Author Topic: Shutterstock is an embarassment (Read 24277 times)

gnirtS · « **Reply #25 on:** June 29, 2023, 08:46 »

Quote from: trek on June 28, 2023, 20:24

My video sales are 70% below 2017...

Dropping from average of $38 to an average of $7 with some sales a few cents will do that.

They utterly demolished the video commission system and then made it even worse with the level system.

70% is roughly what i see as well.

Asthebelltolls · « **Reply #26 on:** June 29, 2023, 13:26 »

The SS and their treatment of contributors is a prime example of how unions are born. It's no different than the "boardroom boys" of a company mulling over how they can squeeze their employees out of more money before the employees finally are fed up and unionize.
From my perspective that would entail contributors creating their own microstock site and contributors signing an agreement that this site would be the only one that they will contribute to.
It's a complicated scenario. How can the microstock group ensure that contributors are adhering to the agreement they signed and not continuing to feed the SS and other agencies with their images and clips using another erroneous name? And how can contributors initiate the site? Can enough money be raised to create and maintain the exclusive site? Will enough contributors sign up and build an agency that reaches the top 5?
50% for the contributor's exclusive agency and 50% of the buyer's money for the photographer/Videographer would be incentive to get things moving.
The SS boardroom boys and their trained monkeys. How can we, as photographers and videographers, change the current industry standards? Unionization. IMO.
I am not someone who has ever depended on commissions. I'm concerned about the contributors who used their earnings to
feed their families. In the pre-SS days when commissions were a
lot higher, the money was a part of the essential need for those of
us who really depended on commissions to move forward. Those are the people I think most about and why I feel the SS and other agencies are immoral and corrupt.

blvdone · « **Reply #27 on:** June 29, 2023, 21:22 »

I had a BME on Pond5 last October. Of course, it wasn't a BME for overall stock video revenue because Shutterstock video sales was good before they started video sub and Adobe Stock started video sub too last year, but it was nice to see I can still get BME on Pond5 with 60% exclusive royalty.

Noedelhap · « **Reply #28 on:** June 30, 2023, 05:56 »

Quote from: Asthebelltolls on June 29, 2023, 13:26

The SS and their treatment of contributors is a prime example of how unions are born. It's no different than the "boardroom boys" of a company mulling over how they can squeeze their employees out of more money before the employees finally are fed up and unionize.
From my perspective that would entail contributors creating their own microstock site and contributors signing an agreement that this site would be the only one that they will contribute to.
It's a complicated scenario. How can the microstock group ensure that contributors are adhering to the agreement they signed and not continuing to feed the SS and other agencies with their images and clips using another erroneous name? And how can contributors initiate the site? Can enough money be raised to create and maintain the exclusive site? Will enough contributors sign up and build an agency that reaches the top 5?
50% for the contributor's exclusive agency and 50% of the buyer's money for the photographer/Videographer would be incentive to get things moving.
The SS boardroom boys and their trained monkeys. How can we, as photographers and videographers, change the current industry standards? Unionization. IMO.
I am not someone who has ever depended on commissions. I'm concerned about the contributors who used their earnings to
feed their families. In the pre-SS days when commissions were a
lot higher, the money was a part of the essential need for those of
us who really depended on commissions to move forward. Those are the people I think most about and why I feel the SS and other agencies are immoral and corrupt.

Tale as old as time; people have been advocating for years for a union or a contibutor-run stock site, there have even been a couple of attempts in the past (Stocksy comes to mind). But in the end, heavy competition from the market leaders made it nearly impossible to gain enough traction and become a big player. And how do you get all contributors working together in the first place? Joining a union can be risky for those who need the income. People contribute to SS from all over the world, and in some low-wage countries, the revenue from SS is still enough to feed their families. So good luck convincing them to join your union.

gnirtS · « **Reply #29 on:** June 30, 2023, 07:06 »

Unions are by their very nature political and the second you get political you have disagreements and conflicts.

Its a non-starter.

Asthebelltolls · « **Reply #30 on:** June 30, 2023, 08:33 »

IMO constant talk about how much less you're making isn't going to draw the attention of the Boardroom Boys. They couldn't give a flipping *. But sharing ideas about resolving the problem of low commissions may draw the attention of agencies.
Ok, a self-run contributor site isn't going to work, in your opinion. But an active, on-going conversation is far more effective than individual contributors complaining about the pennies their now making.
The Boardroom Boys figured as long as they can make their contributors roll over and rub their tummies they can do whatever they * well please. So far it's working, IMO.

blvdone · « **Reply #31 on:** July 02, 2023, 07:36 »

Quote from: Brasilnut on June 29, 2023, 07:05

I interviewed Doug Jensen, veteran stock footage contributor, with a portfolio of 9,187.

Question: In terms of sales volumes and revenue, have you experienced a decrease in the past two years since our last interview?

Answer: "If you define “sales volume” as being the total number of clips that are sold, then that number has remained fairly consistent since we last spoke. Unfortunately, my revenue, which is ultimately the metric that matters most, has dropped by more than 50% during that same time period. I attribute this to two things: First, Shutterstock made a lot of changes to their commission structure that have hurt contributors. And second, Shutterstock is really pushing customers towards a subscription-based sales model which results in overall lower pricing per clip — thus lower revenue for the contributors who created those clips.

Here’s how I see it: If a customer pays an agency $50, does it really matter to the agency whether that $50 covers a single download or a hundred downloads? $50 is $50 of income to the agency no matter how you slice it. But the agency didn’t put any effort whatsoever into shooting, editing, uploading, or creating the metadata, so they don’t really care whether that $50 covers one download or a hundred downloads. It’s still $50 of income (minus the commission) to their bottom line. But to the average contributor, it is devastating because we only get a very small slice of that $50 if the customer is downloading multiple files. The way the subscription model works, the more clips a customer downloads, the less money any individual contributor will get for their slice of the pie. The bottom line is that when you have agencies that are offering customers unlimited 4K and HD downloads for as little as $50 per month, who do you think loses? The contributor."

Link to full interview:

https://brutallyhonestmicrostock.com/2023/06/28/interview-with-doug-jensen-stock-footage-expert-fresh-insight-after-2-years/

That dude used to attack me when I criticized Shutterstock on Shutterstock's contributor forum. Now he's suffering the same fate as everybody else huh.

Zero Talent · « **Reply #32 on:** July 02, 2023, 13:05 »

Quote from: blvdone on July 02, 2023, 07:36

That dude used to attack me when I criticized Shutterstock on Shutterstock's contributor forum. Now he's suffering the same fate as everybody else huh.

Yes. The dude is an arrogant know-it-all type, who was caught with his pants down on multiple occasions.
He was there to sell his "course" to those gulible enough to pay for something that is widely available for free.

blvdone · « **Reply #33 on:** July 02, 2023, 16:28 »

Quote from: Zero Talent on July 02, 2023, 13:05

Quote from: blvdone on July 02, 2023, 07:36

That dude used to attack me when I criticized Shutterstock on Shutterstock's contributor forum. Now he's suffering the same fate as everybody else huh.

Yes. The dude is an arrogant know-it-all type, who was caught with his pants down on multiple occasions.
He was there to sell his "course" to those gulible enough to pay for something that is widely available for free.

LOL!! Glad to hear you agree with me on this!! Yes, maybe he was just trying hard to sell his stock video tutorial videos. He was making ridiculous claim of making $300/hr or something on stock videos, but he didn't calculate his expenses for equipments, travel and his labor hours shooting footages because "he enjoys shooting". Total BS. Many end up making less than minimum wage these days in reality.

Elijah · « **Reply #34 on:** July 03, 2023, 03:57 »

Yeah, screw Doug, the guy is incredibly arrogant and annoying.

qunamax · « **Reply #35 on:** July 03, 2023, 06:33 »

Quote from: stockman11 on June 23, 2023, 16:26

My SS earnings used to be 15x higher than now, and they just keep nosediving from month to month. Once a good earner, now abomination. Seems like it will join mid-tier agencies soon. Inexcusable.

During this same time, my Adobe Stock earnings has been growing, and Istock has been consistent.

I'm considering to start treating SS like the other mid-tier agencies and completely stop uploading there.

Identical experience for me too.

Wilm · « **Reply #36 on:** July 03, 2023, 07:44 »

Quote from: blvdone on July 02, 2023, 16:28

Quote from: Zero Talent on July 02, 2023, 13:05
Quote from: blvdone on July 02, 2023, 07:36

That dude used to attack me when I criticized Shutterstock on Shutterstock's contributor forum. Now he's suffering the same fate as everybody else huh.

Yes. The dude is an arrogant know-it-all type, who was caught with his pants down on multiple occasions.
He was there to sell his "course" to those gulible enough to pay for something that is widely available for free.
He was making ridiculous claim of making $300/hr or something on stock videos, but he didn't calculate his expenses for equipments, travel and his labor hours shooting footages because "he enjoys shooting". Total BS. Many end up making less than minimum wage these days in reality.

I remember this "calculation" too.

Doug Jensen · « **Reply #37 on:** July 03, 2023, 11:55 »

Hey guys, your favorite arrogant jerk has arrived at the party!! How ya'll doing? It is nice to feel your love. Kisses to everyone.

I thought you might like an update on my continued success with stock footage.

As of July 3, 2023
Lifetime earnings at Shutterstock: $217,011
Lifetime earnings at Adobe: $23,938
Lifetime earnings at Pond5: $12,000 (approximate)
Lifetime earnings at Getty: $13,977
Total: $266,926

Number of clips in Shutterstock portofilo: 9187 (with far fewer clips at other agencies)

Average earning per clip (so far): $29.05
Average time to edit, grade, add metadata, and upload each clip: 5 minutes
5 minutes = 12 clips per hour
12 x $29.05 = $348 per hour

So, I've already earned $348 per hour for my work, and those clips continue to earn money everyday. Not as much as they used to due to Shutterstock's changes a couple of years ago (completely out of my control), but I still have a nice steady income stream from work I already did a long time ago.

I have never hidden the fact that I do not factor in my time to shoot stock because I only shoot for fun. There is nothing in my portfolio that I didn't want to shoot or regretted shooting. It is all fun to me. No different than other people going fishing or golfing or hiking, etc. which they don't expect to be paid for. Only a moron can't understand that shooting for stock can be a legitimate leisure activity. Just because you hate it doesn't mean other people don't get pleasure from shooting.

I have also never hidden the fact that I do not factor in the cost of my camera equipment or computer hardware/software because I already own them because I actually work in the TV/video production industry. My gear is already bought and paid for from other sources and would be just sitting on the shelf gathering dust when I am not working on a paid gig.

So my income for the actual the work and drudgery of stock (creating the metadata) is $348. The numbers don't lie. They are just facts.

Now, if YOU think shooting stock is work or a chore or you hate doing it for whatever reason, then YOU should factor that into your own calculations. If YOU only use your camera gear for stock and never for any other purpose, then YOU should probably factor those costs into your own calculations. I HAVE ALWAYS SAID THAT.

So, my friends, success is its own reward. Please continue with all the put-downs, insults, and name-calling you want. I'm laughing all the way to the bank while you're all just still whining about how the agencies are out to get you. Get over it. If you want to play the victim card, be my guest.

Asthebelltolls · « **Reply #38 on:** July 03, 2023, 12:49 »

Quote from: Noedelhap on June 30, 2023, 05:56

People contribute to SS from all over the world, and in some low-wage countries, the revenue from SS is still enough to feed their families. So good luck convincing them to join your union.

Wow! A statement I can image the Boardroom Boys making when justifying cutting commissions by 80%: "Sure, we've got contributors who used their commissions to feed their families. They bought rice, vegetables and maybe even took their families out for dinner once in a while when sales were good...but they can still buy them rice."

Elijah · « **Reply #39 on:** July 03, 2023, 16:06 »

Quote from: Doug Jensen on July 03, 2023, 11:55

Average time to edit, grade, add metadata, and upload each clip: 5 minutes

Right...

Zero Talent · « **Reply #40 on:** July 03, 2023, 16:34 »

Quote from: Elijah on July 03, 2023, 16:06

Quote from: Doug Jensen on July 03, 2023, 11:55

Average time to edit, grade, add metadata, and upload each clip: 5 minutes

Right...

Right, right... and I'm earning ♾️/hour because everything I do is for fun.

Doug Jensen · « **Reply #41 on:** July 03, 2023, 16:36 »

Quote from: Elijah on July 03, 2023, 16:06

Quote from: Doug Jensen on July 03, 2023, 11:55

Average time to edit, grade, add metadata, and upload each clip: 5 minutes

Right...

If it takes you longer than that you must be doing something wrong. How long does it take you ingest, edit, grade, and create the metadata? I assure you, 5 minutes is a very conservative number for me.

Doug Jensen · « **Reply #42 on:** July 03, 2023, 16:37 »

Quote from: Zero Talent on July 03, 2023, 16:34

Quote from: Elijah on July 03, 2023, 16:06
Quote from: Doug Jensen on July 03, 2023, 11:55

Average time to edit, grade, add metadata, and upload each clip: 5 minutes

Right...

Right, right... and I'm earning ♾️/hour because everything I do is for fun.

If that is true, then you are a very lucky person. I hate doing metadata, so that will always be a chore for me and I absolutely must be paid well for doing it. As shown above, I'm at $348 per hour right now, but I'd keep doing it for 1/3 that. If it gets down to less than $100 per hour that is the day I will stop submitting.

Zero Talent · « **Reply #43 on:** July 03, 2023, 16:45 »

Quote from: Doug Jensen on July 03, 2023, 16:37

Quote from: Zero Talent on July 03, 2023, 16:34
Quote from: Elijah on July 03, 2023, 16:06
Quote from: Doug Jensen on July 03, 2023, 11:55

Average time to edit, grade, add metadata, and upload each clip: 5 minutes

Right...

Right, right... and I'm earning ♾️/hour because everything I do is for fun.

If that is true, then you are a very lucky person. I hate doing metadata, so that will always be a chore for me and I absolutely must be paid well for doing it. As shown above, I'm at $348 per hour right now, but I'd keep doing it for 1/3 that. If it gets down to less than $100 per hour that is the day I will stop submitting.

I am not lucky! ♾️>348. Therefore I am better, despite my lack of talent!
Imagine that!

Doug Jensen · « **Reply #44 on:** July 03, 2023, 16:58 »

Quote from: Zero Talent on July 03, 2023, 16:45

Quote from: Doug Jensen on July 03, 2023, 16:37
Quote from: Zero Talent on July 03, 2023, 16:34
Quote from: Elijah on July 03, 2023, 16:06
Quote from: Doug Jensen on July 03, 2023, 11:55

Average time to edit, grade, add metadata, and upload each clip: 5 minutes

Right...

Right, right... and I'm earning ♾️/hour because everything I do is for fun.

If that is true, then you are a very lucky person. I hate doing metadata, so that will always be a chore for me and I absolutely must be paid well for doing it. As shown above, I'm at $348 per hour right now, but I'd keep doing it for 1/3 that. If it gets down to less than $100 per hour that is the day I will stop submitting.

I am not lucky! ♾️>348. Therefore I am better, despite my lack of talent!
Imagine that!

Congratulations! I envy your willingness to do it all for free. But I have better things to do with my time if I'm not being paid. You are indeed a lucky person.

If you really love doing metadata, and can prove you can actually do it competently, I've got 6500 4K clips that are edited, rendered, and just awaiting metadata before i can upload them. I'd be more than happy to let you do all the metadata just for fun. I won't charge you a thing for giving you so much fun, in fact, I would be very thankful for your help. Please point me to some of your clips so I can judge your ability. This is gonna be great for both of us!! Makes me feel a little like Tom Sawyer.

blvdone · « **Reply #45 on:** July 03, 2023, 17:31 »

Quote from: Doug Jensen on July 03, 2023, 11:55

Hey guys, your favorite arrogant jerk has arrived at the party!! How ya'll doing? It is nice to feel your love. Kisses to everyone.

I thought you might like an update on my continued success with stock footage.

As of July 3, 2023
Lifetime earnings at Shutterstock: $217,011
Lifetime earnings at Adobe: $23,938
Lifetime earnings at Pond5: $12,000 (approximate)
Lifetime earnings at Getty: $13,977
Total: $266,926

Number of clips in Shutterstock portofilo: 9187 (with far fewer clips at other agencies)

Average earning per clip (so far): $29.05
Average time to edit, grade, add metadata, and upload each clip: 5 minutes
5 minutes = 12 clips per hour
12 x $29.05 = $348 per hour

So, I've already earned $348 per hour for my work, and those clips continue to earn money everyday. Not as much as they used to due to Shutterstock's changes a couple of years ago (completely out of my control), but I still have a nice steady income stream from work I already did a long time ago.

I have never hidden the fact that I do not factor in my time to shoot stock because I only shoot for fun. There is nothing in my portfolio that I didn't want to shoot or regretted shooting. It is all fun to me. No different than other people going fishing or golfing or hiking, etc. which they don't expect to be paid for. Only a moron can't understand that shooting for stock can be a legitimate leisure activity. Just because you hate it doesn't mean other people don't get pleasure from shooting.

I have also never hidden the fact that I do not factor in the cost of my camera equipment or computer hardware/software because I already own them because I actually work in the TV/video production industry. My gear is already bought and paid for from other sources and would be just sitting on the shelf gathering dust when I am not working on a paid gig.

So my income for the actual the work and drudgery of stock (creating the metadata) is $348. The numbers don't lie. They are just facts.

Now, if YOU think shooting stock is work or a chore or you hate doing it for whatever reason, then YOU should factor that into your own calculations. If YOU only use your camera gear for stock and never for any other purpose, then YOU should probably factor those costs into your own calculations. I HAVE ALWAYS SAID THAT.

So, my friends, success is its own reward. Please continue with all the put-downs, insults, and name-calling you want. I'm laughing all the way to the bank while you're all just still whining about how the agencies are out to get you. Get over it. If you want to play the victim card, be my guest.

U R the GOAT!!

Doug Jensen · « **Reply #46 on:** July 03, 2023, 17:34 »

Quote from: blvdone on July 03, 2023, 17:31

U R the GOAT!!

Oh, I highly doubt that. I am absolutely certain that there are many people who could put my earnings and hourly wage to shame. I'm just a yeoman with a little side hustle. That's all.

blvdone · « **Reply #47 on:** July 03, 2023, 17:35 »

I think I have to buy his "How to make $$$ uploading videos to Shutterstock" tutorial video. I'm nowhere near making $350/hr. I've been doing this totally wrong way.

Doug Jensen · « **Reply #48 on:** July 03, 2023, 17:37 »

Quote from: blvdone on July 03, 2023, 17:35

I think I have to buy his "How to make $$$ uploading videos to Shutterstock" tutorial video. I'm nowhere near making $350/hr. I've been doing this totally wrong way.

That might be true about doing it the wrong way. What is your process? I'd be happy to take a look at your best clips and give you some free feedback on the subject matter, editing, grading, and of course, the all important metadata. Post a link and I'll do my best to get you headed in the right direction.

blvdone · « **Reply #49 on:** July 03, 2023, 17:39 »

Quote from: Doug Jensen on July 03, 2023, 17:37

Quote from: blvdone on July 03, 2023, 17:35
I think I have to buy his "How to make $$$ uploading videos to Shutterstock" tutorial video. I'm nowhere near making $350/hr. I've been doing this totally wrong way.

That might be true about doing it the wrong way. What is your process? I'd be happy to take a look at your best clips and give you some free feedback on the subject matter, editing, grading, and of course, the all important metadata. Post a link.

It's OK. I'm too embarrassed after seeing your $$$ figure. I totally suck at this. I should go back to delivering newspapers.

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Author Topic: Shutterstock is an embarassment (Read 24277 times)

gnirtS

Asthebelltolls

blvdone

Noedelhap

gnirtS

Asthebelltolls

blvdone

Zero Talent

blvdone

Elijah

qunamax

Wilm

Doug Jensen

Asthebelltolls

Elijah

Zero Talent

Doug Jensen

Doug Jensen

Zero Talent

Doug Jensen

blvdone

Doug Jensen

blvdone

Doug Jensen

blvdone

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