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Author Topic: Just when you thought It couldn't get worse.  (Read 29821 times)

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Rinderart

« on: July 14, 2016, 02:11 »
+31
OK. been in 11 Years .......newbies before march 12th 2012 need not Post Or who cares if ya do.... But, Sales after that date was the telling Point for me that something was amiss...........search went crazy. Most Popular disappeared and all hell broke loose. Some noticed nothing..... Probably due to small noncommercial work, BS or super small Ports. OR... the wooHoo crowd thinking Buyers love there work....?. And when i first took Notice Because Up until that date the slight variations were normal. Lots Of posts along the way since then. But Just for me and many swings that were quite large ...this july 2016 is a total Joke I mean serious Joke after uploading no less than 100/200  a month going On what I've told newbies you must do.. Im sorry I don't believe that crap anymore and Im tired and the Koolaid is getting distasteful and I apoligize to anyone I said that to.

This july has be a disaster. Less than My commissions from 10 Years ago.

Go Ahead Jon...Farm all the 25 cent folks you can. this is getting so Out of control. I Pray a new site comes in and  "SCARES THEM STRAIGHT" I doubt it. ego and Money has Changed My Old friend. the mistakes they are making. ????? they don't even know about.

Sorry About the Rant. Thats what a veteran does. I don't know. I leave the critique forum and after 11 years in one week Fools are critiquing Others that have no clue what there doing themselves. MAN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! WHOA. I guess I have to let this go and Move on. It's tough But I will. I see crap people are posting and it's Mind Blowing.   HEY LEAF.............Heads up ,here come your new forum Posters. they will be here real soon. I won't,  I'll be out making Money, these fools have no Idea about that part because we know How.........


Leo

  • http://www.clipartillustration.com

« Reply #1 on: July 14, 2016, 02:26 »
+2
Thanks for that update - its good to hear from a pro that things are down (its not just me!)

gyllens

« Reply #2 on: July 14, 2016, 02:32 »
+1
Amen to that!

« Reply #3 on: July 14, 2016, 02:42 »
+2
I have great respect for Laurin. Also for David. They have taught me a lot about stock photography, especially food photography. I thought that it's just me who go so bad because of my port or I belief that adding no more than 100 / 150 pictures per month it's the problem.
I try to be more optimistic but, for now, I don't see how. I began to work on another project with my photos, maybe I will do much better than stock photography, who knows ?!... I hope that Laurin, David and other great people from this industry also find another niche.

Cheers !
 :)

« Reply #4 on: July 14, 2016, 02:46 »
+2
its good to hear from a pro that things are down (its not just me!)

No, it is not good. If things are down because of oversaturation it is much, much worse than in the case when you or somebody else are having a poor month or a quarter.
In the second case, things could always improve for you, you may increase your port, etc. In the first case it is more or less Game Over. I have seen quite a few sites fade away but I have never seen a site making a spectacular come back.
Therefore I'd rather have a situation when "it's just me" than when "it is bad for everybody".

« Reply #5 on: July 14, 2016, 02:48 »
+45
OK. been in 11 Years .......newbies before march 12th 2012 need not Post Or who cares if ya do.... But, Sales after that date was the telling Point for me that something was amiss...........search went crazy. Most Popular disappeared and all hell broke loose. Some noticed nothing..... Probably due to small noncommercial work, BS or super small Ports. OR... the wooHoo crowd thinking Buyers love there work....?. And when i first took Notice Because Up until that date the slight variations were normal. Lots Of posts along the way since then. But Just for me and many swings that were quite large ...this july 2016 is a total Joke I mean serious Joke after uploading no less than 100/200  a month going On what I've told newbies you must do.. Im sorry I don't believe that crap anymore and Im tired and the Koolaid is getting distasteful and I apoligize to anyone I said that to.

This july has be a disaster. Less than My commissions from 10 Years ago.

Go Ahead Jon...Farm all the 25 cent folks you can. this is getting so Out of control. I Pray a new site comes in and  "SCARES THEM STRAIGHT" I doubt it. ego and Money has Changed My Old friend. the mistakes they are making. ????? they don't even know about.

Sorry About the Rant. Thats what a veteran does. I don't know. I leave the critique forum and after 11 years in one week Fools are critiquing Others that have no clue what there doing themselves. MAN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! WHOA. I guess I have to let this go and Move on. It's tough But I will. I see crap people are posting and it's Mind Blowing.   HEY LEAF.............Heads up ,here come your new forum Posters. they will be here real soon. I won't,  I'll be out making Money, these fools have no Idea about that part because we know How.........

every 3 months you write a post like this but you never leave, seen your rants for years, even before 2012, and your first sentence shows your true character, why not be a gracious old man.

hit the bong man, think of your heart, take a rest, its nearly 1 am
« Last Edit: July 14, 2016, 02:51 by Microstockphoto »

« Reply #6 on: July 14, 2016, 03:18 »
+5
Most of my sales with SS are from old images.  My earnings month to month have wild swings because the big single and other sales make a huge difference.  This month is grim so far.  There is another site that's almost making up for it, but it would be stupid to tell people what site that is, because then everyone starts uploading there and my earnings shoot down.  So I better not say it starts with C, ends in a and has anv in the middle, that would make me really dumb :)  If I don't mention it, lots of other people will and already have, there's no secrets in this business, or are there?

« Reply #7 on: July 14, 2016, 03:32 »
+21
OK. been in 11 Years .......newbies before march 12th 2012 need not Post Or who cares if ya do.... But, Sales after that date was the telling Point for me that something was amiss...........search went crazy. Most Popular disappeared and all hell broke loose. Some noticed nothing..... Probably due to small noncommercial work, BS or super small Ports. OR... the wooHoo crowd thinking Buyers love there work....?. And when i first took Notice Because Up until that date the slight variations were normal. Lots Of posts along the way since then. But Just for me and many swings that were quite large ...this july 2016 is a total Joke I mean serious Joke after uploading no less than 100/200  a month going On what I've told newbies you must do.. Im sorry I don't believe that crap anymore and Im tired and the Koolaid is getting distasteful and I apoligize to anyone I said that to.

This july has be a disaster. Less than My commissions from 10 Years ago.

Go Ahead Jon...Farm all the 25 cent folks you can. this is getting so Out of control. I Pray a new site comes in and  "SCARES THEM STRAIGHT" I doubt it. ego and Money has Changed My Old friend. the mistakes they are making. ????? they don't even know about.

Sorry About the Rant. Thats what a veteran does. I don't know. I leave the critique forum and after 11 years in one week Fools are critiquing Others that have no clue what there doing themselves. MAN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! WHOA. I guess I have to let this go and Move on. It's tough But I will. I see crap people are posting and it's Mind Blowing.   HEY LEAF.............Heads up ,here come your new forum Posters. they will be here real soon. I won't,  I'll be out making Money, these fools have no Idea about that part because we know How.........
Have you considered the possibility that some of the newbies might actually be good and meeting the market's current needs better. I sniff a sense of entitlement here...no one can make people buy images they don't want.

« Reply #8 on: July 14, 2016, 03:40 »
+17
Rinder: It might just be your work not only competition. I don't understand why people are blaming the stock agency's. Look at some ports of best selling contributors like this one:

http://www.shutterstock.com/gallery-91282p1.html

I don't see any of that kind of work, style in your portfolio. You are ranting and complaining all the time but if you look at your work from before 2012 and now you are standing still wile the competition is getting better and better. And yes. There are many newbies, graphic designers and young creative talents that are doing much, much better commercial work. THAT is why some people are loosing sales.

« Reply #9 on: July 14, 2016, 04:09 »
+4
I see more works which need more expensive setup, paid models, travel etc. Not a lot of countries have prices levels which can balance this well. BTW ss is too much slow today.
Personally i have more demands for group shots, only beautiful people of different ages, and this is going as work for hire, not for stock, otherwise here i will not cover my expenses.

« Reply #10 on: July 14, 2016, 04:19 »
+6
Ghastly June and July looks even worse - but I can't check because the bloody site is down AGAIN!!

« Reply #11 on: July 14, 2016, 04:22 »
+5
Rinder: It might just be your work not only competition. I don't understand why people are blaming the stock agency's. Look at some ports of best selling contributors like this one:

http://www.shutterstock.com/gallery-91282p1.html

I don't see any of that kind of work, style in your portfolio. You are ranting and complaining all the time but if you look at your work from before 2012 and now you are standing still wile the competition is getting better and better. And yes. There are many newbies, graphic designers and young creative talents that are doing much, much better commercial work. THAT is why some people are loosing sales.


I see no more than bluish images in the old Yuri Arcurs style

Dook

« Reply #12 on: July 14, 2016, 04:38 »
+9
It's not the point if he's better or worse than someone else at the moment. He can improve, he can be better than he used to be. But, he (we) can't improve infinitely. Just like we can't keep increasing portfolio at the same rate, we can't improve our skills forever, and we can't keep reducing costs forever. And when we do everything we can to make successful stock business and things are still going downhill, it is a good indicator that it is, like someone said earlier, game over.
« Last Edit: July 14, 2016, 04:42 by Dook »

« Reply #13 on: July 14, 2016, 05:19 »
+2
It's not the point if he's better or worse than someone else at the moment.
Thats exactly the point

« Reply #14 on: July 14, 2016, 06:07 »
+7
I guess misery loves company, but I am at least reassured by the fact that it's not just me.

I am not a huge player in this, but have built up a portfolio over several years that has been consistently earning me a four-figure sum at Shutterstock each month. Now in July, I am lucky if I make $100 a week.

What the f*** happened? Am I just buried under a slew of crappy icons and shots of weed?

Shutterstock appears to be on a course to self-destruct. What incentive is there to submit there anymore? Assuming of course, that the site is actually accessible to upload, which it currently isn't.
« Last Edit: July 14, 2016, 06:09 by KuriousKat »

« Reply #15 on: July 14, 2016, 06:12 »
+4
I guess misery loves company, but I am at least reassured by the fact that it's not just me.

I am not a huge player in this, but have built up a portfolio over several years that has been consistently earning me a four-figure sum at Shutterstock each month. Now in July, I am lucky if I make $100 a week.

What the f*** happened? Am I just buried under a slew of crappy icons and shots of weed?

Shutterstock appears to be on a course to self-destruct. What incentive is there to submit there anymore? Assuming of course, that the site is actually accessible to upload, which it currently isn't.
Like it or not the published and audited figures coming out of S stock are far from indicating any kind of imminent self destruction though I expect competition to get stiffer

« Reply #16 on: July 14, 2016, 06:17 »
+4
And yes. There are many newbies, graphic designers and young creative talents that are doing much, much better commercial work. THAT is why some people are loosing sales.

That's true and that is the real threat for oldies and also the hidden reason of their complaint.
I'm old too, I don't complain, just envy them. It's a new world!.



« Reply #17 on: July 14, 2016, 06:24 »
+6
OK. been in 11 Years .......newbies before march 12th 2012 need not Post Or who cares if ya do.... But, Sales after that date was the telling Point for me that something was amiss...........search went crazy. Most Popular disappeared and all hell broke loose. Some noticed nothing..... Probably due to small noncommercial work, BS or super small Ports. OR... the wooHoo crowd thinking Buyers love there work....?. And when i first took Notice Because Up until that date the slight variations were normal. Lots Of posts along the way since then. But Just for me and many swings that were quite large ...this july 2016 is a total Joke I mean serious Joke after uploading no less than 100/200  a month going On what I've told newbies you must do.. Im sorry I don't believe that crap anymore and Im tired and the Koolaid is getting distasteful and I apoligize to anyone I said that to.

This july has be a disaster. Less than My commissions from 10 Years ago.

Go Ahead Jon...Farm all the 25 cent folks you can. this is getting so Out of control. I Pray a new site comes in and  "SCARES THEM STRAIGHT" I doubt it. ego and Money has Changed My Old friend. the mistakes they are making. ????? they don't even know about.

Sorry About the Rant. Thats what a veteran does. I don't know. I leave the critique forum and after 11 years in one week Fools are critiquing Others that have no clue what there doing themselves. MAN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! WHOA. I guess I have to let this go and Move on. It's tough But I will. I see crap people are posting and it's Mind Blowing.   HEY LEAF.............Heads up ,here come your new forum Posters. they will be here real soon. I won't,  I'll be out making Money, these fools have no Idea about that part because we know How.........

....or maybe the people you keep calling newbs, trying a bit too hard be condescending, are indeed uploading way better stock than you do. Which not that hard to do, to be honest.

Shelma1

« Reply #18 on: July 14, 2016, 06:30 »
+13
Yup, this year something's definitely up. SS is clearly being set up for a sale, IMO. They opened the floodgates to lower-quality work when they loosened the entry standards; went after huge ports of similar, very simple icon images that they then uploaded all in one day; allowed spammy titles all over the place to disrupt the search; either did something weird to the search or the search broke and they haven't bothered to fix it. I think they also changed the algorithm to favor newer ports over older ports in the extreme, so they'd pay out less in royalties (paying 25 is better for them than paying 38, after all).

Clearly they're trying to quickly inflate the library while keeping a larger percentage of the royalties.

Oringer has little incentive to stay tied to the site. He's a programmer, not a stock artist, and he started the site to make money. It must have been exciting to identify that market niche and grow his own huge company so quickly, but now he is beholden to investors and has to listen to them. If I were him I'd have taken my billion dollars and skipped out years ago.

« Reply #19 on: July 14, 2016, 07:16 »
+5
And yes. There are many newbies, graphic designers and young creative talents that are doing much, much better commercial work. THAT is why some people are loosing sales.

That's true and that is the real threat for oldies and also the hidden reason of their complaint.
I'm old too, I don't complain, just envy them. It's a new world!.

I agree with this, but only to a certain extent. Whilst it is obviously true that work submitted several years back is often inferior in quality, and there are a lot of new talented artists joining, I don't believe that this is the main reason people are losing sales. It will certainly account for a gradual decline, as more contributors are taking a slice of the same pie, but it won't account for sales halving overnight, which is what has happened to me since the 1st July.

We all know that in this industry it is important to keep producing and uploading new, quality work, but I am noticing that hardly anything new is selling - sales are generally coming from older work, which must therefore be more visible and favoured in the search.

Also, there may be a lot of real talent joining but there are also plenty of new contributors who think they will get rich quick from this industry. I came across a new contributor this morning who has  uploaded a portfolio of 18000 icons images this year, of very average quality. I actually looked up the contributor's portfolio on the Top 100 Shutterstock Authors site, and calculated that they have sold just 1.6% of their portfolio. At 25c a sale, (assuming that like the rest of us the ODs, ELs & SODs are a bit thin on the ground), so this means their 18000+ portfolio has earned them a grand total of $72. I doubt that would even pay the cost to employ a reviewer to process 18000 images!

IMO, Shutterstock has opened the flood gates and lowered the standards, and this is clearly working for their bottom line profits in the short term. Longterm, the question is will they manage to keep contributors engaged if the contributor only earns $72 for 18000 images? Eventually, they will only manage to keep the contributors producing mediocre content, as the rest of us will have sought out alternative opportunities for revenue. I sincerely hope they realise the path they are on is not sustainable before it's too late.


« Reply #20 on: July 14, 2016, 07:32 »
+16
snip
IMO, Shutterstock has opened the flood gates and lowered the standards, and this is clearly working for their bottom line profits in the short term. Longterm, the question is will they manage to keep contributors engaged if the contributor only earns $72 for 18000 images? Eventually, they will only manage to keep the contributors producing mediocre content, as the rest of us will have sought out alternative opportunities for revenue. I sincerely hope they realise the path they are on is not sustainable before it's too late.

Most definitely there is a problem with SS that doesn't have anything to do with whether one is old or young, or has a new portfolio or has been there for years. Some of the previous posters think it's "cool" to disrespect someone like Laurin, who has more talent in his left pinky than they will in their entire lives, but the bolded statement above says it all. The cream of the crop talent will find other more profitable venues, and the low to mediocre talent will remain in microstock, dispelling the theory that one has to be a "hipster" just to produce saleable, relevant content. Good is good no matter how old you are or how long you have been in the business.

I see the word entitlement being thrown around...and yet the notion that "old" people should go rest and smoke their bongs and leave the real talent to the young hipsters, to me, is the epitome of the definition of entitlement. Maybe a little humility would go a long way. Some of you hipsters might have to go google that word.  ;)

Shelma1

« Reply #21 on: July 14, 2016, 07:37 »
+10
The best are the people who disparage others' ports while remaining anonymous themselves.

« Reply #22 on: July 14, 2016, 08:04 »
0
Most of my sales with SS are from old images.  My earnings month to month have wild swings because the big single and other sales make a huge difference.  This month is grim so far.  There is another site that's almost making up for it, but it would be stupid to tell people what site that is, because then everyone starts uploading there and my earnings shoot down.  So I better not say it starts with C, ends in a and has anv in the middle, that would make me really dumb :)  If I don't mention it, lots of other people will and already have, there's no secrets in this business, or are there?

looks like we are on the same tandem. i thought it was me, but like you if not for my oldest images
and regular sellers i am in zero days since this month.
in the past like stockastic pointed out then, if not for the 28 , 85 and 102 single commission
it would also be dead duck for me.
now with the disappearance of those single large commissions, zero days are all over the place.

it can't be my portfolio is suddenly redundant as i have increased my portfolio 3000
but in spite of how hard i try, i just can't seem to find someone in my city to sell me marijuana
so i could flood my port with still life shots of this stuff that ss so love to have...

buf !!!
« Last Edit: July 14, 2016, 08:09 by etudiante_rapide »

« Reply #23 on: July 14, 2016, 08:07 »
+9
Many oversee that Shutterstock itself DOESNT HAS A PROBLEM AT ALL. When i read this it looks like Shutterstock is dying. But Shutterstock is growing every year. There is no way in near future that SS goes out of business. I guess they will only upgrade and expand. The problems mentioned here have nothing to do with Shutterstocks position.

It is a contributors problem. More competition.... more images....

Anyway i dont like in general that contributors are all the time pointing at other contributors. Complaining that there are to many and so on...... SS is for everyone and everybody has right to register and submit photos.

« Reply #24 on: July 14, 2016, 08:07 »
+17
I will say this. First, Shelma is right. For me I do not attack others, disparage others because I choose to be anonymous.  But I will fire back when someone disparages me, it's human nature.  That being said, several posts here are spot on.  Rinder, like others, are very frustrated.  I have about 10 years in this business and 38 years in a specialty area of photography, but Rinder, for example, has a lifetime in this business. I can completely empathize with him, but I don't necessarily agree with everything he says.  Some newbies are killer artists and ARE willing to accept 38 cents.

For me, I consider my port to be what seems to be called here "average". Aside from some of my underwater work, as an average quality & concept producer in this for 10 years, I see huge declines, and SS is on that list.  I am getting $6 days, then $80 days, but mostly now $13-$18 days with almost 5,000 assets on SS. But, listening to my business side (I do continuous improvement and business process design for a living) I have made shifts in my strategy to create a wider breadth of subject matter and have delved into video to help offset what amounts to a 30% decline in revenue for my still work.  So even as an AVERAGE producer I am feeling the pinch of ROI.  This is not an "old timer", super experienced contributor issue.  I think most everyone who closely follows their business sees some decline....I said mostly not all. I think Rinder looks at others' work and compares it to his knowledge and talent and puts it in a category, whereas the artist is submitting something that is good in their eyes and, in fact, could be a nice seller even though it is called mediocre work by some.



« Last Edit: July 14, 2016, 08:09 by Mantis »


 

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