.

About 90% of my earnings comes from other sites. So would that 60% suddenly increase my P5 sales to astronomical levels? I think not.
If you're happy getting 90% of sales at 30-35% then what's the problem getting the last ten at 40%?  How many people will quit uploading to a site that pays better than most?  By putting the same clips at sites that pay 30-35% you've told them that is how much they should pay out.

My biggest earners all pay 50%. Which really should be the minimum everywhere. Even that is somewhat insulting.

« Reply #30 on: March 21, 2019, 15:20 »
0
It's not just marketing though.  If you need a specific video and it's only on Pond5 then you need to go to Pond5 to get it.

Obviously. But that doesn't make it more valuable to the customer. Or us.
If they pay 60% rather than 30,35, or 40% it does.

Really? Since you have to remove your clips from every other site it definitely does not.

About 90% of my earnings comes from other sites. So would that 60% suddenly increase my P5 sales to astronomical levels? I think not.
If you're happy getting 90% of sales at 30-35% then what's the problem getting the last ten at 40%?  How many people will quit uploading to a site that pays better than most?  By putting the same clips at sites that pay 30-35% you've told them that is how much they should pay out.

My biggest earners all pay 50%. Which really should be the minimum everywhere. Even that is somewhat insulting.
I've been away from here for a while which sites are paying 50%?

Noedelhap

  • www.colincramm.com

« Reply #31 on: March 21, 2019, 15:22 »
+1

Why should it be evenly divided they want exclusive content, nonexclusive content just isn't as valuable.

Which proves my point they're not doing this for contributors, only for their own good. I.e. greed.

I couldn't even offset my prices by 20% due to their rule that it should match competitors' prices. "Suck it up or join our program", that is what it boils down to. Why would I reward Pond5 with my exclusive files after a power move like this?
« Last Edit: March 21, 2019, 15:25 by Noedelhap »

« Reply #32 on: March 21, 2019, 15:24 »
0
The whole Town Hall livestream was a bunch of hypocritical nonsense. It started off great with them claiming they would never want to do a race to the bottom and they give contributors total freedom.
And then monkey came out of the bag, as we all predicted on this forum: a commission cut...unless you join our Exclusivity Program!
 
Being forced to raise prices or become exclusive, if that's not a total lack of respect towards your contributors, I don't know what it.
If you are licensing content for a lower price and accepting a lower royalty rate at other sites I'm not sure what the complaint is?  SS is 30% and Adobe is 35%, last I checked 40% was better.  If you value your work lower then why should you expect agencies to value it higher?

Ah, so it's a punishment of sorts? Because I undercut myself at other sites, Pond5 follows that race to the bottom? According to your logic anyways. I thought they didn't want to do a race to the bottom.

But the content I sell on all three sites is priced pretty evenly, so for the buyers there's hardly a difference. Now Pond5 grabs a bigger cut, and for what? To compensate for the expensive Exclusivity or to force me into exclusivity?

Why would you defend their greed?
It's hard to call them greedy when they pay more for nonexclusive work than sites you like (SS, Adobe for example).  They still seem to be the least greedy of the bunch don't they? 
A race to the bottom involves undercutting the competition, matching pricing and paying a higher royalty rate doesn't seem to me to be part of the race to the bottom, if anything I'd say contributors accepting lower rates and prices are what's driving the race to the bottom.


They paid more than other sites, yes, but will stop doing so. They weren't greedy, but now they are.

This isn't anything else than a cash grab, and their livestream didn't give us an explanation, only a unfair comparison to the 60% for exclusive members (which is a smaller percentage of contributors than non-exclusives, so it's not evenly divided).
Why should it be evenly divided they want exclusive content, nonexclusive content just isn't as valuable.

Which proves my point there not doing this for contributors, only for their own good. I.e. greed.

I couldn't even offset my prices by 20% due to their rule that it should match competitors' prices. "Suck it up or join our program", that is what it boils down to. Why would I reward Pond5 with my exclusive files after a power move like this?
Because they pay a higher % and you can set your prices.

Noedelhap

  • www.colincramm.com

« Reply #33 on: March 21, 2019, 15:27 »
+6

Because they pay a higher % and you can set your prices.

Joining their Exclusive Program is a leap in the dark, you'd lose maybe 50% of your revenue overnight (by deleting it from other sites) and there's no promise Pond5 will make up for that loss.

« Reply #34 on: March 21, 2019, 15:29 »
+1
Which proves my point they're not doing this for contributors, only for their own good. I.e. greed.

Exactly.

The thing is that instead of making up this elaborate story, they could have been honest.

"Guys, revenue is decreasing, this is what it costs to run the site, we are losing market share, etc. In order to keep the site alive, we regretfully have to lower the commission."

Sure, this would also suck, but it would be done in a more honest way.

Being played for fools makes few people happy.

« Reply #35 on: March 21, 2019, 15:30 »
0

Because they pay a higher % and you can set your prices.

Joining their Exclusive Program is a leap in the dark, you'd lose maybe 50% of your revenue overnight (by deleting it from other sites) and there's no promise Pond5 will make up for that loss.
I'm small time in video and Pond5 is my best site.  The problem for most people here is that they've accepted getting paid 30-35% so it doesn't really make sense to complain that P5 is "only" paying 40%.  Will they lose anyone because of this, I doubt it.

« Reply #36 on: March 21, 2019, 15:40 »
0
Quote
Will they lose anyone because of this, I doubt it.

If they end up with only web sales as fixed 24$ price and 40/60 split yes they will lose interest to contribute there I guess.

---

Quote
I'm small time in video and Pond5 is my best site.

 +1

HEre is a question: Can anyone please explain how this Global Partner program work?
how my rejected in Adobe and accepted in P5 exclusive clip will appear in Adobe through this GPP?
How Vimeo that rejected me will quality control my exclusive yet, handheld shots again through this program?


???

« Reply #37 on: March 21, 2019, 15:57 »
+4
Why should it be evenly divided they want exclusive content, nonexclusive content just isn't as valuable.

No stock clip is exclusive for the customer if it can be bought more than once. It's just another way to be able to use the word "exclusive" in marketing.

It's more valuable for Pond5, sure, because they get more customers. It's not more valuable for the customer, or the contributor.

Definitely, customers don't care if a clip is exclusive P5 or not. P5 makes it sound like they're doing the customer a favour, but they just don't want them to shop around. They're greedy, why not offer 70% for exclusive and leave it at 50% for non exclusive if they are doing so much for us contributors? Oh and also they never mentioned price matching in the town hall, that's quite an important part that they purposely forgot.

Time to bump all the prices up by 25% to get the same share as before.
« Last Edit: March 21, 2019, 16:06 by Not Today »

Noedelhap

  • www.colincramm.com

« Reply #38 on: March 21, 2019, 16:08 »
+4
Well, I've increased my prices, I noticed they'd been tinkering with my prices without giving me notice. Never increasing prices, only lowering them. At least I think that's what happened, I saw some weird prices for my content that I had never set myself.

« Reply #39 on: March 21, 2019, 16:45 »
+2
Yes, a bunch of my prices were lowered as well - I think they were doing split testing/testing which price points generated more sales.

Well, I've increased my prices, I noticed they'd been tinkering with my prices without giving me notice. Never increasing prices, only lowering them. At least I think that's what happened, I saw some weird prices for my content that I had never set myself.

« Reply #40 on: March 21, 2019, 17:14 »
+1
0 people are going to become exclusive with pond5. pond5 will pay everyone 10% less. this is what will happen.

That is probably the plan all along to justify the cut. I make way too much on other sites to go exclusive on p5. Sales are 3-5 vide a month. No thanks. Take your 20% p5. Money grab.

« Reply #41 on: March 21, 2019, 18:48 »
0
I liked how the townhall went till I heard our royalty cut to 40%.  That sucks. 

« Reply #42 on: March 21, 2019, 19:15 »
+6
...Being forced to raise prices or become exclusive, if that's not a total lack of respect towards your contributors, I don't know what is.

The way you know it's disrespectful is that it's exactly what Getty did to PumpAudio contributors when they acquired that formerly good stock music agency in 2009. In that case a 50/50 split went to 35/65 except for those they chose to become exclusive who could keep the 50/50

« Reply #43 on: March 21, 2019, 20:28 »
0
Such a disappointment, this year I was planning to increase my prices slightly but now even If i did I would still receive less commission after this cut.

When they implement decisions like these it's highly likely that this was on the cards for a long time and that there were probably elements within the P5 management structure championing for the cut to be 35%, similarly others with a more conservative approach wanting 45%

And so naturally the end number was to go with 40% and monitor contributor reaction like a hawk right from the get go, and you can bet your bottom dollar that right now they are listening because they haven't made such a drastic change to contributor policy in over a decade.

So guys and girls, now's the time or it's all down hill from here.

gillian vann

  • *Gillian*
« Reply #44 on: March 21, 2019, 22:14 »
+2
I just read the summary of the Town Hall (3am Sydney time, yeah, I never get to see those things live) and relieved to see everyone here is also concerned. I don't have much of a portfolio at P5, currently putting video on Stocksy and some stuff on SS, Getty. There is no way I could go exclusive at Pond 5 without removing probably 1000 images from stocksy, and of course you can't remove content from Getty anyway. This whole idea is bonkers.

I would very happily go per video exclusive at P5, and the majority of us are well trained in what is a "sister image" so we understand the rules. But they must show us respect (rather that talking about respect) and allow us to put rejected work, or more niche work, where it's going to sell best.

I urge P5 to reconsider this move. It's not respectful.

« Reply #45 on: March 21, 2019, 22:52 »
+2
agree, its a simple code implementation:
Do you wish this clip to be exclusive:
  • yes, [ ] no

Are y selling similar clips at other agencies [ ] yes,
  • no

Done.



I would very happily go per video exclusive at P5, and the majority of us are well trained in what is a "sister image" so we understand the rules. But they must show us respect (rather that talking about respect) and allow us to put rejected work, or more niche work, where it's going to sell best.

I urge P5 to reconsider this move. It's not respectful.
[/quote]

« Reply #46 on: March 22, 2019, 03:03 »
0
Quote

 rejected work


Rejected clips on Pond5?
I find it hard to understand, actually from a newbies perspective AS and SS kill around 15-35% of my uploads (from an initial 50-65% rejection rate) that actually get accepted in P5. Only files returned for missing releases and similar minor errors.

I dunno if curation will go harder and reject easier now with those new rules.
« Last Edit: March 22, 2019, 03:07 by georgep7 »

« Reply #47 on: March 22, 2019, 14:18 »
0
So how do we react? Do we start bombarding them with mails telling them that the move is unfair? Do we hit them on instagram, facebook, twitter? Do we set up a petition? Lets actually act in a way that tells them this is not a welcome move.

« Reply #48 on: March 22, 2019, 15:10 »
0
So how do we react? Do we start bombarding them with mails telling them that the move is unfair? Do we hit them on instagram, facebook, twitter? Do we set up a petition? Lets actually act in a way that tells them this is not a welcome move.
You have videos on SS and get 30% for them what's your complaint about 40%?  You've sent them the message that 30% is good enough already.

« Reply #49 on: March 22, 2019, 15:12 »
0
So how do we react? Do we start bombarding them with mails telling them that the move is unfair? Do we hit them on instagram, facebook, twitter? Do we set up a petition? Lets actually act in a way that tells them this is not a welcome move.

easiest way would be to either delete your portfolio, or stop uploading. they don't care if you just send e-mails, because people will continue to upload. so they really don't care that way.


 

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