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Author Topic: Just when you thought It couldn't get worse.  (Read 30152 times)

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« Reply #75 on: July 14, 2016, 16:00 »
+5
There are solutions to competition. Work hard, come up with new ideas, learn new skills, keep up with market trends, or enter new markets. And yes, I subscribe to my own advice.

As previously stated, I too subscribe to this advice. How are you finding it? I find that I am working harder, learning more skill, striving to develop new ideas, uploading better and more diverse work, but I'm still buried in the search.

This isn't about complaining, although sometimes it does help to get it off your chest, it's about trying to gauge what others are experiencing and trying to establish a sense of whether everyone is reporting the same issues, similar issues or if this is unique to me.

My work ethic hasn't changed, and my last photoshoot cost me $2400. I'm worker harder than ever and investing more time and money into my business but, from 1st July 2016, my sales fell off a cliff. Not a gradual decline due to increased competition - I could accept it if my Shutterstock sales dropped from a daily average of 100 downloads to 90 to 80, etc. - that has been the pattern for the last couple of years.

From 1st July 2016, my daily sales have dropped to 40%of my daily average of June 2016 - literally overnight. Can someone please explain that without telling me I should work harder? If the issue was just about the quality of my work, I would be seeing similar declines across all the sites I contribute to, but this sudden change, at least for me, is unique to Shutterstock.

I find that it works for me. I can't say it'll work for everyone since everyone has a different portfolio, but I know it works for me. I know that a lot of people work hard, but are not producing results. My guess is that one part is not coming together and it's usually commercial value or keywording.

Someone posted a SS tracking website before he took it down not too long ago. When you look at the top 100 selling images, the most popular images on that list were related to business, marketing, family, technology and concepts that are currently trending, like feminism and empowerment. Those are the type of images that sell well.

If you have quality work and you believe it will sell, then maybe keywording needs improvement. That's one of the most critical mistakes that many contributors make. They don't think it through and see it as a chore, so they don't put their best effort forward. I don't believe my work is amazing, but I know that my keywording is top notch because of my knowledge in SEO and marketing.

I'm always thinking about new concepts and there are new emerging concepts everyday. Some are temporary, some are permanent. A fellow contributor here recently made a killing on Brexit, because he was first and had quality work. Even saw his work on a news site I regularly visit. If you're first to market and you have quality work, not even copy cats can displace you.

I think you are missing my point here, and I fully understand and agree with exactly what you are saying about commercial value, the importance of keyboarding, etc.

I know I am producing consistently good work, because up until 30th June, it was selling very well on all sites. From 1st July it continues to sell well on all other sites, it just nosed-dived on Shutterstock. Why? The quality of my 6000+ images didn't change overnight, so something else did.


Rinderart

« Reply #76 on: July 14, 2016, 16:13 »
+3
Do you guys...meaning all you guys Old and new have any Idea How many Have given Up and left? A LOT and I mean A LOT. And i don't mean Just the forums. Im talking inactive Ports. never deleted. WHY should they. The forums?? 90% Posting currently are new. and of course asking and experiencing the same things we did. Just different names. And the reason I left the critique forum after 11 years. The quality Level has dropped dramatically, The questions are off the charts amateur. Folks with No desire whatsoever to do the work themselves. I enjoyed helping someone along that showed thay wanted this are were willing to do the work and get out of the box. Thats gone and so am I. I still work with achievers Privately with PM.

There is no work ethic at least None I see. And the things I read on the forums and experiencing Myself uploading is embarrassing to say the least.

The review staff is really....really non functional. I had some issues Last week with 12 or so Images that I had to submit 6 times without changing anything until I stumbled acroos someone who read what I was doing. simply amazing.

« Reply #77 on: July 14, 2016, 16:15 »
0
I think you are missing my point here, and I fully understand and agree with exactly what you are saying about commercial value, the importance of keyboarding, etc.

I know I am producing consistently good work, because up until 30th June, it was selling very well on all sites. From 1st July it continues to sell well on all other sites, it just nosed-dived on Shutterstock. Why? The quality of my 6000+ images didn't change overnight, so something else did.

It's hard to know without knowing what's in your portfolio. I haven't seen any changes in the search algorithm for any of the sections. What I do know is that they added roughly 2 million new images since July 1st.

« Reply #78 on: July 14, 2016, 16:17 »
+3
I think you are missing my point here, and I fully understand and agree with exactly what you are saying about commercial value, the importance of keyboarding, etc.

I know I am producing consistently good work, because up until 30th June, it was selling very well on all sites. From 1st July it continues to sell well on all other sites, it just nosed-dived on Shutterstock. Why? The quality of my 6000+ images didn't change overnight, so something else did.

i don't think they are missing the point...
they are just in denial
even when already repeatedly mentioned by so many experienced contributors
that we had our portfolio suddenly fell off a cliff
- even with consistent new images
- even when for months we had single earnings regularly of 28 to 102 dollars

i don't know what it is we keep saying that hit a brick wall to so many
experts trying to say we all suddenly contracted alzheimer
and forgot how to produce sellable images.

it's like some wet behind the ears kid off the block
telling an experienced sailor he has to learn how to swim ,
steer a boat, study the stars to navigate,etc..

hell, we have already done that since we too were first wet behind the ears.

as Kurious Kat said it..
 From 1st July it continues to sell well on all other sites, it just nosed-dived on Shutterstock. Why? The quality of my 6000+ images didn't change overnight, so something else did.

dbvirago

« Reply #79 on: July 14, 2016, 16:30 »
0
My sales at SS continue to rise slowly - had my BME in March. Having said that, July is shaping up to be my worst month there in 2 years. No ELs, and only FB SODs.
Can't blame it on search algorithms as my evergreens and new sellers still come up where they should. One month has to be the worst, so hopefully this is just that and not a trend.


Rinderart

« Reply #80 on: July 14, 2016, 16:37 »
+2
Well Rinder, I have read your posts and thus far feel you've been pretty honest about your perspectives on SS. As far as I remember, you were there right from the start.

I hope this may be sufficient motivation to hedge your bets and join us over at Symbiostock - the more passionate contributors we have launching their independent media stores, the less reliant we will all be on third parties to maintain income stability.

Hi Robin. well I sold my first stock shot in 1968 so this ain't my first Rodeo. I have always said even in the good times that Micro or Macro accounts for maybe 20/25% of what I need to Make with My expenses. And for the time spent...20/25% i was getting a fair return. Im a working Photographer, I have 35 year clients. I can do 50 Headshots a day where I live and make a LOT of money But I don't Like them...To many rules for me. If stock ended completely tomorrow I would be Just fine. I could easily Pick up the 20/25% elsewhere. I do Lots of different things. Thank goodness. I feel Bad for those that only do this. And I would advise them to get ready for some serious Stuff coming and diversify and take...Taking Pictures more seriously than Penny stock.

Also. you said I should do the symbiostock thing? well truthfully I've looked at it for a Long time. The Principle Looks and feels Fine and kinda reminds me of some very old concepts that were tried Long before. Also I haven't met, read or talked to anyone that does well doing Symbio. Unless you have some Links to Look at or folks to talk to. Seems Kinda Pie in the sky. I remember the first conversations about this and it was very exciting. seems to have gone to sleep unless Im Missing something/

We all know 80% of all Images being used are being stolen, I also think "This business" as we know it or used to know it is very soon gonna change again. good or Bad? Don't know and actually don't really care. I have no faith anymore. No feeling of belonging to anything anymore, no feeling   the entire business cares less about us and Now a serious feeling of no community at all. The new folks have no clue what it was so they don't know. And they just float around with the "shutterfly" attitude uploading the stuff we did because it looks new to them.   LOL  Thats fine. what ya gonna do? ....Nothing.

Robin, If ya have some stats or Ports that do well. I would love some Links, To me the work always speaks Loudest.. Pls send to Rinderart@aol.com

Thanks for writing.
« Last Edit: July 14, 2016, 19:01 by Rinderart »

« Reply #81 on: July 14, 2016, 16:37 »
+1
I think it has a lot to do with SS adding nearly 1 Million images PER WEEK (2 million since July 1st). We don't know what is in those 2 million images and how it affects existing portfolios.

There is more competition than ever on SS and that's just the reality of it. Some contributors are more affected than others.

Rinderart

« Reply #82 on: July 14, 2016, 16:38 »
+1
I think you are missing my point here, and I fully understand and agree with exactly what you are saying about commercial value, the importance of keyboarding, etc.

I know I am producing consistently good work, because up until 30th June, it was selling very well on all sites. From 1st July it continues to sell well on all other sites, it just nosed-dived on Shutterstock. Why? The quality of my 6000+ images didn't change overnight, so something else did.

i don't think they are missing the point...
they are just in denial
even when already repeatedly mentioned by so many experienced contributors
that we had our portfolio suddenly fell off a cliff
- even with consistent new images
- even when for months we had single earnings regularly of 28 to 102 dollars

i don't know what it is we keep saying that hit a brick wall to so many
experts trying to say we all suddenly contracted alzheimer
and forgot how to produce sellable images.

it's like some wet behind the ears kid off the block
telling an experienced sailor he has to learn how to swim ,
steer a boat, study the stars to navigate,etc..

hell, we have already done that since we too were first wet behind the ears.

as Kurious Kat said it..
 From 1st July it continues to sell well on all other sites, it just nosed-dived on Shutterstock. Why? The quality of my 6000+ images didn't change overnight, so something else did.

+1000

Rinderart

« Reply #83 on: July 14, 2016, 16:42 »
+1
My sales at SS continue to rise slowly - had my BME in March. Having said that, July is shaping up to be my worst month there in 2 years. No ELs, and only FB SODs.
Can't blame it on search algorithms as my evergreens and new sellers still come up where they should. One month has to be the worst, so hopefully this is just that and not a trend.

Fingers crossed Old friend. July is absolutely Horrible.

« Reply #84 on: July 14, 2016, 17:21 »
+3
I think you are missing my point here, and I fully understand and agree with exactly what you are saying about commercial value, the importance of keyboarding, etc.

I know I am producing consistently good work, because up until 30th June, it was selling very well on all sites. From 1st July it continues to sell well on all other sites, it just nosed-dived on Shutterstock. Why? The quality of my 6000+ images didn't change overnight, so something else did.

It's hard to know without knowing what's in your portfolio. I haven't seen any changes in the search algorithm for any of the sections. What I do know is that they added roughly 2 million new images since July 1st.

The point is that my portfolio, with the exception of some recent additions, was the same in June as it is now.

June sales were fine.

July sales are in the toilet.

The addition of a million images a week is nothing new, and was happening throughout June, in just the same way as it has for the first two weeks of July. This cannot be rationally explained away by saying that 'competition is tough so up your game'.

My gut feeling on this is some sort of rotation, and I'm currently on the bottom of a cycle. Holiday period, site outages, etc. can explain fluctuations, but not a 60% loss of earnings overnight.

Just as an observation, I would say there is plenty up with the search. I just checked one of my very recent uploads, which is of a very specific and hard to come by subject, and found it is already on page 4 when searching by new. I wouldn't mind if the 300+ images ahead of it actually pertained to the same subject, but only about 35-40% were relevant.

« Reply #85 on: July 14, 2016, 17:44 »
0

The point is that my portfolio, with the exception of some recent additions, was the same in June as it is now.

June sales were fine.

July sales are in the toilet.

The addition of a million images a week is nothing new, and was happening throughout June, in just the same way as it has for the first two weeks of July. This cannot be rationally explained away by saying that 'competition is tough so up your game'.

My gut feeling on this is some sort of rotation, and I'm currently on the bottom of a cycle. Holiday period, site outages, etc. can explain fluctuations, but not a 60% loss of earnings overnight.

Just as an observation, I would say there is plenty up with the search. I just checked one of my very recent uploads, which is of a very specific and hard to come by subject, and found it is already on page 4 when searching by new. I wouldn't mind if the 300+ images ahead of it actually pertained to the same subject, but only about 35-40% were relevant.

My sales are down for July. I'm on pace to earn about 20% less compared to June. Historically, July has not the best month for microstock sales on SS. I know a number of people on vacation and some people are out there catching their Pokemon.

I'm not too concerned about it. When August comes around, sales will pick back up again.

ngaga35

« Reply #86 on: July 14, 2016, 18:20 »
0
I don't think it's problem with lots of new contributors, or lots of good new stuff.... I think that it is problem with closed ports, and we can't see it because site search engine is not the same for contributors and buyers. Lots of my work is on first page by popular but it is not selling.
July is the WM since my first year here.

Rinderart

« Reply #87 on: July 14, 2016, 18:57 »
0
My "So Called Most Popular" is so far from being My most Popular it's amazing. Most Popular when??.. this week.Month,Year?

ngaga35

« Reply #88 on: July 14, 2016, 19:07 »
0
Yes I know that. But it is on first page and the people can see they and buy it. It's not disappeared into the crowd.

« Reply #89 on: July 14, 2016, 19:09 »
+2
that most popular algorithm changed over a year ago if not longer, has been explained countless times it is not about sales only, but keep complaining about it, that helps

we are sharing the pie with a lot more people than when we joined, simple math, you get less per head, it will never go back to the golden days, accept it or move on


ngaga35

« Reply #90 on: July 14, 2016, 19:43 »
+1
Then what is the problem with differences between sales July and June. It's very big differences!!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

« Reply #91 on: July 14, 2016, 19:45 »
0
that most popular algorithm changed over a year ago if not longer, has been explained countless times it is not about sales only, but keep complaining about it, that helps

we are sharing the pie with a lot more people than when we joined, simple math, you get less per head, it will never go back to the golden days, accept it or move on

yes, sadly, greed change people.
the analogy would be my landlord. when he first inherited the bldg, he says to the tenants,
i only want good tenants, quiet, pay the rent promptly. i won't even think of raising the rent much.
4 years later, he caught sniff of money and he found out instead of renting , he would make 4 times more but converting each apartment into a rooming house.
he started to ignore request to repair and replace worn out windows, broken appliances.etc
iow, i now cannot kick you all out , but i can get you irate enough to leave.

same thing with getty and ss. we no longer need you. our main priority now is to attract
buyers , and suppliers are no longer figured in their list of important people.

the writing is on the wall, we are seeing istock being replayed.


dbvirago

« Reply #92 on: July 14, 2016, 19:55 »
0
I don't think it's problem with lots of new contributors, or lots of good new stuff.... I think that it is problem with closed ports, and we can't see it because site search engine is not the same for contributors and buyers. Lots of my work is on first page by popular but it is not selling.
July is the WM since my first year here.


As far as I can tell, the search engine is the same. When I click on my images and put in a search subject, I am taken to the generic buyer's search page, http://www.shutterstock.com/etc...

If I spend any time there at all, I will get a popup asking me to sign up for an account.

« Reply #93 on: July 14, 2016, 20:14 »
+1
Then what is the problem with differences between sales July and June. It's very big differences!!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

It is a big difference for me...WAYYYYY down. Today I made $12 with 5000 assets.

ngaga35

« Reply #94 on: July 14, 2016, 20:23 »
0
I have over 14400, today I made only $10. This is over 50% lower then June.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

ngaga35

« Reply #95 on: July 14, 2016, 20:31 »
0
I don't think it's problem with lots of new contributors, or lots of good new stuff.... I think that it is problem with closed ports, and we can't see it because site search engine is not the same for contributors and buyers. Lots of my work is on first page by popular but it is not selling.
July is the WM since my first year here.


As far as I can tell, the search engine is the same. When I click on my images and put in a search subject, I am taken to the generic buyer's search page, http://www.shutterstock.com/etc...

If I spend any time there at all, I will get a popup asking me to sign up for an account.

Yes, but you are not log in as buyers. I think that this is a catch. We can always see our portfolio, but buyers can't or the search is changes in some  time period.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

« Reply #96 on: July 14, 2016, 20:32 »
0
I have over 14400, today I made only $10. This is over 50% lower then June.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

WOW, how is that possible? Your port is beautiful.

ngaga35

« Reply #97 on: July 14, 2016, 20:35 »
0
I have over 14400, today I made only $10. This is over 50% lower then June.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

WOW, how is that possible? Your port is beautiful.
Tnx


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

« Reply #98 on: July 14, 2016, 22:42 »
0
Hi Rinder,

Look, as Andre has alluded to on numerous occasions, which I am firmly in agreement with, if you are someone who wants and intends to truly try to change the state of affairs, it is plainly irresponsible to stand on the sidelines, complain, and wait for someone else to do all the work for you so that you can then hop on the bandwagon.

I'm not saying this is you, but I'm re-iterating that the mentality should not be 'pie in the sky' - it may very well be a 'pie in the sky', but that's not what's important. What's important, for your sanity, for your professional future, is that there is the possibility that it will work, the best possibility, and in pursuing that best possibility, you are doing everything you can to offset this awful progression of contributor extortion.

If you're standing there asking for stats and proof instead of spending $10 a month to get some of your best images on Symbiostock and Symzio, it seems plainly counter-intuitive. I've clearly demonstrated, the entire Symbiostock team has demonstrated, a serious and dedicated desire to create massive and powerful infrastructure that serves to assist professionals exactly like you.

And as predicted, slowly, but surely, people are starting to see some results:

http://www.symbiostock.org/forums/topic/sale/

If you take a look at this, you'll see that it's certainly not earth shattering (yet), but some contributors may be making upwards of 30 to 50 dollars a month on average through these sales. And these are only the contributors that are actively telling us about their sales. Some are on Symzio, some are through their independent sites.

30 to 50 dollars a month is more than a lot of people make through agencies such as Dreamstime, Fotolia, DepositPhotos etc. So you see that it becomes a real and true addition to your agency workflow.

Most importantly:

1) That money is NOT as a result of $0.25 subscriptions. These individuals either made 70% of the sale price, 80% of the sale price, or 100% of the sale price.
2) They know their clients and their clients know them
3) There is nothing but positivity as a result of the sale, because of the aforementioned reasons
4) They control the licensing terms of their media on their independent sites

I urge you to explore, if you are genuinely interested in funneling some of this negative energy into a positive mechanism, a cost effective manner of getting your port on Symbiostock, and join us on the forums, if even on a semi-passive basis. Other contributors and the entire marketing arm of Symbiostock and Symzio will passively promote you as well, as we do each other.

Rinderart

« Reply #99 on: July 14, 2016, 22:54 »
+1
that most popular algorithm changed over a year ago if not longer, has been explained countless times it is not about sales only, but keep complaining about it, that helps

we are sharing the pie with a lot more people than when we joined, simple math, you get less per head, it will never go back to the golden days, accept it or move on

A year ago?????????? Try march 12th 2012 man. Thats when the so called switch was thrown. I dont want less and I won't accept less and I don't want Myself or my friends who have done the work and helped Build SS accept Less.. if you want to be fatalistic about this and say thats the way it is. your part of the Problem.!!! Period. We had the chance to do something 4/5 years ago and we simply didn't we were very Busy trying to stop the DFC at fotolia. which was a joke.. Myself and others could have done so much more. maybe you weren't here then. maybe you were. being anonymous makes it hard to tell. Ya never know if your talking to some veteran or some kid sitting on his parents computer in Tulsa Oklahoma submitting tomatoes.

lets see your port. the work speaks, words don't. Heres Mine.http://www.shutterstock.com/cat.mhtml?gallery_id=7918 and google.https://search.yahoo.com/yhs/search?p=laurin+rinder&ei=UTF-8&hspart=mozilla&hsimp=yhs-003



 

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