Quote from: For Real on November 25, 2021, 01:40

Quote from: Wilm on November 24, 2021, 21:52

Quote from: Justanotherphotographer on November 24, 2021, 09:53
On course for BME on Adobestock, but then again I stopped giving SS any new work (SS work at least a year older than on AS). in the 2-3000 dls/month on AS range
[/quote

Excuse me, but I didn't understand your statement at all. Maybe it's because English is not my native language, but even with translation software I didn't understand it.

I'm keeping my fingers crossed that it will be your best month at AS, but the rest is unclear to me.

I think he stated his is having a best month ever with Adobe due to his continuation of submitting images to them where he no longer submits images to SS. He's not surprised by this stat as well since he works harder with Adobe.

Thank you for the explanation.

2-3000 Dls/month only with AS is really impressive. Even though I don't know how big Justanotherfotographer's portfolio is. But it must be good.

Quote from: Justanotherphotographer on November 24, 2021, 09:53
On course for BME on Adobestock, but then again I stopped giving SS any new work (SS work at least a year older than on AS). in the 2-3000 dls/month on AS range

Excuse me, but I didn't understand your statement at all. Maybe it's because English is not my native language, but even with translation software I didn't understand it.

I'm keeping my fingers crossed that it will be your best month at AS, but the rest is unclear to me.

Quote from: Zero Talent on November 22, 2021, 22:35

Quote from: Wilm on November 22, 2021, 22:26

Quote from: Zero Talent on November 22, 2021, 22:20
Here is another example I dealt with today, after the seller received a takedown notice from Etsy, following my DMCA report:

Seller: Hello,
We just received your copyright complain regarding your photo and we do ave the license for it. We licensed your photo via DepositPhoto and here is the information
Photography ID: xxxxxxxx
License ID: yyyyyyy
Please let us know if you need any information and we are looking forward to resolve this issue.
Me: Please let me know the type of license you purchased and the date of the purchase
Seller: I don't know how to look at it, I bought in yyyy.
This is how I saved the file. From DepositPhotos.
Date: mmm dd, yyyy
Photography ID: xxxxxxx
License ID: yyyyyyyy
Me: I can see this photo being purchased 3 times on mm dd, yyyy.
However, none of these licenses is an extended license.
To resell prints, posters, etc, you need to purchase an EXTENDED license.
For more details check this license comparison:
https://depositphotos.com/license-comparison.html
Seller: We do have adobe stock images can you please send us the direct link for adobe or we can license it directly from you for a lower price

15 minutes after I sent him the link, I was able to see his Extended license purchase from AS.

It's sad, but true. Nobody reads any license terms in this day and age.

Yes, probably it was an honest mistake.

But despite the point raised by the OP, and the popularity of similar "poor-me-it's-not-my-fault" or "terrible-greedy-American-capitalism" marxist posts in this thread , no government, and no additional laws were required to solve this dispute.
Just do it, take action, instead of sitting on your hands complaining. 

Hello Zero Talent,

I personally don't have to complain or take action as I am not affected in this case.

But the factual situation is this:
If you discover portfolios on shutterstock that contain stolen images, you can contact infringementclaims@shutterstock.
The result is that the images that are used without permission are deleted. That's it. I have not heard of a single case where the rightful contributor of the images was compensated. In my view, if the stolen image was downloaded 100 times, the rightful contributor is entitled to the money for those 100 downloads.

In my view, this is also the case with Etsy, FineArtAmerica, Art and whatever other platforms are called. All agencies simply keep the money for themselves, although it was acquired illegally. That's what annoys me the most about it personally.

If you get caught for speeding, you can't say you didn't see the speed limit signs. You will be punished in any case.
In my view, the same must apply to disregarding license conditions. These are the legal foundations of the business.

Quote from: Zero Talent on November 22, 2021, 22:20
Here is another example I dealt with today, after the seller received a takedown notice from Etsy, following my DMCA report:

Seller: Hello,
We just received your copyright complain regarding your photo and we do ave the license for it. We licensed your photo via DepositPhoto and here is the information
Photography ID: xxxxxxxx
License ID: yyyyyyy
Please let us know if you need any information and we are looking forward to resolve this issue.
Me: Please let me know the type of license you purchased and the date of the purchase
Seller: I don't know how to look at it, I bought in yyyy.
This is how I saved the file. From DepositPhotos.
Date: mmm dd, yyyy
Photography ID: xxxxxxx
License ID: yyyyyyyy
Me: I can see this photo being purchased 3 times on mm dd, yyyy.
However, none of these licenses is an extended license.
To resell prints, posters, etc, you need to purchase an EXTENDED license.
For more details check this license comparison:
https://depositphotos.com/license-comparison.html
Seller: We do have adobe stock images can you please send us the direct link for adobe or we can license it directly from you for a lower price

15 minutes after I sent him the link, I was able to see his Extended license purchase from AS.

It's sad, but true. Nobody reads any license terms in this day and age.

Quote from: offisapup on November 22, 2021, 12:01

Quote from: HappyBunny on November 22, 2021, 09:42
I wonder if photographers who upload on free stock websites earn more money. Not that I want to support that but I have seen a Christmas background which was downloaded 180000 times. I wonder how often someone bought that person a coffee. Why do people upload thousands of images there if they don't earn 1 cent?

It's not about the money, it's about the dopamine. What the free sites (and social media like FB and Insta) have figured out very successfully is that people will spend all their time and money in creating something for them as long as they get instant validation. When you see your picture get a 100000 views and a 10000 downloads, it makes people feel good and that's what they're looking for.

That's true! But they could also be happy if they'd find out that an image has sold 1000, 5000 or 10000 times.

Quote from: HappyBunny on November 22, 2021, 09:42
I wonder if photographers who upload on free stock websites earn more money. Not that I want to support that but I have seen a Christmas background which was downloaded 180000 times. I wonder how often someone bought that person a coffee. Why do people upload thousands of images there if they don't earn 1 cent?

The most astonishing thing about it is that they don't even mind that the agency, where they don't earn a cent for their work, is earning good money through advertising.

From my point of view, being a good photographer is not that relevant for Microstock. A successful microstocker creates images. The images are generated as the market needs them. The photography is only a small part of it.

If you search for an image, you can see that a fraction of the images are pure photography. The biggest part are photomontages, CGI images, vectors, illustrations, composite images. The concept is in the foreground of the success, not the good photography in the technical sense.

There are extremely successful contributors who do not have a single photo in their portfolio. Therefore, I absolutely agree with marthamarks. It is certainly an advantage to be a good or professional photographer, but it is by no means a must.

Quote from: aphasia on November 20, 2021, 09:22
I still find istock brings in the most money then Shutterstock, followed by Adobe. I just look at the end of month earnings not individual sale values. You will still get loads of 10 cent sales on Shutterstock at Level 6.
Don't see the point of stopping to upload to any agency myself as I use Microstock Plus uploader, my weekly uploading takes 20mins whether I upload to one agency or 50 agencies. Never create new keywords etc as just copy paste from previous photos.

How do you do that with the order of the keywords at Adobe Stock, which is very important there? And how does it work with the Microstock Plus Uploader at istock, where you have to correct half of all keywords?

And last question: How do you do the categories with this software?

And what it costs, I would be interested as well as Pete.

Quote from: Pacesetter on November 19, 2021, 22:48
Adobe's free image giveaway is clearly working very well, shame it is killing sales this month.

I did my personal  math and came to the conclusion that Adobe's free selection is a losing proposition. It flushes money into the cash once and then brings losses for the remaining 11 months. That is the reason why I do not participate.

In addition, I firmly believe that the campaign produces false impulses that, on balance, harm the entire industry.

Quote from: DOP on November 19, 2021, 21:32

Quote from: Wilm on November 19, 2021, 21:07

Quote from: DOP on November 18, 2021, 21:34

You clearly went wrong there and should have uploaded many thousands more 

In my next life I will try, Deb. 

I was being ironic Wilm.
You are a prime example where quality over quantity works.
I could probably have uploaded tens of thousands more images than you and have sold a fraction of what you have sold.

I know, Debbie. We've known each other long enough for that. And thank you - again - for your kind words.

If I was more motivated, I would have uploaded more pictures. But of course we are not talking about thousands and not hundreds. In fact, I would pretty much know what I would produce. But right now, I just don't have the drive. Maybe it will come again.

I find that strange anyway. From my point of view, it is out of proportion. The jump from 150 to 5000 downloads is gigantic. And how many contributors really need all the products from the CC?

Why don't they offer intermediate Bonus solutions?
150 downloads - 1 product
500 downloads - 2 products
1500 downloads - 3 products
3000 downloads - 4 products
Just as an example.

We bought the last versions of CS. When they don't work anymore, because the new operating systems don't allow it, we will do everything with Affinity.
I was extremely annoyed that you can only subscribe to the new Adobe products. I want to buy them. Because it's significantly cheaper. But the option is no longer there. So in the future, we're just not Adobe customers anymore.

I would have liked to give away my bonus, but unfortunately that's not possible. Not even to my daughter. So it expires year after year.

Quote from: whosvegas on November 19, 2021, 11:59
Today for the first time, i had 10 downloads on Shutterstock in one day, all < $0,15

Should i be happy?

Congrats! And yes, you should be happy if it was the first time from my Point of view. No matter what it brought in.

Quote from: DOP on November 18, 2021, 21:34

You clearly went wrong there and should have uploaded many thousands more 

In my next life I will try, Deb. 

Quote from: Uncle Pete on November 19, 2021, 20:46

Quote from: Noedelhap on November 19, 2021, 17:23
Sadly the criteria for receiving the All Apps Plan has become insanely high since last year. It's not even something we can control ourselves (as opposed to Number of approved assets), since it's the agency's responsibility to sell our assets.

150 downloads a year is insanely high?

Hello Pete,

Noedelkap wrote about "all apps" - and for that you need 5000 downloads, not 150. I feel this hurdle is also quite high. I will not make it.

Quote from: DOP on November 18, 2021, 10:54
Congratulations Wilm.
74K.  Wow.
Almost as many as me .. 

Hi Debbie,

I figured you'd hit the six-figure downloads long ago. But you are always so modest - so I was not sure. 

There was a desire for something positive here in the forum. So I'm going to contribute something to that.

Nearly 600 downloads so far. Obviously this November will become better than November 2019 and almost the same as November 2020 - at least concerning downloads. This is a positive result for me personally because I have uploaded very little in the recent past. I'm surprised this hasn't had a negative impact on download numbers. However, the fact that it was worse in 2019 may also have been due to the initial effects of Corona - the economy was pretty much paralyzed then - obviously more than at the moment.

Also, I can post a round number on shutterstock from this morning. That's significantly less than Annie and others have, but I'm still happy.

Quote from: UPLOAD-UPLOAD-UPLOAD on November 17, 2021, 20:34
In a perfect world every rejection would be fair and square.
We don't live in a perfect world.
So, if you don't like what Shutterstock is doing, send them a message.
Close your account and quit.
That's fine.
Whining about these problems here on this forum accomplishes nothing.
You complainers never offer a solution except to cut and run.
Fine, cut and run. That's your choice and your right but please don't
bore me with the same old, same old complaints offering no solution.
Who needs that?

I'm happy to repeat it again.

The OP will obviously not delete the account, but has decided to leave the pictures online. I thought that would have become obvious. And I personally feel that is a good solution.

And for potential other solutions, I had posted a link. There are interesting thoughts to read about copy space, backgrounds behind the main subjects, image size and resolution. So to solutions.

Also the old shutterstock forum was a huge resource full of tips, thoughts, suggestions and ideas on how to make better images and get more sales. All this information is now unfortunately lost forever.

You didn't miss the forum, as you write yourself.
On the contrary. From your point of view, as you write, it was worthless and it was foreseeable from your point of view that it would disappear

What do you expect from a forum? That it exclusively blows your horn?

Also now I repeat myself gladly once again. The OP made a good decision from my subjective and personal point of view, which came about because it was discussed in this forum. Is that not a positive thing?

Quote from: RalfLiebhold on November 17, 2021, 11:36

Quote from: Wilm on November 17, 2021, 10:54
The $0.10 is a symbolic value. Of course, there are also the double-digit downloads. But they also existed before the new revenue structure.

In my case, I have an average monthly loss of $63 in subscriptions, compared to the income when each sub brought in $0.38. That's a loss of $750 per year. I can't compensate these losses with the double-digit downloads, because they haven't become more than before. Therefore, RPD is declining for me.

I can certainly understand that contributors want to close their account because they are frustrated, perhaps also in combination with the difficult selection.
I personally would not do that. It would destroy years of work and you give up revenue. You can just let it expire, not invest any more work and take the money that still comes in.

Fact is: The poll results clearly show that shutterstock has lost the position 1. Adobe Stock is the market leader.

Wilm, I think the way you look at it also depends a bit on how long you've been at it and your frustration and that of others, is understandable and comprehensible.
But for me, when the revenue structure was changed, I was still in the old 25-cent level (which you probably don't remember anymore  ) and then moved to level 4, which was a significant improvement for me.
Roscoe summed it up nicely. As long as I can afford a nice vacation at the end of the year from my Shutterstock earnings, for example, there is no reason to stare only at the "symbolic" 10 cents.
That it was certainly easier and faster in the past to earn more money here is not to be denied. However, this viewpoint is of no use to a newbie like me in the here and now.
Maybe I will see the situation differently in 5 years.

Yes, Ralf, you are right. I did not know that or have not had it in memory.

Quote from: UPLOAD-UPLOAD-UPLOAD on November 17, 2021, 18:49
This whole thread is nothing but a whine full of negative thinking.
I have never bought into the "the going is tough, let's quit and run" mentality.
Yeah, SS now hands out a lot of rejections for focus, noise and similars.
You can whine and cry about it and accomplish nothing, or you can use
those rejections as a learning experience.
You can quit Shutterstock. That is your right. You can  disable your port if
you want to cut off your nose to spite your face. Shutterstock is so huge
they don't care. They won't notice you left.
It's obvious to me that SS has decided to stop accepting a lot of images
because their memory banks are bulging already. So they have become
a lot more picky. Good for them!
It has forced me to become a lot more picky in my uploads as well.
So, the choice is yours. Keep fighting and uploading and collecting money or
quit and lose. Your choice.
I'm going to leave this thread because it way too negative with a lot of loser attitude.
I'm going to find a positive thread, one with ideas on selling images, on increasing income
and on having fun. Know of any? Maybe I should start one.

I don't know if you have to look at all of that as a negative.

For me personally, the shutterstock development is negative - admittedly. The trend is also negative at 123rf and at dreamstime.

At Adobe the numbers are stable - to say something positive. The same goes for istock. And that's why I personally focus on that. That's why I don't accept the loser attitude. The bottom line is that I'm still happy that money is coming in, even if it's less than it used to be.

The ideas on how to sell more images have already been discussed by Annie and Firn, for example. There have been a lot of suggestions, thoughts and tips from Annie. You can read them here:

https://www.microstockgroup.com/general-stock-discussion/this-month's-sales/100/

And from my point of view it is also positive that SVH now obviously does not want to delete the portfolio. That is a very positive result of this discussion from my point of view.

The $0.10 is a symbolic value. Of course, there are also the double-digit downloads. But they also existed before the new revenue structure.

In my case, I have an average monthly loss of $63 in subscriptions, compared to the income when each sub brought in $0.38. That's a loss of $750 per year. I can't compensate these losses with the double-digit downloads, because they haven't become more than before. Therefore, RPD is declining for me.

I can certainly understand that contributors want to close their account because they are frustrated, perhaps also in combination with the difficult selection.
I personally would not do that. It would destroy years of work and you give up revenue. You can just let it expire, not invest any more work and take the money that still comes in.

Fact is: The poll results clearly show that shutterstock has lost the position 1. Adobe Stock is the market leader.

Quote from: Firn on November 16, 2021, 17:16

Quote from: H2O on November 16, 2021, 17:09
This petition is about protecting people, from reading it, it is about consumer rights for both the sellers and purchasers.

I can't see anything wrong in that.

No, this petition is about etsy not wanting to be held accountable if someone steals your artwork and sells it on etsy.

Exactly! +1

Quote from: Uncle Pete on November 15, 2021, 15:33

Quote from: thijsdegraaf on November 15, 2021, 14:14

Quote from: Wilm on November 15, 2021, 13:59

Congrats, Thijs!

But one question: is there an upload limit at AS? Never heard of this before. Or was it a joke?

Thanks Wilm
Not a joke. Until now I am not allowed to upload photos with illustrative editorial content. That's only allowed if you've sold more than hundred photos, I thought.
That will take a while, because I don't sell a lot on AS. I have many photos suitable for that. I hope I get in January approval.

My current RPD for this years downloads is $.97

I'm at $1,25 at AS vs. $0,61 at shutterstock. More than twice as much. Since the introduction of the new earnings structure my RPD at shutterstock decreased by 15.3% at shutterstock.

Since my downloads and revenues at AS are very constant (apart from the monthly differences), but those at shutterstock are declining, it is clear that AS now brings in more money than shutterstock - in contrast to before. And the poll results also show that it is obviously the same for most contributors. The numbers used to be the other way around. Shutterstock was always in first place. I am very sure that this trend will continue and strengthen.

In addition, there is another medium- to long-term problem for shutterstock from my point of view. If revenues no longer cover production costs, image styles and content will change and become more influenced by the cultural origin of the countries where images will be produced in the future. This may mean that buyers from the countries where new images are no longer being created will no longer be able to find the image material that suits their cultural background. Models, architecture, graphic styles, colors, layouts, etc. are all influenced by our cultural background. And this is naturally different in the various regions of the world.

Quote from: Wilm on November 15, 2021, 11:55
shutterstock no longer has the capacity to maintain the forum. It's all the more amazing how often they ask me to participate in the contributor survey. I get it at least once a week.

After months I uploaded an image again. It was rejected because of noise. With all other agencies the problem did not exist. But I don't care. If they don't want it, they don't want it. I do not make a second attempt.

The image has just sold at Adobe Stock. Fine!

Quote from: thijsdegraaf on November 15, 2021, 14:14

Quote from: Wilm on November 15, 2021, 13:59

Quote from: thijsdegraaf on November 15, 2021, 13:49

Quote from: thijsdegraaf on November 12, 2021, 11:20
Fan of Annie's work (watched from the Shutterstock forum often). Not from Social Media. I never read that, but understand that it can be useful for sales. I don't have very expensive equipment, know a lot about insects, but that's not a subject that you sell a lot of, or you have to spend much more money on lenses, lighting.
So I don't mind, understand that my sales are not very high. I do like the fact that I can pay my provider of my website with the earnings of the photos, that I have money left over and that the earnings continue to rise.
I do find it strange that I didn't sell anything at Adobe in November, while November is not a bad month. But according to the probability calculation, it is probably not very special either. Who knows next week will be much better. 

Yippee! My first two sales this month from Adobe. Only unfortunately twice 0.33. But because of the number I am a bit closer to permission to upload my more commercial photos.
And since yesterday in level 4 at Shutterstock. Only my first sale after that was of course 0.10 

Congrats, Thijs!

But one question: is there an upload limit at AS? Never heard of this before. Or was it a joke?

Thanks Wilm
Not a joke. Until now I am not allowed to upload photos with illustrative editorial content. That's only allowed if you've sold more than hundred photos, I thought.
That will take a while, because I don't sell a lot on AS. I have many photos suitable for that. I hope I get in January approval.

Okay, Thijs, now I get it. Yes, I know about the illustrative editorials in combination with sales. I was probably just confused because you used the term "commercial photos". But you didn't mean the license type, but your personal commercial success.

Quote from: thijsdegraaf on November 15, 2021, 13:49

Quote from: thijsdegraaf on November 12, 2021, 11:20
Fan of Annie's work (watched from the Shutterstock forum often). Not from Social Media. I never read that, but understand that it can be useful for sales. I don't have very expensive equipment, know a lot about insects, but that's not a subject that you sell a lot of, or you have to spend much more money on lenses, lighting.
So I don't mind, understand that my sales are not very high. I do like the fact that I can pay my provider of my website with the earnings of the photos, that I have money left over and that the earnings continue to rise.
I do find it strange that I didn't sell anything at Adobe in November, while November is not a bad month. But according to the probability calculation, it is probably not very special either. Who knows next week will be much better. 

Yippee! My first two sales this month from Adobe. Only unfortunately twice 0.33. But because of the number I am a bit closer to permission to upload my more commercial photos.
And since yesterday in level 4 at Shutterstock. Only my first sale after that was of course 0.10 

Congrats, Thijs!

But one question: is there an upload limit at AS? Never heard of this before. Or was it a joke?