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Messages - Jo Ann Snover

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2876
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1. Do you report the full sales price of a image / item (not the commission from Envato) as revenue to your local Tax Authorities? If not you are committing a tax fraud.
Envato currently insists that the complete sales price is YOUR income and you have to deduct later their commission as your expense.

I'm in the US and I'm not a lawyer, but I think that regardless of what Envato calls the money they pay us, I think I have a reasonable case that the money I receive from them (especially as I don't know who the buyer is or have any possibility to influence the price or terms of this "sale" I made to the unnamed buyer) is my income, not the amount the buyer paid Envato.

Just because they call it something doesn't make it so.

There are a number of situations - companies that tried to call hourly workers managers to avoid paying them overtime, for example - where one party tries to change the definition of a transaction so that it contradicts what's actually happening. I think that's what Envato is trying to do.

I will stay for the moment, but if I thought for one second that I'd have any tax issues as a result of them trying to impute income to me beyond my royalties, I'll leave.

2877
Adobe Stock / Re: Fotolia Joins Adobe
« on: February 06, 2015, 16:05 »
Maybe you use some different combination, but for most creative professionals, CC is cheaper.

Not to revisit this painful debate, but it isn't cheaper if you're a long time owner of Photoshop, Illustrator and (less long) Lightroom. And the Photographer deal doesn't help if you do something other than just Photoshop and Lightroom, but not a lot of their products.

I have no problem with them offering the subscription to those for whom it works well. It's the removal of a regular (what they now sweetly call "perpetual") license that is deeply painful for long time users of their products.

I'm not irrational - if it were a better deal for me I'd go for it

2878
General Stock Discussion / Re: Free is the new black
« on: February 06, 2015, 11:43 »
I have no problem with free photos as long as the ones you get for free are clearly not as good as the ones you pay for - as noted above.

In everything I've seen to date - and I looked at the Canva blog post, though not at the many sites they reviewed - it's very clear what the difference is. Free stuff generally looks like it was someone's own snapshot - best way to see that is one of the sites that runs paid shots next to free ones, like this:

http://freerangestock.com/search.php?search=woman+computer&submit=&match_type=all

I still see things like Dollar Photo Club as a much bigger threat - full size images and illustrations for $1 with no volume commitment. That gets you really good quality stuff for a pittance.

2879
I had 6 - I wonder if there was some accounting glitch from the past that got "corrected" yesterday?

It'll take more of the $15 distribution "regular" sales to make any real uptick in Canstock earnings (those appear to have dried up to a trickle). 30 cent subs is noise - even if it's fraud and they claw it back :)

2880
I did a few searches, but I don't see prices on anything.

You can click on a contributor's name, but that just goes to a page with no information and no portfolio.

If there are search results, you get a minuscule window with mini thumbnails and have to click a link to see them all. When you do see the results, clicking on the thumbnail just puts up a hover preview - you have to click on the three dots to see more information

Everything seems like too many steps to get the simplest things

Then there's the notion of requesting things. iStock tried this ages ago (Buy Request) and shelved it because it just didn't work well. There are a number of sites with "briefs" where contributors compete to get the sale (or a lot of times no sale). I don't see how this model works at microstock prices. iStock's request forum worked really well for a while - designers and contributors hung out there and could interact. They nuked all of that; not sure how you get the hoped for interaction going on a new site - photographers don't join without buyers and buyers won't bother without contributors...

There seem to be so many things left unsaid - about when you take 10% vs 20%; are there any standard licenses you offer or does each contributor invent their own; do you have FTP upload and do you read IPTC data; What's this limit of 10G of storage with a note about e-mailing if you want more? - "You'll start off with 10GB. There are plenty of other ways to increase your storage for free. If you need mass storage email us. "; do you do any marketing at all or is it all up to contributors; do you exercise any control at all over model/property releases, copyright issues (vectors that are traces of another person's photograph, for example)?






2881
They're in Australia, I'm in the US, so I've never had a report from them for the income there. I use my royalties as my income (not the amount the buyer paid) and I plan to keep doing that regardless of what they are doing with the crazy accounting.

I also sell via Creative Market and they (on site; haven't received anything from them for tax paperwork probably because I'm new to the site and earned so little in 2014) report total revenues and "Your earnings". Perhaps someone who has been there longer would know which numbers they report on 1099s

I think they've got this all wrong, especially with respect to Photo Dune (given that they're acting like an agency with uniform pricing and an approval process).

2882
General Stock Discussion / Re: Royalty split feature
« on: February 04, 2015, 12:15 »
Why get the agency involved? If you want to work with someone on a project, submit the images and split the earnings with the other person, you can do that right now - just draw up a contract.

2883
This is reminiscent of some history of the gold rush era I heard on a trip to California a few years back - in general, the only people who got rich were those supplying the prospectors. The rush was fueled by dreams of huge returns (like those tales of big sales in the blog) which were not the typical experience.

I'm willing to pay FAA $30 a year because I make that back (typically) with one sale. The first year, I thought $30 was small enough that running a one year experiment made sense. $500? Not a prayer - at least not unless I heard tons of stories of people regularly making sales through that site.

2884
Alamy.com / Re: Hybrid RF/RM licensing
« on: February 04, 2015, 02:06 »
I don't know that the naming is right - royalty free isn't really what the following terms map to IMO - but from my three sales in January, here are the two variants called "royalty free"  but limited by use and time:

Country: Worldwide
Usage: Non-Editorial Electronic and web uses, Use on website and social media, worldwide for 5 years.
Media: Corporate website, single design

Usage: iQ sale: Magazine, Editorial print and digital use. Up to DPS, inside.One time use only

The other RF sale was the largest amount - it certainly seems reasonable to offer fewer rights for less money if they have a market for that.

The only problem with the limited rights sales is tracking that buyers don't overstep their licensed rights (something that Canva neatly avoids). I can't imagine Alamy really pays much attention to that unless a contributor brings it to their attention.

2885
The forums appear to be up and running (I can log in at any rate) at

http://www.symbiostock.org/community/

Is that where you're trying to log in/register?

Not sure which Facebook wall you're referring to, but the Symbiostockers group on Facebook is just a bunch of site owners, not the owners of the forum (which I think is back to Leo now, but might be Cascoly still - as you can tell I haven't been active there recently). When I logged in today there were very few posts about anything in the last month.


The store on symbiostock.com has a contact address - leo [at] symbiostock [dot] com - perhaps try that for assistance?

2886
iStockPhoto.com / Re: When will iStock stabilize?
« on: February 01, 2015, 17:33 »

I guess credit sales is pretty much history now, on all sites.

Not really. In January, my subscription sales at Shutterstock were 34% of my total earnings - meaning that 66% came from OD, SOD and ELs. It has been around 40% subs for quite a while now.

At some other agencies that got bitten by the "I want to be Shutterstock" bug, like Dreamstime, subscriptions ate into credit sales and reduced overall earnings (their level system notwithstanding).

SS started out as just subscriptions and has slowly and steadily been growing their non-subscription business. I'm not thrilled about subscriptions, but as part of an overall mix of sales, it can work. I am guessing that the growth of SS's non-subscription business has largely been at Getty's expense.

Edited to add that I looked back at Jan 2014 and Jan 2013 and the subs sales in each of of those and 2015 are all within $3 of each other, but in Jan 2013 subs were 54% of my total, Jan '14 44% and Jan '15 34% (I was back as an indie in Jan 2012, but was still ramping up; subs then were 57% of the total).

In other words, all the growth is coming from the non subscription sales.

2887
General - Top Sites / Re: Fotolia beats Shutterstock
« on: February 01, 2015, 15:22 »
I'm not with Fotolia, but SS for Jan 2015 was up about 22% over Jan 2014 (with only very minimal uploads last year). I'm at the 38 cent level, so should be seeing a decline if they were favoring new contributors

2888
Envato / Re: Envato's idea of a fun fact
« on: January 31, 2015, 19:45 »
So they're revamping their invoices:

http://marketblog.envato.com/news/new-statements-invoices/

and have written a blog post out of their take on their new business model

http://marketblog.envato.com/news/envato-market-platform/

I made a forum post about how this just doesn't work at all for PhotoDune - if it were a marketplace (like Creative Market) - I would get to decide what was for sale and at what price. It isn't and I don't.

And my fun fact is that my last sale was 1 day ago for $1 (don't remind me; I'd rather just watch the balance go up)!

2889
There's a link on the page you click on to download a PDF with a verification word in it - just shows you can handle PDF files as well as thwarting bots

Edited to add that there are effing ads on the third page of this form!! Even the tax paperwork gets commercial sponsorship - blech!

2890
Adobe Stock / Re: Fotolia Joins Adobe
« on: January 29, 2015, 15:32 »
Hope they will kill DPC.

It'd be nice, but the Twitter spam (the paid "isn't DPC wonderful" stuff) is still alive and well, plus Matt Koslowski is talking them up today - groan!! Given how he makes his living, it's a real shame he's supporting this POS "agency":

https://twitter.com/MattKloskowski/status/560520522229096449/photo/1


2891
Adobe Stock / Re: Fotolia Joins Adobe
« on: January 29, 2015, 10:49 »
I would certainly consider it (returning to the agency) but it's not just seeing the old crew of management depart, but also the compensation models for contributors in the new Adobe CC-centered sales.

I thought the idea was interesting (somewhere above) that they might let subscribers use images as long as they were subscribers, but they'd be gone if you ever canceled. In that sort of model, would the contributor get monthly royalties on the use? If not, then it's a total ripoff, with the recurring income going to the agency for a one time payment to the contributor.

I'm not a fan of the subscription model for software licensing (although I know all the reasons why the software companies like it), but if there's going to be a sea change and contributors can go with it - with monthly income to us as well as the agencies/Adobe/whoever - then perhaps that's OK.

Having our images be part of some loss leader to flog Adobe CC subscriptions is not of much interest (DPC on steroids as it were).

2892
With those low royalties, does that mean they only got small sizes of your work as JPEGs? Not saying fraud is ever good, but better small JPEG than the vectors. DT does issue refunds for fraud, so you'll know soon enough if that's what this was. I didn't see anything unusual at DT, but perhaps other illustrators might be the ones to check with

Fingers crossed it's legit :)

2893
Canva / Re: Canva
« on: January 28, 2015, 11:12 »
Thanks for the suggestion guys, I am looking for a simple portfolio overview/editing/filter system guys, I am not looking for a single image. I have no way of quickly seeing what is accepted, rejected, pending. Contributor admin tools is one of the things that really need improvement on Canva. IMO

It is important, but getting images reviewed is more important. I'll start nudging them on other things once my images submitted the first week of October have been reviewed :)

2894
Symbiostock / Re: People Still Using SymbioStock?
« on: January 27, 2015, 11:28 »
I'm still hosting my site, but the number of sites and images in the network is steadily shrinking. And it's been a while since I had a sale - but I think a couple of the illustrators have been doing OK.

http://symbiostock.info/

It was 175+ and about 290K images before the guy who started the project walked away. Leo Blanchette is the author of the pro plugin (it was $75; not sure what the current deal is); you'd need to get it from him, I think. But I'm honestly not sure that it's a great idea to start a new site given where things are at the moment.

2895
Selling Stock Direct / Re: WooCommerce launches Photo Plugin
« on: January 27, 2015, 11:22 »
I had a quick look, and in addition to the things Pixart mentioned, it appears you also need to pay for one (or more) of the payment gateways - a bunch of those are $79 each. Looking at the list of payment gateway options, it's pretty overwhelming - I shop online a lot and most of those I have never heard of. I'm not sure how I'd choose a provider, but you'd (ideally) want to be able to take PayPal and Moneybookers and amazon payments would be a plus.

Given the focus around delivering prints, I think trying to shoehorn stock licensing into it wouldn't appeal to me (long term, it'd be nice to have something to migrate my site to when Symbiostock stops working, which eventually I'm sure will happen). Having something from a major platform (WooCommerce on WordPress) is definitely appealing

2896
New Sites - General / Re: Pixabang.com
« on: January 26, 2015, 11:02 »
I did a search for office and got three images - the closest to an office was a phone receiver dangling against an outdoor scene.

I searched for Aruba and got pictures of dogs (none of which had the keyword Aruba, so the problem isn't spam)

If buyers can't find anything useful when they search, we don't even get to the discussion of terms, royalties, payments, etc. You don't appear to be ready to even ask for contributors to upload.

2897
iStockPhoto.com / Re: Tax Interview
« on: January 26, 2015, 01:15 »
are you sure Seattle is part of the States? Rumor has it that the Seahawks are out of this world!  :)

I am the polar opposite of a sports fan - can't stand 99% of it :) Not the football I grew up with (England) or the sports of my current home - I try to keep up enough to carry on a conversation and not sound like I come from Mars, but that's as far as I go.

But I hear there are a few fans in the area who are just a tad excited about an event next Sunday...

2898
iStockPhoto.com / Re: Tax Interview
« on: January 25, 2015, 19:52 »
I'm reading this thread, and is making me afraid of opening the form....because this interview is sounding so much more complicated than filling a regular W9 form if you are in the USA????   Is this form a catch all sort of thing for people worldwide??

With a regular W9 form is pretty straight forward...

I'm a US taxpayer and it wasn't hard to fill out - once you identify as a US resident (I think it asked about citizenship too, but I don't remember) - it's as straightforward as filling out a W-9.

2899
New Sites - General / Re: swoozo.com - the next evil exploiter
« on: January 24, 2015, 12:27 »
They apparently have multiple contributors. I see photos that are less than exciting for prices from 1 to 120 euros, a 50/50 commission split and a quarterly payout!

"For every sale, you 50% (percent) of the price will be credited (price of the sold file in credits).
A gained Credit has a value of one (1) Euro.
The generated profits are paid quarterly (31.March / 30.June / 30.September / 31.December).
At the time of payment is the payment proof download ready."

The artist supply agreement is only in German, but I read it via Google Translate

http://www.swoozo.com/php/en/verkaufen_rechtliches.php?dokument=7

This lists the two owners and here's some other information a search revealed about other web sites they own

http://website.informer.com/Rayk+Boehm+Trotzinski+Sven+%2F+Boehm+Rayk+GbR.html

The site is really ugly, hard to navigate and the search is useless (at least in English).

I searched for office and was presented with a strawberry, a butterfly, geese in the grass, potatoes, pasta, a rusty lock (someone should ban those!), and this gem of stock (who would use this?)

http://www.swoozo.com/php/en/a_foto.php?view=1&id=637


2900
http://www.insightpartners.com/about/

...Remember the Getty deal where the venture capitalists wanted their $500M and Getty went into deep debt to do it? This is the same thing. ...


Just a point of order :) Venture Capitalists and Private Equity companies are both sources of financing, but are very, very different beasts IMO.

Generally, venture capitalists help get a business started (cash in return for an equity stake in the company) and "get out" once it has gone public by selling their stock - so they can go invest in some other startups.

Private Equity firms buy up businesses in some sort of fiscal weak state (in Getty's case it was a falling stock price) and then split them up, or try somehow to spiffy them up so they can sell in 3-5 years. They are more like vultures than any sort of helper. Hellman & Friedman couldn't get out of Getty and so did this awful thing called dividend recapitalization where they saddled Getty with masses of debt so they could get their "dividend". They did that twice, I think.

I don't see anything amiss about the VCs who invested in SS before it went public selling to move on to other things. SS isn't a startup any more.

My original question above, which apparently offended the OP, was only seeking some wisdom (I'm largely ignorant of the ins and outs of this stuff) as to whether this was something special or unexpected. Ron wanted to know the same thing. Seems a reasonable question.

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