Imagekind: pay to play?

[stockastic]

I just found out about another POD, Imagekind.   Does anyone here have experience to share?

First of all I need to find out if they read IPTC; if not, forget it.

But the thing I saw right away is that if you pay a monthly fee you get "highlighted search placement" and even, apparently, become a "featured artist".  This is the first time I've actually seen this offered and I'm trying to decide if I think it's evil, or not.   

[stockastic]

Never mind.

I created an account, uploaded a photo and I see that they don't read any IPTC data.  So, forget it.

Can't comprehend why some agencies can't be bothered to incorporate the small amount of code necessary to read name, description and keywords.   But the site looks dead anyway; their forum shows no recent activity.

[Steveball]

I uploaded 59 pics a few weeks ago (took a while!) then realised the life support had been turned off! Wont be uploading any more.

[SpaceStockFootage]

Not sure if it's 'evil' but I think it's a bad idea from a longevity of the site point of view. Everywhere else features files because they're of a high quality and useful to buyers. If anyone can feature their own items, then I'm sure you'll get a lower caliber of content being presented to potential buyers. And if they're featured files are rubbish, then that's not really going to impress buyers. Bad idea in my opinion. 

[stockastic]

I keep hoping to find a POD that really competes with FAA but as of today there doesn't seem to be one.  And I'm getting worried about the direction at FAA.   

[CJH Photography]

I uploaded 59 pics a few weeks ago (took a while!) then realised the life support had been turned off! Wont be uploading any more.

Maybe this explains why my mark-up always returns to 0%, no matter how many ways I change and save it.   

[stockastic]

It seems there's a growing number of 'zombie' sites:  no action, no site development, no forum activity, no one reporting any sales, no advertising or promotion.  They stay up, so they must be bringing in a bit of money, but they're not going anywhere. 

When I hear about a new POD site these days, of course the first question is, what's the percentage split on sales.  If it's reasonable, and I can set my own markup, I check it out further.

First I try to find out if it has a pulse. Is there forum activity? Do they post on FB more than once every 3 months?  Does the stuff on the main page change? 

Then I check the submission process.  Is it dated and clunky, or does it read all the metadata, so I could actually put up a couple hundred in a reasonable time?   

Most of these sites are just sitting there, dead in the water, producing a little income for someone by selling stuff that was uploaded long ago.

[CJH Photography]

I'm a bit more cynical.  I suspect they are making money by selling "premium" upgrades to contributors with little or no concern as to whether anything on the site actually sells.

[HappyBunny]

I agree with you.

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[stockastic]

I'm a bit more cynical.  I suspect they are making money by selling "premium" upgrades to contributors with little or no concern as to whether anything on the site actually sells.

Yes, and if you think about, that's very close to being an outright scam.   

[HappyBunny]

I checked today and my mark ups are also all 0% again.

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[HappyBunny]

A British landscape photographer with more than 400 images on Photo4me told me that nothing is going on there. I have not sold one image on there yet but I don't have 400 images on that website. Does anyone have sales on that site?

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[HappyBunny]

Is it worth it paying the membership fee on FAA and getting a website from them?

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[stockastic]

Is it worth it paying the membership fee on FAA and getting a website from them?

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If you have no marketing of your own, sales are going to be few.   Unless you have a unique niche which is reflected in your keywords, you'll be so far back in the FAA search you'll never be seen. 

[stockastic]

A British landscape photographer with more than 400 images on Photo4me told me that nothing is going on there. I have not sold one image on there yet but I don't have 400 images on that website. Does anyone have sales on that site?

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I hadn't heard of Photo4me so I just checked it out.  It seems to be 'alive', but barely.  They list their top sellers, and #2 has sold 4 in the last 30 days - which would be a big number for me, but is pretty low for a site overall.   It seems like there used to be a forum, but it's now "under construction".  The link to Facebook goes to a missing page.   I like the look of the site, and the freedom to control your pricing, and the fact that submissions are inspected.  But is it a ghost town?

[ShadySue]

A British landscape photographer with more than 400 images on Photo4me told me that nothing is going on there. I have not sold one image on there yet but I don't have 400 images on that website. Does anyone have sales on that site?

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I hadn't heard of Photo4me so I just checked it out.  It seems to be 'alive', but barely.  They list their top sellers, and #2 has sold 4 in the last 30 days - which would be a big number for me, but is pretty low for a site overall.   It seems like there used to be a forum, but it's now "under construction".  The link to Facebook goes to a missing page.   I like the look of the site, and the freedom to control your pricing, and the fact that submissions are inspected.  But is it a ghost town?

Are images inspected there?
I put one image up there (didn't notice anything about inspection) and got a barrage of likes and positive comments, presumably selected from a list of possible comments. It seems that that's a way to get ranking of some sort, but I was totally put off by that, as I can't be bothered playing that kind of game, far too time consuming.
I know someone who has sold a few there. He's been there for over a year. It's targetted mainly at the UK market, which I was keen on as FAA targets and is priced for the US market. Some of the Photos4Me sales (I have no idea what proportion) are people using it for fulfilment for pics for family members or personal clients.

[stockastic]

A British landscape photographer with more than 400 images on Photo4me told me that nothing is going on there. I have not sold one image on there yet but I don't have 400 images on that website. Does anyone have sales on that site?

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I hadn't heard of Photo4me so I just checked it out.  It seems to be 'alive', but barely.  They list their top sellers, and #2 has sold 4 in the last 30 days - which would be a big number for me, but is pretty low for a site overall.   It seems like there used to be a forum, but it's now "under construction".  The link to Facebook goes to a missing page.   I like the look of the site, and the freedom to control your pricing, and the fact that submissions are inspected.  But is it a ghost town?

Are images inspected there?
I put one image up there (didn't notice anything about inspection) and got a barrage of likes and positive comments, presumably selected from a list of possible comments. It seems that that's a way to get ranking of some sort, but I was totally put off by that, as I can't be bothered playing that kind of game, far too time consuming.
I know someone who has sold a few there. He's been there for over a year. It's targetted mainly at the UK market, which I was keen on as FAA targets and is priced for the US market. Some of the Photos4Me sales (I have no idea what proportion) are people using it for fulfilment for pics for family members or personal clients.

I did the free signup and one of the terms you must agree to is that you understand your uploads will be inspected and may not be approved.   

[HappyBunny]

Yes, photos need to be approved. If they don't get enough likes from other members they won't go on the site. The British member I mentioned is a professional photographer with more than 400 landscape images and since months he had no sales. The aircraft photos always sell. Flowers and cats don't sell I was told.

[HappyBunny]

They don't like Abstract and nothing apart from typical British seems to sell. Travel photos don't sell. Don't they like the Amalfi Coast? I am not Italian but I love photos of the Amalfi Coast. I have one in my home on  canvas and I didn't take that photo.  No chance for my modern images. I put some abstract flower photos up but was told they prefer natural. Which other websites are there apart from Imagekind and FAA ?  If you want to buy your own image you have to go to the Photo4me website and buy it like other customers. They then will pay you your mark up. That way it counts as sale for them. I often wonder how many of the sold images actually bought by their artists. I bought one of my images but not on Photo4me because I wanted it printed on thin acrylic glass.

[HappyBunny]

I just read that FAA gives us the option to sell art RF and RM. I have never put my art on a microstock website. I didn't even know that you can. Art should be paid properly. Is there a macrostock agency for art?

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[stockastic]

Which other websites are there apart from Imagekind and FAA ?

That's what I want to know, too.   There is Crated.com, but all I hear over there are crickets chirping.  I did sell one small print in about 6 months.

I actually think it's ok if Photo4Me is selective and has a focus in terms of subject matter.   We just need more sites like that, with different orientations. 

[HappyBunny]

Can I use the FTP uploader for Crated? Copying and pasting is soooo frustrating. Photo4me can't read keywords. Are Crated and Zazzle free? I am not paying FAA!

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[stockastic]

Can I use the FTP uploader for Crated? Copying and pasting is soooo frustrating. Photo4me can't read keywords. Are Crated and Zazzle free? I am not paying FAA!

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Crated doesn't have FTP, but they do read the IPTC data.   Crated is also free, for any number of images. You won't show up in search unless you get 'curated', i.e. someone at their end looks at your work and decides they like it.  However, as far as I can see, just about everyone who signs up is now getting 'curated' because there's a lot of utterly boring, repetitious stuff showing up.

 Zazzle is such a total waste of time I won't even comment on it.   

If Photo4me doesn't read IPTC data, I'll forget about them, just like I wrote off Imagekind for the same reason.  These companies just don't get it.  To make any sales at all, you'd have to upload hundreds of photos - and no serious contributor is going to do that if the upload code doesn't read the IPTC.   
 

[HappyBunny]

Hello Stockastic, I don't know anything about Zazzle. I don't want to waste my time. Could you let me know please why it isn't good? I make images for people to hang up on their walls. If I do go on holidays I also take travel photos. But I don't want to make designs for clothes on the computer.

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[stockastic]

Hello Stockastic, I don't know anything about Zazzle. I don't want to waste my time. Could you let me know please why it isn't good? I make images for people to hang up on their walls. If I do go on holidays I also take travel photos. But I don't want to make designs for clothes on the computer.

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It's been a long time but what I remember is this: the process of uploading, creating 'products', organizing your 'store' was enormously tedious and confusing; many people spent a lot of time creating customized store pages, and one day Zazzle just ended it and made all the pages look the same; they tried to force contributors to lower their commissions by pushing you back in the search if you charged more than some very low number, don't remember what it was exactly.  Others here will know more.

[HappyBunny]

That doesn't sound good. I find it unbelievable that FAA let's you only upload 25 images for free. If you want to upload more you have to pay.  I signed up at Crated. They don't sell many products but at least they can read IPTC data. I find it weird that their canvas print has either white or black on the sites. However, they accepted the few images I uploaded and I am delighted about not having to copy and paste. I mentioned it to Photo4me to get an IPTC data reader. They will look into it.

[Braznyc]

I still believe that the same people sell the same images on FAA.
If you're a new seller... good luck! There's no rotation.

Some people there behave like there's some kind of hierarchy.

In the forums there's always the same people saying that they are selling well... The newbies always trying to find out what's happening because nothing is selling.

My 10 cents.

[HappyBunny]

Thank you Braznyc. I am not going to upgrade to a paid account on FAA.

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[stockastic]

I still believe that the same people sell the same images on FAA.
If you're a new seller... good luck! There's no rotation.

Some people there behave like there's some kind of hierarchy.

In the forums there's always the same people saying that they are selling well... The newbies always trying to find out what's happening because nothing is selling.

My 10 cents.

An accurate summary.  The reason you see the same handful of people posting in the forum, every day, is that FAA said at one time that forum participation affects your search rank.  But I doubt that's really true - the main 3 factors are previous sales, previous sales and previous sales.   I think the people making the real sales are the ones in the FAA "Collections" and there's no way to apply, the selection is done by FAA. 

[ShadySue]

I still believe that the same people sell the same images on FAA.
If you're a new seller... good luck! There's no rotation.

Some people there behave like there's some kind of hierarchy.

In the forums there's always the same people saying that they are selling well... The newbies always trying to find out what's happening because nothing is selling.

My 10 cents.

A lot of these sellers have their own buyers and use FAA for fulfilment. One of the high sellers said last month that no files would be sold via random searches. That's not quite true, I have a very few sales, all totally randomly searched, but FAA don't hide that you really need to be bringing your own buyers, by whatever means doesn't stick in your craw.

[stockastic]

I have no marketing, but I do sell one now and then on FAA.   But the trend seems to be downhill. The guy is playing SEO games that I think are backfiring on him.   Or maybe he's just funneling all the searches to his 'collections'. 

[stockastic]

Photo4me now reads IPTC data, although it still takes way too many clicks to post an image.   I haven't yet figured out what's really going on at this site, it all seems to be in flux right now.  Some of their FB postings are saying that big things are coming.

[HappyBunny]

Yes, I noticed. Unfortunately they are selling less and less. They used to sell about 10 images per day but now it's just 4 most of the time.

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[wordplanet]

I had forgotten about Photo4Me after uploading a handful of files  - less than 20 I think - on there a couple of years ago after some European friends with good sales told me about it. I got a sale last month and made $87. It was a travel image from Sweden.

Right now, my most regular POD site for sales is redbubble where I get several sales a month - have had over 100 with a tiny portfolio there (maybe 25-30 images) - but mostly small amounts so it takes a while to make payout.

FAA is still my best POD - I have 500+ photos there so no surprise it's my best earner. Had two large random sales last month - a framed print and a canvas. I've sold some cards and pillows to friends who saw my stuff on FB but most of it is random. I do post images on twitter a few times a week but seem to sell totally random stuff - from flowers to travel and landscape as well as abstracts. I wish I had stuff in their collections.

Any sales on Crated? My last sale there - $168 net profit - was a year ago - but they seem to be doing more social media these days so hoping it picks up - they featured my landscapes about a week ago via their twitter account - and I usually have pix on the first page and in some collections. I really wish they'd get more traffic. I like how the site looks and it's easy to upload. It's free to join.

I've put less time into POD sites this year but I think the effort I made last year in uploading more is starting to pay off. Wish the effort I put into 500px had - no sales there yet. I didn't close my account but haven't added new work since they changed the commission structure. I had such high hopes for them.

[PaulieWalnuts]

I recently tried uploading a handful of images to Imagekind. Unless they start selling like crazy, no thanks. Dont read IPTC data so it's either manual entry or redundant copy and paste. How hard could this be to make work?

FAA seems to boost the work that sells which would make sense. The more stuff sells the further it moves up the search results and stuff that doesn't sell falls to the back. And if you stick with the free account that limits 25 images unless your work is amazing you probably wont sell anything. You need hundreds or thousands.

I'd also like to find some alternatives to FAA so I can not have all my eggs in one basket but so far I haven't found anything. Like others have said some of these places seem dead and others that may be selling are forcing contributors to offer the lowest pricing. I've tried ArtistRising, Zazzle, RedBubble, CafePress, and a few others and got nowhere. I get a sale once in a while on Crated.

[stockastic]

I'm always surprised when people say they sell on RedBubble.  They don't read IPTC even after all these years.  I put a bunch of photos up there years ago, pounded in some keywords, and never sold a thing.  Life is just too short to mess with sites that don't read the IPTC data.

After a much-hyped start, Crated seems to have gone nowhere.   I've had a couple hundred photos there for several months and have sold one tiny print.  Maybe I've posted on this too many times, but their "curation" seems to be heavily compromised because I'm now seeing a lot of junk (IMHO) showing up there.